From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V11 #317 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Monday, October 7 2002 Volume 11 : Number 317 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: #316 [Eb ] suitable after all [grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan)] Re: so many threads, so little time [Stewart Russell ] feglit [Stewart Russell ] Re: feg idiom [gSs ] Profiteers resell Africa's cheap Aids drugs. [gSs ] Re: minor NDL gripes [Brian ] Exiles, baby tunes, ghouls ["Rex.Broome" ] Re: minor NDL gripes [Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey ] Re: feglit [Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey ] Re: feglit [Stewart Russell ] Re: minor NDL gripes [Stewart Russell ] Re: feglit [Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey ] feg imit [Miles Goosens ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 12:19:17 -0700 From: Eb Subject: Re: #316 >From: "Rex.Broome" > > >>Seems like there's gotta be a Kinks song which is a strong contender >in this category (raga) > >I think I mentioned "See My Friends" when starting this thread... that's >probably the one you need. You have your threads crossed. My above response regarded '60s songs which could fit the *Charleston*, not raga. I have a relevant Kinks tune in my head, but I can't recall the song title. I think it's on Face to Face or Something Else, though.... BTW, I don't think Rhino is likely to release a Kinks box, since they've *already* mounted a Kinks campaign in the past. They reissued a slew of early/middle Kinks albums, but let them all go out of print. There's nothing left now, but one middling "Greatest Hits" disc. (Despite the label's righteous tastes, I've always found Rhino's "Get in, wring out a few bucks and bail out" attitude really troubling -- I bet that I own *50* out-of-print Rhino releases. Needless to say, Hitchcock himself has been victimized by this strategy -- I just checked the Rhino website, and it indicates all the Hitchcock reissues are out of print except I Often Dream of Trains.) >Michael Wells: >I'll have to break with you on that one, Kristin was terribly underwhelming >at our show. Not that she could be leaping around doing cartwheels or >anything, just didn't have 'it' happening despite having clearly half the >crowd there to see (only) her. Plus she still does that fabulously annoying >sideways shimmy-thing with her head while singing. Blech. I really *enjoy* that "shimmy-thing." I find it fascinating. I'm always sucked in by artists whose onstage body language seems to operate on a subconscious, involuntary level (well, unless it's Keith Jarrett, in which case I just grimace and crawl away). I've expressed before how much Tori Amos' performing style annoys me, and that's because she fails so badly to achieve this ambience -- she's *always* so self-conscious and audience-aware. Regarding Hersh, I'm more concerned about the deterioration of her voice, both on her last album and in the last performance I saw. Someone get this girl a lozenge! I must say that she doesn't look too healthy to me, in general. Too many years of smoking? I don't know. I'm pretty sure that at one point, she even smoked *cigars*...yikes. > >- -Kristin Hersh is probably the only artist I've ever paid to see >perform > >in an advanced stage of pregnancy (she looks at least as big >as my wife, >>who's due in December)... > >??? I didnt know advanced pregnancy decreased a woman's ability to perform >music;-P. Several years ago, I saw Hersh perform when she was verrry pregnant (this was with the Muses) and her performance suffered terribly. Her vocals were sadly "ginger," all night. It was as if she was afraid she'd BURST if she strained to belt out a note, and her voice had none of its usual power as a result. I've seen her perform several times, and this was definitely the worst of those shows. Springsteen's second song on last night's SNL premiere was pretty darn good TV. Wish the album wasn't so slick and bland. I'm seeing the Super Furries tomorrow night, unless something goes awry. Eb np: Jurassic 5/Power in Numbers ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 18:41:00 +1300 From: grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan) Subject: suitable after all Well, that band name didn't necessarily relate to Earth, did it? James James Dignan, Dunedin, New Zealand. =-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= .-=-.-=-.-=-.- .-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-. -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= You talk to me as if from a distance =-.-=-. And I reply with impressions chosen from another time -=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=- (Brian Eno - "By this River") ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 09:17:32 -0400 From: Stewart Russell Subject: Re: so many threads, so little time James Dignan wrote: > > Applecross - the Scottish equivalent of the back of beyond. och no -- appleX is positively a metropolis compared to most of Knoydart. It's the rough bounds that do it. Stewart ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 09:55:24 -0400 From: Stewart Russell Subject: minor NDL gripes Only things I can come up with NOT to like are: * the boop-be-doop supermarket music bassline to Unprotected Love. It doesn't sit well. * the long noodle at the end of Mr Kennedy. Well played and all, but that's what we go to live concerts to hear. * LaCherite is a Robyn solo song with the SBs tacked on. Maybe it's 'cos I heard these first played by Robyn in Edinburgh (Mr K in Glasgow) last year. It's nothing personal. Stewart np (in rotation!): NDL / Apples in Stereo - Velocity of Sound / Elf Power - Nothing's Going To Happen (yes, James, it _does_ feature a cover of the Tall Dwarfs track, plus "Listening to the Higsons") / Elf Power - Live at The Horseshoe - -- foreach(split('',"\3\3\3c>\0>c\177cc\0~c~``\0cc\177cc")) {$_=unpack('B8',$_);tr,01,\40#,;print$_,"\n";}##IYDKINT! ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 10:02:06 -0400 From: Stewart Russell Subject: feglit brief "What's everyone reading?" interlude. I'm completely sold on "The Art of Looking Sideways", by Alan Fletcher (Phaidon Press, 2001; ISBN: 0714834491). This tome (1000+ big pages) may be the size and weight of several house bricks, but it's a treasure-trove of delightful ideas, quotations and artwork. Open it at any page, and you'll be lost for hours. It reminds me a lot of this list -- it's ostensibly about one thing, but ends up being about everything else. Stewart (trying hard not to think what the Victorian piment called "mummy" was made from.) - -- foreach(split('',"\3\3\3c>\0>c\177cc\0~c~``\0cc\177cc")) {$_=unpack('B8',$_);tr,01,\40#,;print$_,"\n";}##IYDKINT! ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 09:32:26 -0500 (CDT) From: gSs Subject: Re: feg idiom On Mon, 7 Oct 2002, Stewart Russell wrote: > brief "What's everyone reading?" interlude. just finished jupiter by asimov and just started life and energy by asimov and the outline of history by hg wells. jupiter is a technical guide to jupiter. interesting stuff to know before you go. life and energy is a guide to modern biological dynamics and the significance of heat, work, motion, chemical reaction energy etc.. and their relationships. gSs ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 10:51:15 -0500 (CDT) From: gSs Subject: Profiteers resell Africa's cheap Aids drugs. Sarah Boseley and Rory Carroll Friday October 4, 2002 Shipments of low-cost Aids drugs which were intended to save the lives of thousands of impoverished Africans have been intercepted, flown back to Europe and sold at vast profits, it emerged yesterday. At least $18m (12m) worth of Combivir and other highly effective antiretroviral drugs made by the British company GlaxoSmithKline is believed to have been hijacked. The drugs were to be sold at significantly discounted prices to clinics in Senegal, Ivory Coast, the Republic of Congo, Togo and Guinea-Bissau under a scheme to offer some drugs at lower prices to poor countries agreed by Glaxo and four other drug companies with the World Health Organisation. But about 3m doses of Combivir - a third of the supply - was diverted back to Europe by profiteering wholesalers as it arrived at the African airports or even earlier. "There are indications that perhaps some of these batches never even left Europe," said Alan Chandler, a Glaxo spokesman. The allegations of cynical profiteering by European traders have shocked activists who have been clamouring for more and cheaper Aids drugs for developing countries. At least 6 million HIV-positive people could benefit from the drugs and most of those will die without them. The latest WHO figures show that only 27,000 have got access to the vital medicines through the two-year-old UN deal called Accelerated Access. http://www.guardian.co.uk/international/story/0,3604,804381,00.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 12:45:24 -0400 From: Brian Subject: Re: minor NDL gripes At Monday, 07 October 2002, Stew: wrote: >Only things I can come up with NOT to like are: > >* the boop-be-doop supermarket music bassline to Unprotected Love. It >doesn't sit well. Oh man! That's one of my favorite parts of the album! Played NDL for my girlfriend and she digs it. Chicago will be her 2nd SB/RH experience. Nuppy ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 09:54:39 -0700 From: "Rex.Broome" Subject: Exiles, baby tunes, ghouls Michael W. >>Too bad there was a sense of hurry-up to the show ( they were the first on a >>twoshow night at the Abbey Pub, and had to clear the stage on time), because >>songs like 'Happiness' were done at twice normal speed. Not knowing the Grant tunes, I didn't notice this, but two of Kristin's tunes were definitely speeded up. One perhaps for effect (not unusual for her to do that) but one just seemed very "hurry-up". >>Kristin was terribly underwhelming at our show. Plus she still does that >>fabulously annoying sideways shimmy-thing with her head while singing. Blech. Ah, to each his own indeed... his own affected stage mannerisms, in this case. To me that "shimmy-thing" is part and parcel of the "channeled" nature of her songs, where it was Grant's rock star mannerisms which proved impentetrable to me. What was funny was how both of them transformed back into affable, funny, ebullient people between songs. I think I'd probably like GLB better than GLP. Plus admittedly one of the people I went with actively detests GLP and I'm sure that colored my opinion. For reference on my idiosyncratic taste in vocal styles, Thom Yorke makes me cringe but I love Neil Young. Perhaps I hate vocal range, having none myself? __________ Kay: >>??? I didnt know advanced pregnancy decreased a woman's ability to perform music;-P. Not so much that as to tour for months on end... but I was really comparing her directly to my wife, who looks at about the same stage of pregnancy and only made it to work in LA three times last week... and she's having a pretty "easy" pregnancy. Of course Kristin's on her 4th child and we're working on our 2nd and final... Glad you liked Miranda's hit-parade. Funny about "What Goes On", I thought that was pretty original! I also occasionally do "Rock and Roll" and adapt it to our family-- "Miranda said when she's bout eight months old you know my parents gonna be the death of us all"... and I have the same problem with Who songs, wanting to follow all the harmonies and failing. Meanwhile I like doing the Byrds because I seem to be able to pick a new "melody line" evey time I sing a given tune. Fun for the whole family! >>or why a great song is like a Tardis;-?) That's almost as good as Dylan's "A song is anything that walks around on its own". >>How do other people think of ghouls? Well, I recently annoyed a lot of people on a sailing trip by trying to differentiate between various classes of sinister supernatural beings: phantoms, spectres, shades, wraiths, ghouls, fiends, ghosts, vampires, zombies, revenants, etc. Prime questions were: corporeal or not? Formerly living or borne exclusively of the spirit world? And what do they do? Ghouls to me would be non-corporeal but not ghosts (i.e. they were never alive), and they are relatively mindless and kind of gross and hungry. A spectre would be a more sophisticated, erudite version of same. Happy Halloween! Rex ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 13:05:40 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: minor NDL gripes On Mon, 7 Oct 2002, Stewart Russell wrote: > Only things I can come up with NOT to like are: > > * the long noodle at the end of Mr Kennedy. Well played and all, but > that's what we go to live concerts to hear. It's not *that* long. But anyway, I'm not sure I get this complaint: one of the SBs' distinctive traits was the guitar interplay between Kimberley & Robyn (also, the only major band I can think of whose two guitarists have women's names but are not women). So on a 40-minute album, you're complaining about one or two minutes of it? And as some of our fellow fegs' posts have demonstrated, not everyone can go hear the band live - so a little of that on record is worth documenting. > * LaCherite is a Robyn solo song with the SBs tacked on. Probably...but as folks have commented, that's true of a lot Robyn's material going back to the Egyptians - at least one can think of them that way. I think it's the sort of acoustic-guitar arpeggiation of the figure that makes it seem that way - and perhaps the personal/mysterious lyric. But that last is part of Hitchcock's songwriting evolution generally: he's just not writing about pigworkers doing the chisel any more. Me, I just like the song, so it doesn't particularly bother me that it could easily be on one of his solo albums. I listened to NDL yesterday, and I surprised myself at how well I knew the songs, considering I've had it only since it came out (i.e., not any sooner) and haven't listened to it *that* many times. A good sign, that. To me what makes it a Soft Boys record is the two-guitar approach, Seligman's bass, and the vocal harmonies. - --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::Some see things as they are, and say "Why?" ::Some see things as they could be, and say "Why not?" ::Some see things that aren't there, and say "Huh?" np Ash _1977_ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 13:14:42 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: feglit On Mon, 7 Oct 2002, Stewart Russell wrote: > brief "What's everyone reading?" interlude. > > I'm completely sold on "The Art of Looking Sideways", by Alan Fletcher > (Phaidon Press, 2001; ISBN: 0714834491). This tome (1000+ big pages) may > be the size and weight of several house bricks, but it's a > treasure-trove of delightful ideas, quotations and artwork. Open it at > any page, and you'll be lost for hours. > > It reminds me a lot of this list -- it's ostensibly about one thing, but > ends up being about everything else. What's the one thing? (Sounds intriguing - bonus points for nearly being a Soft Boys title.) Me, I'm in the midst of three different books. First, another multi-brick tome: Harold Bloom's _Shakespeare and the Invention of the Human_, which gives Bloom, a well regarded and elderly literary critic, the opportunity to wander through each of Shakin' Willy's plays and divagate thereupon, frequently throwing in digs at contemporary literary philosophies (as I said, he's old) - many deserved, some not. A bit repetititititive, and I'm guessing his academic clout prevented mere editors from culling those bits, but intriguing in small doses. Made me want to (re)read the plays, so that's good. Second: Howard Bloom's (no relation; weird coincidence) _Global Brain: The Evolution of Mass Mind from the Big Bang to the 21st Century_, which looks at the cooperative and collective aspects of biological evoluation (as opposed to the standard focus on competition and individuality). While Bloom's title might suggest nearly a new-age focus, his ideas are rooted in science rather than mysticism or spirituality. Curiously, one of yahoo's headlines today was on the Nobel Prize in Medicine being awarded to two scientists whose work concerned "cell suicide": a topic Bloom addresses here (and apparently addressed at greater length in his previous book, _The Lucifer Principle_). And finally, by way of relief: _The Monster Book_, which walks through all the "monsters" on _Buffy the Vampire Slayer_ through the first four seasons and gives some background on the myths surrounding those types of monsters. Oh: and I'm teaching Kalle Lasn's _Culture Jam: The Uncooling of America(tm)_. Every once in a while, I find nothing to do and post to this list. - --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::the sea is the night asleep in the daytime:: __Robert Desnos__ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 14:50:15 -0400 From: Stewart Russell Subject: Re: feglit Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey wrote: > > What's the one thing? (Sounds intriguing - bonus points for nearly being a > Soft Boys title.) it's *supposed* to be about creativity in design, but it's not one of those appalling How To Be Creative books that suggests wearing a beret and writing in green ink. TAOLS has a clever little warning on the perils of writing in green ink in order to appear eccentric; something like, "I wouldn't trust someone who wrote in green ink, but I suspect that's one of my eccentricities." What's this list about? Surely you know by now. Stewart ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 14:59:01 -0400 From: Stewart Russell Subject: Re: minor NDL gripes Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey wrote: > > So on a 40-minute album, you're > complaining about one or two minutes of it? yes, sorry. Unless an album has a Prog Advisory label on it (a bit like the Explicit lyrics one, but done in pastel colours by Roger Dean), I like it to be noodle-free. > And as some of our fellow fegs' posts have demonstrated, not everyone can > go hear the band live - so a little of that on record is worth > documenting. Hey, I'm one of the fegs thus affected. I'd go see 'em if it weren't for these crappy N.Am. holidays (or total lack of them). But the guitar duelling is too clean in the studio. On stage, it's amazing, with R & K feeding each other leads, but, like a frog, it dies when dissected. > Probably...but as folks have commented, that's true of a lot Robyn's > material going back to the Egyptians I blame hearing him sing a very early version. I still prefer that to the NDL one. > he's just not writing about pigworkers doing the chisel any more. And why not? Nothing wrong with that. Don't forget that on the same album as Pigworker and Chisel was Human Music, my ultimate favourite SBs lyric. Stewart ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 14:03:07 -0500 (CDT) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: Re: feglit On Mon, 7 Oct 2002, Stewart Russell wrote: > it's *supposed* to be about creativity in design, but it's not one of > those appalling How To Be Creative books that suggests wearing a beret > and writing in green ink. TAOLS has a clever little warning on the > perils of writing in green ink in order to appear eccentric; something > like, "I wouldn't trust someone who wrote in green ink, but I suspect > that's one of my eccentricities." "Creativity" is one of those awful words that everyone likes to praise but too often ends up being "please value my cliched little deviation from the norm, like wow I'm going to spell my first name wrong on purpose" or something. That said, the quality it actually names is valuable, and rare, I suppose. To me it has something to do with (another buzzword) lateral thinking, the ability to make connections among disparate things, seeing things differently, adaptive reuse, etc. Does anyone else get the feeling that for Robyn, "creativity" is almost like a living substance oozing out of his pores nearly against his will, such that he's almost *compelled* to write/paint/draw/sing/story-tell etc.? And somewhat oddly, given that he's never seemed to lack for supporters, collaborators, and people who get on with him, there seems a profound loneliness at his core, which might be one reason his music can be so affecting, regardless of the surface oddity and even absurdity it sometimes sports? (Something that, incidentally, Robyn-imitators almost invariably get wrong, and so seem stupidly shallow by comparison. One exception, and I wouldn't call him an imitator per se - partly because he does create a sense of emotional connectedness that's his own, at least for me: Sacramento's Anton Barbeau. Obvious RH influence there - but for me, at least, he transcends mere influence.) - --Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::a squid eating dough in a polyethylene bag is fast and bulbous...got me? __Captain Beefheart__ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 14:20:37 -0500 From: Miles Goosens Subject: feg imit At 02:03 PM 10/7/2002 -0500, Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey wrote: >One >exception, and I wouldn't call him an imitator per se - partly because he >does create a sense of emotional connectedness that's his own, at least >for me: Sacramento's Anton Barbeau. Obvious RH influence there - but for >me, at least, he transcends mere influence.) Mr. Barbeau also used to subscribe to this list. Don't I get a banana? later, Miles ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V11 #317 ********************************