From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V8 #35 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Wednesday, February 3 1999 Volume 08 : Number 035 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: Alternative top 100 and Soft Boys [MARKEEFE@aol.com] Jason Falkner [0% RH] [Joel Mullins ] Re: Alternative top 100 and Soft Boys [Joel Mullins ] Jason Falkner [Joel Mullins ] "Smile" [MARKEEFE@aol.com] El translacion loco [james.dignan@stonebow.otago.ac.nz (James Dignan)] "Cosmic Debris" [Patrick Welker ] Re: Alternative top 100 and Soft Boys ["D B" ] SH not at Southampton [cinders blue ] the reverse quiz answers... [james.dignan@stonebow.otago.ac.nz (James Dig] Re: the reverse quiz answers... [Mark_Gloster@3com.com] Re: news from spain [Zloduska ] Re: the reverse quiz answers... [Capuchin ] "Alternative" top 100 [Natalie Jacobs ] Re: "Alternative" top 100 [amadain ] 22/7 [Capuchin ] Re: Yip [Capuchin ] Re: 22/7 [Aaron Mandel ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 2 Feb 1999 17:48:16 EST From: MARKEEFE@aol.com Subject: Re: Alternative top 100 and Soft Boys In a message dated 99-02-02 17:20:11 EST, Joel writes: << Well, maybe we should make a list which is an alternative to the lists that are an alternative to the usual lists. >> You realize that, sooner than later, what you'll end up with is the current Top 100 Billboard albums, of course. "No way, man -- Tit Wrench is WAY too obvious to be on our best alternative-to-the-alternative-to-the- alternative-to-the-alternative-to-the-alternative-to-the-alternative-to-the- alternative-to-the-alternative albums list . . . what about the N'Sync Christmas album, though?" ;-) - ------Michael K. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 17:20:00 -0800 From: Joel Mullins Subject: Jason Falkner [0% RH] Hey, in case anyone is interested, I just got the Jason Falkner 7" from Lovitt Records in the mail today. I was lucky enough to get one on clear vinyl, of which there were only 200 made. Anyway, I just finished my first listen and here are my reactions. Side A "Holiday" I think this song will be on the new album, due out Feb. 23. I like the song, but it didn't immediately strike me as anything great. But none of his songs have ever struck me that way. They usually have to grow on me and then after awhile, I end up loving them. This song definitely has that potential. At the end, his voice goes way up high into his falsetto voice and it sounds really kick ass. I loved that part immediately. Side B "Down at the Lake" This song will not be on the upcoming album. I can't decide what I think about this song. I like it, but it reminds me of something else, and I have yet to figure out what that something else is. There are some cool lines in the second verse: "I mean we were down with Costello After Armed Forces I was never the same." I really liked that little reference to Elvis C. Anyway, I know there are a few Jason fans out there in Fegland, so I hope this post will be somewhat interesting to someone. Later Joel ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 17:29:28 -0800 From: Joel Mullins Subject: Re: Alternative top 100 and Soft Boys MARKEEFE@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 99-02-02 17:20:11 EST, Joel writes: > > << Well, maybe we should make a list which is an alternative to the lists > that are an alternative to the usual lists. >> > > You realize that, sooner than later, what you'll end up with is the > current Top 100 Billboard albums, of course. "No way, man -- Tit Wrench is > WAY too obvious to be on our best alternative-to-the-alternative-to-the- > alternative-to-the-alternative-to-the-alternative-to-the-alternative-to-the- > alternative-to-the-alternative albums list . . . what about the N'Sync > Christmas album, though?" ;-) > Yeah, exactly. If you keep doing this, you'd just end up with a list of the albums that are so fucking horrible they'd never be able to make any best-of-lists. I'll second the vote for N'Sync and nominate every Celine Dion album. - --Joel ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 17:33:04 -0800 From: Joel Mullins Subject: Jason Falkner Well, it didn't take very long for "Holiday" to grow on me. This is a great fucking song!! - --Joel ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Feb 1999 18:45:31 EST From: MARKEEFE@aol.com Subject: "Smile" For anyone who's ever wanted to hear this famous, "lost" Beach Boys classic, there's a spot on the ol' Internet you might want to check out: Web Sounds' Smile Section - Index http://easyweb.easynet.co.uk/~annew/smile/index.htm It's an expertly assembled and wonderfully annotated compilation of the best possible approximation of the Beach Boys "Smile" album. You can listen to RealAudio samples and/or download mp3's of each track. I'm currently listening to the CD that I burned from the mp3 -> AIFF (for Mac) files that I downloaded last night. Warning! This is a time/memory-consuming project. Most songs are from 1 to 4 megs and take anywhere from, oh, 5 to 17 minutes to download! But it's worth it, for sure :-) Look! Listen! Vibrate! Smile! (well, Robyn would agree with the third verb, anyway). - ------Michael K., who's definitely on a major Beach Boys jag of late ('66 to '73, anyway) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Feb 1999 15:07:39 +1300 From: james.dignan@stonebow.otago.ac.nz (James Dignan) Subject: El translacion loco >"Robyn Hitchcock has been forming its style throughout 20 years and now it >is when owner of the scene seems to feel. Magician of the small rooms >where usually he acts and where excites to his public with fantastic >stories improvised between song and song. ' >that it interprets in the film that Jonathan Demme has made on him can be >felt how the public puts in the delirious history of minotaurs that they >kidnap to a man and they take it under earth turned into pump, on the >verge of exploding in the center of London. >You obtain >during five years and raisins the rest of your life in recovery, in a >house of rest or something similar. this sums RH up better than anything I think I've ever read. Perhaps all articles on him should be babelfished before publication... James RIP - David McComb ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Feb 1999 18:18:43 -0800 (PST) From: Patrick Welker Subject: "Cosmic Debris" >>Alternative top 100 and Soft Boys<< What can I say? The list blew Monkey chunks. More of a "my favorite" type list, rather than having any real substance. Mile Davis "alternative" Eh!? Hmmm... >>>is it just me, or is it *impossible* to get Rattling Bog out of your head for the entire day if you've listened to it in the morning? not that this is a bad thing, necessarily.<<< Oh thank God! I thought I was the only person with this problem. For me though, it's Porcipine Tree's "Up the Downstair". After listening to this early in the morning while laying in a dark room half asleep. I'm simply demented for the rest of the day... Would anyone happen to know which Syd Barrett bootleg it is that Robyn drew the cover to? Pat. n.p. The Refo:mation :- "pharmakio/distance crunching honchos with echo units" _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 18:21:15 PST From: "D B" Subject: Re: Alternative top 100 and Soft Boys Then again, >this list was probably made up by one or two people, judging from the biases >towards Nich Drake, Joni Mitchell and Iggy Pop. Not to mention Dexy's Midnight Runners... ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 21:14:21 -0500 From: cinders blue Subject: SH not at Southampton fyi, southampton fegs. >Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 11:27:50 +0000 >From: 96176623 <96176623@brookes.ac.uk> >Reply-To: 96176623@brookes.ac.uk >To: woj@smoe.org >Subject: no show > >Storefront won't be shown in Southampton as Harbour lights has sadly >just closed down!! > >dave > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Feb 1999 15:30:32 +1300 From: james.dignan@stonebow.otago.ac.nz (James Dignan) Subject: the reverse quiz answers... some of you may (or mauy not) remember that about a month back I sent out "the first annual James Dignan reverse quiz" - 21 weird and wonderful answers requiring questions. I got a wide number of responses, with scores ranging from 21/21 to about 3/21, with Christopher Price insisting, Peanuts-like, that the answer to all the questions was "Twelve". Top marks go to Jeme, aka Capuchin, to whom I owe one CD of his choice. Other worthies to score close to full marks (both above 17/21) were Chris Barrus and Stephen Hall-Jones. For some answers, such as "Pepin the Short", several possible related questions were possible - in marking these questions I simply looked for evidence that the question I had in mind and the question supplied both clearly related to the same person. In one case, "Laocoon", two different questions were possible - one relating to the legendary character and one to a statue depicting his death (housed at the Vatican). In one case, "Thingsvallavatn", my source may have provided an error - I have checked and the usual spelling has no 's'. So... here are the questions I had. 01 Farr, Mann, Thomas [...] (Who did Joe Louis beat in his record 25 World Heavyweight boxing title defences?) 02 Spyridon Louis (who won the Marathon in the first modern Olympics at Athens in 1896?) 03 Pepin the Short (Who did Charlemagne succeed as King of the French?) 04 Palmer Putnam (What was the name of Amelia Earhart's husband?) 05 Thingvallavatn (what is the largest lake in Iceland?) 06 Nukuhiva, Uapu... (what are the six inhabited islands in the Marquesas chain?) 07 "Nately's whore was hiding [...]" (what are the last two lines of "Catch 22"?) 08 L.H.O.O.Q. (which five letters did Duchamp and Picabia add to their infamous reproduction of the Mona Lisa? [LHOOQ, in France is pronounced 'elle a chaud au cul', i.e., 'she has a hot ass']) 09 Medac acne medication [...] (what four products are advertised on the cover of the Who's "The Who sell out" album?) 10 Paisiello (1782) and Rossini (1816) (which two composers both wrote opera called "The Marriage of Figaro", and when were they first performed?) 13 Laocoon (which Trojan priest warned against the acceptance of the wooden horse as a gift?) 14 The first book of Nephi (what is the first book of the Book of Mormon called?) 15 David Scott and James Irwin, Hadley Rille (which two astronauts travelled to the moon on Apollo 15, and where on the moon did they land?) 16 Louise Brown, in 1978 (who was the world's first "Test tube baby", and in what year was she born?) 17 196.9665; 1064.43 (what is the atomic weight and melting point in Celsius gold?) 18 W, O, B, A, F, G, K, M, R, N, S (What letters are used to classify stars by their spectral types?) 19 Julius Ullman and Gladys Smith, 28th of March, 1920 (what were Douglas Fairbanks and Mary Pickford's real names, and when did they marry?) 20 Walter, Ottumwa (In "M.A.S.H.", what was Radar O'Reilly's first name and home town?) 21 "Lil din l'art helwa, l'omm li tatna isimha" (what is the first line of the Maltese national anthem?) 11Z The Frigate "Rattlesnake", based at Port Phillip (Melbourne), 1836-37. (what was the only naval command of William Hobson, NZ's first Governor?) 11U Schuyler Colfax and Henry Wilson (which two men were vice-presidents vice-president under Ulysses Grant?) 11B Quintinshill, Scotland (where was Britain's worst ever railway disaster?) 11C June 30th, 1984 (on what date did Pierre Trudeau retire from politics?) 11A The Bradfield Highway (what is the name of the road that crosses Sydney Harbour Bridge?) 12Z Auckland 3, Wellington 6 [...] (what were the results of the first three ever Ranfurly Shield matches?) 12U Lew Alcindor (what was Kareem Abdul-Jabbar's original name?) 12B Queen's Park and Clydesdale (which two teams competed in the first Scottish FA cup final?) 12C Montreal AAA, 1894 (who were the first Stanley Cup Hockey champions, and in what year?) 12A D.W.Gregory (who captained Australia in the first ever cricket test, in 1877? Not, as someone suggested, anything to do with XTC!) Well done to those who did well, I hope the quiz was as fun trying as it was to make. Jeme, let me know what CD I should start looking for! James James Dignan___________________________________ You talk to me Deptmt of Psychology, Otago University As if from a distance ya zhivu v' 50 Norfolk Street And I reply. . . . . . . . . . Dunedin, New Zealand with impressions chosen from another time steam megaphone (03) 455-7807 (Brian Eno - "By this River") ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Feb 1999 21:22:05 -0800 From: Mark_Gloster@3com.com Subject: Re: the reverse quiz answers... Dearest all. I'm sure it looks like I'm bragging, but: 1. I actually know the guy that got all the answers. He had the good sense to not copy my answers. 2. I really did get more than 0 right, but I am probably above gloating about 1 correct answer. Hope y'all are getting lots of fiber. - -Markg ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Feb 1999 01:39:16 -0600 From: Zloduska Subject: Re: news from spain Eddie wrote: >anybody feels like translating, that would be bitchin'! >as ever, hotmail can't reformat worth fuckall, so i'm going to do it >manually. may miss a paragraph break here, there, or everywhere. Er, I'm technically not *fluent* in Spanish, but I can read it. Here is my go at translation, to the best of my ability. Plus I don't have a dictionary, so bare with me (and through what I think are some typos). FIETTA JARQUE, Madrid Robyn Hitchcock (London 1953) takes a liking to being considered a cult musician. "The majority are generally mistaken," he says. The circles of mainstream rock disgust him. His solitary route, nevertheless, has earned him loyal admirers. Among them, the movie director Jonathan Demme, who just finished introducing a documentary about one of his live performances, in which he combines stores and songs. Hitchcock is performing in Madrid today. Robyn Hitchcock has been shaping his style as long as twenty years and now is when he seems to feel that he dominates the scene. King of the small rooms where he usually performs and where he excites his audience with fantastic improvised stories between each song. "They are stories that occur to me at the moment," he affirms, although this is something difficult to believe. On the album that he just released, with music that is performed in the film Jonathan Demme has made about him, one can feel how the audience gets involved with a delirious story of some minotaurs that kidnap a man and take him underground [where] converted into [(?)this phrase makes no sense] a bomb, on the verge of exploding in central London. Unfortunately, the limits of language can change the tone of the show. "It's different in each place. If I am in Spain, for example, I tend to speak in Spanish, although my vocablulary is reduced to some seventy-five words," he explains. "The stories go with the songs. They are like photographs that give you distinct aspects of the same situation. The music is something more emotional, any sentiment fits in it. The stories have to do with thoughts more than with feelings. The stories are the mind, and the songs, the heart." "There are many ways to take people into your own world," he continues. "I think that the majority of people tell stories to themselves subconsciously, even though they don't pay attention to them while awake. Only when they are at the point of falling asleep, or during dreams, they listen, they see them. Sometimes one begins to dream before falling asleep. I believe what I cultivate is that sharp line between the conscious and the unconscious. That both realities invade one another." In true form, the darkness of the scene, the spotlights, help to create that ambiguous atmosphere, similar to one of the theater. The film that Demme made based on a series of live performances takes advantage of these circumstances. "It is exactly that which the film has captured," affirms Hitchcock. "What I make is cocktail music. You can drink glasses while you listen to it. It is not music for dancing. It's more similar to what you listen to on the radio, like ballads that accompany you. Before, with rock, people could listen to a story contained in a fifteen minute song. The public was more patient. What I make is the opposite of rock. Rock is like a dog with its tongue sticking out, that comes and throws its bone at your feet. You want it or not. Rock is really disagreeable. I am more of a folkie." He began his career in the 70's with a group called Soft Boys, but totally rejects that world today. "The previous generation and the present have grown with rock. I belong to the first generation that grew up with rock. But it rapidly became a form of making a lot of money for a few people. It's a question of that." A gulf of five years. [there must be a typo or some words missing here] The professional path Hitchcock has chosen is the less traveled. He has remained in the most reduced circles. "I have kept up well thus far. If you are cautious with money you can live well. I have not been, but I keep ahead. The average professional subsistence in the world of rock is about five years. You achieve it during five years and spend the rest of your life in recovery, in a rest home or something like that. But there are people with long-term projects, and I consider myself one of them. I would like to be like John Lee Hooker or Martin Carthy, the English folk singer, who began at twenty and will continue to sing until the day of their death," he affirms. For years Hitchcock has been presenting an acoustic spectacle, scarcely accompanied by any supporting musician. "When I arrived at forty I realized that I no longer desired to go with a band of musicians. It is a little sad to go there with a group of men, unless you need the money." ~~~Viva La Velvet! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Feb 1999 23:41:37 -0800 (PST) From: Capuchin Subject: Re: the reverse quiz answers... On Wed, 3 Feb 1999, James Dignan wrote: > Top marks go to Jeme, aka Capuchin, to whom I owe one CD of his choice. > Other worthies to score close to full marks (both above 17/21) were Chris > Barrus and Stephen Hall-Jones. Phew! I was afraid someone else got 20 and I'd feel bad for asking Nathan about that star question. > 10 Paisiello (1782) and Rossini (1816) > (which two composers both wrote opera called "The Marriage of Figaro", > and when were they first performed?) Just to be all snooty and stuff, that's "The Barber of Seville". > Well done to those who did well, I hope the quiz was as fun trying as it > was to make. Jeme, let me know what CD I should start looking for! Oooh... one you should start looking for? So I can request something extraordinarily rare and valuable? I'll take the latest release by Dolph Chaney! J. ________________________________________________________ J A Brelin Capuchin ________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Feb 1999 09:09:47 -0500 From: Natalie Jacobs Subject: "Alternative" top 100 Well, it was an interesting idea, I guess... with some good stuff on there, but the constant repetition of artists (two Todd Rundgren albums and two Nick Drake albums in the top ten, for instance) seems to bespeak a lack of imagination. They were stretching beyond the norm to make the list, but not stretching far enough. At least they limited it to albums that were at least two years old, so you didn't see the clutter of Oasis and Verve albums that always seems to turn up on British lists of this type. > I can't understand why they felt like they had to include all three Drake >albums, thereby excluding plenty of other good stuff. And I *really* like >Nick Drake! Also, I think *most* people would pick either "Five Leaves" or >"Pink Moon" over "Bryter Layter" . . . Well, "Bryter Layter" is the Drake album that is constantly cited by critics as his "masterpiece," so ranking it above "Pink Moon" again seems unimaginative. And it certainly doesn't deserve a number one slot! I would have liked to have seen "Underwater Moonlight" on the list, maybe. I don't think any of Robyn's other albums are quite in the "classic" category, as good as they are. n. p.s. Check out the list of "established classics" they excluded - Garbage? The La's? The Happy Mondays?? ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Feb 1999 13:01:02 -0600 From: amadain Subject: Re: "Alternative" top 100 >Well, it was an interesting idea, I guess... with some good stuff on there, >but the constant repetition of artists (two Todd Rundgren albums and two >Nick Drake albums in the top ten, for instance) I think it IS a fabulous idea. But it did look as if, as someone here said (sorry, forgot who :)), the list was made up by one or two people. Either that, or there's something odd in the water over there making all the rock critics in a certain area of the country think that Todd Rundgren was a good deal more influential than he actually is. >imagination. They were stretching beyond the norm to make the list, but >not stretching far enough. I can think of dozens of things that could have gone on that list. So could we all have, obviously. One thing I noticed particularly was that electronic music was conspicuously under-represented- in fact, I'm not sure I saw ANY. How about Kraftwerk or perhaps Silver Apples? It seems to me too, although I only gave it a brief once-over so my memory may not be 100 percent accurate, that I didn't see a whole lot of punk on there either. And a foray into including jazz albums was a silly mistake, no doubt done to show the hipness of the listmakers. But really, that just opens a huge can o'worms they'd have been better off leaving shut, as I can think of several jazz albums more interesting and maybe even more influential in the world of pop and rock than some of the pop albums included. >least two years old, so you didn't see the clutter of Oasis and Verve >albums that always seems to turn up on British lists of this type. One of my personal big peeves. That was one of the good things about it, but they maybe should have extended it to five years or something. Love on ya, Susan and what's with including a TLC album, fer chrissakes *cranky mumble*! ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Feb 1999 11:21:17 -0800 (PST) From: Capuchin Subject: 22/7 I'm catching up on stuff in my postponed-messages folder. Deal. On Sat, 19 Dec 1998, Ken Sabatini wrote: > Movies?: > I'd have to include the movie Pi (that is, the movie who's title is > the symbol for Pi the number--3.14159...) among my top movies of the year. > The premise being that numbers underlie all processes and if one can > identify the numerical patterns then one can predict the stock market > perfectly, understand the Bible as it was intended, etc. Well that's > not exactly the premise, but that's a portion of it. See it if you > can find it. Movies like this make me so ANGRY. OK, the filmmaking was kind of neato. There was some interesting camera work and the soundtrack was oh-so-hip technostuff that did mostly add to the ambience, etc. But the story was SUCH SHIT. I saw the movie as being about extremists and crazy obsessive-compulsive people who can't tell the difference between their private passions and things that really matter. So that stuff was good. That said, let's talk about the numbers. The fellow who wrote this film has a VERY poor understanding of mathematical modelling, dynamic nonlinear systems, and numbers as a whole. The moment they started talking about numbers underlying all patterns in nature, I tensed up. I hate it when people go on about these things as if their making sense. It was metaphysical gibberish. OK, then the guy gets the special magic superfast microprocessor... you know, the one with two pins? And he plugs that in where his little cube of parts was connected... because hey, it accepts the same instructions, sure. I don't know... I just hate it when people write about things they know nothing about (to paraphrase Amy Archer). Just babbling. Je. ________________________________________________________ J A Brelin Capuchin ________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Feb 1999 11:38:08 -0800 (PST) From: Capuchin Subject: Re: Yip On Thu, 8 Oct 1998, Eb wrote: > Well, personally, I'd rather a song about a father's death engage my HEART > over my brain. But engaging the heart has never been one of Robyn's chief > selling points ("She Doesn't Exist" notwithstanding). A song like "The Yip > Song" underscores this shortcoming. Personally, I'd rather more things engaged my mind and fewer things made a vain attempt to appeal to my emotions. I'm not saying an appeal to my emotions will always fail, but that specific appeals to emotion by artists almost always fails. I don't believe this is some fault of mine. I believe it's a flaw in the artist's intent. People are very different from one another. There's no reason to believe that an appeal to one's emotions will be reflected in another's. Robyn does a great job of being personally emotional... that is to say he writes things that are emotional for him. If you don't grasp his emotional hook, that's fine... there's something ELSE in there for the general consumer (either clever ideas or juxtapositions or just crafty wordplay). People that write for the heart are either extraordinarily arrogant, naive or vapid and money-grubbing. Sometimes several at the same time. Note my number one complaint with Elvis Costello: too much crappy sentimentality. I can dig heaps of his work, but not all of it... and certainly not much in a row. An hour or two tops. I'd like to be able to check out a song when I'm NOT up for having my emotions manipulated and still find something wonderful. > Look at how cold and analytical your above language is. There, that's the > response which Robyn elicited. With a song about one of the saddest > experiences of any person's life. Instead of making you sad and teary, he > made you stroke your chin and deliberate. Hrrm. YAY! I wish more people would stop and deliberate before bursting into tears. Robyn wrote a song that can make you all teary and sad if you're up for it, but has all sorts of other intricacies that you can explore when you're not. If the goal of a song is to make its listeners teary, then it's not going to be a very good song for most interesting people. Either it's going to appeal to the basest and least sophisticated emotions (like a Spielberg movie or a Clapton song), or it's written by an arrogant person who thinks everyone feels the same about complex things (like most Elvis songs... either, really). Anyway, give me brainy over emotional any day. Then again, my friend Tom just gave me a sticker that says "My world is cold and without hope." I disagree, but he's entitled to an opinion. > If that makes it a successful song for you, so be it. Yay again! Je. np: John Oswald/Plunderphonic : plexure (WOW!!! if you haven't heard this... wow... you're missing something neato.) ________________________________________________________ J A Brelin Capuchin ________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Feb 1999 15:34:11 -0500 (EST) From: Aaron Mandel Subject: Re: 22/7 danger! spoilers for Pi, if you haven't seen it yet. On Wed, 3 Feb 1999, Capuchin wrote: > The fellow who wrote this film has a VERY poor understanding of > mathematical modelling, dynamic nonlinear systems, and numbers as a whole. > The moment they started talking about numbers underlying all patterns in > nature, I tensed up. I hate it when people go on about these things as if > their making sense. i expected to hate the movie for that reason... most people think higher math is really complicated arithmetic, and don't realize that the calculus they learned in high school was taught as arithmetic too. it's no crime not to realize these things (how would one know, and what in most people's math education would make them want to look behind the curtain?) but nevertheless it means the portrayal of math in movies usually makes me wince. in fact, as i write this, Momus is singing "The war begins at school when you rebel against the maths teacher / Who touched you up behind his desk / And ends when you've failed your final maths exam / And had your first success with sex" because you don't need math once you're doing adult things like sex, no doubt. sorry, where was i? oh, i liked Pi. > And he plugs that in where his little cube of parts was connected... > because hey, it accepts the same instructions, sure. my reading of the film is that it took place in the last few days of the world's life, when the flimsiness of god's creation shows through. absurd coincidences happen because, well, the world isn't as complex as it looks. people (businesspeople, especially) behave only according to instinct as the universe totters along like the robots that Doctor Who has fooled into entering a situation its programming does not account for. god managed to fool us all with processes that look random -- at least, random enough -- until they begin decaying toward a fixed point. sort of the reverse of The Truman Show, then. the detail and complexity of the real world is a hoax set up to entertain us; in REAL reality, everything works out just so. just two things made me grimace: 1. when Max tells the rabbis "you've probably written down every possible 216-letter combination already, haven't you?" uh, Max, i suspect they haven't gotten around to every last one yet... 2. a pet peeve of mine is how in cartoons, whenever someone is hit with the Smart-O-Ray, the first thing out of their mouths is "the square root of 860137719583.21 is 927436.1!" i realize that doing lightning calculation was just a little game Max played with the little girl next door as opposed to being the whole substance of his genius, but it hit a sore spot for me. a ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V8 #35 ******************************