From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V9 #214 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Tuesday, August 1 2000 Volume 09 : Number 214 Today's Subjects: ----------------- LIMP BISCUIT ["Noe Shalev" ] Re: LIMP BISCUIT [GSS ] comic book geekery report [Natalie Jacobs ] RE: LIMP BISCUIT ["Brian Huddell" ] Mary and Tim -- oops! [The Great Quail ] Re: comic book geekery report [hbrandt ] Re: comic book geekery report [Aaron Mandel ] RE: comic book geekery report [Natalie Jacobs ] "Glass Hotel" updates [Bayard ] Syd Barrett/Robyn Hitchcock. [nyquilathotep ] a tale of poetic justice [Jeff Dwarf ] The real problem with MP3... ["Brian Huddell" ] Re: KC and the Richard Carpenter Band [Michael R Godwin ] Re: The real problem with MP3... [Stephen Buckalew ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2000 08:48:59 +0200 From: "Noe Shalev" Subject: LIMP BISCUIT Anybody heard about: LIMP BISCUIT? I need as much information as you have plzzz all the best NOE ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2000 12:41:19 -0500 (CDT) From: GSS Subject: Re: LIMP BISCUIT On Mon, 31 Jul 2000, Noe Shalev wrote: > Anybody heard about: LIMP BISCUIT? > > I need as much information as you have plzzz uuuuuuhhhhhhhhh, at least they ain't in it just for the money. the guitarist does have a good stage presence, i gotta give'em that much. love, a good stiff lolly wait, that doesn't sound right. ps. shit, etews said like two or three things in his last couple posts that I agree with. i'm not sure who this will bother most, me or him. ;+} nader is the man, sorta. but then i might vote for nixon if he was running against gore and bush. "God is a comedian playing to an audience too afraid to laugh." - - Voltaire ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2000 11:15:26 -0700 From: Natalie Jacobs Subject: comic book geekery report Possibly only Viv and Hal will be interested in this, but what the hell... I went to see a talk given by Peter Bagge, author of "Hate" and other amusing comics. Very entertaining, intelligent guy with a lot of harsh things to say about the state of "alternative" comics. His career doesn't seem to be going well at the moment - he's doing stuff for Suck.com and attempting to get "Hate" made into a TV show or movie, and his latest comic (for DC!) was a dismal failure. So he's understandably pretty bitter. He started out talking about his crappy home life and escaping to New York in the late '70's, where he did comics with the guys who ran "Punk" magazine. He contrasted their low-brow approach (and also that of Robert Crumb and himself, among others) with the high-brow, "artsy-fartsy" approach of Art Spiegelman and his cohorts. He discussed working with Robert Crumb on Crumb's magazine "Weirdo" (he said Crumb used to be a nice guy but is now "a pain in the ass"), and detailed the evolution of "Hate" and why he quit doing it - he didn't want to be pigeonholed as the creator of this one comic. (For those who are familiar with the comic, he said he regrets killing off Stinky.) He got especially bitter towards the end of the lecture, saying that Spiegelman's "artsy-fartsy" cohort had "won" and comics were now considered "art," rather than just entertainment. He doesn't think there are any new cartoonists who are doing anything challenging or ground-breaking - although there are talented new artists around, they all have their roots in older material. (He used Adrian Tomine and Chris Ware as examples.) He bitched about the high price and low availability of comics and praised the Internet as an alternative, saying that it's preferable to read comics on-line for free rather than try to seek out hard-to-find, expensive paper comics. "People who go on about the 'feel' of paper comics - that's just nostalgia." Describing Chris Ware's work as "anal" and perfectionist, he said, "It'd better be perfect if you're going to pay $4.95 for it!" He also claimed that he didn't care that he had never won a Harvey award and sneered at Dan Clowes for having all his Harvey awards on display in his house. (Whoo - sour grapes!) Bagge is a rabid Libertarian, but didn't get into politics too much, except when someone asked him why he didn't like "Doonesbury." He really cut loose on Gary Trudeau, said he was smug and politically correct, and got really acerbic about the fact that all liberals were somehow expected to like "Doonesbury" and agree with everything in it. So anyway, I really enjoyed the lecture, despite all the bitterness. I hope Bagge's career gets on track again soon, and maybe the next time he comes to Portland his slant on comics will be a little different. n. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2000 13:23:59 -0500 From: "Brian Huddell" Subject: RE: LIMP BISCUIT The spelling might be throwing off your searches (this is a case where being multi-lingual doesn't help!) Limp Bizkit http://allmusic.com has an entry. And here's a link to their page at the Ultimate Band List (which will give you more links than you can possibly use): http://ubl.com/links.asp?mode=websites&artistid=11220&p_id=P+++213327 > Anybody heard about: LIMP BISCUIT? > > I need as much information as you have plzzz > > all the best > NOE > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2000 14:41:17 -0400 From: The Great Quail Subject: Mary and Tim -- oops! LJ pointed out an error in my last post -- when I referred to Tim as "occasional Feg and less-occasional friend of Scary Mary," I meant to imply that "less" occasional" meant constant, or always. But reading it makes it seem quite the opposite! Please, accept my appy-polly-loggies! - --Quail ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2000 14:50:15 -0600 From: hbrandt Subject: Re: comic book geekery report Natalie Jacobs wrote: > I went to see a talk given by Peter Bagge Thanks for this report on Pee Bag! > author of "Hate" and other > amusing comics. Fantagraphics is currently reprinting Bagge's "Junior" stories from Neat Stuff. The most recent reprint had me laughing at a strip titled "Uncle Hal". I am an uncle, but I'm nothing like the guy in the strip..! > his latest comic > (for DC!) was a dismal failure. So he's understandably pretty bitter. He's talking about "YEAH!", a kiddie comic about an all-girl rock band who are only popular on other planets. Even though it featured Bagge scripts with Gilbert Hernandez art, the stories were pretty Archie-like and the rock band humor was a bit dated. He has only himself to blame. Even the kids ignored it. > "Hate" and why he quit > doing it - he didn't want to be pigeonholed as the creator of this one > comic. (For those who are familiar with the comic, he said he regrets > killing off Stinky.) Too bad he wants to distance himself from his HATE! legacy. He should reconsider and make his next project "Stinky: The Early Stories". THAT I'd pay $2.95 for. > > He got especially bitter towards the end of the lecture, saying that > Spiegelman's "artsy-fartsy" cohort had "won" and comics were now considered > "art," rather than just entertainment. Again, I say...Resurrect Stinky. Problem solved. :) Too bad to hear that Bagge is bitter (3x fast). Not pleasant to hear him knock Adrian Tomine, Chris Ware, Garry Trudeau and Dan Clowes. Crumb being a pain in the ass doesn't come as a shock if you've read any of his comix or seen the Terry Zwigoff documentary (Zwigoff's next project? Clowes' "Ghost World"!) I agree with Bagge about art spiegelman's artsy-fartsy Pulitzer prize approach being a bigger minus than a plus for the industry. The debate continues. Thanks again for the report from the field, gNat! /hal, with mouth still agape after reading the latest issue of Preacher and currently salivating anticipating the final issue (#66) in three weeks ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2000 17:12:57 -0400 (EDT) From: Aaron Mandel Subject: Re: comic book geekery report On Mon, 31 Jul 2000, Natalie Jacobs wrote: > He got especially bitter towards the end of the lecture, saying that > Spiegelman's "artsy-fartsy" cohort had "won" and comics were now > considered "art," rather than just entertainment. which hole in the ground is Bagge living in? most people still think of 'comics' as meaning 'superhero comics' (and think that superhero comics are all the same), and of the comics being written in the indie/self-published world, there are more that are too shallow than are too 'deep'. if i had to venture a mean-spirited guess, i would have to wonder if he's not actually bitter about critical acclaim not translating into massive success for him. > He doesn't think there are any new cartoonists who are doing anything > challenging or ground-breaking - although there are talented new > artists around, they all have their roots in older material. why should he care, if he thinks comics aren't art? aaron ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2000 14:25:12 -0700 From: Natalie Jacobs Subject: RE: comic book geekery report > if i had to venture a mean-spirited guess, i would have to > wonder if he's not actually bitter about critical acclaim not translating > into massive success for him. I think he's bitter that he hasn't gotten the kind of mainstream acclaim that Spiegelman and the "Raw" folks have gotten, and he feels he deserves it because his stuff is "low-brow" and just "entertainment." n. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2000 20:24:48 -0400 (EDT) From: Bayard Subject: "Glass Hotel" updates http://www.glasshotel.net/gh/crypt.htm http://www.glasshotel.net/gh/rumors.htm http://www.glasshotel.net/gh/radiohitchcock.htm ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2000 23:20:42 -0400 From: nyquilathotep Subject: Syd Barrett/Robyn Hitchcock. the old robynhitchcock@egroups.com mailing list has, via an influx of rabid posters from a now-defunct syd barrett egroups list, transformed itself into a new joint mailing list: VegetableFriends@egroups.com. i'm not sure if the old list will be shutting down or not. in any event, here is the announcement about the new list: >Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2000 15:18:21 -0000 >From: "Twig The Wonderkid " >Subject: Syd Barrett/ Robyn Hitchcock. > >You are cordially invited to join the newest, hippest, swingingest >community currently active on egroups. >"Vegetable Friends" is a joint dissusion group dedicated to the works >of Syd Barrett- the spaced out wonder kid that thrust the earliest >incarnation of The Pink Floyd Sound into an acid fuelled orbit >of psychedelic ecstacy,chart success and worldwide critical acclaim- >The second object of our , frankly, un-natural desire is the one and >only Mr. Robyn Hitchcock, perveyor of all things absract, passionate >and (lets not mince our words here) downright wierd! >But it doesn't end there! We will be putting into place a files and >MP3 >sharing facility and there is some pretty damned exotic material to be >had. Besides Syd and Robyn, subjects covered tend to include most of >the >'Arts' and if you want heated debate about Napster then this is the >place to be! >www.egroups.com/group/VegetableFriends > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2000 03:47:50 -0700 (PDT) From: Jeff Dwarf Subject: a tale of poetic justice http://www.snopes.com/horrors/freakish/saguaro.htm Cactus Courageous Legend: A damaged cactus falls onto the man who had harmed it, killing him. Example: [Collected on the Internet, 1999] In southern arizona they have the sorts of cacti that have great arms like you see on old westerns, called saguaros. they're quite protected by various laws and live to be hundreds of years old. The story goes that some guy was out with his shotgun shooting signs and such. Well, he decided to blast some cacti too. As he stood within a few feet, perhaps 10, of a giant old cactus, he blasted a few holes in its giant trunk. It gave way and fell right on top of him, crushing and impaling him with nail-like spikes. He died, being alone and unable to crawl away. Origins: People do stupid, unthinking things. Most of the time, they get away with them . . . . In 1982, roommates David Grundman and James Joseph Suchochi decided pack up the guns and go wandering in the desert two miles north of Arizona 74, just west of Lake Pleasant. One or both of them was struck with the brilliant notion of taking pot shots at saguaro they found growing there. Maybe it was the Devil in them. Maybe it had to do with the eerily manlike shapes these monstrous plants can grow into. Grundman shot a small saguaro in the trunk so many times that it thudded to the ground. "The first one was easy!" he cried, according to Suchochi. He next chose a specimen which stood 26 feet high and was estimated to be a hundred years old. Before the ringing in his ears had stopped, a four-foot spiny arm, severed by the blast, fell on Grundman, crushing him. Grundman's demise is chronicled in "Saguaro," a song by the Texas rock band, the Austin Lounge Lizards. There are other stories in urban lore about Nature's children taking revenge on their human tormentors (the dynamite dog and Gucci kangaroo, for instance), but this is the only one where a plant strikes back. Then again, the saguaro is one very special plant. Saguaros are tall cactuses that can reach heights of 60 feet and grow only in the Sonoran Desert in the southwestern United States. For the first 75 years of their lives, they have only huge central trunks; their distinctive outstretched and upwards-bent arms develop later, if at all. Their usual lifespan is 150 to 200 years, though some have lived to be 300. Oh, one other fact about saguaros; they can weigh up to 8 tons. As Grundman found out. Barbara "cactus attack" Mikkelson ===== "Life is just a series of dogs." -- George Carlin __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Kick off your party with Yahoo! Invites. http://invites.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2000 00:19:36 -0500 From: "Brian Huddell" Subject: The real problem with MP3... ...is that you don't have to take responsibility for the music you listen to. The anonymity of an Internet download has created a situation wherein I can revisit the shame of my pre-teen tastes and not have to face the scorn of some surly kid at the Virgin Megastore. I've already sorted out the Partridge Family, the unspeakable Bobby Sherman, and others that I dare not mention. But I can't shake the Carpenters. The fucking Carpenters. This is an open invitation to any feg with the guts to either justify my reluctance to write them off as saccharine crap, or to make a compelling case that That Voice and Those Arrangements amount to garbage, and that I'm just a victim of nostalgia. Ob Robyn: I like Robyn Hitchcock very very much. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2000 14:41:27 +0100 (BST) From: Michael R Godwin Subject: Re: KC and the Richard Carpenter Band On Tue, 1 Aug 2000, Brian Huddell wrote: > But I can't shake the Carpenters. The fucking Carpenters. This is an open > invitation to any feg with the guts to either justify my reluctance to write > them off as saccharine crap, or to make a compelling case that That Voice > and Those Arrangements amount to garbage, and that I'm just a victim of > nostalgia. No way. "Goodbye to love" is one of the most distinctive records ever. And while it's quite nice listening to 24 George Harrisons singing 'Hare Rama' over and over, it doesn't compare with 48 Karen Carpenters singing 'aah' for 8 bars and then adding an ace guitar solo by Tony Peluso over the top. Nice! And it makes a change from listening to Moe Tucker singing "I'm sticking with you". - - Mike Godwin PS But those jolly 'Top of the World' pseudo-ersatz-upbeat-pop-country Carpenters singles are the world's worst; they should've stuck with wallowing ... n.p. Dollar 'Give me back my heart' ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 01 Aug 2000 08:22:14 -0700 From: Jason Thornton Subject: Re: Syd Barrett/Robyn Hitchcock. At 11:20 PM 7/31/00 -0400, nyquilathotep wrote: > >From: "Twig The Wonderkid " Ah, a Bowie reference! Must me the fates telling me it's time to post again. > > Besides Syd and Robyn, subjects covered tend to include most of > >the > >'Arts' and if you want heated debate about Napster then this is the > >place to be! Dear Lord, Professor Richards! It's like some evil parallel universe where *NOTHING* is the same. - --Jason "You'll have to pry the intellectual property from my cold, dead gray matter, hippies!" Thornton "Only the few know the sweetness of the twisted apples." - Sherwood Anderson ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 01 Aug 2000 12:26:24 -0400 From: Stephen Buckalew Subject: Re: The real problem with MP3... Sorry, I can't say they are crap. Whatever bad stuff one may say about the Carpenters, the songs were actually very catchy, and Karen's voice was simply very beautiful. Being a singer myself, I know how hard it is to sing well. Some people are born with beautiful voices, and Karen was one of those people. I love RH's music, and his voice is distinctive and effective for his material. But he's really not that great of a singer. I may be forever lambasted for defending the Carpenters on this list, but so be it.... S.B. *************************************************************** "...isn't it good to be lost in the wood..."--Syd Barrett *************************************************************** >But I can't shake the Carpenters. The fucking Carpenters. This is an open >invitation to any feg with the guts to either justify my reluctance to write >them off as saccharine crap, or to make a compelling case that That Voice >and Those Arrangements amount to garbage, and that I'm just a victim of >nostalgia. > >Ob Robyn: I like Robyn Hitchcock very very much. > > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2000 08:32:56 -0700 From: "Marc Holden" Subject: Full Dimensional Hey there-- I just picked up an EP (red vinyl) from a band called Full Dimensional = recently and finally got around to giving it a listen. Pretty = interesting. I picked it up because they covered a song by someone who = gets the occasional mention on Fegmaniax, Robyn Hitchcock (who?)--Zipper = in My Spine. Info at http://members.aol.com/rcknrex/collect Also, just out of curiosity--when Robyn played the Troubadour with = Grant Lee Phillips, he dropped a verse from Mexican God. Did he do that = at the other shows also, or was this possibly accidental? Later, = Marc np--the Buzzcocks--singles going steady "The fact of the matter is, I'm fucking brilliant. Not was brilliant. Am = brilliant." --- Pete Townshend =20 ("...it ain't bragging if it's true..." ---Dan Bern(stein) = quoting Muhammad Ali) ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V9 #214 *******************************