From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V7 #74 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Friday, February 27 1998 Volume 07 : Number 074 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: Soy Bomb [Eb ] Re: rh diversity [Ner ] Re: moss elixir [Ner ] Grammys [Ner ] Re: Soy Bomb [Ner ] Re: Grammys [Ross Overbury ] alms for a bitter feg [dwdudic@erols.com (luther)] Re: Neutral Black Milk Cat Saturday Hotel [MARKEEFE ] Re: the eb issue [Ner ] Re: Catchin' up on some threads + [james.dignan@stonebow.otago.ac.nz (Jam] Re: Soy Bomb ["Michael R. Runion" ] Re: don't start [james.dignan@stonebow.otago.ac.nz (James Dignan)] Re: Soy Bomb ["Michael R. Runion" ] Osborne, Tull, Country, Severed Heads [james.dignan@stonebow.otago.ac.nz ] Re: bands v. solo careers [The Great Quail ] Re: Grammys [The Great Quail ] Re: moss elixir ["Maxey L. Mullins" ] Re: the eb issue ["Maxey L. Mullins" ] Re: bands v. solo careers ["Baker, David(KWI-C09)" ] Re: Guithread... [Mark ] Re: bands v. solo careers [nicastr@idt.net (Ben)] Re: Soy Bomb [Ner ] Re: the eb issue [Capuchin ] Re: Guithread... [Ross Overbury ] Soy Bomb mystery solved? [Eb ] Re: Soy Bomb [Capuchin ] Re: Neutral Black Milk Cat Saturday Hotel [Terrence M Marks ] Re: instrumentation [KarmaFuzzz ] Re: bands v. solo careers ["Maxey L. Mullins" ] Re: Look Back in Anger. Or, um, don't. [KarmaFuzzz ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 16:40:39 -0700 From: Eb Subject: Re: Soy Bomb Brandt briefed: >"Soy Bomb"? What was that? A plug for that guys struggling band or >something? Dylan's coolheadedness was amazing, but it's a good thing >that Soy Bomb didn't have a copy of "Catcher In The Rye" and a firearm >with him. Where the hell was security? Check THIS out. I did a websearch for Michael Portnoy, the guy who pulled the Soy Bomb prank. He's an established performance-artist/dancer, and has appeared in a rock video by Maggie Estep, whom I know nothing about (http://www.mouthalmighty.com/maggie1.htm). He's done this sort of thing before, apparently. And check THIS link out: http://www.thing.net/ttreview/aprrev.04.html. It says: "michael portnoy responds: I am a performance artist/musician/dancer. I have never seen Fabre's work and I came to your review hoping to find some description of the work. Too bad! Do you have any video of his work or know anybody that does? I thought The Kitchen might, but no. Please call me with any leads: (212) 479-7316 -Michael Portnoy." Do you KNOW how I could ruin this guy's life, if I posted his phone number to the Bob Dylan newsgroup?? (I won't.) >Streisand and Pavarotti's no-shows must've driven the producers mad. You betcha. >Bette Midler's dig at Barbra was beautiful. I missed that. What did she say? Here are some mental notes I made during the ceremony: 1. I guess one should admire his devotion, but Mike Myers presenting with an Ash Wednesday smear on his forehead was a bit peculiar. It didn't occur to me until MUCH later what the mark was. At the time, I was wondering if he had joined the Manson family. ;) 2. How come Lee Ann Rimes, Hanson and Babyface rocked, while Aretha Franklin's stuff just laid there? She really seems to have lost a lot of her range and intensity, sad to say. 3. The graybeard, old-fogey blunder of the night was James Taylor winning Best Pop Album. Sheesh. (I was rooting for Sarah McLachlan, myself.) 4. Interesting that both CDNow and Music Boulevard bought commercial time. Internet CD sales have obviously become big business! 5. I was thrilled to see Dylan win Best Album (Double Fantasy, Graceland and Time Out of Mind are the only Best Albums of the last 20 years which I've had genuine enthusiasm for), but him winning Contemporary Folk Album was a bit lame. If anything, Time Out of Mind is a contemporary blues album, and even that is stretching the definition. 6. Other than Bawb winning Best Album, the coolest moment of the night was Van Morrison/John Lee Hooker beating out Monster Noggin & Monster Ego for Best Pop Duet. I cheered loudly. 7. When did Lindsay Buckingham lose his voice? And when he did morph into Bill Murray? 8. Strange bedfellows: Patti Smith sitting directly behind Tara Lipinski. 9. Peter Stampfel, legendary alumnus of Eb's Annoying Singer list, won a Grammy for contributing to the liner notes of the American Folk Anthology set. 10. Yet another Grammy for Sir Georg Solti, even after death. Wow. And it's a shame that the Grammy presentation for John Denver wasn't televised -- that would've been touching. 11. Wow -- the Chemical Brothers win a Grammy. And (ahem) Tool, too? 12. I don't mind Paula Cole's music, but she is utterly unwatchable as a performer. Take it down a peg, sweetie. And if you're not gonna shave, you could at least stop wearing sleeveless tops and lifting your arms up all the time. 13. I'm happy that Vanessa Williams escaped the stage set with her life. 14. Whaddya bet that Fiona Apple would've won Best New Artist instead of Cole (releasing her *second* album), if not for The Speech? Eb ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 19:54:04 -0500 From: Ner Subject: Re: rh diversity JH3 wrote: > At the same time, I should say that Robyn is probably the only performer who > can stand there with just an acoustic guitar and keep me fully entertained > for 90 minutes. Elvis Costello and Bob Mould couldn't do it. (Eb probably > couldn't do it either, unless maybe he had several guitars and was smashing > them all. That'd be *cool*...) I agree on the Bob Mould thing although I have only seen him solo on his most recent tour so I can't speak for anything before that. I thought he was pretty good but not great - parts of the show didn't really hold my attention. Have you ever seen Jonathan Richman as a solo act? I saw him once a few years ago - just Jonathan and guitars - and he was great! I highly recommend checking him out for those who have not already done so. Oh, I also saw Neil Young solo acoustic a few years back and thought he was awesome, amazing, splendiferous, all of the above. IMHO Neil rules!!! - -Ner ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 19:59:34 -0500 From: Ner Subject: Re: moss elixir Maxey L. Mullins wrote: > Everyone is saying that Robyn is done growing and experimenting. Hey, not everyone!!! Don't include me in that group... - -Ner ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 20:14:49 -0500 From: Ner Subject: Grammys Eb wrote: > Jeez, do you folks live in such a vacuum? Not one post about the Grammys? > Reflects the Hitchcockian create-your-own-little-world-and-hide aesthetic, > I guess. Ha. What about the Grammys? I didn't see 'em. I don't generally watch any awards shows because I find them tedious, irrelevant, and uninteresting. I get the recaps but I just can't seem to care one way or the other about who wins or loses. So Bob Dylan won for best album. That's great! Congrats Bob. Makes no difference to me, I already knew the album was great. So now "Time Out of Mind" is a Grammy winner just like Joni Mitchell's "Turbulent Indigo" was a couple of years back. And I bet the members of Jethro Tull are really proud of the Grammy for Best Heavy Metal Band they received a few years back. Ok, I've ranted enough; think I'll go crawl back into my vacuum... - -Ner ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 20:30:51 -0500 From: Ner Subject: Re: Soy Bomb Eb wrote: > It's not just a question of guitar. It's a question of lyrical tone, > melodic style, attitude, character, influences mined, etc. I *definitely* > think Dylan's catalog is more varied than Robyn's. Okay, I have to agree that I don't think that Robyn will ever do anything that really surprises me anymore. I know what to expect and that's what he delivers. Since I generally love much of what he delivers that equation works out fine for me. I also have to agree that I think Dylan's catalogue is more varied. > And when did I > ever say I liked the Ramones, Johnny Cash or (blecch) Ani DiFranco more > than Robyn? Awww, you don't like Ani DiFranco? Oh well. I discovered her about a year ago after I saw a video on 120 Minutes. I saw her live about a month later and thought she was very entertaining. Her rapport with the audience was great! Okay, so I didn't like her enough to go rush out and track down all her CDs - just a couple. But, I think her new release "Little Plastic Castles" is the best thing I've heard from her. Excellent stuff for the most part. Have you heard it, Eb? > I like this list. That's why I'm here. I'm getting all choked up. You're okay by me, Eb! - -Ner ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Feb 98 20:41:55 EST From: Ross Overbury Subject: Re: Grammys Ner wrote: > And I bet the members of Jethro Tull are really proud of the Grammy > for Best Heavy Metal Band they received a few years back. Actually, they took a full page ad in one of the trade magazines to say "The flute is a heavy metal instrument". I think they were rather pleased with it. - -- Ross Overbury Montreal, Quebec, Canada email: rosso@cn.ca ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 01:41:17 GMT From: dwdudic@erols.com (luther) Subject: alms for a bitter feg Any of ya'll have the lyrics for "blues in the dark" laying around? I just had a 'balloon man' (woman, actually) situation, And I feel like stewing in bitterness for a while :-). -luther w dudich np. "You can't win"- Richard Thompson ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 20:53:54 EST From: MARKEEFE Subject: Re: Neutral Black Milk Cat Saturday Hotel No, I'm not seeing them on this tour (those non-coming-to-Portland-type- dumb-stupid-heads). But I *did* just hear the album for the first time today (I'd been hoping for a promo, but they apparently gave them all away to the rock critics and din't save any for us poor record store owners). Eb, I agree with all the "wees" and droolings. The best album I've heard this year so far! After so much anticipation, I just had to share my glee. For those who haven't yet, buy it now! - ------Michael K. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 20:53:43 -0500 From: Ner Subject: Re: the eb issue Maxey L. Mullins wrote: > does anyone else find it extremely grosse that eb says he is a fan of > over 700 artists. and that in 1996 he liked 140 different albums. i > mean who has that kind of time? eb, you're either extremely rich, work > at a record store, or someone's paying you to listen to music. i mean > there's no way i even hear 140 new albums in a year much less like that > many. that's a lot of freaking albums. i'm afraid i don't have the > time or money. or maybe i'm just too caught up in my "Hitchcock > vaccuum." > > =joel There are ways to do it. I don't have many expenses other than purchasing CDs and literary materials, and going to see shows. I probably averaged about four new CDs a week for the year - only about 60% of which were new releases. I get many of them by mail from Columbia House and BMG Music at an average cost of about 8 dollars per disc. I work as a computer programmer and I have a portable CD player set up on my desk at work. As a result I probably listen to about 7 or 8 CDs a day while I work. I got home about three hours ago. I've listened to two CDs since I got home. I'll probably listen to one more (probably "Minstrels in the Gallery" ;) ) and then take a break for the rest of the night. At this rate I am able to absorb a great deal of music and still have time for my many other interests. I calculate that I spend about 60 hours a week listening to music. The key is being able to do it while you work - but it can be done... - -Ner ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 15:22:18 +1300 From: james.dignan@stonebow.otago.ac.nz (James Dignan) Subject: Re: Catchin' up on some threads + >>>)...and, after three days of frenzi= >>>dancing and lucid dreaming, we could torch the 300 foot tall Thoth! > >Is there a Hitchcock/lucid dreaming coorelation? I'm a lucid dreamer >too, and the Goddess of Toast has led me to believe she also has a >talent for lucid dreaming. I coached one feg in lucid dreaming techniques >last year. Discuss lucid dreaming with your average human and you get some >very strange looks indeed. quite possibly. Let's face it, people who are interested in Robyn (and his lyrics) have a taste for the surreal, and from there its just a short step to discussing dream states. I've never been aware of lucidly dreaming (in the sense of being able to manipulate the action within a dream through conscious effort) although I have come close to it and did keep a dream diary for a while. One of my songs is also directly from something remembered in a dream ("Down") >> what? even the wonderful "Le nouveau Western" by MC Solaar? [...] >> great shuffling sak/rap of "Pozhetunmai" by Russian rapper Kino. (JD note - that sould say ska/rap) >To me French rap is like a tap dancer doing some really busy footwork to >Jimi Hendrix songs -- just completely inappropriate for that particular >medium. 'Course I'm not very appreciative of rap in general. THE language to rap in is Japanese. >The foreign music I tend to like best is that which tries least to ape the >qualities of currently trendy music from our culture. Oddly, most modern Maori music is based around reggae and ragga/rap, but it too is at its best when it retains at least some elements of traditional styling. >So music from other cultures tends to be best when it's produced in isolation, >and all music (including that of other cultures) can benefit from external >influences. Conflicting logic, right? I'm still working on it, feggies... >it's from the guts. hmmm. As a fan of 'fourth world" music, I'd argue that. But then again, 'fourth world' music treats the individual threads of musical influence in isolation and doesn't try to blend and bland them together. Sort of like taking seven coloured paints and either keeping them separate and painting a rainbow or mixing them together and painting mud. >One more thing. I'm a primarily acoustic guitarist myself, and when I >read the statement that acoustic was more expressive than electric, I >nodded in agreement. Then I thought about it. I *like* the sound of >acoustic a lot, but I couldn't think of one good reason why acoustic >guitar should be more expressive than electric. Anyone care to help >me with this? hmmm again. good question. Perhaps it's the natural resonances of the soundchamber that give it that feel. A sound that can be further enhanced with very simple effects 9like gentle stereo chorusing). Not that an electric can't be made to sing beautifully, mind you. James James Dignan___________________________________ You talk to me Deptmt of Psychology, Otago University As if from a distance ya zhivu v' 50 Norfolk Street And I reply. . . . . . . . . . Dunedin, New Zealand with impressions chosen from another time steam megaphone (03) 455-7807 (Brian Eno - "By this River") ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 20:31:27 -0800 From: "Michael R. Runion" Subject: Re: Soy Bomb Whoops...didn't mean to include all of Eb's post at the end of my last one. Damn, you don't post for a few days and you really get rusty. Mike - -- ******* Mike Runion email: mrrunion@palmnet.net *** * Virtual Cone Museum * * http://www5.palmnet.net/~mrrunion/cones.htm * * Globe Of Fegs * * http://www5.palmnet.net/~mrrunion/fegmaps/ * ********************************************************* "Wait a minute! Time for a Planetary Sit-In!" - Julian Cope ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 15:28:24 +1300 From: james.dignan@stonebow.otago.ac.nz (James Dignan) Subject: Re: don't start >leave it out. If you start wittering on like this you'll sound like a >total >wazzock. The whole list will go pearshaped and everyone will be sick as >a >parrot. And if that happens you'll get a right bollocking. > >A right bollocking, cor strike a light , you know how to make a bloke >feel small, enough to make a bloke feel like he's fallen arse over tit!!. > dave do me a favour. You'd feel a proper charlie, like some git thinking he was lord muck had given you a quick one-two smack bang on your conk. (I said CONK. Gawd'elpus. Conk. Y'know - schnoz? hooter?) James ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 20:29:51 -0800 From: "Michael R. Runion" Subject: Re: Soy Bomb On the Grammy's: I enjoyed watching Dylan (looking a'fright as usual), and thought the Soy Bomb thing was somewhat comical, but this bursting in and disrupting thing is getting a bit old. It's like we almost are beginning to expect it. Fleetwood Mac (a personal favorite) really disappointed me by doing the mediocre medley. A waste of airtime, which was sad. In general, the 1 1/2 hours I watched was a bore. Every year I say I'm not going to get sucked in again, and every year I watch at least part of it. I much prefer reading the list of winners the next day...and grumbling about the nominees and awkward categories the weeks before. On Robyn's diversity: My personal opinion is that he's not the most diverse guy in the world, but that has no bearing whatsoever on how and why I like him. In my limited experience, diversity generally breeds bland material that may shimmer initially but loses it's luster very quickly. If anyone, let alone an artist, finds his nitch or stride or whatever you want to call it, more power to them. To my ears and eyes (and touch), mining deep is preferable to roaming the surface. On the other 2 of my top 3: REM also does not strike me as particularly diverse, to their credit. Julian Cope on the other hand is sometimes almost maddeningly diverse, and while a lot of it works, just as much doesn't. > Though as I > already said, he does show a bit more willingness to write a "real" and > personal lyric in recent years. That was specifically what turned me on > about Respect, as opposed to his other A&M albums (and Elixir/Liquor). Granted, Respect had a few, but ME has a far more personal feel to me. "The Speed Of Things" is an utter and truthful beauty in my opinion, and "Sinister", "Filthy Bird", "Beautiful Queen", etc hit the same mark. Perhaps this is what I find so fascinating about Robyn: he can sing the most obtuse lyric that alone would be near foolish, but somehow he finds the fine mixture of chord and verse and instrumentation to reach out and really touch you inside versus just getting your foot tapping or making you want to slam or scream or whatever. Am I getting older? Yeah. Is he? Yeah. Alright. Incoherence is beginning here I know. Intelligible phrases don't suffice. This is music we're talking about, not essay-writing, or speech-giving, or academic-criticism. At the risk of sounding "Copian", the best music is a form of artistic expression that goes well beyond formal cause and effect and mental rationalization. There are no absolutes, no rights and wrongs. Objectivity is impossible. That's what makes award shows so meaningless, record reviews so pointless, and best-of lists so baseless. I've said it before, but in my humblest opinion, in the end its the emotional and spiritual connection you make with the music on your own terms (and in a twisted 20-century fan-obsessed way, with the artist) that really means something. All else is friendly chatter and wile-away-the-time banter. Back to internet reality... Eb, you're truly a character (albeit a near faceless and possibly computer-generated one). The lifestyle I imagine you leading truly intrigues me (and I'm sure I'm well off the mark). Would you allow me to be presumptuous and ask how many hours a day you spend "just" listening to music and scanning the internet? The preponderence of your posts and admitted comprehensiveness of your knowledge of recorded music (we should all be so lucky to find a field that so consumes us) at times overwhelms me. But what do I know... Mike (enjoying a post after a long long day) Eb wrote: > > Brandt briefed: > >"Soy Bomb"? What was that? A plug for that guys struggling band or > >something? Dylan's coolheadedness was amazing, but it's a good thing > >that Soy Bomb didn't have a copy of "Catcher In The Rye" and a firearm > >with him. Where the hell was security? > > Check THIS out. I did a websearch for Michael Portnoy, the guy who pulled > the Soy Bomb prank. He's an established performance-artist/dancer, and has > appeared in a rock video by Maggie Estep, whom I know nothing about > (http://www.mouthalmighty.com/maggie1.htm). He's done this sort of thing > before, apparently. And check THIS link out: > http://www.thing.net/ttreview/aprrev.04.html. It says: "michael portnoy > responds: I am a performance artist/musician/dancer. I have never seen > Fabre's work and I came to your review hoping to find some description of > the work. Too bad! Do you have any video of his work or know anybody that > does? I thought The Kitchen might, but no. Please call me with any leads: > (212) 479-7316 -Michael Portnoy." Do you KNOW how I could ruin this guy's > life, if I posted his phone number to the Bob Dylan newsgroup?? (I won't.) > > >Streisand and Pavarotti's no-shows must've driven the producers mad. > > You betcha. > > >Bette Midler's dig at Barbra was beautiful. > > I missed that. What did she say? > > Here are some mental notes I made during the ceremony: > > 1. I guess one should admire his devotion, but Mike Myers presenting with > an Ash Wednesday smear on his forehead was a bit peculiar. It didn't occur > to me until MUCH later what the mark was. At the time, I was wondering if > he had joined the Manson family. ;) > > 2. How come Lee Ann Rimes, Hanson and Babyface rocked, while Aretha > Franklin's stuff just laid there? She really seems to have lost a lot of > her range and intensity, sad to say. > > 3. The graybeard, old-fogey blunder of the night was James Taylor winning > Best Pop Album. Sheesh. (I was rooting for Sarah McLachlan, myself.) > > 4. Interesting that both CDNow and Music Boulevard bought commercial time. > Internet CD sales have obviously become big business! > > 5. I was thrilled to see Dylan win Best Album (Double Fantasy, Graceland > and Time Out of Mind are the only Best Albums of the last 20 years which > I've had genuine enthusiasm for), but him winning Contemporary Folk Album > was a bit lame. If anything, Time Out of Mind is a contemporary blues > album, and even that is stretching the definition. > > 6. Other than Bawb winning Best Album, the coolest moment of the night was > Van Morrison/John Lee Hooker beating out Monster Noggin & Monster Ego for > Best Pop Duet. I cheered loudly. > > 7. When did Lindsay Buckingham lose his voice? And when he did morph into > Bill Murray? > > 8. Strange bedfellows: Patti Smith sitting directly behind Tara Lipinski. > > 9. Peter Stampfel, legendary alumnus of Eb's Annoying Singer list, won a > Grammy for contributing to the liner notes of the American Folk Anthology > set. > > 10. Yet another Grammy for Sir Georg Solti, even after death. Wow. And it's > a shame that the Grammy presentation for John Denver wasn't televised -- > that would've been touching. > > 11. Wow -- the Chemical Brothers win a Grammy. And (ahem) Tool, too? > > 12. I don't mind Paula Cole's music, but she is utterly unwatchable as a > performer. Take it down a peg, sweetie. And if you're not gonna shave, you > could at least stop wearing sleeveless tops and lifting your arms up all > the time. > > 13. I'm happy that Vanessa Williams escaped the stage set with her life. > > 14. Whaddya bet that Fiona Apple would've won Best New Artist instead of > Cole (releasing her *second* album), if not for The Speech? > > Eb - -- ******* Mike Runion email: mrrunion@palmnet.net *** * Virtual Cone Museum * * http://www5.palmnet.net/~mrrunion/cones.htm * * Globe Of Fegs * * http://www5.palmnet.net/~mrrunion/fegmaps/ * ********************************************************* "Wait a minute! Time for a Planetary Sit-In!" - Julian Cope ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 15:46:22 +1300 From: james.dignan@stonebow.otago.ac.nz (James Dignan) Subject: Osborne, Tull, Country, Severed Heads >I feel that >it is my duty, the pale bookish geek that I am, to add that "Look Back in >Anger" was the title of a post WWII play by John Osborne that was quite >in vogue in England for a while. I feel it is my duty to add that one of the greatest newspaper headlines ever concerned a librarians strike in a certain town north east of London: "Book lack in Ongar" >Come to think of it, I would love to hear a *really good* Jethro Tull >tribute CD, with real bands, not these Cleopatra one-shots filled with >bands no one'e ever heard of with names like "Noodle Maggots" or "Leppo >and the Jooves." I think there'd be some cool ideas . . . and it would >probably sound really weird, and delightfully eclectic. > >Oh, yeah, and what about Tori Amos covering "Hunting Girl?" (Christ, that >would get me to, um, pay attention.) um, yeah... me too! Trouble with Tull songs, though, is I can only really imagine Ian Anderson singing them. Although Robyn would do a good version of "Dun Ringhill" IMHO. And I'd love to hear Midnight Oil cover "Fylingdale Flyer". I shudder tothink what Marilyn Manson would do with "Aqualung", mind. >If I do get bored after listening to the third RH album in a row, and want >something country (or, for me, contry-ish) I'll chuck on Johnny Cash or >"Almost Blue." what? not "Dr Byrds and Mr Hyde"???? BTW - Severed Heads are an Australian dacey-industrial band. Their CD "Cuisine (with Piscatorial)" ain't too bad, either. James np - "Stand Up" James Dignan___________________________________ You talk to me Deptmt of Psychology, Otago University As if from a distance ya zhivu v' 50 Norfolk Street And I reply. . . . . . . . . . Dunedin, New Zealand with impressions chosen from another time steam megaphone (03) 455-7807 (Brian Eno - "By this River") ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Feb 98 21:48:19 -0500 From: The Great Quail Subject: Re: bands v. solo careers Nick!!!!! Nick Cave! N i c k C a v e !!!! Did I mention, perhaps, Nick fucking Cave? - --Quail PS: Um, from the Birthday Party. . . . - ---------------------------------+-------------------------------- The Great Quail, K.S.C. | Literature Site - The Libyrinth: TheQuail@cthulhu.microserve.com | www.rpg.net/quail/libyrinth www.rpg.net/quail | Vampire Site - New York by Night: riverrun Discordian Society | www.rpg.net/quail/NYBN 73 De Chirico Street | Arkham, Orbis Tertius 2112-42 | ** What is FEGMANIA? ** "The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the human mind to correlate all its contents." -- H.P. Lovecraft ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Feb 98 21:45:56 EST From: Ross Overbury Subject: Re: Catchin' up on some threads + Good 'ol James failed to ignore me in the current flurry of Grammy postings and wrote: > I've never been aware of lucidly dreaming (in > the sense of being able to manipulate the action within a dream through > conscious effort) although I have come close to it and did keep a dream > diary for a while. One of my songs is also directly from something > remembered in a dream ("Down") If you remember your dreams easily you may not have to do much work to play with them in real time. It's the second most enjoyable thing you can do legally. > >I *like* the sound of > >acoustic a lot, but I couldn't think of one good reason why acoustic > >guitar should be more expressive than electric. Anyone care to help > >me with this? > > hmmm again. good question. Perhaps it's the natural resonances of the > soundchamber that give it that feel. A sound that can be further enhanced > with very simple effects like gentle stereo chorusing). Not that an > electric can't be made to sing beautifully, mind you. > But that's a static element of the sound isn't it? It doesn't offer any more creative opportunity for the artist, just a different starting point. Of course that takes you different places, but not more places. You can apply just about any acoustic technique to electric playing (except maybe body tapping), and the whole guitar/effects/amp/speaker/ (feedback)-guitar chain gives you plenty of parameters to tweak, even from one note to the next. Besides, you should hear the electric guitar fans in alt.music.guitar argue bitterly about which wood gives the best tone to an electric. One could probably make a better case for the guitar being a more expressive instrument than the piano. - -- Thing Montreal, Quebec, Canada email: rosso@cn.ca ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Feb 98 21:59:52 -0500 From: The Great Quail Subject: Re: Grammys >Actually, they took a full page ad in one of the trade magazines to say >"The flute is a heavy metal instrument". I think they were rather >pleased with it. I saw them live shortly thereafter, and Ian thought it was the funniest thing n the world. He spend the night taking some good-natured shots at Metallica. . - --Quail - ---------------------------------+-------------------------------- The Great Quail, K.S.C. | Literature Site - The Libyrinth: TheQuail@cthulhu.microserve.com | www.rpg.net/quail/libyrinth www.rpg.net/quail | Vampire Site - New York by Night: riverrun Discordian Society | www.rpg.net/quail/NYBN 73 De Chirico Street | Arkham, Orbis Tertius 2112-42 | ** What is FEGMANIA? ** "The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the human mind to correlate all its contents." -- H.P. Lovecraft ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 21:06:07 -0600 From: "Maxey L. Mullins" Subject: Re: moss elixir Ner wrote: > > Maxey L. Mullins wrote: > > > Everyone is saying that Robyn is done growing and experimenting. > > Hey, not everyone!!! Don't include me in that group... > > -Ner well, i guess i shouldn't have said "everyone." sorry. =joel ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 21:08:45 -0600 From: "Maxey L. Mullins" Subject: Re: the eb issue Ner wrote: > > Maxey L. Mullins wrote: > > > does anyone else find it extremely grosse that eb says he is a fan of > > over 700 artists. and that in 1996 he liked 140 different albums. i > > mean who has that kind of time? eb, you're either extremely rich, work > > at a record store, or someone's paying you to listen to music. i mean > > there's no way i even hear 140 new albums in a year much less like that > > many. that's a lot of freaking albums. i'm afraid i don't have the > > time or money. or maybe i'm just too caught up in my "Hitchcock > > vaccuum." > > > > =joel > > There are ways to do it. I don't have many expenses other than purchasing > CDs and literary materials, and going to see shows. I probably averaged > about four new CDs a week for the year - only about 60% of which were new > releases. I get many of them by mail from Columbia House and BMG Music at > an average cost of about 8 dollars per disc. I work as a computer > programmer and I have a portable CD player set up on my desk at work. As a > result I probably listen to about 7 or 8 CDs a day while I work. I got home > about three hours ago. I've listened to two CDs since I got home. I'll > probably listen to one more (probably "Minstrels in the Gallery" ;) ) and > then take a break for the rest of the night. At this rate I am able to > absorb a great deal of music and still have time for my many other > interests. I calculate that I spend about 60 hours a week listening to > music. The key is being able to do it while you work - but it can be > done... > > -Ner man. i need a job like that! =joel ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 11:21:00 +0800 From: "Baker, David(KWI-C09)" Subject: Re: bands v. solo careers I don't know about this - I thought Paul McCartney's solo work stands up to his work with Wings so I guess he is another exception :) Alcoa of Australia Ltd ACN 004 879 298 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 21:18:11 -0600 From: "Maxey L. Mullins" Subject: dreams on the dream issue. i have pretty lucid dreams when i take naps in the afternoon. and about a month ago, i did write a song in my dream. in the dream, i was on a farm and i wanted to talk to this cute girl but i couldn't because my mouth was full of hay. i kept trying to spit it out but there was no end to the amount of hay in my mouth. anyway, as i was spitting out hay, i was singing to myself the words "horde mouth." i woke up and remembered some of the words and melody so i picked up my guitar and worked out the rest. it's definitly not one of my better songs, but i thought it was kind of an interesting experience and fit well with that whole lucid dreaming topic. and man was that girl cute. i'd love to dream of her again, but this time i could do without the hay. that kind of ruined my chances with her. =joel ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 19:27:17 -0800 From: Mark Subject: Re: Guithread... My reasons for accusing the guitar of being so expressive: 1. It approaches the violin and the cello as a conduit for communicating the emotion of its artist. 2. There are billions of things one can do with/to an acoustic guitar: a. Strumming b. Picking c. Hammer-ons d. Pull-offs e. Thumping f. scraping a violin across its strings (nigel tufnel is a god) Yes, these can be done on an electric, but what the player is doing, is less clear because it is virtually always compressed or diluted by the electronic chain and speaker response curves. 3. The mere selection of wood composition and workmanship are a significant component in forming the sound of a song so it seems that it "just grew that way." 4. I don't think I've ever heard a better instrument for single accompanyment that can match it to communicate the real feel of a song of nearly any style. Yes, this is dependant upon the player, but it works for nearly every genre. 5. It is accessible for people of many levels of mastery to communicate those emotions effectively. I hope this hints at an answer. If y'all want to fight about this with me, you'll have to wait until I get back from skiing. I'll be offlist for over a week. Try to get by without me. Try not to use the claw end of your hammers on Eb (we have EbTech water filters at work- scary) while I'm gone. See you again soon, - -Mark Gloster ps. I apologize if my posts have been decipherable without your magic Church of Quail Conciousness Super Dooper Decoder Rings lately. I'm sure that my sudden acute lack of obtuse obfuscation in my prose will go away immediately. pps. Bay Area Fegs: maybe we could do lunch on the 12th or 19th. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 23:59:31 -0500 From: nicastr@idt.net (Ben) Subject: Re: bands v. solo careers >Then Ben attempted the same point, twice in a row: >>Eb, since you seem to know what every musician is doing wrong or right, >>why don't you become one and show them how it's done? >> >>I would personally be totally shocked if Eb >>could come up with anything half as clever as "The Unpleasent Stain". > >You know, this "Let's see you do something better" argument is weak, weak, >weak and always has been. I see it in newsgroups all the time (and not just >in a musical context). Feeble. > >Eb, who plays piano quite well, actually Why is that weak, weak, weak? Maybe you should admit it's true. I think it's personally pretty lame that you spend so much time criticizing other peoples work, and do it with some kind of an air of authority. The fact is, you know no more about writing or performing music than anybody else on this list, so don't act like you do. If you play piano, why don't you get some if your own music out there and let the other Eb's of the world tell you what's wrong with it. Who knows, maybe you'll be lucky enough to make your own top 100 list. - - Major Bill Smith ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 23:48:07 -0500 From: Ner Subject: Re: Soy Bomb Eb wrote: > Check THIS out. I did a websearch for Michael Portnoy, the guy who pulled > the Soy Bomb prank. He's an established performance-artist/dancer, and has > appeared in a rock video by Maggie Estep, whom I know nothing about > (http://www.mouthalmighty.com/maggie1.htm). Funny you should mention her. A month ago I knew nothing about her either and even now I know little more. I just picked up the new release from Recoil, the band that Alan Wilder (Depeche Mode) is put together. Maggie Estep wrote the lyrics and performed the vocals on two of the songs. Two of the best songs, I might add. Her vocal style reminds me of Ann Magnuson (formerly of Bongwater). The disc is, overall, really good. I'm not a Depeche Mode fan but Recoil sounds much darker and edgier than Depeche. Is anyone else familiar with them or anything else Maggie Estep has done? - -Ner ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 20:49:33 -0800 (PST) From: Capuchin Subject: Re: the eb issue On Thu, 26 Feb 1998, Maxey L. Mullins wrote: > does anyone else find it extremely grosse that eb says he is a fan of > over 700 artists. and that in 1996 he liked 140 different albums. i > mean who has that kind of time? eb, you're either extremely rich, work > at a record store, or someone's paying you to listen to music. i mean > there's no way i even hear 140 new albums in a year much less like that > many. that's a lot of freaking albums. i'm afraid i don't have the > time or money. or maybe i'm just too caught up in my "Hitchcock > vaccuum." I'm sure a thousand people told you, but Eb's a rock critic. He gets paid to listen to music and I'm sure he gets many discs for free. He's on this list because Robyn's way up on his list of favorites. If you can call 100 bands "really good", he can call 700 the same. That makes his top 30 roughly equivalent to your top 4. That beats me. I probably don't REALLY like more than about 35 bands... that's an absolute top number. I'm picky. If Robyn's in my top 2, that's about the same as Eb's top 40. If Robyn's in his top 30, it's possible he likes Robyn more than me. There's no way to tell such a thing. It's all really ridiculous. Just some words. J. ________________________________________________________ J A Brelin Capuchin ________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Feb 98 0:12:56 EST From: Ross Overbury Subject: Re: Guithread... > > My reasons for accusing the guitar of being so expressive: ^^^^^^ acoustic vs electric! Assuming it was you who threw this into the ring, I'm not letting you back down so easily, Mark! > > 1. It approaches the violin and the cello as a conduit for communicating > the emotion of its artist. I'm writing this message with a cello between my knees. What he said! > 2. There are billions of things one can do with/to an acoustic guitar: > a. Strumming > b. Picking > c. Hammer-ons > d. Pull-offs > e. Thumping > f. scraping a violin across its strings (nigel tufnel is a god) > Yes, these can be done on an electric, but what the player is doing, is > less clear because it is virtually always compressed or diluted by the > electronic chain and speaker response curves. > The chain giveth and the chain taketh away. Try "Van Halening" on an acoustic. Gordon Giltrap can do it, but I sure can't. Try bending a note and leaping into an artificial harmonic at the top of the bend, then releasing down to an octave above the original starting point. Easier on electric, isn't it? As I said, just a different base point for similarly sized ranges of expressive techniques. Now it's another thing entirely to say you express yourself best with the range of sounds on an acoustic. That's an issue of what's appropriate for the application. Coltrane's sax speaks eloquently, but what about that honking on Groovy Decay? Is it just the musician, or is it a case of using the wrong tool for the job? > 3. The mere selection of wood composition and workmanship are a > significant component in forming the sound of a song so it seems that it > "just grew that way." As I said, witness the arguments between "maple neck is crap/maple neck is god" camps in the usenet guitar groups. Then we get into bolt on vs. set neck, laminates vs solid wood, neck through body, etc, etc, etc. If the selection of wood and workmanship were not as relevant to the production of a fine electric guitar, a few hundred should get you the most expressive, best sounding, playable electric you can find. > > 4. I don't think I've ever heard a better instrument for single > accompanyment that can match it to communicate the real feel of a song > of nearly any style. Yes, this is dependant upon the player, but it > works for nearly every genre. > Yup. On acoustic or electric, that's something I can agree with. > 5. It is accessible for people of many levels of mastery to communicate > those emotions effectively. > Again, I don't see how this excludes the humble electric. > See you again soon, > -Mark Gloster > - -- Ross Overbury Montreal, Quebec, Canada email: rosso@cn.ca ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 21:29:05 -0700 From: Eb Subject: Soy Bomb mystery solved? http://www.hiphopmusic.com/soybomb.html Look at this URL which a friend just sent me! Eb ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 21:51:06 -0800 (PST) From: Capuchin Subject: Re: Soy Bomb On Wed, 25 Feb 1998, Ner wrote: > Funny you should mention her. A month ago I knew nothing about her either and > even now I know little more. I just picked up the new release from Recoil, the > band that Alan Wilder (Depeche Mode) is put together. Maggie Estep wrote the > lyrics and performed the vocals on two of the songs. Two of the best songs, I > might add. Her vocal style reminds me of Ann Magnuson (formerly of Bongwater). > The disc is, overall, really good. I'm not a Depeche Mode fan but Recoil sounds > much darker and edgier than Depeche. Is anyone else familiar with them or > anything else Maggie Estep has done? I blush at this, but in my very young days I was a huge Depeche Mode fan. Alan Wilder brought all kinds of fantastic things to the band and his previous group (something like The Outlaws? Some terrible name) did some interesting things. He brought black leather to DM and washed away all that Vincly beepy sounding keyboard stuff. Depeche Mode hasn't made a good album since Black Celebration (although they've done three or eight good songs, no really good albums... kind of like REM not doing a really good album since Green even though each successive album has had a few good songs) and I haven't been keeping up too much on their work since Violator. I'd be happy if Alan took off and did his own thing. Martin Gore can't get over the gloomy teenage girl inside him and Dave Gahan is just a creepy junky nowadays and Andy Fletcher never did anything anyway. I haven't heard Recoil yet, but I have no doubts there's some fine potential there. Yeah, I can't name The Kinks or The Who, but I can give a detailed history of Depeche Mode and Oingo Boingo. J. ________________________________________________________ J A Brelin Capuchin ________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 01:10:44 -0500 (EST) From: Terrence M Marks Subject: Re: Neutral Black Milk Cat Saturday Hotel > Did anyone manage to catch Neutral Milk Hotel on this tour? I am seeing > them in Washington DC this Saturday -- the Black Cat Club. (Anyone > going?) How do they sound live? > I saw them, Music Tapes and The gerbils at the Florida Popfest. I didn't think that they were anything great. The Gerbils were the best out of that set, I think, because they had the ebst singer. (Downside: all the songs were abotu him being dumped and getting really depressesd) Music Tapes was the strangest, with melodicae, singing saws and static the TV. Unfortunately, it didn't sound that great because it was noise, as opposed to music. )sorry abotu linewrap/spelling. It's lagging too bad for me to correct) NMH was ok. but a bit too out-there and without enough good arrangements...In general , they had too much stuff. Everyone else seems to think they're GREAT, but I think they're only very good. I'd go see them, though. Terrence Marks normal@grove.ufl.edu ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 22:28:30 -0700 From: Eb Subject: Re: don't start >>leave it out. If you start wittering on like this you'll sound like a >>total >>wazzock. The whole list will go pearshaped and everyone will be sick as >>a >>parrot. And if that happens you'll get a right bollocking. >> >>A right bollocking, cor strike a light , you know how to make a bloke >>feel small, enough to make a bloke feel like he's fallen arse over tit!!. >> dave > >do me a favour. You'd feel a proper charlie, like some git thinking he was >lord muck had given you a quick one-two smack bang on your conk. (I said >CONK. Gawd'elpus. Conk. Y'know - schnoz? hooter?) I think this is my favorite active thread right now. ;) Eb ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 02:07:00 EST From: KarmaFuzzz Subject: Re: instrumentation In a message dated 98-02-26 19:00:25 EST, nicastr@idt.net writes: >>On Wed, 25 Feb 1998, Ben wrote: >>> Eb, since you seem to know what every musician is doing wrong or right, >>> why don't you become one and show them how it's done? > >>...isn't that more or less how the world wound up with the pet shop boys? >>(tongue protruding through cheek) >I don't follow the Pet Shop Boys (#276), so I can't say, but I imagine they >have spent more time making music than criticizing it. And they probably >get sent a lot of advance copies of records too. before forming PSB though, Neil Tennant was a music critic (as was Chrissie Hynde, but that's another story). He formed Pet Shop Boys as a reaction to the records he had to review, as he rarely found any he liked. that's all. and anyways, i happen to LIKE the pet shop boys so piss off ;) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 01:10:05 -0600 From: "Maxey L. Mullins" Subject: Re: bands v. solo careers Ben wrote: > > >Then Ben attempted the same point, twice in a row: > >>Eb, since you seem to know what every musician is doing wrong or right, > >>why don't you become one and show them how it's done? > >> > >>I would personally be totally shocked if Eb > >>could come up with anything half as clever as "The Unpleasent Stain". > > > >You know, this "Let's see you do something better" argument is weak, weak, > >weak and always has been. I see it in newsgroups all the time (and not just > >in a musical context). Feeble. > > > >Eb, who plays piano quite well, actually > > Why is that weak, weak, weak? Maybe you should admit it's true. I think > it's personally pretty lame that you spend so much time criticizing other > peoples work, and do it with some kind of an air of authority. The fact is, > you know no more about writing or performing music than anybody else on > this list, so don't act like you do. If you play piano, why don't you get > some if your own music out there and let the other Eb's of the world tell > you what's wrong with it. Who knows, maybe you'll be lucky enough to make > your own top 100 list. > > - Major Bill Smith and eb, where do you find the time to play the piano? aren't you too busy listening to the 700 bands that you like and compiling lists of your favorite 140 albums of the year? by the way, where do the spice girls fall no that list? =joel ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 02:26:56 EST From: KarmaFuzzz Subject: Re: Look Back in Anger. Or, um, don't. TheQuail@cthulhu.microserve.com, talking in maths uttered: << Instant KarmaFuzzz, >as for direct beatle rip-offs, "Don't Look Back in Anger," in addition to >trying to lyrically dispute a far superior David Bowie song, completely rips >off "Imagine" in the intro. I am not about to defend Oasis and get my hands all dirty and tangled in this particular thread. (I'm still trying to cleanse myself of my involvement in the Titanic Incident.) I mean I like them, but I certainly do not love them -- although I do think "Wonder Wall" is a *great* song. But as far as the refutation of a Bowie song, I feel that it is my duty, the pale bookish geek that I am, to add that "Look Back in Anger" was the title of a post WWII play by John Osborne that was quite in vogue in England for a while. Part of the "Angry Young Man" thing. So I assume that both Bowie and the Gallagheri are just plugging into something farther back. For all I know, Osborne got it from an even previous source, perhaps the mandatory Bible or Shakespeare, or mayhaps even Ye Booke of Taliesin or the Bodicea Diaries of Flaming Love. I don't know. . . . By the way, there was a very good version of the play put out on video in 1989 starring Kenneth Branagh and Emma Thompson. . . . >> i hadn't heard of it. i'm very willing to buy Bowie knew of it, but the Gallaghers? i doubt they know of any plays without songs by andrew lloyd webber (or films more obscure than Close Encounters). I mean, they do think they discovered the Beatles...... ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V7 #74 ******************************