From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V11 #15 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Friday, January 11 2002 Volume 11 : Number 015 Today's Subjects: ----------------- ohmigod, owls are so cool [Viv Lyon ] a moment of silence, if you please [bayard ] Syd Barrett on VH1 [Christopher Warner ] Re: who has the oldest computer? ["Russ Reynolds" ] Re: iMac, uMac, we all Mac? (NeXt, cube, next desperatemarketing ploy) [T] Re: who has the oldest computer? ["Stewart C. Russell" ] Nyoik + Jazz butchery [MSewell@oxfam.org.uk] Re: a moment of staunch federalism, if you please [gSs ] Re: a staunch moment of libertarianism [gSs ] the angel in the house ["Natalie Jane" ] finally, computers are good for SOMETHING... ["Jason R. Thornton" ] Re: who has the oldest computer? [Tom Clark ] Re: who has the oldest computer? ["Russ Reynolds" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2002 21:05:15 -0800 (PST) From: Viv Lyon Subject: ohmigod, owls are so cool Owl survives head-on crash The Associated Press 1/10/02 11:28 PM McMINNVILLE, Ore. (AP) -- An owl survived a head-on collision with a truck this week, even making it through a long ride while tangled in the pickup's grille. It was still dark at 5 a.m. Monday when Rhonda Ingram drove over the bridge on 99W south of Amity, bound for her job at Betty Lou's in McMinnville. She caught movement in the corner of her eye, just a flash. There was no time to react. "I thought, `Should I stop? Should I stop? Well, there's nothing I can do. It's gotta be all over the front of my truck,' " Ingram recalled. When Ingram pulled into the parking lot at Betty Lou's and got out, she was startled to see the bird was still there, plastered across the plastic grille of her S-10 Chevy. "I started apologizing, saying, `Oh, I'm sorry, I didn't mean to kill you."' Ingram hurried into the building, not wanting to see any more. She called her husband to tell him what had happened, then asked a couple of co-workers to check the damage and see if they could remove the bird. In a minute, her co-workers were back with startling news. She had hit a great horned owl and it was still alive. After being pried free, the bird hopped around. It tried to take flight, but kept flopping back to the ground as if disoriented. Ingram called 911. An emergency dispatcher gave her the name of a wildlife specialist in Amity, who advised her to call the McMinnville Wildlife Rehabilitation and Care Clinic, run by veterinarian Michelle Schroeder. Schroeder said the owl was having trouble with one of its eyes, but was otherwise doing well. "It was just extremely lucky," she said. The bird should be released in a couple of weeks, Schroeder said. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2002 21:18:29 -0800 (PST) From: bayard Subject: a moment of silence, if you please On Thu, 10 Jan 2002, Fric Chaud wrote: > Until this year I had a non-functional Apple II+ which I threw out > (but kept for years because I just *liked* it) and a Mac Classic > which I gave away. Let us not forget the Amiga you threw away, too.... =b* "you utter BASTARD" - -- http://glasshotel.net/glassflesh * who salvaged a Mac SE from worktrash, for Chris ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2002 21:58:33 -0800 (PST) From: Christopher Warner Subject: Syd Barrett on VH1 Just to remind everybody to tune in this Sunday to VH1 Legends-Pink Floyd and Syd Barrett. No word yet on if this is the same as the Omnibus special featuring our very own Robyn. Hey look at that...Robyn content!! Chris in DC I wonder...are there any fegs who don't like Syd..that would be a strange bird indeed. perhaps mad.. Send FREE video emails in Yahoo! Mail! http://promo.yahoo.com/videomail/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2002 23:08:36 -0800 From: "Russ Reynolds" Subject: Re: who has the oldest computer? >> Anybody here still have a Mac Color >> Classic? > > Until this year I had a non-functional Apple II+ which I threw out > (but kept for years because I just *liked* it) and a Mac Classic > which I gave away. color? WOW! I've still got my very first mac. They tell me it's a Mac Plus--was that the first model? Because I got that thing for Christmas in 1983, a good month before it was unveiled in the infamous 1984 Super Bowl commercial. I always thought it was just a plain old Macintosh. "The computer you already know how to use." I haven't used it in about three years but I still have it sitting right next to me here, and it still works. The extensive Robyn Hitchcock discography I spent years researching is still on the hard drive. Of course you can find all that stuff on the internet now so I stopped bothering... - -rUss np: Yardbirds/Ultimate Elvis Costello/Blood & Chocolate Velvet Underground/Loaded Ryan Adams/Gold Genesis/Lamb Lies Down On Broadway ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 02:21:07 -0600 From: steve Subject: Re: iMac, uMac, we all Mac? (NeXt, cube, next desperate marketing ploy) On Thursday, January 10, 2002, at 05:11 PM, Fric Chaud wrote: > What does "a Pentium-crushing G4 processor" mean to you? It means that G4s crush Pentiums on the things that they crush Pentiums on. Cross-platform benchmarks are pretty iffy, not to mention different bus speeds, RAM, etc., etc. Photoshop is the usual test and the G4 holds it's own against Intel chips that have a much higher clock speed. Each platform wins some of the Photoshop tasks and the G4 has a big win in a couple, thus being "better" overall. I haven't seen a G4 873 vs. Pentium4 2000 or 2200 test. Motorola's primary G4 interest is in the embedded market rather than desktop Apple boxes. This means that the chips must be smaller and run cooler, so that makes for an excellent fit in the PowerBook. (I think that mobile Pentium chips may be "lite" versions of their desktop equivalents). I have no doubt, should Motorola do an Enron, that Apple will exercise it's G4 buyout option and have IBM or AMD fab the chips. Then we'll see a quicker pace toward higher speeds. As it is, the G4 800 iMac probably means that the rumored G4s in the 1000 to 1600 range are not too far away for the desktop PowerMac. > Hey, how about AMD? Butt-kicking leader in the MHz race until Intel decided that clock speed was job 1 for the Pentium4. Notice how they're no longer rating their chips by speed and have joined the fight against the "MHz Myth". Corrections from tech savvy Fegs welcome - Steve __________ I know that it's cynical, but I feel that civil liberties-for a lot of these people in Congress-are either an inconvenience or a campaign slogan. They care only about money and power. - Wil Wheaton ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 09:21:37 +0000 From: "matt sewell" Subject: Re: iMac, uMac, we all Mac? (NeXt, cube, next desperate marketing ploy) You're wrong there, Ken - I *couldn't* care less! ;-) Matt "techie schmechie" Sewell >From: Ken Weingold > >I think we had better take this off list. I am sure 99% of the people >here could care less about this stuff. > > >-Ken - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: Click Here ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Jan 2002 00:36:31 +1300 From: grutness@surf4nix.com Subject: Re: who has the oldest computer? >My guess is that James has the oldest computer. Either him or Mike Godwin. hm. Possibly not. I mean, it's old, but I'm sure there must be older ones out there. "Athene" is a PowerMac 7200/120 (circa 1995, IIRC), but she's still running system 8.0 My mum's still using my first Mac - "Mycroft", an LCII - running 7.5.1, and Alice has my old LC575, "Minerva". Briefly, I used a Bondwell. Even a PC is better than that ;) Before you ask, yes, I used to read a lot of Heinlein, until his libertarianism pissed me off too much. James James Dignan, Dunedin, New Zealand. =-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= .-=-.-=-.-=-.- .-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-. -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= You talk to me as if from a distance =-.-=-. And I reply with impressions chosen from another time -=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=- (Brian Eno - "By this River") ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Jan 2002 00:37:52 +1300 From: grutness@surf4nix.com Subject: re: Imac, Umac, we all Mac? >On 10 Jan 2002, at 21:47, grutness@surf4nix.com wrote: > >> just out of curiosity, why do you feel a compulsion to rubbish reports >> made here of good things from Macs at every turn? > >You're a nice guy. You deserve a straight answer. thanks for that - and a lot of what you say is fair comment. But, the one thing about Mac is that - as others have said before - one of its biggest assets is the loyalty of its users. It's very likely the same with any smaller company that makes an (in some ways, but not necessarily all ways) excellent product competing with a much larger company making a good (and in some ways excellent) product. The question is, why is there this loyalty? The answer is very probably that they see an (in their view) excellent product that is in danger of being swamped by the other (in their view) less good product. They fear their favourite product may go under due to the market clout of their product's rival. It's happened before (Betamax, would be an example), and loyal product fans have saved a marque before (eg Harley Davidson). There's a natural tendency to speak up for an underdog, especially one that is worth speaking up for. You don't see the same brand loyalty from PC users, in part because there is less need to praise such a big proportion of the market (everyone knows it), and in part because many of its users either do so grudgingly, or aren't really computer aficionados, just people who need to use them for work. Users of smaller market-share brands who like the product are far more likely to speak up, both to support the underdog, and becuase there is more chance that others won't be aware of that product's advantages. So yes, Mac users are loud when it comes to praising their favourite computer. It's no stranger than hearing people on this list saying "hey, I just saw this great movie" - they want people who may not otherwise be tempted to try the product to do so. It's probably worth noting that part of the reason I'm quick to plug New Zealand is for a very similar reason. It's a small, little known country. Hey everyone - we're never gonna do more with the Mac/PC argumants than piss the list off. Can we call a truce yet? James James Dignan, Dunedin, New Zealand. =-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= .-=-.-=-.-=-.- .-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-. -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= You talk to me as if from a distance =-.-=-. And I reply with impressions chosen from another time -=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=- (Brian Eno - "By this River") ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 07:08:10 -0500 From: Terrence Marks Subject: Re: Imac, Umac, we all Mac? Fric Chaud wrote: > I'm mad at Intel for holding up the release of DDR for P4, Exactly! I demand they release Dance Dance Revolution as well! (and that they finally agree to send P4 chips to East Germany. I mean, it's not even Communist now anymore...) - -- Terrence Marks http://www.unlikeminerva.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 07:18:31 -0500 From: Terrence Marks Subject: Re: iMac, uMac, we all Mac? (NeXt, cube, next desperatemarketing ploy) steve wrote: > (I think that mobile Pentium chips may be "lite" versions of their desktop > equivalents). They are, which is why they don't have P4 laptops quite yet. They do have a mobile version of the AMD XP series out, though. Likewise with servers, or at least those made by IBM, which use the PIII Xeon instead of a P4-family chip. - -- Terrence Marks http://www.unlikeminerva.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 12:49:30 +0000 From: "Stewart C. Russell" Subject: Re: who has the oldest computer? Carole Reichstein wrote: > > Anybody here still have a Mac Color Classic? I have an SE/30, and just got rid of an SE FDHD... But neither to surf with, though there are fools who surf on an SE. Stewart ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 12:51:15 +0000 From: "Stewart C. Russell" Subject: Re: who has the oldest computer? Brian Huddell wrote: > > Let's see, I have a Commodore 64 in a box somewhere that probably still > works, but I know that's easy to top. Synertek SYM-1. 256 bytes, 6502 processor, hex keypad. 1977-78 vintage, AFAIK. Stewart ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 12:55:31 +0000 From: "Stewart C. Russell" Subject: Re: Well! Looks like we got us a reader! Larry O'Brien wrote: > > Fast Food Nation looks really good. It is. And if you ever get to Colorado Springs, the burgers in Conway's Red Top are actually better than he says they are. It's almost worth just going to Colorado Springs just for them. Stewart ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 13:02:31 +0000 From: "Stewart C. Russell" Subject: Re: a moment of silence, if you please bayard wrote: > > Let us not forget the Amiga you threw away, too.... the weird thing is, the only two folks I know who still mention Amigas, Bayard and my friend Dave, could be identical twins. Stewart ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 13:03:15 +0000 From: "Stewart C. Russell" Subject: Re: So What's Everybody Reading? victorian squid wrote: > > I didn't think I was reading an authoritative work on the OED. > Is that how it was marketed? Wincherster's got an awful lot of work recently writing as a "word expert". Stewart ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 08:56:30 -0500 From: "Larry O'Brien" Subject: RE: So What's Everybody Reading? BTW, check out Thompson's page 2 column on espn.com http://espn.go.com/page2/s/thompson/ This week -- The Bears Uber Alles I found a near perfect copy of "The Curse of Lono" at the dump swap shop a few weeks ago. God I love that book. - -----Original Message----- From: victorian squid [mailto:v.squid@eudoramail.com] Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2002 5:47 PM To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Subject: Re: So What's Everybody Reading? On Thu, 10 Jan 2002 09:32:31 Stewart C. Russell wrote: >Everything I've ever read or heard about HST -- everything, that is, >NOT written or spoken by HST himself -- makes out that Raoul D. is a >complete tosspot. Ralph Barger is spectacularly dismissive of him. That may well be true. When I said Anthony Bourdain would love the comparison, I wasn't necessarily complimenting -him- by saying so. >You mean Simon "Breathless. Conjecture-Filled. Prose." >Winchester, the authority on the OED just 'cos he says he is? I didn't think I was reading an authoritative work on the OED. Is that how it was marketed? Anyway, I buy books like that with the understanding that some parts of it (particularly with regard to the psychological) will be speculative. I also love "In Cold Blood", quite a bit of which is speculative or possibly even wrong. loveonya, susan Join 18 million Eudora users by signing up for a free Eudora Web-Mail account at http://www.eudoramail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 13:02:31 +0000 From: MSewell@oxfam.org.uk Subject: Nyoik + Jazz butchery Fegs Do any of ye in NY know about busking laws/little venue gig booking over there? A friend of mine is going over next month - he's an *amazing* guitarist & composer (John Peel said that he was the only person he was jealous of who wasn't a footballer -praise indeed!) and would like to busk or maybe play some gigs... how viable a proposition is this? His style is very innovative, but kind of rock/no-wave/jazz, well I dunno, you'd have to hear it... but any help gratefully received. Also, are there any Jazz Butcher fans here? My friend Terry has an exhibition in Oxford later this month at which Pat will be playing... there's also a CD for sale, which is various (and very strange) collaborations between Terry and TJB over the last ten years... let me know if any of you are interested... Anyway, terribly sorry to interrupt the *fascinating* Mac vs PC debate... I am currently using a Sinclair ZX81 (although it *does* have a 16k RAM pack ;-)) Cheers Matt Oxfam works with others to find lasting solutions to poverty and suffering. Oxfam GB is a member of Oxfam International, a company limited by guarantee and registered in England No. 612172. Registered office: 274 Banbury Road, Oxford OX2 7DZ. Registered charity No. 202918. Visit the web site at http://www.oxfam.org.uk ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 08:46:59 -0500 (CDT) From: gSs Subject: Re: a moment of staunch federalism, if you please On Fri, 11 Jan 2002, Stewart C. Russell wrote: > the weird thing is, the only two folks I know who still mention Amigas, > Bayard and my friend Dave, could be identical twins. Anyone still or ever for that matter, running an Atari 1040st? gSs ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 10:11:23 -0500 (EST) From: Christopher Gross Subject: More geekery On Thu, 10 Jan 2002, Carole Reichstein wrote: > With all this talk about the spiffy new Imacs, Ipods, etc, I wonder who > the techie anachronisms are on this list? Who has the oldest Mac/PC to do > things like surf the web (slowly), process words, do page layout, write > letters, etc? Anybody here still have a Mac Color Classic? Karen regrets > selling hers back in 1994. I have a picture of it for posterity, however. I still have my first computer, an original Mac LC purchased in early 1990, but that doesn't really count since I don't use it anymore. If anyone wants it, it's yours for the price of shipping. It's maxed out at 10 mb RAM and 512 KB VRAM, with an 80 MB hard drive, 12" RGB monitor, System 7.1 (plus install disks for 6.14), and some of those old 6-color Apple stickers. Original boxes and manuals too. A collector's item! The oldest computer I actually use is a PM 7100/66. (Well, it's not in use right at the moment, but it was my main computer until six months ago; and I plan to set it up and network it to my blazing fast beige G3/300, so Bayard and I can shoot each other in Marathon.) Fric, it seems like the thing that really burns you is Apple's "Pentium crushing" comment. Can't you just accept this as ordinary marketing hyperbole, like when Microsoft says Windows is reliable and easy to use? - --Chris np: Pogues, "Turkish Song of the Damned" nr: Jose Saramago, "Blindness" (still) nc(ursing): overactive heating system and underactive staff ______________________________________________________________________ Christopher Gross On the Internet, nobody knows I'm a dog. chrisg@gwu.edu ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 10:17:48 -0500 (CDT) From: gSs Subject: Re: a staunch moment of libertarianism In case anyone is interested, I got tossed out of the c&w band I was playing in, 'The Texas Nights'. Just not cuntry enough is what they said. Not my playing ability but my lifestyle. And this was from a couple guys who live in apartments in Allen, Texas and drive Asian automobiles, but have George Strait posters on all their main walls. I think it actually has more to do with politics and religion and that time I compared sport hunters to serial rapists. I mean, I castrated pigs and dipped snuff when I was younger. I made a number of contacts and have been asked to come play with another big Dallas c&w band. I am not sure if I should keep it up. Though a pedal steel, fiddle, bass and a purdy girl singin sure is nice. I have learned a couple things from my time on the fringe. Not all the folks who listen to c&w are stupid republicans. Some are stupid democrats. And many are Canadians, neither Republican or Democrat. Damn, I never knew so many Canadians lived in NE Texas. Most of them own Pawn Shops. Conservatives hate libertarians as much as liberals hate libertarians. Why is this? gSs ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 08:42:19 -0800 From: "Natalie Jane" Subject: the angel in the house >Similar tendencies to de-humanize women are often called misogyny, >whether >the de-humaniztion is favorable or disfavorable. I disagree with this. I generally see the term "misogyny" being used in its literal sense, and I don't think it would be used to describe, for instance, the Victorian concept of women as angelic creatures that musn't be tainted with earthly concerns like voting or owning property. Such de-humanization is simply sexist - it doesn't imply outright *hatred* of women a la Dave Sim. Viewing women as disgusting, evil, or repellent, on the other hand, is truly misogynist. There is definitely an eliding between the two... sexism can slip into misogyny, as it often did during the Victorian period, but I do think that they are separate phenomena. My dictionary defines misogyny simply as "hatred of women." Sexism is defined as "1. Prejudice against the female sex; 2. Any arbitrary stereotyping of males and females on the basis of their gender." I haven't read Cryptonomicon, but it seems from Viv's description that Stephenson is guilty of the latter, not the former. Not that that lets him off the hook in any sense. Interesting that the dictionary included men in its definition of sexism... pedantically, n. _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 09:02:29 -0800 From: "Jason R. Thornton" Subject: finally, computers are good for SOMETHING... http://ucsdnews.ucsd.edu/newsrel/science/mcporous.htm - --Jason "Only the few know the sweetness of the twisted apples." - Sherwood Anderson ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 11:45:52 -0600 From: "Mike Wells" Subject: Re: a staunch moment of libertarianism gSs ruminated: > Conservatives hate libertarians as much as liberals hate libertarians. Why > is this? Not necessarily true. Speaking for conservative libertarians worldwide, rest assured that neither of us hates you. Hope that helps. Michael "you put your right wing in, you take your right wing out" Wells ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 17:56:40 +0000 From: "Redtailed Hawk" Subject: Comic Virgins and Gross Godlings Nat on Banks: >he frequently goes the extra mile to shock or pull a gross-out. Exactly!:-) And bravo. He can give me an utter shudder and I love that. I'm pretty hard to gross out but part of me remains 10 and loves it when someone suceeds. Maybe cause when I was a kid my summer gang was all boys. Gross little boys who did horrid things in the marsh to defenseless frogs and turtles. Then threw them at me. I learned to throw them back. I learned to -enjoy- throwing them back. His prose is what floors me, his descriptions. Look how vibrant his verbs are. His landscapes rear up at you. Also I'm amazed by the reach of his imagination in the SF stuff--how does he dream that stuff up? I admit plot is a weak point but at this moment I just love marinating in the sensibility. - ------------------------------ In regard to Quails Mideast booklist-- Ive always had a fascination for the Middle East and Central Asia. Maybe its my partially semitic blood, don't know. I fall into intense daydreams where I'm Avincenna, sitting by an arcaded fountain somewhere deep in the Fergana Valley, smoking my water pipe, pondering Aristotle. Love the buildings, decorations, textiles, food, poetry with a passion. Hate the politics. Want to travel there very much. A land of extremes. - --------------------------------- More Booklist(I made the mistake of walking thru the Art Dept) Kingdom of the Soul: Symbolist Art in Germany 1870-1920 Great reproductions by more than the usual suspects Plus my daughter dragged me into a comic books store and while she perused the historic Archie digests I stumbled upon the Craig Russell Oscar Wilde Fairy Tale volumes. Man o man--I could go broke on that stuff. So I am no longer a totally comic virgin. I am now an only slightly comic virgin(Fric--have as much fun with -that- one as you'd like;-) - ----------------------------------- Re: Godling's Will People tend to get the godlings they want. And whatever may or may not be beyond this life lets them, perhaps its called free will. But its the sort of thing which makes me want to kneecap a certain proportion of the population(Go meditate Kay. Compassion, compassion ...) - -------------------------------- Kay "Love is All You Need" The Beatles _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 10:30:14 -0800 (PST) From: "Andrew D. Simchik" Subject: robyn machitchcock > From: "Fric Chaud" > You can't imagine I just invented the idea of the gushing > Machead. You seem to imagine you invented the idea of "refuting" them. My mouse wheel finger is getting tired of scrolling past your blather, which I can get on any mailing list or newsgroup on the net. > That's what I'm reacting to. I did it in a comical way, > too. I would say that "comical," like OS/platform preference, is pretty subjective. Drew ===== - -- Andrew D. Simchik, adsimchik@yahoo.com Send FREE video emails in Yahoo! Mail! http://promo.yahoo.com/videomail/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 10:33:11 -0800 From: Tom Clark Subject: Re: who has the oldest computer? on 1/10/02 11:08 PM, Russ Reynolds at rcreation@earthlink.net wrote: > I've still got my very first mac. They tell me it's a Mac > Plus--was that the first model? Because I got that thing for Christmas in > 1983, a good month before it was unveiled in the infamous 1984 Super Bowl > commercial. I always thought it was just a plain old Macintosh. "The > computer you already know how to use." > Are you sure it wasn't Christmas 1984? I'm pretty sure the only people with Macs in 1983 were the small group of pirates on Bandley Drive in Cupertino. I think the Mac Plus came out in 1986, so you either have an original Mac or a "FatMac" with 512k RAM. Those were the two that were around in '84. FWIW, I still have an original Newton and a prototype 20th Anniversary Mac ("Spartacus"). And if I may toot my own horn yet again, our product was named "Best in Show" at CES last night. Wooohoo! http://www.techtv.com/freshgear/bestofces/story/0,23008,3367505,00.html - -tc ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 11:15:21 -0800 From: "Russ Reynolds" Subject: Re: who has the oldest computer? tc: > I'm pretty sure the only people with > Macs in 1983 were the small group of pirates on Bandley Drive in Cupertino. > I think the Mac Plus came out in 1986, so you either have an original Mac or > a "FatMac" with 512k RAM. Those were the two that were around in '84. Might have been '84. But I vaguely recall my dad saying he somehow got a hold of whatever the computer industry word for "advance promo copy" is. It might also have been birthday rather than christmas, which would put it in early January, 1984. Right around the 11th. By Xmas '84 I don't think I was still living in the house I remember living in when I received it. But this was the '80s so the expression "maybe I was on crack" applied. Except back then we didn't call it crack. Or even Crack Plus. It was the original crackintosh. - -rUss ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 13:22:42 -0600 From: "Gene Hopstetter, Jr." Subject: Re: who has the oldest computer? >From: "Fric Chaud" >Subject: Re: who has the oldest computer? > >Until this year I had a non-functional Apple II+ which I threw out >(but kept for years because I just *liked* it) and a Mac Classic >which I gave away. I currently have an Apple IIGS (it works, but I need a cable to connect the monitor to the CPU. Anybody got one for sale?), four Macintosh SEs, and two 512Ks. Oh, and the G4 I'm sending this email with. There isn't a single Intel chips in my house. But I emulate Windoze on my G4 with VirtualPC (take that, Mr. Gates!). ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 13:37:44 -0600 From: "Gene Hopstetter, Jr." Subject: Re: Imac, Umac, we all Mac? >From: "Fric Chaud" >Subject: re: Imac, Umac, we all Mac? > >Now let the Mac Inquisitors come to pick at each sentence. You all >*know* what I mean. Finally, finally, someone invited me to join this thread . Here's my $.02 on the whole "Whose processor is faster" conundrum. A friend of mine once said, "If your CPU is 50% faster, do you get 50% more work done?" I think the answer to that is "No." But you do get 50% more game playing done -- and that's what's driving processor innovation nowadays anyway, right? That said, my main beef with computers nowadays is not with processor speed, but with their INTERFACE. Jared Spool, in one of his usability studies, showed that Amazon.com was faster, on average, than most other web sites. Why? Because people could *find what they were looking for more quickly* than on other sites, even though the pages on Amazon.com have bigger file sizes and longer download times. Didn't matter if they were using NCSA Mosaic .096b on a 24K dialup or IE6 on an overclocked AMD 2GB box with DSL. People (everyday, mom 'n pop computer users, I think) regard *speed* not as number of instructions per cycle, but how long it takes them to get their email or buy the latest Harry Potter book online. It's a wonder to me how AOL can be so popular with such an awful interface. Intel, RISC, Motorola, whatever Silicon Of The Month the industry is cramming down our throats, doesn't mean diddly if we can't make the computers do what we want and need them to do. Implement the perfect interface and people won't worry about processors anymore, I think. I choose Apple computers, because I think the MacOS is a better operating system. I think MacOS is easier to use, easier to customize to suit my own needs and tastes, and just plain looks better. But hey, that's me. I've been reading Alan Cooper's "The Inmates Are Running The Asylum" which discusses the shortcomings of the contemporary computer interface, and I tend to agree with most of what Cooper's saying. ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V11 #15 *******************************