From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V7 #458 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Saturday, December 12 1998 Volume 07 : Number 458 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [Re: Uncorrected personality traits] [Joel Mullins ] Re: Album Ratings [Joel Mullins ] Robyn chat [Joel Mullins ] best egyptians live tape? [dwdudic@erols.com (David W. Dudich)] Viv (sorry no classical music content) [DDerosa5@aol.com] Sonicnet chat [desmond in a tutu ] Re: Album Ratings [amadain ] Re: Uncorrected personality traits [amadain ] Re: Viv (sorry no classical music content) [Gary Assassin ] Re: Album Ratings [MARKEEFE@aol.com] Re: Album Ratings [amadain ] Re: Uncorrected personality traits [Charles Gillett ] Top Albums of the Decade! [MARKEEFE@aol.com] Re: Album Ratings [Ben ] Chat [griffith ] Re: Uncorrected personality traits [amadain ] "I know my rights, man." "You don't know shit, Lebowski." ["Capitalism B] Re: Beat the Boots! ["Capitalism Blows" ] Re: Album Ratings [desmond in a tutu ] Re: Album Ratings [Eb ] Re: "I know my rights, man." "You don't know shit, Lebowski." [Terrence ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 02:39:12 -0800 From: Joel Mullins Subject: [Re: Uncorrected personality traits] Message-ID: <367247B5.43DC@swbell.net> Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 02:38:45 -0800 From: Joel Mullins Reply-To: skmull@swbell.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-SBXA (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amadain Subject: Re: Uncorrected personality traits References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > >Narcissistic Personality: > >================== > >I'm the Greatest - Ringo Starr "I Am The Greatest" by A House would also work. And he's definitely not kidding. Has anyone ever listened to A House? Most of their albums are just a little better then mediocre, but I Am The Greatest is a kick-ass album. There's another song on that album called "I Lied" that would definitely fit with some kind of disorder but I have no idea which one. - --Joel ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 02:46:12 -0800 From: Joel Mullins Subject: Re: Album Ratings > Firstly: "Groovy Decoy" is NOT A CLUNKER. In my own opinion, "Perspex > Island" is the only genuine clunker in the RH catalog, but this opinion is > somewhat disputed :). I'll have to agree with this. Both Groovy Decoy and Decay are great. And, in my humble opinion, Perspex Island IS his worst album. But it's still better than just about anything anyone else ever releases. > Secondly: I really hope another "Eye" vs. "Respect" debate is not looming > on the horizon. When I say I think "Eye" is his masterpiece, I am stating > my own personal opinion, and not attempting to start all that shit up again. I, personally, don't think Respect even compares to Eye. Eye is fucking amazing! But my vote for his masterpiece would have to be Element of Light. (I'm sorry, Susan, if I've started this debate again. I just wanted to get my two-cents in). - --Joel ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 02:51:43 -0800 From: Joel Mullins Subject: Robyn chat I don't know if someone has already mentioned this, but SonicNet is having a live chat session thingy with Robyn on December 14 at 6 pm eastern time. There's a plug-in you need to get first, so you'll need to go to this page and get that plug-in now. Here's the link: I apologize if this is old news. - --Joel ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 14:02:34 GMT From: dwdudic@erols.com (David W. Dudich) Subject: best egyptians live tape? On Sat, 12 Dec 1998 02:35:26 -0500 (EST), you wrote: > >>"Stand Back Dennis" seems to be a popular one, but the performance is >>mediocre at best. Yawn... > >This is the only tape of Robyn and the Egyptians that I own, and I've >nearly worn it out by playing it constantly. If it's mediocre, I'd >certainly be curious to hear what a good one sounds like (I'm serious). Tipitinas 1992...A gig in New Orleans with the Egyptians in an acostic format that NEVER sounded better.... I'd make you a copy, but I owe a lot of folks copies of the Rams Head gig (contact me, my branches). An other ideas in great egyptians tapes? -luther ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 16:41:59 EST From: DDerosa5@aol.com Subject: Viv (sorry no classical music content) I've been lurking on and off for a while, but must have missed the point where it became logical for Viv to dump me. I may be insufficiently maniacal for some, but have been a Robyn fan for over eleven years and sometimes got temporarily fanatical when he put out really good albums. I know some of you still doubt Viv's existence, perhaps mine moreso as a consequence, but ours is currently a linctup house. So wait yer turn... dave, off for probably another indeterminate period... ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 10:48:28 -0500 From: desmond in a tutu Subject: Sonicnet chat >From: maro@sonicnet.com (Maro Hagopian) >Subject: Robyn Hitchcock Chat Link > >Rock N' Roll Insider Chat >Hosted by SonicNet's Michael Goldberg & Gil Kaufman >Special Guest: Robyn Hitchcock >Monday, December 14, 6:00 PM (ET), 3:00 PM (PT) > >Link To: http://www.sonicnet.com/channels/ > >*Yahoo! Headline ->Does Robyn Hittchcock still wish he was a >pretty girl? >_______________________________________________ >Robyn Hitchcock's wit, weirdness and skewed melodies >play perfectly into the new Jonathan Demme >film "Storefront Hitchcock" and promise more strange >tracks on his untitled upcoming Warmer Bros. release >featuring cameos by R.E.M. Find out more from the man himself >_______________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 11:11:24 -0600 From: amadain Subject: Re: Album Ratings >And, in my humble opinion, Perspex Island IS his worst album. But it's >still better than just about anything anyone else ever releases. Well, I can't say as I would go that far. I can think of hundreds of albums I like better than "Perspex Island". >amazing! But my vote for his masterpiece would have to be Element of >Light. (I'm sorry, Susan, if I've started this debate again. I just >wanted to get my two-cents in). Understood. Hey, voting for E of L isn't starting the debate again necessarily. As I've always understood it, the acrimony isn't over "this is the best one" "NO, THIS is the best one". The "Respect" vs. "Eye" thing seems to have a bit more to do with general tastes in production. Love on ya, Susan P.S. Keep your hair on, Dave. I don't think Capuchin was all -that- serious. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 11:52:43 -0600 From: amadain Subject: Re: Uncorrected personality traits >I've always thought it was a spoof. Yes, I was thinking of portraits of the >personality types, not music written by people in need of therapy. It was >penned by John, anyway. > >If we're looking for only music actually written by those with personality >disorders that would eliminate half of pop music! I'm not entirely sure about that one. IMO we've all -got- disorders of some kind or another, in most cases they are very mild, but is there such a thing as a person with no disorders at all? And would they even be a person worth knowing? I wasn't trying to say that if you're going to use music for this purpose, you should only use the music of Syd Barrett :). I just think that using material that was obviously meant to be humorous might not be the best way to teach the concept. For example, I think a paranoid disorder is much better illustrated by Gary Numan's "Cars" than by Bob Dylan's "Talking John Birch Society Blues". Love on ya, MC Escher The Impossible Rapper ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 12:41:06 -0500 (EST) From: Gary Assassin Subject: Re: Viv (sorry no classical music content) Viv exists. I have witnessed her. You on the other hand are just a figment. ------------------------------------ If you have a condom and sunscreen SPF 15 or greater, than it's safe to look at http://www.panix.com/~gsa/index.html On Fri, 11 Dec 1998 DDerosa5@aol.com wrote: > I've been lurking on and off for a while, > but must have missed the point where it > became logical for Viv to dump me. > I may be insufficiently maniacal for some, > but have been a Robyn fan for over eleven years > and sometimes got temporarily fanatical when > he put out really good albums. > > I know some of you still doubt Viv's existence, > perhaps mine moreso as a consequence, > but ours is currently a linctup house. > > So wait yer turn... > > dave, off for probably another indeterminate period... > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 13:37:00 EST From: MARKEEFE@aol.com Subject: Re: Album Ratings In a message dated 98-12-12 11:52:13 EST, you write: << >And, in my humble opinion, Perspex Island IS his worst album. But it's >still better than just about anything anyone else ever releases. Well, I can't say as I would go that far. I can think of hundreds of albums I like better than "Perspex Island". >> Yeah, c'mon, seriously. Are there some of us who are so fanatical that even our *least* favorite Robyn Hitchcock album would make a Top 100 Favorite Albums of All Time list? Personally, I think "Perspex" would come in at around #800 for me, were I to have a list of my 1,000 favorite albums (and I actually have had a list of my favorite 500! (now trimmed down to the bare essential Top 250) -- anyone else out there so anal and geeky as to maintain a favorite albums list of this exaggerated length? or longer? << As I've always understood it, the acrimony isn't over "this is the best one" "NO, THIS is the best one". The "Respect" vs. "Eye" thing seems to have a bit more to do with general tastes in production. >> Apples and oranges, if ya ask me. I happen to like both of these albums a lot, although "Eye" is my favorite Hitchcock album. I think that the respective production approaches work equally well for each kind of album. I know there are those out there (indie rockers) who are disdainful of certain "types of production" -- usually that which is considered "over-produced," which is, in some people's eyes (indie rockers), a well-balanced mix of a clean recording. But I just think that's silly. Unless, of course, we're talking about the afore-dissed Mitchell Froom. Now *that's* over-produced! (no, really, it deserves mentioning more than just once a year :-)) - ------Michael K. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 13:11:35 -0600 From: amadain Subject: Re: Album Ratings > Yeah, c'mon, seriously. Are there some of us who are so fanatical that >even our *least* favorite Robyn Hitchcock album would make a Top 100 Favorite >Albums of All Time list? Oh, I'd say there probably are :). You and I are just not among them. We will now probably be burned as heretics. Film at 11. >actually have had a list of my favorite 500! (now trimmed down to the bare >essential Top 250) -- anyone else out there so anal and geeky as to maintain a >favorite albums list of this exaggerated length? or longer? Well, no, actually not, but I think I must be that anal and geeky because I thought, when I read this, "hey, that sounds like a cool idea". Love on ya, Susan ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 13:02:52 -0600 From: Charles Gillett Subject: Re: Uncorrected personality traits On Fri, 11 Dec 1998 15:24:51 -0600, amadain wrote: >>Narcissistic Personality: >>================== >>I'm the Greatest - Ringo Starr > >Wasn't he kidding? If we're talking about taking these songs straight, >lyrically, or taking them as -portraits- of that type of personality, then >you could also use Momus's "I Was Born To Be Adored By Women". I was too lazy to respond to the original post, but this Momus song was also the one which came to my mind. The song after it probably also indicates a certain personality type...anyway, "Born To Be Adored" is perhaps the standout track on an album that gets a little too cute (though overall it's good). I've yet to work up the grit it'll take to fork over the $20+ required to get one of his earlier records. For the past few months I've been followed around by Beth Orton. I don't know what I've been looking for in the "O" section (Oswald? O'Rourke?), but it seemed like every time I went into a CD store I'd find that damned Orton staring at me. I found this torturously disturbing, for some reason, even more so than the long period in my life about six years ago when I couldn't go anywhere without seeing death metal albums. Good old Rolling Stone appeared in my mail a couple of days ago (gotta keep up with what the kids are doing), and out pops the "Future of Music as Predicted by the Milk Industry" insert with that smirking mug on it...thus driven to the brink of insanity, I hopped out and bought _Trailer Park_. It's...okay. I've heard worse things. I've probably purchased worse things. The end. I'm currently amusing myself by reading old Eb screeds on DejaNews. Ha! - -- Charles Listening to: Dave Tarras ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 14:18:56 EST From: MARKEEFE@aol.com Subject: Top Albums of the Decade! So, the 90's are now nearly 90% over. In about one year's time, there will be the inevitable onslaught of pulications listing out the best 'x' number albums of the decade. I say we beat 'em to the punch! Since there is still one year left to go in the decade, I think we should accordingly scale down from the standard Top 10 lists. So, (1) what does everyone think are the 9 albums most likely to be deemed by the media as the "best albums of the decade" and (more importantly) (2) what are your favorite 9 albums of the decade? Here're my lists: Media Top 9 (as they spring to mind): Nirvana: "Nevermind" Beck: "Odelay" Radiohead: "OK Computer" REM: "Automatic for the People" Massive Attack: "Blue Lines" Bob Dylan: "Time Out of Mind" Fugees: "The Score" Bjork: "Debut" (? -- one of hers, anyway) Oasis: "(What's the Story) Morning Glory?" I'm fairly certain that the first three on that list will rate really highly in most lists next year; the rest are iffy, I guess. British publications will undoubtedly list the Oasis album near the top, while Rolling Stone will have it at around #17. My Top 9 of the Decade (again, as they pop into my head): Radiohead: "OK Computer" Tindersticks: "Tindersticks" (1st) Neutral Milk Hotel: "In the Aeroplane Over the Sea" Marillion: "Brave" Robyn Hitchcock: "Eye" Jack: "Pioneer Soundtracks" Jeff Buckley: "Grace" Chills: "Submarine Bells" Verlaines: "Ready to Fly" (2 Kiwi albums! -- surprised even myself!) 1999 album that I'm hoping will be great enough to fill the 10th slot on my Top 10 of the 90's list: new The The, scheduled for spring release. Don't get me wrong; I'd be thrilled if "Jewels for Sophia" were that good of an album. I'm thinking it will be quite good, but probably not amazing. Actually, the The The album will probably also not be that good, but I can't help hoping that it will be. My favorite album next year will probably be something totally unexpected, as it so often is. Album in my reserve #10 slot, in case nothing really incredible comes out next year: Pavement: "Slanted and Enchanted." - -------Michael K. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 14:44:15 -0500 From: Ben Subject: Re: Album Ratings > around #800 for me, were I to have a list of my 1,000 favorite albums (and I > actually have had a list of my favorite 500! (now trimmed down to the bare > essential Top 250) -- anyone else out there so anal and geeky as to maintain a > favorite albums list of this exaggerated length? or longer? To all those poor souls who have their records rated in a top whatever list, please do the right thing and destroy it! ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 12:14:15 -0800 (PST) From: griffith Subject: Chat I just received an email stating that Robyn will be on SonicNet Chat monday 14 December at 6:00pm EST. Check out www.sonicnet.com/station griffith = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Griffith Davies hbrtv219@csun.edu ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 14:37:21 -0600 From: amadain Subject: Re: Uncorrected personality traits >I was too lazy to respond to the original post, but this Momus song was >also the one which came to my mind. Oh come on! He was mostly just taking the piss out of Barry White! :) >The song after it probably also indicates a certain personality type... "Coming In A Girl's Mouth" is actually rather charming, I think. But then I'm the sort of person who thinks "What are the cultural implications of coming in a girl's mouth" is not an entirely invalid question, and something worth pondering in odd navel-gazing-ish moments :). Anyway that line about John The Baptist- "like my cock is John The Baptist saying 'One day someone greater than me shall come'/Or some Moses who leads an entire nation across her tongue/To Liberation" fills me with glee! >anyway, "Born To Be Adored" is perhaps the standout track on an album that >gets a little >too cute (though overall it's good). Actually, I think it's all pretty great. "What Are You Wearing?", "MC Escher", "Everyone I Ever Slept With", and the aforementioned unmentionable track are my favorites. "Lucretia Borgia" cracks me up- "We are really not that thirsty, Lucretia Borgia/ We will not take two goblets of wine". I can see how it might all be a little too precious for some tastes, but not mine. I guess I'm exactly the sort of person he writes for. The only thing I unequivocally don't like on the album is "Harry K-Tel". What brought that particular fit of viciousness on, I wonder? >I've yet to work up the grit it'll take to fork over >the $20+ required to get one of his earlier records. From what I understand, they aren't all worth it. "Tender Pervert" definitely is worth your bucks tho. >even more so than the long period in my life about six years ago when I >couldn't go anywhere without seeing death metal albums. Good old Rolling >Stone appeared in my mail a couple of days ago (gotta keep up with what >the kids are doing), I understand, believe me. I feel the same way about Jewel. Why is Jewel everywhere? Is there some way to stop it? Love on ya, Susan with nothing else to do on a Saturday afternoon, I guess n.p.- The Ventures' Christmas Album ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 12:40:14 PST From: "Capitalism Blows" Subject: "I know my rights, man." "You don't know shit, Lebowski." you see young capooch, in this song the giants are using a literary device known as "satire," which, granted, can be a little bewildering. the "key" to "getting" "satire" is in understanding that the words are not to be taken "literally." although frankly, it's not really *that* far underneath the surface here. i mean, jesus jeme, if someone were to compare *you* to napolean, would you take that as a compliment? of course you wouldn't. and do you really think *any* sane person would sing approvingly such lines as "achieve our manifest destiny," and "seized the whole southwest from mexico"? of course you don't. they list off polk's "accomplishments" exactly as you would find them in any fucking history textbook or encylopaedia. "made the british sell the oregon territory"? how did the british come to have it in their possession in the first place? the took it by force. you know, the original inhabitants of that region didn't have any say, weren't a part to any of the negotiations. "made sure the tariffs fell"? utter fantasy to suppose that any country in history ever industrialized (or for that matter, could even survive for more than about fourteen seconds) without MASSIVE state intervention in the economy. in our own case, we started out by slaughtering off the indigenous population and stealing their land, then using slaves to pick the cotton. it continued down through the civil war (an imperialist undertaking if ever there was one) through to the new deal, military keynesianism, and the reagan administration, the most protectionist in history -- to name just a very few. (reagan was quite proud of his protectionist "success," by the way. so don't bring any of that reagan-as-free-market-champion bullshit in here.) not even a hint of sarcasm, jeme? surely you jest? to top it off, of course, they support it with wonderfully whimisical music, and backing vocals. call it "happy music for troubled times," if you like. but to suggest that it's "blatant praise for an unpraised president" is kwazy! i have NOTHING AT ALL against either Flavour Of Night or Ted, Woody And Junior. even less against The Lizard. all i'm sayin' is, i can think of a lot of other songs i'd love to hear him do live on piano. in fact, how about an *entire gig* on piano? yyyyyyikes! i bet even eb'd not only show up, but probably even leave a decent tip as well! <5/3/89 Cubby Bear Lounge, Chicago (Worst Case Scenarios) - RH&E with Peter Holsapple and Peter Buck in a great laid back show with many cool retro covers.> for the record, this was on 3/5/89. don't bother. it's crap. you know, i felt the same way about Happiness as i did about Welcome To The Dollhouse. certainly didn't find it boring or uninteresting. wasn't a waste of my time or anything like that. but, i just don't quite see what all the fuss is about. hey, they don't call it the "petroleum broadcasting system" for nothin'! <"Someone left the prawns out in the rain...."> one time ago, i was driving a guy home from work, and it was raining out. somebody had left their lawnmower out in the rain, and this guy that i was driving home just totally flipped his wig. it was riotously funny to see/hear him carrying on so. ok, i'm sure you had to be there. but this was years and years ago, and i *still* get a nice belly-laugh about that incident quite frequently. ha! i got that for free from the oft-maligned mrs. wafflehead! although i'm currently sitting here stewing in my own juices because both partridge outbid me for the ELEMENT OF LIGHT test pressing, and holden outbid me for THE DAY THEY ATE BRICK. <> I haven't seen the film, though. It's called "We All Stand Together" by Paul McCartney and The Frog Chorus from Paul's "Rupert The Bear" cartoon short that was shown before "Broad Street" in the UK. The demo version with Paul singing all the parts is really nice.> it never ceases to amaze me. hal seemingly owns a copy of every rare/bootleg video ever produced. i can't rank robyn albums against any other artists'. i have to have two separate lists. and even there, the robyn list is rife with ties. hey, i'd LOVE to see your top 250 if you've got it in easily cut-and-pastable format, michael. well, even if you don't, and you feel like typing it up... "so what we've got is the same old thing. congress essentially ignoring puerto rico and refusing to deal with the ethical ordeal of colonialism. how do you resolve being a so-called representative democracy and then holding on to a terrritory and permitting it no representation? puerto reco has one non-voting resident commissioner in congress. he goes around sniffing at the shoes and licking the heels of whoever he has to appeal to at any given moment. puerto ricans can be drafted to fight and die in u.s. wars but they can't vote for the president of the united states. explain that." --martin espada, 1998 ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 14:04:47 PST From: "Capitalism Blows" Subject: Re: Beat the Boots! the problem here, as ben mentioned, is that so many live tapes are so freely circulating, that it doesn't make much sense to buy a bootleg anyways unless you want it for the cover art, or you're a trying to complete the entire discography (merry FUCKING christmas, john and marc. you sons of bitches!) in which cases the existence of a "beat the boots" masterplan isn't going to deter one from buying the boot. anyway, the original producers of the bootlegs aren't seeing any money for them anymore. what *might* make more sense would be a "beat the promos" master plan. those damned promos usually fetch much more money than the bootlegs, and, of course, they're way better recordings. much more suitable for cd-ing than the boots, by and large. HISTORY is more less pirate, isn't it? and i'm not sure i think ROUT OF THE CLONES has been made obsolete by legitimate releases. some of it is compiled onto 1976-1981, but not all. i'm still not 100% convinced that it's a bootleg, though. finally found PREMONITION used (admittedly, i hadn't seen the inside of a record store for a while...) wow, this fucking RULES! fogerty's voice is in very fine form, there's a nice mix of creedence and solo material, the recording is stellar. and most of all, the band is phenomenal. dare i say, they're actually better than creedence themselves? they're just a little crunchier and a little livelier. the only name i recognize is kenny aronoff. i'd love to see him make a studio record with this band!! my audio discoveries of the year: neutral milk hotel, and the "shut up, little man" recordings. not sure which one is going to be more important to me in the long run, but they're both courtesy of eb. eb, you are the god damned daddy! thanks, brudda, for sorting through all the bullshit for us, and letting us know about the worthwhile stuff! i don't envy your job at all (but i guess that's why i'm just a lowly cretin, and you're THE EB.) ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 17:11:21 -0500 From: desmond in a tutu Subject: Re: Album Ratings also sprach Bayard: >His best is underwater moonlight, i often dream of trains, eye, or element >of light, depending on who you ask! (actually i guess it could be any one >of them depending on who you ask. but those are the ones i remember from >the last fave album poll. is there a fave album poll posted on >fegmania.org or just the fave song poll?) the only poll on the fegsite is the 1996 favorite robyn song poll that rex ran. it's not explicitly linked from anywhere, but the url is . woj ps. jeme, the correct way to refer to an url is to surround it by angle brackets and preface the actual address with a "URL:". for example, "to learn more about referencing uniform resource identifiers, see ." thus, it matters not if you end a sentence with a url or not. personally, i usually skip the "URL:" part. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 14:58:30 -0800 From: Eb Subject: Re: Album Ratings Michael K: >I actually have had a list of my favorite 500! (now trimmed down to the bare >essential Top 250) -- anyone else out there so anal and geeky as to maintain a >favorite albums list of this exaggerated length? or longer? No, not even me. You're paddling out there alone, buddy. ;) Eb ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 18:47:48 -0500 (EST) From: Terrence M Marks Subject: Re: "I know my rights, man." "You don't know shit, Lebowski." >>I don't see it, man. I think the song is blatant praise for an >>unpraised president. >you see young capooch, in this song the giants are using a >literary device known as "satire," which, granted, can be a little >bewildering. >here. i mean, jesus jeme, if someone were to compare *you* to >napolean, would you take that as a compliment? of course you >wouldn't. Y'know, that "Napoleon of the Stump" thing *was* meant as a compliment, historically. And there are worse people to be compared to than Napoleon. I'd say that "He gives speeches like Napoleon leads armies" counts as a pretty good compliment, given that Napoleon's army-leading record is, generally, pretty impressive. (Yeah, I know...the Russian campaign was absolutely miserable, and there was Waterloo and the loss of Egypt, but apart from that [eg. When he conquered most of Europe], he did well.) >and do you really think *any* sane person would sing approvingly >such lines as "achieve our manifest destiny," and "seized the >whole southwest from mexico"? of course you don't. I really think that you're projecting your anti-imperialism onto others, Eddie. I don't think that celebrating the growth of America makes one insane. It wasn't the nicest of things, but, well, we won. A fair number of people take/took pride in having a large, powerful country. >"made the british sell the oregon territory"? how did the british >come to have it in their possession in the first place? the took >it by force. you know, the original inhabitants of that region >didn't have any say, weren't a part to any of the negotiations. Yep. Historically speaking, if you didn't have the military power to back up what you say, the other nations didn't pay you much attention. That was the way diplomacy worked at that point in history (yeah, it's always like that, but it was even more prominent back then, which is part of why WWI happened. Both Austria-Hungary and Russia were on the verge of not being taken seriously as world powers). >"made sure the tariffs fell"? utter fantasy to suppose that any >country in history ever industrialized (or for that matter, could >even survive for more than about fourteen seconds) without MASSIVE >state intervention in the economy. [snip] >not even a hint of sarcasm, jeme? surely you jest? Yeah. We industrialized. And most people seem to think we're better off for it. I don't get why praising someone for tarriff-reduction is so insane. > >don't bother. it's crap. Man, Eddie, you don't like *anything*, do you? >i can't rank robyn albums against any other artists'. i have to >have two separate lists. and even there, the robyn list is rife >with ties. Rephrase: Man, Eddie, you don't like *anything except Robyn Hitchcock*, do you? Robyn's music is pretty good, but I don't think he's made an album in the same class as Odessey & Oracle, Dark Side of the Moon or Pet Sounds. Terrence Marks normal@grove.ufl.edu ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V7 #458 *******************************