From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V8 #293 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Friday, August 6 1999 Volume 08 : Number 293 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: Once in every lifetime [Michael R Godwin ] RE: Once in every lifetime ["Thomas, Ferris" ] timelessness of escape characters [Miles Goosens ] Re: Once in every lifetime [ultraconformist@mail.weboffices.com] Re: timelessness of escape characters [ultraconformist@mail.weboffices.co] Kate Bush kicks ass ["Andrew D. Simchik" ] Re: Blair witch (warning spoilers...) [ultraconformist@mail.weboffices.co] Re: August 23rd Music [Mark_Gloster@3com.com] Re: August 23rd Music [Bayard ] Re: the timelessness of quality (long) [MARKEEFE@aol.com] pouring catchup on the list [Mark_Gloster@3com.com] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 6 Aug 1999 14:53:36 +0100 (BST) From: Michael R Godwin Subject: Re: Once in every lifetime Drew wrote: > >And what does it mean that I've seen all 12 Young Ones episodes so often that > >I *am* the Young Ones? Best TV series of all time? (Maybe*.) On Thu, 5 Aug 1999, Eb wrote: > Are there only 12? Wow. I've just recently seen a few episodes...my first > exposure to the show. Had no idea it was that limited. > And yeah, I get a kick outta The Young Ones. I can't get much more > enthusiastic than that, but it's fun and different. I'm still trying to > figure out what purpose "Mike" serves, though -- he seems like nothing but > excess baggage. No? Rik Mayall, Ade Edmonson, Nigel Planer and Alexei Sayle have all gone on to successful careers in TV and live theatre. But I've only ever caught one glimpse of Mike the Cool Person - as an extra in an episode of the Comic Strip. You could argue that he was the Zeppo of the group, and that without one character who behaved approximately normally, you could lose sight of how bizarre the other characters were. Certainly those 'Bottom' shows with Rik and Ade are just meaningless recaps of Young Ones slapstick. My favourite YOs moment is the 'Young Adults' TV show, featuring the then completely unknown (except as a YOs scriptwriter) Ben Elton as the groovy yet patronising presenter, and Kynaston Reeves(?) as the ancient polytechnic administrator. Spot on! Oh, and Scumbag College on University Challenge - believe me, it really is like that, revising rivers of Yorkshire on the train up to Manchester... - - MRG PS Has anyone else ever played that 'Which one were you when you lived in a student house?' game? My mates were all quite definite that I was Rik, Mart was Vivian, Trev was the Cool Person and John "Why shouldn't I keep a pigeon in my room?" Bristowe was the Hippy. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Aug 1999 10:00:37 -0400 From: "Thomas, Ferris" Subject: RE: Once in every lifetime Mike The Cool One had at least one part on Bottom which was on, I think, two seasons ago in the UK (UK fegs? anyone....anyone....). He was borderline unrecognizable, though, having a Methuselah-like beard. Looking very, very old..... > -----Original Message----- > From: Michael R Godwin [mailto:hssmrg@bath.ac.uk] > Sent: Friday, August 06, 1999 9:54 AM > To: Mrs. Watson > Subject: Re: Once in every lifetime > > > > Drew wrote: > > >And what does it mean that I've seen all 12 Young Ones > episodes so often that > > >I *am* the Young Ones? Best TV series of all time? (Maybe*.) > > On Thu, 5 Aug 1999, Eb wrote: > > Are there only 12? Wow. I've just recently seen a few > episodes...my first > > exposure to the show. Had no idea it was that limited. > > And yeah, I get a kick outta The Young Ones. I can't get much more > > enthusiastic than that, but it's fun and different. I'm > still trying to > > figure out what purpose "Mike" serves, though -- he seems > like nothing but > > excess baggage. No? > > Rik Mayall, Ade Edmonson, Nigel Planer and Alexei Sayle have > all gone on > to successful careers in TV and live theatre. But I've only > ever caught > one glimpse of Mike the Cool Person - as an extra in an episode of the > Comic Strip. You could argue that he was the Zeppo of the > group, and that > without one character who behaved approximately normally, you > could lose > sight of how bizarre the other characters were. Certainly > those 'Bottom' > shows with Rik and Ade are just meaningless recaps of Young Ones > slapstick. > > My favourite YOs moment is the 'Young Adults' TV show, > featuring the then > completely unknown (except as a YOs scriptwriter) Ben Elton > as the groovy > yet patronising presenter, and Kynaston Reeves(?) as the ancient > polytechnic administrator. Spot on! > > Oh, and Scumbag College on University Challenge - believe me, > it really is > like that, revising rivers of Yorkshire on the train up to > Manchester... > > > - MRG > > PS Has anyone else ever played that 'Which one were you when > you lived in > a student house?' game? My mates were all quite definite that > I was Rik, > Mart was Vivian, Trev was the Cool Person and John "Why > shouldn't I keep a > pigeon in my room?" Bristowe was the Hippy. > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Aug 1999 07:06:09 -0700 (PDT) From: Vivien Lyon Subject: Re: Once in every lifetime - --- Michael R Godwin wrote: > Rik Mayall, Ade Edmonson, Nigel Planer and Alexei > Sayle have all gone on > to successful careers in TV and live theatre. But > I've only ever caught > one glimpse of Mike the Cool Person - as an extra in > an episode of the > Comic Strip. He was on a few episodes of Absolutely Fabulous, playing Edwina's first ex-husband. I seem to remember something else too....but no, I guess I don't. > PS Has anyone else ever played that 'Which one were > you when you lived in > a student house?' game? My mates were all quite > definite that I was Rik, > Mart was Vivian, Trev was the Cool Person and John > "Why shouldn't I keep a > pigeon in my room?" Bristowe was the Hippy. We were going to go as the Young Ones for Halloween one year in college, but since I manifestly had to be Vyvyan, and yet fit the personality of Rik much better, it ended badly and we all went as the cast of Grease. Faugh. Vivien I was Rizzo. _____________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Free instant messaging and more at http://messenger.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 06 Aug 1999 11:03:18 -0500 From: Miles Goosens Subject: timelessness of escape characters At 08:54 AM 8/6/99 +0100, Stewart Russell 3295 Analyst_Programmer wrote: >>>>>> "Miles" == Miles Goosens writes: > > Miles> I beg a favor of those of you using Macs: please head to > Miles> http://www.rsteviemoore.com to help this PC user examine a > Miles> potential problem. > >It's not just Mac users that are likely to have problems. It breaks >Tidy, Dave Raggett's HTML cleaner >(http://www.w3.org/People/Raggett/tidy/), which is a pretty rare >achievement. None of the entities have semicolons at the end, so they >may or may not render, depending on how the browser is feeling. I'd say that's running afowl of Tidy isn't as rare as you think. For example, I just downloaded Tidy and ran it against several websites designed by friends who do website design for a living, and it routinely found 20-50 errors per page. A lot of them had to do with small things, such as using a single tag for a long stretch (rather than having in every paragraph), etc. A good-looking professional page like C|NET's generated 190 errors, CNN's 454! Our own beloved Woj, terse coder that he is, gets cited for 12 Tidy errors on fegmania.org's index page. Not that its suggestions aren't valid or useful (I've already adopted them for the index page, and I'll be running the others through it shortly) or that one shouldn't have the cleanest code possible -- it's just that most browsers are smart enough these days to display pages correctly anyway. But many thanks for pointing me in this direction! And to contribute to the Andrew's "timelessness..." thread (and a thanks to him too for helping with the great Apple webpage test): I *know* I've played ABC's fluffy, fun HOW TO BE A ZILLIONAIRE about five times more than I've played TROUT MASK REPLICA. I have to be in the proper mood to subject myself to TROUT MASK's skronk, and that mood may not come around for six months, or even a couple of years. But I can listen to ZILLIONAIRE just about any time. I seem to be different about film, though -- APOCALYPSE NOW is dark and intense, yet whenever I encounter it on a TV, I find myself powerless resist watching the movie again. Doesn't matter where I come in -- Martin Sheen punching the mirror, the USO debacle, entering Kurtz' compound -- I'm transfixed for the duration. later, Miles ====================================================== Miles Goosens UNlimited edition R. Stevie Moore CDs now available! http://www.rsteviemoore.com My personal website http://www.mindspring.com/~outdoorminer/miles "If a million people say a stupid thing, it is still a stupid thing." -- Anatole France ====================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Aug 1999 09:29:32 -0700 (PDT) From: Capuchin Subject: Witches, Star Trek and Art. On Wed, 4 Aug 1999 DDerosa5@aol.com wrote: > (...having had my doubts grow through LB about technical plausibility > made me wonder how the filmmakers in BWP kept their batteries > going--until I read after seeing it that batteries and food were left > for the actors/camerafolks at the same time they were scaring them in > the middle of the night and hanging twig figures...) Recall that in the begining of the film, there are several comments about batteries and tape, including one line that says "We've got enough battery power to last us a week and we're only going to be up there two days." or something quite similar. Also, they definitely look stupid and hungry on those last two days. > I guess the main suspension of disbelief needed is that people lost in > the woods and freaking out and even losing one of their party would > continue to keep filming. But, in our post-modern world, that conceit > will likely become more and more plausible. Although a little cheesey, I did like the idea that the girl filmed everything because it made it less real and easier to handle. (Yeah, I know. My tag was opened on day one.) > (I always love in the Star Trek future that reports from the planet's > surface must be conveyed by communicator (first series) or little > handheld grainy cameras (TNG)--don't they ever perfect fiber optics > after they invent transporters?) At first I read this adn thought "Fiber optics? You want them to TETHER the ship to the landing party?" Then I realized what you meant; fiber optic lenses. Well, I would say it's a matter of using appropriate technology. First, visual transmission from the planet on Star Trek would still be much more bandwidth intensive than voice, so a grainy picture going up through all that distance on limited power isn't at all unreasonable. Just think of it as massive jpeg compression. So most of the time, there's no REASON for visual communication. It's the same reason we don't have video phones today. Oh, we could DO it... we just don't want to do it. I don't want people to call me and insist on not only hearing me, but seeing me as well. Nor do I want to see most of the people I call. > All in all, I found BWP very good, though not the masterpiece everyone > made it out to be-- It was very good. And, well, I would call it a masterpiece only insofar as a masterpiece is a work that shows a craftsman has become an artist. I would call Steven Seagal a craftsman (in filmmaking... he's probably an artist in knife-fighting, but that's not the subject at hand). I would call Celine Dione and Mariah Carey craftsmen. I would Robyn an artist, of course... but there are plenty of musicians and filmmakers that I don't like that I would call artists. Spielberg is an artist (he certainly expresses himself in his films and has mastered the craft of cattle manipulation... I just don't think he has anything interesting to say). Chris Isaak is an artist. Quick rant on the nature of art which I'm sure I've spewed to the list previously. I'm totally of the opinion that art is not simply self-expression. Expression is basic in humanity and the argument that all things expressive are by their nature artistic is absurd. Art, for me, is the perfection of a craft to the point of self-expression. If you're a cabinet maker and you master the craft of cabinet making, you may then produce a work that so demonstrates that skill and imparts upon the user of those cabinets some kind of understanding of the nature and use of the cabinet as an appliance and humanity's interaction with it. That is a masterpiece and that is artistic expression. The key, to me, is that an artist must have a craft perfected. Too many people today call their work art when it is merely self-expression without craft. > PS but, one quibble, Jeme, I don't think LB even had much of an arthouse > showing. I mean, a coupla underground film fests around the country, and it's > cool that it's been shown on Sundance, but I doubt it ever even showed for a > week at a theatre, the way storefront did in NYC and Chicago...tell if I'm > wrong, and it showed all over the left coast... Played at the Hollywood here... Don't think it was part of a festival. I think it ran a week. I can't speak for the rest of the coast. J. - -- ________________________________________________________ J A Brelin Capuchin ________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Aug 1999 12:06:17 -0600 From: ultraconformist@mail.weboffices.com Subject: Re: Once in every lifetime >PS Has anyone else ever played that 'Which one were you when you lived in >a student house?' game? My mates were all quite definite that I was Rik, >Mart was Vivian, Trev was the Cool Person and John "Why shouldn't I keep a >pigeon in my room?" Bristowe was the Hippy. Yes. Everyone said I was Neil. It pissed me off. I loathe prog music and I am actually quite prissy about clothes and grooming issues. I took offense at the idea that anyone would associate me even vaguely with someone who LOOKED like Neil, let alone had his musical taste. OTOH, I was a vegetarian on a budget and practically lived on lentils, which is probably where it came from. Love on ya, Susan 'Momus? That guy is sinister!' Marilyn Manson, as reported by Haig Bedrossian ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Aug 1999 12:10:50 -0600 From: ultraconformist@mail.weboffices.com Subject: Re: timelessness of escape characters >I've played TROUT MASK REPLICA. I have to be in the proper mood to subject >myself to TROUT MASK's skronk, and that mood may not come around for six >months, or even a couple of years. But I can listen to ZILLIONAIRE just >about any time. Same here. I listen to Adam Ant's "Friend or Foe" more often than I listen to "Eye", but that's because "Eye" demands a lot more from me. "Friend or Foe" is pretty much catchy, campy ear candy. I'd never say that it's -better-, it's just a less difficult listen and a lot better for things like doing loads of housework, tho in a way that makes -it- kind of a classic in a way too, since it's 16 years old and still sounds pretty catchy/spiffy to my ears. Apples and oranges. These two albums weren't after the same sort of prize. Love on ya, Susan 'Momus? That guy is sinister!' Marilyn Manson, as reported by Haig Bedrossian ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Aug 1999 11:18:34 -0700 (PDT) From: "Andrew D. Simchik" Subject: Kate Bush kicks ass > From: Vivien Lyon > complete conversations in MP quotes. But we never, > ever used quotations from the Holy Grail, as we > considered that the heighth of nerdiness. Huh. Anyway, That's correct. Grail-quoting is for losers, unless it's absolutely positively perfect for the occasion. > From: Eb > Citizen Kane is one of the few films I've ever seen which > totally gripped > me both as storytelling AND as razzle-dazzle film-making. > I think it > deserves every bit of its legendary status. Well, I think it does, too, but I expected the story itself to grip me a lot more than it did. Now there's an example of a type of greatness that *must* diminish over time, come to think of it -- the greatness of innovation. If a film influences a huge number of films that come after it, because of some radical innovation it's made...if you go back to watch the original after seeing all the films that copied its techniques, those techniques don't seem too original anymore. The greatness there depends on your historical knowledge that, say, Welles did it *first*. [Young Ones] > Are there only 12? Yep. Demolition, Oil, Boring, Bomb, Interesting, Flood, Bambi, Cash, Nasty, Time, Sick, and Summer Holiday. I can't figure out what gives with the six-episode season (see also Blackadder). UKers? What gives? > I'm > still trying to > figure out what purpose "Mike" serves, though -- he seems > like nothing but > excess baggage. No? He's there to quietly be much stranger than any of them, and to be the one who seems outwardly sane. It's hard to explain, but I can't see the household without him. > From: "Capitalism Blows" > maybe there should be > two different continuua: one for how much we respect > works of art, and > another for how much we like them. This starts to get at the problem, yes. The criteria by which we "respect" things -- not just art -- are very different from those by which we "like" them, yet we so frequently feel that we *must* like better that which we respect more. I respect Citizen Kane highly, but I like The Fisher King better. (Well, maybe that's unfair, because I also respect The Fisher King highly.) > i rarely listen to ABBEY ROAD, yet still consider it my > favorite album. > every time i *do* listen to it, i love it, I think this might be the key. Maybe you don't listen to or watch it often...but how do you feel about it when you do? Such-and-such a movie might be rarely screened nowadays, but when it is, how do people react to it? > i listen to DILATE more than any other ani album, by the > way (unless you > count THE PAST DIDN'T GO ANYWHERE). I'm still hooked on OUT OF RANGE, maybe because it was my first Ani album. > intense > folk-punk-rock s like drama -- drama seems inherently > heavier and more > "serious" and closer to greatness.> > > i wonder if we've been socialised to believe this? I'm certain of it. We also believe that depression springs from what is true and real, while happiness is from fleeting things. That's another of my silly generalizations, in case you couldn't tell, but it's why negative comments from strangers can depress someone more than positive comments from their friends can cheer them up... > Godfather's ass (a > movie I really love, but which I've only seen once). Is > that reasonable?> > > first off, i did say that i would *like* to make the > argument. i'm not > convinced i believe it myself. Noted. [snip] > but it does make some sense to me that, all things being > equal, if you'd > *rather* watch Alien than The Godfather, that you think > it's a better movie. But that doesn't follow, to my mind, partly because all things are rarely equal in the real world. On a desert island, if I had to pick one movie from those two, I'd have a tough time. But in real life, any number of factors, from the time available to the mood I'm in, will intrude. Actually, these are bad examples, because Alien and The Godfather are both tense films filled with action, suspense, and (to some extent) character. Maybe take Edward Scissorhands and The Godfather. I think the latter is the better film, but I'm more inclined to casually watch the former. > sense of "great" > we've been discussing, the sense that Eb has in mind?> > > you mean, does the world-at-large consider it great just > because you've seen > it dozens of times? no. but who gives a fuck? Well, critics do, or at least most of them seem to. And I do, if only because I find it interesting to pick apart that sense I have that some films are better than others, a sense that is qualitatively distinct from the sense I have that I enjoy some films more than others. > you? If it's lame at > first and becomes excellent, does that make it better > than excellent at > first and becomes lame?> > > well how long do they take to grow on you? robyn albums > usually take some > time to grow on me, but only a few days or weeks, > generally. I've had a Slowdive album for years and I only discovered how incredible it is in the past few months. > but, honestly, aren't those > albums that you > listen to a couple or more times a year *every year*, and > like *just as much > if not more* than you ever did better records, in > retrospect, than those > which you listened to a million times one summer but > never since? I don't know -- I tend to follow neither pattern. > to have, > does that mean they were *never* good?> > > it may well mean they were never *as* good as you at one > time, for whatever > reasons, believed. That smacks of revisionism -- I can't have enjoyed them as much as I thought I did. Unless the goodness is not in the record but in the listener, which is one conclusion we could draw from all this. > if those > people who love South > Park now don't still love it ten years from now, and > those people who will > have been exposed to it in the next ten years don't love > it either; can it > really be considered a great movie because at one point > in time a bunch of > people *did* love it? Hard to tell...in twenty years, will it suddenly become a cult favorite whose popularity keeps growing? When do we conclude it really sucked after all? And what causes people to love it at first? Delusion? Maybe something in society at the time makes it just the right response to the zeitgeist. Does art suck if it tries to answer society as it is at one point in time? > i dunno. i think the cream does rise to the top, over > time. show The Seven > Samurai to just about any person, from any culture, at > any period of time > since its release, and they're going to say it's great. > let just about any > person, from any culture, at any period of time since its > writing read War > And Peace, and they're going to say it's great. i'd say > that's a pretty > decent indicator. Assuming that's true, and I don't think it is. You yourself find Citizen Kane boring. Most film critics would put Kane up there with any Kurosawa film. Why don't you say it's great? Why can't I stand the Aeneid? I'm a person from a culture at a period of time. Is the Aeneid not great? Or do I just have no taste? > From: "D B" [I said] > I never want to listen to my Kate Bush albums anymore, > >but that's more because I've played them into the ground > than because I > >think > >they're lame. If they don't have the same impact on me > that they used to > >have, > >does that mean they were *never* good? > > Trust yourself now, on this one. They suck. Oh, please. Drew === Andrew D. Simchik, schnopia@yahoo.com _____________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Free instant messaging and more at http://messenger.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Aug 1999 13:31:56 -0600 From: ultraconformist@mail.weboffices.com Subject: Re: Blair witch (warning spoilers...) >recording events. Either way, you are removed one significant step >from the event itself . . . the camera takes on the role of a crutch, >a drug, and in an event like that depicted in the BWP, one >paradoxically serving as an anchor to a "sane" world. You would fucking LOVE "Repulsion". (My favorite living director. Roman Polanski kicks ass.) The camera takes on a very similar role in that film. Not as drug, per se, but as an (ultimately false) anchor to sanity and objectivity. I could say more about this but I'd like to wait and see how many people have actually seen it before I spoiler it any. Speaking of which, anyone seen a movie called "Following"? I saw the preview for it at Facets when I went to see "Storefront", it looked really intriguing. Love on ya, Susan 'Momus? That guy is sinister!' Marilyn Manson, as reported by Haig Bedrossian ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Aug 1999 11:49:23 -0700 From: Mark_Gloster@3com.com Subject: Re: August 23rd Music Robyn stressed its importance. I am pretty sure that August 23rd was the original release date for Moss Elyxir. It may bear other significance as well. - -Mgarkshkzfifflbee "Russ Reynolds" on 08/06/99 05:40:37 AM Please respond to "Russ Reynolds" Sent by: "Russ Reynolds" To: fegmaniax cc: (Mark Gloster/HQ/3Com) Subject: August 23rd Music So I was trying to remember the significance of August 23, as in "August 23rd Music." I don't recall what we came up with the last time this was brought up but I do remember thinking that whatever it was seemed a bit obscure or vague. Then I happened to find myself standing in front of a Rhino Records calendar this morning, glanced ahead to August 23rd and saw "Raymond Chandler, 1888" AHA! I thought to myself. Then I realized I was looking at July. So someone remind me: what is the significance of August 23rd again? - -rUss ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Aug 1999 15:00:28 -0400 (EDT) From: Bayard Subject: Re: August 23rd Music it is one of RH and Michele's anniversaries, but he did not go into detail about exactly what happened. It could be two things, or even more, just like April 29 1998 was my birthday, "great Robyn GAMH gig day", and "naked Russ in the Hotel day" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Aug 1999 15:06:17 EDT From: MARKEEFE@aol.com Subject: Re: the timelessness of quality (long) Just to throw in my quick two cents, I don't think that one's favorite albums can be measured by the number of times one has listened to said albums. Also, I don't think it should matter whether or not the albums are serious or fun. It should all be about how much these albums mean to you. I also think it's important to always make a clear distinction between what you consider your personal favorites and what you would rate as some of the "greatest albums ever made." Marillion's "Misplaced Childhood" is one of my all-time, top 5 favorite albums, but I wouldn't put it all that high on a list of the greatest albums ever made. I'd slip it into the lower half of the Top 100, just cuz I think it's a great album. But it's so completely lost on its own little anachronistic island that it'd be pretty hard to say that it's "important" (to anyone other than myself and maybe 10,000 other people on the planet). But that doesn't weigh in as a factor in how high up that album goes on my personal favorites list. On the other side of that coin, an arguably great album like "Sgt. Pepper's" wouldn't even make my top 100 favorites list (although I *do* like it . . . but not as much as I like maybe 5-7 other Beatles albums). But if I were to make a Top 100 greatest albums ever list, "Sgt. Pepper's" would have to be pretty high up there. So, put a "#1" in front of that Bangles album, or ABC, or Adam Ant!! Oh, and, btw, don't even get in the same room with me and say that Kate Bush's albums suck. "Hounds of Love" rules! :-) - ------Michael K. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Aug 1999 12:28:36 -0700 From: Mark_Gloster@3com.com Subject: pouring catchup on the list Re: Which one are you?: Same thing as Susan. People called me Neil and it pissed me off. I was probably more like him than any of the other YO's, including Susan, but its not a compliment to anybody to call them Neil. Kate Bush: I still have some respect for her, just don't listen to her. There was all of those self-absorbed vids she did that tended to drive me away, too. She has a little bit in common with the seventies acts whose lyrics are just a little to "heavy" and occluded for me to put in my ears. I still think she's got talent, and writes good songs when she's writing about something real. Genesis: I am considerably less embarassed about having spent much of my youth listening to this band than many others. I think they were good songwriters and really good musicians. They were more on the pop side of prog even early on, so it took me a while to like them. I also agree that they didn't go nuts with the "irritating synth sound du jour." The last thing I'd like to mention about them is that, like Crimson, they played as a unit, not a bunch of wanking soloists forced to stand on the same stage-> this serves the music more than it serves the egos of each. There are a lot of movies and directors and songwriters and musicians for whom I have great respect, but just never seem to be in a mood conducive to their enjoyment. I am learning over time to respect the things I like and feel less guilty for their pleasures. Super, thanks for asking, - -'arkg ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V8 #293 *******************************