From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V7 #143 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Tuesday, April 14 1998 Volume 07 : Number 143 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: If you go chasing rabbits. . . . ["Capitalism Blows" ] D&D [Jim Moore ] this Portland Feg wants to go to S.F.! [Karen Reichstein ] Re: Trip Shakespeare [Eb ] here we go again..... (0% RH) [tanter ] The 3 Robyns (no Neutral Milk Hotel content) [nicastr@idt.net (Ben)] Re: The 3 Robyns (no Neutral Milk Hotel content) [Mark_Gloster@3com.com] 3 Rs [tanter ] Mummery? [james.dignan@stonebow.otago.ac.nz (James Dignan)] When Robyn's old [Capuchin ] Wilde and Wilder [james.dignan@stonebow.otago.ac.nz (James Dignan)] Re: When Robyn's old [nicastr@idt.net (Ben)] Santa Cruz Dan Bern Fegathering (virtually quail-free content) [Mark Glos] Re: here we go again..... (0% RH) [KarmaFuzzz ] Re: 3 Rs ["Wookie Conscious" ] Re: Semicoatedfragilebiscuit... [Stewart Russell 3295 Analyst_Programmer ] An introduction ["West A. Moran" ] Re: Elton Vs. Robyn [dlang ] house of love [dwdudic@erols.com (David W. Dudich)] Re: house of love [Gary Assassin ] fwd: When Robyn's old [Russ Reynolds ] Re: house of love ["JH3" ] Re: house of love ["Caroline" ] Re: SO [Mark_Gloster@3com.com] fegSOs ["Chaney, Dolph L" ] Re: house of love [kenster@MIT.EDU (Ken Ostrander)] Re: fwd: When Robyn's old [Mike Runion ] Re: An introduction [donald andrew snyder ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 11:51:53 PDT From: "Capitalism Blows" Subject: Re: If you go chasing rabbits. . . . is it just me, or is catch-and-release kind of sadistic? i mean, it would be bad enough if you could somehow lassoo the fish, pull them up against their wills, let them flop around out of water for a while, and then throw them back. but, planting a freaking barbed *hook* in their mouths? ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 15:01:06 -0500 From: Natalie Jacobs Subject: Kristin Hersh, again again One last thing, then I'll shut up... Ms. Hersh is playing here in Ann Arbor on May 2. If there are any Ann Arbor/Detroit-area Fegs who are interested in seeing her, let me know and maybe we can arrange a mini Feg-gathering. n. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 14:08:00 -0500 From: Jim Moore Subject: D&D Terry quoth: >Is that as in "the collection was inspired by the cartoon" or as in "we're >trying to make it sound like we influenced some good music with some >crappy cartoon based on a crappy movie that only succeeded because it had >Jim Carrey in it"? I agree with everything you said here, dude, except the "crappy movie" part. You didn't think D&D was funny? Man, I laughed my dang ass off! But what do I know, I'm insane, Chuck. JM ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 12:24:32 -0700 (PDT) From: Karen Reichstein Subject: this Portland Feg wants to go to S.F.! Hey!! I hear Eddie and Capuchin are hitching their way down to S.F? Since my sis Carole got to go to Austin, well, I feel like I shouldn't miss out. I've never been to S.F, and I hear it's a lovely city, so this Portland Feg is gonna see if she can make it down there. Jeme and Eddie--you wouldn't, er, have any room in your vehicle, would you? I was about to buy a plane ticket, but if I can hitch a ride I'd be thrilled to pieces. Are there still tickets available for Storefront Hitchcock? Karen (who would even be willing to sing harmony with Capuchin on a long stretch of road...) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 13:26:02 -0700 (PDT) From: misplaced joan of arc Subject: Trip Shakespeare I used to see these guys play a lot in the late 80's. They were a Minneapolis institution and had an enormous following there. The band was made up of two (very attractive) brothers, both on guitar and vocals, an enormously tall bassist, who sang a mean soprano and wore the ugliest polyester slacks, and this tiny woman on drums, who looked like the type of person who would rather live in a trailer and raise horses. They had a great sense of humor and a most obscure look/sound about them - kinf of a postmodern psychedelic seventies band, totally self-aware, with strong guitar melodies and guys harmonizing in falsetto, but minus any wanky guitar solo. Unfortunately, they are the band, who's live show outshines their recordings. I highly recommend the album _Are You Shakespearienced?_, which contains the classic song "Toolmaster of Brainard," a song often quoted on MST3K (yet another Minneapolis institution). Onstage, during this song, one of the the singers (Matt Wilson) used to do an impromptu monologue, chock full of tongue-in-cheek toolmaster-like phallic references; completely different every time and always very clever. Their first album, I think it was called _The Applehead Man_, was also very good. Their third, _Across the Universe_, was the one they released after signing with a major label (I think it was WB, but not sure). It was to be their big break, but, unfortunately, it came out alongside the big testosterone grunge boom, so it was highly unmarketable. I personally think it is great, but I might be biased - all of the songs were better live. The album after that, _Lulu_, was just pretty disappointing. After Lulu, the major label dropped them and they broke up. Now, one of the brothers and the giant bassist is in a band called Semisonic, which is... OK, but not the same. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 14:18:34 -0700 From: Eb Subject: Re: Trip Shakespeare Julien of Arc wrote: >Their third, >_Across the Universe_, was the one they released after signing with a major >label (I think it was WB, but not sure). It was to be their big break, but, >unfortunately, it came out alongside the big testosterone grunge boom, so it >was highly unmarketable. I personally think it is great, but I might be >biased - all of the songs were better live. The album after that, _Lulu_, >was just pretty disappointing. No, not Warner Brothers. It was A&M, of course! Yet another credible artist dumped or lost during A&M's decade-long Dog Days. The Mekons, Joe Henry, Trip Shakespeare, Kitchens of Distinction, Chris Stamey, Squeeze, Swervedriver, the Feelies, Janet Jackson, Soul Asylum, the Blue Nile...all gone. Plus, the Guy Who Sang "Balloon Man." Just plain embarrassing. Meanwhile, Claudine Longet's A&M records remain out of print, except in Japan. And they keep the original work of the Move, Emitt Rhodes/Merry-Go-Round and the Flying Burrito Brothers off the shelves too. Phooey. Now, A&M is the label that has Suzanne Vega and Chris Cornell. Let's see how long they can hold onto Cornell. A bit grumpy this morning, Eb ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 19:43:36 -0400 From: tanter Subject: here we go again..... (0% RH) Sean Lennon sees conspiracy in death of his dad Copyright © 1998 Nando.net Copyright © 1998 The Associated Press NEW YORK (April 13, 1998 4:49 p.m. EDT http://www.nando.net) -- Sean Lennon believes the government was behind the slaying of his father, John Lennon. "He was a countercultural revolutionary, and the government takes that kind of (stuff) really seriously historically," the 22-year-old Lennon said in the latest New Yorker. Mark Chapman is in prison after pleading guilty to shooting the ex-Beatle in front of his Manhattan apartment house in 1980. Chapman said he was influenced by "Catcher in the Rye" and a voice in his head that told him "Do it! Do it! Do it!" Lennon, a singer himself, said anyone who believes Chapman was "just some crazy guy who killed my dad for his personal interests is insane, I think, or very naive, or hasn't thought about it clearly." Why would the government want his father dead? "He was dangerous to the government. If he had said, 'Bomb the White House tomorrow,' there would have been 10,000 people who would have done it," Lennon said. "These pacifist revolutionaries are historically killed by the government."  ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 19:57:23 -0500 From: nicastr@idt.net (Ben) Subject: The 3 Robyns (no Neutral Milk Hotel content) What is your favorite of Robyn's incarnations, as a Soft Boy, part of RH & the Egyptians, or as a solo performer? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 18:35:06 -0700 From: Mark_Gloster@3com.com Subject: Re: The 3 Robyns (no Neutral Milk Hotel content) Maybe it's a good thing that I didn't send that last reply to the list. I didn't properly read your message. I feel so, illiterate. I need to get my eyes screwed back in correctly after dolphing the uberquailpost in one sitting. 1. In concert, I like RH + the Egyptians. The albums were great too. 2. I really like his last studio effort without them, though. 3. I also really like his solo, solo stuff too. 4. And nobody has the balls, wow, and obscurity of dem Soft Boys. 1, 2, and 3 are just about too damn close to call for me, though. - -retsolG kraM nam ytrewq sdrawkcab ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 22:37:14 -0400 From: tanter Subject: 3 Rs My fave is the very first time I saw him, just him, piano and guitar. He's never been as good as he was that night. Maybe because now when I see him I have expectations and that first night I didn't. marcy ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 14:43:27 +1200 From: james.dignan@stonebow.otago.ac.nz (James Dignan) Subject: Mummery? >> * In July, James P. Morrow, a recent resident of an Ohio >> penitentiary, filed a lawsuit in Dayton against Gov. George >> Voinovich and 300 other officials because they allegedly tried to >> "beam" security people down to confront Morrow every time he >> entered a courthouse. According to Morrow's petition, the only >> way he could bypass such beaming is if the court granted him >> "Wallydraggle, Mummery Feg Winple Soupcon-type relief." > >I'm sure I've mentioned this on-list before, but that's the whole reason I >got into Robyn in the first place. I felt it was necessary to become a >Feg in order to convince the courts that I deserved full and perpetual >Wallydraggle, Mummery Feg Winple Soupcon relief. The little known fact that many of you will, I am sure, be unaware of, is theat Walter Jehosephat "Wally" Draggle is in fact the birth name of Carl Palmer. James Dignan___________________________________ You talk to me Deptmt of Psychology, Otago University As if from a distance ya zhivu v' 50 Norfolk Street And I reply. . . . . . . . . . Dunedin, New Zealand with impressions chosen from another time steam megaphone (03) 455-7807 (Brian Eno - "By this River") ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 20:12:46 -0700 (PDT) From: Capuchin Subject: When Robyn's old Ticketmaster has tickets for Robyn Hitchcock at The Point in Atlanta, Georgia on January 1, 2039. Man, I'm getting mine now. There's going to be a big run on these things October 27, 2028 when everyone wakes up alive. J. ________________________________________________________ J A Brelin Capuchin ________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 15:10:43 +1200 From: james.dignan@stonebow.otago.ac.nz (James Dignan) Subject: Wilde and Wilder >> I was listening to an NPR story today, talking about the resurgance of >> Wilde's popularity and it struck me that he would have made a great Feg. >Yes, but then we'd have had to put up with Bosie, and he seemed like a >bit of a tosser. (Lillie Langtry, though... now *there's* an Edwardian >babe...) My question is, what's the new movie like? haven't seen it yet, but the rumours I've heard are that Stephen Fry is excellently cast, but the script doesn't live up to the promise. I don't know who the scriptwriter is, but Wilde he ain't. Last film seen - Jackie Brown (very subdued for Tarantino - only four people died, and there was only one little bag of drugs in the whole movie!). Next? Well, the Dunedin Film Festival starts this week... James PS - congrats on the assistantship, Danielle! ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 23:56:28 -0500 From: nicastr@idt.net (Ben) Subject: Re: When Robyn's old >Ticketmaster has tickets for Robyn Hitchcock at The Point in Atlanta, >Georgia on January 1, 2039. > >Man, I'm getting mine now. There's going to be a big run on these things >October 27, 2028 when everyone wakes up alive. >J. Since you mention the date of Earth's destruction, I was wondering if everyone else is building a spaceship in their basement? And most importantly, what CD's should I take along for the ride? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 21:33:41 -0700 From: Mark Gloster Subject: Santa Cruz Dan Bern Fegathering (virtually quail-free content) I think I'll try to host (in the least medical way possible, think of me more like a guest host on a cable access "do your own surgery and save" show) the Dan Bern fegathering in happy Santa Cruz. I'd like to see what Bay Area Fegpersons think about trekking (ewww, that has such negative connotations) to one of the greatest venues to see one of the best bards ever to come out of 'meruca. The gig is Saturday, May 16, 1998 at the Kuumbwa in Santa Cruz. Eightish pm ish, I believe- but don't quote me. The place couldn't hold much over 150, so we should get our tickets early. I am trying to get special favors from my promoter people connections, but I'm not sure if that weighs anything. I would like to get a head count- yes, that's probably better than a body count- for the show. Also, I'd like to know if there is a consensus about which of his other shows in the Bay Area will be attended, so we can meet more fegages. Re: RH. I plan on being in attendance of the StageFright Hitchpox flyk. We might even stay the night up in Sam Fran's Cyst Co., so that we may be refreshed for the concert performance the following evening. This is going to be a pretty good month for entertainment. A friend of mine who does amazingly brilliant comedy jazz is playing two nights in Monterrey. I'll try to keep subsequent Bay Area postings off this list. Some of you have already informed me that you want to be on my "Bay Area Fegs" list. Others have been silent. Thanks for your indulgence and your feathered finery, - -that damn mark ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 01:31:52 EDT From: KarmaFuzzz Subject: Re: here we go again..... (0% RH) In a message dated 98-04-13 20:08:17 EDT, tanter@econs.umass.edu writes: >Sean Lennon sees conspiracy in death of his dad >Copyright © 1998 Nando.net >Copyright © 1998 The Associated Press [article deleted] well, and this applies to the King family as well, it's probably more reassuring, in an odd way, that your father, especially a father as mythic as John Lennon (or MLK), was taken away from you via some sort of conspiracy than some lone psycho fuckwad with a grudge based on misreading Salinger. it gives his growing up fatherless some sort of meaning. that's the reason conspiracy theories exist: they are ultimately more comforting than the truth of some lone twit wreaking so much havoc. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 02:56:33 -0500 From: "Wookie Conscious" Subject: Re: 3 Rs i don't like any of the three. i only like the small thing robyn does at the end of that thomas dolby song. - --shane ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 09:48:13 +0100 From: Stewart Russell 3295 Analyst_Programmer Subject: Re: Semicoatedfragilebiscuit... >>>>> "Nick" == Nick Winkworth writes: Nick> Do any of you remember reading the "Mary Poppins" books as a Nick> kid? Yeah, I had one read to me at school when I was six. Somewhat trippy. They don't compare to the 'Uncle' books, about a benevolent dictator elephant in a post-treacle-flood world. It's as barking as it sounds. Stewart (talking of odd, anyone know where I could track down the Rev. Fred Lane CD 'From the One That Cut You/Car Radio Jerome'? It has an annoying little song "The French Toast Man" [makes Balloon Man look sensible] that I'm given to singing at inappropriate moments.) - -- Stewart C. Russell Analyst Programmer, Dictionary Division stewart@ref.collins.co.uk HarperCollins Publishers use Disclaimer; my $opinion; Glasgow, Scotland ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 02:44:19 -0700 From: "West A. Moran" Subject: An introduction Greetings, programs! Please allow me to intrude-uce myself. My name is West. I'm brand spankin' new to this whole internet deal, but believe you me, I'm a Feg from way back. I've been reading all your messages for a couple of days now, and, sufficiently impressed at the array of subjects, I felt that I should jump in and make my presence known. I am in L.A., but I like to think anyway. I hope that those of you who observe such things had a happy Easter. I took my annual Ten Commandments Nap. (Every Easter, Cecil B. DeMille's delightfully turgid film, The Ten Commandments, is shown on TV here in America; every Easter, I say to myself, "This year, I'm gonna watch the whole movie without falling asleep," and gee, I never do.) A fellow Feg by the name of Bayard (hello if you're reading this; a check and a blank tape is in the mail to you!) told me that I could inquire here about tape swapping; although as yet I have no tape to swap, I heard that some of you would be nice enough to help me get the ball rolling so long as I sent a blank tape. I would also like to add that I have a MiniDisc player/recorder, so if any swappers have access to MDs, that would be swell. Of course, tape is fine too. If you have any information, questions, comments, et cetera, don't hesitate to get in touch. Thank you! Your friend and mine, West ipalindromei@earthlink.net ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 19:34:05 +2910 From: dlang Subject: Re: Elton Vs. Robyn Bayard made me look a right prat here by stating : ps. the big star records thing is fairly common mr lang, i'm sure someone someone has mailed yuo already offering you a copy so i will not do so b/c i'm sllloooowww about trading. but get in touch if no one else can help. =b Pardon my abysmal ignorence Bayard olde bean, its just that the owner of the original recording is being very reluctant to part with a dub of the said item , he seems to think that its a rarity. I will inform him that its as common as olde muck , everyone in the known universe has one but me and and that should persuade him to give me a first gen dub.Many thanks. Dave ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 13:46:14 GMT From: dwdudic@erols.com (David W. Dudich) Subject: house of love Hey yall. I was wondering if any of you knew about a band called "house of love". They were around in Robyns late 80's/early 90's commercial heyday, and also had a definate Syd Barrett influence. They had a 'hit' of sorts called "i don't know why i love you", off a self-titled album that has the sort of production PI shouldv'e had. Anyone know where they came from/where they went? -luther ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 11:58:45 -0400 (EDT) From: Gary Assassin Subject: Re: house of love This band seemd to stick to their hits. They put that song on like three different album. their other hit was: Shine On (also on like three albums) I don't know what ever happened to them. They are English, but I can't give you more info than that. On Tue, 14 Apr 1998, David W. Dudich wrote: > Hey yall. > I was wondering if any of you knew about a band called "house > of love". They were around in Robyns late 80's/early 90's commercial > heyday, and also had a definate Syd Barrett influence. They had a > 'hit' of sorts called "i don't know why i love you", off a self-titled > album that has the sort of production PI shouldv'e had. > Anyone know where they came from/where they went? > > -luther > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Apr 98 09:48:00 -0800 From: Russ Reynolds Subject: fwd: When Robyn's old ======== Original Message ======== Ticketmaster has tickets for Robyn Hitchcock at The Point in Atlanta, Georgia on January 1, 2039. Man, I'm getting mine now. There's going to be a big run on these things October 27, 2028 when everyone wakes up alive. J. ________________________________________________________ J A Brelin Capuchin ________________________________________________________ ======== Fwd by: Russ Reynolds ======== with any luck Andy, Kimberly and Morris will show up too. That would RAWK! possible set list: Statue With A Walker Where are the Prunes? Antacid Bird any others? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 12:03:01 -0500 From: "JH3" Subject: Re: house of love >I was wondering if any of you knew about a band called "house >of love".... Anyone know where they came from/where they went? Funny this should come up - I just obtained the brand-spanking-new solo CD by Guy Chadwick, former frontman of this very band. It's called "Lazy Soft & Slow" and it's on Setanta records. You can get it from CDNow but Setanta is a very nice label and you'd have just as much luck (and a better chance of getting free samplers later on that include folks like Edwyn Collins, Adrian Borland, and the Divine Comedy) if you buy directly from the label (e-mail them at setantaus@aol.com, unless they've changed their e-mail address recently). HOL broke up at least 3-4 years ago, I think. They never really sold many records outside of the UK, AFAIK. As for the Guy Chadwick CD, it's about what you'd expect - not as big-sounding or as upbeat as any of the HOL albums, in fact maybe a little too understated and introspective on occasion, but a "solid effort" nonetheless, to use the old rock-crit cliche. Actually, it's sort of like the difference between, say, an Egyptians album and "Moss Elixir" - not a strictly acoustic record, but not really a full-blown rock & roll album either. John H. Hedges ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 12:59:44 -0400 From: "Caroline" Subject: Re: house of love house of love were pretty amazing. i'm a big fan. search out the self-titled album from 1990, it's worth it. house of love broke up, reasons unknown to me. but guy chadwick, the singer, released a solo single earlier this year. caroline - -----Original Message----- From: David W. Dudich To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Date: Tuesday, April 14, 1998 10:01 AM Subject: house of love >Hey yall. > I was wondering if any of you knew about a band called "house >of love". They were around in Robyns late 80's/early 90's commercial >heyday, and also had a definate Syd Barrett influence. They had a >'hit' of sorts called "i don't know why i love you", off a self-titled >album that has the sort of production PI shouldv'e had. > Anyone know where they came from/where they went? > > -luther > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 10:28:21 -0700 From: Mark_Gloster@3com.com Subject: Re: SO My sweety introduced me to RH's music. I've probably repeated that story so many times that y'all can mouth the words as I'm typing them. 'xpecially the slow readers. I used to wonder if she thinks I've "taken him away from her?" But, I still catch her caressing the Fegmania CD in that special way sometimes. Happies, - -Markg ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 13:55:50 -0400 From: "Chaney, Dolph L" Subject: fegSOs All I can say is, maybe if I'd waited for a nice Feg girl, I wouldn't be writing so many sad songs these days... Dolph ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 14:07:30 -0400 From: kenster@MIT.EDU (Ken Ostrander) Subject: Re: house of love wow. haven't pulled that one out in a long time. they always reminded me a lot of the jesus and mary chain. didn't they do a song on the leonard cohen tribute thang? KEN > I was wondering if any of you knew about a band called "house >of love". They were around in Robyns late 80's/early 90's commercial >heyday, and also had a definate Syd Barrett influence. They had a >'hit' of sorts called "i don't know why i love you", off a self-titled >album that has the sort of production PI shouldv'e had. > Anyone know where they came from/where they went? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 14:09:40 -0700 From: Mike Runion Subject: Re: fwd: When Robyn's old Russ Reynolds wrote: > Ticketmaster has tickets for Robyn Hitchcock at The Point in Atlanta, > Georgia on January 1, 2039. > possible set list: > > Statue With A Walker > Where are the Prunes? > Antacid Bird > > any others? Young People, they make Old People Scream! My Dead Wife And My Dead Wife Never Stop Bleeding (the low coagulates remix) Senile, But She Was Happy Furry Green Toilet Bowl Heart Full Of Cholesterol Mellow Together (the unplugged version) The Man Who Urinated Himself Only the Kidney Stones Remain All I Want To Do Is Fall Asleep Sorry, some of these are a bit sick. - -- Mike Runion Cocoa, FL, USA /******************************************************************\ | VCM: http://www5.palmnet.net/~mrrunion/cones.htm | | Fegmaps: http://www5.palmnet.net/~mrrunion/fegmaps | | Spoken Word Tape: http://www5.palmnet.net/~mrrunion/wordtape.htm | \******************************************************************/ "Wait a minute. Time for a Planetary Sit-In!" - Julian Cope ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 14:32:56 -0500 (CDT) From: donald andrew snyder Subject: Re: An introduction On Tue, 14 Apr 1998, West A. Moran wrote: > that I have a MiniDisc player/recorder, so if any swappers have access I was wondering this the other day. How many MD users are out there in fegland? I have officially joined the ranks. If anyone wants to do MD trades of some new music let me know (also let me know if this is illegal, but I assume it would be just like making a mixed tape even if there is less sound degradation, etc.). Heard a song by a group called Bedhead and really liked it. Ends up they're coming to town and wanted to know if anyone knew anything further. Chicagofegs: Richard Davies will play free Fri at Reckless Records. - -Andy ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V7 #143 *******************************