From: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org (ecto-digest) To: ecto-digest@smoe.org Subject: ecto-digest V8 #87 Reply-To: ecto@smoe.org Sender: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk ecto-digest Thursday, March 28 2002 Volume 08 : Number 087 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: Lamb as corporate sell-outs? [Neal Copperman ] Re: Lamb as corporate sell-outs? [Neal Copperman ] indie labels: what's a typical record contract these days? ["Vienna Teng"] Today's your birthday, friend... [Mike Matthews ] Re: Never like this in MY day !!!! [Dan Riley ] RE: indie labels: what's a typical record contract these days? [Phil Huds] Re: indie labels: what's a typical record contract these days? [Jeffrey B] Re: indie labels: what's a typical record contract these days? ["Michael ] Highlights from the impromptu EctoFestSouth (very south) / An Awesome Aussie show upcoming in Northhampton MA 4/11 [] Re: Highlights from the impromptu EctoFestSouth (very south) / An Awesome Aussie show upcoming in Northhampton MA 4/11 [] Voices on the Verge [Nadyne Mielke ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 23:19:34 -0700 From: Neal Copperman Subject: Re: Lamb as corporate sell-outs? At 12:48 PM -0500 3/26/02, badly drawn woj wrote: >when we last left our heroes, Jeffrey C. Burka exclaimed: > >>Finally it occurs to me to hit reverse scan on the cd player and >>sure enough, in the song "Small", around 1:48, is the ring tone. >>Given the quality of their production, it's hard to see this as a >>mistake, but I haven't been able to make it make sense with the >>lyrics of the song. > >the motorola pager beep is rather nicely incorporated into the bonus >track on eels' _daisies of the galaxy_ album. it's right at the >beginning and right at the end. first time i heard it, i was using >meredith's pager as an alarm clock, so you can imagine it was a bit >of a shock. We've had several house concerts where the phone rang during the show. (We are better at unplugging it now.) Since I record the shows, the ringing phone is clearly evident on the CD's. Almost every time I listen to one, when I hear the phone ring I leap up to get it. Recently, I was listening to a recording and heard the phone ring. Instead of my usual reaction, I realized I was listening to a house concert and figured the ringing was on the recording. This time it was actually my phone though! I guess there is no winning. neal ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 23:17:21 -0700 From: Neal Copperman Subject: Re: Lamb as corporate sell-outs? At 1:41 PM -0500 3/26/02, Jeffrey C. Burka wrote: >woj sez: > >>the motorola pager beep is rather nicely incorporated into the >>bonus track on eels' _daisies of the galaxy_ album. > >and there's a digital watch's alarm beeping somewhere toward the end >of "Painters" on Jewel's _Pieces of You_. Keep in mind that much of Pieces of You was recorded live at the Innerchange Coffeehouse. So that's probably where the watch alarm comes from. neal np: My Songs And A Poem - Estrella Morente ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 23:58:21 -0800 From: "Vienna Teng" Subject: indie labels: what's a typical record contract these days? Greetings all - I'll get right down to the point here: I'm being offered my first record contract (yay!), and I'm doing some research on what the "industry standard" is now for independent record labels. Can anyone give me a rough idea of typical advance amounts, term lengths for exclusive licensing, that kind of thing? Or point me to people I might ask about such matters? And while I'm here: much, much gratitude to all of you who've posted regarding my music! I've kept quiet on the subject myself, in hopes that people will feel more inclined to speak freely about it if they have an opinion. I do read 'em, but I won't be offended or hurt by anything, promise. :^) Thanks, Vienna ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2002 03:00:01 -0500 (EST) From: Mike Matthews Subject: Today's your birthday, friend... i*i*i*i*i*i i*i*i*i*i*i *************** *****HAPPY********* **************BIRTHDAY********* *************************************************** *************************************************************************** ********************** Tom Proven (Horter3@aol.com) *********************** *************************************************************************** -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Tom Proven Sat March 27 1971 Eat at Joe's Jennifer Albert Wed March 30 1966 Aries (w/Cancer rising!:) Warpaint Mon April 01 1991 Brilliant! Michael Pearce Wed April 03 1946 Pegasus Michael E. Bravo Mon April 05 1971 Dandelion Wine Brion McIntosh Sun April 06 1958 Aries Marcel Kshensky Thu April 06 1950 Aries Bill Mazur Mon April 06 1953 Aries Sun/Cancer Rising David Dixon Tue April 07 1970 Aries Heidi Heller Mon April 08 1974 Aries Jill Hughes Sat April 09 1955 Aries Klaus Kluge Sun April 10 1960 Unicorn Steve VanDevender Sun April 10 1966 Racer Art Liestman Fri April 10 1953 Repeat Stephen Golden Sat April 10 1971 Jokey Michael Bowman Wed April 11 1962 Aries Wolfgang Ullwer Fri April 11 1969 Widder Janet Kirsch Thu April 11 1974 Aries Jerry Tue April 13 1971 Aries Stuart Myerburg Mon April 14 1969 Aries T-Bone Wed April 15 1992 happy cat Jeff Hanson Sat April 16 1966 Aries Michael Klouda Mon April 17 1967 Aries Harry Foster Sat April 21 1956 NiceGuy Kjetil Torgrim Homme Thu April 23 1970 Taurus Jeff Burka Thu April 24 1969 GoFlyAKite Christine Waite Tue April 25 1972 Taurus Matt Adams Thu April 26 1962 Taurus - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- ------------------------------ Date: 27 Mar 2002 07:22:20 -0500 From: Dan Riley Subject: Re: Never like this in MY day !!!! Greg footahed: > In addition, this whole nokia ring tone craze (which is definitely > crazed in europe these days) is an encouraging example of DIY music. > or maybe i mean a hideous scourge. or both, which would make it rock > and roll ;) Already being coopted by the acacdemy -- see "Dialtones: a Telesymphony", "a concert performed entirely through the ringing of the audience's mobile phones", http://www.flong.com/telesymphony/ - -dan ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2002 09:13:27 -0800 From: Phil Hudson Subject: RE: indie labels: what's a typical record contract these days? Hey Vienna, great news on your contract offer. Congratulations and much good luck with your career. Now, when's the next album ? :) Regards Phil ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2002 12:22:10 -0500 From: Jeffrey Burka Subject: Re: indie labels: what's a typical record contract these days? Phil sez: > Hey Vienna, great news on your contract offer. Congratulations and much good > luck with your career. > > Now, when's the next album ? :) Yeah! What he said! _Waking Hour_ is one of my *very* favorite albums from last year, and the boyfriend and parents love it too. Best wishes and good luck! jeff n.p. strangely enough, I was on track 10 of _Waking Hour_ when this e-mail came in... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2002 09:33:04 -0800 From: "Michael P. Schneider" Subject: Re: indie labels: what's a typical record contract these days? [this is posted to ecto and sent directly to Vienna....I feel strongly about it =) ] At 11:58 PM 3/26/2002 -0800, you wrote: >Greetings all - > >I'll get right down to the point here: I'm being offered my first record >contract (yay!), and I'm doing some research on what the "industry standard" >is now for independent record labels. Can anyone give me a rough idea of >typical advance amounts, term lengths for exclusive licensing, that kind of >thing? Or point me to people I might ask about such matters? I have had numerous friends that have told me about contract experience with record companies. The number one thing that they say is to _always_ get a good contract attorney who will explain what each of the terms of the contract mean and to read the fine print very very carefully. From personal experience I would advise you to get TWO attorneys and checkup on both of them and compare their descriptions. I would do it as a double blind test ( neither knows of the other ). The initial expense can be pretty high but you may save yourself from getting royally screwed. Be sure about who owns what ( i.e. do you own your music or do they ), how long it will be owned if they own it and what are the costs associated with transferring ownership (i.e. do you own masters or do they, how much will it cost to get them back, after a certain period will the masters default to you or them permanently if they are not re-purchased by you within a specified time ), what are the terms of distribution/marketing/etc., What burdens will you have to bear ( such as repaying their marketing costs, distribution, concert/tour costs, etc. ), What are the responsibilities that they will have for your music (i.e. are they committing in writing to provide x dollars towards marketing of your music -or- sending out x copies to their distributors, will you have to pay for those copies which don't sell?, who is handling the money? ) A second thing is to make sure that you have legal recourse should they mismanage your contract AND that some mention of what your legal recourse IS, is present in the contract itself otherwise you may be stuck with only the terms in the contract ( such as binding legal arbitration of their choosing ). Most artists are placed into the position of watching their ( possibly ) life's work sit in escrow for the next 40 years and they can do nothing about it while the record company goes through "restructuring" or gets sold or whatever. Don't let it happen to you. A third thing is that you should assume that you could get screwed beyond your wildest dreams and be in debt for the next 100 years. So be careful careful careful about knowing what your liabilities are and whether or not being on a label will support your long term goals should the label up and disappear on you -or- just plain fuck up and mismanage your music. The last thing is that you should not be afraid to push for what you want. The entire thing is a business, if they want your music then YOU have the final say on how they get it and the terms. Don't ever sign something they just hand in front of you ( especially a "pre-agreement" not to shop around your music as that could screw you over to begin with ). In other areas of the business world there is an adage that applies here as well, ALWAYS change at least one thing in the agreement in your favor. If they are not willing to accept even a single change then that definitly will set the tone for what will happen when things start to go bad and can show that they will rigidly use the definition of the contract which means that YOU will need to know exactly what your liabilities are for each and every term of the contract and what gray area exists that they could pull shit on you. I do _NOT_ have my tongue in cheek. I wish you the absolute best of luck in dealing with this situation. I hope it turns out beautiful for you and you can continue to make your music available for people. Michael P. Schneider - ----------------------------------------------------------- Michael P. Schneider Software Engineering michael@cybermagician.com Web Design http://www.cybermagician.com Training Web Tools ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2002 23:16:23 -0500 From: Jason Gordon Subject: Highlights from the impromptu EctoFestSouth (very south) / An Awesome Aussie show upcoming in Northhampton MA 4/11 I am back in the states and badly jetlagged after a few weeks in australia :) The impromptu EctoFestSydney was wonderful :) Three people [the two sydneyphiles and myself], three bands :) [Lino, Gorgeous and someother band I cannot remember]. Anyhow, gorgeous were fantastic as well as Lino (which Andrew gave the award for band that sounded least live like as on thier album). I managed to catch 6 concerts (4 in five nights :) ) while there...The EctoFestSydney show, Wendy Rule in Melbourne (she absolutely rocked...the cello accompaniament was fantastic...she did a version of Slow Down that was mind blowing- sort of like she was channelling ella fitzgerald and played Chariot at my request, and for her not having played it for two years or so was incredible), Kasey Chambers at a very packed last show of the year, Robyne Dunn (who is quite a good jazz singer), Women in Docs, and Patty Larkin for good measure with Sherlyn as well :) I have piles and piles of cd's to go through :) Immediate things worth checking out is the debut album by George which is utterly fantastic! The Killjoys "Sun Bright Deep" is a must listen for any fan of the Sundays. Oh, the important Aussie show coming up...In reading through one fo the music mags in Sydney I stumbled across Women in Docs (www.womenindocs.com) and got to see them do a short set and they are quite wonderful. They are heading over to the US to do the NEMO in Boston in April...There is a spectacular show upcoming with them and The Waifs (another wonderful Aussie ecto band, www.thewaifs.com.au) at the Iron Horse in Northampton, MA on Thur, April 11 at 7pm, $10. I believe you can catch both bands in Boston at some point in April as well. Sorry for the stream (Ocean?) of consciousness but my mind thinks it is still somewhere over the pacific - -Jason n.p. Women In Docs Live ep ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2002 20:31:35 -0800 From: Nadyne Mielke Subject: Re: Highlights from the impromptu EctoFestSouth (very south) / An Awesome Aussie show upcoming in Northhampton MA 4/11 At 23:16 27-03-02 -0500, Jason Gordon wrote: >I am back in the states and badly jetlagged after a few weeks in australia >:) [snip] For fans of Australian music, Aussie icon Paul Kelly [1] is currently touring the US and Canada in support of his most recent album, '... nothing but a dream'. You can see his tour dates online at: http://www.paulkelly.com.au/tour-dates/index.html#ca He writes intelligent lyrics and catchy melodies. For me, it's three minutes of a perfectly-captured moment. My favourite song from the current album is 'Midnight Rain'. /nm {who desperately misses living in Sydney} [1] Who says that he's a legend, not a star. :) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2002 20:54:32 -0800 From: Nadyne Mielke Subject: Voices on the Verge I just noticed that Voices on the Verge is going to be on Mountain Stage. According to the schedule, they'll be on 'the week after Apr 5'. If you're not certain if or when Mountain Stage is broadcast in your neck of the woods, you can get a listing of affiliates and broadcast times at: http://www.mountainstage.org/msstations2.htm /nm ------------------------------ End of ecto-digest V8 #87 *************************