From: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org (ecto-digest) To: ecto-digest@smoe.org Subject: ecto-digest V16 #65 Reply-To: ecto@smoe.org Sender: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk ecto-digest Wednesday, April 6 2011 Volume 16 : Number 065 To unsubscribe: e-mail ecto-digest-request@smoe.org and put the word unsubscribe in the message body. Today's Subjects: ----------------- Today's your birthday, friend... [Mike Matthews ] Kate's new Deeper Understanding [Laura Clifford ] Re: Kate's new Deeper Understanding [Tim Jones-Yelvington ] Re: Kate's new Deeper Understanding [Gregory Bossert ] Re: Kate's new Deeper Understanding ["jhanson21@comcast.net" ] Re: Kate's new Deeper Understanding [ART ROCK POSTER ] Re: Kate's new Deeper Understanding [Tim Jones-Yelvington ] Re: Kate's new Deeper Understanding [Joseph Zitt Subject: Today's your birthday, friend... i*i*i*i*i*i i*i*i*i*i*i *************** *****HAPPY********* **************BIRTHDAY********* *************************************************** *************************************************************************** ******************** Michael E. Bravo (mbravo@acm.org) ******************** *************************************************************************** -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Michael E. Bravo Mon April 05 1971 Dandelion Wine Brion McIntosh Sun April 06 1958 Aries Marcel Kshensky Thu April 06 1950 Aries Bill Mazur Mon April 06 1953 Aries Sun/Cancer Rising David Dixon Tue April 07 1970 Aries Heidi Heller Mon April 08 1974 Aries Jill Hughes Sat April 09 1955 Aries Klaus Kluge Sun April 10 1960 Unicorn Steve VanDevender Sun April 10 1966 Racer Art Liestman Fri April 10 1953 Repeat Stephen Golden Sat April 10 1971 Jokey Michael Bowman Wed April 11 1962 Aries Wolfgang Ullwer Fri April 11 1969 Widder Janet Kirsch Thu April 11 1974 Aries Kristen Scallion Fri April 12 1974 Aries Jerry Tue April 13 1971 Aries Stuart Myerburg Mon April 14 1969 Aries T-Bone Wed April 15 1992 happy cat Jeff Hanson Sat April 16 1966 Aries Michael Klouda Mon April 17 1967 Aries Noe Venable Tue April 20 1976 Aries Harry Foster Sat April 21 1956 NiceGuy Kjetil Torgrim Homme Thu April 23 1970 Taurus Jeff Burka Thu April 24 1969 GoFlyAKite Christine Waite Tue April 25 1972 Taurus Matt Adams Thu April 26 1962 Taurus Brad Hutchinson Tue April 28 1964 What sign? Geoff Parks Sun April 30 1961 Taurus Marty Lash Sat May 01 1948 Taurus Barney Parker Fri May 02 1986 happy cat Gray Abbott Tue May 03 1955 Suprised Tamar Boursalian Tue May 03 1966 Taurus - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Apr 2011 08:10:41 -0400 From: Laura Clifford Subject: Kate's new Deeper Understanding http://blogs.bbcamerica.com/anglophenia/2011/04/05/new-kate-bush-single-may-feature-autotune/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Apr 2011 16:09:44 -0700 From: Neile Graham Subject: Re: Kate's new Deeper Understanding It's available here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H5UsjqXXcZ4 but...I had to turn it off. I *hate* vocorder. Or is that autotune? Whatever that vocal distortion thing? Hates it. Alas! On Apr 5, 2011, at 5:10 AM, Laura Clifford wrote: > http://blogs.bbcamerica.com/anglophenia/2011/04/05/new-kate-bush-single-may-feature-autotune/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Apr 2011 18:17:24 -0500 From: Tim Jones-Yelvington Subject: Re: Kate's new Deeper Understanding It's her son! It makes sense conceptually and I love the sound of the rest of the track, so I am hoping it will grow on me. ~tim On Tue, Apr 5, 2011 at 6:09 PM, Neile Graham wrote: > It's available here: > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H5UsjqXXcZ4 > > but...I had to turn it off. I *hate* vocorder. Or is that autotune? > Whatever that vocal distortion thing? Hates it. > > Alas! > > On Apr 5, 2011, at 5:10 AM, Laura Clifford wrote: > > > > http://blogs.bbcamerica.com/anglophenia/2011/04/05/new-kate-bush-single-may-feature-autotune/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Apr 2011 16:28:52 -0700 From: Neile Graham Subject: Re: Kate's new Deeper Understanding So, is lovely lovely lovely lovely Bertie being autotuned or using vocorder? Inquiring minds want to know (even if they don't want to listen). On Apr 5, 2011, at 4:17 PM, Tim Jones-Yelvington wrote: > It's her son! > > It makes sense conceptually and I love the sound of the rest of the track, so I am hoping it will grow on me. > > ~tim > > On Tue, Apr 5, 2011 at 6:09 PM, Neile Graham wrote: > It's available here: > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H5UsjqXXcZ4 > > but...I had to turn it off. I *hate* vocorder. Or is that autotune? Whatever that vocal distortion thing? Hates it. > > Alas! > > On Apr 5, 2011, at 5:10 AM, Laura Clifford wrote: > > > http://blogs.bbcamerica.com/anglophenia/2011/04/05/new-kate-bush-single-may-f eature-autotune/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Apr 2011 16:21:47 -0700 From: Gregory Bossert Subject: Re: Kate's new Deeper Understanding On Apr 5, 2011, at 4:09 PM, Neile Graham wrote: > but...I had to turn it off. I *hate* vocorder. Or is that autotune? Whatever that vocal distortion thing? Hates it. the original had a vocoder. this one uses Autotune. like any instrument or tool, Autotune can be used creatively or otherwise. i get what Kate is doing with it here, but... it needlessly calls attention to itself, and adds nothing. the original track also had more of the fantastic bulgarian backing vocals and a mix that better featured the great bass part. or at least, that was my impression from a first listen. not an auspicious introduction to her Director's Cuts, alas, alas. - -- www.gregorynormanbossert.com -- - -- www.suddensound.com -- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Apr 2011 17:44:55 -0600 From: "jhanson21@comcast.net" Subject: Re: Kate's new Deeper Understanding It is really annoying though, I must admit. I'm pretty disappointed--I certainly don't see it as an improvement over the original. Sent from my iPhone On Apr 5, 2011, at 5:17 PM, Tim Jones-Yelvington wrote: > It's her son! > > It makes sense conceptually and I love the sound of the rest of the track, > so I am hoping it will grow on me. > > ~tim > > On Tue, Apr 5, 2011 at 6:09 PM, Neile Graham wrote: > >> It's available here: >> >> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H5UsjqXXcZ4 >> >> but...I had to turn it off. I *hate* vocorder. Or is that autotune? >> Whatever that vocal distortion thing? Hates it. >> >> Alas! >> >> On Apr 5, 2011, at 5:10 AM, Laura Clifford wrote: >> >>> >> http://blogs.bbcamerica.com/anglophenia/2011/04/05/new-kate-bush-single-may-feature-autotune/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Apr 2011 19:51:29 -0400 From: ART ROCK POSTER Subject: Re: Kate's new Deeper Understanding one time at band camp, Neile Graham (neile@zipcon.com) said: >So, is lovely lovely lovely lovely Bertie being autotuned or using vocorder? >Inquiring minds want to know (even if they don't want to listen). think it's vocoder or a similar effect, not autotune...but i do not know for sure. i'm not underwhelmed by the reworked version of "deeper understanding" but it's a bit mysterious to me. i like the more open sound of this version and the new drum track is much better but do not understand what the extended ending adds to it. so, while not thrilled about that or the concept of the whole project in general, i can say that i am very happy to hear that the joyce estate has allowed KaTe to use the words from _ulysses_ as she originally intended and amm looking forward to hearing "flower of the mountain," as "the sensual world" with the joycean lyrics is known. in other news, thank you neile -- i like the new susan james records very much and am pleased to say the cd's reportedly in the mail. in the meantime, yay for bandcamp! also happy to report that the new collection of demos and outtakes from mira, _the echo lingers on_, is quite tasty. unlike many odds and sods collections, it holds its own as a record and, as the first four tracks are the earliest released material by the band at, perhaps, their most chunky, it's not a bad place to start with them at all. limited run of 300 cds and, of course, the unlimited digital release we all know and love available from projekt.com. wheeee! woj ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Apr 2011 19:52:52 -0400 From: ART ROCK POSTER Subject: Re: Kate's new Deeper Understanding one time at band camp, Gregory Bossert (bossert@fuaim.com) said: >the original had a vocoder. this one uses Autotune. you sure? thought i had read somewherethat it wasn't autotune as msot people assumed from the clips that surfaced early... +w ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Apr 2011 19:56:29 -0500 From: Tim Jones-Yelvington Subject: Re: Kate's new Deeper Understanding Something about the way the original SENSUAL WORLD tracks were produced does not mix well at all with newer productions... like when I try to use them on mixes w/ more contemporary material... I don't know what it is because I have not had the same problem with older Kate stuff. But they feel soft (I always have to change the volume when they come on after tracks from other more recent albums) and like the sound quality is weirdly flat and distant or something considering the richness of the instrumentation. Maybe one of the engineers on this list can help me understand what I'm reacting to, it has always puzzled me. ~tim On Tue, Apr 5, 2011 at 6:51 PM, ART ROCK POSTER wrote: > one time at band camp, Neile Graham (neile@zipcon.com) said: > > >So, is lovely lovely lovely lovely Bertie being autotuned or using > vocorder? > >Inquiring minds want to know (even if they don't want to listen). > > think it's vocoder or a similar effect, not autotune...but i do not > know for sure. > > i'm not underwhelmed by the reworked version of "deeper understanding" > but it's a bit mysterious to me. i like the more open sound of this > version and the new drum track is much better but do not understand > what the extended ending adds to it. > > so, while not thrilled about that or the concept of the whole project > in general, i can say that i am very happy to hear that the joyce > estate has allowed KaTe to use the words from _ulysses_ as she > originally intended and amm looking forward to hearing "flower of the > mountain," as "the sensual world" with the joycean lyrics is known. > > in other news, thank you neile -- i like the new susan james records > very much and am pleased to say the cd's reportedly in the mail. in the > meantime, yay for bandcamp! > > also happy to report that the new collection of demos and outtakes from > mira, _the echo lingers on_, is quite tasty. unlike many odds and sods > collections, it holds its own as a record and, as the first four tracks > are the earliest released material by the band at, perhaps, their most > chunky, it's not a bad place to start with them at all. limited run of > 300 cds and, of course, the unlimited digital release we all know and > love available from projekt.com. > > wheeee! > > woj ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Apr 2011 21:44:02 -0400 From: Paul Blair Subject: Re: Kate's new Deeper Understanding I'm with Jeff. I've heard snippets a few times so it's beginning to grow on me, but the original is one of my favorite Kate Bush songs and I don't think this version will be up there. In the original, the machine vocals let you resonate with them and identify with the appeal of the machine; in this one the machine is more alien and disharmonious. For me that works against the song. I have a feeling, though, that her take on it might be that in 1987 it was harder to make a case that people would really form emotional attachments to their machines, whereas today the issue is getting people to separate from their machines enough to see them as something alien. I got to wondering whether Kate's vocals are newly recorded for this version, so I listened a bit to the old and the new side by side. On the new one she drops the "g" on words ending in "-ing" - "loadin' a new program," "deeper understandin'" etc. Certain bits that I had thought were new in this version are actually there in the original, but just buried. Now I can see why people complain about the production, though I rather like having all that stuff somewhat difficult to access beneath the surface. On Tue, Apr 5, 2011 at 7:44 PM, jhanson21@comcast.net wrote: > It is really annoying though, I must admit. I'm pretty disappointed--I > certainly don't see it as an improvement over the original. > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Apr 5, 2011, at 5:17 PM, Tim Jones-Yelvington > wrote: > > > It's her son! > > > > It makes sense conceptually and I love the sound of the rest of the > track, > > so I am hoping it will grow on me. > > > > ~tim > > > > On Tue, Apr 5, 2011 at 6:09 PM, Neile Graham wrote: > > > >> It's available here: > >> > >> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H5UsjqXXcZ4 > >> > >> but...I had to turn it off. I *hate* vocorder. Or is that autotune? > >> Whatever that vocal distortion thing? Hates it. > >> > >> Alas! > >> > >> On Apr 5, 2011, at 5:10 AM, Laura Clifford wrote: > >> > >>> > >> > http://blogs.bbcamerica.com/anglophenia/2011/04/05/new-kate-bush-single-may-feature-autotune/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Apr 2011 23:03:05 -0400 From: Joseph Zitt Subject: Re: Kate's new Deeper Understanding Yeah, I'm not thrilled, much as I'd like to be, "Deeper Understanding" may be my single favorite KaTe song,, so I realize I have to try to put high expectations aside... but the computer voice grates against the rest of the track, and sounds out-of-date in a way that the original didn't. I'm psyched about "Flower of the Mountain," though. On Tue, Apr 5, 2011 at 9:44 PM, Paul Blair wrote: > I'm with Jeff. I've heard snippets a few times so it's beginning to grow on > me, but the original is one of my favorite Kate Bush songs and I don't think > this version will be up there. In the original, the machine vocals let you > resonate with them and identify with the appeal of the machine; in this one > the machine is more alien and disharmonious. For me that works against the > song. I have a feeling, though, that her take on it might be that in 1987 it > was harder to make a case that people would really form emotional > attachments to their machines, whereas today the issue is getting people to > separate from their machines enough to see them as something alien. > > I got to wondering whether Kate's vocals are newly recorded for this > version, so I listened a bit to the old and the new side by side. On the new > one she drops the "g" on words ending in "-ing" - "loadin' a new program," > "deeper understandin'" etc. > > Certain bits that I had thought were new in this version are actually there > in the original, but just buried. Now I can see why people complain about > the production, though I rather like having all that stuff somewhat > difficult to access beneath the surface. > > On Tue, Apr 5, 2011 at 7:44 PM, jhanson21@comcast.net > wrote: > >> It is really annoying though, I must admit. I'm pretty disappointed--I >> certainly don't see it as an improvement over the original. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Apr 5, 2011, at 5:17 PM, Tim Jones-Yelvington >> wrote: >> >> > It's her son! >> > >> > It makes sense conceptually and I love the sound of the rest of the >> track, >> > so I am hoping it will grow on me. >> > >> > ~tim >> > >> > On Tue, Apr 5, 2011 at 6:09 PM, Neile Graham wrote: >> > >> >> It's available here: >> >> >> >> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H5UsjqXXcZ4 >> >> >> >> but...I had to turn it off. I *hate* vocorder. Or is that autotune? >> >> Whatever that vocal distortion thing? Hates it. >> >> >> >> Alas! >> >> >> >> On Apr 5, 2011, at 5:10 AM, Laura Clifford wrote: >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> http://blogs.bbcamerica.com/anglophenia/2011/04/05/new-kate-bush-single-may-feature-autotune/ > - -- Joseph Zitt ::http://www.josephzitt.com ------------------------------ End of ecto-digest V16 #65 **************************