From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V10 #371 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Saturday, September 22 2001 Volume 10 : Number 371 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: TMBG [Brian Cully ] Re: Still more inappropriate playlist entries [Brian Cully ] Re: Bush's speech II [Tom Clark ] Re: Pakistan playing ball [JH3 ] telelogy [Marshall Needleman Armintor ] Re: Bush's speech II ["Jason R. Thornton" ] Re: 5-1! (fwd) [grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan)] mainly flags, some music, and and old Greek guy [grutness@surf4nix.com (J] the third path ["Walker, Charles" ] Re: Bush's speech II ["Maximilian Lang" ] I'll Be Damned [Tom Clark ] Flags, Germans, Afghanistan, and Palmer [grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dig] Re: Plato: the Movie! ["madcowan" ] Re: relative badness [Rob Gronotte ] Re: I'll Be Damned [Ken Weingold ] Re: relative badness ["noe shalev" ] Re: 5-1! (fwd) [Jeff Dwarf ] Re: they might be guy ants question [Jeff Dwarf ] Re: Bush's speech II [Jeff Dwarf ] It's the most blunderful time of the year.... [Jeff Dwarf Subject: Re: TMBG On Fri, Sep 21, 2001 at 08:21:14AM -0400, Maximilian Lang wrote: > I used to be into TMBG heavily and stopped with Flood. Which CDs would some > of you recommend? Apparently I'm a bit off-kilter for this list, but I'm a fan of all of Their albums to a greater or lesser degree. I will concur that the first three are really amazing, but there's definately good stuff on the later ones. _Apollo 18_ is a really good kind of quirky album, still fairly true to how they started, only with some people playing real instruments instead of a Casio drum machine (although it's worth noting that at least on _The Guitar_ Linnel is playing bass, and the only "extra" person is Laura Cantrell on vocals). _Misc T_, is very comparable to the first three, naturally, as it's a collection of B-sides from those releases. _John Henry_ is a fairly serious departure from their earlier material, but it's really grown on me. _Dirt Bike_ is a really nice slow song in the same vein as _Road Movie to Berlin_ which is later echoed by _Mink Car_ (which aside from the length, is probably my favourite of the triad). They definately have a band, and make no bones about it, but once you get over They not being They, it's really superb, IMHO. _Factory Showroom_ is probably my least favourite - I really just can't stand the constant lead guitar sullying otherwise good tracks (_XTC vs. Adam Ant_ and _Metal Detector_) but _Spiralling Shape_ makes it all worthwhile. _Severe Tire Damage_ is probably the weakest of them all, as its just a rehash that we're all too familiar with. I like the jazzy take on _She's Actual Size_, but I've been to a million They shows and even though it's never really the same thing twice, you do grow kind of numb to it and don't need an album composed of live tracks. I have mixed opinions about _Long Tall Weekend_. I can listen to it every once and a while, but it's almost /too/ clean, and that bugs me. _Certain People I Could Name_ is a perrenial favourite. _Working Undercover for the Man_ hasn't warranted a lot of listens from me. The title track was one of my favourites (along with _Certain People I Could Name_) from the concerts. It's just one of those tracks that when you can't hear it well enough to understand the lyrics, it just festers on the unconscious and you find yourself trying to sing it, but getting frustrated for the lack of known lyrics. In general, I just thought a lot of the tracks were unfinished. _Mink Car_, as I've stated previously, is pretty fantastic, and up there with _John Henry_, but with more of a classic They feel to it. I like the newer renditions of _Cyclops Rock_ and _Drink!_, although I'm not a big fan of the former, and think the TMBG Unlimited version of Drink! preferable, for the most part. All in all, though, it's very consistantly listenable and boppy, which is what I like best about Them. - -bjc ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 18:05:47 -0400 From: Brian Cully Subject: Re: Still more inappropriate playlist entries On Fri, Sep 21, 2001 at 10:21:37AM -0500, JH3 wrote: > Speaking of TMBG, yesterday I vaguely recalled a song > of theirs that mentioned a bunch of NYC landmarks, and > sure enough, it's on "Factory Showroom" -- but the song > doesn't mention the WTC at all, and it's probably the only > major NYC landmark it *doesn't* mention. _New York City_, and it's a They cover of a Cub song. One of the better off that album. - -bjc ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 18:06:35 -0400 From: Ken Weingold Subject: Re: Bush's speech II On Fri, Sep 21, 2001, Maximilian Lang wrote: > >on 9/21/01 7:51 AM, Ken Weingold at hazmat@hellrot.org wrote: > > > I cannot believe that I forgot to mention this. Right after the > > speech was over, some git turns back on the music in the place. > > What came on? Yup, you guessed it, Born In The USA. I bet Bruce > > would be appalled.... > > > Perhaps, although I wouldn't be surprised if he played it on the TV > special tonight. Bruce? He wouldn't dare. Would he? Unless, of course, he changed the lyrics. - -Ken ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 15:12:11 -0700 From: Tom Clark Subject: Re: Bush's speech II on 9/21/01 3:06 PM, Ken Weingold at hazmat@hellrot.org wrote: >>> What came on? Yup, you guessed it, Born In The USA. I bet Bruce >>> would be appalled.... >> >> >> Perhaps, although I wouldn't be surprised if he played it on the TV >> special tonight. > > Bruce? He wouldn't dare. Would he? Unless, of course, he changed > the lyrics. Am I missing something here? Which lyrics would be inappropriate? - -tc ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 17:03:49 -0500 From: JH3 Subject: Re: Pakistan playing ball > And speaking of using a stick, has anyone else heard the > rumor that the US plans to oust the Taliban and replace > them with a former Afghani monarch? I just hope nobody around here is into all that Nostradamus shit, because it's almost like these people are deliberately trying to prove him right or something. The traditional title of the Afghan monarch was "Khan." John "I just like being first to point these things out" Hedges ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 17:19:48 -0500 (CDT) From: Marshall Needleman Armintor Subject: telelogy <> Nice to see someone referencing the Symposium on a mailing list -- that's a first for me. I think that dialogue is the ur-text for all of Western philosophy, how that for pompous? Actually, I've got an extended discussion of it, particularly the part with Alcibiades, going into the first chapter of my dissertation. To be fair to Aristotle, all of what survives of his work is what we would call today "lecture notes," which why it's so dense. Presumably when actually discussing and disseminating his ideas, he would embellish and give examples. He did write lots of other things, apparently, and no less an authority on eloquence than Cicero wrote that Aristotle's dialogues outshone those of Plato. But we'll never know. marshall np billie holiday ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 15:21:24 -0700 From: "Jason R. Thornton" Subject: Re: Bush's speech II At 03:12 PM 9/21/2001 -0700, Tom Clark wrote: >on 9/21/01 3:06 PM, Ken Weingold at hazmat@hellrot.org wrote: > > >>> What came on? Yup, you guessed it, Born In The USA. I bet Bruce > >>> would be appalled.... > >> > >> > >> Perhaps, although I wouldn't be surprised if he played it on the TV > >> special tonight. > > > > Bruce? He wouldn't dare. Would he? Unless, of course, he changed > > the lyrics. > >Am I missing something here? Which lyrics would be inappropriate? For example: Got in a little hometown jam So they put a rifle in my hand Sent me off to a foreign land To go and kill the yellow man - --Jason ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Sep 2001 10:24:52 +1200 From: grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan) Subject: Re: 5-1! (fwd) That's more what the list needs right now! Good show that man! > Universal Pictures announced today they plan to make a film of the > momentous football match that took place on Saturday 2nd September 2001. > > Five-One is the tentative title of what could be next year's big summer > hit, depicting the American national soccer team's stunning victory over > Germany. > > Nicholas Cage heads an all star cast as the captain of the brave US Soccer > team haunted by the trauma of losing in the 2000 World Cup final on > penalties and the death of his wife in a riot caused by English football > hooligans, and finds love in the arms of a female sports journalist played > by Julia Roberts. Mel Gibson is the no-nonsense Swedish coach who leads > them to glory, with Keanu Reeves, Ben Affleck, Matt Damon and Will Smith > playing some of Cage's heroic team mates. Jeremy Irons is set to star as > Sir Nigel Villiers-Smythe, the dastardly Englishman who coaches the German > team and forces them to play with poisoned-tipped studs to try and cheat > the heroic American team out of victory. > > Director Steven Spielberg defended the film-makers' decision to focus on > the American contribution to the victory over Germany and inaccurate and > even imagined events in the story, saying, "Obviously we've had to take > some artistic licence to make the story work on film, but I hope that what > we produce will be true to the spirit of what happened on that famous > night." James James Dignan, Dunedin, New Zealand. =-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= -=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.- .-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=- You talk to me as if from a distance -.-=-.- And I reply with impressions chosen from another time =-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-. (Brian Eno - "By this River") ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Sep 2001 10:24:57 +1200 From: grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan) Subject: mainly flags, some music, and and old Greek guy >> Essence. He differed from Plato(in one of many ways) in that he felt >> Form had no being independent of Essence. > >* He was Alexander the Great's tutor. Maybe AtG rushed off to conquer the >world in order to skive off lessons like this one ... ah Alexander. Even he had trouble with the Afghani. >And how about this for a song to ban. The Screaming Blue Messiahs' Killer >Born Man. Bill Carter tells it like it is... Warren Zevon's "Turbulence". >> Back to flags anyone? >But seriously folks, how come pretty colors aren't flag worthy;-? >I think the NZ flag -should- have kiwi in it. >- -->Chas in LA replies: I believe that most flags originated as battle >standards and needed to be recognizable from a long distance so their >history is to be 'contrasty.' a subtle blending of kiwi and teal just doesnt >stand out through cannon smoke. not a kiwifruit, a kiwi. Brown. or stylised white. And' you're right about them needing to be recognised from a distance, which is why both Australia and New Zealand frequently debate changing their flags. IMHO the Aussies should change theirs first (after all, they stole the design from us!) >* OK. What's special about the Nepalese flag? (James, don't tell anybody >until they've had a try). as if I would :) The wojster's right, though, as is JohnH with his luvly description. And that's not just special, it's unique (unless you - incorrectly - claim that square flags aren't rectangular)> >- -->Chas in LA replies: just out of curiosity, i wonder which >country/continent is prominent on the image of the globe of our fair and >dear Mother Earth? any wagering types out there? well I know what you're thinking but the best known view of the world from space places the Democratic Republic of Congo in the middle of the image, and that's the one used. So, which two European countries officially have square flags? A clue. One of them's very small... James Dignan, Dunedin, New Zealand. =-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= -=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.- .-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=- You talk to me as if from a distance -.-=-.- And I reply with impressions chosen from another time =-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-. (Brian Eno - "By this River") ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 15:33:32 -0700 From: "Walker, Charles" Subject: the third path One of my greatest fears going into whatever retaliation the US embarks upon is the potential for a widening of the conflict into a Pan-Islamic war with the West. chas in LA replies; an appeal to the folks smarter than i - most of you probably. but something has been bugging me for a bit and i havent heard anyone talk much about this. the notion comes out from the 'why were we attacked?' question that many have been discussing here in LA. the rightist attitude here in LA is, 'well, 'cause we're the best. they hate us for our freedom and what we have.' the leftist tends to slant to 'it's our policies abroad over the last 15 years.' - i've heard a bit of this from the list here. both seem somewhat credible to me. but i have this idea that the goal of ObL and his groups may be a bit more insular. the goal is not to topple the US directly through terrorist attacks, but to lure us into the region with our far reaching promises and essentially disrupting the whole area. the US could be the catalyst and not the antagonist/protagonist in WW III. most americans, myself included, struggle with our vanity to think that the world couldnt possible have a world conflict without us. but perhaps ObL's goal is more of an end around play to get us into a holy war where the whole region descends into chaos and then it DOES come around to us dealing with a faith - 1 billion strong as opposed to our stated goals of dealing only with terrorists and those who support them. i do not support the annihilation of entire countries but our quest to have no collateral damage and fight 'the good war' [whatever that means] might make this a slippery arena. it is easy to get the toothpaste out but not back in kind of stuff. perhaps i am being overly cautious - something MUST be done, i do believe that. but perhaps in some of our war lust we are getting a bit blinded to the fact that there may be other factors at work than just the USA getting attacked. ObL is no genius but i think he knows us better than we know him, at least in public discussions. my knowledge of islam is next to zilch except it has, shameful to say, given me an uneasy feeling in the past - some of the implied rhetoric. i think this situation is FAR more complicated than is being openly discussed. i worry about civil wars and pakistan/indian conflagrations, the whole region could explode and what good are our rhetorical gascans that we have been running around with then? feel free to expostulate to the nth degree... ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 18:44:52 -0400 From: "Maximilian Lang" Subject: Re: Bush's speech II >From: "Jason R. Thornton" >Reply-To: "Jason R. Thornton" >To: jingo bells >Subject: Re: Bush's speech II >Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 15:21:24 -0700 > >At 03:12 PM 9/21/2001 -0700, Tom Clark wrote: >>on 9/21/01 3:06 PM, Ken Weingold at hazmat@hellrot.org wrote: >> >> >>> What came on? Yup, you guessed it, Born In The USA. I bet Bruce >> >>> would be appalled.... >> >> >> >> >> >> Perhaps, although I wouldn't be surprised if he played it on the TV >> >> special tonight. >> > >> > Bruce? He wouldn't dare. Would he? Unless, of course, he changed >> > the lyrics. >> >>Am I missing something here? Which lyrics would be inappropriate? > >For example: > > Got in a little hometown jam > So they put a rifle in my hand > Sent me off to a foreign land > To go and kill the yellow man > >--Jason OOPS didn't really think of it that way, well it has a better chance of being done than 46 Bullets or whatever it was called. Max _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 16:02:00 -0700 From: Tom Clark Subject: I'll Be Damned I've been listening to the new Damned album for a week now and I've got to say it KICKS ASS. I think it was Hamish who posted about it a while ago, and while I don't think I'll be sticking pencils in my ears to avoid hearing anything else, I am going to keep it in the rotation for a good long time. not jason priestly, - -tc ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Sep 2001 11:12:53 +1200 From: grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan) Subject: Flags, Germans, Afghanistan, and Palmer >Can anyone tell me the history of the Isle of Man flag? >Are they the legs of Morris dancers? it's called a triskelion, and it's an ancient symbol dating back (I think) to Viking times. The motto of the island reflects its turbulent early history - something like "Whichever way I'm thrown, I stand". Strangely, the only other place to have ever used it on a flag is Sicily (but then again, the Vikings got there, too). >Here, there are *always* interesting discussions. Being in Germany, I'm >sorry to never have met any of you guys in person, but maybe we'll manage >that at some point during the next 8 years ;-) agreed - it's the same here. At least where you are it wouldn't be that difficult to meet some of the Britfegs. Here I suspect that DLang is the nearest, and he's still a couplathou miles away. >And speaking of using a stick, has anyone else heard the rumor that the US >plans to oust the Taliban and replace them with a former Afghani monarch? (I >haven't heard who, and I'll leave it to those more knowledgeable of Afghani >politics to speculate on his identity). first find one. Afghanistan have had (ISTR) seventeen revolutions and civil wars in the last 100 years (and before you ask yes, they've also had more flags in the last century than any other country). The monarchy somehow survived on and off until July 17th, 1973. >chas in LA writes: that kansas1225 from few posts back [363] is pretty >crazed. but i know where he is coming from. i had a friend back in college >who was paranoid schizophrenic, clinically diagnosed, and he sounds EXACTLY >like this guy - same patterns of finding, well, patterns in numbers as they >relate to world events. at one point my friend was trying to numerically >figure out and prove that the president of my college, john lennon, and the >southern baptists were all in cahoots with one another. was he being followed by Carl Palmer? James James Dignan, Dunedin, New Zealand. =-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= -=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.- .-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=- You talk to me as if from a distance -.-=-.- And I reply with impressions chosen from another time =-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-. (Brian Eno - "By this River") ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 19:29:19 -0400 From: "madcowan" Subject: Re: Plato: the Movie! From Kay: >Would love to hear a female cover of Costellos's "Girls Talk" The wild rocker Linda Ronstadt did that one too, showing that she at least had good taste in material. Roberta ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 20:14:01 -0400 (EDT) From: Rob Gronotte Subject: Re: relative badness I said: > So, one dead innocent is as bad as 5000? Sounds very strange to me. > I guess we might as well just nuke the whole country, since 50 million or > so should also be about just as bad, and then we'd be sure to get the > guilty ones, huh? noe shalev replied: > It's not actualy said here, but do you mean you measure guilt and human > lives by nombers? Pretty much, yes. I don't know any other way to measure lives or anything else. > if so the US is not in a very good position on the world life taker > list. I certainly never said it was, nor was that close to being the issue as far as I am concerne. > would you kill a person to save anopther 100? or let's make it more > provactive and nasty, would you kill me to save anothe 1,000? I probably would, if I had your permission. I certainly would sacrifice myself for 1000 innocent civilian lives, maybe even for 1000 soldiers. I'd try to get someone to take care of my cats first, but the 1000 would be missed a lot more than I would be. Rob Why don't you come up and surf me sometime? --> http://www.patriot.net/users/rob ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 21:40:50 -0400 From: Ken Weingold Subject: Re: I'll Be Damned On Fri, Sep 21, 2001, Tom Clark wrote: > I've been listening to the new Damned album for a week now and I've got to > say it KICKS ASS. I think it was Hamish who posted about it a while ago, > and while I don't think I'll be sticking pencils in my ears to avoid hearing > anything else, I am going to keep it in the rotation for a good long time. Tom, thanks so much for that. I had no idea they had a new album out. Maybe on this tour they will actually play some of it! I thought the album the put out in '96, Not Of This Earth (US) / I'm Alright Jack & The Beanstalk (UK), was AWESOME. Every time I listen to it I like it more, too. But the tour after that, nothing from it. Different band. The original band toured, but the Not Of This Earth was different enough that they played none of it. Very disappointing. One comment, though. I think Patricia Morrison sucks in the band. Just doesn't work in The Damned. - -Ken ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Sep 2001 05:50:41 +0200 From: "noe shalev" Subject: Re: relative badness noe shalev replied: > > > It's not actualy said here, but do you mean you measure guilt and human > > lives by numbers? rob said: > Pretty much, yes. I don't know any other way to measure lives or anything > else. well, just few lines later you said "for 1000 innocent civilian lives, maybe even for 1000 soldiers" well here's another measurment so it's not numbers alone. do you remember the atempt to assasinate reagan? I remember the two security guys jumping as alive shield to take the bullets and protect him. should two die to save one? because this is exactly what they were paid for. Here in Israel one of the magor claims against the security service, after the assasination of PM Rabin, were aimed at the slightly wounded bodyguad. who should have cover him completley. my point is that like it or not. we don't and can't measure lives solely by NUmbers. it doesn't work this way. > > I probably would, if I had your permission. I certainly would sacrifice > myself for 1000 innocent civilian lives, maybe even for 1000 soldiers. > I'd try to get someone to take care of my cats first, but the 1000 would > be missed a lot more than I would be. > so let's make it harder on you. would u justify an operation in which two firemen get killed in order to save a baby? one baby? you don't have to answer that. what I'm trying to say is clear. there are other social, practical, cultoral and moral issues involved in the art of killing. thus I think killing is wrong. I don't like playing god and have the decision who is to live and who's not. and realy appreiciate it that you wouldn't kill me without getting my permission. this is exactly what I said. even you agree that saving lives and lots of them is not a complete justification to take mine instead all the best :-) NOE ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 23:15:27 -0700 (PDT) From: Jeff Dwarf Subject: Re: 5-1! (fwd) Michael R Godwin wrote: > ... Mel Gibson is the no-nonsense Swedish coach who leads > them to glory, ... doesn't mel have enough trouble being believable doing the accents of the two countries he's from (the US and Australia), without having him try Swedish. and besides, to really make it marketable to americans, you'd have to change it to a(n american) football game. or at least basketball. ===== "Loyalty to a petrified opinion never yet broke a chain or freed a human soul." -- Mark Twain "The divinity of Jesus has been made a convenient cover for every absurdity." -- John Adams "The jury is the last line of defense against corporate misconduct." -- Craig McDonald, Texans for Public Justice ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2001 23:49:15 -0700 (PDT) From: Jeff Dwarf Subject: Re: they might be guy ants question "Jason R. Thornton" wrote: > Aaron Mandel wrote: >> Jason R. Thornton wrote: >>> Just out of curiosity, does anyone know on which They Might Be >>> Giants album the "Daily Show" theme-tune might be found, if any? >>wasn't it written by Bob Mould? a brief web search suggests it was, >>or at least a lot of people think so. > Oh, you're right. My mistake. I must have read the closing credits > too quickly... according to the omniscient Internet Movie Database: > Original music by > John Flansburgh (as They Might Be Giants) > John Linnell (as They Might Be Giants) > Bob Mould (main theme) "Dog on Fire" was written by Mould; the original version was recorded by Mould. sometime during Jon Stewart's first year, TMBG recorded a new version of it, which they've been using ever since. i got the impression when TMBG were on 9/10 they and Stewart (another Jo[h]n!!) go way back; i know TMBG were the house band during the millenium special. ===== "Loyalty to a petrified opinion never yet broke a chain or freed a human soul." -- Mark Twain "The divinity of Jesus has been made a convenient cover for every absurdity." -- John Adams "The jury is the last line of defense against corporate misconduct." -- Craig McDonald, Texans for Public Justice ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Sep 2001 00:22:31 -0700 (PDT) From: Jeff Dwarf Subject: Re: Bush's speech II Ken Weingold wrote: > I cannot believe that I forgot to mention this. Right after the > speech was over, some git turns back on the music in the place. What > came on? Yup, you guessed it, Born In The USA. I bet Bruce would be > appalled.... between that and "rock the casbah," it's a gonna be a banner month for songs being played by people clueless about what they actually are about... ===== "Loyalty to a petrified opinion never yet broke a chain or freed a human soul." -- Mark Twain "The divinity of Jesus has been made a convenient cover for every absurdity." -- John Adams "The jury is the last line of defense against corporate misconduct." -- Craig McDonald, Texans for Public Justice ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Sep 2001 04:34:41 -0700 (PDT) From: Jeff Dwarf Subject: It's the most blunderful time of the year.... http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1448907/20010917/ramones.jhtml Spirit Of '77: Ramones, Pistols Nominated For Hall Of Fame 09.17.2001 With punk rock progenitors the Sex Pistols and the Ramones sharing the 2002 Rock and Roll Hall of Fame nomination ballot with more populist acts such as Jackson Browne and Tom Petty, this year's end-of-ceremony jam session could be an anarchic sight to behold. The committee might not be brave enough to elect both punk acts; and though seminal, the Pistols, who recorded only one album proper in their short career, might be too anti-establishment for the typically conservative Rock Hall. By contrast, the Ramones recorded tirelessly for two decades  exerting considerable influence on everyone from U2 to Green Day  and have the sympathy of the industry following the death of singer Joey Ramone, who succumbed to lymphoma on April 15 (see "Punk Pioneer Joey Ramone Dead At 49"). Last week, around 1,000 members of the nominating committee received the 2002 Hall of Fame ballot, which also includes first-time nominees Talking Heads, funk-soul icon Isaac Hayes, alt-country maverick Gram Parsons, '60s teen-pop singer Gene Pitney, R&B girl group the Chantels and doo-wop acts the Dells and the "5" Royales. The 2002 Rock and Roll Hall of Fame ballot will also include repeat nominees AC/DC, Patti Smith, Brenda Lee, Lynyrd Skynyrd and Black Sabbath, the latter of whom may decline their nomination, as they have in years past (see "Ozzy Tells Rock Hall To Forget About Black Sabbath"). Artists become eligible for the Hall of Fame 25 years after the release of their first record. Criteria includes "the influence and significance of the artist's contributions to the development and perpetuation of rock and roll," according to the organization. This year's selection process began last spring when a group of around 60 industry professionals made up of record executives, lawyers, managers, journalists and musicians convened to brainstorm potential nominees, said the Hall of Fame publicist. A laundry list of names was pared down to the 16 nominees. Between five and eight final inductees are typically chosen by the committee, which is made up of a pool of 1,000 voters from throughout the music industry. Inductees for the class of 2001 were Aerosmith, Steely Dan, Queen, Michael Jackson (solo), Paul Simon (solo), Solomon Burke, Ritchie Valens, the Flamingos, James Burton and Johnnie Johnson (see "Aerosmith Thrilled, Steely Dan Unimpressed At Rock Hall Ceremony"). The Rock and Roll Hall of Fame and Museum is located in Cleveland, Ohio. Jon Wiederhorn ===== "Loyalty to a petrified opinion never yet broke a chain or freed a human soul." -- Mark Twain "The divinity of Jesus has been made a convenient cover for every absurdity." -- John Adams "The jury is the last line of defense against corporate misconduct." -- Craig McDonald, Texans for Public Justice ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V10 #371 ********************************