From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V7 #275 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Thursday, July 16 1998 Volume 07 : Number 275 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: Rap Bastards! [nicastr@idt.net (Ben)] Re: critical support? [nicastr@idt.net (Ben)] Re: South Park/Reasons for not posting [nicastr@idt.net (Ben)] Re: Eb Wars - echoing Mark G [Eric Loehr ] Reasons for not watching "South Park" [JH3 ] Re: Reasons for not posting [Mark_Gloster@3com.com] Re: Eb Wars - echoing Mark G [Mark_Gloster@3com.com] Re: scott baio's pecker ["Glen E. Uber" ] Repo, Other list thangs [Ethyl Ketone ] Re: Reasons for not posting [Stewart Russell 3295 Analyst_Programmer ] new [dwdudic@erols.com (David W. Dudich)] Re: critical support? [M R Godwin ] Re: critical support? [nicastr@idt.net (Ben)] Robyn, in the news [nicastr@idt.net (Ben)] Re: Reasons for not watching "South Park" [Bayard ] Re: Reasons for not posting [Aaron Mandel ] Re: new [Terrence M Marks ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 00:31:15 -0500 From: nicastr@idt.net (Ben) Subject: Re: Rap Bastards! >Ben: >>>Christ. Listen, I didn't start the Dead flame wars -- others did. >> >>Well, the USA declared war on Japan before Japan declared war on the USA. >>But, as I remember, there was a little incident that *provoked* the USA... > >Oh, so writing a negative sentence about the Grateful Dead is just as >reprehensible as bombing Pearl Harbor. Well, maybe in your world.... Uhh... not until listmembers start exploding. Not to get into a "you started it!", "no you did!" argument, but my point was that you provoked the "Dead-wars". None of us indignant Deadheads started the ruckus out of the blue. >>I think what Ken was mainly referring to was your use of name-calling. >>"Petulant child", "indignant deadhead", "proggie", etc.... they are more >>clever than the standard brand of name-calling, but still the same thing. > >Well, boiling down an insult down to two glib words is a lot less violent >than posting rambling 6-7K tirades the ways others do. So you do admit you have done a bit of name-calling here? n.p. Son House - Delta Blues and Spirituals Why listen to Pigpen when there's Son House?!?! :) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 00:41:44 -0500 From: nicastr@idt.net (Ben) Subject: Re: critical support? >In Beck's case, nope, not at all. I think Beck may be remembered as THE >artist of the '90s, and I believe he will be around and flourishing for a I don't think that any one artist (or any 5, 10, or 20) will be remembered as THE artist of the 90's. I think the only deacades in the brief history of rock 'n' roll that you could make a list of truly definitive artists for would be the 50's or maybe the 60's, and that would still be pretty difficult. But since then, "rock" music has just become more and more diverse as to make any sort of absolute assesment of a decade nearly impossible. n.p. Son House - Delta Blues and Spritiuals (still) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 00:45:21 -0500 From: nicastr@idt.net (Ben) Subject: Re: South Park/Reasons for not posting >But, as for South Park, is the show as great as its adherents--George >Clooney, say--claim? Sometimes it's funny, sometimes it isn't. It certainly is better than most of the inane programs on TV. Since it's on Comedy Central it will probably vanish soon. :) n.p. Son House - Delta Blues and Spirituals (still still) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 00:54:34 -0400 (EDT) From: Eric Loehr Subject: Re: Eb Wars - echoing Mark G So, James -- are you saying that Eb is good-annoying or bad-annoying? ;-}} Eric the Lurker On Thu, 16 Jul 1998, James Dignan wrote: > >Is he correct in saying that he will be treated differently > >for things like starfucking than the rest of us? I'm almost > >positive that he is. > > agreed. I've mentioned knowing Martin Phillipps (Chills), Bob Scott (Bats), > Shayne Carter and Andrew Brough (Straitjacket Fits), David Kilgour (Clean) > and various members of the Verlaines on several occasions on this list over > the past few years. Although none is quite in the stellar league of some > other names mentioned, I have never received any abuse from anyone about > it. > > Eb raises the hackles of more than a few members of this list for his > opinions, but at least he has the courage to say them, knowing that he will > cause the occasional flame. Better that than never to have a worthwhile > opinion on anything. > > And think of how boring this list would have been without him for the last > couple of years! There are a handful of fegs I always look out for the > posts of, because they are usually worthwhile. Eb is right at the top of > that list, along with The Great Quail and Susan D. (there are others, never > you fear, sticking their latex fins above the surface of some coastal > region, and from the wilds of Australia and Canada to the swamplands of > Florida and Bath, and all points in between...) > > Basically, what I'm saying is: don't lay off Eb completely - a lot of his > opinions are just that and as such need to be half of a debate. BUT try to > keep it a debate, rather than degenerating into flame wars. Don't single > him out as "Fegmania's most wanted". And fer feg's sake steer well clear of > attacking the person - go for the ball, not the player, otherwise you will > be yellow carded, or worse! > > James > > > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Jul 1998 23:53:16 -0500 From: JH3 Subject: Reasons for not watching "South Park" Daniel Barkhouse writes: >I'd appreciate hearing some feedback from other Fegs about this show. I >am a part-time teacher and I find it more than a little disturbing that >the majority of my middle school students absolutely adore it. That *is* disturbing. However, it would be even more disturbing if they were all really into "Days of Our Lives." >I read >TIME, Newsweek, Rolling Stone articles on the programme, but have to >confess that I have not seen much other than a Web clip of one of the >show's eight-year-old characters drop-kicking a baby. You haven't missed anything - the show consists mostly of drop-kicking babies, though occasionally you'll see a cute puppy in there too. >Between that and >DVDA, I can't say that I'm motivated towards it. What is going on in our >culture that this sort of thing is as wildly popular as it is? Personally, I blame the Internet. >And nail >me for being anal if you like, but it's my feeling that something has >happened within the popular culture within the past ten years or so that >makes events like the Jonesboro episode almost understandable... In all seriousness here, I don't think you can legitimately blame tasteless teevee shows, or anything else in popular culture, for the outbreak of youth violence. I know you're a teacher so please don't take this personally, but I've been saying for years (though not in this forum, until now) that the growing tendency in the last 20 years to force "self-esteem" down the throats of little kids is creating a generation of monsters. Parents are abandoning traditional discipline and the imbuing of moral values in favor of telling their little brats that they're the greatest creatures who ever breathed, that they should never have to feel like they ever do anything wrong, etc. etc. Their egos are getting built up to dizzying heights, but often on a foundation of nothing. So as soon as they experience a tiny bit of failure or rejection, the edifice crumbles, they can't handle the poisonous mix of anger and self-loathing, and out come the AK-47's. Sorry, I just had to say that. If you all think I'm a conservative now, so be it. >Circa Tarantino, peut-etre? Touche! >But, as for South Park, is the show as great as its adherents--George >Clooney, say--claim? Definitely! John "I'd still like to see Robyn and the Chef doing a 'Wafflehead' duet" Hedges ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Jul 1998 22:23:48 -0700 From: Mark_Gloster@3com.com Subject: Re: Reasons for not posting Daniel barked alone: >>10. It's time for South Park! >I'd appreciate hearing some feedback from other Fegs about this show.... >But, as for South Park, is the show as great as its adherents--George >Clooney, say--claim? It is shocking and clever. It is hard to imagine anything like that ever getting on tv. Friends tape it for me because I'm not a cable guy or gal. It's a little like the first time I saw Saturday Night Live, National Lampoon, Benny Hill, snuck in to see Flesh Gordon. It's deffinitely NOT sophisticated in any way, but it can be funny. I think the whole first season was funny. It's been a little hit-and-miss this season. I think there's always something very oddly funny in every episode. Instead of trying to answer if this material is appropriate for viewers of any specific age, I suppose I wouldn't let my parents watch it. I'm happily vasectomized, so I don't have to worry about polluting the minds of children. Oh. My cats really like Cartman. I hope this helps in your quest for continuing education. - -markg ("I can't seem to find the man in the boat, mayor.") BTW: I saw Something About Mary last night. It was surprisingly funny. Some _very_ low comedy, but pretty well done. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Jul 1998 22:26:47 -0700 From: Mark_Gloster@3com.com Subject: Re: Eb Wars - echoing Mark G >So, James -- are you saying that Eb is good-annoying or bad-annoying? I think the answer here is yes. - -sharkofextremeannoyance ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Jul 1998 22:50:19 -0700 (PDT) From: "Glen E. Uber" Subject: Re: scott baio's pecker On Wed, 15 Jul 1998, Capitalism Blows wrote: > at ringler's the other week, capuchin asked which robyn song he thought > would best lend itself to a ska cover (having already decided on > Somewhere Apart, so i guess it was kind of a rhetorical question.) my > immediate reaction was The Man Who Invented Himself, but the more i > think about it, the more i'm convinced that the song i'd really love to > hear skaified is Let Me Put It Next To You. Definitely "Midnight Fish". The proof? Play the _Groovy Decay_ LP version at 45 RPM. QED, - -g- - ----------==========**********O**********==========--------- Glen Uber uberg@sonic.net "When I read about the evils of drinking, I gave up reading." --Henny Youngman - ----------==========**********O**********==========--------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Jul 1998 23:30:58 -0700 From: Ethyl Ketone Subject: Repo, Other list thangs > David W. Dudich penned: >> A little poll: How many people on here have seen Repo Man more >>than five times? I have. Ah, well, if I really like a film, I will see it anytime it plays - and with 3 rep houses on my side of the bay, that might be fairly often! So I'd say I'm upwards of a dozen viewings on this. Only 4 or so on Sid and Nancy, which is a great film, but I just can't stand to hear "Siiiiid" whined by Chloe Webb all that often (talk about annoying!). Close to 40 on Blade Runner, 12 on Brazil (or pretty much any other Gilliam film) and upwards of 20 on Apocalypse Now. And quite honestly, I'm close to double digits on nearly all of Tarkovskys films, but that is rather revealing, isn't it? My favorite Alex Cox film - for the pure insanity of it - is Straight to Hell (A story of blood, money, guns, coffee, and sexual tension). It never shows at the rep houses but is probably on video. Starring Joe Strummer, the Pogues, Elvis Costello (as the butler), with cameos by Jim Jarmusch, Dennis Hopper and Grace Jones. One of the Pogues characters is named "Repo McMahanon" or something like that. 1987. A marvelous play on spaghetti westerns, it is actually a spoof of an even more obscure and harder to find film, "A Fistful of Travellers Checks," which I saw once and have never been able to track down since. (Hint - if anyone has any info I'd love it - it's not in the IMDb). OK, I'll stop on film. > Eb writes: >Well, look at it this way: Why would a Feg choose NOT to express an opinion >about some artist, when said artist's name comes up? Is it more likely >because he/she is timid to offer an independent view, or because he/she >simply isn't familiar enough with the artist to have a confident opinion? The latter for some of us Eb. There are names of musicians and bands that fly back and forth on this list that I have never heard of but this is a good thing. I read these posted debates. And when I am in the retail music outlet of my choice, I search out new stuff. It's informing, not to mention lively. And since soundtracks and early music are the only things I really have any "knowledge" of (limited, albeit), it's refreshing to hear about new stuff. (And RH, of course). This list is populated by an amazing group of people who not only think, but are capable of being articulate about what they think. It feels like a group of friends... I enjoy reading the posts and respond when it's relevant and not redundant. I suspect a secret world government plot against us however! Additives to the drinking water? Something in your coffee perhaps (or coke if you are an engineer)? I swear this list is the liveliest I've ever seen it! Since I can barely keep up, I suspect some of you get this list at your work... Re: South park - I'm curious about the appeal. Having only seen still images and they look rather crude, I am baffled at the popularity of this show. A majority of the folks I work with watch the show - and this is a bunch of very critical artists, engineers and designers working in games. Not owning a TV, I have never seen it. But I must ask why... Take my eyes, I've used them. Carrie n.p.: Zbigniew Preisner - soundtrack to "Dekalog" - a film by Krysztof Kieslowski "Questions are a burden for others. Answers are a prison for oneself." **************************************************************************** M.E.Ketone/C.Galbraith meketone@ix.netcom.com cgalbraith@psygnosis.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 08:34:12 +0100 (BST) From: Stewart Russell 3295 Analyst_Programmer Subject: Re: Reasons for not posting >>>>> "Daniel" == Daniel Barkhouse writes: >> 10. It's time for South Park! Daniel> I'd appreciate hearing some feedback from other Fegs about Daniel> this show. I wouldn't be without it. I don't think kids would get the subtlety of some of the remarks. The show's a big hit here in the Dictionary Department, and even some of us nuance-aware folks only picked up some of the humour on the second or third viewing. (Hint: Just about everything that Cartman's mom says is a double entendre.) It's pretty harmless. Doubtless there'll be some killjoys who want to ban it, and a junior psycho who'll claim that "South Park & sugar cereal made me do it." - -- Stewart C. Russell Analyst Programmer, Dictionary Division stewart@ref.collins.co.uk HarperCollins Publishers use Disclaimer; my $opinion; Glasgow, Scotland ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 04:33:30 -0400 (EDT) From: Terrence M Marks Subject: Re: South Park/Reasons for not posting On Thu, 16 Jul 1998, Ben wrote: > >But, as for South Park, is the show as great as its adherents--George > >Clooney, say--claim? > > Sometimes it's funny, sometimes it isn't. It certainly is better than most > of the inane programs on TV. Since it's on Comedy Central it will probably > vanish soon. :) Well, it's in the top 5 cable programs, in terms of ratings. Which means that it beats everything on UPN. Put together. Personally, I think it's pretty good; better than most anything else on Comedy Central (the network that once brought you days with 10 hours of Saturday Night Live, 8 hours of "Heathers" and 2 hours of Soap. [nb. Same episodes of SNL/Soap each time.]) It isn't good enough to become the ubiquitous cultural phenomenon that it is though. (Ubiquitous cultural phenomena are never *really* good enough to become ubiquitous cultural phenomena.) It's half jokes and half shock value. Am I saying that I don't like shock value? Well, the show amuses me, but I don't see shock-for-the-sake-of-shock as being a hallmark of quality, generally. np-Spirit: Son of Spirit. (Don't buy that album. Too soft, too bland. Ed Cassidy sleepwalks through most tracks. The lead guitar is unimpressive; you'd never guess that Randy California used to play with Hendrix...) Terrence Marks normal@grove.ufl.edu ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 06:02:11 -0700 (PDT) From: Danielle Subject: Muggins (mostly Eb, a little techno) Once more unto the breach... The Kenster said: >Perhaps it has to do with your history of being argumentative, insulting, >and hurtful on a list that is generally friendly and helpful. Good *god*. I don't believe I’ve heard anything quite so ridiculous since the Costello-l flame wars of last November. If people here get their feelings hurt by posts from dear old Ebby, I'm a little concerned about their abilities to function normally when they move away from the screen. ;) >Surely you know what is in your heart when you bait others and drop >insults in the presumed hope that people will respond, only for you to >unleash a torrent of abuse upon them. > Well now, there's a creative interpretation. Certainly is! What's in Eb’s heart is a mystery to us all, but speculating upon its moral fibre is a bit... *naff*, isn't it? Once again, I bring out my tired old response to this one and dust it off: if Eb insults one of the sensitive singer-songwriters (Neil Finn, Paul Kelly, et al) - or as he calls them, 'Blandies' - whom I like, and he calls me a silly ditz with no taste (or worse) as he is wont to do, I *laugh*. I insult him back. For example, I tell him that confessing to a fondness for Emerson Lake and Palmer is utterly sad. I tell him that no one should admit to liking a band whose members wore capes without irony. ;) And that's the point of what Eb said later about his exchanges with Woj. There's a good-natured, humorous tone to a lot of those digs, but some of you don’t seem to see it. Deep, cleansing breaths, all. >My guess is that the silent polite >majority hold their tongues at most of your antics, so the criticism you >do hear is just a sampling. Can I give an emphatic 'I like Eb' cheer here? I'm not silent or polite, and I'm probably not in the oh-so-earnest moral majority, (for which I am profoundly grateful) but anyway... >At some point, you gotta reckon its time to saddle up and head off to >another town (listserv). How patronising. You could conceivably be justified if Eb's contributions to this list were nothing but negative and content-less. But it's obvious that they aren't. Telling someone to leave a list just because they rub you up the wrong way... lordy. Next you'll be telling us to stay on topic. Do you give detentions too? Ebbed (hey, that really works!): > How about this attack on me, Danielle? Just like > being back with the old > poops on COSTELLO-L again, eh? Woo. Perhaps Ken's real name is Tom! I dunno, maybe it’s me. If I'm on a list, some people automatically start treating you like the anti-christ. Shall we try it out somewhere else? :) And back to the music. > I think Beck may be remembered as THE artist of the '90s, Agreed, probably. But: > As for the Prodigy, they really aren't that much of a critic's choice -- > they received lots of press, but it was mostly not-so-informed > mainstream critics completing assignments to write about the big Electronica > phenomenon (which never quite took off). And once again I say *in America*. It never took off *in America*. Is the US the only country which doesn't get it yet? Now, I'm not such a fan of the Prodigy (though I'm quite fond of a bit of 'I got the poison! I got the remedy! I got the pulsating rhythmical remedy!'), but dammit, there are gazillions of other techno (electronica is an annoying word) or techno-influenced artists who are worthwhile and interesting and significant. And I'm not even that knowledgeable about the genre. Ben said: > So you do admit you have done a bit of name-calling here? I have to wonder, does no one appreciate a bit of well-honed insulting rhetoric any more? Maybe I was born in the wrong century... Oh, thumbs up on South Park. Mostly. The leg that was Patrick Duffy really did it for me. Danielle, feeling like I've written this post before somewhere, and equally confused by Scott Baio's entree into the melee, though I did have an embarrassing crush on him as a child _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 13:29:02 GMT From: dwdudic@erols.com (David W. Dudich) Subject: new On Thu, 16 Jul 1998 00:24:49 -0400 (EDT), you wrote: >In Beck's case, nope, not at all. I think Beck may be remembered as THE >artist of the '90s, and I believe he will be around and flourishing for a >very long time. Wothout a doubt...all of the musical culture of the past 40 years recombined in one man...I'm just suprised radio plays him ("Is he rap?" "Is he folk?" "Is he HARD rock?" "Will our 16 yr old Led Zepplin fans listen to this?" (note-not a crack on all of zeppelin- Their acoustic songs were generally quite nice--even if 50% of the lyrics are complete crap)) . As for the Prodigy, they >really aren't that much of a critic's choice -- they received lots of >press, but it was mostly not-so-informed mainstream critics completing >assignments to write about the big Electronica phenomenon (which never >quite took off). Well, Americans are big on "guitar rock." Yes, we are stupid. Electronic dance music is big in the rest of the world, I have heard. Since top 40 stations died (there is a resurrgence, thankfully), the fragmented radio stations couldn't fit it into their formats. Not really a heartfelt thing. And the album only received >OK reviews, actually -- the idea of the Prodigy, Charismatic Nucleus of the >Latest Rebellious Musical Craze, was larger than the reality of their >music. Me, I didn't even bother hearing the album -- I heard the previous >one (which most of the band's veteran fans like better), and it didn't win >me over. Meanwhile, all the Prodigy's recent radio hits seemed pretty >shallow to me. Not too durable. Lots of initial "grab-you hipness," not >much else. I wasn't motivated to hear more. Well, hit singles generally are NOT known for depth...I am re-reading the KLF manual, which talks about all this...I'm gonna have to get it online... -luther ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 15:01:23 +0100 (BST) From: M R Godwin Subject: Re: critical support? On Thu, 16 Jul 1998, Ben wrote: > I don't think that any one artist (or any 5, 10, or 20) will be remembered > as THE artist of the 90's. I think the only deacades in the brief history > of rock 'n' roll that you could make a list of truly definitive artists for > would be the 50's or maybe the 60's, and that would still be pretty > difficult. But since then, "rock" music has just become more and more > diverse as to make any sort of absolute assesment of a decade nearly > impossible. OK, I can do this: _50s_ Chuck Berry Buddy Holly Elvis Presley, Scotty Moore, Bill Black and DJ Fontana Little Richard Eddie Cochran Gene Vincent and the Blue Caps (Cliff Gallup lineup) Howling Wolf Lonnie Donegan Jerry Lee Lewis The Everly Brothers Bubbling under: Ricky Nelson with James Burton on guitar, Bo Diddley, Larry Williams, Fats Domino, Bill Haley and the Comets ... _60s_ The Jimi Hendrix Experience The Rolling Stones The Beatles The Kinks The Byrds Syd Barrett and the Pink Floyd The Velvet Underground Love The Doors Bob Dylan and the Hawks Bubbling under: Jefferson Airplane, Peter Green's Fleetwood Mac, The Cream, Donovan, The Bonzos, Simon and Garfunkel, Otis Redding, The Temptations ... That was more difficult than I expected - many of these are post-65 acts. It might be easier to split the 60s into pre-psychedelic and post-psychedelic phases. I think this is the start of the increasing diversity of popular music which makes it so difficult to select 'definitive' artistes for the 80s and 90s. > > n.p. Son House - Delta Blues and Spritiuals (still) Really excellent choice. My favourite Son House track is the 'Empire State Express' duet with Al Wilson. 'Death Letter' is good too - it begins: "Got a letter this morning How do you reckon it read?" which is the basis of Captain Beefheart's 'Ah feel like Ah-cid': "Got a letter this morning How do you reckon it red 'n' blue 'n' green all through my head" But that's by the way. - - Mike Godwin "Till I'm wheezing like a bus stop Running up the stairs gonna meet you on the rooftop" (Thinks: Gosh, I didn't even _remember_ the Lovin' Spoonful) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 10:56:14 -0500 From: nicastr@idt.net (Ben) Subject: Re: critical support? >_50s_ >Chuck Berry >Buddy Holly >Elvis Presley, Scotty Moore, Bill Black and DJ Fontana >Little Richard >Eddie Cochran >Gene Vincent and the Blue Caps (Cliff Gallup lineup) >Howling Wolf >Lonnie Donegan >Jerry Lee Lewis >The Everly Brothers >Bubbling under: Ricky Nelson with James Burton on guitar, Bo Diddley, >Larry Williams, Fats Domino, Bill Haley and the Comets ... > You could also add most of the catalouge of Sun and Chess....! >_60s_ >The Jimi Hendrix Experience >The Rolling Stones >The Beatles >The Kinks >The Byrds >Syd Barrett and the Pink Floyd >The Velvet Underground >Love >The Doors >Bob Dylan and the Hawks > >Bubbling under: Jefferson Airplane, Peter Green's Fleetwood Mac, >The Cream, Donovan, The Bonzos, Simon and Garfunkel, Otis Redding, The >Temptations ... > But it would only be fair to add.... The Yardbirds (for the holy trinity of guitar gods) The Four Tops Smoky Robinson & The Miracles Marvin Gaye Ray Charles Fairport Convention The Beach Boys The Who etc.... (there are so many more) >That was more difficult than I expected - many of these are post-65 acts. >It might be easier to split the 60s into pre-psychedelic and >post-psychedelic phases. I think this is the start of the increasing >diversity of popular music which makes it so difficult to select >'definitive' artistes for the 80s and 90s. Agreed... by the time the 70's gets in to full swing you've got so many artists doing anything and everything they can think of, that a "definitive" overview becomes the size of War and Peace! n.p. Stevie "pre-Ray" Vaughan - In The Begining ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 10:59:42 -0500 From: nicastr@idt.net (Ben) Subject: Robyn, in the news From the Richard Thompson list (where flame wars are unheard of!): >FYI, for you Robyn Hitchcock fans, he appears, according to the NYT's >review, in the new Cameron Diaz film There's Something About Mary. >Apprently he pops up throughout the film providing musical commentary on >the action. Anyone seen it yet? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 11:00:12 -0400 (EDT) From: Bayard Subject: Re: Reasons for not watching "South Park" On Wed, 15 Jul 1998, JH3 wrote: > I've been saying for years (though not in this forum, until now) that the > growing tendency in the last 20 years to force "self-esteem" down the > throats of little kids is creating a generation of monsters. Parents are > abandoning traditional discipline and the imbuing of moral values in favor > of telling their little brats that they're the greatest creatures who ever > breathed, that they should never have to feel like they ever do anything > wrong, etc. etc. Their egos are getting built up to dizzying heights, but > often on a foundation of nothing. So as soon as they experience a tiny bit > of failure or rejection, the edifice crumbles, they can't handle the > poisonous mix of anger and self-loathing, and out come the AK-47's. The spoiled baby grows into... The escapist teenager, who's... The adult alcoholic, who's... The middle-aged suicide! OY! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 11:09:22 -0400 (EDT) From: Aaron Mandel Subject: Re: Robyn, in the news On Thu, 16 Jul 1998, Ben wrote: > >FYI, for you Robyn Hitchcock fans, he appears, according to the NYT's > >review, in the new Cameron Diaz film There's Something About Mary. > >Apprently he pops up throughout the film providing musical commentary on > >the action. Anyone seen it yet? i haven't seen it, but i think someone has got robyn confused with Jonathan Richman. a ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 11:24:55 -0400 (EDT) From: Aaron Mandel Subject: Re: Reasons for not posting On Wed, 15 Jul 1998, Daniel Barkhouse wrote: > I read TIME, Newsweek, Rolling Stone articles on the programme, but > have to confess that I have not seen much other than a Web clip of one > of the show's eight-year-old characters drop-kicking a baby. one of the show's better scenes. there have been good episodes and bad ones (with the latter increasing in frequency, i fear the thing may grind to a halt pretty soon) but nothing i've read in the press captures the spirit of the show. watch a few episodes and see what you think... i think a lot of it does go over kids' heads, though the problem is that still leaves a lot of jokes about asses for them to snicker over. still, how on earth did this prepare the way for jonesboro? a ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 11:43:14 -0400 (EDT) From: Terrence M Marks Subject: Re: new > On Thu, 16 Jul 1998 00:24:49 -0400 (EDT), you wrote: > > >In Beck's case, nope, not at all. I think Beck may be remembered as THE > >artist of the '90s, and I believe he will be around and flourishing for a > >very long time. > Wothout a doubt...all of the musical culture of the past 40 > years recombined in one man...I'm just suprised radio plays him ("Is > he rap?" "Is he folk?" "Is he HARD rock?" "Will our 16 yr old Led > Zepplin fans listen to this?" (note-not a crack on all of zeppelin- > Their acoustic songs were generally quite nice--even if 50% of the > lyrics are complete crap)) As far as lyrics go, a rate of 50% crap isn't that bad. Were you to tally it up, song by song, I think The Kinks would run about 30% crap, the Beach Boys 70%, Squeeze 15%...well, this is basically turning into an exercise of associating numbers arbitrarily with groups, but what I'm saying is that a lot of groups, even those associated with good lyric-writing abilities, have a fair portion of bad lyrics. (Now that I've committed myself, I ought to ask how we define lyrics as "complete crap". What counts as? Yes-style unrelated pretty words? Kinks-style social commentary that sometimes doesn't quite work[1]? High Llamas-style related pretty words? Velvet Underground-style gritty and ugly pictures of a bleak, desparate life?) 1: I'm referring not to the entire Kinks catalog but certain bits of it like Preservation II, "Two Sisters", and some others. Likewise with VU. Terrence Marks normal@grove.ufl.edu ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V7 #275 *******************************