From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V10 #362 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Tuesday, September 18 2001 Volume 10 : Number 362 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Smither in Australia (no RH content) ["Mike Wells" ] beGoggled ["Viola Rockiss" ] RE: wtf is wrong with people? ["Poole, R. Edward" ] Witness ["Viola Rockiss" ] RE: Interesting article (Guardian 18/9/01) ["Poole, R. Edward" ] Robyn Hitchcock film music: Mrs. Baker [strange little woj ] the prodigal returns... [Natalie Jane Jacobs ] Re: flagburning ["lucifersam" ] music again [BLATZMAN@aol.com] Memorials Worldwide [hydra@voicenet.com] Re: stars, bars, etc.--a bit late, but... [lj lindhurst ] Re: stars, bars, etc.--a bit late, but... [Christopher Gross ] Julie [Brett Cooper ] Re: Music (No RH% & NO WTC%) ["victorian squid" ] Re: stars, bars, etc.--a bit late, but... ["Kenneth Johnson" Subject: Smither in Australia (no RH content) FYI thought that the "down under" fegs might be interested to see Chris Smither is playing Australia in October. Apart from that, I thought the venue names were smashing (why can't we have a "Cape Nelson Lightstation" here?) Michael who would like to blame his recent case of Shingles on bin Laden, but can't prove it (it's a conspiracy!) ================= In this time of confusion and sadness, we just want to offer our sincere condolences to everyone affected by this week's tragedy, our heartfelt gratitude to those who are involved in the rescue and recovery, and peace to all during this difficult time. Sincerely, The folks at Young/Hunter Management p.s. To donate to the Red Cross Disaster Relief Fund: http://www.redcross.org/donate/donate.html or http://www.amazon.com/red-cross AUSTRALIA: WA 10/4 Albany Town Hall, Albany, 0418 933 346 10/5 Rock Garden Cafi, Inglewood, 08 9272 1011 10/6 Kulcha Club, Fremantle, 08 9336 4544 10/7 Kulcha Club, Fremantle, 08 9336 4544 SA 10/10 The Governor Hindmarsh, Adelaide, 08 8340 0744 VIC 10/11 Uncle Neill's Place, Upwey, 03 9754 1177 10/12 East Brunswick Club Hotel, East Brunswick, 03 9387 3376 10/13 The Big House @ 3 Oaks, Geelong, 03 5266 1638 10/14 Lancefield Winery, Lancefield, 03 5433 5292 10/16 Cape Nelson Lightstation, Portland, 03 5523 5100 10/17 Cornish Arms Hotel, Brunswick, 03 9380 8383 10/18 Serviceman's Memorial Hall, Beechworth, 03 5728 6555 ACT 10/19 The Merry Muse, Canberra, 02 6262 7265 NSW 10/20 The Harp Hotel, Tempe, 02 9559 6300 10/21 The Claron Hotel, Katoomba, 02 4782 1322 10/23 Panorama Motor Lodge, Bathurst, 02 6332 1175 10/24 Twyford Hall, Merimbula, 0500 538 479 10/26 The Great Northern Hotel, Byron Bay, 02 6685 6454 10/28, The Basement, Sydney, 02 9251 2797 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 10:15:57 -0400 (EDT) From: Christopher Gross Subject: RE: Israel On Mon, 17 Sep 2001, Capuchin wrote: > Are you saying there is no law or policy in Israel that is particularly > jewish? No, I'm not. (I could go on about hostile misinterpretation of my words, etc....) But Israel is certainly not a Jewish theocracy, or anything close to it. It has Muslim, Christian and atheist citizens who practice their beliefs openly and legally. > > Ah, yes, Saint Noam the Infallible.... > > You'll note that I particularly stated that I had no reference for > this... I mean, I could refer you to the particular interview (or talk, I > forget) in which he makes the statement, I don't have an external > reference. I certainly wouldn't just say "Yeah, Chomsky SAID SO!" and > expect it to mean a damn. You're right, I shouldn't have said that. I just find it amusing the way so many people cite Chomsky at every opportunity, like fundamentalist Christians quoting scripture. But to express my amusement the way I did put a misleading spin on your words. I realize that in retrospect, and I apologize. - --Chris ______________________________________________________________________ Christopher Gross On the Internet, nobody knows I'm a dog. chrisg@gwu.edu ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 14:05:24 +0000 From: "Viola Rockiss" Subject: beGoggled I wrote: >McGonagall exudes McGonagallness Stewart, stalwart Scot that he is, shot back- >what, exudes an unshakeable air of their own genius in spite of > >overwhelming >evidence to the contrary? Or has the name of the great poet and >tragedian >been taken in vain by some tawdry piece of kidult kulture? >I fear the latter. And I'm talking about William Topaz, who is the >McGonagall in my book Oh forgive me laddie for taking the name of Scotland's most, err, "unusual" bard in vain. But yes, the head of Gryffindor House in Harry Potter is a female Prof McGonagall(wonder if that was intentional on Rowling's part.) In penitence to my grevious sin against all, err, -underated- poets everywhere(one of which I consider myself. Alas, while my poetical powers do indeed almost equel that of the the glittering Topaz Ive yet to rouse myself to a similarly unshakable belief in my own genius) I include two of my favorite passages from the Master's work. The first bit is from "The Railway Bridge of the Silver Kay," the second from "The Kay Bridge Disater." "Beatiful Railway Bridge of the Silvery Kay ! That has caused the Emperor of Brazil to leave His home far away, incognito in his dress, And view thee ere he passed along en route to Inverness." or, descending farther into the river's bathos "It must have been an awful sight, To witness in the dusky moonlight, While the Storm Fiend did laugh, and angry did bray, Along the Railway Bridge of the Silv'ry Kay, Oh! ill-fated Bridge of the Silv'ry Kay, I must now conclude my lay By telling the world fearlessly without the least dismay, That your central girders would not have given way, At least many sensible men do say, Had they been supported on each side with buttresses, At least many sensible men confesses, For the stronger we our houses do build, The less chance we have of being killed." The river T.., wait, no, Kay, looking for buttresses in all the wrong braces "But cleanliness of the soul is important, dont you thee-ee-ink?" Robyn Hitchcock _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 10:27:52 -0400 From: "Poole, R. Edward" Subject: RE: wtf is wrong with people? Jeme: >> That said, I totally agree that the people buying and selling >> this crap are pretty sick and fucked-up, but making it harder >> for them to find a venue isn't going to make it go away. >> That was the thinking behind alcoholic prohibition and the >> church's battle against homosexuality. We know how >> successful those have been. Huddell: >Attention Edward R. Poole: I feel quite certain that Jeme is *not* >lamenting the church's failure to wipe out homosexuality. Thanks. I picked up on that -- Jeme didn't say "homosexuals probably should be destroyed," so I didn't jump to any conclusions about his bias/lack of bias towards gays and lesbians. Oh, and it's "R. Edward," if you don't mind. ============================================================================This e-mail message and any attached files are confidential and are intended solely for the use of the addressee(s) named above. This communication may contain material protected by attorney-client, work product, or other privileges. If you are not the intended recipient or person responsible for delivering this confidential communication to the intended recipient, you have received this communication in error, and any review, use, dissemination, forwarding, printing, copying, or other distribution of this e-mail message and any attached files is strictly prohibited. If you have received this confidential communication in error, please notify the sender immediately by reply e-mail message and permanently delete the original message. To reply to our email administrator directly, send an email to postmaster@dsmo.com Dickstein Shapiro Morin & Oshinsky LLP http://www.legalinnovators.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 14:25:44 +0000 From: "Viola Rockiss" Subject: Witness Just as a witness for my heritage and not to cause further discord. As a half-Jew who once had -alot- of family in Germany I find the comment that the Israili people "probobly" shouldnt be destroyed almost unspeakably offensive. While I support a Jewish state in the Middle East I can accept that others may not. I do not accept the casual tossing-around of the idea of mass-murder. Of -any- people. And as someone who was Jewish enough for Hitler, Im sure you all understand my need to say this. Kay "But cleanliness of the soul is important, dont you thee-ee-ink?" Robyn Hitchcock _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 10:38:36 -0400 From: "Poole, R. Edward" Subject: RE: Interesting article (Guardian 18/9/01) Matt: >A very interesting piece by >all-round-socialist-hero/dangerous-pinko-looney George Monbiot... I have >to say he makes a lot of sense... "an eye for an eye makes the whole >world blind" now that's what I call wisdom! True, that's wise, but it's also a quote from Gandhi. ============================================================================This e-mail message and any attached files are confidential and are intended solely for the use of the addressee(s) named above. This communication may contain material protected by attorney-client, work product, or other privileges. If you are not the intended recipient or person responsible for delivering this confidential communication to the intended recipient, you have received this communication in error, and any review, use, dissemination, forwarding, printing, copying, or other distribution of this e-mail message and any attached files is strictly prohibited. If you have received this confidential communication in error, please notify the sender immediately by reply e-mail message and permanently delete the original message. To reply to our email administrator directly, send an email to postmaster@dsmo.com Dickstein Shapiro Morin & Oshinsky LLP http://www.legalinnovators.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 18:32:39 +1200 From: grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan) Subject: Re: flagburning >Only a miserable, ingrateful asshole would burn an American flag... but >I'm proud to live in a country where it's not illegal to be a miserable, >ingrateful asshole. > >And, to my way of thinking, a country that allows its people to burn its >flag is just taking cues from a God that would let his people murder his >son. to be a vexillologically minded pedant here, burning the flag is technically the only legal way of destroying a *damaged* US flag. If you have an old, ripped US flag and get a new flag, then it is illegal for you to throw the old one away. If you want to get rid of it (and aren't prepared to give it to someone else) you should burn it. I realise that this is different to the symbolic burning of a flag in protest, but it's a piece of useless information I thought you wouldn't like to know. This has been a public disservice announcement. James James Dignan, Dunedin, New Zealand. =-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= -=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.- .-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=- You talk to me as if from a distance -.-=-.- And I reply with impressions chosen from another time =-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-. (Brian Eno - "By this River") ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 15:15:26 +0100 (BST) From: Michael R Godwin Subject: Re: crusade On Tue, 18 Sep 2001, minister of misinformation wrote: > The continuing presence of US troops in S Arabia is seen as defiling > the holy shrines at Mecca. They also had interviews with other > moderate US Muslims who said that for them this also was an insult, > although they would not support a jihad aimed against the west , but > it was a problem for them. Interesting piece in today's Independent saying that the word 'crusade' which has been employed by the US govt. has the same implications to Muslims as the word 'jihad' does to us - a holy war against all unbelievers. The writer said that the use of this term is likely to make non-terrorist Arabs think that the US is planning war against the whole of Islam. - - MRG ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 11:10:22 -0400 From: strange little woj Subject: Robyn Hitchcock film music: Mrs. Baker >From: "Daniel Saunders" >To: woj@fegmania.org >Subject: Robyn Hitchcock film music: Mrs. Baker >Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2001 16:45:13 -0700 > >I don't know if people have already heard about this, but Robyn Hitchcock >"has offered to contribute some of his music" to the film in progress called >Mrs. Baker by Brian McDonald, who made a cool short film I saw at the >Seattle International Film Festival called White Face. The announcement >about Robyn's involvement is halfway down this page: > >http://www.scotopiapictures.com/Current/currentprogress.html > >The main page for the film is at: > >http://www.scotopiapictures.com/Current/current.html > >and there's a neat handwritten "letter of support" by Robyn Hitchcock at > >http://www.scotopiapictures.com/Current/currentletters_robyn.html > >Dan ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 08:52:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Natalie Jane Jacobs Subject: the prodigal returns... I made it back to Portland last night, at last. Everyone on the plane was trading stories of "Where were you stranded?" There was a smattering of applause when the plane finally touched down. Surprisingly few flags here. There's two BIG ones hung up at work, though. Portland fegs - Marrakesh's special feast does not involve a whole goat, it involves a whole SHEEP. (You can order half or a quarter.) It's $29 per person, and has to be ordered 3 days in advance. just so you know, n. - -- Natalie Jane Jacobs gnat@bitmine.net ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 16:53:02 +0100 From: "lucifersam" Subject: Re: flagburning Lucky for us that we have freedom in the west huh? - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- - --- If you have an old, ripped US flag and get a new flag, then it is illegal for you to throw the old one away. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 11:59:36 EDT From: BLATZMAN@aol.com Subject: music again I've been lucky enough to share my music with a number of Fegs over the years, and I'm happy to say I've got some new stuff I'd like to share. Now that MP3s are everywhere, I have a new tune that I could email to anyone interested. It's a bit sappy, more Terry Hall than Robyn... The song is actually not done, but I started working on it 4 years ago with people, then I moved out of LA to Phoenix, and with things the way they are in the world, I don't know if I'll ever be able to finish my music. So I present it here as a work in progress... Email me offlist if any kind souls would care to take a listen. File size is around 4000 kb(not all servers will take a file this size) Dave/blatzy/blatzman ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 12:42:13 US/Eastern From: hydra@voicenet.com Subject: Memorials Worldwide http://www.wam.umd.edu/~hughesa/thankyou.htm - --------------------------------------------- This message was sent using Voicenet WebMail. http://www.voicenet.com/webmail/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 12:52:08 -0400 From: lj lindhurst Subject: Re: stars, bars, etc.--a bit late, but... Natalie wrote: >My grandmother (hardly a hawkish type) was wearing red, white, and >blue today. I asked her why, and she said she found people's >kindness and generosity during the last few days to be inspiring. >"But other people besides Americans are kind and generous," I said. >"But Americans are the closest people to hand," she said. Well, all >right... I'm not going to split hairs with a nearly-deaf >91-year-old. :) > >Anyway, I wonder how much of this flag-waving is inspired by my >grandmother's attitude, and how much of it is inspired by weird >abstract notions of AMERICA as "our side," "the good guys," etc.? I >think it's mostly the latter. I got a nasty chill when I saw >footage of people in Washington D.C. chanting "U.S.A.! U.S.A.!" as >if at a football game. Our team's gonna kick your team's ass, man! >Yeah! Whoo! 'Cos we're the land of the free, man! > >My sister asked my grandmother (who's lived through WWI, WWII, the >Korean War, and the Vietnam War) if this uglier sort of patriotism >seemed like a precusor to war. She said, "Oh, yes, definitely." You know, this has been bugging me ever since I read it. What the hell is WRONG with your grandma wearing red, white, and blue? And yes, other people besides Americans are kind and generous, but what the hell does that have to do with anything at a time like this? Are you just LOOKING for something to bitch about?? Millions and millions of people--AMERICANS, mainly--were affected by the terrorist attack. And I don't think I need to mention the obvious fact that this attack took place IN America (regardless of the symbolism of the sites attacked). I think it's wonderful that your grandmother was showing that she appreciates the kindness and generosity of the American people, and I find her show of solidarity quite touching. Once again, what the hell is wrong with this? America IS "our side"! Don't you live in America??? Is it so *un-hip* to you kneejerk-leftist Pacific-Northwesterners to take a little bit of pride in your country and your people, or at least feel a surge of gratitude at the outpouring of generosity and charity during such a personally sad time for so many people? I'm sick to death of this shit. You guys can preach from your soap-boxes till the cows come home and that's not going to change SHIT for those guys from Boone County, Missouri who got in their cars and drove 28 hours straight to NYC to volunteer 24/7 in the rescue effort. Now those are Americans, and those are kind and generous people, and they deserve more than cynical overanalytical bullshit from a bunch of overeducated wankers in god-forsaken Oregon. lj ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 10:34:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Capuchin Subject: Re: stars, bars, etc.--a bit late, but... On Tue, 18 Sep 2001, lj lindhurst wrote: > What the hell is WRONG with your grandma wearing red, white, and > blue? And yes, other people besides Americans are kind and generous, > but what the hell does that have to do with anything at a time like [snip] > America IS "our side"! Don't you live in America??? Is it so > *un-hip* to you kneejerk-leftist Pacific-Northwesterners to take a > little bit of pride in your country and your people, or at least feel > a surge of gratitude at the outpouring of generosity and charity > during such a personally sad time for so many people? I feel gratitude. I feel a desire to help. I believe the best way to help is to do everything I can to prevent more killing. I live in America, but I reject killing in my name. As long as some would use national security or patriotism or pride as an excuse for murder, I will not stand in solidarity with them. The sad fact is that the colors red, white, and blue have been hijacked by the war supporters and support for the people of this nation is indistinguishable from support of deathsquads. > I'm sick to death of this shit. You guys can preach from your > soap-boxes till the cows come home and that's not going to change > SHIT for those guys from Boone County, Missouri who got in their cars > and drove 28 hours straight to NYC to volunteer 24/7 in the rescue > effort. Now those are Americans, and those are kind and generous > people, and they deserve more than cynical overanalytical bullshit > from a bunch of overeducated wankers in god-forsaken Oregon. I don't know that anyone here was cynically questioning the kindness and sacrifice of rescue workers and support volunteers. I think we all know what kind of gratitude those people deserve. And wait 'til you come see before you call this place "god-forsaken". I mean, just because most of us have forsaken God in some way (Oregon was, after all, the first state to have a non-church-going population exceed the church-going population... but I suppose knowing that makes me over-educated.) doesn't mean that any God has forsaken this place. But remember that the most important thing about being American is that nothing makes one MORE American than any other American. The man working to support the endeavors of the standing leaders is as much a patriot as the one working to tear those leaders down so long as they both believe they are working in the interest of the nation as a whole. J. - -- _______________________________________________ Capuchin capuchin@bitmine.net Jeme A Brelin ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 13:39:46 -0400 From: lj lindhurst Subject: Re: stars, bars, etc.--a bit late, but... capuchin: >I feel gratitude. I feel a desire to help. I believe the best way to >help is to do everything I can to prevent more killing. Bullshit. What the FUCK are you doing to prevent more killing, unless of course the sheer force of all the hot air you are spewing is having some kind of effect on the so-called "deathsquads" you are fantasizing about. >The sad fact is that the colors red, white, and blue have been hijacked by >the war supporters and support for the people of this nation is >indistinguishable from support of deathsquads. Oh please. No one around here is flying the flag because they are supporing "death squads" (whatever the hell that means)--it's a sign of solidarity and a sign of gratitude. This is exactly what I mean by calling this kind of poisonous rhetoric cynical bullshit. >And wait 'til you come see before you call this place "god-forsaken". I >mean, just because most of us have forsaken God in some way (Oregon was, >after all, the first state to have a non-church-going population exceed >the church-going population... but I suppose knowing that makes me >over-educated.) doesn't mean that any God has forsaken this place. blah blah blah... whatever. lj ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 10:59:57 -0700 (PDT) From: Mike Swedene Subject: Music (No RH% & NO WTC%) I just got the new Pulp and Cranberries albums off the web. Pulp is VERY strong (on 3 listens), great effort. I am, yet again, disappointed by the Cranberries. They need (IMHO) to get back to their roots (Songwriting) and stay away from the pulpit of modern rock. I think they are excellent songwriters but they drag politics into each song they can and it kills it, because they lose their melody just to get their message in. Anyone else hear these yet? Herbie ps - antone in Western New York (Ie- BuffalO) Kim Gordon and Thurston Moore are appearing at Buff State for a spoken word and duo performance. Not sure what it is all about but I saw a flyer on campus today for it. __________________________________________________ Terrorist Attacks on U.S. - How can you help? Donate cash, emergency relief information http://dailynews.yahoo.com/fc/US/Emergency_Information/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 14:30:20 -0400 (EDT) From: Christopher Gross Subject: Re: stars, bars, etc.--a bit late, but... I let this go by earlier, but since it's still in play, here's my view: I am deeply saddened that any simple disply of American patriotism, even simply wearing our national colors, is interpreted as right-wing militarist jingoism. There's more to America than that! And the flag and other symbols stand for the *all* of America. If you're an American, regardless of your politics, the flag stands for you, and you should defend your right to it, not give up on it. Why equate our flag with the right wing and war fever, just because right-wingers and the war-fevered fly it? I'm willing to fly the flag and I don't consider myself right-wing or a victim of war fever (some may disagree). And the left wing Feg community of Portland, Oregon has just as much right to fly the American flag, if only they would avail themselves of it. For example, if you're a pacifist, then why not fly an American flag and a peace banner together? If you've totally given up on America and consider our nation completely evil, then I could understand rejecting our national symbols; but not otherwise. Lunchtime! - --Chris ______________________________________________________________________ Christopher Gross On the Internet, nobody knows I'm a dog. chrisg@gwu.edu ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 11:32:36 -0700 (PDT) From: Carole Reichstein Subject: cleaning house Susan wrote: Say, am I the only person who has spent much of today cleaning and doing laundry? I have this weird but -undeniable- compulsion to "prepare" for something, tho I don't know what good scrubbing my kitchen sink does anyone really, particularly if we all get nuked tomorrow. Gives a sense of control, I guess, and also maybe this idea that who the hell knows what happens now, maybe tomorrow there will be complete chaos and I'll be glad I got the cleaning done today. It sounds strange when I write it out, it feels strange when I stop to think about why, but it's still with me. There are worse things than a clean house *shrug*. Yes! Susan, I'd think you're a Virgo if we didn't already celebrate your birthday a few months back. I've also been occupying myself with household matters; my boyfriend and I have spent the last 2 days painting my living room red, which is a good task to concentrate on while George Bush talks about "ridding the world of Evildoers." Doesn't the man realize how ridiculous he sounds? You'd think he was quoting a Marvel comic book. Ugh. Carole ps: when Gnat comes back, I'd love to go to Makkaresh (sp) or Abou Karim or any of those places in Portland that have good falafel. Mmm. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 11:02:01 -0800 From: Brett Cooper Subject: Julie Did any of you hear about Real World hottie Julie Stoffer was actually going to be on flight 11 but cancelled at the last minute only to find out that the flight that she was going to be on had been hijacked hours later? Brett ******************************************** Cooper Collections http://home.gci.net/~coopercollections ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 12:06:13 -0700 From: "victorian squid" Subject: Re: Music (No RH% & NO WTC%) On Tue, 18 Sep 2001 10:59:57 Mike Swedene wrote: >I just got the new Pulp and Cranberries albums off the >web. Pulp is VERY strong (on 3 listens), great I meant to post something thanking you for posting a link to those tracks, and um, then stuff happened. Anyway, I did a bit of reading up because last I had heard, Pulp was not a going concern. Wanted to know what was up with this and if it was really going to happen and noticed that this album was produced by Scott Walker. This is such a momentous moment in art damage, it is impossible to convey in words :). That being said, I thought "Weeds" was ok, and "I Love Life" was something amazing and promising. I have a feeling that this is one where I will need to hear the whole to really understand the parts. loveonya, susan Join 18 million Eudora users by signing up for a free Eudora Web-Mail account at http://www.eudoramail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 12:30:56 -0700 From: "Kenneth Johnson" Subject: Re: stars, bars, etc.--a bit late, but... ********* I AM SO SICK OF *THIS* SHIT!!!! LJ: > >Is it so*un-hip* to you kneejerk-leftist Pacific-Northwesterners to >take a little bit of pride in your country and your people >Now those are Americans, and those are kind and generous >people, and they deserve more than cynical overanalytical bullshit >from a bunch of overeducated wankers in god-forsaken Oregon As someone who lives in Oregon and may be described as being over-educated, leftist, and maybe even a wanker, I take great exception to this bullshit. This is not the first time I have heard shit like this being flung on the list. You know, not everyone from the Pac NW is some evil minded insensitive snipe. There happen to be a large number (larger than in any other area in the country per capita from my experience) of people out here who are very compassionate and thoughtful. Based on one or two inflamatory posters to this list you brand all of us as holy than thou knee jerk leftists? Fuck you very much! Just because one or two people from out here rub you all the wrong ways, don't you dare assume it is some trait of the region in general. You are being very ignorant and rude. Are we to understand that everyone in NYC are that way?..... I would appreciate in future if you take what someone says as THEIR grain of salt and not associate it with anyone who happens to live within shouting distant. I have my own opinions and feelings too and forgive me if they do not fit your scenario. LIKE: What the hell is wrong with being cynical about the flag wearing/waving? Grow up. I am all about solidarity. I think it is essential at a time like this. I am respectful of tributes and memorials and symbols of our country. (AND YES EGAD! I am a liberal, cynic for the left coast!) However, the flag waving and the frothing at the mouth patriotism does scare the shit out of me. Far be it from me to tell someone's grandma what they can or can't wear, but the people who are chanting and stomping and waving old glory need to settle down. We are at a delicate time in our country and I don't want that kind of over the top nationalistic fervor to drown out any rational deliberation or interfere with the much needed healing and compassion for the victims If anything serves to fuel peoples hearts and mind to help their fellow Americans. I say YEAH it is a good thing. It is MY contention, however, that people who view all of the events of the past week in only black and/or white need to wake up and start digesting the whole story. You need both the sympathetic emotion and the rational cynicism at once to survive something like this. DISCLAIMER: this was my .02 please do not let this reflect on anyone else I know or am related to or happen to come in contact with, share a bus seat, have similar eye color..etc. Kenneth _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V10 #362 ********************************