From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V10 #475 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Tuesday, December 25 2001 Volume 10 : Number 475 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: wishing you all... cosmic consciousness ["Fric Chaud" ] Re: Francais, Ecossais, euh. ["Fric Chaud" ] Re: wishing you all... [grutness@surf4nix.com] Re: fegmaniax-digest V10 #474 [grutness@surf4nix.com] Arwyn [BLATZMAN@aol.com] Re: Francais, Ecossais, euh. ["Stewart C. Russell" ] Happy Happy, Joy Joy! ["Maximilian Lang" ] La charite' ["Fric Chaud" ] Please Welcome... (5% RH) [] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 23 Dec 2001 22:19:08 -0500 From: "Fric Chaud" Subject: Re: wishing you all... cosmic consciousness On 23 Dec 2001, at 16:39, Jeffrey with 2 Fs Jeffrey wrote: > But I still don't get why you folks in NZ and Australia get to have > holidays *first*. It's still the 23rd here, of course. The advantage > was, if anyone was worried, at the end of 1999, about the whole Y2K > thing, it would be New Zealand that'd be hit first. So the rest of us > could have ducked. I have been thinking a lot about that recently. James writes us from tomorrow. If the world were many times larger, and we had sufficiently fast transportation, we could travel days, weeks, or months into our own futures or to our pasts to advise and caution ourselves concerning forthcoming events. Except we couldn't do much, good or bad, because gravity would be so imposing. Cosmic Consciousness. It boggles the mind! - -- Fric Chaud ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 23 Dec 2001 22:36:20 -0500 From: "Fric Chaud" Subject: Re: Francais, Ecossais, euh. On 23 Dec 2001, at 9:30, Stewart C. Russell wrote: > grutness@surf4nix.com wrote: > > > > according to my copy of the New Testament in Lalland Scots, the > > quote is: "Gin I speak wi the tungs o men an angels but hae nae luve > > i my hairt I am no nane better nor dunnerin bress or a ringin > > cymbal." > > oh dear; "luve" is only (apparently) in post-Burns Scots. Charity was > the term used (cf Welsh "cariad") in any bibles used in pre-synthetic > Scots. I don't understand. That isn't the language of Scots, is it? It sounds like the accent written so that an Englishman could speak English like a Scotch. I would not expect to see a "Quebecois" bible that began: In de beginning dere, God creat de 'eaven and de urt. An' 'e say ' "Stie, dat's good!" Did the Scotch not take offense at the Lalland Scots version? - -- Fric Chaud ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 23 Dec 2001 23:04:26 -0500 From: "Fric Chaud" Subject: Re: Francais, Ecossais, euh. On 23 Dec 2001, at 22:07, Stewart C. Russell wrote: > Brian Huddell wrote: > > > > I'm hoping for a really snappy denouement. Soon would be nice. > > I guess that should teach me to fight a battle of wits with an unarmed > man. But Fric takes so long to respond, and when he does the response > is so lame, what's a Scottish p/eh/rson to do? If you two think you can provoke me into posting some witty response for your amusement, you are wrong. Don't hold your bread. - -- Fric Chaud ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Dec 2001 00:08:51 +1300 From: grutness@surf4nix.com Subject: Re: wishing you all... Jefffrey (plus or minus one f) said: >But I still don't get why you folks in NZ and Australia get to have >holidays *first*. well, it makes up in part for missing out on tours by travelling British guitarist/singer/.songwriters with strange shirts and a habit of blinking a lot. talking of whom... a dear friend has just sent me a dub copy of various robyn video excerpts which I believe formed a tree here many moons back. One of them is a version of the Yip Song with a complete extra verse (stated as being on MTV 120 minutes from 1993). Never seen any mention of that verse anywhere here before... have I simply not been looking? James hey... it's 12.05... merry Christmas! James Dignan, Dunedin, New Zealand. =-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= .-=-.-=-.-=-.- .-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-. -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= You talk to me as if from a distance =-.-=-. And I reply with impressions chosen from another time -=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=- (Brian Eno - "By this River") ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Dec 2001 00:13:18 +1300 From: grutness@surf4nix.com Subject: Re: fegmaniax-digest V10 #474 >James, you anaroak you, > >Hey, I was quoting from memory (Chesterton used to drive his editors >half-mad cause he always quoted from memory in his books, giving everything >a Chestertonian skew)--and pretty darn close for that! >Love the Scots version. Is that bibble on-line? Dear Kay, I know you are letter-challenged, but anaroak is a beauty. That word deserves to exist! As to the Scots New Testament, I don't know whether or not it is online, but the details, o libraried one, are: "The New Testament in Scots" (trans. W. L. Lorimer), Penguin Books: Harmondsworth (Middx, UK), 1985. ISBN 0-14-007571-2. Given the date, I shall add a further passage: Nou, i that same pairt the' war a wheen herds bidin thereout on the hill an keepin gaird owre their hirsel at nicht. Suddent an angel o the Lord can an stuid aforethem, an the glorie o the Lord shined about them, an they war uncolie frichtit. But the angel said tae them: "Binna nane afeared: I bring ye guid news o gryte blytheness for the haill fowk - this day in Dauvit's toun a sauviour hes been born til ye, Christ, the Lord! This gate ye s'ken it is een as I say: ye will finnd a new-born bairn swealed in a barrie an liggin intil a heck." Syne in a gliff an unco thrang o the airmies o heivin kythed aside the angel, giein laud tae God an liltin: "Glorie tae God i the heicht o heiven, an peace on the yird tae men he delytes in!" Hm. That should do for another year... James James Dignan, Dunedin, New Zealand. =-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= .-=-.-=-.-=-.- .-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-. -.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= You talk to me as if from a distance =-.-=-. And I reply with impressions chosen from another time -=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=- (Brian Eno - "By this River") ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Dec 2001 10:50:54 EST From: BLATZMAN@aol.com Subject: Arwyn Possible spoilers, so don't read this if you haven't seen the film... I know they changed Arwyn's character, but I can't tell how much.. Is she even in the Fellowship book? And, this is a stupid question... but she's not an elf, is she? And if they made her Elrond's daughter, then it stands to reason that they deleted her real father's character, and most importantly, Fellowship doesn't set up her relationship with Aragorn as a doomed one... My money is on a happy ending... I know I remember that it was not Arwyn that carried Frodo to Rivendel. That's a pretty major change to the books... Guess they had to make those changes to add more female characters. Let's face it, the books are sadly lacking many women characters... Dave, majorly missing Barrow-Wights and also wondering why the black riders were such wimps ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Dec 2001 15:25:31 +0000 From: "Stewart C. Russell" Subject: Re: Francais, Ecossais, euh. Fric Chaud wrote: > > I don't understand. That isn't the language of Scots, is it? No, not really. There was a movement about fifty years ago to recreate the Scots language in order to create a new Scottish identity. Trouble is, it wasn't the language that the writers themselves spoke, and also it looks kind of silly when written down. It's hard to take earnest pleas for national sovereignty seriously that are written in language that most people find amusingly quaint. People probably were offended by the Scots NT, but then anything to do with religion offends someone in this country. - -- Stewart C. Russell, Kirkintilloch, Scotland - scruss@enterprise.net "There Is No Santa Claus, How Could You Lie To Me?" - Chocolate USA http://homepages.enterprise.net/scruss/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Dec 2001 15:27:18 +0000 From: "Stewart C. Russell" Subject: Re: Francais, Ecossais, euh. Fric Chaud wrote: > > Don't hold your bread. By some cosmic coincidence, I am holding bread -- we're about to feed the swans on the canal. - -- Stewart C. Russell, Kirkintilloch, Scotland - scruss@enterprise.net "There Is No Santa Claus, How Could You Lie To Me?" - Chocolate USA http://homepages.enterprise.net/scruss/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Dec 2001 15:50:31 +0000 From: "Stewart C. Russell" Subject: Re: lyrics: that new(ish) song Kay, the ever-vigilant, spotted a mini-mondegreen in my transcription: > In my end is my beginning > Only if your aim is true > When you're brave, your skull is grinning which should read: From your grave your skull is grinning And also I'm still not convinced about: > Looking for le charit\'e The first vowel sound of the last word is definitely /eh/, not /ah/. Stewart (more confused than ever) - -- Stewart C. Russell, Kirkintilloch, Scotland - scruss@enterprise.net "There Is No Santa Claus, How Could You Lie To Me?" - Chocolate USA http://homepages.enterprise.net/scruss/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Dec 2001 16:12:29 +0000 From: "Stewart C. Russell" Subject: Re: wishing you all... cosmic consciousness Fric Chaud wrote: > > If the world were many times larger, and we had > sufficiently fast transportation, we could travel days, weeks, or > months into our own futures or to our pasts oh dear, you haven't been reading Bucke, have you? Stewrat - -- Stewart C. Russell, Kirkintilloch, Scotland - scruss@enterprise.net "There Is No Santa Claus, How Could You Lie To Me?" - Chocolate USA http://homepages.enterprise.net/scruss/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Dec 2001 10:22:39 -0600 From: "Michael Wells" Subject: Re: Arwyn = spoilers = ======= spoilers ======= > I know they changed Arwyn's character, but I can't tell how much.. Is she > even in the Fellowship book? And, this is a stupid question... but she's not > an elf, is she? And if they made her Elrond's daughter, then it stands to > reason that they deleted her real father's character, and most importantly, > Fellowship doesn't set up her relationship with Aragorn as a doomed one... > My money is on a happy ending... I know I remember that it was not Arwyn that > carried Frodo to Rivendel. That's a pretty major change to the books... Arwen is a half-elf, as is her father Elrond (the "Half-Elven"). She appears in the text as a whole in a much less active role, and in FoTR as the love interest for Aragorn that waits in Rivendell. Her marriage to him is ultimately a bittersweet one; she forgoes the choice of the Elves to pass into the undying lands and stays with him in Minas Tirith. She gets her man, but is broken from her father. My guess is they'll stay pretty close to that in the movies. It was Glorfindel an elf-lord from the House of Elrond that finally carried Frodo to Rivendell. Plus it was only a straight run down the "last mile" of the road to the fords, not an extended chase through the woods with lots of dramatic low-angle and sweeping down from above camera shots. I suppose of the narrative changes this one didn't bother me so much, except that they spent too much time on the chase itself. For my money you could have cut that part in half and included something else instead, considering how much probably ended up on the cutting room floor. > Guess they had to make those changes to add more female characters. Let's > face it, the books are sadly lacking many women characters... A familiar criticism. > Dave, majorly missing Barrow-Wights and also wondering why the black riders > were such wimps I as well think they blew a fantastic chance to finally film the Old Forest, Bombadil, and the Barrow Wights. It's been noted here before that this is the loop that gets whacked off in many adaptations to save time...and yet to me it's one of the best parts of the whole damn story. There's a fair amount of explanation as to why the Black Riders don't overcome the party at Weathertop; all nine were not together, there's half of Wilderland between the party and Rivendell and the riders prefer remote assaults, they are suprised by determined resistance with people wielding fire and Elvish blades, etc. Plus they're fighting a real-life King-to-be and the heir to Isildur himself, sword or no. Michael "and you can lose Elrond's radio-announcer voice, too" Wells ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Dec 2001 15:41:27 -0500 From: "Maximilian Lang" Subject: Happy Happy, Joy Joy! Merry Christmas to everyone! Happy New Year too! Max _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Dec 2001 18:14:18 -0500 From: "Fric Chaud" Subject: La charite' One never ceases to wonder at the things inspired by Christmas! I was offered to hear listen to the new song, and by a person whose generosity I am ashamed to admit left me quite surprised. Resulting from this, I can now tell you all that these ears hear "la charite' " and "le chair". Actually, not "le chair", but a quaintly mispronounce "le shay" that was meant to be "le chair". Substituting "the flesh" and "the charity" for "le shay" and "le charite", the song makes very good sense. Having heard Robyn struggle with french the last time he visited Montreal, I can believe the way the word was pronounced in that song was an attempt to say "flesh" in french. The vowel was anglicised and the terminal "r" was left unpronounce in the manner of the English. The only alternatives are so out of place I cannot believe they could have been used. Chai - a wine storage building, Chez - which would beg another word to complete the sentence, and Chier - a vulgarity for the act of producing excrement. Joyeux Nokl to all of you, including Scotch gentlemen. - -- Fric Chaud ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Dec 2001 22:30:34 -0800 (PST) From: Subject: Please Welcome... (5% RH) ...Joelle Marie Clark! Born 12/24/01, 3:44 PST. Coleen and I are the happiest parents ever. We'll definitely be bringing her up in a house full of Robyn's music! Feel free to check out Joelle's web site: http://homepage.mac.com/joellemarieclark/ - -tc p.s. I love you all. Well, most of you. ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V10 #475 ********************************