From: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org (ecto-digest) To: ecto-digest@smoe.org Subject: ecto-digest V13 #418 Reply-To: ecto@smoe.org Sender: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk ecto-digest Friday, March 7 2008 Volume 13 : Number 418 To unsubscribe: e-mail ecto-digest-request@smoe.org and put the word unsubscribe in the message body. Today's Subjects: ----------------- female guitarists ["Donald G. Keller" ] songs about flowers [Becky Rizoli ] new camille [anna maria "stjärnell" ] Re: female guitarists [Doug ] Re: female guitarists [Greg Dunn ] Re: female guitarists [Timothy Jones-Yelvington ] Re: songs about flowers [Timothy Jones-Yelvington ] Re: songs about flowers [Yngve Hauge ] Ani and Over The Rhine ["Urs Stafford" ] Re: songs about flowers ["Richard Messum" ] Re: Greatest Female Guitarists writeup [Suzanne DeCory ] Re: songs about flowers [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED] [Amanda Williams ] Re: female guitarists [meredith ] Re: songs about flowers [meredith ] Re: songs about flowers [birdie ] Re: songs about flowers [Alberto ] Re: female guitarists [Greg Dunn ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 09:45:38 -0500 (EST) From: "Donald G. Keller" Subject: female guitarists My problem with the "best female guitarists" list is that there seem to be too many "greatest female artists who happen to play guitar": Chrissie Hynde, Courtney Love, and PJ Harvey among them. Important songwriters and singers, but not notable for their ability to play the guitar. (Effective, not technically outstanding.) Jenny Toomey is another one. (And Liz Phair--not good at all.) As for female guitarists who actually =are= notable for their ability to play, I'll endorse Carrie Brownstein (but not Corin Tucker), Mary Timony (most for her earliest work with Autoclave), and Kristin Hersh. And more I'll think of later, doubtless. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 07:10:46 -0800 (PST) From: Becky Rizoli Subject: songs about flowers Spring is in the air and I thought I'd make a mix of songs about gardens and flowers. So far I have: "Wildflower" and "Violet or Blue" by Rachael Sage "The Flowers" by Regina Spector "Living It Up In The Garden" by The Nields "We'll Plant An Oak" by Nerissa & Katryna Nields "Little Perennials" by Indigo Girls "The Rose" Bette Midler Anyone have any other suggestions? Songs from both ecto and non-ecto artists are welcome. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 07:35:34 -0800 (PST) From: anna maria "stjärnell" Subject: new camille hi. I hope you all know Camille is relasing her new album Music hole soon. The first song I've heard "Money note" is astonishing. Anna ____________________________________________________________________________________ Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 09:50:38 -0600 From: Doug Subject: Re: female guitarists > As for female guitarists who actually =are= notable for their ability to > play, I'll endorse Carrie Brownstein (but not Corin Tucker), Mary Timony > (most for her earliest work with Autoclave), and Kristin Hersh. NOT Corin? Ouch. I've been impressed by Ellen Cherry's (Kristin's) guitar work, but I doubt anyone here has heard of her... - --Doug ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 10:52:48 -0500 (GMT-05:00) From: Greg Dunn Subject: Re: female guitarists Carrie Newcomer; the goddess of fingerstyle and alternate tunings. If she weren't turning out an album a year, she'd be a guitar instructor somewhere. Don't know if she's kept up her chops lately, but Jewel used to be a pretty skilled guitarist; it wasn't unusual for her to retune or switch guitars between almost every song at her earlier shows, and she really seemed to grok the instrument. Though I always felt her expertise was at creating emotive tonalities rather than focusing on sheer speed and dexterity, she could be mesmerizing. Heather Nova, on her last US tour, brought along a lady who utterly eclipsed most guitar players of either sex I've seen in a while - Berit Fridahl. She was comfortable with searing rock riffs and gentle ballads in equal measure, and I hope to see her play live again some day. I also need to put in a word for Bay area artist Megan Slankard, who is mostly self-taught but eminently capable with many different styles and tunings. She's another one who creates an atmosphere with her carefully-chosen chord and fingerstyle sequences. - -----Original Message----- >From: "Donald G. Keller" >Sent: Mar 6, 2008 9:45 AM >To: ecto@smoe.org >Subject: female guitarists > >My problem with the "best female guitarists" list is that there seem to be >too many "greatest female artists who happen to play guitar": Chrissie >Hynde, Courtney Love, and PJ Harvey among them. Important songwriters and >singers, but not notable for their ability to play the guitar. >(Effective, not technically outstanding.) Jenny Toomey is another one. >(And Liz Phair--not good at all.) > >As for female guitarists who actually =are= notable for their ability to >play, I'll endorse Carrie Brownstein (but not Corin Tucker), Mary Timony >(most for her earliest work with Autoclave), and Kristin Hersh. > >And more I'll think of later, doubtless. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 06 Mar 2008 10:30:06 -0600 From: Timothy Jones-Yelvington Subject: Re: female guitarists Annie Clark (St Vincent) belongs on the list as well, but I think she's still too recent to register. On 3/6/08 8:45 AM, "Donald G. Keller" wrote: > My problem with the "best female guitarists" list is that there seem to be > too many "greatest female artists who happen to play guitar": Chrissie > Hynde, Courtney Love, and PJ Harvey among them. Important songwriters and > singers, but not notable for their ability to play the guitar. > (Effective, not technically outstanding.) Jenny Toomey is another one. > (And Liz Phair--not good at all.) > > As for female guitarists who actually =are= notable for their ability to > play, I'll endorse Carrie Brownstein (but not Corin Tucker), Mary Timony > (most for her earliest work with Autoclave), and Kristin Hersh. > > And more I'll think of later, doubtless. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 06 Mar 2008 10:26:38 -0600 From: Timothy Jones-Yelvington Subject: Re: songs about flowers Some choices from my iTunes: "Hangover Flower" - Abby Travis "Destroy the Flower" - Lisa Germano (OK, maybe a little bit dark, but great song) "Hearts and Flowers" - Lamb "Little Flowers" - Denison Witmer (I can't remember if he ever actually says the word flower in this song, but it's great). "Flower in Time" - Noe Venable "Incarceration of a Flower Child" - Marianne Faithfull "Happy Flower" - Nellie McKay "Lynn Teeter Flower" - Maria Taylor (this isn't a real song, it's an intro where Maria vocalizes into a mic as a small child... But it might be a good prologue for the mix) On 3/6/08 9:10 AM, "Becky Rizoli" wrote: > Spring is in the air and I thought I'd make a mix of songs about gardens and > flowers. So far I have: > > "Wildflower" and "Violet or Blue" by Rachael Sage > "The Flowers" by Regina Spector > "Living It Up In The Garden" by The Nields > "We'll Plant An Oak" by Nerissa & Katryna Nields > "Little Perennials" by Indigo Girls > "The Rose" Bette Midler > > Anyone have any other suggestions? Songs from both ecto and non-ecto artists > are welcome. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 17:21:08 +0100 From: Yngve Hauge Subject: Re: songs about flowers Here you have some with flowers in the title at least - if they actually are about flowers and gardens I can't say as I don't have the lyrics here. Some of them I know ain't about flowers, but I did list them anyways :) All About Eve - Flowers In our Hair 1k Maniacs - Wildwood Flower Area / M7X - I'll Gather The Flowers Big Hat - Flowerbox Blackgirls - Moonflower Cibo Matto - Flowers Dead Can Dance - Flowers Of the Sea / Persephone (The Gathering Of Flowers) Dreambeach - Flowers John & Mary - Rags Of Flowers Lamb - Hearts And Flowers Liz Phair - Flower Mandalay - Flowers Bloom Martha Wainwright - These Flowers Mazzy Star - Flowers in December / Blue Flower Mecca Normal - Cherry Flowers Mike Oldfield - Flowers Of The Forest Moonflowers - Moonflowers (with Anne Marie Almedal from Velvet Belly) Noe Venable - Flower In Time Peter Gabriel - Wallflower Shelleyan Orphan - Century Flower / Long Dead Flowers Dried Out in Summer Stereolab - The Flower Called Nowhere Talking Heads - (Nothing but) Flowers Tracy Bonham - Wilting Flower Tribe - Dogflower Tweeterfriendly Music - Free Love & Flowers Veda Hille - Red Flowers / White Flowers Velvet Belly - Flower ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 15:17:36 -0500 From: "Urs Stafford" Subject: Ani and Over The Rhine Hi all Ani Difranco & Over the Rhine are performing TONIGHT (6 March) at the Bijou Theater in Knoxville. Doors open at 7pm, concert starts 8pm. I am *so* there... Cheers, Urs. - -- It's psychosomatic. You need a lobotomy. I'll get the chainsaw. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 15:49:40 -0500 From: "Richard Messum" Subject: Re: songs about flowers How can i resist adding "Beware Of The Flowers ('Cause I'm Sure They're Gonna Get You, Yeah)" by John Otway & Wild Willy Barrett.... Richard ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 17:25:18 -0500 From: Suzanne DeCory Subject: Re: Greatest Female Guitarists writeup They left out Carley Simon and Melissa Etherige, and Happy Rhodes! and quite a few others too... Obviously just picking their favs... Pay no attention to the panel behind the rolling curtain... _________________________________________________________________ Shed those extra pounds with MSN and The Biggest Loser! http://biggestloser.msn.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2008 00:48:58 +0100 From: Rolf Peukert Subject: Re: songs about flowers > Anyone have any other suggestions? Songs from both ecto and non- > ecto artists are welcome. "Night Scented Stock" - Kate Bush (does Kate's "Lily" count? It's not really about the flower, well, Night Scented Stock isn't about anything particular...) "White Lily" - Laurie Anderson "Blue Orchid" - White Stripes ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2008 11:35:11 +1100 From: Amanda Williams Subject: Re: songs about flowers [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED] A song that I believe is very ecto, even if the singer herself is as far away from Ecto that you can get, is "Where the Wild Roses Grow" by two very successful Aussie expats, Kylie Minogue, aka "The Singing Budgie" and Nick Cave (who I saw on Letterman recently with his new outfit, the Grindermen. I really don't think his new style becomes him, I have to say). But the song is incredibly haunting, and if you ever get a chance to look up the video, it's just amazing. Just like the song - haunting, evocative, moody, rich with dark promise and while the song lustrous orchestrations, the video is rich in colour . You can thank Nick for giving it that feel, of course. I think that and "Confide in me" are Kylie's best songs (though I have to admit I have a secret soft spot for "Better the Devil you Know" Amanda *** > Anyone have any other suggestions? Songs from both ecto and non- > ecto artists are welcome. "Night Scented Stock" - Kate Bush (does Kate's "Lily" count? It's not really about the flower, well, Night Scented Stock isn't about anything particular...) "White Lily" - Laurie Anderson "Blue Orchid" - White Stripes NOTICE This e-mail and any attachments are intended for the addressee(s) only and may be confidential. They may contain legally privileged or copyright material. You should not read, copy, use or disclose them without authorisation. If you are not the intended recipient please contact the sender as soon as possible by return e-mail and then please delete both messages. This notice should not be removed. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 19:57:01 -0500 From: "Robert Lovejoy" Subject: Re: Greatest Female Guitarists writeup I notice they included Carol Kaye, a bass player. So where was Aimee Mann? Bob Lovejoy, still thinking of even more female bassists... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 20:21:36 EST From: Marypt51@aol.com Subject: Re: Greatest Female Guitarists writeup In a message dated 3/4/08 11:46:46 PM, morayati@email.unc.edu writes: > I thought some of you might be interested in this - it's a direct > response to Rolling Stone's male-dominated 2003 "The 100 Greatest > Guitarists of All Time," featuring quite a few Ecto names, and writeups > on everyone listed. > > https://venuszine.com/articles/music/features/2575/The_Greatest_Female_Guitar > ists_of_All_Time > A questionable list. I'm seeing a lot of people impressed by famous names or by female singers who present an image of wanting people to view them as guitar heroes just because they accompany themselves on guitar. I can think of one whose entire guitar schtick is to turn up the effects really loud to make her guitar sound bigger without actually doing any difficult playing; her other trick is to play arpeggios or arpeggiated chords up and down the neck. Big deal. I'd agree with Carol Kaye, Jessie Mae Hemphill, and a couple of others, but not most of the women on the list simply accompany themselves by strumming or by simple arpeggios. Bonnie Raitt has done some lead guitar work, but I saw no mention of Ellen McIlwaine, who is a very talented slide guitarist. McIlwaine is a guitarist primarily, not a singer songwriter personality like the many women who are getting credit in this list for being great guitarists just because they held one on stage. So many female guitarists on such a list would not make a similar list for great male guitarists if they were men unless you count every person who ever strums a guitar as a great guitarist. If a zine wants to list women who were among the women who pioneered performing guitar live to accompany themselves but not particularly standout guitarists, many of the artists on this list would be more appropriate listed there or as "rhythm guitarists". There are tons of better female guitarists in the South than the women who made this list, but they aren't famous. ************** It's Tax Time! Get tips, forms, and advice on AOL Money & Finance. (http://money.aol.com/tax?NCID=aolprf00030000000001) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 21:36:08 -0600 From: Steve Schiavo Subject: Re: songs about flowers On Mar 6, 2008, at 9:10 AM, Becky Rizoli wrote: > Anyone have any other suggestions? Songs from both ecto and non- > ecto artists are welcome. The Return of the Giant Hogweed? Uh, I guess Humble Daisy by XTC would be better. - - Steve _______________ Interaction with cosmic intelligence may be influenced by Penrose noncomputable Platonic wisdom embedded in Planck scale geometry. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 06 Mar 2008 23:25:54 -0500 From: meredith Subject: Re: female guitarists Hi, Donald G. Keller wrote: > My problem with the "best female guitarists" list is that there seem to > be too many "greatest female artists who happen to play guitar": Agreed. Just because a woman can play a guitar doesn't mean she's automatically a genius on the instrument. But there are plenty of women who are truly great. The list of "best guitarists I've ever seen who just happen to be female" includes, in no particular order: Patty Larkin Kristin Hersh Erin McKeown Susan Werner Maura Kennedy Kaki King Pamela Means Ani DiFranco Chris Pureka Christine Lavin Vicki Genfan (underappreciated, totally indie instrumentalist in the vein of Michael Hedges -- she's on the first La Gitarra compilation, IIRC) ... and I'm sure I'll think of more the minute I hit "send" on this. (Who is the woman who was in Natalie Merchant's band for a while ... Jennifer Turner, maybe?? She was damned good, too.) Ani DiFranco has spawned a ton of annoying clones (who shall remain nameless), but she is to be commended for inspiring a whole generation of grrls to pick up the guitar and figure out how to do more with it than just the three-chord-strum. Some of them have even found their own voices, and it's been an interesting phenomenon to observe. - -- =============================================== Meredith Tarr New Haven, CT USA mailto:meth@smoe.org http://www.smoe.org/meth =============================================== hear at the HOMe House Concert Series http://hom.smoe.org =============================================== ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 06 Mar 2008 23:26:01 -0500 From: meredith Subject: Re: songs about flowers Hi, Becky Rizoli wrote: > Spring is in the air and I thought I'd make a mix of songs about gardens and flowers. So far I have: > > "Wildflower" and "Violet or Blue" by Rachael Sage ... and "Language of Flowers" and "Lotus Flower", from her first two albums, respectively. :) Others: * "Flower Days", Trina Hamlin * "Jacaranda", Trina Hamlin * "Blood Roses", Tori Amos (probably not really fitting the mood, though :}) * "Daisy Dead Petals", Tori Amos (again, probably not, but who knows :) * "Would If I Could", Happy Rhodes (taken from _A Midsummer Night's Dream_, the imagery fits) * "Garden Rose", Kris Delmhorst * "My Mother's Garden", Susan Werner - -- =============================================== Meredith Tarr New Haven, CT USA mailto:meth@smoe.org http://www.smoe.org/meth =============================================== hear at the HOMe House Concert Series http://hom.smoe.org =============================================== ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 06 Mar 2008 20:52:43 -0800 From: birdie Subject: Re: songs about flowers Book of Love's Flower Parade Chatterbox I Touch Roses Flower in my Hand ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 21:26:12 -0800 (PST) From: Alberto Subject: Re: songs about flowers If a hogweed counts as a flower, does that mean we have to consider "Lilywhite Lilith"? ... never mind... How about R.E.M.'s "Flowers of Guatemala"? Steve Schiavo wrote: On Mar 6, 2008, at 9:10 AM, Becky Rizoli wrote: > Anyone have any other suggestions? Songs from both ecto and non- > ecto artists are welcome. The Return of the Giant Hogweed? Uh, I guess Humble Daisy by XTC would be better. - - Steve _______________ Interaction with cosmic intelligence may be influenced by Penrose noncomputable Platonic wisdom embedded in Planck scale geometry. - --------------------------------- Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2008 01:17:18 -0500 From: Greg Dunn Subject: Re: female guitarists At 11:25 PM -0500 3/6/08, meredith wrote: >... and I'm sure I'll think of more the minute I hit "send" on this. >(Who is the woman who was in >Natalie Merchant's band for a while ... Jennifer Turner, maybe?? >She was damned good, too.) Yes! Brilliantly musical and very skilled. - -- - -- | Greg Dunn | "And I don't think it's my | | gregdunn@indy.net | fault... you never get what | | The Sultan of Slack(tm) | you want." | | http://www.indy.net/~gregdunn/ | Patty Griffin | ------------------------------ End of ecto-digest V13 #418 ***************************