From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V7 #84 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Monday, March 2 1998 Volume 07 : Number 084 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: robyn orgy wrapup [Capuchin ] Re: Prescription for Capuchin's Pianophobia [Capuchin ] best new artist [KarmaFuzzz ] Re: Five figers of milk&ATTENTION Quail & Luther [dlang ] Re: NPR ["Gene Hopstetter, Jr." ] NMH vs. Rolling Stone Magazine (RH 30%) [dsaunder@islandnet.com (Daniel S] Fwd: NMH vs. Rolling Stone Magazine (RH 30%) ["Gene Hopstetter, Jr." ] Storefront, Bragg, & Thompson ["Runion-1, Michael" ] Re: Cleopatra [Terrence M Marks ] Re: best new artist [Capuchin ] Hitch [Russ Reynolds ] Hey, I just saw... [Russ Reynolds ] Re: Hitch [Capuchin ] Re: best new artist [Eb ] Re: best new artist [Capuchin ] Re: best new artis [Bret ] More politics. [Capuchin ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 00:55:01 -0800 (PST) From: Capuchin Subject: Re: robyn orgy wrapup On Sun, 1 Mar 1998, Aaron Mandel wrote: > in the mood - the banana boat song - caroline says - fairplay - kung fu > fighting What's the source for In The Mood? Where can I hear it? And I can't think of a song off-hand that isn't on the list... Cars She Used To Drive, maybe? J. ________________________________________________________ J A Brelin Capuchin ________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 01:29:00 -0800 (PST) From: Capuchin Subject: Re: Prescription for Capuchin's Pianophobia On Mon, 2 Mar 1998, The Great Quail wrote: > >Pianos and guitars are super wimpy in my book. They're for Billy Joel and > >James Taylor. Blech. A piano can't express any kind of joy without > >laying about seven feet of chain across the strings and playing Joplin or > >some other radical alteration. > > Dr. Quail fears that his friend Capuchin is in need of the following > medicine to cure this terrible affliction: > 150O mg of Page McConnell from Phish playing piano for sheer unspeakable > happiness I hate Phish. Had a roommate in college that played Phish all the time and I found it nothing but dull. > Follow this with: > 150 mg of Tori Amos for wit and emotion > 100 mg of Mike Garson (David Bowie) for intricate color > 75 mg of Keith Emerson for anti-wimpy bombast > 120 mg of Piano Circus of London for radical re-invention > 10 mg of early Elton John for lyrical expressiveness > 50 mg of Philip Glass for timeless peace > 50 mg of Steve Reich for spooky and startling harmonics Never heard Keith Emerson or Piano Circus, but I find the rest kind of down-noted. It's either dull, melancholic or just plain sad. > and > 2.5 grams of Beethoven to *forever* cure this idea that pianos are not > emotional. . . . I didn't say pianos aren't emotional. I said they can't bring me joy. Big difference. I dig Tori Amos for the most part. I dig Beethoven in a pretty big way. All kinds of great people use pianos very effectively. I'm just saying that it's not great at inspiring an enormous RANGE of emotion in me. I don't find pianos nearly as bland and banal as guitars, but I can't really say they're way up on my expressiveness list, either. > Let me know how all this works, Capuchin, and we'll start you off on a > Guitar Recovery Program next. . . . Hit me with your best shot, doc. Oh, and speaking of Beethoven, here's a story from my dear friend Ian whom I've mentioned several hundred times (those few of you that have met him might enjoy this story more than the 284 who have not). On Tue, 24 Feb 1998, Ian wrote: > So, I'm in choir. This term we've got a lot of music to rehearse. One of > them just happens to be Beethoven's Ninth Symphony. ("Ninth Symphony" is > actually a subtitle. The actual title is "An Die Fruede", or as we say > in Englische, "Ode to Joy".) It's just an amazing piece of music in a > lot of ways, and not all of them are good. For starters, the piece is 62 > pages long and twice as brutal(?). It's very fast, very loud, and very > high--There are many places within the score where the tenors have to > sing a high 'A' at double forte. (Keep in mind that "O'wimoweh" starts > on the 'C' below that!!!) > After we had been singing this for a while, our conductor stopped the > rehearsal to let us catch our breath and to give us a short music > history lesson. > When this piece was presented for the first time to the choir and > orchestra, the musicians rebelled. They felt that it was too difficult a > piece and that it was not humanly possible to perform it. They > approached Beethoven and said: "Maestro, we implore you to amend the > score, the singers cannot possibly sing so high and the strings cannot > possibly play so fast. Beethoven became enraged. He vehemently refused > the requests of his musicians. He threw his usual tantrum and when he > was finished, promptly stormed off. > > It was at this point in the story that I said with disdain: > > "They might as well have been talking to a deaf man." > > Luckily I wasn't beaten. > > -Ian. I hope you enjoyed that story as much as I did. Ian's a good man. I'm trying to get him converted enough to join the list. Right now we're working on getting a new newsgroup together (alt.misanthropy), but we can't decide if we want to actually deal with other people or not. The whole thing's rather depressing. Jeme. ________________________________________________________ J A Brelin Capuchin ________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 05:04:11 EST From: KarmaFuzzz Subject: five finger bands 1983 (i was 11): Men at Work, The Police, Duran Duran, Thompson Twins, that perv with the sequinned glove 1988: The Smiths, The Cure, R.E.M., Depeche Mode, The Cure 1993: The Jesus and Mary Chain, R.E.M., Nirvana, The Cure, Nine Inch Nails 1998 (all-time): The Beatles, Joy Division, R.E.M., The Jimi Hendrix Experience, The Cure [robyn'd be around 8, soft boys 12] 1998 (current work): Radiohead, Luna, Blur, Ivy, Kristin Hersh, Bjork ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 05:04:51 EST From: KarmaFuzzz Subject: best new artist >BTW, I've seen umpteen babillion "Best New Artist" nominations for artists >with more than one album out. What, exactly, *IS* the "rule" for this >category? until the mid-80's, it was first released as a featured artist within the 12 month eligibility period. then Whitney Houston wasn't eligible for her debut album because she sang a duet the previous "year" with Jermaine Jackson, so Clive Davis had the rules changed so it's first "prominant" release, or the one that sells good or charts somewhere. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 02 Mar 1998 22:49:38 +2910 From: dlang Subject: Re: Five figers of milk&ATTENTION Quail & Luther Quail chittered: "mobbed some British guy in town to see the show -- "Liam Gilligan" or "Leon Gallagher" or something. Nice bloke, real rational talking to the cops, seemed to love Americans. " Quail , you had to be hallucinating ,or the guy was an imposter.Young Liam G was busy behaving himself on an ansett flight from Perth to Adelaide on the aforesaid night. Although as i write this , waves of paranoia come rushing in as i fall into a Philip K Dickian " all is conspiracy-nothing is what you really see" mode. *Of course*, Liam was holographically recreated throughout the Australian leg of the tour so he could get to see the neutral Milkers with the Quail, ( whom he has always admired from afar) and party it up after the show in cheesy Wisconsin with the fair LJ on the Sunday .Shit it all makes sense now. This latest farago of lies and deception just confirms my belief that the Quail is secretly behind every conspiracy plot in the known universe. Beware Quail, I am onto you and I will be revealing your complete history to the unsuspecting fegs in the near future ( or just as soon asi can get through all this bleeding marking) ..... BTW, Quailovitch I await your *taping requests * so I can get started with our trade, or are you too busy hatching plots to subvert the galaxy to look through my lists (and did you get the rest of them BTW?) and LUTHER, get your finger out too and let me know if you have sent the tapes,or I'll post the Can tape to EB instead, I know he would get off on it. Dave frum down undereeeee....... ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 02 Mar 1998 07:13:34 -0600 From: Miles Goosens Subject: Re: billy bragg At 02:09 AM 3/2/98 -0600, Maxey L. Mullins wrote: >i've heard many of you mention the name billy bragg on this list. >however, believe it or not, until just a few hours ago, i had never >heard anything by him. i was watching 120 minutes and i caught a video >by billy bragg. the title had the words "the new brunette," in it. i >can't remember any more than that. anyway, i really liked the song. it >was great. is the rest of his stuff a lot like that? and which album >would you suggest that i go buy? i'm definitly interested in hearing >more of his music. Despite the apparent ill-will generated between RH and BB fans during their joint tour in the fall of 1996, I remain an ardent fan of both gents. Any of Bragg's first three full-length CDs (BACK TO BASICS, TALKING WITH THE TAXMAN ABOUT POETRY, and WORKERS PLAYTIME) are eminently worthy; the two latest (DON'T TRY THIS AT HOME and WILLIAM BLOKE) are considerably more spotty, even though they have their moments. I'd find me a copy of BACK TO BASICS, thrill to the sounds of "A New England," "It Says Here," "The Saturday Boy," and "A Lover Sings," and go from there. later, Miles p.s.: "Greetings to the New Brunette" is the leadoff track on TALKING WITH THE TAXMAN. ============================================================== JASON WILKINS (of Neilson Hubbard): Victor's was just starting to happen, then it burned down. BILL LLOYD: That's a pretty good metaphor for the Nashville rock scene. -- NASHVILLE SCENE, Jan. 15, 1998 Miles Goosens outdoorminer@mindspring.com http://www.mindspring.com/~outdoorminer/miles ============================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 09:11:27 -0500 From: "Gene Hopstetter, Jr." Subject: Re: NPR woj, >>I seem to remember sobody mentioning that Robyn had been featured on an >>'episode" of NPR's Morning Edition or NPR's Weekend Edition. Can anyone >>confirm this? If so, I'd like to know the original broadcast dates. > >hitchcock, robyn 96/10/27 weekend edition, npr > >gene added: > >>In October, 1996, Robyn appeared on NPR's Fresh Air. > >really? wonder how i missed that one. Erm, ah, maybe they're the same thing. I may be mistaken. The tape I have definitely occurred at the end of October, 1996, and it aired on the weekend. Maybe it was on the Fresh Air show, maybe not. +++++++++++++++++ "I did acid once, and I lost my keys." + Gene Hopstetter, Jr. + -- Stephin Merritt +++++++++++++++++ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 1 Mar 1998 22:24:42 -0800 From: dsaunder@islandnet.com (Daniel Saunders) Subject: NMH vs. Rolling Stone Magazine (RH 30%) In an Aeroplane over the Ocean. Eb, one of our most hardened critics, starts raving incoherently about it. Someone else picks it up and raves incoherently. Addicted to Noise gives it the Orgasmic rating. I buy it, and at first listen it sounds extremely appealing. Then I make a mistake. Opening Rolling Stone to the music review page, before I can catch myself I look at the review of the album, where it's given only three stars, a distinctly mediocre rating. I tell myself that this is the same column that gave Moss Elixir the same rating as Janet Jackson's new album, and that Pop and Be Here Now were rated even higher. But I am afflicted with extreme suggestibility in the face of criticism, and I'm afraid it may spoil my enjoyment of the album So could someone please tell me why this review is crap? In an unrelated note (in that it has to do with Robyn Hitchcock) I'd like to say that of his new songs, the one that's burrowed deepest into my subconcious is undoubtly I Saw Nick Drake. I can tell because I had a dream about Nick Drake a few nights ago, that he was alive and I was trying to find a gig he was playing at my local university. Since I don't know what Nick Drake's music sounds like, it turned out to be Tim Keegan. I think that shows the amount of emotion you can evoke even without really complex lyrics. - -- Daniel Saunders Reality is that which when you stop believing in it, it doesn't go away. - Philip K. Dick ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 10:03:13 -0500 From: "Gene Hopstetter, Jr." Subject: Fwd: NMH vs. Rolling Stone Magazine (RH 30%) Daniel Saunders asked: >Opening Rolling Stone to the music review page, before I can catch >myself I look at the review of the album, where it's given only three >stars, a distinctly mediocre rating. > >So could someone please tell me why this review is crap? Well, I can't explain or justify the review's being crap, but I will say that I totally disagree with it. I bought the new NMH hotel album because of the sound clips of it I heard at Addicted to Noise, and nothing more. Those 30-second clips really grabbed me, so I bought the CD. I almost always ignore anything written by critics in popular magazines or web sites (now, I'll usually take seriously anything written by the folks at _Forced Exposure_ or any other critic with a shred of self-humor and humility and experienced ears, which are sorely lacking at Rolling Stone). That said, I'll inject this about NMH. I saw them perform this last Saturday night at the Black Cat in Washington, DC (sorry I missed ya, Quail). I saw seven high-school-band-dropout-looking geeks making the most glorious, naive, honest, brutal, and cacophonous noise I've ever heard. I've been seeing live music for almost fifteen years and I was floored. NMH has restored my faith in rock and roll. (Well, so did the Donnas, whom I caught last night. Woo hoo!) And, I'm convinced, that on stage, Jeff Magnum is the closest thing to Syd Barrett I've ever seen. He couldn't even mumble a coherent sentence between songs, but he towered like a giant with his voice and guitar. Uncanny. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 10:38:03 -0500 From: kenster@MIT.EDU (Ken Ostrander) Subject: Re: In sorrow not in anger >#30, #5, #3... am I the only one on this crazy list who puts RH in the >middle podium, gold medal winner, #1 post modern artist, king of all >media except radio and mtv, top fav? come on-- who's with me????? right now, it's a pretty close race for me between robyn, lou reed, and jon langford. elvis costello's up there somewhere too; but then again there are so many artists up there that i'm tempted to list 'em all off. KEN np jon langford's _skull orchard_ saw him play last night and had an actual conversation with the man! i'm still woozy. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 10:55:31 -0500 (EST) From: Aaron Mandel Subject: Re: robyn orgy wrapup On Mon, 2 Mar 1998, Capuchin wrote: > What's the source for In The Mood? Where can I hear it? it's on Live At The Portland Arms. embarrassingly, i don't know the original source, though i think harry connick jr. did a version of it a few years ago. > And I can't think of a song off-hand that isn't on the list... Cars She > Used To Drive, maybe? no, that's on there in one of the "transportation" sets. there were stacks of little index cards in the studio, each with one song on it, sorted by album. this allowed us to program pretty freely without worrying about repeating songs, though a couple ("insanely jealous" is one, i don't remember the others) got played both while i was asleep and while i was on. a ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 09:58:57 -0500 From: "Runion-1, Michael" Subject: Storefront, Bragg, & Thompson Regarding the "Store Front Hitchcock" CD I saw in www.gemm.com... I emailed the store, called Allstars, a Netherlands outfit. They were listing this as a "jap import". Their reply was as follows: >Sorry, but we don't have a stock so i cannot give you any information about a tracklist. >The only thing i know is that it is not released yet. > >bye >Eelke Eelke...(just wanted to type it again). So, what does this mean? Is this just a gear-up for the official release? Could it be a bootleg hoping to jump the market? Ah well... Regarding Joel's Bragg request... I'd recommend either "Talking To The Taxman About Poetry" or "Worker's Playtime". I picked up the Peel Sessions CD this weekend. There's a Morrissey/Marr penned tune called "Jeanne" on there...any Smiths fans know about this song? I'm not aware of it on any Smiths album and don't think I've ever heard it before. On Richard Thompson... Bought my first Thompson album this weekend, I Want To See The Bright Lights Tonight, and so far really like it. Of course I selected this one for "Calvery Cross" and "Withered & Died", a pair Robyn has covered. I was also pleasantly surprised to hear the original "Has He Got A Friend For Me", a great song Maria McKee has covered. So where do I go from here? On guitars... After a long struggle against my wife's subtle urgings, I'm now the proud owner of a Tacoma C1CE Chief acoustic guitar. I've lived with a $150 Hondo for about 15 years now and have secretly grown desirous of my wife's Alvarez-Yari. Any guitar nuts have an opinion of these Tacoma's? We also snagged a Fender Acoustisonic Jr. (By the way, yes, they're made in "Viva Sea-" Tacoma, WA.) That's all for today, Mike Runion Mike Runion EG&G S&MA Data & Analyses; ADoCS Office 867-3619 BOC-251 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 12:16:45 -0500 From: nicastr@idt.net (Ben) Subject: Re: Thompson >On Richard Thompson... > >Bought my first Thompson album this weekend, I Want To See The Bright >Lights Tonight, and so far really like it. Of course I selected this >one for "Calvery Cross" and "Withered & Died", a pair Robyn has covered. >I was also pleasantly surprised to hear the original "Has He Got A >Friend For Me", a great song Maria McKee has covered. So where do I go >from here? The first Thompson CD(s) I bought was the 3-disc "Watching The Dark" compilation. It's got to be one of the best overviews of anyone's work ever (not surprising considering the material to choose from). As well as having key album tracks, it also includes many rare and unreleased tracks, so you won't end up selling it when you buy the rest of his albums (which you should do!). As for single discs, "Shoot Out The Lights" is considered by most to be not only Thompson's best, but one of the great albums by anyone ever. But, as I'd say with Robyn, get them ALL. The only one I'd reccomend not getting until last is "Sunnyvista". As for Robyn's version of "Calvary Cross", I must admit I've never heard any versions that come close to matching what RT does to this tune live. Listen to the live "Calvary Cross" from "Watching the Dark"... when the walls of your home begin to bleed and the portal to the netherworld begins to open, you will know what I mean. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 12:25:31 -0500 From: nicastr@idt.net (Ben) Subject: Re: Prescription for Capuchin's Pianophobia > >I didn't say pianos aren't emotional. I said they can't bring me joy. >Big difference. I dig Tori Amos for the most part. I dig Beethoven in a >pretty big way. All kinds of great people use pianos very effectively. >I'm just saying that it's not great at inspiring an enormous RANGE of >emotion in me. I don't find pianos nearly as bland and banal as guitars, >but I can't really say they're way up on my expressiveness list, either. > All of this talk of certain instruments being incapable of inspiring a range of emotion in you makes me think that a plastic mannequin may be capable of more emotional range... ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 12:32:25 -0500 From: nicastr@idt.net (Ben) Subject: Re: Cleopatra >Speaking of which, does anyone here own that Syd Barrett album on >Cleopatra? I think it's called Octopus? What IS that, anyway? Just more >rough demos, or what? > >Eb The album called "Octopus" (cover is a pic af Syd surrounded by psychedelic colors, I believe?) is just a compilation of material from his 2 albums and "Opal". I think the only official solo material of Syd's besides those three albums are the "Peel Sessions" and the demos on the "Crazy Diamond" box set. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 02 Mar 1998 10:21:34 -0800 From: Paul Montagne Subject: [none] >Paula Cole is pretty unforgettable IMHO. Eb do you agree? To which Eb responded: "We've been through this already. And I have a feeling that maybe you meant to type "forgettable," based on the transition to the next sentence...no?" Uhm. I must have missed the dialogue, but anyhow yes I meant forgettable. I suffer from a slight dyslexia Eb, but I can keep my Coles straight, Holly Cole, Paula Cole, Cole Porter, and Cole Slaw, my personal favorite. The other Waits tribute I saw was on an indy label and wasn't very good. I find Straight Up to be, as you said, uneven, which tributes almost always are. Definately better than most. Pete Shelley's rendition of Better Of Without A Wife is particularly bad, and I love Buzzcocks. Which gets me thinking of Tributes, has there been any dialogue about top 5 tributes on the list? My picks are: Where The Pyramid Meets The Eye - Roky Erickson The Bridge - Neil Young I'm Your Fan - Leonard Cohen Conmemorativo - Gram Parsons If I Were A Carpenter - The Carpenters np:DIY - American Power Pop Vol I ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 14:01:30 -0500 (EST) From: Terrence M Marks Subject: Re: Cleopatra > Speaking of which, does anyone here own that Syd Barrett album on > Cleopatra? I think it's called Octopus? What IS that, anyway? Just more > rough demos, or what? > If it's what I think it is, it's a "greatest hits" package with no new tracks. But then, making a greatest hits package for someone who only put out three albums and had no hits is kinda pointless. Terrence Marks normal@grove.ufl.edu ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 11:18:57 -0800 (PST) From: Capuchin Subject: Re: best new artist On Mon, 2 Mar 1998, KarmaFuzzz wrote: > until the mid-80's, it was first released as a featured artist within the 12 > month eligibility period. then Whitney Houston wasn't eligible for her debut > album because she sang a duet the previous "year" with Jermaine Jackson, so > Clive Davis had the rules changed so it's first "prominant" release, or the > one that sells good or charts somewhere. This still makes me look at you strangely because both Garbage and No Doubt released albums about four months before the eligibility year in which they were nominated for "Best new artist". I'm lost. ________________________________________________________ J A Brelin Capuchin ________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Mar 98 11:28:00 -0800 From: Russ Reynolds Subject: Hitch Hey, I was watching a TV bio on Alfred Hitchcock and I noticed everyone kept referring to him as "Hitch". How come we don't do that? I'm going to start now. Hitch is one of my favorite artists. There. - -rr ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Mar 98 11:23:00 -0800 From: Russ Reynolds Subject: Hey, I just saw... pardon me if I'm touching on something that's already been touched on (nothing wrong with being touched more than once if it's in the right place, I always say) but I just saw "Titanic" over the weekend and one of the tunes played by the band in that party scene down below sure sounded an awful lot like "Muriel's Hoof/Rout of the Clones" to me. Did anyone else catch that? Has this been mentioned? Was anything resolved regarding this (like, say, "muriel's hoof was the soft boys version of an old celtic folk song" or "robyn hitchcock secretly wrote much of the music for Titanic") or is it just that all those jig tunes sound alike? I missed most of the Titnic thread first time around because I didn't want to read about it before I saw it. I'll comment now that I thought the movie was very good--much better I had expected, though it's quite frustrating when the whole middle section is out of focus, especially when there are naked breasts in the middle section. Shitty theater. Robyn Hitchcock's birthday tomorrow...don't forget to hoist one in his honor. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 11:56:55 -0800 (PST) From: Capuchin Subject: Re: Hitch On Mon, 2 Mar 1998, Russ Reynolds wrote: > Hey, I was watching a TV bio on Alfred Hitchcock and I noticed everyone kept > referring to him as "Hitch". How come we don't do that? Mostly because we don't talk about Alfred Hitchcock. > I'm going to start now. OK. > Hitch is one of my favorite artists. There. Yeah, he's pretty incredible. My personal favorite is The 39 Steps. J. ________________________________________________________ J A Brelin Capuchin ________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 12:03:38 -0700 From: Eb Subject: Re: best new artist Capuchin wrote: >This still makes me look at you strangely because both Garbage and No >Doubt released albums about four months before the eligibility year in >which they were nominated for "Best new artist". > >I'm lost. No Doubt, four months??? They released another album on Interscope like four YEARS before Tragic Kingdom! Eb ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 12:20:08 -0800 (PST) From: Capuchin Subject: Re: best new artist On Mon, 2 Mar 1998, Eb wrote: > No Doubt, four months??? They released another album on Interscope like > four YEARS before Tragic Kingdom! Yeah, I'm totally aware of that. I'm talking about the "prominence" rule. I'm just saying they still violated that one. ________________________________________________________ J A Brelin Capuchin ________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 14:29:26 -0600 (CST) From: Bret Subject: Re: best new artis At 12:03 PM 3/2/98 -0700, you wrote: >Capuchin wrote: >>This still makes me look at you strangely because both Garbage and No >>Doubt released albums about four months before the eligibility year in >>which they were nominated for "Best new artist". >> >>I'm lost. > >No Doubt, four months??? They released another album on Interscope like >four YEARS before Tragic Kingdom! and for what it's worth, a fairly good little record. Tragic Kingdom makes my insides churn (even thinking about it makes lunch (Bass Ale) do weird things). and on another note, I know that some time ago, there was a list of songs that RH (or Hitch) has covered running around the list, if anyone has that still could you please send it to me off the list? many thanx! - --Bret 'slipping you the midnight fish' Bolton ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 2 Mar 1998 12:31:41 -0800 (PST) From: Capuchin Subject: More politics. On Mon, 2 Mar 1998, The Great Quail wrote: > Liking or not liking armpit hair is not sexist. It is a matter of > personal taste, heavily influenced by cultural programming. We all know > this, I hope. Totally agree here. > Saying that you like "everything about women" is not sexist. That's like > saying being sexually oriented is sexist. This contemporary American > belief that expressing sexual preference is "sexist" is absurd. See, here's where we disagree and I'd be happy to take it off-list but I'm sure you'd be happier dropping the point. I FIRMLY believe that any generalization or exclusion based entirely on gender is sexism and you can't have it both ways. If you say there's a non-physical difference between the sexes, you're saying something sexist. If you express a sexual preference, that is sexism by definition. If you say it's purely a decision BASED on those existing physical differences, well, you're kind of shallow. > "Susan's posts are not interesting because women don't know anything > about music." > That is sexist. Yep. You're generalizing about women in a non-physical way. > "I think Cole should shave her pits because it grosses me out." > Culturally biased prejudice, slightly sexist. Yep. Says nothing about sex at all. > "I like everything about women. Yum Yum" > Not sexist. (Maybe lacking somehwat in judgment, however, unless Ner is a > cannibal.) Again, out of context it's not QUITE sexist. He could very well be referring to those few physical characteristics that identify women as women. However, IN CONTEXT, it's completely sexist because he mentioned their armpit hair and that's not something belonging exclusively to women. He loves armpit hair just because it's growing on a woman? That's completely sexist. He loves everything about women, even the things that men and women share, just because they're women? That's sexist. J. -- who believes also that the words women and men are needlessly descriminatory and prefers male and female because all females are men but no male is a woman. Man is generic and woman is specific. Didn't it used to be Man divided into the groups heman and woman? That's more sensible. ________________________________________________________ J A Brelin Capuchin ________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V7 #84 ******************************