From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V10 #254 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Sunday, June 24 2001 Volume 10 : Number 254 Today's Subjects: ----------------- ars gratia artis [grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan)] Happy LAW! [Mike Swedene ] Toshiba DVD Player (NO RH%) [Mike Swedene ] Re: phallocentric rawk ["Ben Nicastro" ] Re: not digging Led Zeppelin ["Ben Nicastro" ] Re: Gates, LaDeDas, Eno, Trade [grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan)] stones vs zep ["victorian squid" ] Re: Chris content, 100% ["Gene Hopstetter, Jr." ] Re: anybody got the 1980 maxwells boot? ["Gene Hopstetter, Jr." ] Re: stones vs zep [Stephen Mahoney ] remove [Stephen Mahoney ] Re: anybody got the 1980 maxwells boot? ["brian nupp" ] Re: Chris content, 100% [Christopher Gross ] Re: ars gratia artis [grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan)] Re: Nuggets II [Robcow@aol.com] Barnaby Tull ["Russ Reynolds" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2001 13:21:43 +1200 From: grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan) Subject: ars gratia artis >>What sort of comment is that? Art in and of itself is subjective. Call me >>stupid (I heard that!), but doesn't everyone judge art by how relevant its >>ideals are to one's own outlook on life? does anyone look at art this way? Art is objective. The appreciation of art is subjective. I judge art on its ability to change or enhance the way I think about things, my mood, or my view of reality. I am mightily impressed by some of Kienholz's installations, for instance, even though they are the sort of things that would give me nightmares (indeed one of them, The Beanery, did turn up in a nightmare of mine). I have been impressed by Pollock and Rothko's work (which are much more impressive 'in the flesh' than I would have thought just from seeing illustrations of them), despite their sheer abstraction having little relevance to me. And I enjoy HR Giger's art without (I hope!) its ideals being connected to my outlook. On the other hand, I am impressed by the artistic abilities of Rockwell despite regarding much of his work as cloying. And of Egon Schiele, despite his figures being grotesque. My favourite artists is possibly Kay Sage, sparse dreamlike landscapes that affect the way I feel more than they are 'relevant in their ideals to my outlook on life'. James James Dignan, Dunedin, New Zealand. =-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= -=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.- .-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=- You talk to me as if from a distance -.-=-.- And I reply with impressions chosen from another time =-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-. (Brian Eno - "By this River") ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2001 21:09:41 -0700 (PDT) From: Mike Swedene Subject: Happy LAW! Just wanted to wish you all a Happy Lightning Awareness week. It is important, I guess, that we note this week since Lightning tragically takes the lives of 72 people (on average) per year in the US. Heard it on NPR today. Who knew? Herbie Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2001 21:12:46 -0700 (PDT) From: Mike Swedene Subject: Toshiba DVD Player (NO RH%) Hi. I have an issue with my older Toshiba DVD home player. It gets picky, and So I wonder if it is a film critic in a box, but it gets tempermental and does not like playing and or reading certain films. For example it STRONGLY dislikes GLADIATOR as well as DANCER IN THE DARK (both the American and Quebec ) versions. Any suggestions on how to fix it? or newsgroups? Have a safe and fun weekend all! Herbie Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2001 18:21:28 -0400 From: "Ben Nicastro" Subject: Re: phallocentric rawk > horribly tediously phallocentric Why is it cool for the Rolling Stones to make sexist music but not Led Zeppelin? ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2001 18:14:21 -0400 From: "Ben Nicastro" Subject: Re: not digging Led Zeppelin Led Zeppelin was probably the first good band I ever really listened to and the one that got me into listening to good music, because unlike a lot of other hard rock/heavy metal, their music did have a diversity of influences that could lead you into listening to some different sorts of music, if you were so inclined. At the time I discovered Zeppelin I was also a big comic book fan, and their music had a lot of the same appeal as comics did. However if I had been a fan of graphic novels and not Marvel superhero comics I probably would have started out listening to music that was much more highbrow than Zeppelin. ;-) Today Zeppelin has the same appeal to me as cheesy Saturday afternoon monster movies and such - sure, they may have been a major influence for Spinal Tap but is it a crime to enjoy them becuase of their silliness? ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2001 16:57:23 +1200 From: grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan) Subject: Re: Gates, LaDeDas, Eno, Trade >> Its Friday. Its been a long week. Work sucks. Our new computer dosnt only >> have the wrong internet card--it has the wrong operating system. > >Definition of "wrong operating system": any system made by the Microsoft >Corporation of Redmond, WA. as in the statement: "I'm sorry, I'm having problems with this... you see, my computer has MS" [1] Re: "How is the air up there?" >There was a song by that name on the very first Bangles EP... >I'd lay money it's the same song. it is >Odd - the Cale lyric there reminds me a LOT of Eno's lyrics on >_Taking Tiger Mountain (By Strategy)_, . . . First-person, lots >of international intrigue and eccentric characters skulking about >exotic locations. true - some early Eno songs like "Burning Airlines Gives you so much more" and "Back in Judy's Jungle" are like this... but Eno's style has changed frequently and considerably since then. >> I know that a few years back New Zealand outlawed all region coding, >> seeing it as price-fixing in diguise > >Not quite. And James or someone can correct me if I'm wrong. But it's my >understanding that New Zealand, understanding its place as a >geographically remote and isolated nation, has laws that specifically >prohibits geography based trade restrictions because of the price fixing >this allows. that's roughly right, from what I gather (and too complex to bore the list with, even if I knew the full details). NZ has virtually no geographically-related trade restrictions. This has its good points and its bad points. Until the early 80s NZ was one of the most protectionist economies in the world. Which was great for the internal economy, but dreadful when it came to competing in the world market. Along came "Rogernomics" - the harsh slash and burn policies of Finance Minister Roger Douglas. Severe hardship on the local economy (which we've only begun to climb out of in the last few years), but a lean mean fightin' machine internationally. It definitely has other bad points though - the market gets a lot of el cheapo products from dubious southeast Asian manufacturers with even more dubious employment and environmental practices. Personally I think a balance between the two extremes would be much more sensible. Some trade restrictions are necessary for the sake of both local business and overseas workers and environment. James [1] no offence intended to multiple sclerosis sufferers. Only to Bill Gates Global Colonisation Inc. James Dignan, Dunedin, New Zealand. =-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= -=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.- .-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=- You talk to me as if from a distance -.-=-.- And I reply with impressions chosen from another time =-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-. (Brian Eno - "By this River") ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2001 00:28:47 -0700 From: "victorian squid" Subject: stones vs zep On Fri, 22 Jun 2001 18:21:28 Ben Nicastro wrote: >Why is it cool for the Rolling Stones to make >sexist music but not Led Zeppelin? Since I made the observation that bugged you, I should probably answer. In large part I feel the same way about the Stones, but much of their music swings in a way I find a lot more pleasing than Zep's habitual heavy crunch, particularly the early 70s stuff. They have a sly sense of humor and sometimes even of camp at times, neither of which is really a distinguishing feature of late 60s-early 70s bluesy-rawk bands (aside from Aerosmith) and thus all the more notable and welcome. More to the specific point, I also have a sense that as far as that goes, Mick never believed everything he sang. Not that they didn't manhandle their share of groupies or never acted like assholes, but it seems pretty clear that they have always had a carefully thought-out schtick of which the supermacho thing is part and parcel. Whereas with Zep I don't think self-consciousness or self-awareness was ever a big part of what they were about. loveonya, susan Join 18 million Eudora users by signing up for a free Eudora Web-Mail account at http://www.eudoramail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2001 11:03:57 -0500 From: "Gene Hopstetter, Jr." Subject: Re: Chris content, 100% >Subject: Playboy? (0% RH, 0% military history) > >I need to find an article in a >recent issue about Madalyn Murray O'Hair, the famous and now dead atheist >activist. There's been a huge amount of coverage about her in San Antonio's _Current_, fwiw. >As for Neutral Milk Hotel, I like all their stuff, but I think I like >Avery Island better than Aeroplane. At least, I play it more often. >This seems to be the minority opinion though. Count me in -- I do prefer Avery Island, too. I think "Gardenhead" is their best song. >"Hey, I'm fucking bleeding! How unusual is that?" > > --Nivek Ogre, 6/21/01 I have a pile of fake dollar bills covered with fake blood from a Skinny Puppy show back in 1986. Har, I forgot I had those. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2001 11:18:29 -0500 From: "Gene Hopstetter, Jr." Subject: Re: anybody got the 1980 maxwells boot? >From: bayard > >anyone have an original of this? and how does it sound? > >http://www.jh3.com/robyn/base/disc.asp?tench=304 > I'd love a CDR of that show, too. It's Number 1 on my List of Soft Boys Things I Still Have to Acquire. I seem to recall an English listmember mentioning he saw a person selling hand-made CDRs of that show at a record convention or something a year or so ago. Seems there were very few of them made, IIRC. Now, if www.underwatermoonlight.com ever adds all of the songs from that gig, we can make our own CDRs. But according to Tracy, there are licensing issues with the covers which prevent them from adding all the MP3s. (But if they are adding MP3s, I wonder if Robyn has a master tape of that show which they're using as the source for the MP3s? Grrr, I want that show on CD very badly.) So far, on MP3 www.underwatermoonlight.com has given us the following songs from that gig: 1. Kingdom Of Love 2. Out Of The Picture 3. Zip Zip 5. I Wanna Destroy You 8. The Queen Of Eyes 9. There's Nobody Like You 11. Insanely Jealous Which leaves, 4. Human Music 6. Only The Stones Remain 7. Leppo & The Jooves 10. Underwater Moonlight 12. Astronomy Domine 13. Vegetable Man and since Zip Zip has been added (a cover whose permission was pretty easy to get, I imagine), it's just that Pink Floyd cover which remains the problem (come on, Mr. Waters, let us have it!). Howsabout those other five cuts, Tracy? ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2001 11:02:06 -0700 (PDT) From: Stephen Mahoney Subject: Re: ars gratia artis On Sat, 23 Jun 2001, James Dignan wrote: > >>What sort of comment is that? Art in and of itself is subjective. Call me > >>stupid (I heard that!), but doesn't everyone judge art by how relevant its > >>ideals are to one's own outlook on life? > > does anyone look at art this way? want some fun reads- read the futarist manifesto and/or the dadaist manifesto and then read those top three lines again... > Art is objective. The appreciation of art is subjective. I judge art on its > ability to change or enhance the way I think about things, my mood, or my > view of reality. I am mightily impressed by some of Kienholz's > installations, for instance, even though they are the sort of things that > would give me nightmares (indeed one of them, The Beanery, did turn up in a > nightmare of mine). I have been impressed by Pollock and Rothko's work > (which are much more impressive 'in the flesh' than I would have thought > just from seeing illustrations of them), despite their sheer abstraction > having little relevance to me. I remember first experiencing "the ozymandious parade" by ed and nancy keinholtz in '88 wide eyed idealist that I was back then...not their best work but it sure left and impression on me that is still there, it was the first work of art that included all the senses for me, god it smelled bad! I had a studio at portland state u. which was in the elementary school that rothko went to as a child... that was just too cool! Saw a retrospect of works on paper by rothko, one of the few shows at the portland art museum which actually moved me emotionally. The Monet water lillies exhibition was th3e other one. Then there was Paris and the almighty Louvre!!!! For myself, being moved emotionally is more important than being stimulated intellectualy by a work of art...however, your results may vary! mahoney ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2001 11:07:20 -0700 (PDT) From: Stephen Mahoney Subject: Re: stones vs zep I think zep is great but I would admit that it is definately more testosterone based primal grooving music that the stones whose good looks appeal to the ladies! :) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2001 11:10:08 -0700 (PDT) From: Stephen Mahoney Subject: remove remove ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2001 15:37:49 -0400 From: "brian nupp" Subject: Re: anybody got the 1980 maxwells boot? >>So far, on MP3 www.underwatermoonlight.com has given us the >following >songs from that gig: > >1. Kingdom Of Love >2. Out Of The Picture >3. Zip Zip >5. I Wanna Destroy You >8. The Queen Of Eyes >9. There's Nobody Like You >11. Insanely Jealous > >Which leaves, > >4. Human Music >6. Only The Stones Remain >7. Leppo & The Jooves >10. Underwater Moonlight >12. Astronomy Domine >13. Vegetable Man > >and since Zip Zip has been added (a cover whose permission was pretty >easy to get, I imagine), it's just that Pink Floyd cover which >remains the problem (come on, Mr. Waters, let us have it!). > >Howsabout those other five cuts, Tracy? Four cuts. Astronomy Domine (written by Barrett, right?) was released on the 7'' that came with the re-re-re-release of the vinyl UM. I would love to hear Vegetable Man live. Nuppy _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2001 16:19:42 -0400 (EDT) From: Christopher Gross Subject: Re: Chris content, 100% On Sat, 23 Jun 2001, Gene Hopstetter, Jr. wrote: > >I need to find an article in a > >recent issue about Madalyn Murray O'Hair, the famous and now dead atheist > >activist. > > There's been a huge amount of coverage about her in San Antonio's > _Current_, fwiw. Thanks for the tip! Is that a newspaper, local magazine, or what? If anyone else is still reading this, I still need to find out what issue of Playboy had the article about O'Hair. > Count me in -- I do prefer Avery Island, too. I think "Gardenhead" > is their best song. "Gardenhead" is my favorite too, or at least it would be on my top 5 list of NMH tracks. Actually, tend to think of "Gardenhead/Leave Me Alone" as one long son. > I have a pile of fake dollar bills covered with fake blood from a > Skinny Puppy show back in 1986. Har, I forgot I had those. Now that's a collector's item! I don't have anything that cool, but I do have a page ripped out from a Bible at an Electric Hellfire Club show.... - --Chris, who is perhaps not *quite* as hostile to religion as this post might make him sound ______________________________________________________________________ Christopher Gross On the Internet, nobody knows I'm a dog. chrisg@gwu.edu ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2001 10:45:00 +1200 From: grutness@surf4nix.com (James Dignan) Subject: Re: ars gratia artis >On Sat, 23 Jun 2001, James Dignan wrote: > >> >>What sort of comment is that? Art in and of itself is subjective. Call me >> >>stupid (I heard that!), but doesn't everyone judge art by how relevant its >> >>ideals are to one's own outlook on life? >> >> does anyone look at art this way? > >want some fun reads- read the futarist manifesto and/or the dadaist >manifesto and then read those top three lines again... > >> Art is objective. The appreciation of art is subjective. I judge art on its >> ability to change or enhance the way I think about things, my mood, or my >> view of reality. I am mightily impressed by some of Kienholz's >> installations, for instance, even though they are the sort of things that >> would give me nightmares (indeed one of them, The Beanery, did turn up in a >> nightmare of mine). I have been impressed by Pollock and Rothko's work >> (which are much more impressive 'in the flesh' than I would have thought >> just from seeing illustrations of them), despite their sheer abstraction >> having little relevance to me. > >I remember first experiencing "the ozymandious parade" by ed and nancy >keinholtz in '88 wide eyed idealist that I was back then...not their best >work but it sure left and impression on me that is still there, it was the >first work of art that included all the senses for me, god it smelled bad! sadly I've never experienced any Kienholz work in person (one of the problems of living thousands of miles from anywhere big). A series of photos of "The Beanery" that I saw a few years ago left a really deep impression, though. As for Rothko, I have seen a few of his works at visiting exhibitions. You get nothing of what they are like from photos - it's like watching a movie like Lawrence of Arabia on a ten inch television. The sheer size of them compounds the feelings you get from them in some way. The same's true for a lot of abstract artists. James James Dignan, Dunedin, New Zealand. =-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-= -=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.- .-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=- You talk to me as if from a distance -.-=-.- And I reply with impressions chosen from another time =-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-.-=-. (Brian Eno - "By this River") ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2001 23:31:40 EDT From: Robcow@aol.com Subject: Re: Nuggets II The U.S. Kaleidoscope were the one that gave David Lindley his start. Big influence on Camper van Beethoven who even nicked their arrangement of "Oh Death". Very consistent and original sounding band. The U.K. Kaleidoscope were a distinct, separate entity who existed at almost the exact same time (ca. 1967). Recorded 2 albums (Tangerine Dream and Faintly Blowing) and another as Fairfield Parlour that hold up for fans of British psych-pop and I daresay fit in perfectly with much of Nuggets II. I noticed that many of the tracks on the box had been previously compiled on Bam Caruso's excellent Rubble series. Did Phil Smee, by any chance, have something to do with this project also? Haven't seen his name mentioned yet but it would make a lot of sense. Hope to hear it soon. You might be pleasantly surprised by the quality of the Guess Who's early albums by the way. Several songs I can think of (especially the epic "Friends of Mine") were staples of the hip "underground" FM radio stations I listened to in my formative years. And the singles were gems that were fresh sounding in their time and are sadly all most people remember them for. It took me awhile to really appreciate Led Zeppelin but once I did they stayed with me. Roberta ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2001 09:09:55 -0700 From: "Russ Reynolds" Subject: Barnaby Tull This is for Tull fans--I know there are one or two on the list. Two demographics that apparently do not intersect: Jethro Tull Fans and Barnaby Jones Fans. Perhaps this had already been researched when the producers decided to pass off "Wind Up" (from the Aqualung album) as an original song in the following episode: 2031. A Gold Record for Murder (02/10/74) Production Code 9768 When his 'ghost writer' Ray wants the proper credit for his songs, rock star David Colton kills him with a drug overdose. David tries to get rid of his manager Gil, who knows about Ray's songs. Barnaby, hired by Ray's parents, finds out about David's secret. w. Larry Brody, d. George McCowan Marjoe Gortner (David Colton), What's hilarious abou this is that Barnaby actually picks up a guitar and sings a verse of the song. Anyway, I find it interesting that there appears to be absolutely no mention of this on any Jethro Tull site that I can find, nor any mention of Tull or "Wind Up" on any Buddy Ebsen/Barnaby Jones site. I seem to be the only person on the planet who has heard the album AND seen the show. Am I alone or are there others out there? - -rUss BTW, "American Woman" is not over rated. It RAWKS. ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V10 #254 ********************************