From: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org (ecto-digest) To: ecto-digest@smoe.org Subject: ecto-digest V13 #82 Reply-To: ecto@smoe.org Sender: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk ecto-digest Wednesday, April 4 2007 Volume 13 : Number 082 To unsubscribe: e-mail ecto-digest-request@smoe.org and put the word unsubscribe in the message body. Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: Beware the eggcorn [kerrywhite@webtv.net (kerry white)] Today's your birthday, friend... [Mike Matthews ] Eleni Mandell [adamk@zoom.co.uk] Re: Beware the eggcorn [Bernie Mojzes ] EMI ditch DRM in iTunes ["Karen Hester" ] Re: Beware the eggcorn ["Paul Blair" ] Re: Beware the eggcorn [Steve VanDevender ] Re: Beware the eggcorn ["Paul Blair" ] Re: Beware the eggcorn [DanStark <2005.carnivore99@verizon.net>] Re: Beware the eggcorn [kerrywhite@webtv.net (kerry white)] Re: Beware the eggcorn ["Paul Blair" ] Re: Oh, also... [CollectedSounds ] Re: Beware the eggcorn [Ed Cole ] Re: Beware the eggcorn [birdie ] Re: Beware the eggcorn [Cheri Villines ] RE: Beware the eggcorn ["Michael Quinn" ] Re: Beware the eggcorn [kerrywhite@webtv.net (kerry white)] Re: Beware the eggcorn [Patrick Green ] Glory Eleni [Wretchawry ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 3 Apr 2007 00:56:22 -0500 From: kerrywhite@webtv.net (kerry white) Subject: Re: Beware the eggcorn Hi, if I had more energy I'd look up the name for the same thing when applied to song lyrics. (Don't tell me Enya does not say "Save a Whale" at least once in Orinoco Flow!) 8-) Bye, Kerry KrW I'm Peter Pan! I'm perpetually young!! OW!! What's wrong with my back? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Apr 2007 03:00:02 -0400 (EDT) From: Mike Matthews Subject: Today's your birthday, friend... i*i*i*i*i*i i*i*i*i*i*i *************** *****HAPPY********* **************BIRTHDAY********* *************************************************** *************************************************************************** ********************* Michael Pearce (mp@moonmac.com) ********************* *************************************************************************** -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Michael Pearce Wed April 03 1946 Pegasus Michael E. Bravo Mon April 05 1971 Dandelion Wine Brion McIntosh Sun April 06 1958 Aries Marcel Kshensky Thu April 06 1950 Aries Bill Mazur Mon April 06 1953 Aries Sun/Cancer Rising David Dixon Tue April 07 1970 Aries Heidi Heller Mon April 08 1974 Aries Jill Hughes Sat April 09 1955 Aries Klaus Kluge Sun April 10 1960 Unicorn Steve VanDevender Sun April 10 1966 Racer Art Liestman Fri April 10 1953 Repeat Stephen Golden Sat April 10 1971 Jokey Michael Bowman Wed April 11 1962 Aries Wolfgang Ullwer Fri April 11 1969 Widder Janet Kirsch Thu April 11 1974 Aries Kristen Scallion Fri April 12 1974 Aries Jerry Tue April 13 1971 Aries Stuart Myerburg Mon April 14 1969 Aries T-Bone Wed April 15 1992 happy cat Jeff Hanson Sat April 16 1966 Aries Michael Klouda Mon April 17 1967 Aries Noe Venable Tue April 20 1976 Aries Harry Foster Sat April 21 1956 NiceGuy Kjetil Torgrim Homme Thu April 23 1970 Taurus Jeff Burka Thu April 24 1969 GoFlyAKite Christine Waite Tue April 25 1972 Taurus Matt Adams Thu April 26 1962 Taurus Brad Hutchinson Tue April 28 1964 What sign? Geoff Parks Sun April 30 1961 Taurus Marty Lash Sat May 01 1948 Taurus Barney Parker Fri May 02 1986 happy cat Gray Abbott Tue May 03 1955 Suprised Tamar Boursalian Tue May 03 1966 Taurus - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Apr 2007 08:31:23 +0100 From: adamk@zoom.co.uk Subject: Eleni Mandell Yikes. The lambasting on the ecto site comes from me, a disgruntled customer. I'd heard her CD while sitting in the 12-Bar having coffee and, intrigued, asked the waitress who it was. The waitress told me that Eleni was performing the following week, so I bought a ticket right there. (That must say something about the music itself). I know I sounded unduly harsh about her performance that night, and was taken to task over it by a fellow Brit ecto who was also there and who now seems to have left the list. But everyone had assured me she was a brilliant performer, and I had my hopes up, but she really, really, was pretty bad. Two things in mitigation: an unnecessary level of chatter from the balcony that obviously distracted her, finally resulting in another audience member going up there and giving the culprits such a ticking off that they were seen to file out, hand in hand, shortly afterwards. And there was also the laryngitis. Sure, but -- as I originally said, it doesn't take much to fill the 12-Bar, which seats all of about 40 people, and she didn't just look ill, she looked genuinely peed off. A few weeks later I saw Thea Gilmore play the Scala (much, much bigger) with the flu, and absolutely fill the whole place with joy, despite the increasingly ragged edge to her voice (and produce one of the best gigs I've ever seen). I still haven't listened to the CD I bought that night, Snakebite, as much as I should, and I've heard excellent things about her new one that, combined with the passage of time and fading of memory, have made me think, "Hmmm, sounds interesting. Maybe I should try again". Let's just say I think the entry in the guide could use a little balance, and not just the ravings of a grumpy old man (that's me) from four years ago. adam k. - ----------------------------------------------- This mail sent through http://webmail.zoom.co.uk ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Apr 2007 11:54:49 -0400 (EDT) From: Bernie Mojzes Subject: Re: Beware the eggcorn There seems to be an annapolis, md eggcorn that drives me mad. "that away" As in: "send me your cell number, that away I can get aholt of you in an emergency." > I was in a discussion over the use of the phrase "free reign" as a > substitute for "free rein"; I discovered that the phrase is an > "eggcorn," "an idiosyncratic substitution of a word or phrase for a > word or words that sound similar or identical in the speaker's > dialect"--so named for the case of a woman who substituted the phrase > "egg corn" for the "acorn." > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eggcorn > > The list of eggcorns is entertaining. I particularly like: > > a nominal egg (an arm and a leg) > deformation of character (defamation of character) > doggy-dog world (dog-eat-dog world) > on the spurt [or sperm] of the moment (on the spur of the moment) > old timers (Alzheimer's) > nip it in the butt (nip it in the bud) > pier-to-pier network (peer-to-peer network) > reeking havoc or wrecking havok (wreaking havoc) > take it for granite (take it for granted) > > There is also a database (containing over 500 eggcorns) here: > > http://eggcorns.lascribe.net/ > - -- brni i don't want the world, i just want your half. www.livejournal.com/~brni ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Apr 2007 08:59:50 -0700 From: "Karen Hester" Subject: EMI ditch DRM in iTunes "EMI will make almost its entire catalogue available via Apple's iTunes Music Store in high-quality non-DRM format from next month." The "almost its entire catalogue" may refer to those Beatles guys :) Will cost more than standard iTunes songs if buying per track, cos they want you to buy entire albums (which cost the same as standard iTunes albums). http://news.com.com/EMI%2C+Apple+partner+on+DRM-free+premium+music/2100-1027_3-6172398.html http://publicaddress.net/default,4073.sm#post4073 (My fav NZ media/tech commentator) (Apologies if already posted, am on digest; I do like the implications of this) Karen ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Apr 2007 12:07:42 -0400 From: "Paul Blair" Subject: Re: Beware the eggcorn On 4/3/07, kerry white wrote: > Hi, if I had more energy I'd look up the name for the same thing when > applied to song lyrics. You're thinking of "mondegreen." An eggcorn is different from a mondegreen--with an eggcorn the wrong phrase is used to communicate the same meaning as the right phrase does. A mondegreen means something entirely different from what was intended. When the woman says "egg corn," she means the little nut that falls from a tree. On the other hand, when you hear Jimi Hendrix saying "kiss this guy," that's not what he meant (presumably). On 4/3/07, Bernie Mojzes wrote: > > There seems to be an annapolis, md eggcorn that drives me mad. > > "that away" > > As in: "send me your cell number, that away I can get aholt of you in an > emergency." The one I remember hearing a lot in Cincinnati when I was a kid was "wheel barrel." ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Apr 2007 09:34:33 -0700 From: Steve VanDevender Subject: Re: Beware the eggcorn Bernie Mojzes writes: > There seems to be an annapolis, md eggcorn that drives me mad. > > "that away" > > As in: "send me your cell number, that away I can get aholt of you in an > emergency." Well, that's also not reallg an eggcorn so much as an example of a common phonetic process where speakers tend to prefer consonant-vowel alternation and will sometimes insert a vowel between adjacent consonants. (I'm sure there's a specific linguistic term for this but I don't remember what it is.) > > I was in a discussion over the use of the phrase "free reign" as a > > substitute for "free rein"; I discovered that the phrase is an > > "eggcorn," "an idiosyncratic substitution of a word or phrase for a > > word or words that sound similar or identical in the speaker's > > dialect"--so named for the case of a woman who substituted the phrase > > "egg corn" for the "acorn." > > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eggcorn ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Apr 2007 12:43:59 -0400 (EDT) From: Bernie Mojzes Subject: Re: Beware the eggcorn it ain't phonetic when it's typed... :) > > Well, that's also not reallg an eggcorn so much as an example of a > common phonetic process where speakers tend to prefer consonant-vowel > alternation and will sometimes insert a vowel between adjacent > consonants. (I'm sure there's a specific linguistic term for this but I > don't remember what it is.) > > > > I was in a discussion over the use of the phrase "free reign" as a > > > substitute for "free rein"; I discovered that the phrase is an > > > "eggcorn," "an idiosyncratic substitution of a word or phrase for a > > > word or words that sound similar or identical in the speaker's > > > dialect"--so named for the case of a woman who substituted the phrase > > > "egg corn" for the "acorn." > > > > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eggcorn > - -- brni i don't want the world, i just want your half. www.livejournal.com/~brni ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Apr 2007 12:44:06 -0400 From: "Paul Blair" Subject: Re: Beware the eggcorn Looks like the difference between an eggcorn and a malapropism is pretty subtle. Wikipedia says an eggcorn is not a malapropism because "egg corn and acorn are homophonous in the dialect in question." But I thought a malapropism was supposed to sound like the phrase it's substituting for. Is the difference one between sounding similar and sounding exactly alike? Wikipedia also says this about a malapropism: ******** An instance of misspeech is called a malapropism when: * The word used means something different from the word... the speaker or writer intended to use. * The word used sounds similar to the word that was apparently meant or intended. Using "obtuse" (wide or dull) instead of "acute" (narrow or sharp) is not a malapropism; using "obtuse" (stupid or slow-witted) when one means "abstruse" (esoteric or difficult to understand) would be. * The word used has a _recognized meaning_ in the speaker's or writer's language. Simply making up a word, or adding a redundant or ungrammatical prefix ("irregardless" instead of "regardless") or suffix ("subliminible" instead of "subliminal") to an existing word, does not qualify as a malapropism. These characteristics set malapropisms apart from various other speaking or writing mistakes, such as an eggcorn or spoonerism. ******** Now "egg" and "corn" have a recognized meaning even if the combination doesn't, so I don't see how this is much different from, say, a malapropism like "What a terrible cat's after me!" (catastrophe) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 03 Apr 2007 13:07:56 -0400 From: DanStark <2005.carnivore99@verizon.net> Subject: Re: Beware the eggcorn I love how a couple of them have been used as song or album titles by some of the artists in my collection: - - tenderhooks instead of tenterhooks Holly Palmer - Tender Hooks album. Not technically incorrect since it's written out as two words which actually make sense in the way they're used. Still, I think it was intended to be a clever play on words, if only the source were a real word. - - chomp at the bit instead of champ at the bit Kristin Mainhart - Chompin' (at the Bit) from Stranger Things I'd have to give Kristin the benefit of the doubt, though. I've always heard that phrase said as "chomp at the bit", and it does seem to make sense in that form, doesn't it? My biggest pet peeve on the list is hearing "wallah!" instead of "voila!" And while it doesn't seem to fit the definition of an egg corn there's the misused phrase "could care less," which always makes me wonder if people even think about what they're saying. Dan ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Apr 2007 13:27:01 -0500 From: kerrywhite@webtv.net (kerry white) Subject: Re: Beware the eggcorn Hi, My memory-example for a malapropism is: Mrs Malaprop went up to a speaker she admired and said, "I thought your speech was just superfluous!" Bye, me KrW I'm Peter Pan! I'm perpetually young!! OW!! What's wrong with my back? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Apr 2007 14:41:41 -0400 From: "Paul Blair" Subject: Re: Beware the eggcorn I remember Mayor Berry of Cincinnati once having said that the city was "infinitessimally grateful" to somebody or other for something. On 4/3/07, kerry white wrote: > Hi, My memory-example for a malapropism is: Mrs Malaprop went up to a > speaker she admired and said, "I thought your speech was just > superfluous!" Bye, me > > KrW > I'm Peter Pan! > I'm perpetually young!! > OW!! What's wrong with my back? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Apr 2007 14:07:24 -0500 From: CollectedSounds Subject: Re: Oh, also... I have the new Jonatha. It's still growing on me, but I like it. I think I will like it more and more. I particularly like the first song, which is think is the title track. I'm happy to hear that Tracey Thorn has a new one. I have re-discovered my old copy of Edlewild (sp?) and I just love it. - -- Amy Collected Sounds www.blog.collectedsounds.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 03 Apr 2007 10:04:14 -0700 From: Ed Cole Subject: Re: Beware the eggcorn OED says: malapropism....... The ludicrous misuse of words, esp. in mistaking a word for another resembling it; an instance of this. No entry yet for eggcorn ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 03 Apr 2007 12:54:28 -0700 From: birdie Subject: Re: Beware the eggcorn I must say, this has all been an outnormous amount of fun! XXBirdie Ed Cole wrote: > OED says: > > malapropism....... > > The ludicrous misuse of words, esp. in mistaking a word for another > resembling it; an instance of this. > > No entry yet for eggcorn ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 03 Apr 2007 13:40:16 -0600 From: Cheri Villines Subject: Re: Beware the eggcorn Wow, that sounds just like my family! They are all northern Arkansasans, some ways from Annapolis, MD. The hill folk are spreading out! :) Cheri - ----- Original Message ----- From: Bernie Mojzes Date: Tuesday, April 3, 2007 10:11 am Subject: Re: Beware the eggcorn To: Paul Blair Cc: ecto@smoe.org > There seems to be an annapolis, md eggcorn that drives me mad. > > "that away" > > As in: "send me your cell number, that away I can get aholt of you > in an > emergency." ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Apr 2007 16:38:50 -0400 From: "Michael Quinn" Subject: RE: Beware the eggcorn I've never heard of an "egg corn" but some of those listed like "deformation of character" are classic malapropisms so I guess the words are interchangeable to a certain extent. "Free rei(g)n" is an interesting one because, not only are they homonyms but the meanings of rein and reign in this sense are so close that either could conceivably be used to get the correct meaning of the phrase. Actually before this was posted I probably would have thought "free reign" was correct so I guess I learned something. A bit more word trivia that ties weirdly in to the DRM discussion. The longest (English) word with no repeating letters is "uncopyrightable" [I feel there's a message in there for the RIAA somewhere :) Mike - -----Original Message----- From: owner-ecto@smoe.org [mailto:owner-ecto@smoe.org] On Behalf Of Ed Cole Sent: April 3, 2007 1:04 PM To: ecto@smoe.org Subject: Re: Beware the eggcorn OED says: malapropism....... The ludicrous misuse of words, esp. in mistaking a word for another resembling it; an instance of this. No entry yet for eggcorn ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 3 Apr 2007 15:45:35 -0500 From: kerrywhite@webtv.net (kerry white) Subject: Re: Beware the eggcorn Hi, If Annapolis was farther west I'd say it was a hold over from 'they went thataway', a la Gary Cooper. As a kid I went to Baltimore from central NY and heard: "Ha kum yu tawk so funi?" Now, I visit and more and more people sound like TV announcers: ie, with bland regionless sameness. bah, me. KrW I'm Peter Pan! I'm perpetually young!! OW!! What's wrong with my back? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 03 Apr 2007 15:41:21 -0500 From: Patrick Green Subject: Re: Beware the eggcorn Yep, I've found it all pretty mindbowling. On 4/3/07 2:54 PM, "birdie" wrote: > I must say, this has all been an outnormous amount of fun! > > XXBirdie > > Ed Cole wrote: > >> OED says: >> >> malapropism....... >> >> The ludicrous misuse of words, esp. in mistaking a word for another >> resembling it; an instance of this. >> >> No entry yet for eggcorn [ALERT] -- Access Manager: This email is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain information that is privileged, confidential or otherwise protected from disclosure. Dissemination, distribution or copying of this e-mail or the information herein by anyone other than the intended recipient, or an employee or agent responsible for delivering the message to the intended recipient, is prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error, please immediately notify us by calling our North American Help Desk at (972)506-3939. Targetbase Messaging Services provided by DMSP ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 04 Apr 2007 01:49:07 -0500 From: Wretchawry Subject: Glory Eleni As far as I know Happy's never mentioned the sigh in "Glory." I've always loved that ending. Eleni Mandell is a goddess. V (don't write me here) ------------------------------ End of ecto-digest V13 #82 **************************