From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V11 #72 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Sunday, March 3 2002 Volume 11 : Number 072 Today's Subjects: ----------------- RE: more tales of greed ["Bret Bolton" ] RE: more tales of greed ["Poole, R. Edward" ] Ross is amazing ["Snow Drop" ] RE: more tales of greed [FS Thomas ] xeroxed by voices ["Natalie Jane" ] RE: more tales of greed [Ken Ostrander ] Re: more tales of greed [Tom Clark ] wales, flags, and toner [grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan)] Re: more tales of greed ["Jason R. Thornton" ] shirt and sorrow [Jill Brand ] RE: more tales of greed [Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey ] bell hooks and sebastian bach [drew ] Chicago Tix ["Michael Wells" ] attn collector scum (1.3% RH content) ["Roberta Cowan" Subject: RE: more tales of greed Technically these discs aren't "Compact Discs" because they do not comply with the Red Book standard. Therefore, they shouldn't have the "Compact Disc Digital Audio" stamp on them. If they do, I suppose they could be sued by Philips, et al. http://zdnet.com.com/2100-1103-817929.html ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2002 16:02:41 -0500 From: "Poole, R. Edward" Subject: RE: more tales of greed tc: >On another note, how about that fuckwad from the RIAA using his Grammy >airtime to spew his shit about how downloading music is depriving musicians >of their livelihood? Fuck him and all his fellow corporate shitlickers. First of all -- you WATCHED the Grammies??? Second -- how right you are (despite your shocking taste in televisual entertainment). Even assuming the premise (which I do not) that MP3 trading / "piracy" has a negative effect on CD sales, the conclusion that it hurts *musicians* is ludicrous. Only the mega-stars (Lars, I'm looking at you) have much interest at all in record sales. 95% or more of recording artists make NO money from royalties -- if they make money, it's coming from touring and merchandise (of course, most don't actually make money at all). For this RIAA guy to pitch his argument in a "we are just concerned about the artists" is such blatant hypocrisy and downright lies. This is about the 4 big recording conglomerates, plain and simple. Fuck them -- they should get the picture by now that no one needs them anymore. All they are good at is advertising / payola / fad-creation. Anyone can self-produce, burn their own CDs, silk screen some shirts, and book their own tour schedule. And they should. - -ed ============================================================================This e-mail message and any attached files are confidential and are intended solely for the use of the addressee(s) named above. This communication may contain material protected by attorney-client, work product, or other privileges. If you are not the intended recipient or person responsible for delivering this confidential communication to the intended recipient, you have received this communication in error, and any review, use, dissemination, forwarding, printing, copying, or other distribution of this e-mail message and any attached files is strictly prohibited. If you have received this confidential communication in error, please notify the sender immediately by reply e-mail message and permanently delete the original message. To reply to our email administrator directly, send an email to postmaster@dsmo.com Dickstein Shapiro Morin & Oshinsky LLP http://www.legalinnovators.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 01 Mar 2002 21:31:23 +0000 From: "Snow Drop" Subject: Ross is amazing Fric asked: >Is English your mother tongue? Sorry, I thought you already knew the aweful truth. I am a refugee from the land of Dysglish where all lexicons are intongued at birth by giant mother fungi. What results, frankly is too horrible to describe, sufice it to say that anything you read of mine has first been transliterated from Dysglish into Anguish before being reproduced into my own stunted version of English. Except for one passage I wrote earlier this afternoon after which I sat back and thought--My, my, 47 years and maybe just maybe Ive finially learned how to write. Has anyone here ever done anything to copyright their writing other than pay the fee to LC? I think I may actually meet my March 21st deadline for my November novel after all. Kay _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2002 13:36:35 -0800 (PST) From: FS Thomas Subject: RE: more tales of greed Ed was gasped: > you WATCHED the Grammies??? While I know that wasn't geared to me, I'll admit that I did watch probably the last forty five minutes of it. Only with one eye, though, if that counts. I did see Mr. RIAA's heartfelt tirade. What a load of bollucks. Ed does strike close to the facts, I think, in pointing out that it really is just conglomerate penny pinching. If they /are/ loosing anything due to piracy it's more than likely because their prices are too high to begin with. If their sales are down by ten percent on the year maybe it's got something to do with people's ability now to paruse an album ahead of time and realise that, "god, there's really only one good song on here--the rest is tripe," and not throw seventeen clams down the toilet (and into the pipes and cess to eventually wind up in a Big Four exec's pocket.) > All they are good at is > advertising / payola / fad-creation. I think I could do without fad creation, honestly. There really hasn't been a good one since the Beatles and even /that/ was over the top. > Anyone can > self-produce, burn their > own CDs... Not, I'm sure, if the RIAA had anything to say about it. Taking a Devil's Advocate and sympathetic look at it, I can understand the record labels and artists being frustrated by the purveyance of illegally obtained materials. It is, after all, a loss of revenue. But only in so far as to the piracy of commercially available items and pre-released titles. I personally think that there should be some leniency when considering back catalog or out of print items; product that cannot be purchased through traditional means. If a record label is no longer interested in making items available due to production costs or what have you they should perhaps forfeit their rights to pursue piracy charges. The practice retaining rights and not releasing material boils down to squatters rights and not in the best interest to the marketplace. If you own the rights to it and someone wants it you should make it available to them--even if it's just a downloaded pack of MP3s. Don't cry about having your money stolen when you haven't the intent of making the product available in the first place, for fuck's sake. (Remember too that this is an organization representing a business sector that with one hand is signaling for help over losses to piracy and threats to the artists they represent while with the other hand paying those same artists only four percent of the monies generated from the sale of their work-product.) - -f. - --- Yahoo! Greetings - Send FREE e-cards for every occasion! http://greetings.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 01 Mar 2002 13:38:50 -0800 From: "Natalie Jane" Subject: xeroxed by voices >"I WANNA DESTROY YOU!" goes the chorus. Yes, the Soft >Boys have made it onto prime time broadcast TV. My bandmate told me about this and I thought he must have been mistaken. But now there's another witness... >A civilization grew up inside a xerox machine. [etc.] I like this very much, though I read it just as a story rather than a Robyn monologue. I imagined the story as taking place within the small, somewhat rickety Aficio machine in my workplace. I purchased "Under the Bushes, Under the Stars" by "Guided By Voices" (as Kay would have it! :) last weekend and have been listening to it ever since. "Cut-Up Witch" is my favorite track so far. I always really enjoy "Tobin Sprout's" songs (on this album and others) and feel that he is underrated in comparison with the far more prolific "Bob Pollard." Anyway, thanks to y'all for recommending it. "n." _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 01 Mar 2002 16:48:41 -0500 From: Ken Ostrander Subject: RE: more tales of greed >>On another note, how about that fuckwad from the RIAA using his Grammy >>airtime to spew his shit about how downloading music is depriving musicians >>of their livelihood? Fuck him and all his fellow corporate shitlickers. > >First of all -- you WATCHED the Grammies??? > >Second -- how right you are ...(snip)... Fuck them -- they should get >the picture by now that no one needs them anymore. All they are good at is >advertising / payola / fad-creation. Anyone can self-produce, burn their >own CDs, silk screen some shirts, and book their own tour schedule. And >they should. i have to confess to watching the latter part of the grammies when i got home on wednesda night. there were some really good live performances (outcast, dylan, nelly, alicia, and al green) and i was pleasantly suprised to see the 'oh brother where art thou?' soundtrack win album of the year. kudos. t bone burnett may never get there again. it was great to see all of the artists on the album get up on stage with him. i was really disappointed in the self-indulgent "we're a rock band in high flight" bullshit from bono. i really hoped for something a bit more substancial and topical. alicia keys' humility put them to shame. speaking of shame, that speech about the "theft" of downloading music was so pompous and hypocritical. someone in the audience yelled "boo", though who knows what they were booing. lets all work to destroy the big corporate record companies one download at a time. morpheus has been down for a few days. coincidence? ken "your paradigm of hope" the kenster np downloaded music ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 01 Mar 2002 13:13:24 -0800 From: Tom Clark Subject: Re: more tales of greed on 3/1/02 1:02 PM, Poole, R. Edward at PooleR@dsmo.com wrote: > tc: > >> On another note, how about that fuckwad from the RIAA using his Grammy >> airtime to spew his shit about how downloading music is depriving musicians >> of their livelihood? Fuck him and all his fellow corporate shitlickers. > > First of all -- you WATCHED the Grammies??? > > Second -- how right you are (despite your shocking taste in televisual > entertainment). Even assuming the premise (which I do not) that MP3 trading > / "piracy" has a negative effect on CD sales, the conclusion that it hurts > *musicians* is ludicrous. Only the mega-stars (Lars, I'm looking at you) > have much interest at all in record sales. 95% or more of recording artists > make NO money from royalties -- if they make money, it's coming from touring > and merchandise (of course, most don't actually make money at all). For > this RIAA guy to pitch his argument in a "we are just concerned about the > artists" is such blatant hypocrisy and downright lies. This is about the 4 > big recording conglomerates, plain and simple. Fuck them -- they should get > the picture by now that no one needs them anymore. All they are good at is > advertising / payola / fad-creation. Anyone can self-produce, burn their > own CDs, silk screen some shirts, and book their own tour schedule. And > they should. Preach it, Brother!! To be honest, I was watching a hockey game and flipping back to the Grammys occasionally because I wanted to see the O Brother and Dylan performances. I was calling so much bullshit on this guy that my wife was getting pissed at me for yelling so loud while she was trying too feed the baby. Heh heh, I get a little carried away sometimes... - -tc ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 2 Mar 2002 12:03:27 +1300 From: grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan) Subject: wales, flags, and toner >> nflying - Y ddraig goch ar llawr hanner gwyrdd ac hanner wen. > >A red dragon, yes. Gwyrdd and wen must be green and white? Oh yes, like >'Hen wen' in Lloyd Alexander. Hanner must be something like background or >stripe. No idea about llawr. literally: The red dragon on a field half green and half white. Not 100% sure of my Welsh - I learnt a little in form one when I was 11. That's several geological epochs ago now. FWIW it was St David's Day yesterday. >PS They seemed to be having some disagreements about the Afghan flag >recently. What's the latest, James? Allah alone knows. Afghanistan is the most vexillologically volatile nation on earth. About 19 national flags since 1900. As far as I know the green-white-black one is still in use, but... James PS - ross, very good, but you've been too long at the photocopyer - the toner funes are getting to you! James Dignan, Dunedin, New Zealand. =-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= .-=-.-=-.-=-.- .-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-. -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= You talk to me as if from a distance =-.-=-. And I reply with impressions chosen from another time -=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=- (Brian Eno - "By this River") ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 01 Mar 2002 15:28:06 -0800 From: "Jason R. Thornton" Subject: Re: more tales of greed Has anyone seen this article? Any ideas about the possible ramifications of this case either way? "Copy-protected CD makers lose battle" http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/zd/20020223/tc_zd/5103674&cid=73 Jason ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2002 20:46:03 -0500 (EST) From: Jill Brand Subject: shirt and sorrow You know, Ray Davies actually has a song called The Shirt, which was on the Songs of Ray Davies thing that came out about 3 years ago. I'm still mourning the fact that, unless Robyn adds a Boston show, I won't be seeing him on this tour. Jill ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 2 Mar 2002 10:53:14 -0600 (CST) From: Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey Subject: RE: more tales of greed On Fri, 1 Mar 2002, Poole, R. Edward wrote: > As much as I condemn the practice -- and agree that it is "evil" -- it isn't > "illegal," per se. What they are doing is selling you a greatly more > limited license to the copyrighted works. Under this new license, all you > can do is listen to the music in a CD player (most CD-ROM and DVD-ROM drives > will not play copy protected CDs). That's not illegal -- no more than, say, > an orchard granting a license for consumers to pick their own strawberries, > but not including the right to dig up and carry away apple trees. I think > the interesting question (to me, anyway) is whether the recording industry > is perpetrating a fraud on consumers by selling a product which they know > the public will believe to convey the same license as in the past (i.e. a > normal CD), but which is actually a severely limited license, compared to > the public's expectations. The fact that at least some manufacturers > include some explanation or disclaimer on the packaging is of little or no > consequence. Under consumer protection statutes, the public is entitled to > clear, explicit, and obvious (i.e., large bold print) notice. The way I see > it, the recording industry is intentionally misleading the public -- if not > peddling an outright lie -- with these restricted discs. They should be > forced to place large bold lettering on every cover saying: "ATTENTION: THIS > COMPACT DISC IS UNFIT FOR USE WITH COMPUTER CD-ROM DRIVES, DVD-ROM DRIVES, > AND CONSUMER DVD PLAYERS. THE DATA CONTAINED ON THIS DISC MAY NOT BE COPIED > OR MODIFIED IN ANY WAY, NOR MAY THE AUDIO FILES BE TRANSFERRED TO ANY OTHER > DIGITAL MEDIA STORAGE DEVICE, SUCH AS COMPUTER HARD DRIVES OR DIGITAL MEDIA > STORAGE/PLAYBACK DEVICES (e.g. MP3 PLAYERS)." If all "protected" CDs came with such labels, then I wouldn't object to them as much - I'd just not buy them, and be mightily pissed at any artist who doesn't make every effort to make sure non-corrupted versions of their dicscs are available. If they were labeled, they'd be similar to software - - where the consumer is presented with a licensing agreement (including limitations of use) either before opening the CD-ROM or during installing (that IULA screen you have to click "I AGREE" to). BUt since they're not, such discs represent a species of consumer fraud. I think someone should print up bright red labels with the text Mr. Poole suggests above, and sticker them on the cover of these bogus CDs. Certainly, I'd feel perfectly okay with anyone who hacks the "protection" code and posts copies of such discs to Morpheus et al. One thing that surprised me about the list of such discs (in the NYT article link at fatchucks.com) was the presence of a couple of indie-label discs (one was on Epitaph, for instance). I guess I shouldn't be, though. - --Jeff J e f f r e y N o r m a n The Architectural Dance Society www.uwm.edu/~jenor/ADS.html ::the popularity of the gruesome FACES OF DEATH video series is ::apparently so great that a children's version is in production, ::to be called FACES OF OWIES. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 2 Mar 2002 10:55:02 -0800 From: drew Subject: bell hooks and sebastian bach > From: "Snow Drop" > Drew, thanks for the feedback in B&S. What I like about them is not > only > the skewed Smiths angel, but the weird 60s cheesy sound filtered thru I > dont > know what added into their 90s disaffected thing. And I like how the > guy > can sing, but sometimes talks the lyrics. Talking your lyrics is its own > art(also--youve got to have decent lyrics in the first place to do it.) You know, if you're talking about what I think you're talking about, you might be thinking of two different band members. I don't think the fella who talks is the same as the one who sings. The Gorky's concert last night SUCKED, though I recognize that my opinion on the matter is subjective. We left before it was over. Drew ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 2 Mar 2002 13:10:11 -0600 From: "Michael Wells" Subject: Chicago Tix The rumours were true, tix went on sale this morning. Bad news is they're being handled by Ticketbastard www.ticketmaster.com so your $20 ticket just became $29.68 ($0.18 of which was tax). "Convenience Charge" and "Order Processing Fee" additional, you understand. No, I didn't find it 'convenient' to use this service, thank you very little. Michael "and you can slag the order processing fee as well" Wells Ps. Had what can I believe would be called a "Quail Moment" when I fried the left front speaker in my Jeep to "Exit" from 'Joshua Tree' whilst driving into work the other morning. I think the volume was up a bit too high. A bit. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2002 10:20:48 -0500 From: "Roberta Cowan" Subject: attn collector scum (1.3% RH content) Many of you may find this worth checking out. Heavy on the NZ pop/noise (read Xpressway related artists) but there is such a wide variety of interesting music and collectible items represented here I thought it would be valuable to pass on. Enjoy! 8-) Roberta - ------------------------------------------------------------------ - -------------- > I've posted a bunch of CD's & records & lathes for sale here... > http://home.attbi.com/~cassetto/salepage.html > Everything is first come first serve, I will start confirming stuff on > Sunday. > Thanks greatly- Dan - ------------------------------------------------------------------ - -------------- ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V11 #72 *******************************