From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V11 #289 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Sunday, September 15 2002 Volume 11 : Number 289 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Paper Puppets [Mike Swedene ] R:wind ["Golden Hind" ] More soace junk ["Golden Hind" ] Re: Iraq and Afghanistan and stuff [Aaron Mandel ] Re: cvb, rew, s3 [Aaron Mandel ] Ugly Americans and stuff [Christopher Gross ] I can't resist [steve ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2002 20:56:12 -0700 (PDT) From: Mike Swedene Subject: Paper Puppets Where is the link for the soft boys paper puppet thingies we had? I lost my link to it. Thanks! Herbie np-> "Black" Pearl Jam ===== - --------------------------------------------- View my Websight & CDR Trade page at: http://midy.topcities.com/ _____________________________________________ Yahoo! News - Today's headlines http://news.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 15:12:50 +0000 From: "Golden Hind" Subject: R:wind James-- Thanks for the links and info. You are an earth angel indeed. And if the devil comes from Kansas, perhaps an angel comes from Taxsas(which leads me nicely into thanking Greg for his info:-) >[sound of raspberry being blown] Sound of 3 Bronx cheers in return. Kay _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 15:26:58 +0000 From: "Golden Hind" Subject: More soace junk Alas Matt, space junk it seems to be: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/low/science/nature/2253385.stm _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 13:39:19 -0400 (EDT) From: Aaron Mandel Subject: Re: Iraq and Afghanistan and stuff On Fri, 13 Sep 2002, Christopher Gross wrote: > I'm glad we all agree there. I don't know if I ever said so in so many > words, but the thing that most upset me about leftist reactions to Sept. > 11 was that they seemed to reserve all their anger for the American > response. Sure, most of them condemned the al Qaeda attacks, but > without a tithe of the passion and fervor with which they condemned > America. Well, someone already pointed out how this was the standard spin assigned by jackasses to almost any leftist commentary a year ago, but since I'm assuming you don't mean it with the anti-liberal fervor that it was so often said, I'll try to take it at face value: For me, personally, the reason was that I *wasn't* complicit in the al-Qaida attacks! I mean, these are horrible, horrible people, but what does hating them do for me? They've already written off me and every other American as the enemy. Spending time actively hating al-Qaida, as opposed to just wanting to get rid of them, is shouting down a well. On the other hand, I was suddenly surrounded by people talking loudly about how all Americans felt, and how America had to do this or that. Well, I'm American, and while I guess it might be futile at the time I thought my opinions mattered. So I despised the people who claimed to speak for me, who drew their power from the moral weight of acting on behalf of 300 million people, who behaved like they had never had a sincere moment of comprehension about lefty ideals or peace or civil fucking freedoms in their lives. al-Qaida never betrayed me. They're just violent motherfuckers who, it became clear last year, pose more of a threat to me and the people I love than I had previously thought. That's not an emotional issue for me; it's a practical one. Seeing my country's leaders disgrace us with the percentage of their time they're spending with heads up asses, and the degree to which their own venal instincts distract them from the problems at hand -- that's an emotional issue for me. a ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 13:41:08 -0400 (EDT) From: Aaron Mandel Subject: Re: cvb, rew, s3 On Thu, 12 Sep 2002, Brian Hoare wrote: > I checked the track listing at amazon which suggests that instead of the > wished for filling of discs with goodies, the first 4 cds are just the > albums as they were so any new stuff will be on the 14 track 5th disc > from which All Her Favorite Fruit (Orchestral) was already CVB Is Dead. I believe the 5th disc is a live set (apparently from pretty late, but hopefully with Segel still on board). I'm pretty sure there's better unreleased CvB stuff out there than the swampwater on CVB Is Dead; with two rarities discs already out there, though, either I'm wrong or something is keeping it from seeing the light of day. a ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2002 20:24:03 -0400 (EDT) From: Christopher Gross Subject: Ugly Americans and stuff A few more comments on a lazy Saturday afternoon ... whoops, no, it's evening already.... On Fri, 13 Sep 2002, Rex.Broome wrote: > Chris G.: > >>I don't know if I ever said so in so many words, but the thing that most > upset me >>about leftist reactions to Sept. 11 was that they seemed to > reserve all their anger >>for the American response. > > See, I'm not at all sure that's true. That's what the right expected them > to do and they were quick to paint any skeptical comments from the left that > way. My bad -- I should have written "the reactions of SOME leftists." Not all of them did this by any means. Hell, by mainstream American standards I'm a raving leftist myself! But I think my comment was a fair description of MANY people on the left, especially when you get farther left than the average Gore voter.... On Sat, 14 Sep 2002, Aaron Mandel wrote: [in response to the same comment] > Well, someone already pointed out how this was the standard spin assigned > by jackasses to almost any leftist commentary a year ago, but since I'm > assuming you don't mean it with the anti-liberal fervor that it was so > often said, I'll try to take it at face value: Well, thanks. ;-) If you believe this is just "standard jackass spin," does that mean you don't think any leftists fell into that category? That there weren't really people who were only angry at the US, and saw al Qaeda as something like a hurricane or earthquake, something worthy of sadness but not anger? Your own words make it sound like you fall into this category. > For me, personally, the reason was that I *wasn't* complicit in the > al-Qaida attacks! I mean, these are horrible, horrible people, but what > does hating them do for me? They've already written off me and every other > American as the enemy. Spending time actively hating al-Qaida, as opposed > to just wanting to get rid of them, is shouting down a well. But hatred aside, you didn't feel just a moment of *anger*? You didn't think "those fucking al-Qaeda bastards!" just once? > On the other hand, I was suddenly surrounded by people talking loudly > about how all Americans felt, and how America had to do this or that. > Well, I'm American, and while I guess it might be futile at the time I > thought my opinions mattered. So I despised the people who claimed to > speak for me, who drew their power from the moral weight of acting on > behalf of 300 million people, who behaved like they had never had a > sincere moment of comprehension about lefty ideals or peace or civil > fucking freedoms in their lives. > > al-Qaida never betrayed me. They're just violent motherfuckers who, it > became clear last year, pose more of a threat to me and the people I love > than I had previously thought. That's not an emotional issue for me; it's > a practical one. Seeing my country's leaders disgrace us with the > percentage of their time they're spending with heads up asses, and the > degree to which their own venal instincts distract them from the problems > at hand -- that's an emotional issue for me. Okay, that's exactly the attitude I was talking about. I don't like it any better now that you've elaborated on it. You don't get emotional when a group of "violent motherfuckers" attacks your country and kills thousands of people, but your fellow citizens who disagree with you politically or follow policies you don't like -- they really make your blood boil. That just bothers me. You have a right to feel however you want, and to express your feelings, and I'm not saying you don't; but these particular feelings disturb and alienate me. I'm too lazy to say much about the whole ecological circumstances leading to cultural differences thread; let's just say I agree with most of what's been writtten there, but would also caution against making it a universal explanation for all trends in human history. I'd recommend Jared Diamond's _Guns, Germs and Steel_; also, on a narrower focus, William MacNeill's _Plagues and Peoples_. - --Chris ______________________________________________________________________ Christopher Gross On the Internet, nobody knows I'm a dog. chrisg@gwu.edu ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2002 09:16:55 -0500 From: steve Subject: I can't resist Spirited Away clips and featurette, in English - http://movies.yahoo.com/shop?d=hv&id=1808405164&cf=trailer - - Steve __________ Does pop music really change anything other than the width of a teenager's trousers? Is there really no Santa Claus on the evening stage? Does the shed hold only a push bike, or is there a lawn mower in there too? Well, I've done the research, talked to the culprit's parents and come to my own conclusions. The answer is this: God's atoms have been scattered and re-assembled in the form of a fluffy bunny. - Bill Nelson ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V11 #289 ********************************