From: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org (fegmaniax-digest) To: fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Subject: fegmaniax-digest V7 #58 Reply-To: fegmaniax@smoe.org Sender: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-fegmaniax-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk fegmaniax-digest Saturday, February 14 1998 Volume 07 : Number 058 Today's Subjects: ----------------- doh! [dwdudic@erols.com (luther)] Re: doh! [dmw ] Re: Titanic [james.dignan@stonebow.otago.ac.nz (James Dignan)] best albums, perceived beauty, Rhymney [james.dignan@stonebow.otago.ac.nz] agree [dwdudic@erols.com (luther)] could be worse [dwdudic@erols.com (luther)] good x-files [dwdudic@erols.com (luther)] A New Chat site called "Black Snake Diamond Room" [woj ] Re: Titanic (Robynless) ["Runion-1, Michael" ] Re: best albums, perceived beauty, Rhymney [Capuchin ] (0%RH) Within/Without [hal brandt ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 00:42:31 GMT From: dwdudic@erols.com (luther) Subject: doh! As someone just pointed out, valentines day is actually on the *14th*. But, everybody was celebrating it today at work, and what not, so there you go. Yes, I am an idiot. :-) -luther ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 21:14:30 -0500 (EST) From: dmw Subject: Re: doh! On Sat, 14 Feb 1998, luther wrote: > As someone just pointed out, valentines day is actually on the *14th*. > But, everybody was celebrating it today at work, and what not, > so there you go. yeh, well, some of us start wringing the bitter bitter sap from those wretched vines a little early anyway. > Yes, I am an idiot. highly doubtful. - -- d. - - oh,no!! you've just read mail from doug = dmayowel@access.digex.net - - and dmw@mwmw.com ... get yr pathos at http://www.pathetic-caverns.com/ - - new reviews! tunes, books, flicks, etc. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 15:01:54 +1200 From: james.dignan@stonebow.otago.ac.nz (James Dignan) Subject: Re: Titanic >> X-Files is one of >> the best things on TV, along with Babylon 5 and the Simpsons. at the risk of confusing our American cousins, I'd add 'Hamish Macbeth' to that list. I'd also add 'The Critic' (is this one still being made/shown?) >>Yes, a very intriguing question . . . it really amounts to a view of >>love, doesn't it? All I can say is this: I would have jumped. Back on the >>Titanic. To be with the one I loved. > >OK, but could you fall that deeply in love after two days? So deeply that >you value the love over life itself? After TWO DAYS? two days? Two hours. I've been hit by love at first sight, once. And it was so scary I hope it never happens again. I doubt it will - that woman still hangs onto a fair chunk of my heart, and always will, even though she now lives 500 miles away and is happily married to someone else (as long as she is happy, I am content with the situation). But yes, I would have risked everything for her even after just the first time I saw her. >watch those Titanic spoilers, Eb. not everyone has seen it yet-- only >almost everyone. SPOILER FOLLOWS! The ship sinks James PS - did anyone else notice that none of the last digest - other than a piece of general purpose weirdness from Nick - so much as mentioned Robyn Hitchcock? ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 15:45:24 +1200 From: james.dignan@stonebow.otago.ac.nz (James Dignan) Subject: best albums, perceived beauty, Rhymney >This raises a side issue: How many of us feel we can have a favourite >album? I'd put Sgt. Pepper in my desert island collection, but >selecting a single favourite recording? That's like selecting a single >favourite *beer*! or in my case, cider. No - I don't think it can be done. I could probably come up with a short-list: the Beatles' contender would be Rubber Soul. But I couldn't point blank say "that is my favourite". It would mean denying Eno's "Before and After Science", Cale's "Paris 1919", Dylan's "Highway 61 revisited", Robyn's "Element of Light", and "Harry Secombe sings Nine Inch Nails' Greatest Hits". I'd even try to squeeze "Bridge over troubled water" on there. And that's without starting on the New Zealand albums... I'd need a crate to take to my desert island, full of CDs... > ...And besides, Am I the only one that thinks slightly chubby >(and intelligent) is actually a GOOD thing? I think it's more >attractive than empty headed women (the kind Robyn was always >attacking lyrically in the Soft Boys) who have spent a lot of time, >uh, kneeling before the porcelin god. (don't flame me for that >comment, please.) (/PC mode (hah!) off) not in the least. 'Em lasses could do with a bit of meat on them. More to grapple with, if you get my drift, as well as looking good. And it is nice to have a conversation occasionally, too, preferably one that is intelligent. A few comfy bulges and a bit of brain power are excellent in a woman. (/PC mode on. No - skip that - I'm still using a Mac) The kenster sez: > i think that the best singing i've heard robyn do is in his remake >of 'bells of rhymney'. i get all tingly everytime he hits that high note. ah, but then again, I could get tingly hearing Groucho Marx sing that one. The song is such a beauty, especially with the jangle of the guitars that the Byrds gave it (and it's the Byrds arrangement that Robyn sings). IIRC it was their arrangement, too, that inspired George Harrison to write his best song (IMHO), "If I needed someone". James (curiously noting that Rhymney, and all the other places in that song, are in Wales) PS - make mine a Strongbow. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 03:06:52 GMT From: dwdudic@erols.com (luther) Subject: agree On Thu, 12 Feb 1998 19:15:36 -0500 (EST), you wrote: > Fear not, Femme Fegs. . . there are at least a few of us guys out here >who appreciate (and, in the case of Kate Winslet, *very much* appreciate) a >woman who isn't all skin and bones. > >- ------Michael K., who would love to see the Kate Winslet look surpass the Kate >Moss look. I hate to say, 'me too', but, well, 'me too'. :-) ` -luther ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 03:04:54 GMT From: dwdudic@erols.com (luther) Subject: could be worse On Thu, 12 Feb 1998 19:15:36 -0500 (EST), you wrote: > Just think yourselves lucky , on the Fairport list they've just had >about 200 posts about Swedes and beer and the Rt list discussed Dire >Straits endlessly for about three weeks. Yeah, really! "Is Mark Knophler the 'evil' Richard Thompson?" Like that old Python sketch said, "Alright, stop that! stop that! too silly!!" =luther ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 03:16:25 GMT From: dwdudic@erols.com (luther) Subject: good x-files On Thu, 12 Feb 1998 19:15:36 -0500 (EST), you wrote: > >However, the show has reached a point where it has become >institutionalized and comfortable enough to enter a certain "postmodern" >mode of self-referentiality, and that means that not all episides must be >deadly serious. Personally, one of my favorites is the episode where the >Air Force fakes abductions -- the one where Alex Trebec plays a Man in >Black. That episode, which had the geefully courage to deconstruct the >show's own mythology -- was a masterpiece. That WAS a great episode... AND 'MACHO MAN' RANDY SAVAGE (is he out of the NWO? :-) ) was also a MIB!!! -luther will it surprise anybody if Mulder turns out to be a feg? ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 22:36:41 -0500 From: woj Subject: A New Chat site called "Black Snake Diamond Room" >Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 14:47:20 -0800 >From: Ken DeRouchie >Reply-To: webmaster@pomn.com >To: woj@remus.rutgers.edu >Subject: A New Chat site called "Black Snake Diamond Room" > >Out of the ruins of the Warner Bros. message board comes a new and >exciting chat room/message board. The Black Snake Diamond Room is now >operating at http://www.pomn.com/robynh/ >When WB changed the format of their Robyn Hitchcock message board, there >was a public outcry for something better, easier, more fan based. In >came Ken DeRouchie, webmaster of the Portland Online MusicNet. He being >a longtime fan of Roby Hitchcock took it upon himself to put up a site >that would appease the fans. That very day (02/05/98) the chat room went >up and almost all of the regulars at the Warner Bros. site switched >over. Let people know about this new chat/message room. A link is going >op to your site, please put one up back to the HREF="http://www.pomn.com/robynh/">Black Snake Diamond Room > >Thank you very much for your time, > >Ken DeRouchie >webmaster@pomn.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 12:39:30 -0500 From: "Runion-1, Michael" Subject: Re: Titanic (Robynless) > Here, here. I thought TITANIC was a waste of my time and couldn't believe > all the people crying around me in the theatre. It's historically > inaccurate, the love story is weak and the special effects aren't _that_ > special--when the ship is next to the iceberg after they hit, it reminds me > of sci fi films from the 50s, when a giant monster looms over a car or > something. Although the final scenes when people bounce off various parts > of the ship before hitting the water did seem realistic..... I admit it. I was one of those people crying around you. I'm proud to say it wasn't due to the admittedly unrealistic and rather weak love-story plot line (though it wasn't all *that* bad), but rather from the realization of what it must have been like to have been there. I feel the movie did an excellent job of protraying this during the last hour. Sure, there were those tender gut-wrenching Hollywoodism's thrown in for good measure, and yeah, I teared up at some of 'em (the woman tucking her kids into bed and reading them to sleep, the floating body of the woman clutching her baby). Maybe I'm a just a soft boy in the end. As far as historical inaccuracies, I was and still am in sheer amazement of how accurate the movie was (based on the testimonies and eyewitness accounts uncovered during the congressional inquiries). Sure, the Californian incident wasn't mentioned (for thematic scope reasons). Sure, the Statue of Liberty is holding the new lamp. Did Mr. Ismay really goad the Captain into firing up all the boilers and increasing speed? Who knows. I'd really like to see a list of inaccuracies (off list is fine) just out of curiousity...maybe I overlooked some obvious ones. I do agree that major flubs include the cartoon-nature of the classes, as well as the inference that locked gates kept the 3rd class passengers prisoners below decks during the final hours. As far as effects, some were dazzling (the sweep over the ship, the bouncing people) and some were duds (the faces of Leonardo and Kate running through the flashing strobes). On the whole, I think the movie plays exactly as intended...a grand explosive romp through a historical disaster meant for mainstream audiences. It may not be a poignant art-flick, but that's not inherently bad. Worthy of all the Oscar attention? Again, who knows. I'm not a fan of stuffy Hollywood award-aganzas in any case. All in all, I had a blast, saw it twice, and recommended it to everyone I knew. Now, if you want to talk about "Independence Day", that's another story. :-) Sorry to bore everyone...just thought I'd chime in an opposing viewpoint. You know, I just might be a prime candidate for the list's Anti-Eb. There's very little that I hate...I always tend to find something positive amid the rubble to catch hold of. Oh well. Mike p.s. Now, if Robyn had been one of the musicians standing tall on deck until the final plunge, *that* would have been a movie! Imagine the screams as he begins to play "Ghost Ship" or Luminous Rose" one more time. Mike Runion EG&G S&MA Data & Analyses; ADoCS Office 867-3619 BOC-251 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 08:30:14 -0500 From: "Runion-1, Michael" Subject: Re: Titanic, Love, and TP Hope this gets through. I sent along a post yesterday that failed to ever show (just another of those pro-Titanic posts). Anyway, still curious about any apparent inaccuracies... Quail says: > writing *is* an artifice, and > is very deliberate. For instance: Joyce, Beckett, Woolf, Eliot, Stoppard, > Burroughs, Barth, Barthelme, and Pynchon are very notable examples, and > to a lesser extent, Burgess, Mailer, DeLillo, Ginsberg, Garcia Marquez, > and Nabokov. . . . Ah, my beloved Nabokov finally rears his head on the Feglist! "Pale Fire" is one of my all time favorites, a real joy of a book to puzzle through and simmer over. > I am willing to bet that you would rather read "The Old Man and the > Sea" than "Ulysses" or "Gravity's Rainbow." Just different -- but equally > valid -- styles. Yes, all equally valid. Quail, if you're implying (though I'm pretty sure you're not) that Hemingway sought a "transparent" style, I'd have to disagree. His writing style is smack dab in your face from the first sentence. While I've strayed from my man during the 90's, there was a string of years there in the late 80's where Hemingway could do no wrong in my book (well, perhaps "Death In The Afternoon" and most of "To Have And Have Not", but who's quibbling?) But, I guess I will have to attempt "Gravity's Rainbow" again...I read, mostly in awe, everything else except for Slow Learner, but my old ragged and yellowed paperback copy of GR never seemed to open itself up for me all the way. One of these days... (And I really *liked* "V" as well). Eb, on Titanic... > OK, but could you fall that deeply in love after two days? So deeply that > you value the love over life itself? After TWO DAYS? Okay, okay, you old grouch. Maybe two days is stretching it a bit. But technically (correct me if I'm wrong), Titanic sailed on the 12th, but didn't flouder completely until the wee morning hours of the 15th, so we're looking at 2 1/2, maybe even close to 3 days...a much more realistic timespan for falling in love. : ) On Twin Peaks... Ah, it's been a nostalgic blast listening to all the TP talk lately. Sadly, my entire video library of TP was taped on a shite VCR I owned back then and is nearly unwatchable, so I haven't had the pleasure to lay eyes on that sleepy little Northwestern town in many a year. The anticipation and thrill of those Thursday nights (wasn't it on Thursday?) are sorely missed, and little on TV since has pulled me so, except for perhaps the original airings of My So Called Life. (no slams please). On jumping back aboard... Quail nailed it when he said being in love gives you a different perspective on the whole wrenching and/or stupid end to Titanic. There is absolutely no way I could have sat down and descended in a lifeboat while my wife stood by on deck. (Of course, this would have never happened...she'd be in the boat and I'd be on deck freezing!) My wife and I had this very discussion after we saw the movie the first time, and she agreed with me wholeheartedly. Anyway, I don't think jumping back on board is that far-fetched, particularly given the romantic angle of the movie. Enough, as I don't even know if this post'll go through. See ya, Mike Mike Runion EG&G S&MA Data & Analyses; ADoCS Office 867-3619 BOC-251 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 20:41:27 -0800 (PST) From: "Chris, the missing years." Subject: Re: Bob: 0% Beatles: 55% Others: 45% Conspiracy: 0% and I won't even mention anything about T.V. of the Titanic... > The fact remains that Sgt. Pepper changed all the rules. Brian Wilson > said when he first heard SP, he had been ready to take the world by storm > with "Pet Sounds", and immediately decided his work was about to go > unnoticed. Ahh..close. It was "Rubber Soul" that did it for Brian, and "Pet sounds" that did it for Paul. So, it could be said that "Pet Sounds" changed the rules. But, of course, these were the rules of the upper crust of the pop world at the time. More towards the bottom several bands had not even read these rules, i.e. VU or the MC5. All a matter of perspective really... I think Ross also mentioned that he like "Within You...." I think this is one of the better songs on the album. But, that is just me. Overall, I think there is something different about it that gives it an endearing quality, but separates it from other albums of a thematic bent, such as "Pet Sounds." Something is just not quite there with "Sgt. Pepper." Whereas "Pet Sounds" might as well be the only album ever recorded--on some days that is. .chris (who thinks the combination of "Pet Sounds" and Spiritualized's "Lazer Guided Melodies" is way past bliss.) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 21:20:35 -0700 From: Eb Subject: Re: Winslet You know, all this obsessive talk about Winslet's girth (on this list, and elsewhere)...yet to me, her most unattractive feature is that little cluster of raised moles on her right cheek. While watching Titanic, my eyes kept landing on that spot, eyeing the makeup trying to cover them, etc. Eb ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 21:45:19 -0800 (PST) From: Capuchin Subject: Re: best albums, perceived beauty, Rhymney On Sat, 14 Feb 1998, James Dignan wrote: > (/PC mode (hah!) off) not in the least. 'Em lasses could do with a bit of > meat on them. More to grapple with, if you get my drift, as well as looking > good. And it is nice to have a conversation occasionally, too, preferably > one that is intelligent. A few comfy bulges and a bit of brain power are > excellent in a woman. (/PC mode on. No - skip that - I'm still using a Mac) Me, personally, I'd say that the shape is negligible. It's all above the neck and behind the eyes in my book. > The kenster sez: > > i think that the best singing i've heard robyn do is in his remake > >of 'bells of rhymney'. i get all tingly everytime he hits that high note. > ah, but then again, I could get tingly hearing Groucho Marx sing that one. This is the real reason I commented here. I don't quite get what you mean by this line. Is it that you don't really know anything at all about Groucho or the Marx brothers and you're saying he sings poorly? Or are you saying that because he's dead his voice would have deteriorated and it'd still make the song pretty? Or are you saying that the song isn't so great, but Groucho sings so beautifully it could make you tingly? See, the fact is that Groucho had an amazing voice. And The 4 Marx Brothers could harmonize like nobody's business (or Monkey Business if you catch my drift... as in out to sea). And while his voice did fade a bit in his later years, he was still fantastic up into the 1960s. Nobody messes with Groucho. He's bigger than both BNL and God in my book (of course, I'd put most anything above those two). J. ________________________________________________________ J A Brelin Capuchin ________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 21:54:51 -0800 (PST) From: Capuchin Subject: Re: Titanic (Robynless) On Thu, 12 Feb 1998, Runion-1, Michael wrote: > p.s. Now, if Robyn had been one of the musicians standing tall on deck > until the final plunge, *that* would have been a movie! Imagine the > screams as he begins to play "Ghost Ship" or Luminous Rose" one more > time. See, now THAT might have got me to leap off the lifeboat and back onto the deck of the ship. That's just good entertainment. J. ________________________________________________________ J A Brelin Capuchin ________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 23:58:31 -0700 From: hal brandt Subject: (0%RH) Within/Without Chris, the missing years. wrote: > "Within You...." I > think this is one of the better songs on the album. But, that is just > me. It's also me. George's persona is the most interesting of the surviving Threetles and this is one of his best songs. Beautiful lyrics and instrumentation and the giggles at the end perfectly offset the weightiness of the words just as Her Majesty took the stuff out of the seriousness of the medley finale at the end of Abbey Road. The Beatles were always an incredibly fun band...how could anyone say their career was anything but perfect from Hamburg to Abbey Road? What more do you want from a pop group? /hal ------------------------------ End of fegmaniax-digest V7 #58 ******************************