From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V9 #202 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Friday, July 21 2000 Volume 09 : Number 202 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: Schlock Radio [Vivien Lyon ] I'n in love with a beautiful American girl [BLATZMAN@aol.com] Schlock Talk [BLATZMAN@aol.com] Re: Schlock Radio [Capuchin ] Re: I'n in love with a beautiful American girl [Capuchin ] why i wearied of our young world [dmw ] Artwork ["SIMPSON,HAMISH (A-Scotland,ex1)" ] american women [Eleanore Adams ] Kick out the style; bring back the jam [Glen Uber ] Re: comix [hbrandt ] Re: american women ["Paul Christian Glenn" ] Re: american women [hbrandt ] Re: why i wearied of our young world [hbrandt ] Re: american women [Glen Uber ] Re: Kick out the style; bring back the jam [Eclipse ] Re: american women [Stephen Buckalew ] Re: Schlock Radio [John Barrington-Jones ] Yes, it's another damn Patriot comment [Christopher Gross ] Re: Stone the quails [Eb ] Re: Kick out the style; bring back the jam ["Andrew D. Simchik" ] Re: Kick out the style; bring back the jam ["elizabeth " Subject: Re: Schlock Radio - --- hbrandt wrote: > Crappy casting?! Eric Bogosian originated the role > off-Broadway in a > one-man show. He also wrote the script. It is his show, and it would have been irresponsible to cast anyone else in the role. He was playing a radio talk host (Alan Berg, who > was > actually much worse looking than Bogosian.) I can't be the only one who doesn't think Bogosian is sort of good-looking, can I? His only real drawback is his too-curly hair. Trust me...people > on the > radio usually don't look like Mel Gibson. I wonder if the same > bonehead > USC instructor thinks Spalding Gray shouldn't get to do the > filmed > versions of his one-man monologues because he is also 'ugly'. Oh no no no! Spalding Gray is adorable! Or at least, he was, circa Swimming to Cambodia. Vivien tired of seeing the same twenty Hollywood-approved 'good-looking' people in every damn movie. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get Yahoo! Mail – Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 12:03:23 EDT From: BLATZMAN@aol.com Subject: I'n in love with a beautiful American girl In a message dated 7/20/00 1:19:31 PM US Mountain Standard Time, owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org writes: << Hear, hear! I also don't understand American men's idea of what a "beautiful" woman is: Julia Roberts, Charlize Theron, Cameron Diaz, and especially Cindy Crawford. >> Uh, you forgot Ashley Judd. When she walks up to the ballgame during Simon Birch, she is a vision of perfection. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 12:34:08 EDT From: BLATZMAN@aol.com Subject: Schlock Talk In a message dated 7/21/00 9:11:57 AM US Mountain Standard Time, owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org writes: << Crappy casting?! Eric Bogosian originated the role off-Broadway in a one-man show. He was playing a radio talk host (Alan Berg, who was actually much worse looking than Bogosian.) Trust me...people on the radio usually don't look like Mel Gibson. I wonder if the same bonehead USC instructor thinks Spalding Gray shouldn't get to do the filmed versions of his one-man monologues because he is also 'ugly'. >> Who cares if Bogosian originated the role off broadway? WHO CARES???? That is no reason to bankroll a multi-million dollar film on his ugly mug. People who go to Spalding Gray films go to see Spalding Gray. And in case you haven't noticed, Gray's films are LOW BUDGET. The one I saw was all done in a single room. Gray is the draw and the budget is low. The risk of not making your money back is smaller. People who go see Talk Radio, for the most part, are not going to see a Bogosian monologue. Must you be reminded that films are business ventures? Studios NEED to make their money back if the they are going to be in the movie making business. I for one would not invest in a medium budget film that had Bogosian's way ugly mug as the lead. I'm sure that "bonehead" instructor at USC would be happy to invest in a low-budget Spalding Gray film directed by Demme. Duh, it's a no-brainer. Anyone know how well Schlock Radio did at the Theaters? What was its budget? Dave ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 09:33:39 -0700 (PDT) From: Capuchin Subject: Re: Schlock Radio On Fri, 21 Jul 2000, hbrandt wrote: > Crappy casting?! Eric Bogosian originated the role off-Broadway in a > one-man show. He was playing a radio talk host (Alan Berg, who was > actually much worse looking than Bogosian.) Trust me...people on the > radio usually don't look like Mel Gibson. I wonder if the same bonehead > USC instructor thinks Spalding Gray shouldn't get to do the filmed > versions of his one-man monologues because he is also 'ugly'. Well, if you hadn't said it, I would have. Bogosian is a lead because he can act. And that beats the shit out of anybody's reason for casting DiCaprio, Reeves (any one that I've seen), or Gibson. Also, Bogosian WROTE the thing (well, the play and most of the screenplay). And let me just use this opportunity to mention AGAIN probably the greatest of the reasonably modern Saturday Night Live sketches: Monsters of Monologue! Jay North is the ringmaster/announcer a la Vince McMahon pitching the Monsters of Monologue Tour! in the middle of the "squared circle". He announces the main attraction, a final battle between Eric "Wildman" Bogosian (a very nice impression by Adam Sandler) and "Scalding" Spalding Gray (played PERFECTLY with all the necessary brilliance by Michael McKeown). Damn, if I don't laugh very hard EVERY time I see it. If you happen to get it on tape, I'll trade you Vivien for it. J. - -- _______________________________________________ Capuchin capuchin@bitmine.net Jeme A Brelin _______________________________________________ [cc] counter-copyright http://www.openlaw.org ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 09:35:37 -0700 (PDT) From: Capuchin Subject: Re: I'n in love with a beautiful American girl On Fri, 21 Jul 2000 BLATZMAN@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 7/20/00 1:19:31 PM US Mountain Standard Time, > owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org writes: > << Hear, hear! I also don't understand American men's idea of what a > "beautiful" woman is: Julia Roberts, Charlize Theron, Cameron Diaz, and > especially Cindy Crawford. >> > > Uh, you forgot Ashley Judd. When she walks up to the ballgame during Simon > Birch, she is a vision of perfection. You mean mentally retarded? Because that's how she looks to me. (No offense to the mentally retarded... but you gotta admit there's a "certain look" that's usually quite reliable.) I'm with whoever originally wrote the post. Those folks considered "beautiful" in the entertainment industry are nearly all creepy looking. J. - -- _______________________________________________ Capuchin capuchin@bitmine.net Jeme A Brelin _______________________________________________ [cc] counter-copyright http://www.openlaw.org ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 09:36:30 -0700 From: Natalie Jacobs Subject: comix > Love those ducks, and I agree with all of the above...plus I'll add Will > Eisner, Winsor McKay, Dave Sim/Gerhard, Julie Doucet, Lee/Ditko, > Lee/Kirby, Garth Ennis, Warren Ellis, Peter Bagge, Adrian Tomine, Paul > Pope, Vaughn Bode, Alan Moore, Charles Burns, Jill Thompson, David > Lapham, Berni Wrightson, Chris Ware (a genius), Bob Burden, Ivan > Brunetti, Kurt Busiek and many more that I'm sure I'm overlooking. Especially don't forget George Herriman and Windsor McKay!! gnat "there is a heppy land fur, fur awaaayyyy" the gnatster p.s. Oh, and don't forget Neil Gaiman, neither. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 12:40:05 -0400 (EDT) From: dmw Subject: why i wearied of our young world On Fri, 21 Jul 2000, lj lindhurst wrote: > Oh, I don't know-- I've always been more in the 80085 camp. > > And anyhow, who's going to publicly post their PIN number here, ya dumbass? put me down for pi, sideways. and if we're still nominating directors for death, can i vote for speilberg? further: like, after wasting two of the longer hours of my life spent outside dentist's waiting rooms watching _the doors_ i'm going to go see anything else with oliver stone's name on it? no, i don't think so, honey. - -- d. np sisters of sharon _paper planes and daisy chains_ - - oh no, you've just read mail from doug = dmw@radix.net - get yr pathos - - www.pathetic-caverns.com -- books, flicks, tunes, etc. = reviews - - www.fecklessbeast.com -- angst, guilt, fear, betrayal! = guitar pop ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 16:11:33 +0100 From: "SIMPSON,HAMISH (A-Scotland,ex1)" Subject: Artwork fegs, Pardon my probable ignorance but is the sleeve for Capt. Sensible's "I Get so Exited" an RH design. It can be seen half way down http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Studio/6589/discosingle.htm Cheers H ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 10:13:38 -0700 From: Eleanore Adams Subject: american women Maybe I missed this, but there was a list of american women that you guys thought were stereotyped gorgous, but not really attractive. But who is attractive???? Or a real american woman? My favorite star female, for looks, was always Isabella Rosallini (Yeah, I know she ain't america) (and being a strait female, this is out of my league) I also think Sharon Stone, especially recently, with the short hair and 40 something going on, is attractive. But my husband thinks that the best american girl is that girl from Sleepy Hollow and The Opposite of Sex. (I forgot her name) I keep telling him that is sick - she is just a child. He also gives votes to Elizabeth Hurley. So who is attractive? If all those listed before are not, than is it the Ricki Lake types;-)? Roseanne? Rosie ODonnell? (Or, let me guess, it is the Borg chick from Voyager, and Wynona Ryder. Guys always say that if they don't go for the "america" type) eleanore ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 10:33:27 -0700 From: Glen Uber Subject: Kick out the style; bring back the jam On 7/21/00 9:03 AM, BLATZMAN@aol.com wrote: > << Hear, hear! I also don't understand American men's idea of what a > "beautiful" woman is: Julia Roberts, Charlize Theron, Cameron Diaz, and > especially Cindy Crawford. >> > > Uh, you forgot Ashley Judd. When she walks up to the ballgame during Simon > Birch, she is a vision of perfection. Actually, I was trying to say that the women I listed above are considered paragons of beauty, but I find nothing attractive about any of them (including Judd). Hollywood's idea of beauty is something that is manufactured. The movie critics and E! Television show hosts and Glamour magazine publishers tell us what beauty is and we're supposed to buy into that based on the person's looks and nothing else. I'd rather be with someone like Janeane Garafalo (as an example), who is probably totally cool and could give a fuck what people think of her than to be with someone like Ashley Judd (as an example) who is more than likely concerned with how the outside world views her and whether or not her hair is going to get mussed while I'm doing her seven ways to Sunday. I just get upset that regular people don't appear in movies and when one does, such as Eric Bogosian, the directors are criticized for casting a regular looking -- dare I say "fugly" -- person. Give me substance over style any day. - -- Cheers! - -g- "P.T. Barnum's marketing theories are the cornerstone of pop culture." - --Mark Gloster +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ Glen Uber uberg@sonic.net http://www.sonic.net/~uberg ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 11:38:49 -0600 From: hbrandt Subject: Re: comix I wrote: > > > I'll add Will > > Eisner, Winsor McKay, Dave Sim/Gerhard, Julie Doucet, Lee/Ditko, > > Lee/Kirby, Garth Ennis, Warren Ellis, Peter Bagge, Adrian Tomine, Paul > > Pope, Vaughn Bode, Alan Moore, Charles Burns, Jill Thompson, David > > Lapham, Berni Wrightson, Chris Ware (a genius), Bob Burden, Ivan > > Brunetti, Kurt Busiek and many more that I'm sure I'm overlooking. > > Especially don't forget George Herriman and Windsor McKay!! > See above (McKay). Agreed on Krazy Kat's kreator. > > p.s. Oh, and don't forget Neil Gaiman, neither. Right! (although Neil has left the comics world behind, sadly.) /hal /hal ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 12:13:48 -0500 From: "Paul Christian Glenn" Subject: Re: american women > But my husband thinks that the best american girl is that girl from > Sleepy Hollow and The Opposite of Sex. (I forgot her name) Christina Ricci. > So who is attractive? Julianne Moore. Dreamy perfection. Paul Christian Glenn pcg@mailandnews.com Eon Chamber http://eonchamber.port5.com "Freedom is the most demanding of all responsibilities. It is something constantly to be worked at if it is to be understood, maintained, and developed. Freedom is not so much the liberty to do what one likes, as the right to be able to do what one ought". - Ashley Montagu ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 11:47:55 -0600 From: hbrandt Subject: Re: american women Eleanore Adams wrote: > > who is attractive???? Or a real american woman? To name but a few: Alicia Witt! Rebecca Romijn-Stamos. Madonna (who now looks better than ever.) /hal ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 11:50:34 -0600 From: hbrandt Subject: Re: why i wearied of our young world dmw wrote: > and if we're still nominating directors for death, can i vote for > speilberg? Yes, please do, and consider it seconded. What an overrrated mama's boy Spielberg is. /hal ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 10:47:52 -0700 From: Glen Uber Subject: Re: american women On 7/21/00 10:13 AM, Eleanore Adams wrote: > My favorite star female, for looks, was always Isabella Rosallini > (Yeah, I know she ain't america) (and being a strait female, this is out > of my league) I also think Sharon Stone, especially recently, with the > short hair and 40 something going on, is attractive. I kinda dig Rene Russo, Susan Sarandon and Sela Ward. I always thought Dana Delany was hot in her army khakis. Other American women I consider attractive are Patricia Arquette, Parker Posey and Rose McGowen. > But my husband thinks that the best american girl is that girl from > Sleepy Hollow and The Opposite of Sex. (I forgot her name) I keep > telling him that is sick - she is just a child. He also gives votes to > Elizabeth Hurley. I like your husband's tastes. :) The hottie from Opposite of Sex is Christina Ricci. She's legal, by the way. I like Elizabeth Hurley because of the combination of brains and beauty. I also like that Madonna/whore thing she's has going. I mean just hearing those stories of those spanking games she plays with friends gives me something to think about late at night. For similar reasons (that spanking thing aside) I used to think that Emma Thompson was pretty hot. I haven't seen her for awhile, though, so I can't say for certain whether she'd still make the cut. > So who is attractive? If all those listed before are not, than is it the > Ricki Lake types;-)? Roseanne? Rosie ODonnell? Arrrgghhh!!!! > (Or, let me guess, it is the Borg chick from Voyager, and Wynona Ryder. Oh, yeah! Now that's what I'm talking about! I always liked Dr. Crusher on New Generation. > Guys always say that if they don't go for the "america" type) I don't have a preference when it comes to nationalities: I just don't go for blondes all that much. I like redheads and brunettes meself. - -- Cheers! - -g- "The revolution will not be televised but it will have its own web site." - --Glen Uber, 25 April 2000 (apologies to Gil Scott-Heron) +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ Glen Uber uberg@sonic.net http://www.sonic.net/~uberg ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 10:50:03 -0700 (PDT) From: Eclipse Subject: Re: Kick out the style; bring back the jam On Fri, 21 Jul 2000, Glen Uber wrote: > Actually, I was trying to say that the women I listed above are considered > paragons of beauty, but I find nothing attractive about any of them > (including Judd). Hollywood's idea of beauty is something that is > manufactured. The movie critics and E! Television show hosts and Glamour > magazine publishers tell us what beauty is and we're supposed to buy into > that based on the person's looks and nothing else. as a "curvy" (and yes, that's another way of saying i'm not a size 6) woman, i say AMEN to the above. i'm so fucking sick of the stereotype of beautiful women pushed on men and women by E! and Glamour and whatnot. give me Kate Winslet or Janeane Garafalo any day. Anjelina Jolie, Ashley Judd, and Cindy Crawford can take their anorexic "beauty" and stick it where the sun don't shine. OBcurvy: anyone interested in women's magazines that don't glorify anorexics and coke-heads should check out _Mode_ magazine - a real women's magazine (and this coming from someone who generally detests the whole idea of fashion rags anyway). > I just get upset that regular people don't appear in movies and when one > does, such as Eric Bogosian, the directors are criticized for casting a > regular looking -- dare I say "fugly" -- person. Give me substance over > style any day. amen to the above too! i have to admit to light crushes on people like Tim Robbins and Anthony Edwards - certainly not "hunks", but actors of style and substance, and a certain geeky charm, imo. - - E "mmm, tall gangly dorks" clipse np: The Monkees, Missing Links Vol. 2 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 14:07:42 -0400 From: Stephen Buckalew Subject: Re: american women Screw casting considerations, why be forced to scald our eyes with ugliness....if I were Fuhrer of this fine culture, all ugly people would be rounded up and put to death! Wouldn't the world be a much more pleasant place then? S.B. At 12:13 PM 7/21/00 -0500, you wrote: >> But my husband thinks that the best american girl is that girl from >> Sleepy Hollow and The Opposite of Sex. (I forgot her name) > >Christina Ricci. > >> So who is attractive? > >Julianne Moore. Dreamy perfection. > >Paul Christian Glenn pcg@mailandnews.com >Eon Chamber http://eonchamber.port5.com > >"Freedom is the most demanding of all responsibilities. It is >something constantly to be worked at if it is to be understood, >maintained, and developed. Freedom is not so much the liberty >to do what one likes, as the right to be able to do what one >ought". > - Ashley Montagu > > > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 11:10:20 -0700 (PDT) From: John Barrington-Jones Subject: Re: Schlock Radio Viv wrote: > tired of seeing the same twenty Hollywood-approved > 'good-looking' people in every damn movie. Me too!! Bring back Sherilyn Fenn!! =jbj= __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get Yahoo! Mail – Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 14:23:09 -0400 (EDT) From: Christopher Gross Subject: Yes, it's another damn Patriot comment On Fri, 21 Jul 2000 BLATZMAN@aol.com wrote: > << why couldn't they at least gave the hero more noble > motivations than personal revenge? > >> > > Why should they? Are you saying that you refuse to believe that in our > history, someone was motivated by personal revenge? Umm, no, that's not what I'm saying. (In fact, usually I would be on your side about accepting the character as an individual and not a personification of his people or era.) I'm just disappointed by the type of movie the Patriot crew chose to make. Given that they chose to make a historically inaccurate, mythical movie, why couldn't they have made one that mythologized the positive aspects of the Revolution? Did we really need _Deathwish 1778_? - --Chris ______________________________________________________________________ Christopher Gross On the Internet, nobody knows I'm a dog. chrisg@gwu.edu ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 11:38:56 -0700 From: Mark_Gloster@3com.com Subject: big changes in sharkboyville....Oliver Stone content 0% Warning: Just skip it. It's babbling about me anyway.... Okay, here it is. Some of you may already know this, but Donne, my sweety for more years than some of you have been alive, and I have been looking for a new town in which to live for a long time. A couple of years ago we decided that town was probably along the coast somewhere in Oregon. Last year we narrowed it down to the southern coast. Earlier this summer we decided that Bandon would be a great place to live. Seemingly, the second we returned from the trip we were informed that the house we rent was going to be sold and before too long, we would be out on our ears, asses, or whatever. We spent the following two months looking and applying for houses in which to live. Without going overboard on the crap that the realtor pulled, we were recently given an eviction notice. I don't know if anyone understands the "gold rush" mentality in the California Bay Area right now with respect to property. I don't think I grok it completely, but houses are simply not for rent. It seems that everyone who can sell is doing that to cash in on the recent insane inflation of property values. This means that for every rental, there are about 50 people applying for each bedroom. On paper and personally, I think it is fair to say that we were always in the running for everything for which we applied, but either wouldn't make ridiculous concessions or weren't related to the owner, or whatever, and didn't manage to get a place. We saw places we wouldn't live for $2,000.00 US/mo. Having had enough of searching for a house in which to have a tolerable limbo until we move to Oregon, we decided to move up there sooner than later. So, as of about August 15th, we will probably be living in Coos Bay (temporarily, as they have DSL) until we can get a place in Bandon with DSL. We are hoping to eventually buy a place with acreage to get the Tigermonkey music and cat ranch going. (Gee, maybe it would make economic sense to start a cult and have a compound there.) Since my management thinks I'm worth it, I will likely retain this email address and I will probably keep my rubrshrk@tigermonkey.com addy, as well. Who knows, maybe one of these day's I'll even update my web site. FYI: I will be in the Bay Area quite a lot over the next couple months, as I will be rehearsing and playing music for the wedding of Glenorglenda and Carol. I'm happy to know y'all. I will miss the people and cats I like down here more than anything else. Happies, - -Markg ps. Please don't let Kevin Costner play me in the movie about my life! ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 12:11:21 -0700 (PDT) From: Vivien Lyon Subject: Re: big changes in sharkboyville.... - --- Mark_Gloster@3com.com wrote: > Having had enough of searching for a house in which to have a > tolerable limbo until we move to Oregon, we decided to move up > there sooner than later. Yes! He's ours! Join us....join us.... Vivien now, where in hell is Bandon? __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get Yahoo! Mail – Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 13:14:50 -0700 From: Eb Subject: Re: Stone the quails Capuchin got no takers on his "trade" offer: >First of all, if I recall the scene (and I'm pretty sure I do), the pan >shot is swirling AROUND the guy doing all the talking. Sure, exactly. But while the camera giddily circles around the guy's face, the viewer's attention is distracted by the camera movement going "wheeeeee" around him...and away from the character's words. Since the dialogue was very important, I consider that bad direction. And fairly emblematic of Stone's lunkheaded, oppressive style. >I think it made the >viewer aware of the radio host as the central point of a world that was >shown all around. "Aware." Or rather, Stone brutally rubbed this obvious fact in our faces for an entire scene, in his inimitable hamfisted way. >I swear, how do you review records if you have to have every little nuance >explained to you from outside? It's the dead opposite. I prefer *not* to have every little nuance bulldozed into me by some manipulative hack. You're the one who thinks several minutes of flashy camera trickery are necessary simply to tell us that the DJ was "the central point of a world." As for me, I craftily surmised that already, because I had seen several scenes taking place in the studio, earlier in the film. Hm. >Subtlety? "look at the package... the strange, unmarked, mystery >package! It's tickytocky! What could it be?" That's ominous, evocative >and subtle? It's cliche, obvious, and bland, if'n you ask me (which, of >course, you didn't). You're not even arguing about anything, anymore. The film *does* have a "Look at the package...the strange, unmarked, mystery package!" shot. So, what's your point? That Stone was being admirably "subtle," by adding several minutes of showy camera spins beforehand? I have never seen an Oliver Stone film which didn't leave me feeling raped, at the end. Even the two or three which I marginally enjoyed. It's as simple as that. And I'm not alone in that view. Eb now playing: interview tapes ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 15:00:29 -0700 (PDT) From: "Andrew D. Simchik" Subject: Re: Kick out the style; bring back the jam I tried _really_ _hard_. What? I _did_! - --- Eclipse wrote: > On Fri, 21 Jul 2000, Glen Uber wrote: > > > Actually, I was trying to say that the women I listed above are > considered > > paragons of beauty, but I find nothing attractive about any of them > > (including Judd). Hollywood's idea of beauty is something that is > > manufactured. The movie critics and E! Television show hosts and > Glamour > > magazine publishers tell us what beauty is and we're supposed to buy > into > > that based on the person's looks and nothing else. > > as a "curvy" (and yes, that's another way of saying i'm not a size > 6) woman, i say AMEN to the above. i'm so fucking sick of the > stereotype > of beautiful women pushed on men and women by E! and Glamour and > whatnot. give me Kate Winslet or Janeane Garafalo any day. Anjelina > Jolie, Ashley Judd, and Cindy Crawford can take their anorexic > "beauty" and stick it where the sun don't shine. Okay, so I find this really odd. Both of you are slamming the popular culture idea of beauty and naming your alternatives. But let's face it, you're still talking about very attractive movie stars who fit a certain body type pretty well. Yes, I prefer Kate Winslet, Janeane Garofalo, and Christina Ricci to Cindy Crawford, Angelina Jolie, and Julia Roberts, but hello! All six of those women are models or movie stars or both! Janeane Garofalo is frequently cited as the antithesis of the knockout blonde perfect 10 movie star, and I adore her too but she is not THAT different. She is the token "girl next door" just as Jennifer Lopez, whose supposedly bountiful "ethnic" posterior is not all that different from any other Hot Chick Celebrity's (tm), is Hollywood's token Latina. If that's as Latina as Hollywood can get, we are a truly pathetic nation. Glen, you claim not to like the Hollywood standard of beauty and yet you're ga-ga over Rebecca Romijn-Stamos? Put a mole on her and she *is* Cindy Crawford. Come on! Didn't they both host "House of Style," even? Just because a woman is a brunette she is not automatically an "unconventional beauty." Drew P.S. Janeane Garofalo is not a "woman of size." I don't even think Margaret Cho is, although she still thinks so. ===== Andrew D. Simchik: drew at stormgreen dot com http://www.stormgreen.com/ __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get Yahoo! Mail – Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 15:28:54 -0700 From: Eb Subject: WOW http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=386859719 Eb ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Jul 2000 18:36:49 -0400 From: "elizabeth " Subject: Re: Kick out the style; bring back the jam >--- Eclipse wrote: >> as a "curvy" (and yes, that's another way of saying i'm not a size >> 6) woman, i say AMEN to the above. i'm so fucking sick of the >> stereotype >> of beautiful women pushed on men and women by E! and Glamour and >> whatnot. give me Kate Winslet or Janeane Garafalo any day. Anjelina >> Jolie, Ashley Judd, and Cindy Crawford can take their anorexic >> "beauty" and stick it where the sun don't shine. I'm not going to say anything on this subject after this, because people always get mad at me when I do, but... you do realize there are those of us who simply come in that size? There are three basic body types, with any number of variations, and I stand no more chance of looking like Marilyn Monroe than your average "curvy" woman does of looking like Kate Moss. I'm 5'8" and never got *up* to a size 6 until my mid-30s (full disclosure: I have never had an eating disorder [unless eating huge quantities of potato chips daily counts]; I've never exercised much at all, let alone obsessively; I've never done cocaine, heroin, or Dexatrim). Don't get me wrong - I'd like to see more variety in the entertainment realm too. I'd especially like to see more actresses with really bad split ends like mine. :-) But I don't see why, say, Queen Latifah being an attractive woman means that Ashley Judd has to be a hideous anorexic freak. (And has anyone seen Janeane Garafolo lately? She's *tiny*... I've always thought she was incredibly beautiful, though) - -- Elizabeth ************ listen to SmartToons Radio at http://www.fringehead.com/smarttoons - -- ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V9 #202 *******************************