From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V8 #276 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Wednesday, July 28 1999 Volume 08 : Number 276 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: Woodstock ["Capitalism Blows" ] Woodstock memories [DDerosa5@aol.com] RE: Woodstock ["Thomas, Ferris" ] Re: Woodstock memories [Christopher Gross ] Musicians against Lung Regeneration tour [Carole Reichstein ] Robyn and Steven, sitting in a tree, M-A-B-D-I-N-G [DDerosa5@aol.com] (no subject) [DDerosa5@aol.com] Re: Woodstock [Griffith Davies ] Re: Woodstock [ultraconformist@mail.weboffices.com] 31 July & 01 August (both 1999) [Griffith Davies ] Re: EJ's triangle [S Dwarf ] Robyn with Billy Bragg in DC ["Andrew D. Simchik" ] techie q's [ultraconformist@mail.weboffices.com] Star Wars: The OTHER Phantom Menace. [Capuchin ] Re: Which one's Pink? [Ken Ostrander ] Re: fegmaniax-digest V8 #267 [candl@journey.com] Re: fegmaniax-digest V8 #267 [candl@journey.com] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 28 Jul 1999 13:49:14 PDT From: "Capitalism Blows" Subject: Re: Woodstock this has got to be the funniest sentence in the history of the fegmaniax computer network! _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Jul 1999 16:50:07 EDT From: DDerosa5@aol.com Subject: Woodstock memories Shit, I would have rioted the moment James Taylor opened the show... but what I wanted to write about is the venue: LJ pointed out it wasn't MaxY's farm, but did everyone here realize it was an old Air Force base? I certainly did, because Griffiss AFB was the first place I ever got arrested, for civil disobedience, protesting the cruise missiles which were stationed there (and which, we pointed out, were also a good reason to stop with all the Star Wars nonsense). This was back in 85, I guess, and I got arrested with some original Woodstock types, mellow and cool if also ridiculous (including one granny who told me "I never feel as alive as when I'm being arrested for something I believe in"), and some of them a coven of witches who were casting spells--some of them had just come back from the big encampment at Greenham Common in UK, where they (air force) were actually testing microwave weapons on protesters to make people irritable and fuck with menstrual cycles and etc. etc. So, the fact that Woodstock 99tm was held at what I considered Home of The Man 15 years ago was hilarious, and that they trashed it...well, sure they did it for the wrong reasons, if they had reasons, but then again I too might have gone nuts trapped in all that barbed wire for four days. Then again, if JT hadn't set me off, Korn would've undoubtedly sent me into a genocidal rage (non-violently, of course). I guess if I had $150 to blow, I would've found another use for it, like having my eyeballs pierced, so disregard all of the above except the verbs. but...shit, I got arrested, and all we did was sit down and sing "We Shall Overcome." I had just learned the words that morning... dave ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Jul 1999 16:57:45 -0400 From: "Thomas, Ferris" Subject: RE: Woodstock First let me start by getting a big AMEN for Brother Quail. Not being an anthropologist or sociologist by any stretch (sociopath doesn't count in this case), but it would seem that this is pretty tightly isolated to the US, unfortunately. In an overly generalized statement, it does so truly suck that those in power (promoters) feel that we can't handle/won't buy anything New and Different. In the face of all the original content that there is out there in the world it seems that every single thing that springs forth from the brain stems of those in Marketing and Promotions is immediately caught up in the tides and eddies and begins a death spiral down the drain towards our cultural past, repeatedly drudging up the muck of days gone by (and it was pretty mucky if you think on it long enough). > OK -- So it was overhyped and over commercialized and really > expensive and > the accommodations were lacking. Wow, what a shock! Amen, Brother Quail. > If they really wanted to protest the commercialism > and the consumerism, they could have done it > with nonviolence and non-participation...If no one > buys tickets for these events, the Man will get a > stronger message. While I'm _in_no_way_ condoning violence, non-participation doesn't always cut it. If no one goes there's no money to be made and then shows get cancelled, bands dropped, and next year rolls around and The Man pulls the plug. I haven't got a problem with taking the man entirely out of the equation, though. When someone organizes something like this for the sake of doing it and not to make a buck (or piles and piles of bucks, as the case may be) there might be a chance at getting something close to the Utopian ideal we're all shooting (hoping---bad choice of words) for. I'm just not sure the American public is capable any more of peaceful gatherings of more than 100,000 people at a clip. > But they chose violence and riot, which only hurts things in the long run True, true. Buttheads abound speaking the evils of modern music. Rather than collectively extend a pile of stiff middle fingers to them probably a hundred jerks fly off the handle and do exactly what they were foretelling. Ech. In retrospect it wouldn't bother me greatly if this were the end of the Woodstock tradition. Then again, maybe I'm just getting too old. A few years ago I went to the Reading Festival. What a world away that was from it's slope-browed American cousin. The line up was probably a solid seven to eight hundred percent better than anything an American promoter has ever put together (but, in this country's defense, the indie/alternative scene has always been stronger in the UK). Just quickly looking at the website (http://www.meanfiddler.com/) for this year's fest it blows any thing American out of the water. The Charlatans, Chemical Brothers, Echo and the Bunnymen, Space, Gene, Apollo 440, Blur, Catatonia, Pavement, Beth Orton, Sebadoh, Sleater Kinney, Red Hot Chili Peppers, Offspring, Terrorvision, Sick of It all, Orgy, Cinerama, Elastica, Jon Spencer BE, Stereolab, the Fall, Guided By Voices, Bis, Luscious Jackson, Arab Strap. Oh, I should just chuck it in and move over. - -ferris... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Jul 1999 17:04:25 -0400 (EDT) From: Christopher Gross Subject: Re: Woodstock memories On Wed, 28 Jul 1999 DDerosa5@aol.com wrote: > but...shit, I got arrested, and all we did was sit down and sing "We Shall > Overcome." I had just learned the words that morning... Did you get arrested for trespassing or for messing up the lyrics? - --Chris ______________________________________________________________________ Christopher Gross On the Internet, nobody knows I'm a dog. chrisg@gwu.edu ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Jul 1999 14:03:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Carole Reichstein Subject: Musicians against Lung Regeneration tour I have to agree with Michael K. and Lobstie--there *did* seem to be an awful lot of smoking going on during the MABD tour--especially among the first two electronica/experimental music/speak & spell acts. What I found so funny was their unflappable ability to fiddle around w/keyboards and electronic equipment with a big ol' cigarette hanging out of their mouth. I kept looking at the big video screen to see if any ash dropped off on their equipment, but couldn't see if any did. That "Bjork" looking girl in IQU smoked as if her life depended on it. About the Sonic Boom guy: not only did I never see him smile, but he could use a few roast beef sandwiches to fatten him up. Heh. Maybe I should hire him to put on a gig here at the Tech bookstore..I bet some geeky/techie customers would dig it. Maybe not our cat, though. I smoke every once in a while..namely, when my sister is in town and we go out for drinks and I can steal a few from Karen. I've tried hanging a cigarette out of my mouth when I'm playing cards, but the acrid smoke just goes straight up my nostrils and it's all highly unpleasant. Is there a trick to this? Maybe musicians are just used to it. Hmmm. By the way..I thought all the bands were excellent, except for Sebadoh, which was just okay..not bad at all, but nothing to make me think, "wheee!" (tm). And yes, as Eddie said, Robyn "fucking owns Portland!" At the Seattle show, Robyn played well, but was a little less than enthused at the still unfilled room. But in Portland, the show was satisfyingly packed, and there's nothing I like better than seeing Robyn come on stage to a full house, and watch him peer out and survey the teeming crowd and smile contentedly. Ahh! I *do* like to see that man in a good mood! And as for what Mike Godwin said about Tim Keegan "sacrificing" his career to play with Robyn: very interesting commentary. I don't really see it as shunting aside his own career to play with Robyn--he probably just likes to! But yes, I do know what you mean. Why don't Homer--er, "The Departure Lounge"--play the West coast? Or anywhere in the US, for that matter? Or even just Tim? He has a small wealth of material to play..he's certainly talented and I don't see why he couldn't tour on his own. Maybe he's having an identity crisis. He shouldn't! ;) Okay, back to work now. All this smoking talk is making my lungs itch. Carole ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Jul 1999 14:13:01 -0700 From: "Jason R. Thornton" Subject: Re: Woodstock At 03:55 PM 7/28/99 -0400, The Great Quail wrote: >...But LJ paints me above as a >starry-eyed hippy, which is not entirely true -- I hate the Woodstock myth >almost as much as her. And here I thought you were rather fond of LJ. - --Go Go Jason Rock Concert Riot ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Jul 1999 17:32:18 EDT From: DDerosa5@aol.com Subject: Robyn and Steven, sitting in a tree, M-A-B-D-I-N-G For those (like me) that have a hard time betting to links from the list, I thought I'd post some of the interview with Robyn and Steeeeeeven. Mostly the second part, after we're done hearing about how corporations put out stupid music to dull our minds. Robyn says a few interesting things, and Steven seems pretty honest about RH. f'rinstance, SFGate: Steven, were you a Soft Boys fan? Drodz: I checked it out but I don't think I'll ever get into it. It's one of those kinds of bands I feel I should like; it's got all the elements I like. But there's some emotional content that's not there that I'm missing. Wow, what can that mean? sure, the misogyny and some other elements might put one off, but how can anyone hear "Insanely Jealous" and not hear emotional content? SFGate: Robyn, were you a fan of the Lips? Hitchcock: I went to see them in London actually and I enjoyed it. I could hear all the lyrics and that impressed me. SFGate: Their lyrics have a lot of vivid, unconventional imagery like yours. Hitchcock: I like those sorts of lyrics. It's good when lyrics can be unfettered. Really you're singing from the back of your mind and you don't really know what's going on, the same as you can't really control your dreams. The healthy psyche will always unleash a load of mystifying gibberish which it can then pick through later and wonder what it all means. See, Livia, he's talking to you! SFGate: Robyn, some people call you a surrealist. Would you concur? Hitchcock: I'm more of a surrealist than I am a basketball player. That much is true, but it's not conscious. I don't have a manifesto, it's just an inclination. I like putting things where they don't belong. What about the Globe of Frogs manifesto? Still one of my favorite, most direct pieces of writing... SFGate: I've seen a few critics compare the new "Soft Bulletin" CD to the Beach Boys' "Pet Sounds." Is there any connection aside from all the time spent in the studio? Drodz: I guess the Beach Boys connection is supposed to be a complement of some kind. It's a fine record. Brian Wilson is a great songwriter. But I don't really connect the two. It's gotten to the point where if you have more than four chords in a song or more than one guy sings a harmony all of a sudden it's the Beach Boys. SFGate: Well, like "Pet Sounds," "The Soft Bulletin" is getting a lot of attention it seems. Drodz: I really think if "The Soft Bulletin" had come out three or four years ago, I don't think people would have been interested in it at all. In the last few years with the grunge fallout and even the alternative rock fallout that seems to be happening now, it seems to be working to our advantage where you don't feel like you have to put in a bunch of flangey, distorted guitars. ... It doesn't have to be distorted guitars and it doesn't have to rock. It can be about love. SFGate: So, what's Robyn like to hang out with? Drodz: He can be a bit whingy, a little whiny, but at the end of the day after he's done his set and he's having a glass of wine and a cigarette, he's one of the funniest people I've ever met. Hmm, the cigarette seems to have gained in stature. So he's not funny till he gets that cigarette? and I wondered where my sense of humor went two years ago... SFGate: Robyn, your new one, "Jewels for Sophia," sounds pretty upbeat. Hitchcock: I think it is a confident sounding record. It's a lot less somber than my last ten albums or so. In some ways it reminds me of the late Soft Boys -- less intense and unhappy. SFGate: Does that reflect your mindset? Hitchcock: I hope so. It's 20 years on and I'm not a tortured young guy anymore. I'm not just some cozy uncle tapping cigar ash over his grandchildren, but I'm personally doing pretty well. I'm definitely trying to celebrate things rather than complain about them. SFGate: It sounds like you weren't always happy with your music. Hitchcock: There was a point about ten years ago where I realized my stuff had almost become a parody of itself -- around the time of "Globe of Frogs" or something. But maybe the truth was I really didn't have something to write about. SFGate: Who is Sophia? Hitchcock: Sophia is somebody I never met. She was a very beautiful woman. I've seen photographs of her. She was killed by the Nazis in WWII along with her husband. The song is basically an acknowledgement, saying hello to somebody even though they're gone. In a way it's trying to console somebody who can never be consoled, who would have died in complete wretchedness and had a completely unforgivable end. So, it's basically a sequel to NMH's "Holland, 1945." Or, perhaps, from the same non-shadenfreude frame of mind. Wonder how Robyn got her diary? SFGate: In the manifesto for "Jewels for Sophia," you talk about love being life's big redemption. What exactly did you mean by that? Hitchcock: You look around, and you look at what people are doing to each other and the planet and you think, is there anything to justify these hairless apes in their endless rape of their environment? While they parade their gods up and down, they slaughter each other. I don't believe in any god and I'm not religious but I still feel grateful for something. I have a sense it's a miracle we exist at all and it's a miracle you exist at the same time as the people you love and that kind of thing. SFGate: So, who on the tour causes the most brain degeneration? Drodz: Robyn. He's the one who really blows people's minds, man. Sometimes he'll do this stream-of-consciousness thing between songs, and it's hilarious. He's very disarming, and that's a good thing. All agreed? OK, everyone disarm, and we can put this whole Columbine thing behind us. For those who need to be dead before we get their cold fingers off the trigger, please line up over there by that pitted cinderblock wall. dave ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Jul 1999 17:37:26 EDT From: DDerosa5@aol.com Subject: (no subject) Russ reported: When we got to the car we tuned the radio to the frequency the show was being broadcast on and it sounded so much better...like actual music. Cool! This is what I was curious about--how far did the signal go? You listened to it all the way home? It sounds like the FCC has stopped harassing small enough microbroadcasters...now we just gotta make some room on crowded wanvelengths like in Chicago... dave ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Jul 1999 14:40:56 -0700 (PDT) From: Griffith Davies Subject: Re: Woodstock Christopher Gross Wrote: >"It's been a bad week for all things Woodstock. First >the riots, and now this: Rydwyn Davies, a 21-year-old >actor portraying Sir Henry Greene in an Elizabethan >drama called Thomas of Woodstock, got himself skewered >during a sword fight when he failed to step out of >the way of his opponent's thrust. Although the blade >was rounded and dull, it still punched a two-inch >hole in Davies, who managed to walk offstage and was >driven to a nearby hospital where he was treated and >released.... I claim no relation, although I feel this has already happened. griffith _____________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Free instant messaging and more at http://messenger.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Jul 1999 16:49:39 -0600 From: ultraconformist@mail.weboffices.com Subject: Re: Woodstock >But at the end of the day, I do not think it gives any excuse for a bunch >of assholes to destroy what is not theirs and suddenly create a threatening >environment. No one made them buy a ticket, and if they thought conditions >would be much better, they were pretty naive. (Although if you want to see I have to agree with this. I mean, how many of these things have you been to, if you don't expect at least some of that? Things like 6 dollar hotdogs are pretty standard. And really, look at the thing- it's neither more nor less than a huge corporate rock festival. If you expected to be treated as something other than cattle, your expectations were notched a bit high. Don't go. Don't buy tickets. Write a bunch of letters and be a pest. That last may seem wanker-y, but it was all the letters written in to complain to newspapers and music magazines and the tour organizers that got the Fleadh changed. (I can only speak for Chicago- I don't know what their policies were in other cities, if this was a nationwide problem with the Fleadh, or what, but I think the point still holds) Last year, it was deadly hot, and you couldn't bring your own water in. People were dehydrating and fainting if they couldn't afford to spend a small fortune on the bottled water. A LOT of people. These people did not suffer silently- they bitched all over the place. This year the policy changed and you were allowed to bring water in. If those people hadn't complained, then nothing would have changed. If they'd decided to riot instead, well, probably there just wouldn't be Fleadh in Chicago. >Additionally, though I can sympathize with the *protesters* -- especially >given the fact that they were expecting a huge supergroup to end the show, >didn't get it, and then the Rave was cancelled on top of that! I've got some sympathy for the outrage, a lot actually. Just not for the way they went about expressing it. Love on ya, Susan 'Momus? That guy is sinister!' Marilyn Manson, as reported by Haig Bedrossian ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Jul 1999 14:54:13 -0700 (PDT) From: Griffith Davies Subject: 31 July & 01 August (both 1999) Well, here is a loose itinerary of Robyn's this weekend: 07/31/99 Noon-2:00pm PST Robyn is guesting on KCRW's "Weekend Becomes Eclectic". For those of you outside the L.A. area, you can listen trough the internet at www.kcrw.org. By the way, this show is being broadcast live from a Starbucks somewhere on Melrose Avenue in Hollywood. 07/31/99 8:00p.m.-??? Grant Lee Philips is performing at Largo (323-852-1073, 432 N Fairfax Ave, Hollywood). From an earlier post to this list, it seems Robyn (and Tim Keegan) will be sitting in with Grant for some of the show. 08/01 3:00pm-??? Instore performance at Rhino Records (310-474-8685) located at 1720 Westwood Boulevard in Westwood (of all places). 08/01 8:00pm-??? Performing sometime in the night at The Palace in Hollywood as part of the MABD tour. I think tickets are still available at this fairly small place. (R.E.M. did a show with Human League at The Palace in the early 80's). griffith ps - I'm taping the KCRW thing, and will hopefully be at the instore (with a camera). _____________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Free instant messaging and more at http://messenger.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Jul 1999 15:03:01 -0700 (PDT) From: S Dwarf Subject: Re: EJ's triangle Livia wrote: > yeah, but what does kfjc stand for? king fucker > jacques crimson aka villeneuve, perhaps? K (it's west of the missisippi) Foothill Junior College. _____________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Free instant messaging and more at http://messenger.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Jul 1999 18:37:22 -0400 From: "Andrew D. Simchik" Subject: Robyn with Billy Bragg in DC >From: Christopher Gross [I said:] >> I can't help you "acquire" any, but fall '96 was actually when I saw my very >> *first* Robyn Hitchcock show, and I fell in love all over again. It was the >> 9:30 Club in Washington, DC. > >That was my first Robyn show, too! And while I had a few of his CDs >already, this show really confirmed and deepened my fandom. Seeing him >live and up close was an amazingly intense experience. Agreed. It was splendid. Do you remember that moment during "You and Oblivion" when he sort of planted his feet and glared out over the audience ("that's when the death train got your ma")? I had a chilling little epiphany there when I realized I'd been essentially bopping around to this really quite intense song whose lyrics I'd been only vaguely aware of at that point. I felt like such an asshole for...well, moving, really. >However, his >tourmate Billy Bragg annoyed me a little. Socialist sermons, fine, >whatever. But to come as a guest to a foreign country, then get up >onstage and mock that country's national sports, and even ridicule the >name of the local soccer team, seemed rather rude to me.... Oh, that didn't bother me in the slightest, but then I think all national sports everywhere deserve to be mocked, and most particularly ours. I quite liked Billy's set, even though I almost never listen to him deliberately, and I was sorry to have to leave in the middle of it to catch the last train out of the city. Wish I'd been seriously reading the list at that time, so I could have met some of the fegmaniax...don't suppose any of you live in Rochester, NY? Drew - -- Andrew D. Simchik, wyrd@rochester.rr.com http://home.rochester.rr.com/wyrd/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Jul 1999 17:52:29 -0600 From: ultraconformist@mail.weboffices.com Subject: techie q's OK, I give up. I can't figure this out by myself. We had DSL installed a few days ago. It works fine. With the exception of my machine. For some reason, even though I am plugged into the proper slot on the router, and all the TCP/IP settings are okee-dokee.......it dunna work. I can't figure out why it dunna work. I checked for the usual "doh!" mistakes (no loose connections, everything is plugged in where it oughta be, no typos in the numbers), and I'm stumped. My ISP doesn't seem to have anyone who knows much about Macs and I can't find much useful on the Apple Support page. Thought one of the studly mac types might be able to help. I'm running OS 8 on a PowerMac 7600, just so's you know. Is there something wobbly about the built-in ethernet? Are there drivers I'm missing here? HEEEEELP! Love on ya, Susan 'Momus? That guy is sinister!' Marilyn Manson, as reported by Haig Bedrossian ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Jul 1999 16:18:11 -0700 (PDT) From: Capuchin Subject: Star Wars: The OTHER Phantom Menace. On Wed, 28 Jul 1999 DDerosa5@aol.com wrote: > protesting the cruise missiles which were stationed there (and which, > we pointed out, were also a good reason to stop with all the Star Wars > nonsense). Speaking of Star Wars, did you all see that they want it back? http://cnn.com/SPECIALS/cold.war/episodes/22/then.now/ Looks like the dems want it this time. Fucking party politics. Republicans are evil and want SDI to stop commies. Democrats are nice and want SDI to stop terrorists. Bullshit. J. - -- ________________________________________________________ J A Brelin Capuchin ________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Jul 1999 11:31:20 -0400 From: Ken Ostrander Subject: Re: Which one's Pink? >> Well, I wasn't kidding. Please, Susan, let us know the answer!! :-) >>From your subject line, I'm taking it that you think it's a pink triangle? > >It's a triangle somewhat south of cleavage ;) i thought of this last night. has anyone seen the sex in the city where kim cattrail gets hers shaved by her personal trainer in the shape of a thunderbolt? ken "shazam!" the kenster ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 26 Jul 1999 19:47:14 -0400 From: candl@journey.com Subject: Re: fegmaniax-digest V8 #267 >A pair of forgettable hidden tracks pulls the batting >average down even further. Huh? That reviewer must have absolutely _no_ grasp of the bicycle, what-so-ever!! Shine on Sophia, Chas - --- "Some people without brains do an awful lot of talking, don't they!" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Jul 1999 16:07:51 -0400 From: candl@journey.com Subject: Re: fegmaniax-digest V8 #267 HI y'all Gotta say, i love the new LP. I think the Great Quail and I must be soul-brothers or something, as his comments on the music, the artwork and how Robyn's music touches, reflects and influences his world read to a T. Last album that did that for me was Eye. Funny that JfS has been compared to Eye here on the list! Anyway, people, something occured to me last night while walking thru local Mill Pond park under the Full Moon, with "Hoot" running thru my head, so I ask you: has anyone else noticed the heavy "Lunar influence" of JfS? A few examples: Mexican God - this wouldn't happen to be refering to Solar deities, would it? "Roasting your people"...."Moon in a cup" etc: all the negatives associated with the "solar"? Down with the Solar, up with the Lunar! Cheese Alarm - well, the Moon is made of Cheese, isnt it? ;) "One half waxes, the other half wanes/ Nixon sent plumbers to stop up the drains" (didn't he make a phone call to the moon? "Hello there Neil and Buzz.....") Nasa Clapping - Obvious. Now it's more than a spiritual/political thing, it's commercial as well. Hoot - I can see a Halloween picture with the silhouette of an owl before the Full Moon - "you've got to find your way around me" (the Moon around the Earth..?). Perhaps Mr. Tongs is gravity, or the instruments that the astronauts used to collect their samples? "Inch by frozen inch" in orbit around our world.... Also, the album was released on the 30th anniversary of the first manned landing on the Moon. So go figure.... As for the production aspect, I didn't like the sound when i first listened to it on my pitiful stereo ( used to the bootlegs I guess). Much better on my brother's surround-sound JVC - I think I had something akin to a religious experience that night. Of course with all those vitamins I had taken, anything was possible :) but give it a listen in the car or with headphones or on a really good stereo. It's really brilliantly done. Shine on Sophia! Chas - --- "Mirrors should reflect a little before throwing back images." - Jean Cocteau ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V8 #276 *******************************