From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V10 #313 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Wednesday, August 22 2001 Volume 10 : Number 313 Today's Subjects: ----------------- I dont get it... ["lucifersam" ] radio 3 [strange little woj ] Re: 1987..... ["Jason R. Thornton" ] RE: 1987..... ["Bachman, Michael" ] Re: I dont get it... ["J. Brown" ] Re: Cracked Actor ["victorian squid" ] Re: radio 3 [Tom Clark ] Re: I dont get it... [Tom Clark ] Re: 1987..... [Capuchin ] Re: I dont get it... [Ken Weingold ] RE: radio 3 ["Cynthia Peterson" ] Re: radio 3 ["Mike Wells" ] RE: radio 3 ["Cynthia Peterson" ] Re: radio 3 ["Ultimate Goal" ] Re: I dont get it... ["Kenneth Johnson" ] overrate me [Natalie Jane Jacobs ] Re: radio 3 [Ken Weingold ] Re: I dont get it... ["Maximilian Lang" ] Re: radio 3 [strange little woj ] Re: overcake me ["Jason R. Thornton" ] Re: radio 3 ["lucifersam" ] Re: overrate me [Tom Clark ] Bunnymen... ["lucifersam" ] Re: radio 3 [Tom Clark ] Re: I dont get it... ["lucifersam" ] White Stripes ["lucifersam" ] Re: 1987..... [Eb ] Dylan ["lucifersam" ] Re: Bunnymen... [Ken Weingold ] Magic Roundabout ["lucifersam" ] Re: Dylan ["Maximilian Lang" ] Re: overrate me [Natalie Jane Jacobs ] overrated ["Andrew D. Simchik" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 22:17:19 +0100 From: "lucifersam" Subject: I dont get it... Just cant 'get' these Sacred Cows... Bob Dylan Beach Boys U2 REM R&B of any kind Blues of any kind Weller since 1984 Chuck Berry Brian Jones Janis Joplin Birthday Party That'll do for now ;0) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 17:26:00 -0400 From: strange little woj Subject: radio 3 okay, the dance base thing is being webcast right now (the bhundu boys are in the second song of their set) and is being recorded for broadcast on radio 3 during any kershaw's show this friday night at 10:30pm. you can view the webcast in realmedia (audio and video) at http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio3/edinburgh/ram/edlive.ram woj ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 14:28:04 -0700 From: "Jason R. Thornton" Subject: Re: 1987..... At 05:13 PM 8/22/01 -0400, lj lindhurst wrote: >And Echo & The Bunnymen?? Come on! They defined the era! I'd defend the Bunnymen as well. Underrated, if anything. Although, if this helps to consolidate these two threads any, they did put out their worst album in 1987. Not counting "Reverberation," of course, because that's not a REAL Echo & the Bunnymen album. Now, go out and buy the "Crystal Days" box set... Jason ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 17:32:02 -0400 From: "Bachman, Michael" Subject: RE: 1987..... Eb wrote: >1987 was a great year, yes. I have more albums from that year than almost >any other. But what do you think makes the current scene equal to 1987? >It's like night and day to me. I would add the db's Sound of Music, Opal's Happy Nightmare Baby and Lesile (Sam)Phillips The Turning to 1987. Although I would take 1982, 1984 and 1980 and 1985 over 1987 as far as great years of albums in the 1980's go. I see your point in the optimism though. I can't agree on The Dream Sydicate and Stone Roses being overated, because I think that they both put out great 1st releases in The Days of Wine and Roses and The Stones Roses(respectively). Although they both went downhill after their first releases. I also like Echo & the Bunneymen's first 5 years (1980-1984) and most of the neo-psychedelic and Paisly Underground stuff from 1980-1985, which included Echo & the Bunneymen, The Dream Syndicate, Rain Rarade, The Three O'Clock, Green on Red and early period Bangels. Michael ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 14:34:48 -0700 (PDT) From: "J. Brown" Subject: Re: I dont get it... On Wed, 22 Aug 2001, lucifersam wrote: > Weller since 1984 this cetainly isnt a sacred cow in my book! i like a good bit of it but there is alot of dross it there as well! Jason Wilson Brown - University of Washington - Seattle, WA "Life boring when you no can die" -Solomon Grundy ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 14:37:52 -0700 From: "victorian squid" Subject: Re: Cracked Actor On Tue, 21 Aug 2001 20:18:52 Eb wrote: >Ziggy Stardust character, and he was nowhere near his Thin >White Duke period yet...what do YOU think came between those >two phases? (You seem to have read a confrontational tone into my post that was not intended. This is not intended as a challenge, either, merely a response to the point raised.) Actually I would argue that the documentary captures an awkward transition phase that came between Ziggy/Halloween Jack/Aladdin and the "soul" thing. This was the Diamond Dogs tour. Have another listen at that album (I'm betting you haven't in awhile and probably don't even own it, but whatever) and you'll see just how schizophrenic it is, stylistically. This is the same album that contains "1984" -and- "Rebel Rebel", after all. It's somewhere smack between the glam rock of yore and the "plastic soul" thing that comes full-circle with "Young Americans", but it isn't really completely either one. At the point this documentary drops us in, the "plastic soul" direction is far from fully realized. They couldn't have known it but those LA dates turned out to be the ones that finally determined the stylistic course that would dominate the next few years. Performance-wise the two tours (Young Americans and Diamond Dogs) were -really- different. The "Diamond Dogs" tour was a huge, elaborate Broadway-quality set up that he nearly went broke over. The "soul man" thing was evolving slowly but the draining money and the constant technical foul-ups of the DD tour really helped speed up the transformation to that performing persona, which required a whole lot less in terms of special effects and such. The LA shows that the doc covered turned out to be almost the last gasp of the really elaborate productions. The LA rehearsal break turned out to be pivotal as well. The R&B backup singers (including Ava Cherry) that went on to be a big part of "YA"'s sound were added in LA, as were a new bassist and drummer- the ones who had started the tour were rock-oriented musicians and either weren't skilled in this new style of music or didn't want to play it (my guess is there's truth to both). By the time "David Live", was recorded in Philadelphia in October, the show and performance were pretty different theatrically and musically from the "Diamond Dogs" tour as originally conceived and the album itself is a lot more coherent as far as style(whether one likes the style or not) than its predecessor "Diamond Dogs". done, finished, over and out, and away from the keyboard the next few days, I remain, susan Join 18 million Eudora users by signing up for a free Eudora Web-Mail account at http://www.eudoramail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 14:39:41 -0700 From: Tom Clark Subject: Re: radio 3 This is totally cool! I had no idea there would video as well! - -tc on 8/22/01 2:26 PM, strange little woj at woj@smoe.org wrote: > okay, the dance base thing is being webcast right now (the bhundu boys > are in the second song of their set) and is being recorded for > broadcast on radio 3 during any kershaw's show this friday night at > 10:30pm. > > you can view the webcast in realmedia (audio and video) at > > http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio3/edinburgh/ram/edlive.ram > > woj ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 14:48:27 -0700 From: Tom Clark Subject: Re: I dont get it... on 8/22/01 2:17 PM, lucifersam at lucifersam@ntlworld.com wrote: > Just cant 'get' these Sacred Cows... > > Bob Dylan I was the same way until I actually started to listen to his stuff (as opposed to just hearing it on the radio). I picked up the two CD "Essential Bob Dylan" and I now listen to it quite often. One of the things that makes me appreciate a lot of his songs is watching Robyn perform them, since Bawb is just a parody of his former self these days. > Weller since 1984 "Stanley Road" is great. - -tc ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 14:53:10 -0700 (PDT) From: Capuchin Subject: Re: 1987..... On Wed, 22 Aug 2001, Eb wrote: > Capuchin managed to steer the topic into another of his tedious, > anti-corporate rants: (hey, if we're going to knock the tedium of each other's personal crusades, I can start a whole new thread.) > >Well, the media consolidation of the past fifteen years is unsurpassed > >probably in any industry over any similar period of time ever. It's quite > >obvious why diversity and artistry are on the decline. > The issue is hardly that simple. I wouldn't say it's a simple issue, but that's the root cause of the problem. The radio syndicates, music studios, labels, distributors, movie studios and distributors, video outlets, and television stations are owned, end to end, by a single commercial interest. The goal of these organizations (as a sort of sub-goal to the only goal: maximizing profits) is to put out as much work that can be consumed (not appreciated, just consumed) by their target demographics (mostly the 2-14 year-old set) that leverages (and provides content for) the widest range of their other media holdings. Forget keeping a major label deal unless you're willing to put your songs on their movie soundtracks, appear in their MTV specials, have books written about your personal life (or a fictionalized version thereof) and have your work sculpted and pitched for appeal to infants. You must please advertisers and mall chain owners first and foremost. New and original music is ignored in favor of what has been proven to be profitable in the past. The so-called "independent" record labels that get mass distribution by the media congolomerates serve as a kind of "farm team" to push the risks of introducing new music onto someone else and adopting only what is most marketable in their cross-media strategies. > >I think this are almost so absurd as to be untennable: > >Cake > >Echo & the Bunnymen > >Morphine > >Social Distortion > >the Dead Kennedys > > I can't reply unless you speak English, pleeze. Are we picking on typos and misspellings now? > If you're saying those artists are clearly unassailable, I > say...phooey. Well, that's a solid response. I was saying that it's untenable to call those particular acts over-rated without calling the entire celebrity system over-rating. None of those musical acts are any worse than the acts that receive similar attention and praise. There may be a handful at their level that are superior, but wouldn't they be considered under-rated, rather than considering every onese over-rated? What range of acts get the same amount of praise as, say, Dead Kennedys? What is the "middle ground" for that set? Who is "properly rated" and who is "under-rated" to make Dead Kennedys appear "over-rated"? Being "over-rated" is relative, of course. So in order to call one set over-rated, one must first define the full set and the median rating. Morphine, Cake, and Social Distortion are and have been sort of fringe, second-class musical acts with their own particular niches in the rock world. I believe they are categorized as such popularly and properly. Certainly their talent and capability is at the very least average for their second- (or third-) tier status. Compare with, say, Bruce Hornsby or 311. J. - -- _______________________________________________ Capuchin capuchin@bitmine.net Jeme A Brelin ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 17:52:41 -0400 From: Ken Weingold Subject: Re: I dont get it... On Wed, Aug 22, 2001, Tom Clark wrote: > on 8/22/01 2:17 PM, lucifersam at lucifersam@ntlworld.com wrote: > > > Just cant 'get' these Sacred Cows... > > > > Bob Dylan > > I was the same way until I actually started to listen to his stuff (as > opposed to just hearing it on the radio). I picked up the two CD "Essential > Bob Dylan" and I now listen to it quite often. One of the things that makes > me appreciate a lot of his songs is watching Robyn perform them, since Bawb > is just a parody of his former self these days. What really made me a fan was when I bought Blood On The Tracks. Tom is right. To really appreciate certain, if not all, artists, you need to put some effort into it, not just take what the radio gives you. - -Ken ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 14:52:32 -0700 From: "Cynthia Peterson" Subject: RE: radio 3 No doubt! I was inspired to clean my monitor. Nice to be joining you all in this simulwebcast moment... Cynthia - -----Original Message----- From: Tom Clark [mailto:tclark@reardensteel.com] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 2:40 PM To: woj; In A Van With Sebadoh; fegmaniax-announce@smoe.org Subject: Re: radio 3 This is totally cool! I had no idea there would video as well! - -tc ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 16:58:19 -0500 From: "Mike Wells" Subject: Re: radio 3 Really, really nice so far... Gene Hackman Cheese Alarm Arms of Love Surgery IODOT Autumn Is Your Last Chance Michael kneeling at the alter of bandwith - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tom Clark" To: "woj" ; "In A Van With Sebadoh" ; Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 4:39 PM Subject: Re: radio 3 > This is totally cool! I had no idea there would video as well! > > -tc ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 15:04:31 -0700 From: "Cynthia Peterson" Subject: RE: radio 3 Was that shirt just made for streaming video compression, or what!? It's a special effect all on its own -- squiggly lines and boxes that would probably look like they were shifting even if it were a still image. Oh wait! I see! It's hand and foot outlines! (This has been today's Shirt Alert...thank you.) CP - -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: radio 3 Really, really nice so far... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 18:05:17 -0400 From: "Ultimate Goal" Subject: Re: radio 3 That was pretty darn cool. Thanks for the link! Nuppy >From: strange little woj >Reply-To: strange little woj >To: fegmaniax@smoe.org, fegmaniax-announce@smoe.org >Subject: radio 3 >Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 17:26:00 -0400 > >okay, the dance base thing is being webcast right now (the bhundu boys >are in the second song of their set) and is being recorded for >broadcast on radio 3 during any kershaw's show this friday night at >10:30pm. > >you can view the webcast in realmedia (audio and video) at > >http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio3/edinburgh/ram/edlive.ram > >woj _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 15:05:29 -0700 From: "Kenneth Johnson" Subject: Re: I dont get it... >on 8/22/01 2:17 PM, lucifersam at lucifersam@ntlworld.com wrote: > > > Just cant 'get' these Sacred Cows... > > > > Bob Dylan > whatever you say Mr Jones......... ; - ) _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 15:08:12 -0700 (PDT) From: Natalie Jane Jacobs Subject: overrate me >Cake >Echo & the Bunnymen >Morphine >Social Distortion >the Dead Kennedys I don't think Cake are overrated. In fact, I don't know of anyone who even likes them apart from Jeme. LJ expostulates: >Oh Eb! Galaxie 500??? That's DEAN, you dick! And Echo & The >Bunnymen?? Come on! They defined the era! (er, well, when I wasn't >rockin out to "R.O.C.K. in the USA") And MORPHINE definitely does >not belong on this list and you well know it. I have to agree with this, though I was never a big Echo & the Bunnymen fan myself. Also, I was listening to Galaxie 500 the other day, for the first time in a long time, and realized that their lyrics are almost unbearably stupid. I still love 'em, though. DEAN! While Radiohead have certainly inspired the most amount of critical drivel (read the review of "Kid A" at pitchforkmedia.com - hilarious!), I have to say that the absolute most overrated band of the past five years has to be Sleater-Kinney. That's my story and I'm sticking to it. n. p.s. Though blind loyalty towards my home state leads me to be curious about the White Stripes, all interviews I've read with them make them out to be almost impossibly stupid and pretentious. And what's with their pretense about being brother and sister? (They are, according to all reliable sources, ex-husband and wife.) Anyway, this leads me to be wary of their music, perhaps irrationally. - -- Natalie Jane Jacobs gnat@bitmine.net ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 18:11:01 -0400 From: Ken Weingold Subject: Re: radio 3 Great. I got to hear about two songs before the piece of shit known as Real Player lost its audio and thenm decided to crash when I would close it, so I just went and got the latest update and now I hear this French crap. Who is it, Serge Gainsberg? :) - -Ken ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 18:13:35 -0400 From: "Maximilian Lang" Subject: Re: I dont get it... >Bob Dylan >Beach Boys >Blues of any kind - Does this include Hendrix? >Chuck Berry Birthday Party So Sorry, so sad...maybe someday it will hit you! Max _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 18:20:21 -0400 From: strange little woj Subject: Re: radio 3 when we last left our heroes, Ken Weingold (hazmat@hellrot.org) exclaimed: >Great. I got to hear about two songs before the piece of shit known >as Real Player lost its audio and thenm decided to crash when I would >close it, so I just went and got the latest update and now I hear this >French crap. Who is it, Serge Gainsberg? :) dunno. just intermission music. andy is interviewing robyn now, before the bhundu boys take the stage again. i believe the webcast will be archived for on-demand viewing from the radio 3 site, but i'm capturing it and will try to get the file up on the web somewhere so folks can grab it if they have problems with the stream. the video quality isn't great and the audio signal is mono, but it is pretty neat to watch. woj ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 15:21:33 -0700 From: "Jason R. Thornton" Subject: Re: overcake me At 03:08 PM 8/22/01 -0700, Natalie Jane Jacobs wrote: >I don't think Cake are overrated. In fact, I don't know of anyone who >even likes them apart from Jeme. I like Cake. Everyone I tell that to, though, tells me that they "hate" them. On a related note, I dislike cake. J. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 23:16:14 +0100 From: "lucifersam" Subject: Re: radio 3 damn! I couldn't get a connection..Grrrrrrrrrr - ----- Original Message ----- From: strange little woj To: ; Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 10:26 PM Subject: radio 3 > okay, the dance base thing is being webcast right now (the bhundu boys > are in the second song of their set) and is being recorded for > broadcast on radio 3 during any kershaw's show this friday night at > 10:30pm. > > you can view the webcast in realmedia (audio and video) at > > http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio3/edinburgh/ram/edlive.ram > > woj ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 15:24:37 -0700 From: Tom Clark Subject: Re: overrate me on 8/22/01 3:08 PM, Natalie Jane Jacobs at gnat@bitmine.net wrote: > p.s. Though blind loyalty towards my home state leads me to be curious > about the White Stripes, all interviews I've read with them make them out > to be almost impossibly stupid and pretentious. And what's with their > pretense about being brother and sister? (They are, according > to all reliable sources, ex-husband and wife.) Anyway, this leads me to > be wary of their music, perhaps irrationally. Hey Fuck You, Natalie Jane!!! Seriously, The impression I get from them is that they are rather pretentious, but I've never heard anything about them being previously married - who are your "reliable sources"? Bottom line - the music kicks ass. You know I love you, nat, but you're walking a fine line here... - -tc ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 23:19:40 +0100 From: "lucifersam" Subject: Bunnymen... 'Crocodiles' is a classic, but i got a little bored of them after that. I saw thwm at the YMCA once in Tottenham Court Rd. Peter Purvis was in the audience! ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 15:27:37 -0700 From: Tom Clark Subject: Re: radio 3 on 8/22/01 3:20 PM, strange little woj at woj@smoe.org wrote: > > andy is interviewing robyn now, before the bhundu boys take the stage > again. Ad to tie my recent posts together (sans White Stripes), Robyn just announced that he will be releasing a double CD of Dylan stuff. The first disc is the "Albert Hall" show, and the second is RH in the studio. I will be able to die a happy man now. - -tc ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 23:23:37 +0100 From: "lucifersam" Subject: Re: I dont get it... Ok, I'll led Hendrix through the net ;-) > >Bob Dylan > >Beach Boys > >Blues of any kind - Does this include Hendrix? > >Chuck Berry Birthday Party > > So Sorry, so sad...maybe someday it will hit you! > > Max ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 23:26:23 +0100 From: "lucifersam" Subject: White Stripes I got the new (to UK) Cd the other week. Not bad at all. I read an interview in NME (I get it every 3 months) and they did appear to be rather dim. The bloke was going on about how he wished he'd been born in the 1930's so he could really live the 'blues'...serious nonsense. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 15:35:32 -0700 From: Eb Subject: Re: 1987..... Jeme: >target demographics (mostly the 2-14 year-old set) I'll blah on the rest of your deja-vu lecture, and focus on this. Now, *here* is a central problem. Alt-rock was more of a twentysomething/college-age phenomenon in the '80s. Then, in the early '90s, the more popular bands (Nirvana, Weezer, whatever) were able to draw teens into the fold. Eventually, the teens took over and the major labels were happy to fuel this coup. *That's* a significant problem. Now, if the Big Evil Corporations had targeted a more mature demographic with this music, things might be very different now. Even though the Big Evil Corporations would still be in place. Personally, I think Green Day deserves a lot of blame. ;) I think I've said this before, but it seems to me that they engendered this whole shallow, harmless, happypunk thing which so dulled the movement's edge. Also, on the heavier end of the spectrum, popular alt-rock's appeal somehow mutated into the same redneck headbanging which the music originally aimed to rub out. Very sad. I can't be sure *why* this happened (the fundamental human need to "let go," I guess?), but I'm not going to blame it solely on Big Evil Corporate Marketing. >Morphine, Cake, and Social Distortion are and have been sort of fringe, >second-class musical acts with their own particular niches in the rock >world. I believe they are categorized as such popularly and >properly. Certainly their talent and capability is at the very least >average for their second- (or third-) tier status. Compare with, say, >Bruce Hornsby or 311. You don't see the same degree of self-righteous militancy in the fanbases of Hornsby and 311. And haven't both those artists lapsed into relative obscurity by now, anyway? - ----- In the LJ I Still Like You Anyway Department: >Oh Eb! Galaxie 500??? That's DEAN, you dick! If I had a home studio, I think it would fun to re-edit a Galaxie 500 album by swapping all the choruses around between tracks. And then see if anyone could tell the difference. ;) >And MORPHINE definitely does >not belong on this list and you well know it. Well, yes, they were never a chart-topping band, if that's your point. But they do retain a rabid cult following among both the press and public, and I think the band is remarkably monochromatic and dull. Some people point to the one-string bass as an exciting experiment. To me, it's a symbol of the band's limitations. ;) And of course, their overratedness will *continue* to flourish, thanks to the dependable premature-death factor. I haven't heard the White Stripes album yet, but saw the group on Craig Kilborn and got a superficial kick out of 'em. (Then again, I've dumped three or four different Jon Spencer albums, so....) And of course I own Diamond Dogs, Susan. Speaking of Dylan, you wouldn't believe the hysteria in the Dylan newsgroup over the upcoming Love & Theft album. Folks are already breathlessly proclaiming it one of his best blahblahblah, only based on hearing three or four MP3s. The "analysis" threads are already in full bloom, even though no one has heard more than a fraction of the disc. Sheesh. Even more embarrassing, there are threads about people's planned "rituals" for playing the album the first time...you know, turn off the lights, light a dozen candles, get stoned, and hang from my gravity boots as it plays...that sort of thing. Ugh. (Based on the professional reviews of the *complete* album I've read, I don't think I'm going to love it. Sounds like another one of those relatively unambitious, rootsy, casual albums which Dylan typically releases after shooting his wad on a major release like Time Out of Mind.) What's this? Overdue signs of life on the Feglist? Eb ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 23:30:37 +0100 From: "lucifersam" Subject: Dylan AAAAAAAAGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Robyn just > announced that he will be releasing a double CD of Dylan stuff. The first > disc is the "Albert Hall" show, and the second is RH in the studio. I will > be able to die a happy man now. > > -tc ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 18:39:31 -0400 From: Ken Weingold Subject: Re: Bunnymen... On Wed, Aug 22, 2001, lucifersam wrote: > 'Crocodiles' is a classic, but i got a little bored of them after that. > I saw thwm at the YMCA once in Tottenham Court Rd. Peter Purvis > was in the audience! Crocodiles, Porcupine, Ocean Rain, self-titled... Give them another try. Hey, first time I saw them New Order was there! Oh, they were playing too. :) It was the summer of '87 tour at The Pier in NYC when Ray Manzarek was touring with them. Great show. - -Ken ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 23:34:49 +0100 From: "lucifersam" Subject: Magic Roundabout I actually got 3 Dylan CD's the other week (#15) for this very reason. Still dont get it. BOT was one of them.... > What really made me a fan was when I bought Blood On The Tracks. Tom > is right. To really appreciate certain, if not all, artists, you need > to put some effort into it, not just take what the radio gives you. > > > -Ken ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 18:58:12 -0400 From: "Maximilian Lang" Subject: Re: Dylan >From: "lucifersam" >>AAAAAAAAGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Hey, I know how you feel, I grew up with a stepfather that listens to Dylan EXCLUSIVELY! It wasn't till recently when one day it hit me...this stuff is great. I can't explain it, I used to mock him(still do) like Dana Carvey on S.N.L., but I really love the guys music now. Sometimes you change your mind for no reason without a reasonable explanation...maybe the Robyn album will do it for you? _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 15:58:33 -0700 (PDT) From: Natalie Jane Jacobs Subject: Re: overrate me > Hey Fuck You, Natalie Jane!!! Fuck you too, Tom Clark!!! > Seriously, The impression I get from them is that they are rather > pretentious, but I've never heard anything about them being previously > married - who are your "reliable sources"? A friend in Ann Arbor who has a lot of connections in the Detroit "scene" (such as it is). I guess that's only one reliable source, but I've also heard about it from less reliable sources (i.e. various music publications). > Bottom line - the music kicks ass. But you also think that Neutral Milk Hotel suck. Why should I trust you? About anything? n. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 15:58:33 -0700 From: "Andrew D. Simchik" Subject: overrated At 05:18 PM 8/22/2001 -0400, fegmaniax-digest wrote: >From: Eb >This reminds me: I was musing about the most overrated artists of all-time >the other night, though my own candidates wouldn't surprise anyone who has >been reading my posts for awhile. Anyone else wanna offer their nominees? I'm in agreement with the ones you listed -- I _like_ Bauhaus, Radiohead, Ani DiFranco, and Echo & the Bunnymen, as well as some songs by some of the others (Stone Roses, Happy Mondays, No Doubt, Jane's Addiction), but I wholeheartedly agree that they are overrated. Then again, "overrated" basically means that we don't like them as much as everyone else seems to. In some ways it's harder coming up with bands that _aren't_ overrated, at least by their fan base. And of course, I would be tempted to offer up entire genres as overrated. I've never heard a single "electronica" act that's lived up to half its hype. And of course we all know how godawful hardcore goth can be. :) Hey, I'm listening to a massively overrated artist right now: Nine Inch Nails. He's turning into a sort of differently-textured Enya, isn't he? >From: "Sweet & Tender Hooligan" > >I was just more or less told that I'm going to be laid off. My boss didn't >say, "such and such will be your last day", but he said, "Nothing is >official, but I would start looking for something if I were you". I can't decide if that was nice of him or not. I'm sorry to hear it, and I wish I could say I was surprised (and not worried that the same will happen to me in a matter of time). >From: Capuchin > >I think this are almost so absurd as to be untennable: >Cake It took me a while to understand how you meant this. I can't understand how anyone manages to listen to Cake at all. I've come to understand, if not relate to, the appeal behind some artists I don't like (Neutral Milk Hotel, for example), but I'm just not there with these guys. >From: "Kenneth Johnson" > >How can one call a folk rock artist as diverse and interesting and inspiring >as Ani DiFranco, who receives little to no mass media attention, overrated? How do you define "mass media attention"? Likewise: "diverse"? I stopped buying DiFranco's records when they stopped being distinguishable from one another. Well, okay, a little after that, I guess. Regarding U2 and the Smiths: well, of course you know I adore the Smiths, and I frankly don't think it's possible to overrate them, especially while allowing U2 so much rope: >From: Eb >I wouldn't put U2 on there. They're very good at what they do -- it's just >not for me. I mean, you could say the same for so many other bands, couldn't you? I once tried to make a mix CD of all the U2 songs I sorta kinda liked and barely scraped up an EP's worth. As for Joy Division: they're a band I loathed at first and have gradually come to respect a great deal. I'd rate them at least equal to Radiohead, probably above. Anyway...predictably, the overrated list has stirred up a lot of conversation, and everyone is going to disagree with some of your choices (oh, while I'm thinking about it, let me throw Rage Against the Machine on the fire -- perhaps Soundgarden as well) and it will be a big silly hoo-hah, but thank god we're not talking about lens prescriptions or bicycles. Drew - -- Andrew D. Simchik, drew at stormgreen dot com http://www.stormgreen.com/ ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V10 #313 ********************************