From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V8 #187 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Saturday, May 22 1999 Volume 08 : Number 187 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: (was 100% S-K, now 100% pronunciation) [Ken Ostrander ] Re: Darth Trek [Aaron Mandel ] Re: (was 100% S-K, now 100% pronunciation) [MARKEEFE@aol.com] Judas Kiss [Tom Clark ] gig dates [Michael Hooker ] Re: Judas Kiss [lj lindhurst ] Re: Aussie dates [Danielle ] "Hate leads to marketing..." [Natalie Jacobs ] Re: (was 100% S-K, now 100% pronunciation) ["Livia" ] Re: (was 100% S-K, now 100% pronunciation) [Eric Loehr ] best pro-Phantom Menace subject line on Usenet [Eb ] Re: gig dates [four episode lesbian ] fifty-one fegs on the northern line.... [Bayard ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 14:28:42 -0400 From: Ken Ostrander Subject: Re: (was 100% S-K, now 100% pronunciation) >> What Joel says is all well and true, but I'm with Eddie on the correct >> pronuciation; if it's spelled Sleater, it oughta be pronounced "slayter". > >So does that mean we should start calling John, Paul, George, and Ringo >the Baytles? well, that's how they pronounced it. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 14:52:59 -0400 From: "Chaney, Dolph L" Subject: RE: Indie, schmindie I'd be hard pressed to imagine gNat finding most any music "threatening." After all, she has Beefheart material -- on video! AND she had the first Throwing Muses album BEFORE Ryko re-issued it. Either Kristin Hersh or Don Van Vliet could (should?) bust Malkmus any ol' day. 8-) Actually, I liked large chunks of Crooked Rain & Wowee Zowee, and would defend Beck to anyone, mainly on the strength of One Foot In The Grave and (to a lesser degree) Mutations. Both excellent records anyway, their Beck-y Goodness is enhanced because both were basically done very quickly as larks, passing the time between "real" albums. Plus One Foot came out on K Records, and therefore is linked with "I Something You" and the fabulous Lois! (le sighhhhh...) Dolph concert of the year: Built To Spill / The Delusions, last Friday night (5/14), The Point, Atlanta ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 14:51:04 -0400 (EDT) From: Aaron Mandel Subject: Re: Darth Trek On Fri, 21 May 1999, Capuchin wrote: potential spoilers for Star Wars below... > Only the characters I know and like get my sympathy. Right, and this movie depended heavily on your already knowing and liking some of the characters. > I'm a bit upset that we've yet to see a female jedi knight. We've apparently seen three, in the background of the council scenes. > Well, seeing that Star Wars is essentially a story about one character > and the incidental impact on the rest of the galaxy (episodes four > through six concern themselves entirely with the redemption of Annakin > Skywalker... and one through three seem to be about his fall from > grace), the kid scenes were appropriate. Yeah, I liked Anakin. The problem was Jar-Jar Binks, an ostensibly adult character who acted like one of the kids from Full House. I can't imagine what he was doing in the movie except to appeal to kids, a function that could have been fulfilled less awfully. aaron ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 15:05:09 EDT From: MARKEEFE@aol.com Subject: Re: (was 100% S-K, now 100% pronunciation) In a message dated 5/21/99 7:57:08 AM Pacific Daylight Time, loehr@javanet.com writes: << What Joel says is all well and true, but I'm with Eddie on the correct pronuciation; if it's spelled Sleater, it oughta be pronounced "slayter". >> Why would that be? There are far more words with "eat" in them that are pronounced as "eet" rather than "ate." Eat, meat, wheat, beat. And then there other words with different consonants after the vowel set: freak, beak, streak, leak, weak, mean, meal, mead, bead, beam, cream, dream, scream, etc. I think examples of the other pronounciation (long 'a' sound) are much fewer. There's: great, break, steak . . . um, I can't think of any others off hand, although I'm sure there are least a few more. On th other hand, I'd bet there are still many others in the "pronounced 'ee' " category. If they wanted to pronounce it "slayter," they shoulda spelled it "Slater" or "Slayter." Since it's spelled "Sleater," it oughtta be pronounced "Sleeter." Some of you Fegs need to find something better to rebel against with righteous indignation. I need to find something else to be nitpicky about now :-) - ------Michael K. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 13:20:06 -0700 From: Tom Clark Subject: Judas Kiss So I saw "Judas Kiss" on Cinemax last night. I can't say it was worth sitting through 98 minutes just to hear Robyn doing "Judas Sings (Jesus and Me)" over the closing credits, but it was an OK flick. Amazingly, it's biggest problem is it's pair of big name actors - Emma Thompson and Alan Rickman. The story is set in New Orleans and these two English actors try to deliver the Raymond Chandler dialog with these horrendous cajun accents. It's also remarkable to note that nobody else in the entire film sounds like they're even from the south, much less Louisiana. Eddie - send me your address so I can mail you the tape. - -t "auditioning for a guest spot on Siskel & Ebert" c ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 14:33:02 -0400 From: Michael Hooker Subject: gig dates hi, regarding robyn in NYC at tramps in june, the ticketmaster web site only lists the tuesday gig, and says " the flaming lips with special guests". does this mean robyn is not headlining? who are the flaming lips? is there a 6-22 gig? thanks, Mike Hooker ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 16:43:45 -0400 From: lj lindhurst Subject: Re: Judas Kiss >So I saw "Judas Kiss" on Cinemax last night. I can't say it was worth >sitting through 98 minutes just to hear Robyn doing "Judas Sings (Jesus >and Me)" over the closing credits, but it was an OK flick. Amazingly, >it's biggest problem is it's pair of big name actors - Emma Thompson and >Alan Rickman. The story is set in New Orleans and these two English >actors try to deliver the Raymond Chandler dialog with these horrendous >cajun accents. It's also remarkable to note that nobody else in the >entire film sounds like they're even from the south, much less Louisiana. Oddly, TGQ and I saw a play here in NY called "Judas Kiss" and it was all about Oscar Wilde. Liam Neeson played Oscar Wilde. No one had a cajun accent. I just wanted to contribute something, anything. +++ +++++ ++ +++ ++++++++ +++++ ++ LJ Lindhurst White Rabbit Graphic Design http://www.w-rabbit.com ++ +++ +++ ++ +++ ++++++ + + + + + + "Let's start a fire Let's have a riot! Yeah it's awful" --Courtney Love ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 15:08:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Danielle Subject: Re: Aussie dates > James (yay Roger Twose!!!*) > > *for Natalie's benefit - Twose & Cairns put on 153 runs > for the 5th wicket > to help the Black Caps beat the Aussies at the World Cup > last night. 149 runs, I believe? A fucking glorious match, any way you slice it. :) Danielle, back in (lovely, wonderful, beautiful, fantastic, glorious) New Zealand for a holiday and eating, drinking, breathing, and sleeping cricket while she can _____________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Free instant messaging and more at http://messenger.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 18:19:27 -0400 (EDT) From: Natalie Jacobs Subject: "Hate leads to marketing..." >*for Natalie's benefit - Twose & Cairns put on 153 runs for the 5th >wicket >to help the Black Caps beat the Aussies at the World Cup last night. Huh? Why my benefit? I usually pronounce "Sleater-Kinney" as "Throwing Muses" or else "Damn, why does everyone like this record so much?" But I've been down that lonely, dusty road before. Jeme, I hope that on your trip east you might be able to stop in my fair city. I suppose it might be somewhat out of your way. But Ann Arbor does await you with open arms, unless you persist in calling Babylon 5 "dumb." (IMO, seasons 2-4 of B5 are some of the best stuff I've ever seen on television - not the best sci-fi, the best *period.* The problem is that the show is so hard to get into - since it's an ongoing story - that people who haven't watched it from the start can't make head or tails of it.) I'm hoping to see Star Wars this weekend. Dunno how bad the crowds are. Maybe I'll just use Hunter S. Thompson's method of pushing through a crowd - - "Excuse me, I'm going to throw up..." - - Darth Gnat ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 16:33:31 +0000 From: "Livia" Subject: Re: (was 100% S-K, now 100% pronunciation) Eric Loehr wrote: > > > > > (like if "sleet" were a verb and the weather could be described > > > as "sleet," "sleeter" and "sleetist.")> > > > > > > this is its common pronunciation, yes. but it bugs hell out of > > > me. if they (not the band so much, as whosoever named the > > > street) wanted it to sound like "sleeter" why in fuck couldn't > > > they have spelt it like "sleeter"? i pronounce it "slayter", > > > and, while this does tend to draw righteously indignant scowls, > > > i strongly believe that when the motherfucking judgement comes, > > > i'll be able to stand up and say, "i pronounced the 'sleater' > > > in 'sleater-kinney' like 'slayter', even knowing it tended to > > > draw righteously indignant scowls. please admit me to heaven > > > now." > > > > Well, you're talking about the English language here. There are > > many different pronunciations of the different groups of words. > > The way they spell "sleater" looks cooler and it does work. Look > > at the word "eat.". > > What Joel says is all well and true, but I'm with Eddie on the > correct pronuciation; if it's spelled Sleater, it oughta be > pronounced "slayter". i think it ought to be spelled sleighter and pronounced slighter. unless you're a latin/greek geek, in which case slaeter is the way to go. - -~=*>> lyv ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 18:00:05 -0700 From: Mark_Gloster@3com.com Subject: Re: Darth Trek Darth Brelin gasped: >> Thought it was really enjoyable to watch. Really thought Darth >> Maule was cool, but we didn't get to know him very well. Some >> significant flaws. It was hard to feel emotional attachments to >> zillions of those computer-generated characters (in _Bugs Life_ it >> was much easier) >I don't know that there was any need at all to sympathize with the CG >characters in this movie. The focus was elsewhere. They were a diversion >and rightly so. Not a big deal there. I didn't feel sorry for the >smashed up snowspeeders at the beginning of Empire Strikes Back, either. >Only the characters I know and like get my sympathy. The occassional >ewok earned some sympathy in Return of the Jedi, but I didn't >automatically grant them status. And their battle was much more >interesting to watch anyway. I guess I kinda think that there are many conditions when you should empathize a little when a lot of time is devoted to a scene. >> Spielberg can't direct more than 1 strong >> female in a movie. >Yeah, phew... it's a good thing Spielberg wasn't directing! >Sorry... just pickinatcha. Lucas, man. Lucas. Got it. Sorry. Please refer to previous posts about my cranial contents and subtract for additional age. >I personally thought Queen Amidala (or whatever) and Shmi Skywalker were >both really strong female roles. I'm a bit upset that we've yet to see a >female jedi knight. (Damn those jedi kicked ass! They were the whole >reason I wanted to see the movie, by the way... to get an idea of what a >world of jedi would be like... it was NEAT! Golly, I'm a dork.) Those jedi were a whole lot like Michael W. on the rampage. Good thing you were nice to Bayard. I really hate to say this, but from where I stand, I can't really tease you about being a dork. The queen was really cool. >> Think he should ease off on the kid scenes. >Well, seeing that Star Wars is essentially a story about one character and >the incidental impact on the rest of the galaxy (episodes four through six >concern themselves entirely with the redemption of Annakin Skywalker... >and one through three seem to be about his fall from grace), the kid >scenes were appropriate. I don't think his lines were well written... at >least not the ones in the action scenes. He was awesome in the pod race, >though. Little hands working with preternatural understanding and >deliberation. Yea. I really do get irritated by heartmelting scenes in movies that aren't supposed to do that. Pod race was great (it would have been distracting to have felt for the characters in that.) Annakin's apparent loss of intelligence later in the movie bugged me too. >> Kinda surprised how poorly they developed most of the characters. >Really? Man, I could go on forever about the great and subtle character >development. Particularly of the Jedi. There are scenes where the two >main fellers act and react differently in the same situation that belie >the differences in the characters that make them rich and deep. The comic >book characters were there, of course... but they've been there from the >first movie on. Ummm. Waaaay too subtle for me. I bow to the highness of your subtlety detection circuits. >Which brings me to the MOST IMPORTANT PART (for me anyway) of this film. >It is stylistically consistent with the other Star Wars films... from the >transition cuts from scene to scene (using corny fading and sweep lines) >to the old 1950s cameras used to shoot many of the scenes that give the >weird depth and warmth found in the first film. Yes. That works wonderfully well. >You're my friend, Mark. I like you. Thank you. Everyone should know that Jeme is one of my friends and favorite people. Turns out he's adork too! >> Red Dwarf >> Bab 5 >> Battlestar Gallactica >> Blake's 7, Space 1999, and Space Cops >Whatever. I guess I've seen a few episodes of Battlestar Galactica (and >Galactica 1980 or whatever that show was... ugh) but none of those shows >mean anything to me. I guess I'd say they're all dumb across the board. I'm talking 1978. It was kinda cool. They were sued successfully by Lucas's lawyers for ripping off their entire idea from Star Wars. The crime was that they did a pretty good job of it. They then made it for a development level below that of the target audience for teletubbies. Red Dwarf is great. Bab 5 was really good until the last 1.5- 2 years. >> You can play the home game of my Darth and Dorks games. They >> are freeware. >What? They're not open source? And I thought you were cool. Sorry. I did provide the source code. But, as usual, it works better with a Mac than with inferior operating systems. >> By the way, I had a great time with Bayard. He's surged back >> into the lead as possibly nicest feg in my book (Michael W >> lost a point for the Caddyshack debacle) but it's a close >> race. We were not able to get Bayard drunk enough to say >> anything bad about anybody or anything this time, however. >Maybe it's me and my grumpy nature, but Bayard said three or four mean >things while he was here (and none of them were about ME!). (What's the >largest number of consecutive punctuation marks that is grammatically >correct?) We had a pretty darned good time while he was here, though, I >must say. I hope he didn't get too annoyed with the fact that I didn't >take any time off of work to be with him. I felt REALLY bad. You grumpy?!? How can this be? At least you're never crabby. "I am _NOT_ crabby!" - -J.A. Brelin >> Bayard assures me that I'll just love Quail and lj. So >> I guess I'll be really tired after they leave. I wonder if >> they're bringing that Allen (who the hell is Allen) guy too. >You know, Bayard assures me that I'll just love Quail and LJ, too! Hmm... >I'm glad I'm going to see them before Mark does. That would just be too >much lovin' for me. I guess the four of us are going to be absolutely >exhausted at the end of that week. Well, you know... if any of these >things are working out the way... oh, forget it. Wheee. >> I am enjoying well-deserved time off. You should too. >I'm getting some time off, too! YES! SO! HERE GOES!.... I recommend that anyone who has the ability to, should stand in line to meet Jeme, Zheme, Gem, Jammies, or Jay Meeeee. He is capable of being a great audience, a great entertainer, so much more, and all at once. You'll all be amazed at just what a great guy he is. Okay, maybe not some of you. Don't forget cranberry juice. Oh. He really doesn't look like Jabba the Hutt's cousin Larry. I think the photo that we saw of him was a little on the cruel side. Happies to everyone. - -sharkboy ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 21:58:57 -0400 (EDT) From: Ross Overbury Subject: Re: (was 100% S-K, now 100% pronunciation) 1) Re: Sleater-Kinney > > > > > > > (like if "sleet" were a verb and the weather could be described > > > > as "sleet," "sleeter" and "sleetist.")> Near as I can make it this would have been pronounced "slay-aw-tair keen-ay" by Chaucer. Chaucer ROCKS! 2) I'll take Jor-Jor over Jar-Jar any day. Jor-jor ROCKS! 3) Ask Bayard for some British Commonwealth Kit Kats. Commonwealth Kit-Kats ROCK! - -- Darth-stick ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 21:13:05 PDT From: "Ariel Green" Subject: Re: gig dates The Flaming Lips were a 1-hit wonder (blunder?) who did a song called "She Don't Use Jelly" several years ago... Personally, I liked the song, although the singer isn't that good.. :) a _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 May 1999 00:45:41 -0400 (EDT) From: Eric Loehr Subject: Re: (was 100% S-K, now 100% pronunciation) On Fri, 21 May 1999 MARKEEFE@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 5/21/99 7:57:08 AM Pacific Daylight Time, > loehr@javanet.com writes: > > << What Joel says is all well and true, but I'm with Eddie on the correct > pronuciation; if it's spelled Sleater, it oughta be pronounced "slayter". >> > > Why would that be? There are far more words with "eat" in them that are > pronounced as "eet" rather than "ate." Eat, meat, wheat, beat. And then > there other words with different consonants after the vowel set: freak, beak, > streak, leak, weak, mean, meal, mead, bead, beam, cream, dream, scream, etc. > I think examples of the other pronounciation (long 'a' sound) are much fewer. > There's: great, break, steak . . . um, I can't think of any others off hand, > although I'm sure there are least a few more. On th other hand, I'd bet > there are still many others in the "pronounced 'ee' " category. If they > wanted to pronounce it "slayter," they shoulda spelled it "Slater" or > "Slayter." Since it's spelled "Sleater," it oughtta be pronounced "Sleeter." > Some of you Fegs need to find something better to rebel against with > righteous indignation. I need to find something else to be nitpicky about > now :-) > > ------Michael K. > DEAR SIRS; I'D LIKE TO COMPLAIN (righteously & JamesDignantly) ABOUT THE ABOVE COMPLAINT COMPLAINING ABOUT OUR COMPLAINT. Oh, never mind -- Joel and Michael have argued convincingly against Eddie's and my assertion about the pronunciation of Sleater, providing numerous examples to prove us wrong. In my defense (CB can speak quite eloquently for himself) I can only say that it just *feels* like it should be pronounced "slayter" -- there was never any doubt in my mind from the first time that I saw the name. Just because I may be wrong, however doesn't mean that you can convince me. ;-} What? you expect logic? Never! E (Mr. Throatwarblermangrove) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 21:49:07 -0800 From: Eb Subject: Re: lips Ariel: >The Flaming Lips were a 1-hit wonder (blunder?) who did a song called "She >Don't Use Jelly" several years ago... Personally, I liked the song, >although the singer isn't that good.. :) Aww, come on. The Flaming Lips have a lengthy (and quite inspired) catalog that began years before "She Don't Use Jelly." I've been a fan since about 1986 myself, when I discovered "Hear It Is" amongst a lot of other underground, neo-psychedelic bands/albums which interested me at the time. Coincidentally, I just heard the band's upcoming disc ("The Soft Bulletin") this morning, and it's damn good. Probably the third or fourth best release I've heard this year. It'll surprise some Lips fans because it has only one track which comes even CLOSE to being "rocking," but the band's majestic stuff can be just gorgeous. Actually, the new album is much more in the vein of the last Mercury Rev disc (and of course, the leader of Mercury Rev was a short-lived member of the Lips around the turn of the decade, and Lips producer Dave Fridmann is also a part-time member of Rev). Anyway...I give a big thumbs-up to the Flaming Lips. GREAT live band, too. I'd say my own favorites of the bands' albums are "In a Priest-Driven Ambulance" and "Transmissions From the Satellite Heart" (the album with "She Don't Use Jelly"). Meanwhile, "Zaireeka" is such a conceptually amazing feat that it sorta defies being measured against the other Lips records. The new one ranks up there, as well. Eb, phantom menace at large PS No, my computer problems haven't been resolved yet, but I kicked my online software back into much-hobbled action, just because. Not that I'd have the guts to open Netscape.... ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 23:26:07 -0800 From: Eb Subject: best pro-Phantom Menace subject line on Usenet "Phontom Menace was excellant-unless your brain dead." Eb PS I haven't seen the film (no immediate plans to do so, either), but I did learn one interesting thing from reading newsgroup discussions: there's a scene in a junkyard (with a character named Watto or something?), where you see one of the 2001 pods amongst the refuse. Nifty. :) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 May 1999 11:47:37 -0400 From: four episode lesbian Subject: Re: gig dates MC 900 Ft Michael Hooker rapped: > regarding robyn in NYC at tramps in june, the ticketmaster web site only >lists the tuesday gig, and says " the flaming lips with special guests". >does this mean robyn is not headlining? who are the flaming lips? is there >a 6-22 gig? tramps itself is only listing the tuesday gig as well, so i'd guess that either the wednesday show is fictitious or an option, if the tuesday one sells out. robyn is not headlining. assuming this is one of those flaming lips revuew shows, it's more of a mini-festival where each act -- including the lips -- will only get 45 minutes to a hour for their show. an article about that was posted at allstar in april. since the april news doesn't seem to have made the transition to the new allstar site at cdnow, here it is again: Flaming Lips Plan Revue With Special Guests Operating on the premise, "If you can't do it in 40 minutes, it isn't worth doing," the Flaming Lips have made tentative plans to launch a star-studded, multi-band club tour this summer. Tentatively dubbed the Flaming Lips Revue and featuring four or five acts performing abbreviated sets, the idea was inspired by lead singer Wayne Coyne's loathing for marathon Lollapalooza-style shows. "I'm not up for sitting in the sun all day to see [the] one band I like that goes on at the end of the night," says Coyne. "We'll tell [our] bands, 'You've got 40 minutes, go onstage and do what you're gonna do. You can set yourselves on fire, we don't care.' We'll tell audiences, 'Show up at 10 p.m., and by 12:35 you'll be done. You'll have seen four or five great bands, and you won't have had to be there from, you know, noon to midnight... You'll see all these bands playing their great songs, and you won't get sick of any of them.'" Though representatives for the band stress that the idea is still in its infancy and none of the artists have officially confirmed, the Lips have been in various levels of discussion, ranging from wouldn't-it-be-nice to more concrete negotiations, with a variety of artists. Says Coyne, "We're talking to Mercury Rev. We're talking to Sebadoh, Aphex Twin, people who we like, really. That's a good enough criteria for us." Robyn Hitchcock is also likely to sign on, and Pavement have reportedly expressed interest, though scheduling problems could either delay or preclude their participation. Given that the condensed nature of the shows would necessitate minimal set changes, the sharing of instruments and billing, and the sort of selflessness not synonymous with the average rock star, it's a small wonder that Coyne has been able to interest anyone at all. "It seems like we have some interest, but we'll see," he says. "Having people respond to it [this way] tells me that while we may be the only ones talking about it, a lot of other bands are thinking about it." Even if the Lips don't pull off the sort of large-scale extravaganza they're hoping for, the band plans to launch the Revue in some form or another, even if it merely means having the Lips perform with a series of lesser known opening bands. "In art and stuff like that, I think watching someone fail is as entertaining as watching someone succeed, anyway," Coyne says. The band hopes to solidify the lineup sometime in the next six weeks or so. Barring unforeseen dsasters or sweeping public indifference, a Winter Revue is reportedly also in the works. -- Allison Stewart ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 May 1999 15:21:42 -0400 (EDT) From: Bayard Subject: fifty-one fegs on the northern line.... My personal fegs-met count has broken the 50 barrier. My feeling that fegs are the best, persists. Big thanks to everyone who was so great to me out West. Tear down 3com park, though, it's colder than Canada in there. Star Wars part I gets two thumbs up from me. But my disbelief suspenders are pretty strong (and stylin'). I can top your good luck Jeme, not only did I see it the first day, I got to see it for free. A feg procured a ticket for me. Thanks Chris! (or did your boss treat you, Jeme? hang onto that job!) Darth Gloster: I actually started a surreal posse tale about Darth Gloster, Emperor Quailpatine, and EB-EO. I wasn't happy enough with it to finish, though. Also was on vacation! Mean nastiness: hope I didn't offend anyone. Jeme says I said four mean things on the visit. When you're the nicest guy on the internet (tm), people seem to keep track of these things. Anyway, thanks again. Looks like the DC contingent will not make it to NY as soon as we'd like, but have extra fun for us. =b ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V8 #187 *******************************