From: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org (ecto-digest) To: ecto-digest@smoe.org Subject: ecto-digest V9 #144 Reply-To: ecto@smoe.org Sender: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk ecto-digest Saturday, May 24 2003 Volume 09 : Number 144 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Today's your birthday, friend... [Mike Matthews ] Matrix and the LAST BUFFY (spoilers) [irvin lin ] Re: New Kinnie Starr [Greg Bossert ] Re: Nerina, Leona, Emiliana ["Mike Gray" ] Recent changes to the Ectophiles' Guide ["The Ectophiles' Guide" ] Re: Nerina [AzeemAK@aol.com] Re: Matrix and the LAST BUFFY (spoilers) [FAMarcus@aol.com] Re: Matrix and the LAST BUFFY (spoilers) [meredith ] White River Folk Festival ["jessica weiser" ] Re: Nerina, Leona, Emiliana, oh my. ["jessica weiser" ] Matrix [Xenus Sister ] Re: Matrix and the LAST BUFFY (spoilers) ["Xenu's Sister" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 03:00:05 -0400 (EDT) From: Mike Matthews Subject: Today's your birthday, friend... i*i*i*i*i*i i*i*i*i*i*i *************** *****HAPPY********* **************BIRTHDAY********* *************************************************** *************************************************************************** ********************* Jewel Kilcher (JewelJK@aol.com) ********************* *************************************************************************** -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Jewel Kilcher Thu May 23 1974 The Gem Chandra Sriram Thu May 27 1971 Gemini Taina Sahlander Mon May 28 1973 Gemini Urs Stafford Thu May 31 1973 Give Way Perttu Yli-Krekola Thu June 02 1966 Kaksoset Alex Gibbs Thu June 08 1967 Betelgeuse Gleb Zverev Tue June 09 1964 Gemini Sonja Juchniewich Mon June 10 1963 Pegasus Joerg Plate Mon June 12 1967 Gemini Chris Montville Tue June 13 1978 Gemini Ectoplasm (original name) Mailing List Thu June 13 1991 Fuzzier blue Paul Huesman Wed June 14 1967 coffee drinker Mark R. Susskind Wed June 15 1966 Gemini Dave Upham Sun June 15 1958 Gemini Mike Matthews Mon June 16 1969 Pr. SAFH Albert Philipsen Mon June 17 1968 Gemini Neal R. Copperman Thu June 17 1965 Gemini Susan Kay Anderson Tue June 17 1969 Gemini Ecto-The Mailing List Tue June 18 1991 Fuzzy blue Tracy Barber Mon June 18 1956 Gemini Greg Dunn Thu June 18 1953 + Paul Blair Thu June 18 1964 Objectivist Mike Connell Sat June 18 1955 Apollo David Lubkin Fri June 20 1958 OurLady Marisa Wood Fri June 20 1969 Gemini Cheri Villines Sun June 20 1965 Gemini-Leo rising Ray Misra Sat June 20 1970 Gemini Nik Popa Sun June 22 1969 Cancer Teresa VanDyne Thu June 23 1960 Cancer - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 01:58:34 -0700 From: irvin lin Subject: Matrix and the LAST BUFFY (spoilers) Thanks VICKIE for you insight on the MATRIX RELOADED. But the fact is I still staunchly stand by what is said. Lots of fight scenes, not enough plot. Video game action scenes (entertaining, but not very deep) and a really boring dance/sex scene that lasted way too long. I would have preferred half the fight scenes cut out, and the entire movie to be shown in it's entirety (MATRIX RELOADED/REVOLUTIONS). And yes, I noticed most of what you mentioned. I immediately picked up on AGENT SMITH being inside ZION, which meant that ZION and "the real world" was just another program, and the MATRIX was a subprogram inside of it - something that actually bugged me. The whole "dream within a dream" or reality within a reality I find entirely contrived. Maybe I've read it or seen it too many times, but it just wasn't done well enough for me to enjoy it this time round. I do withhold completely judgement because I know this is only half of the movie, and a lot more will unfold in MATRIX REVOLUTION, I just expected and wanted this movie to stand more on it's own - even though I KNOW walking into it wasn't going it. I just wanted it to less a transitional movie - a TWO TOWERS sort of movie. And that's what I felt like I got. A movie to bring the first one together with the last one. I WASN'T sure if THE ORACLE really was the person that helped program the matrix as well. (when NEO says it was her to the ARCHITECT, I didn't catch the reply. I THOUGHT the ARCHITECT said "oh please." in a sarcastic tone, but my friends who I saw it with didn't hear that. Can anyone clarify as to what his response was? I actually missed a lot of that exchange because of twelve year old kids behind me complaining that they were talking and not fighting....grrrr) I wonder if THE ORACLE will be back, especially since GLORIA FOSTER (the actress) passed away before principal shooting finished. I will say that I did thoroughly enjoy the actual literal interpretations in the movie. I enjoyed "the backdoors" and THE KEYMAKER. I think that PERSEPHONE will most likely play a much bigger role in the next movie (just by sheer fact that she got her own poster). I think that the idea of her being a former TRINITY an interesting one, but again it's something that will be worked with more in the REVOLUTIONS if it is brought up at all. I found MEROVINGIAN annoying, and I have no real interest in his character, even if he is a former ONE. I enjoyed the TWINS like I enjoyed AGENT SMITH, because they are interesting adversaries, but I hate the way the "rules" shift all over to fit the plotline. I mean, if those TWINS really had the power to become incorporeal and fly into the car to get THE KEYMAKER, why didn't they do that in the first place, and why the ELABORATE car chase/fight scene? If NEO had the power to "jump" into an agent and make them explode (like the end of the first MATRIX), why didn't he do that in the first fight scene against the agents? Perhaps this could be explained away by his offhanded comment "hmm. Upgrades" but that seems rather weak to me. And yeah, my friend mentioned that maybe he didn't want to mutate any of the other AGENTS into what AGENT SMITH became, but he didn't meet AGENT SMITH until after that first encounter. Basically I repeat what my original email said. RELOADED was disappointing (to me), but I do look forward to REVOLUTIONS. As long as they don't throw in any cute cuddly EWOKS, I think the third movie has a chance of being great. And strangely, the music didn't bother me it he least. I didn't even notice it (and I downloaded the soundtrack beforehand just to get myself familiar with it). As for BUFFY's last episode, I think it was actually a decent SERIES finale. COMPLETE closure for the end of SUNNYDALE. That was nice. I probably would have preferred SEASON FIVE's finale to have ended the show (with maybe ONCE MORE WITH FEELING done as a "reunion special") but oh well. I pretty much hated season six and seven (the themes were great, and I had no problems with the darkness that everyone complained about, but the writing was just horrible. Any level of supernatural metaphor or analogies that made me love BUFFY in the beginning were just lost in the stupid clumsy execution. The direction and the acting was muddled, and basically I lost all interest in BUFFY, DAWN, SPIKE, and XANDER characters. I wasn9t even upset that TARA died, they did such a bad job with that story arc. ANYA was great though, and I adored ANDREW - he got all the funny lines that XANDER would have/should have had.) All in all, I thought the ending of the show was a good way to complete a rather lousy season (not as lousy as season six though). JOSS' writing wasn't as top notch as I thought it would be, but I loved the allusions to the first season and the original core four cast members walking down the hallway. It made me pine away for the first three seasons, and I immediately cracked out SEASON ONE ep1 DVD so I can start watching all the seasons again. The LOTR references was a little heavy (WILLOW THE WHITE? Whatever). BUT as much as I have said over and over again about how much I so didn't like season six and seven, I will miss BUFFY. Even if they bring her over for some guest shots on ANGEL, it just won't be the same. And I was quite sadden (even though I knew it was coming) to see ANYA die. The ending doesn't QUITE jive with FRAY (the comic book that JOSS wrote) but whatever. It brings back the ideas of girl empowerment that JOSS always said the show was about, so at least it came full circle in that respect. But jeez, talk about too much exposition and too much hitting you over the head. EVERYONE totally had to EXPLAIN EXACTLY what was going on. Hello. The viewers of BUFFY aren't stupid. irvin ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 11:33:22 +0200 From: Greg Bossert Subject: Re: New Kinnie Starr On Friday, May 23, 2003, at 06:41 Europe/Berlin, Andrew Fries wrote: > On Fri, 2003-05-23 at 14:09, William Mazur wrote: >> Speaking of Eliza, it reminds me that I am surprised that you or any >> of >> the other BtVS fans here haven't posted their thoughts on the last >> Buffy >> episode. > Give us some time ... I couldn't talk about ending of Buffy yet because > I'm still in denial - it cannot be over! and i am still in Berlin - so i haven't seen it! (nor the second to last episode...) please please please label any spoilers! danke. - -g - -- "i've never been afraid to change the circumstances of the world" - -- Happy Rhodes - -- "except for bunnies..." - -- Anya ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 11:03:09 +0100 From: "Mike Gray" Subject: Re: Nerina, Leona, Emiliana > Anyway, from what I heard, POLYDOR actually pulled the NERINA's album to > re-issue it with a few new tracks (I think one song "photograph" was suppose It was just the one new track, Photograph. I interviewed her back in October / November of 2002 and she had had complete creative control over the album and was very happy with it, and then wrote "photograph" which Polydor loved and wanted on the album. Nerina didn't. For what it's worth, I was never keen on the track myself - it reminded me a great deal of "Daydream Believer" and during the Adams support slots, people in the crowd would regularly sing Daydream Believer along with it. As this is all water under the bridge, I guess I can say what happened... I talked to her at the Manchester gig of the Bryan Adams show and she knew that Dear Frustrated Superstar had been pulled and that it was to be re-issued with Photograph as a bonus track, with the removal of one other track (which was suspect to be Watch Out Billie). Work began on getting the studio version of Photograph finished for a single release. The problem was that the record company had it remixed and wanted to take a very specific, dance-oriented direction which was extremely misleading as to her other output. She heard the mixes and thought they were awful. As a result, she posted a message to a UK industry message board (www.tipsheet.co.uk) with the subject line "Has my A&R man gone mad?" - anonymously, mind you. However, someone on the board figure out it was Nerina. I believe relations with Polydor never really recovered. She posted on 21/6 to her Yahoogroup: "Basically, ( and read into this what you will, I have to be very careful), my lovely record label decided not to re-issue the album and release Photograph as a single, or If I Know You for that matter (even though it's already videoed!!), and instead we are moving on to the second album. So, a bummer in one way, but given the incredibly unstable nature of the music business, a bonus to be making another record. I apologise for the delay in telling you all this, but at first I just felt really really low for a little while, and also, it involved contractual re-negotiations blah-de-blah-de-blah. Now that the paperwork is done, I can tell you all without feeling any chickens have yet to hatch. (I like to see them flying in full formation before I ever state anything!) Realistically, this new album will not see the light of day before the New Year...however....." Obviously this never happened and the Yahoogroup hasn't heard from her since 16/8/02. A friend bumped into her backstage at the Aimee Mann gig in London a while back but she didn't really have much to say. Cheers, Mike ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 04:16:12 -0700 From: "The Ectophiles' Guide" Subject: Recent changes to the Ectophiles' Guide Latest changes to the Ectophiles' Guide 22 May 2003 New Guide entries added for: * Kathleen Edwards * Lousia John-Krol * Norah Jones (by request) Changes made to the entries for: * Lori Amey (new album) * Ian Anderson (new album) * Arson Garden (additional comments) * Everything But The Girl (new album) * Susan James (additional comments) * October Project (new ep) - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- You are receiving this email because you have asked to be notified of updates to the Ectophiles' Guide to Good Music at http://www.smoe.org/ectoguide/. If you are no longer interested in receiving these notifications, please unsubscribe yourself using the form at http://www.smoe.org/ectoguide/guide.cgi?newsubscribe&action=unsubscribe ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 08:23:19 -0400 From: Runly Subject: Re: The Matrix Reloaded I thought the sweaty sex thang was fabulous! :) sharon ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 09:14:16 EDT From: AzeemAK@aol.com Subject: Re: Nerina That is a sad and frustrating story, Mike. It must be maddening for her, someone who is really talented and musical, and (seemingly) in it for the music. It's also, on the face of it, hard to explain why her album didn't take off: great, catchy, substantial songs, well-produced, intelligent lyrics, a truly distinctive voice. What's not to like?? And let's not overlook that she's heart-stoppingly beautiful too! Nerina was one of the early familiar faces at the Kashmir Klub (now sadly closed down), and it was obvious from the start that she was special. She came back to do a few dates when her album was being launched, and as her band included some of Sheryl Crow's band, one evening Ms Crow herself turned up to watch! She was only one person away from me, which was quite exciting. Unfortunately I didn't turn up the follwing Saturday, when Sheryl played there herself :-( I'll be watching Nerina's progress with great interest. Azeem in London NP: England v Zimbabwe (cricket, that is) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 13:54:58 EDT From: FAMarcus@aol.com Subject: Re: Matrix and the LAST BUFFY (spoilers) In a message dated 5/23/03 5:12:50 AM Eastern Daylight Time, iflin@speakeasy.net writes: > I WASN'T sure if THE ORACLE really was the person that helped program the > matrix as well. (when NEO says it was her to the ARCHITECT, I didn't catch > the reply. I THOUGHT the ARCHITECT said "oh please." yes .........i heard the same thing and the most of the people i've spoken to didn't remember it the way i did. fred ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 18:19:30 -0400 From: meredith Subject: Re: Matrix and the LAST BUFFY (spoilers) Hi, > > I WASN'T sure if THE ORACLE really was the person that helped program the > > matrix as well. (when NEO says it was her to the ARCHITECT, I didn't catch > > the reply. I THOUGHT the ARCHITECT said "oh please." > >yes .........i heard the same thing and the most of the people i've spoken to >didn't remember it the way i did. FWIW, the transcript I've seen online (was it posted here? I can't remember) does have the Architect saying "Oh please" at that point. (I can't vouch for the accuracy of the transcript, though. I haven't seen the movie, and don't plan to. _The Matrix_ represents two hours of my life that I'll never get back, and I'm not making that mistake again.) =============================================== Meredith Tarr New Haven, CT USA mailto:meth@smoe.org http://www.smoe.org/meth =============================================== Live At The House O'Muzak House Concert Series http://muzak.smoe.org =============================================== ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 21:06:43 -0500 From: "jessica weiser" Subject: White River Folk Festival Hi all, I took a hiatus from Ecto for a year or so but am definitely in need of new music right now :) I have missed the list! I actually wanted to post about a Folk Festival that I have been invited to play at this year. It's the White River Folk Festival in Fishers, IN and the line-up seems pretty cool. I don't know if anyone here is in the Indianapolis area, but you can get tickets on their website: http://www.whiteriverfolkfestival.org -- I'll be playing on Sunday, and they haven't sent me the exact time but have mentioned that I'll be playing early in the day. There are national and local acts playing and it seems like it will be a really cool few days of music... and there aren't many festivals like this in Indiana ;) jessica - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- jessica weiser :: new album AFTER SILENCE available now! touring in 2003! dates at: www.jessicaweiser.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 21:09:58 -0500 From: "jessica weiser" Subject: Re: Nerina, Leona, Emiliana, oh my. irvin lin writes: >but then again I thought LEONA NAESS should have had a hit with her last album I TRIED TO ROCK BUT >YOU ONLY ROLL, but alas it went nowhere. I believe she is currently ready to release an new EP, though not >necessarily on her same label. I thought Leona's first album was pretty amazing but couldn't get into the new one at all. She does indeed have something new coming out... a friend of mine in NY actually has it (I can't say why yet ;) ) but apparently it's REALLY good... I don't know if Leona is on MCA any longer. Her .com website now forwards to a .org site which looks like it is run by a fan.... not much news there. I'll try to get some more news out of my friend. I know that she is going to be doing shows in NY and LA very soon, though. jessica - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- jessica weiser :: singer/songwriter touring in 2003! dates at: www.jessicaweiser.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 21:15:17 -0500 From: "jessica weiser" Subject: Michelle Branch's new album I'm going to see her in Chicago for the first time next week and couldn't be more excited. Heh. My friend is singing bg vocals for her on tour so I'm going to hang out with them and I'm looking forward to it! Anyway, Michelle's new album will be out on 6/24 and despite the very pop/rock sound of her new single, the album is actually MUCH more folky and stripped-down and more mature. I have heard several of the songs and they blew me away, and I'm normally pretty picky. Most of her last album was written when she was very young (14, 15) and she's almost 20 now so I notice quite a bit of growth and depth in her music. Anyway, here is the tracklist... there are some very beautiful songs on the record, so I recommend checking it out if you're interested.... Hotel Paper (out 6/24) 1. Intro 2. Are you Happy Now? 3. Find my way back 4. Empty Handed 6. One of These Days (gorgeous song!) 7. Love me Like That (featuring Sheryl Crow) 8. Desperately (featuring Jessica Harp) 9. Breathe 10. Where are You Now? 11. Hotel Paper 12. Til I Get Over You 13. It's You plus a hidden track :) jessica - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- - --- jessica weiser :: new album AFTER SILENCE out now! touring in 2003! dates at: www.jessicaweiser.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 21:22:30 +0100 From: Xenus Sister Subject: Matrix I appreciate your thoughts too irvin. We just had different experiences in the theater. You said: >I WASN'T sure if THE ORACLE really was the person that helped program the >matrix as well. (when NEO says it was her to the ARCHITECT, I didn't catch >the reply. I THOUGHT the ARCHITECT said "oh please." in a sarcastic tone, >but my friends who I saw it with didn't hear that. Can anyone clarify as to >what his response was? You're right. Here's the relevant bit: =========== "The first Matrix I designed was quite naturally perfect. It was a work of art. Flawless. Sublime. A triumph equaled only by its monumental failure. The inevitability of its doom as apparent to me now is a consequence of the imperfection inherent in every human being. Thus I redesigned it... based on your history. To more accurately reflect the varying grotesqueries of your nature. However I was again frustrated by failure. I've since come to understand the answer alluded me because it required a lesser mind or perhaps a mind less bound by the parameters of perfection. Thus the answer was stumbled upon by another... an intuitive program. Initially created to investigate certain aspects of the human psyche. If I am the father of the Matrix... she would undoubtedly be its mother." "The Oracle." "Please. As I was saying she stumbled upon a solution whereby 99 percent of all test subjects accepted the program as long as they were given a choice. Even if they were only aware of the choice at a near unconscious level. While this answer functioned, it was obviously fundamentally flawed, thus creating the otherwise contradictory... systemic anomaly... That if left unchecked might threaten the system itself. Ergo, those that refuse the program, while a minority, if unchecked would constitute an escalating probability of disaster." =========== The whole conversation can be found here: http://www.hometheaterforum.com/htforum/showthread.php?postid=1548356#post1548356 I'm not taking part in their thread, but it's been fun to read (though I'm already a week behind!) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 22:11:06 +0100 From: "Xenu's Sister" Subject: Re: Matrix and the LAST BUFFY (spoilers) At 06:19 PM 5/23/2003 -0400, meth wrote: >_The Matrix_ represents two hours of my life that I'll never get back, and >I'm not making that mistake again.) Oh well, at least we can agree on Happy and Lord of the Rings :-) V ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 22:47:29 -0700 From: Birdie Subject: Buffy - Script books I thought I'd give those of you interested a heads up on this....... ~~ Buffy the Vampire Slayer: The Script Book, Season One, Vol. 2 Our Price: $14.00 Discounted Price: $11.90 You Save: $2.10 http://www.writersstore.com/?e=873 AOL Link ~~ Buffy the Vampire Slayer: The Script Book, Season Two, Vol. 1 Our Price: $14.00 Discounted Price: $11.90 You Save: $2.10 http://www.writersstore.com/?e=874 AOL Link ~~ Buffy the Vampire Slayer: The Script Book, Season Two, Vol. 2 Our Price: $14.00 Discounted Price: $11.90 You Save: $2.10 http://www.writersstore.com/?e=875 AOL Link ------------------------------ End of ecto-digest V9 #144 **************************