From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V11 #295 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Friday, September 20 2002 Volume 11 : Number 295 Today's Subjects: ----------------- bryson book [Eleanore Adams ] Re: self-filing [Marshall Needleman Armintor ] Re: fegmaniax-digest V11 #294 [drew ] Re: self-filing [Stewart Russell ] Geek overdrive ["Rex.Broome" ] Private Radio ["Rex.Broome" ] Re: defiling [Eb ] Building Your own CD rack ["Jason Brown (Echo Services Inc)" ] Attention Psychedelic people ["Eugene Hopstetter, Jr." ] Re: Buying Nextdoorland ["Kenneth Johnson" ] RE: Buying Nextdoorland ["Bachman, Michael" ] geek filing ["ross taylor" ] Re: Buying Nextdoorland [Alfred Masciocchi ] noooooooo [grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan)] filing your nails [grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan)] your dictionary [grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan)] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2002 12:35:43 -0700 From: Eleanore Adams Subject: bryson book The new Bryson book is called Bryson's Dictionary of Troublesome Words. e ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2002 14:48:57 -0500 (CDT) From: Marshall Needleman Armintor Subject: Re: self-filing Heh, I had to go look just now. I'd be between Archers of Loaf and Louis Armstrong. And unless I buy anything by someone called Armstead or Arminnaches even someone called Bob Armstrong or whatever, I'll always be filed next to Louis Armstrong, on the right, anyway. My wife's late uncle not only filed his records by genre (he was a blues and jazz guy), he subdivided them by _region_, _style_, and period: e.g. North Mississippi electric blues was separated from 20-30s Delta blues, and both were distinguished from postwar Chicago electric blues...and needless to say, I guess, he didn't having anything newer than 1965. Marshall np Princess Superstar ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2002 12:50:38 -0700 From: drew Subject: Re: fegmaniax-digest V11 #294 >From: "Jason R. Thornton" >Recent concerts: Morrissey/Jumbo/Jagueres I saw that. Here's what I said about it: http://www.livejournal.com/talkread.bml?journal=octopus&itemid=147226&nc=2 >From: "Rex.Broome" >[Poison] >You mean they *weren't* ugly girls? For some reason Boy George being basically a drag queen never fazed me at all as a kid. He never even seemed all that weird. I had pretty much the same reaction to 80s hair bands -- it was just The Look, and that's all. Maybe you have to be older and have more ossified ideas of how people should look and dress to react this way to musicians. For example, those nu-metal bands with the shaggy goatees down to their nipples? I have trouble imagining a dumber, more thoroughly repulsive look. Who worships these schmoes? >From: "matt sewell" >So who files their albums alphabetically? I used to, but since I moved they're all just in the right section by first letter, and then chronologically for each artist. That's the 800 or so that I have out; the rest are in boxes. (After what happened to Glen I'm now pretty worried about my CD collection. Why couldn't I like things I didn't have to collect? :( Although I'm not as worried as this guy: >From: gSs [...] >His count in the main room is more >than 8700, plus a few thousand in other parts of the house, with a total >exceeding 11000. he organizes them alphabetically by genre. ) >From: Tom Clark >- -tc, but I still can't find the case for "Kid A!" > >p.s. Punctuation geeks - is the above correct? I remember learning that you >always put the punctuation inside the quotes, but it just doesn't look right >sometimes. I handle it on a case-by-case basis. In this one I would have written it as: "Kid A"! because with record albums you never know when the punctuation is part of the title (e.g. "Fegmania!"?). In practice I usually don't end up putting the punctuation in quotes unless I'm actually quoting someone. Drew ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2002 15:53:57 -0400 From: Stewart Russell Subject: Re: self-filing Marshall Needleman Armintor wrote: > > he subdivided them by _region_, _style_, and period that makes sense; Chicago electric is miles away from the acoustic, good-timey Piedmont blues. Stewart np "How Animals Move" - John Parish (and I'm not sure if I really like it or really hate it; I can't tell. I really *something* it, anyway.) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2002 13:24:09 -0700 From: "Rex.Broome" Subject: Geek overdrive Brian H.: >>Between Robyn Hitchcock and Husker Du. >>- - Brian "what do I win?" Huddell Umm, the "Ultimate Badass Award"? That can't be topped. Although Sebastian's: >>Between the Go-Betweens and Nina Hagen ...is a very interesting place conceptually. ___________ >>has anyone noticed that the new Sleater-Kinney album (well, the bonus >>EP) and Nextdoorland both have songs called "Lions & Tigers"? Yeah, and the S-K tune is great. Never expected to describe a Sleater-Kinney song as "heartwarming" but that one is. Corin Tucker's kid was born within a week or so of my daughter, so all the baby stuff on that record, particularly vis-a-vis 9/11 ("Faraway" = holy shit, I brought a child into THIS MESS?) is extremely visceral to me. Definitely one of my favorite albumsof the year. _____ Matt: >>is this the geekiest thread ever on Fegmaniax? Perhaps someone would like >>to compile a list of the top ten...? ;0) If you did so, you'd win! >>So who files their albums alphabetically? Me. Otherwise I'd never find anything in my pile of 2500 discs. Someone mentioned the filing of compilations in and amongst the artists. I do that, too, but I'm reconsidering. But while I may decide to group "various artists" together, I will never, ever, file them under "V". That just bugs. Michael: >>Here is the geek part, >>I also do it by original release date of the recording. I file single-artist compilations chronologically by recording date of the most recent material contained therein... thus, let's say I buy that Camper Van Beethoven box set with a 2002 vintage; I will still file it BEFORE Our Beloved Revolutionary Sweetheart. Dig? Boots go in chronologically after the albums being toured. 11,000 CD's... that's something. I'll never make it to 3,000, I don't think. My wish list is dwindling faster than interesting new releases appear. _________ Michael to Jason: >>Jason, no Throwing Muses in you collection? My dad's band, Thunderhill, of which I am a latter-day member, used to sit next to the Muses on my shelf. Then I got me some Thunderclap Newman. My ex-band There Goes Bill sits between Thelonious Monster and They Might Be Giants. We might be said to have shared much with the lamer aspects of both artists. The aforementioned Carolinas: between the Cardigans and, erm, Mary-Chapin Carpenter. Same logic applies, oddly enough. My one-off project the Astonishing Panda Inferno lives betwixt Ass Ponys and Chet Atkins, sharing little with either other than a career which is over. _______ Jeffrey (FF) >>one reason I dislike bands that mess with capitalization etc. and insist on it in >>every usage: they're confusing graphic design with typography. Oh, I agree, and I was the one who suggested "banning" the practice. But I just really like the "Minutemen" and "Firehose" as bands. One good aspect of the practice in fIREHOSE's case is that it helps distinguish them from Firehouse, and anything that does that serves a valuable function. - -Rex "I Was Also Forced to Design and Build My Own CD Rack But That's Another Story" Broome ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2002 13:33:41 -0700 From: "Rex.Broome" Subject: Private Radio Jason: >>Sadly, Jason Bob Thornton never bought Billy Bob Thornton's solo album. Oh, that's not sad at all. I actually heard some of that album. Now that's sad. "They all said we'd never make it. Two crazy panthers on the prowl. They said we would only fake it for a while. We just looked at them and growled.'' -"Angelina", Billy Bob Thornton - -Rex Bob Broome ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2002 13:22:24 -0700 From: Eb Subject: Re: defiling >Between Robyn Hitchcock and Husker Du. > >- - Brian "what do I win?" Huddell What else? A shopping list! Woo! Kristian Hoffman Robin Holcomb Hole Peter Holsapple & Chris Stamey Hoodoo Gurus The Hope Blister Wayne Horvitz House of Freaks Hugo Largo Lida Husik This isn't anywhere near the geekiest thread, by the way...especially this year, I've watched some real lulus unfold. Eb np: Queens of the Stone Age ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2002 13:30:44 -0700 From: "Jason Brown (Echo Services Inc)" Subject: Building Your own CD rack Rex Wrote: >Rex "I Was Also Forced to Design and Build My Own CD Rack But That's > Another Story" Broome That's a story I'd definitely like to hear as I am currently about to embark on such a project. Currently I have them in very tall dangerous piles on top of a long chest of drawers in my bedroom. But I'm trying o come up with a safer solution after half of them tumbled to the floor and blocked my door trapping me in my room for 90 minutes as I dug out. Oddly only 2 CD cases broke. I also decided I needed to be a good librarian and weed my collection as picked up CDs off the floor I had listened to in over 5 years. So any ideas low cost homemade solutions would be appreciated. Jason "thinking the new Beck is excellent" Brown ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2002 13:32:42 -0700 (PDT) From: "Eugene Hopstetter, Jr." Subject: Buying Nextdoorland Four days to go till it hits the shelves, and I want it now. Release copies of the LP and CD are appearing on eBay already, but none of the record stores I called have it in stock. I pre-ordered it on LP from 33 Degrees in Austin and can't wait for it to arrive in the mail. I want it now. I am really enjoying the "Mr. Kennedy" MP3. I am really looking forward to the LP. September 24 is a big, big music release day for me. I'll buy new albums from Rhett Miller, Porcupine Tree, the Soft Boys, *and* the "This Time With Feeling" Buffy Musical CD. Oh, and gSs, that's a *sweet* score on the B3s. What kind of tube amps do they have in them? Are they good tubes? . New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! http://sbc.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2002 13:38:42 -0700 (PDT) From: "Eugene Hopstetter, Jr." Subject: Attention Psychedelic people I've been constantly listening to a streaming radio station at this URL: It's the best I've heard in a long time. 60s psychdelic from such bong-loaded chart-toppers as The Koobas, Tangerine Zoo, Bubble Puppy, 49th Parallel, Small Faces, peppered with period radio spots. NP: the swirling mellotrons of The Rolling Stones's "2000 Light Years From Home" New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! http://sbc.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2002 15:45:33 -0500 (CDT) From: gSs Subject: Re: Buying Nextdoorland On Fri, 20 Sep 2002, Eugene Hopstetter, Jr. wrote: > Oh, and gSs, that's a *sweet* score on the B3s. What kind of tube amps do > they have in them? Are they good tubes? are the L and Concorde series classified as B3s? i am just learning the hammond lore. i am not sure of the brand bit I am in the process of cleaning the L-101 and I will send the name when I get it. there are two of them along with an individual vacuum pre-amp that I believe is for the percussion. the two main amps have 12Ax7s and 6l6GCs and the pre-amp has a couple 12Ax7s and another couple I have not identified. where can I get the tubes tested? what happened to all those tube testers that were on at least one end cap in every grocery store during the 70's. gSs ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2002 14:02:55 -0700 From: "Kenneth Johnson" Subject: Re: Buying Nextdoorland Eugene Hopstetter, Jr qouth: "Four days to go till it hits the shelves, and I want it now" I ordered my copy of NDL straight from Matador online and it was shipped Sept. 17th. I expect it on my doorstep today or tomorrow! Vis-a-vis filing yourself: Not sure one could beat the Robyn/Husker sandwich. I believe I'd be between Jesus and Mary Chain and Howard Jones (the latter thanks to my wife's inclusion). I am constantly making the "That's not mine" disclaimer" when friends peruse our collection with regards to such early 80s gems like Kaja-Goo-Goo and Thompson Twins. I used to file chronologically within alphabetical artists, but now I am happy if they are just alphabetical. I do keep rock and pop separate from jazz, orchestral, world and spoken word. Even various artists are sorted at the end, including soundtracks. My books are separated into fiction and non with the latter further subdivided into subjects like philosophy,history,biography,language arts,criticism, etc. I also am interested in building a shelf to house approx. 1000 CDs. I have these disgusting black, plastic towers and a couple of irksome, wood carousels I would love to be rid of for good. Any advice or helpful hints or creative alternatives to CD storage? I need to build some nice book shelves someday too. I still a couple of pre-fab eye-sores hanging out from back in the day. peas, Kenneth >From: "Eugene Hopstetter, Jr." >Reply-To: "Eugene Hopstetter, Jr." >To: fegmaniax@smoe.org >Subject: Buying Nextdoorland >Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2002 13:32:42 -0700 (PDT) > >Four days to go till it hits the shelves, and I want it now. Release >copies of >the LP and CD are appearing on eBay already, but none of the record stores >I >called have it in stock. I pre-ordered it on LP from 33 Degrees in Austin >and >can't wait for it to arrive in the mail. I want it now. > >I am really enjoying the "Mr. Kennedy" MP3. I am really looking forward to >the >LP. > >September 24 is a big, big music release day for me. I'll buy new albums >from >Rhett Miller, Porcupine Tree, the Soft Boys, *and* the "This Time With >Feeling" >Buffy Musical CD. > >Oh, and gSs, that's a *sweet* score on the B3s. What kind of tube amps do >they >have in them? Are they good tubes? > >. >New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! >http://sbc.yahoo.com Kenneth ************************************ "And if you can't shape your life the way you want, at least try as much as you can not to degrade it by too much contact with the world, by too much activity and talk. Try not to degrade it by dragging it along, taking it around and exposing it so often to the daily silliness of social events and parties, until it comes to seem a boring hanger-on" - --C.P. Cavafy (translated from the Greek by Edmund Keeley and Philip Sherrard) ************************************* _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2002 17:27:24 -0400 From: "Bachman, Michael" Subject: RE: Buying Nextdoorland Kenneth wrote: >I also am interested in building a shelf to house approx. 1000 CDs. I have >these disgusting black, plastic towers and a couple of irksome, wood >carousels I would love to be rid of for good. Any advice or helpful hints >or creative alternatives to CD storage? >I need to build some nice book shelves someday too. I still a couple of >pre-fab eye-sores hanging out from back in the day. If you wanted to buy cd cabinets, try Sorice. They make really nice 300 disc (and smaller) stackable cabinets in Golden Oak, Brown Oak, Black Lacquered Oak, Walnut or Cherry. You can order them with clear or smoked glass doors. I am sold on them, they have excellant quality and run sales frequently durring the year. Michael ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2002 21:28:50 +0000 From: "Brian Hoare" Subject: RE: filing myself >From: "matt sewell" > >Subject: RE: filing myself >Is this the geekiest thread ever on Fegmaniax? I saw this start in the last digest and didn't realise how many replies there would be. Myself: Between Robyn (again) and Horslips (both in vinyl and cd) Sarah would have the enviable task of snuggling in between Nina Simone and Siouxie. (Klaus Schulze/Siouxie in vinyl). >So who files their albums alphabetically? 'Fraid so. Classical by composer, solo artist/ "X and ..." by surname and all that. I'm considering moving the Jap psych into its own section for reasons not worth you knowing:) Brian _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2002 17:35:40 -0400 From: "ross taylor" Subject: geek filing Between Mick Taylor (whew! saved from James) and Teardrop Explodes. But thats pop LPs --alpha by artist, then chron. Blues, jazz & folk are together w/ the same treatment, classical are too hard to arrange & a small enuf collection that they're random. (If I did them by label there'd be a longish Nonesuch stretch). I can't say where I'd be in the CDs because they're in various chronological/thematic groupings, "fav mid-60s" "east-coast/brit/euro early 70s" "west-coast or folky early 70s" (includes Incredible String Band), and so forth. It has driven me mad, but that's fun too. - --- Stewart-- > usage, too; f'rinstance, the uses of "sorry" and "excuse me" are > completely reversed between (particularly) Scottish and Midwestern US > usage. I thought everybody now just said "no problem"? Ross Taylor Join 18 million Eudora users by signing up for a free Eudora Web-Mail account at http://www.eudoramail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2002 17:56:07 -0400 From: Alfred Masciocchi Subject: Re: Buying Nextdoorland Is the release date still 9/24? The latest issue of ICE which arrived yesterday now has it for release on 10/9. "Eugene Hopstetter, Jr." wrote: > Four days to go till it hits the shelves, and I want it now. Release copies of > the LP and CD are appearing on eBay already, but none of the record stores I > called have it in stock. I pre-ordered it on LP from 33 Degrees in Austin and > can't wait for it to arrive in the mail. I want it now. > > September 24 is a big, big music release day for me. I'll buy new albums from > Rhett Miller, Porcupine Tree, the Soft Boys, *and* the "This Time With Feeling" > Buffy Musical CD. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2002 10:31:18 +1200 From: grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan) Subject: noooooooo from: HOLLYWOOD Nobody rescues collection depicting sci-fi era September 20, 2002 HOLLYWOOD - For Hollywood and history, it was horrifying. Vultures descended on the estate sale, bickering over prices and carting severed monster heads and space aliens out the landmark mansion's door. Forrest J. Ackerman, the 85-year-old author and sci-fi king, graciously sat on a fold-out chair and watched his lifelong dream destroyed. Somehow, he managed a smile as strangers grabbed up his late wife's $1 Jell-O molds along with the priceless treasures he'd amassed since he was 10 years old. For 51 years, almost every Saturday morning and for free, the enthusiastic funster tookwhomever showed up on a lively, chill-filled "touch everything" tour of the "Ackermansion," jampacked with a 300,000-piece movie memorabilia collection once dubbed the "Fort Knox of Science Fiction." Mostly it was regular folks from around the globe, but A-list celebs, including Bela Lugosi, Vincent Price and Steven Spielberg - the latter who with George Lucas credits Ackerman with inspiring their filmmaking - also ogled at the Martian machine from "The War of the Worlds" and the pteranodon that tried to spirit away Fay Wray in the 1933 "King Kong." Though he was repeatedly ripped off - some moron even hijacked half of the 18-foot sub from "Atlantis, the Lost Continent" - Ackerman until lately let strangers trek through his bathrooms, bedrooms and kitchen because he wanted to share the gifts and purchases he poured every penny into. But here's the real horror story: For decades, Forry, as he was nicknamed, futilely tried to get Hollywood studios, moguls and the city of L.A. to give his wondrous wares a permanent home. And now it's too late. Ackerman had to sell the dilapidating 18-room mansion, move into a small nearby bungalow and liquidate the largest collection of its kind in order to pay $200,000 in legal bills incurred during a court battle with former business partner Ray Ferry over the pen name Dr. Acula. Ackerman won but Ferry declared bankruptcy. "How much is this?" the vultures buzzed as they snatched Forry's beloved fantasy paintings and posters off the walls. "$25," Ackerman replied. "Will you take $23?" Author Ray Bradburydidn't go to the weekend estate sale; he says he would've cried. Ackerman, who was the longtime editor of the pulp magazine, Famous Monsters of Filmland, gave Bradbury his first writing break in 1937. "It's a disaster. This shouldn't have happened," said Bradbury, who claims that over the years he tried to get everyone from the late Mayor Tom Bradley to Spielberg to help with a museum. "Hollywood has never done anything about itself. They're greedy, selfish and they're stupid!" Ackerman, who coined the term "sci-fi" in the '50s and created the Vampirella comic, is still recovering from pneumonia and brain surgery to remove a blood clot, but he sat in that fold-out chair all day, autographing every bargain-basement item for free. Once, he seemed on the verge of tears when he turned over a gargoyle figurine to write his name and saw an old message from the fan who gave it to him - "To Forry" next to a heart. But then, he bravely grinned and addressed the next customer in line. "Can I come and visit your collection sometime with all that great art?" he kindly asked the man buying a sci-fi trove. Who knows why Hollywood, rapturous for remakes but pathetic at preserving its past, never came through. A rep for Spielberg said he remembered being offered all or part of the collection but that the director "may not have been interested at that time" or that when asked, "it was so casual, in the middle of a movie, that it never got further than that." A spokesman for the Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences said a curator from its library, which has extensive archives on Ackerman, visited his home, but that an "official" proposal was never made and the collection was too diverse for the academy. Whatever. It's scary. So instead, there was the ghastly garage sale. Soon, there'll be three auctions, where Forry's 50,000 spine-tingling book collection and other high-end relics go on the block. He did manage to keep about 50 of his most prized mementos, which now surround him in his modest rental. Before going to the estate sale, the lanky gent put aside his walking cane and hammed it up in a cape that Lugosi donned in a 1932 stage production of "Dracula." (Theatrics come easy - he's had scores of cameos, and laughs that as a teetotaler, he drank apple juice at a bar in "Beverly Hills Cop III"). Next to the dining table, he showed off the teeth and top hat worn by Lon Chaney in the 1927 film "London After Midnight." "Don't touch it! That will blow us all to Adam!" he jokingly shouted when a reporter neared a mounted electricity switch from the 1935 "Bride of Frankenstein." Forry has no heirs. "These things are his children," said Ann Robinson, a friend who starred in the 1953 "War of the Worlds." And, no surprise, this big-hearted creature still wants to share his brood with everyone. Next month, with his live-in nurse at his side and by appointment only, Forry plans to begin giving tours of his new digs. He devilishly smiled; once again he'll joyously spook "victims" with long-lost Hollywood lore. Copley News Service writer Norma Meyer reports from Hollywood, as she sees it. Copyright 2002 Union-Tribune Publishing Co. James Dignan, Dunedin, New Zealand. =-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= .-=-.-=-.-=-.- .-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-. -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= You talk to me as if from a distance =-.-=-. And I reply with impressions chosen from another time -=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=- (Brian Eno - "By this River") ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2002 11:28:29 +1200 From: grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan) Subject: filing your nails >James: >>>Driving Miss Daisy, Raising Arizona, Leaving Las Vegas, Saving Private >Ryan, >>Wheeling West Virginia... > >You just put that last one in there to mess with me, right? If it's not an >actual film, why have you even HEARD of Wheeling? guilty secret. "The ballad of Billy the Kid" by Billy Joel. >From: Jeff Dwarf > >by nom de feg: The Dukes of Stratosphear and Bob Dylan > >by nom de reality: Aimee Mann and Bob Marley admit it - you're Mantovani, aren't you? >> First band to mess with punctuation: I think fIREHOSE predates aHouse in >> this field. I believe they were playing on their previous identity as the >> Minutemen, who often, but I don't think always, spelled their name >> "minutemen". > >I think that was just design. One shouldn't confuse design - in which >someone might decide lower-case letters look better - with typography. agreed. Otherwise you'd have to count things like the backward B in Abba. >Rex wrote: >>Good on ya for filing the classical with the pop. who doesn't (apart from the guy Mr. Shell met, who has obvious reasons not to)? James (who has Antonin Dvorak between Ian Dury and Bob Dylan) PS _ ggod score with those Hammonds, gSs! James Dignan, Dunedin, New Zealand. =-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= .-=-.-=-.-=-.- .-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-. -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= You talk to me as if from a distance =-.-=-. And I reply with impressions chosen from another time -=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=- (Brian Eno - "By this River") ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2002 11:46:17 +1200 From: grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan) Subject: your dictionary >> > ... what IS the point of having English and American dictionaries, >> > Stewart? >> >> 'cos color, woolen and tire (noun) are just as wrong in UK english as >> colour, woollen and tyre are in US english. Then of course there's >> Canadian colour, but tire ... > >now i feel dumb. > >so is it only about spelling? all the same weird slang terms show up in >both? Remember also that words sometimes have different meanings on the different sides of the Atlantic. "Presently" is more likely to mean 'soon' in the UK and 'now' in the US. "Rubber" means 'eraser' in the UK and 'condom' in the US. Etc etc etc. One of my lecturers at University wrote a dictionary for Americans visiting New Zealand*, explaining local terms and colloquialisms, and - at one point - - explaining what words are different in NZ English to American English (of which there were over 120 listed), from sporting terms (bowling, hockey, hooker, football, trots) to around the house and farm (wetback, crib, skip, copper, villa, flat, fencing, freezer, station) to food (Belgium, biscuit, chips, cinnamon, lemonade), to education and work (professor, college, solicitor, varsity, boot, normal school), to clothes and fashion (strides, swish, togs), to conversation (come again, away laughing, hooray, eh, cracker), to body parts and functions (crook, fanny, root, hooter). I suspect that - although many of these are slang terms - these are the sort of differences that US and UK dictionaries would contain. Larger US English/UK English dictionaries may also have usage guides which will have further differences (e.g., 'different from' in the UK, 'different than' in the US; 'compares with' in the UK, 'compares to' in the US). >Are there any stats or any other evidence that suggests that writers of the >major different forms of English -- Im guessing you can call them -- English >English, Scottish English, Irish English(where does one stop with >these--Wales, Cornwall, the Isle of Mann?) American English, Canadian >English, South-African English, Indian English?, Australian English and New >Zealand English -- are becoming more aware of the different forms, and that >these forms are now influencing each other more, because of the Net? first questions first: Welsh English, Cornish English, and Manz English are, I'm sure, merely dialects (you'd get far more differentiation between London and Newcastle than you would between London and Douglas, Isle of Man). I think it's in the degree of difference from the standard. Someone from the IoM would be understandable by someone from London. But then again, to quote a conversation between Dennis and an Arizona bartender in the recent series of Auf Wiedersehn Pet: "Cheers Colly, divvent fret pet we dinnen cause any aggro ye know, is too canny a place man" "Didn't understand a word hon, but the next beer's on me" I think that a lot of people using variants of English were aware of them long before the net. Certainly those who used versions other that US English were, anyway. The constant bombardment by US culture via Hollywood, television, music and major franchised business meant that a lot of US English was known outside the US from way back. A couple of examples: from way back we knew about: Technicolor (not Technicolour), 'Zee' rather than 'zed' (thanks to Sesame Street), and I used to own CDs of True Colours by Split Enz and True Colors by Cyndi Lauper. What always surprises me is when Americans deliberately choose to use UK spellings for no apparent reason (such as Husker Du's album "Candy Apple Grey"). That example's a real oddity. Surely in the states it would be 'gray', whereas in the UK it would be 'Toffee apple grey'). James * for you librarians out there: "A personal Kiwi-Yankee Dictionary" by Louis S. Leland, jr. (US Publisher: Pelican Publishing Co;1990; ISBN 0882894145). It's somewhat dated (not updated for about 15 years), and the level of political correctness could be a bit higher, but it's a load of fun as well as being informative. PS: >- -tc, but I still can't find the case for "Kid A!" > >p.s. Punctuation geeks - is the above correct? I remember learning that you >always put the punctuation inside the quotes, but it just doesn't look right >sometimes. I think you put the punctuation inside only if it is part of what went inside. So in this case, it would be '..."Kid A"!'. If you were quoting someone and what they said sounded like it needed an exclamation mark, then it would go inside the quotation marks. James Dignan, Dunedin, New Zealand. =-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= .-=-.-=-.-=-.- .-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-. -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= You talk to me as if from a distance =-.-=-. And I reply with impressions chosen from another time -=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=- (Brian Eno - "By this River") ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V11 #295 ********************************