From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V8 #136 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Monday, April 12 1999 Volume 08 : Number 136 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: had to be said (shirts) ["Ariel Green" ] Stuff [Natalie Jacobs ] Re: Stuff [MARKEEFE@aol.com] highly recommended [hal brandt ] Re: had to be said (or did it?) [amadain ] disinfects while it cleans ["Capitalism Blows" ] Re: had to be said (or did it?) [Ross Overbury ] Eitzel, RT, and kd [dwdudic@erols.com (David W. Dudich)] RH compilation [Joel Mullins ] LoTR/Sometimes I wish I was a Pretty Girl [digja611@student.otago.ac.nz (] Re: RH compilation + bounus text... ["Chris!" ] RE: comparative plastics ["Chaney, Dolph L" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 06:36:55 PDT From: "Ariel Green" Subject: Re: had to be said (shirts) >(btw, the Patti list tshirts are being made in the next two months... >whatever happened to feg0list shirts?) Dunno, but if you guys need a printer, my dad does em!! (plug plug plug) LSDiamond _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 10:10:00 -0400 (EDT) From: Natalie Jacobs Subject: Stuff Things of note that have occurred over the last few days. 1. Note new e-mail address. I have to unsub and resub with the new addy in order to get the Feglist here, right? 2. In one of the more appalling incidents of my music-listening career, I managed to scratch a copy of Belle & Sebastian's "Tigermilk" LP. This may not seem so horrible to some of you (Eb), but since there are only 3000 copies of this LP in existence, and this one did not belong to me, I was a tad upset. 3. A friend of mine introduced me to the wide world of Steve Reich last night. Wow!! Quail, you're into Reich, right? There was one piece called "Tehilim" - a setting of Biblical Psalms in Hebrew for sopranos and various percussion instruments - which had shivers going up my spine. Must buy... must buy... 4. One of the nice clerks at my favorite record shop offered to show me his Robyn-defaced copy of "Groovy Decoy." (I hope this is not a Feg version of "showing me his etchings"...) He also mentioned he had some duplicate autographed LP's he might be willing to part with. Cool! This is the same guy who brought in some of his XTC vinyl specifically for me to select from. He was very awed by my Partridge-smooching story as well. 5. I discovered that the nice zanzithophonist from Elf Power, Laura Carter, whom I met at their show, is Jeff Mangum's girlfriend. I wonder what she would have said if I told her that a bunch of women want to have her boyfriend's love-child... n., strenuously avoiding the gender argument np: Beth Orton, "Central Reservation" (not making much of an impression so far) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 11:30:51 EDT From: MARKEEFE@aol.com Subject: Re: Stuff In a message dated 4/11/99 6:51:07 AM, gnat@cyberspace.org writes: << np: Beth Orton, "Central Reservation" (not making much of an impression so far) >> Well, either ya like Rickie Lee Jones, or ya don't. That's what I always say ;-) - -----Michael K. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 11:36:00 -0600 From: hal brandt Subject: highly recommended Maybe I've missed it, but I haven't heard anyone mention the band Sparklehorse on the list yet. I just heard the new album "Good Morning Spider". It sounds like five different bands (all good!) I heard the album 3 days after Mark Linkous played here live and am now regretting that I missed his show. Anyone else discover this one yet? I mean, anyone in addition to Eb (not, of course, to be confused with the hayseed from 'Green Acres" Eb) who has most likely filed the CD away long ago in his Uncle Scrooge-like pile of promos? http://hollywoodandvine.com/sparklehorse/ /hal ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 13:58:52 -0600 From: amadain Subject: Re: had to be said (or did it?) >> interested in mating with those people that same night. 75% of >> the men said yes, with a large proportion of the remainder offering >> apologetic excuses. 100% of the women said no... > >this probably has to do with "biometric factors".[1] also, it has a lot >to do with the environment/sample population, as i think you mentioned. The tricky part of this comes when you try to figure out what differences come from nature (them biometric factors :)) and what differences come out of nurture. IMO. For example, I think the venues have some relation. Were the men and women approached in the same kind of place? If you approached men and women at a New Year's Eve party, the results might be closer together than if you were approaching them at a laundromat. I would think a lot of women would be freaked out by a random stranger propositioning them at a mundane-ish place. It might not be that any given woman is less interested in meaningless sex, all things being equal, but they aren't. Any woman with half a brain is looking out for predators. Somebody propositioning you in an "innappropriate" place might trip those alarm bells. Men aren't socialized to look out for sexual predators, and maybe aren't aware that they're always out there the way a woman usually is, so they aren't processing any given approach the same way at all. Even though there ARE women who prey on strange men in various ways, but said crimes -usually- have to do with slipping the guy a mickey and taking his cash or something, not picking up guys who look like their ex-fiance and mutilating them. I know men who have been raped by women, and battered by women tho, so it's certainly not that women are never violent, it's just all in all a lot rarer. Soooo.....I'm not sure where I'm heading but I -think- maybe, that there are certain brain chem patterns, violence-proneness being one, that are much more likely to happen in the male, but aren't exclusive. Still, the male makeup seems to be a readier home and there may be some scientist who knows why, but I doubt it. Love on ya, Susan "I continued to sip my espresso. The fog continued to roll across Vandam Street until it almost seemed to take on the bleak, beckoning, ghostly visage of an early-fifties Tennessee highway heading inexorably toward the Canton, Ohio, of the mind"- Kinky Friedman, "The Love Song of J. Edgar Hoover" ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 13:23:41 PDT From: "Capitalism Blows" Subject: disinfects while it cleans "President Clinton has done more to harm the environment and to weaken environmental regulations in three years than Presidents Bush and Reagan did in twelve years." --David Brower, former head of the Sierra Club and Friends of the Earth, 1996 "Clinton can declare black to be white with the best of them. His major environmental initiative in the budget offers tax breaks for the cleanup and development of poisoned land; one can't say for sure, but that sounds like a subsidy to real estate developers in green disguise. (That's the way it's worked in the New York area.) His proposal to push more Medicare recipients into HMOs is described as 'providing more choice.' His health care spending cuts are described as 'strenghtening Medicare and Medicaid.' Welfare cuts are described as promoting work and protecting children. His vision of austerity and free trade is designed to 'create an age of possibility.' It's almost enough to make you nostalgic for Nixon." --Doug Henwood, Left Business Observer brecht's time before the huac was pretty interesting (it's available from smithsonian folkways.) one observer likened it to, "a zoologist being cross-examined by apes with pleasure! $38 to: ava box 459 boonville, ca 95415 do it NOW!! but you just keep repeating "Reagan? Nixon? COME ON..." as if that in and of itself is supposed to mean something. nobody ever said that reagan and nixon were anything other than pieces of fucking shit (okay, well, clinton was really choked up when nixon kicked the bucket, as i recall). the point is, are we just going to jerk our knees and say, "no member of the democratic party, by definition, could possibly be worse than reagan and nixon"? or are we going to look at what they've "accomplished" and then decide for ourselves? but i'm using it as a descriptive term. if we look at clinton's record, rather than *asking* him his party affiliation, it's OBVIOUS that he's a fucking republican (not that there ever was much difference between the two parties, and today they're absolutely indistinguishable, unless the democrats are a bit worse. but in broad strokes, we could at one time sort of get a feeling for what one or the other party stood for). because they get thrown into jail for protesting wwi, i guess is what you're driving at. but if you're implying that clinton doesn't align himself with the dsa or whatever because he's afraid it'll land him in the slammer, then... not *one*? *any*? so you're saying he's the most left-leaning president *ever*, on *every* issue? either you're just trying to bait me, or you're not paying attention *at all*. assuming it's the former, i'm afraid i don't have the time to really get into it, but: clinton is to the right of reaganbush on self-determination for the palestinians. the oslo accords have been compared, rightly, to the *beginning* of the apartheid era in south africa. madeleine fucking albright (the same fuckhead who, upon accepting the post of secretary of state, asked, "what's the use of having this huge military machine if you're not going to use it?", when she was ambassador to the un, in calling to strike past un resolutions on "the situation in the middle east" from the record, deemed them, "obsolete and anachronistic." clinton is to the right of reaganbush on civil liberties. expanding the powers of the police, and diminishing the rights of citizens, in other words. clinton's policy toward cuba is to the right of reaganbush. yeah, yeah, the republicans in congress have something to say about that, too. but clinton's with them every step of the way. hard as it may be to believe, clinton is probably more militarist than reganbush: - --his military budget is larger than nixon's at the height of his vietnam fun 'n' games. - --military aid to columbia, the most repressive regime in the hemisphere, has risen under clinton. - --by presidential decree, we now sell heavy military equipment (jets and tanks and shit) to latin america, which we did not do under reaganbush. - --and of course, clinton just can't stop using the fucking military himself. somalia, iraq twice (*before* "desert fox"), wanted to use it in haiti, wanted to use it last year before the ohio state debacle, sudan and afghanistan, "desert fox", the almost daily iraq bombings since then, and now yugoslavia. can you spell "war criminal"? i knew you could! speaking of iraq, clinton's policy toward it has been the most shameful element, in my opinion, of his presidency, and probably our nation's most shameful "endeavor" since vietnam. no, bush probably wouldn't have done much differently had he been reelected. but it obviously wouldn't have been any worse. clinton's policy toward haiti was to the right of reaganbush. reaganbush couldn't in their wildest wet dreams have conceived of privatizing social security or doing away with afdc. they couldn't have gotten nafta and gatt passed, either. clinton's health care "initiative" was a complete and utter sell-out to the large insurance companies. mergers and acquisitions, full speed ahead under clinton. including in the media, thanks to the telecommunications bill. and of course, wall street just roaring. no less than the ceo of ford motors claimed that clinton was the best president he'd ever seen. (by the way, i kept very close tabs on the seattle times' business page for about nine months, and there is a very strong positive correlation between layoffs and stock performance. the business page is great, by the way. it's the closest thing the newspaper ever comes to telling the truth. and it's where the only serious labor reporting resides.) environment? COMPLETE catastrophe under clinton. there were the sellouts at headwaters, canyonlands, and yellowstone. babbit just gave away huge swaths of alaska to the oil companies. (anda general bending over backwards to satisfy the oil and mining behemoths.) the kyoto nonsense. the dismantling of the delaney clause (which had prohibited chemicals being used in processed foods. now, in the clinton era, we have "acceptable" cancer levels. yum yum!) endangered species? clean air? ozone depleters? corporations all aboard! and on and on and on and on. under clintonomics, personal debt is at record levels, people are working more than ever (but are less unionised than ever), and getting injured on the job more than ever. wages have risen *very* slightly the last few years, but they're still well below nixon-era levels. and there's quite a bit more. in case i haven't made it clear in the past, i don't really believe that clinton's *intentions* are so much more reactionary than those of his predecessors. but his policies, clearly, are. i think it's attributable to a general rightward drift over the last quarter-century, and, yes, to the fact that he's a "democrat", and that policies which reaganbush would *loved* to have been able to sign off on, they simply could not, as the "democrats" wouldn't have allowed it from them. as cockburn has said, the final destruction of the social contract, "had to be an inside job."but clinton is a fucking slimeball, almost without peer. and it's LONG, LONG past time those of us who want to see a better world pulled our heads out of our asses and realized this, and quit supporting the "lesser" evil. 'cause the "lesser" evil has been more ruinous than a couple three of the "greater" evils put together. coupla good sources: noam chomsky (it always comes down to chomsky, doesn't it?), World Orders, Old And New chomsky, The Clinton Vision: Old Wine, New Bottles (available, along with lots of other great stuff, from AK Press audio) cockburn and silverstein, Washington Babylon joshua karliner, The Corporate Planet norman solomon, False Hope DEFINITELY check out the Left Business Observer, and Counterpunch. i know back issues of LBO are available, but not sure about Counterpunch. but i'll tell you (or anybody else) what: send me some blank tapes or some such, and i'll copy a bunch of 'em off for you. "I think the economic logic of dumping a load of toxic waste in the lowest-wage country is impeccable, and we should face up to that." --Lawrence Summers, then World Bank mucky-muck, later Clinton cabinet member hee hee. don't tell that to chris and terry! http://leb.net/iac/ "...the people who in most places in the world provide opposition leadership are, here in America, holed up in academic sinecures arguing about the ethics of lunch and whether or not to hire an immigrant maid. The two-party dictatorship is literally destroying the country and Clinton is the worst president we've ever had -- much worse than Nixon and Reagan combined on everything from the environment to social and economic policy, and where's the left? Sitting by the phone hoping to get on one of those Dead White Man TV talk panels....frankly, these days every time I even see a copy of The Nation, In These Times, or, worst of all, Mother Jones, I feel like punching the first pony tailed, nasal whinnying, Virtual Asseted, public-radioed, candy-assed, so-called leftist who comes through my door. Unfortunately, they come through my door all the time and I'm too old and physically decrepit to carry out a decent physical assault. It's all very frustrating." --Bruce Anderson, Anderson Valley Advertiser _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 21:09:28 -0400 (EDT) From: Ross Overbury Subject: Re: had to be said (or did it?) On Sat, 10 Apr 1999, amadain wrote: > >> interested in mating with those people that same night. 75% of > >> the men said yes, with a large proportion of the remainder offering > >> apologetic excuses. 100% of the women said no... > > The tricky part of this comes when you try to figure out what differences > come from nature (them biometric factors :)) and what differences come out > of nurture. IMO. > > For example, I think the venues have some relation. Were the men and women > approached in the same kind of place? If you approached men and women at a > New Year's Eve party, the results might be closer together than if you were > approaching them at a laundromat. Same place, presumably same night, singles bar. > Soooo.....I'm not sure where I'm heading but I -think- maybe, that there > are certain brain chem patterns, violence-proneness being one, that are > much more likely to happen in the male, but aren't exclusive. Still, the > male makeup seems to be a readier home and there may be some scientist who > knows why, but I doubt it. Probably true*, and I don't take offense because you've said prone not destined. "Readier" is a better term still because it doesn't carry the implication that most males are made more violence-prone because of this factor. There's definitely either strong environmental factors or a wide range of variation among individuals or you'd never get a Maggie Thatcher. *My male Scottie is now "traveling light" because of the chem predisposition assumption, so you know my family has a fair bit of faith in it. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 01:32:29 GMT From: dwdudic@erols.com (David W. Dudich) Subject: Eitzel, RT, and kd On Sun, 11 Apr 1999 07:11:09 -0400 (EDT), you wrote: > >Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 13:10:49 +0200 >From: Victor Schiferli >Subject: Re: had to be said > >It's EitzeL, actually, and all of you fegs who do not know his work should >go out and get his 1996 masterpiece "60 Watt Silver Lining" or "Mercury" by >his old band American Music Club. He is really amazing. Wry, bitter, >tuneful. Sings like he's about to drown. Regulary storms offstage mid-set, >in tears. Great sense of humour though. I don't know where he stands in >this male vs female debate but you should just listen to his music... Just >thought I'd point out my other hero. "Mercury" is great, but I suggest Soft Boys fans would like "Engine" better. Mmercury was produced by Mitchell Froom, who some of you know as the longtime producer of one Richard Thompson. Actually, The best way to describe Eitzel is as an American RT, except RT writes as characters and leads a fairly normal life, whereas Eitzel is apparently really as fu#ked up as his songs would make you beleive... Sadly, some have said See him live before he does himself in... Don't know Mark Eitzen (so tell me about him!) but Patti and k.d. have their place in the stat distribution. For everly k.d. how many Whitney Houstons are there? Well, k.d. has had several hits...Admittedly, "All YOu Can Eat" was a dissapointment sales wise compared to "Ingenue", but it still sold pretty well...All fegs are hereby enjoyed to buy both these albums... masterpieces! "Ingenue" is more of a "night" type record. "All YOu Can Eat" is more a "day" type record, if that makes any sense. (like "Eye" is a nighttime listening record). -luther ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 22:31:32 -0700 From: Joel Mullins Subject: RH compilation Well, I've spent all day trying to make the track listing for that RH compilation tape I'm making for the professor I'm trying to fuck. I started out by writing down all the songs I wanted to put on there. The list ended up being 58 songs/220 minutes. That's too long! It wasn't easy cutting it down to 90 minutes. I had to cut off some of my favorite songs. But I finally was able to come up with a track listing that might work. I probably won't actually make the tape until tomorrow, so if anyone has any suggestions on how to make the track listing better (additions or subtractions or ordering), feel free to submit them to me. Side A: 1. Sometimes I Wish I Was A Pretty Girl 2. Underwater Moonlight 3. Veins of the Queen 4. September Cones 5. My Wife and My Dead Wife 6. Winchester 7. Cynthia Mask 8. Insanely Jealous 9. Do Policemen Sing? 10. Tell Me About Your Drugs 11. Linctus House Side B: 1. Leppo and the Jooves 2. If You Were a Priest 3. Railway Shoes 4. Heliotrope 5. How Do You Work This Thing? 6. Queen Elvis 7. Uncorrected Personality Traits 8. Trash 9. This is How it Feels 10. I Used to Say I Love You 11. He's a Reptile 12. Swirling - --Joel ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 16:20:11 +1200 From: digja611@student.otago.ac.nz (James Dignan) Subject: LoTR/Sometimes I wish I was a Pretty Girl >From: Jon Fetter >Subject: TLOR Movie (.01% Baggins geneaology) > > I read an article today about The Lord of the Rings movie(s) that >said that it was rumored that Sean Connery would be playing Gandalf (It was >a horribly written article, calling Gandalf "the Hobbit elder."). Anybody >else hear any other casting news? > It's being filmed "in secret" on a farm near Matamata. >Jon I'd heard three suggestiond for the role, and certainly Connery's name was one of them. One of the others was (eek! no!) Branagh, the other was Patrick Stewart, who I think would be excellent in the role. Matamata, FWIW, is in rolling fertile country close to the broad valley of NZ's longest river, the Waikato. Most famous as a racehorse breeding area. If it's all to be filmed there, most of the backdrops will have to be done by computer. A bit odd, since NZ has a lot of landscapes theat would fit quite a few of the lands in LoTR. Matamata would be a natural place to use for the Shire and its surrounds, though, and its likely they'd use it for much of theinterior work and maybe for their computer/FX base, as it is close to Auckland (which is about 50 miles to the north), but free enough of the hassles of working in the city. I'm not getting involved in this linguistics in song thing other than to makea few quick comments: 1) I think the reaction to the original request was an overreaction. Sure people are different and saying "men think this, women think that" is akin to saying "The Great Quail's views must be more like Eddie's than LJ's, no matter what" - i.e., a load of bollocks. However, there ARE established differences in the way the two sexes communicate with each other IN GENERAL TERMS. Statistical analyses have shown these trends quite clearly, and they are no more sexist than saying 'the average Japanese male is shorter than the average Bantu male' is racist. 2) One thing no-one has convinced me about the book "Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus" is exactly what planet the writer was on when he wrote it. An even bigger load of bollocks. 3) Yes, people with freckles may communicate differently. A recently announced finding from Britain (one of many such, I'm sure) is that blonde women really are perceived to be less intelligent than women with other hair colours, and brunettes are perceived to be the most shy. If that is the case, it's very likely that the blondes and brunettes need to compensate for these perceptions in their speech. It wouldn't be too much of a stretch to say "people with freckles appear younger, or happier, or more shy, or more adventurous - whatever". If so, they may also need to compensate. 4) Play nice, or I'll start talking about flags again! Oh, and good luck with the assignment, Joel! James (who was once abused by a feminist for daring to claim that I could identify with the lyrics to the Indigo Girls' "Closer to Fine") PS - whoa - Bayard missed it all! Shall we start again from the top??? PPS - the contents of this email are personal blathering, not the blathering of my place of study/work. PPPS - it should be "I wish I were..." James Dignan___________________________________ You talk to me Deptmt of Psychology, Otago University As if from a distance ya zhivu v' 50 Norfolk Street And I reply. . . . . . . . . . Dunedin, New Zealand with impressions chosen from another time steam megaphone (03) 455-7807 (Brian Eno - "By this River") ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 11 Apr 1999 21:27:38 -0700 From: "Chris!" Subject: Re: RH compilation + bounus text... Joel Mullins wrote: > > Well, I've spent all day trying to make the track listing for that RH > compilation tape I'm making for the professor I'm trying to fuck. I always tend to want to see what a whole album is like rather than "these are songs I think you should hear" type gig. Bob has some pretty strong albums to recommend, e.g. Moss Elixir, Element of Light or Queen Elvis. All of these have very non-abrasive tunes that would not offend the unaccustomed Hitchcock ear. (Yes, I know that there are others that you could pick, but not many, and the list makes my point; so, relax all of you PI vs Eye types). I always hate to have a bunch of songs presented to me and then have them stand out too much when I get the album. Remember you first Beatles album where you had heard all of the radio play tunes already? Sort of tarnished it until the other tunes sank in. (And, yes, I know there are those of you who did buy the albums before hearing the tunes on the radio; again, it makes my point.) I do not find much wrong with A&M comp. Overall, it has strong tunes and captures the period very well. Yes, you could get all technical, but the person unfamiliar with RH would not care. Also, the whole compilation on a tape thing, does that reek of tape-weeny-ism? Maybe the tape heads are projecting here? Not that it is a problem, mind you. But, I think giving the person a good solid album does far better than a bunch of greatest hits, which Bob does not lend himself to really. Also, I am listening to "Storefront Hitchcock" and find it really "blahh." It does not move me much. And no there has be no sort of Spencerian evolution since I bought it where the internal bits of it became better to suit my needs. This is a shame; maybe because I am so disappointed by it. Because if I go back the the last release, Moss Elixir, I still find it brilliant, perhaps the most brilliant thing he has done. Maybe Bob is just in a major rut at this time. This might change if I see the movie, but I doubt it; I can never sit still that long. .chris ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 08:51:43 -0400 From: "Chaney, Dolph L" Subject: RE: comparative plastics While completely sidestepping this weekend's episode of "Supergenderpugilisticsociolinguidocious," I would like to cite the use of alternate packaging on my CD. I went with the same dupe house that Glass Flesh used, Oasis Duplication in Maryland, and used their Jewel-Free Box as my CD packaging. http://www.oasiscd.com/jewelfree.html will show you what it looks like, but essentially, it's a 3-panel digipak with a tray that swings freely instead of being glued down. I liked it so much that I spent extra and paid shipping to use an out-of-town company, instead of going with a vendor here in Atlanta. Dolph now drinking: Chock Full O' Nuts ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 10:49:59 -0400 From: "Thomas, Ferris" Subject: RE: Stuff la femme Natalie Jacobs es parle 2. In one of the more appalling incidents of my music-listening career, I managed to scratch a copy of Belle & Sebastian's "Tigermilk" LP. This may not seem so horrible to some of you (Eb), but since there are only 3000 copies of this LP in existence, and this one did not belong to me, I was a tad upset. Appalled by the scratching. Hmmmm. I could very well believe that. It (Tigermilk) is coming out on CD soon, though, I believe. Hopefully chock full of those hated bonus tracks... - -f. np: Going against the grain: Blur "13." And liking it.... ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V8 #136 *******************************