From: owner-edheads-digest@efohio.com (edheads-digest) To: edheads-digest@smoe.org Subject: edheads-digest V1 #40 Reply-To: edheads@efohio.com Sender: owner-edheads-digest@efohio.com Errors-To: owner-edheads-digest@efohio.com Precedence: bulk edheads-digest Thursday, August 27 1998 Volume 01 : Number 040 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Edhead: Re: Hi y'all [Nicole Carlson ] board taping [Kevin Jones ] Re: board taping [Jim_Hirni@sessions.senate.gov (Jim Hirni)] edhead:board taping ["Andrew Bray" ] Re: edhead:board taping [Nicole Carlson ] Re: edhead:board taping [jreiser@ecoutez.com (Jason A. Reiser)] EFO:The Mystery of Taping- Explained! [EFOcrew@aol.com] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1998 08:30:04 -0700 (PDT) From: Nicole Carlson Subject: Edhead: Re: Hi y'all On Mon, 24 Aug 1998, Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV wrote: > Just subscribed yesterday after putting my computer together the way (I > think) I like it. Guess I'll post an intro, as I don't have anything else > of any substance to post. Hi Buddy, welcome to the list! :) Do you do ham radio? KB5ELV looks kinda like a ham radio handle. Ok, I have a silly question for you fine people: What kind of equipment is necessary for board-taping? A tape player/recorder, evidently, but what kind of plug is needed to connect between the tape player and the soundboard? Or is there another setup entirely? Thanks, - --nicole twn who, naturally, gets around to wondering about this the week AFTER the concert... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1998 13:18:29 -0400 (EDT) From: Kevin Jones Subject: board taping Hi Nicole et al.-- >Ok, I have a silly question for you fine people: What kind of equipment >is necessary for board-taping? A tape player/recorder, evidently, but >what kind of plug is needed to connect between the tape player and the >soundboard? Or is there another setup entirely? Just need a set of cables, typically stereo RCA cables, y'know, the red and white ones that interconnect everything in a stereo rack system. That, a deck, and a blank tape, and that's generally it. At least that's the deal when Bob's been doing sound on familiar equipment; occasionally I've had to scrounge up a really weird plug, like at festivals &c., but that's not typical. Kev - -- Kevin B. Jones Department of Environmental Sciences, Clark Hall University of Virginia, Charlottesville VA 22903 804-924-0555 News Director, WNRN 91.9 FM Charlottesville 2125-L Ivy Rd, Charlottesville VA 22903 804-971-4096 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1998 13:15:21 -0400 From: Jim_Hirni@sessions.senate.gov (Jim Hirni) Subject: Re: board taping How do I unsubscribe? ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: board taping Author: Kevin Jones at internet Date: 8/27/98 1:18 PM Hi Nicole et al.-- >Ok, I have a silly question for you fine people: What kind of equipment >is necessary for board-taping? A tape player/recorder, evidently, but >what kind of plug is needed to connect between the tape player and the >soundboard? Or is there another setup entirely? Just need a set of cables, typically stereo RCA cables, y'know, the red and white ones that interconnect everything in a stereo rack system. That, a deck, and a blank tape, and that's generally it. At least that's the deal when Bob's been doing sound on familiar equipment; occasionally I've had to scrounge up a really weird plug, like at festivals &c., but that's not typical. Kev - -- Kevin B. Jones Department of Environmental Sciences, Clark Hall University of Virginia, Charlottesville VA 22903 804-924-0555 News Director, WNRN 91.9 FM Charlottesville 2125-L Ivy Rd, Charlottesville VA 22903 804-971-4096 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1998 13:50:45 -0400 From: "Andrew Bray" Subject: edhead:board taping Here are my suggestions: Hardware I would say that a tape/recording device of some kind is number one. I've seen Walkmans with recording features, regular size tape decks, DAT machines, Minidisc recorders, VCRs. I use a VCR for three reasons. 1) You get a better quality recording. Not as good as digital, but better than a cassette. 2) I already have a VCR. There are a wide variety of options to get started without spending any more money than you have already invested in home electronics. 3) You can tape on EP speed and get 6 hours of audio without losing quality of the recording. This also eliminates the need to guess when the best time to flip the tapes. Connectors As far as plugs go usually whatever is can go into your deck is usually fine, and will connect to the board. The cables to connect to the board are the same as what you would use to connect the deck to the other part of the stereo. Typically, on consumer grade decks these are what are called RCA jacks. Its probably a good idea to invest in some 1/4" plugs as well. 1/4" plugs are the "big" size headphone jacks. If you get these you will also need some kind of adapter so you can connect these type of outputs into your RCA jacks. The 1/4" adapters should be relatively inexpensive (a few bucks, maybe). There are also XLR connectors, which are the pro grade stuff. These can be pretty pricey (>10$). The first time I needed them and didn't have them was the last. Few things are as disappointing as having your deck and all the stuff ready and realizing you don't have the right adapters. Make sure you have the ability to connect to both "male" and "female" outputs with whatever plugs you have. You should be able to get all of these adapters at Radio Shack. Other Junk I carry my stuff in a backpack. I also carry a little flashlight for those dark places, A power strip and an extension cord. (Everybody loves someone with power) I also carry a few business cards so when people ask for a copy I can just say email me. I carry a set of headphones and an adapter to connect it to the output of my deck just so I can make sure I'm getting a signal. Most home decks have a level indicator so you can tell if you are getting something. Write your name on everything. No big deal, but there is no confusion this way. Usually, Bob is great about helping you with what you need, but if you plan to get tape get there VERY early, especially your first time. That way you won't be bothering anyone when it comes time for the big show. Happy Taping! Andy ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1998 13:08:32 -0700 (PDT) From: Nicole Carlson Subject: Re: edhead:board taping On Thu, 27 Aug 1998, Andrew Bray wrote: > Hardware > I would say that a tape/recording device of some kind is number one. I've > seen Walkmans with recording features, regular size tape decks, DAT > machines, Minidisc recorders, VCRs. I use a VCR for three reasons. 1) You > get a better quality recording. Not as good as digital, but better than a > cassette. 2) I already have a VCR. There are a wide variety of options to > get started without spending any more money than you have already invested > in home electronics. 3) You can tape on EP speed and get 6 hours of audio > without losing quality of the recording. This also eliminates the need to > guess when the best time to flip the tapes. The liner notes to Portable EFO Show (speaking of which, anyone else notice the interesting photo of the band in drag? :) mention VCRs, too, but I'm afraid I still don't see how it'd work. Is the audio track of a videocassette necessarily of good quality? And wouldn't it get kind of heavy to lug the VCR around? And don't the sound people not have a tremendous amount of room back at the sound booth? Re: plugs Is it one of them Y-shaped extension cords I need? (That is, two plugs into the soundboard, one plug into the tape player.) I've got plenty of those. Thanks for all your help! :) - --nicole the wonder nerd *** "We will encourage you to develop the three great virtues of a programmer: laziness, impatience, and hubris." --from _Programming Perl_ Visit Nicolopolis! http://wwwcsif.cs.ucdavis.edu/~carlsonn nmcarlson@ucdavis.edu ana.ng@tmbg.org ncarlson@mail.arc.nasa.gov ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1998 20:26:58 -0400 (EDT) From: jreiser@ecoutez.com (Jason A. Reiser) Subject: Re: edhead:board taping >On Thu, 27 Aug 1998, Andrew Bray wrote: >> Hardware >> I would say that a tape/recording device of some kind is number one. I've >> seen Walkmans with recording features, regular size tape decks, DAT >> machines, Minidisc recorders, VCRs. I use a VCR for three reasons. ... >The liner notes to Portable EFO Show (speaking of which, anyone else >notice the interesting photo of the band in drag? :) mention VCRs, too, >but I'm afraid I still don't see how it'd work. Is the audio track of a >videocassette necessarily of good quality? And wouldn't it get kind of >heavy to lug the VCR around? And don't the sound people not have a >tremendous amount of room back at the sound booth? The average stereo HiFi VHS has surprisingly good sound. Notice that movie soundtracks generally sound quite good - you can get that same sort of quality with your recordings too. The sound is slightly compressed, and the levels are set automatically on most all recent decks, but it's still far better than anything under a few hundred dollar investment. A VCR isn't *light*, but it's hardly heavy considering the size. You can throw it in a standard LLBean backpack and still have room for cables, power strip, extra tapes, etc. As for getting in the way, that's what the extention cord and long cables are for. You obviously don't want to get in the way, and most places work out fine as long as you have about 12 feet of audio cable. >Re: plugs >Is it one of them Y-shaped extension cords I need? (That is, two plugs >into the soundboard, one plug into the tape player.) I've got plenty of >those. Well, it depends on what you're recording with. Soundboard outputs will generally be: RCA female pair (look just like the audio plugs on your VCR) 1/4" female t/s (mono) pair (look like a large headphone jack) XLR male (fairly large round plug with three pins) If you plan to do any serious taping, be prepared. You should have, as a minimum: RCA <> RCA pair (about 12-15 feet is usually safe, male on both ends) 1 pair RCA female >> 1/4" mono male adapters (Radio Shack has 'em) RCA male <> XLR female pair - or something else that has XLR females. Also bring some kind of cable that would allow you to plug into an 1/8" stereo jack (like the ones on Walkmans.) Some of us are taping on DAT decks which have these types of connections, so its always wise to have the right cables to connect to other tapers too! You probably already have a cable for this at home - 1/8" stereo <> RCA pair. These are usually used to hook up a portable CD player to your stereo system. RCA pair <> 1/8" stereo adapters are also a good idea, as are RCA barrel connectors, RCA Y-connectors, etc. You can never be too prepared. Of course, the first time you need one of these will either be the day before you run out and buy it, or the *one* day you left it home. Finally - remember - a soundboard tape is not always your best bet. If I have the choice of setting up a good pair of microphones in a good sounding room, that's *always* the way I'll go. If you see someone with a mic stand, talk to 'em - they might be able to give you some good advice. Have fun out there, Jason ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1998 20:35:43 EDT From: EFOcrew@aol.com Subject: EFO:The Mystery of Taping- Explained! Nicole, might I say it was very nice to meet you and all of the other CA and Utah edheads last week. The band and I had a lot of fun. Hopefully we'll get to do more recreational type activities next time. As for your request for taping needs, here goes... Things you will need to tape a show: 1 -Tapedeck (Hi-Fi VCR, DAT or MiniDisc are even better!) with RCA inputs 1 -RCA cable (pair -L,R) preferably 6-10 feet long (sometimes the "taper section" isn't directly near the soundboard area) 2 -1/4" (phone) plug to 2 RCA plugs (works well for stereo or mono outputs) (Bob and I do try to have these at all shows, but we are only Human, and we wouldn't want you to miss the show because we forgot.) Blank Tape(s)/Disc Pen/Pencil (for writing down the setlist, of course!) Mono- use 1 adaptor to split single signal (try repeating THAT really fast for awhile!) to both of your left and right channels {one soundboard output to two tapedeck inputs}. You will be able to help out a fellow taper who might have forgotten their adaptors, because you will only use one of your two adaptors. Stereo- use one adaptor each for the left and right signals {two soundboard outputs to two tapedeck inputs}. You will also be able to help out a fellow taper because you are now splitting both the left and the right signals instead of just the single mono signal, and thus have an "extra" left and right available for another taper. Occassionally, an extension cord is nice, but I have yet to run into a situation where the tapedecks end up more than 5 feet from the soundboard. I know this sounds a little complicated, but just go to Radio Shack and ask for (2) "quarter inch to RCA adaptors". It should have what looks like a large headphone plug on one end with two RCA (female - like the ones on the back of your tapedeck) plugs on the other end. I've never seen them in any color but gray, but that could be coincidence or just Radio Shack's color scheme. BTW, is Radio Shack a nationwide chain? I hope this helps. I'll be home for a while, so don't hesitate to email questions. I don't know everything, but I like to think I do.... CB PS: Andrew had some nice comments on taping. Some VCR's are digital and thus reproduce digital quality sound. I would recommend anything that says Hi-Fi, but as with everything, you get what you pay for. The $100 VCR will not be as nice as the $500 VCR, but unless you have a really crappy VCR, I wouldn't go spending a lot of money on any kind of new deck unless you are an experienced and hopelessly addicted taper. As for tape speed...there is always loss of quality when you reduce the size of the recording medium. A good computer comparison would be the difference between tape speeds is the same as the difference between regular and double density diskettes. In the digital domain, there's not much difference, but there IS a difference. Also, there are very few soundboards which have RCA outputs. If it has them, it is probably a piece of ____. Bob and I try to have the proper adaptors for you guys, but again, we are not perfect and many soundpeople are not as taper friendly as we are. If you try this with some bands, you might find that they don't have time to find the adaptor you need to tape. So it's a good idea to always have them with you. XLR outs are rare, but they do pop up now and again. Very nice comments, otherwise. It's a little easier to read than my version. Maybe one of these days, I'll have this posted on the EFO webpage. Comments on grammer, spelling, and clarity appreciated. I'm a perfectionist, so I'd like to have it edited and easy to read before I get Mike to add it to the EFO site. Bye! -CB ------------------------------ End of edheads-digest V1 #40 ****************************