From: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org (ecto-digest) To: ecto-digest@smoe.org Subject: ecto-digest V14 #186 Reply-To: ecto@smoe.org Sender: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk ecto-digest Tuesday, July 7 2009 Volume 14 : Number 186 To unsubscribe: e-mail ecto-digest-request@smoe.org and put the word unsubscribe in the message body. Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: Great parody of Lady GaGa (who?) [Tim Jones-Yelvington ] Re: Narnia [birdie ] Re: Great parody of Lady GaGa (who?) [kerrywhite@webtv.net (kerry white)] re: NARNIA [kerrywhite@webtv.net (kerry white)] Re: Narnia [Tim Jones-Yelvington ] and now for some real singing... [birdie ] Re: Narnia [birdie ] Re: Great parody of Lady GaGa (who?) [Tim Jones-Yelvington ] Re: Great parody of Lady GaGa (who?) [Michael Quinn ] Re: Great parody of Lady GaGa (who?) [birdie ] Lady GaGa [Michael Pearce ] Re: baby pete [breinheimer@webtv.net (bill)] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 14:38:03 -0700 (PDT) From: Tim Jones-Yelvington Subject: Re: Great parody of Lady GaGa (who?) That makes sense. But while I do believe music can be deeply felt, I also think sincerity, in any kind of performance-type setting, has an element of artifice, of craft to it (like "realism" in fiction, or "cinema verite"), and I don't believe a hammy performance is necessarily any less sincere or "authentic" than an un-hammy one.... I think about how Roisin Murphy talks about her wacky fashions as expressing parts of her personality conventional clothing never could, and that for her, to show up for a concert in jeans and a t-shirt would feel insincere ...or Tori with American Doll Posse, how the terribly earnest persona of "Tori" seems to have become for her, at least in certain moments, a bit confining for her.... or the way Alanis Morrisette, with her satire of "My Humps," so brilliantly poked fun at both her own earnest singer-songwriter persona as well as Fergie's "bootylicious" pop diva persona, and yet I also still think it's possible to take her version of that song quite seriously -- I found it to be one of her most emotive performances in a long, long time. ...I just don't think that the line between "artificial" pop and "authentic" music is always as sharply drawn as we may tend to think. - ----- Original Message ---- From: Michael Quinn To: Tim Jones-Yelvington Cc: Valerie Nozick ; ecto Sent: Monday, July 6, 2009 4:17:07 PM Subject: Re: Great parody of Lady GaGa (who?) Yeah Regina Spektor has always annoyed me for similar reasons and I've never been able to get into her despite trying a few times. I like a little sincerity in the delivery. Tori on ADP...Her personnas and wigs are a little silly but the music ranges from solid to very good so I just ignore the gimmicks. Tim Jones-Yelvington wrote: > I don't know... I actually think "American Doll Posse" glam rock Tori is all about artifice and performativity and the constructed image of the diva/pop singer in some very similar ways as Lady Gaga. > > ...but actually, when I hear Gaga's acoustic version, I think the first person that comes to mind is Regina Spektor. > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Michael Quinn > To: Valerie Nozick ; ecto > Sent: Monday, July 6, 2009 3:39:26 PM > Subject: Re: Great parody of Lady GaGa (who?) > > *Cough* What similarities between her and Tori? Yeah that video does > show she has a pretty good voice but the totally over the top hammy > performance acting totally ruins the song for me. Tori would NEVER do > anything like that. She doesn't have to. She also has a much better > voice and is a far better piano player (not to mention lyricist). > > Compare her to Jill Tracy maybe (although Jill has got better about the > cheesy hamming on her latest album) but not Tori please. > > > Valerie Nozick wrote: > >> Here's a link to the youtube video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwdXnlvUe3I >> >> I'm a LG fan too, although I've always had a weakness for good pop music. This video really brings out the similarities between her and Tori, in theatricality and vocal style. >> >> I'm looking forward to watching LG's career develop. She's very much in control and aware of her image, and in interviews she seems to not take the celebrity part of it all seriously. She'll either become a really great independent artist, or will go down the Madonna path (in an empowering never-know-what-to-expect way, vs. the manufactured Britney way). I doubt we'll never hear from her again after this album. >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ---- >> From: Timothy Jones-Yelvington >> To: Michael Pearce ; Untitled >> Sent: Monday, July 6, 2009 8:42:19 AM >> Subject: Re: Great parody of Lady GaGa (who?) >> >> Not as far as you might think, though. She's surprisingly multifaceted. >> >> Did you know she started out writing more singer-songwritery fare? See if >> you can find the acoustic version of Poker Face on youtube, it's pretty >> incredible. >> >> I'm waiting for her rebel against her own image after a few albums and >> independently release an earnest collection of piano ballads. >> >> >> >> >> On 7/5/09 7:36 PM, "Michael Pearce" wrote: >> >> >> >>> Since Lady GaGa is about as far away from Ecto as, say, Madonna, some >>> of you might not even know who VenetianPrincess is parodying in this >>> song: >>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h47fNaOb-JU&feature=channel >>> >>> If you have never seen LGG, this is all you need to see. >>> >>> Oh, and VP is really funny. Check out her other videos. >>> >>> Michael ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 06 Jul 2009 17:48:03 -0400 From: meredith Subject: Re: Narnia Hi, Jon Wesley Huff wrote: > I'm still waiting for Hungry Hungry Hippos the movie. Funnily enough, this link just appeared on my Facebook feed: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sXoYK4b_q24 (File under "oh they laugh now, but just wait, it's coming...") Meredith :) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 14:56:35 -0700 From: birdie Subject: Re: Narnia great point and i suspect the writers strike has the most to do with it note - no new ideas producers bought rights to ....product from places other than from writers. On Jul 6, 2009, at 2:32 PM, Sue Trowbridge wrote: > On Mon, Jul 6, 2009 at 2:17 PM, birdie wrote: >> > I think we can all blame "Pirates of the Caribbean" for this. Who > would have guessed that a Disneyland ride would spawn a billion dollar > movie franchise. > > --Sue ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 16:58:33 -0500 From: kerrywhite@webtv.net (kerry white) Subject: Re: Great parody of Lady GaGa (who?) Hi, Just read an MSNBC article on 5 Albums Artists Don't Want You To Hear: Tori's Y Kant Tori Read was there, but, also, Alanis Morissette's first 2 'dance pop' albums. With words like "barrier breaking" and the sentence: "Alanis was doing this when Lady Gaga was first saying 'gaga'." Just an FYI. bye, KrW I'm Peter Pan! I'm perpetually young!! OW!! What's wrong with my back? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 17:03:24 -0500 From: kerrywhite@webtv.net (kerry white) Subject: re: NARNIA Hi, I always wanted them to combine a Viewmaster with the disc camera that had come out: a home user 3-D camera. Sure limited to the viewer, but, still.. bye, KrW I'm Peter Pan! I'm perpetually young!! OW!! What's wrong with my back? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 15:07:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Tim Jones-Yelvington Subject: Re: Narnia I've been waiting for "The Tiki Room: The Movie" ever since Pirates became so successful. And I've spent the past several years mentally casting an imaginary live-action Jem and the Holograms. - ----- Original Message ---- From: birdie To: Sue Trowbridge Cc: ecto@smoe.org Sent: Monday, July 6, 2009 4:56:35 PM Subject: Re: Narnia great point and i suspect the writers strike has the most to do with it note - no new ideas producers bought rights to ....product from places other than from writers. On Jul 6, 2009, at 2:32 PM, Sue Trowbridge wrote: > On Mon, Jul 6, 2009 at 2:17 PM, birdie wrote: >> > I think we can all blame "Pirates of the Caribbean" for this. Who > would have guessed that a Disneyland ride would spawn a billion dollar > movie franchise. > > --Sue ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 15:13:09 -0700 From: birdie Subject: and now for some real singing... This is the original acoustic version of Kate Havnevik's - Show Me Love - shot at Mo's http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XDru03rMqNk You'll note how rich the performance is, even tho it's just her singing with a tad of guitar. There is no auto tune or anything else going on. Now - here is the new final going-to-be-on the album version www.myspace.com/katehavnevik first song on the player.... she re-wrote some of the lyrics, added a skippy beat, and backing vocals which were overdubbed. But so... if you listen to the first one, and the new version and go back to the first one.... that is real deal singing and a great song - stripped down or built up. and while she does alternative/electronica/pop no no autotune needed ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 15:14:38 -0700 From: birdie Subject: Re: Narnia somebody sign Tim please and gets these going!!! On Jul 6, 2009, at 3:07 PM, Tim Jones-Yelvington wrote: > > I've been waiting for "The Tiki Room: The Movie" ever since Pirates > became so successful. > > And I've spent the past several years mentally casting an imaginary > live-action Jem and the Holograms. > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: birdie > To: Sue Trowbridge > Cc: ecto@smoe.org > Sent: Monday, July 6, 2009 4:56:35 PM > Subject: Re: Narnia > > great point and i suspect the writers strike has the most to do with > it > > note - no new ideas > > producers bought rights to ....product from places other than from > writers. > > > On Jul 6, 2009, at 2:32 PM, Sue Trowbridge wrote: > >> On Mon, Jul 6, 2009 at 2:17 PM, birdie wrote: >>> >> I think we can all blame "Pirates of the Caribbean" for this. Who >> would have guessed that a Disneyland ride would spawn a billion >> dollar >> movie franchise. >> >> --Sue ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 15:17:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Tim Jones-Yelvington Subject: Re: Great parody of Lady GaGa (who?) I love Y Kant Tori Read. I also love Alanis's first pop album, which is goofy and dance-pop. Her second is really ballad-heavy and "mature," and I really hate mainstream pop ballads. - ----- Original Message ---- From: kerry white To: That warm and fuzzy [place] Sent: Monday, July 6, 2009 4:58:33 PM Subject: Re: Great parody of Lady GaGa (who?) Hi, Just read an MSNBC article on 5 Albums Artists Don't Want You To Hear: Tori's Y Kant Tori Read was there, but, also, Alanis Morissette's first 2 'dance pop' albums. With words like "barrier breaking" and the sentence: "Alanis was doing this when Lady Gaga was first saying 'gaga'." Just an FYI. bye, KrW I'm Peter Pan! I'm perpetually young!! OW!! What's wrong with my back? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 15:43:46 -0700 From: birdie Subject: fall shows in the UK http://www.seetickets.com/gat/index.asp Alison Moyet tickets for her big tour go on sale the 7th but look who's up there now for the fall.. Bat for Lashes & florence and the machine for staters ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 06 Jul 2009 21:56:02 -0400 From: Michael Quinn Subject: Re: Great parody of Lady GaGa (who?) Yeah, good points here. It's not that I don't like some "theatrical" music I mean, I'm a fan of old school 80s goth rock and it's hard to get more dramatic and theatrical than that. It's just sometimes you get the feeling that someone's just trying to hard with their "act" and the song would be better if they just played it straight. It's a subjective thing but I got that feeling big time with that Lady GaGa accoustic clip and I get it from a lot of the Regina Spektor music I've heard as well. Mike Tim Jones-Yelvington wrote: > That makes sense. > > But while I do believe music can be deeply felt, I also think sincerity, in any kind of performance-type setting, has an element of artifice, of craft to it (like "realism" in fiction, or "cinema verite"), and I don't believe a hammy performance is necessarily any less sincere or "authentic" than an un-hammy one.... I think about how Roisin Murphy talks about her wacky fashions as expressing parts of her personality conventional clothing never could, and that for her, to show up for a concert in jeans and a t-shirt would feel insincere ...or Tori with American Doll Posse, how the terribly earnest persona of "Tori" seems to have become for her, at least in certain moments, a bit confining for her.... or the way Alanis Morrisette, with her satire of "My Humps," so brilliantly poked fun at both her own earnest singer-songwriter persona as well as Fergie's "bootylicious" pop diva persona, and yet I also still think it's possible to take her version of that > song quite seriously -- I found it to be one of her most emotive performances in a long, long time. > > ...I just don't think that the line between "artificial" pop and "authentic" music is always as sharply drawn as we may tend to think. > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Michael Quinn > To: Tim Jones-Yelvington > Cc: Valerie Nozick ; ecto > Sent: Monday, July 6, 2009 4:17:07 PM > Subject: Re: Great parody of Lady GaGa (who?) > > Yeah Regina Spektor has always annoyed me for similar reasons and I've > never been able to get into her despite trying a few times. I like a > little sincerity in the delivery. > > Tori on ADP...Her personnas and wigs are a little silly but the music > ranges from solid to very good so I just ignore the gimmicks. > > > Tim Jones-Yelvington wrote: > >> I don't know... I actually think "American Doll Posse" glam rock Tori is all about artifice and performativity and the constructed image of the diva/pop singer in some very similar ways as Lady Gaga. >> >> ...but actually, when I hear Gaga's acoustic version, I think the first person that comes to mind is Regina Spektor. >> >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ---- >> From: Michael Quinn >> To: Valerie Nozick ; ecto >> Sent: Monday, July 6, 2009 3:39:26 PM >> Subject: Re: Great parody of Lady GaGa (who?) >> >> *Cough* What similarities between her and Tori? Yeah that video does >> show she has a pretty good voice but the totally over the top hammy >> performance acting totally ruins the song for me. Tori would NEVER do >> anything like that. She doesn't have to. She also has a much better >> voice and is a far better piano player (not to mention lyricist). >> >> Compare her to Jill Tracy maybe (although Jill has got better about the >> cheesy hamming on her latest album) but not Tori please. >> >> >> Valerie Nozick wrote: >> >> >>> Here's a link to the youtube video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwdXnlvUe3I >>> >>> I'm a LG fan too, although I've always had a weakness for good pop music. This video really brings out the similarities between her and Tori, in theatricality and vocal style. >>> >>> I'm looking forward to watching LG's career develop. She's very much in control and aware of her image, and in interviews she seems to not take the celebrity part of it all seriously. She'll either become a really great independent artist, or will go down the Madonna path (in an empowering never-know-what-to-expect way, vs. the manufactured Britney way). I doubt we'll never hear from her again after this album. >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ---- >>> From: Timothy Jones-Yelvington >>> To: Michael Pearce ; Untitled >>> Sent: Monday, July 6, 2009 8:42:19 AM >>> Subject: Re: Great parody of Lady GaGa (who?) >>> >>> Not as far as you might think, though. She's surprisingly multifaceted. >>> >>> Did you know she started out writing more singer-songwritery fare? See if >>> you can find the acoustic version of Poker Face on youtube, it's pretty >>> incredible. >>> >>> I'm waiting for her rebel against her own image after a few albums and >>> independently release an earnest collection of piano ballads. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On 7/5/09 7:36 PM, "Michael Pearce" wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>> Since Lady GaGa is about as far away from Ecto as, say, Madonna, some >>>> of you might not even know who VenetianPrincess is parodying in this >>>> song: >>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h47fNaOb-JU&feature=channel >>>> >>>> If you have never seen LGG, this is all you need to see. >>>> >>>> Oh, and VP is really funny. Check out her other videos. >>>> >>>> Michael ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 19:28:59 -0700 From: birdie Subject: Re: Great parody of Lady GaGa (who?) oh, that... um... she was a bit forced sloppy and mannered Obviously not a student of Bob Fosse Much much much MUCH practice makes the moves seem natural, flawless, and oh so cool Just ask any of the greats Astaire, Garland, Fosse, and so on It takes a certain severe work ethic MIchael Jackson had it... She was under rehearsed and I suspect needs more coaching Ray Charles on the other hand uh huh.... Ray Charles just did his thang and that included playing all the time... for most of his life and it was a long one With all this instant low fi media - you can see peeps in the arc of development so helps to be a bit less judgemental unless you are working to make improvements then, the critical eye is there to make things better. That wig of hers tho sure looks it could catch fire! On Jul 6, 2009, at 6:56 PM, Michael Quinn wrote: > Yeah, good points here. It's not that I don't like some "theatrical" > music I mean, I'm a fan of old school 80s goth rock and it's hard to > get > more dramatic and theatrical than that. It's just sometimes you get > the > feeling that someone's just trying to hard with their "act" and the > song > would be better if they just played it straight. It's a subjective > thing > but I got that feeling big time with that Lady GaGa accoustic clip > and I > get it from a lot of the Regina Spektor music I've heard as well. > > Mike > > > Tim Jones-Yelvington wrote: >> That makes sense. >> >> But while I do believe music can be deeply felt, I also think >> sincerity, in > any kind of performance-type setting, has an element of artifice, of > craft to > it (like "realism" in fiction, or "cinema verite"), and I don't > believe a > hammy performance is necessarily any less sincere or "authentic" > than an > un-hammy one.... I think about how Roisin Murphy talks about her wacky > fashions as expressing parts of her personality conventional > clothing never > could, and that for her, to show up for a concert in jeans and a t- > shirt would > feel insincere ...or Tori with American Doll Posse, how the > terribly earnest > persona of "Tori" seems to have become for her, at least in certain > moments, a > bit confining for her.... or the way Alanis Morrisette, with her > satire of "My > Humps," so brilliantly poked fun at both her own earnest singer- > songwriter > persona as well as Fergie's "bootylicious" pop diva persona, and yet > I also > still think it's possible to take her version of that >> song quite seriously -- I found it to be one of her most emotive > performances in a long, long time. >> >> ...I just don't think that the line between "artificial" pop and >> "authentic" > music is always as sharply drawn as we may tend to think. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ---- >> From: Michael Quinn >> To: Tim Jones-Yelvington >> Cc: Valerie Nozick ; ecto >> Sent: Monday, July 6, 2009 4:17:07 PM >> Subject: Re: Great parody of Lady GaGa (who?) >> >> Yeah Regina Spektor has always annoyed me for similar reasons and >> I've >> never been able to get into her despite trying a few times. I like a >> little sincerity in the delivery. >> >> Tori on ADP...Her personnas and wigs are a little silly but the music >> ranges from solid to very good so I just ignore the gimmicks. >> >> >> Tim Jones-Yelvington wrote: >> >>> I don't know... I actually think "American Doll Posse" glam rock >>> Tori is > all about artifice and performativity and the constructed image of the > diva/pop singer in some very similar ways as Lady Gaga. >>> >>> ...but actually, when I hear Gaga's acoustic version, I think the >>> first > person that comes to mind is Regina Spektor. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ---- >>> From: Michael Quinn >>> To: Valerie Nozick ; ecto >>> Sent: Monday, July 6, 2009 3:39:26 PM >>> Subject: Re: Great parody of Lady GaGa (who?) >>> >>> *Cough* What similarities between her and Tori? Yeah that video does >>> show she has a pretty good voice but the totally over the top hammy >>> performance acting totally ruins the song for me. Tori would NEVER >>> do >>> anything like that. She doesn't have to. She also has a much better >>> voice and is a far better piano player (not to mention lyricist). >>> >>> Compare her to Jill Tracy maybe (although Jill has got better >>> about the >>> cheesy hamming on her latest album) but not Tori please. >>> >>> >>> Valerie Nozick wrote: >>> >>> >>>> Here's a link to the youtube video: > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwdXnlvUe3I >>>> >>>> I'm a LG fan too, although I've always had a weakness for good >>>> pop music. > This video really brings out the similarities between her and Tori, in > theatricality and vocal style. >>>> >>>> I'm looking forward to watching LG's career develop. She's very >>>> much in > control and aware of her image, and in interviews she seems to not > take the > celebrity part of it all seriously. She'll either become a really > great > independent artist, or will go down the Madonna path (in an empowering > never-know-what-to-expect way, vs. the manufactured Britney way). I > doubt > we'll never hear from her again after this album. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ---- >>>> From: Timothy Jones-Yelvington >>>> To: Michael Pearce ; Untitled >>>> Sent: Monday, July 6, 2009 8:42:19 AM >>>> Subject: Re: Great parody of Lady GaGa (who?) >>>> >>>> Not as far as you might think, though. She's surprisingly >>>> multifaceted. >>>> >>>> Did you know she started out writing more singer-songwritery >>>> fare? See if >>>> you can find the acoustic version of Poker Face on youtube, it's >>>> pretty >>>> incredible. >>>> >>>> I'm waiting for her rebel against her own image after a few >>>> albums and >>>> independently release an earnest collection of piano ballads. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On 7/5/09 7:36 PM, "Michael Pearce" wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> Since Lady GaGa is about as far away from Ecto as, say, Madonna, >>>>> some >>>>> of you might not even know who VenetianPrincess is parodying in >>>>> this >>>>> song: >>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h47fNaOb-JU&feature=channel >>>>> >>>>> If you have never seen LGG, this is all you need to see. >>>>> >>>>> Oh, and VP is really funny. Check out her other videos. >>>>> >>>>> Michael ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Jul 2009 21:23:42 -0700 From: Michael Pearce Subject: Lady GaGa Valerie Nozick wrote: >Here's a link to the youtube video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwdXnlvUe3I > >I'm a LG fan too, although I've always had a weakness for good pop >music. This video really brings out the similarities between her and >Tori, in theatricality and vocal style. I'm impressed. I have officially upgraded my opinion of her. >I'm looking forward to watching LG's career develop. She's very much >in control and aware of her image, and in interviews she seems to >not take the celebrity part of it all seriously. She'll either >become a really great independent artist, or will go down the >Madonna path (in an empowering never-know-what-to-expect way, vs. >the manufactured Britney way). I doubt we'll never hear from her >again after this album. With Perez Hilton as one of her most dedicated promoters, I fear she will be dragged along the manufactured route for a while. It would be cool if, after getting rich, she did blow it all off and produce a real album in her own identity. Hopefully, she won't forget how by then. Still, it's happened before. Michael ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Jul 2009 01:41:45 -0400 From: breinheimer@webtv.net (bill) Subject: Re: baby pete sorry i'm a few days behind but i've just dbeen incredibly busy lately. much to my surprise I find myself coming to peter frampton's defence. no overnight success he had hits in the uk with the herd and enjoyed some success on both sides of the pond with humble pie, who in the opinion of some of us (kerry?) went downhill after he left. he then put out some mildly successful solo albums and toured constantly. it was the material from those albums that were the foundation for the success of (the incredibly overplayed) frampton comes alive. his playing was well regarded enough to cause george harrison, nilsson and david bowie all to bring him in to record with them. unfortunately the record company pushed him into rushing out a weak followup album and the next year he was in a near fatal accident and broke up with his long time girlfriend. like too many artists his best work was his early work and then he seemed to run out of musical ideas. personally I liked frampton comes alive but hated the cheesy talk box effect and quickly stopped playing it on my college radio show due to it's overplay everywhere else. np: nik bartsch's ronin- holon not ecto but the most compelling music I've heard in years. must get more by him. very highly recommended ------------------------------ End of ecto-digest V14 #186 ***************************