From: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org (ecto-digest) To: ecto-digest@smoe.org Subject: ecto-digest V7 #355 Reply-To: ecto@smoe.org Sender: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk ecto-digest Thursday, December 13 2001 Volume 07 : Number 355 Today's Subjects: ----------------- thoughts on becoming popular... [Irvin Lin ] Amusing mis-assignment of a Happy song... [kscleaves@juno.com] agnes bernelle and clare fader [anna maria "stjärnell" ] Re: Susan McKeown tomorrow night [Joseph Zitt ] RE: Susan McKeown tomorrow night [Phil Hudson ] The past *is* Warpaint at Google! ["Xenu's Sister" ] Don't be late ["Mitchell A. Pravatiner" ] Before she was famous--kinda sorta ["Mitchell A. Pravatiner" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2001 01:50:53 -0800 From: Irvin Lin Subject: thoughts on becoming popular... > Subject: RE: 'I like them till' they become popular..' > > I think maybe your point has more to do with the fact that many who have achieved a good measure of financial success ( from popular appeal) are > strongly encouraged to maintain that momentum, sometimes having to include material that will reach a broader audience, when they would perhaps > rather be still following their own personal muse, whereas those who have not hit the broad market are less inclined, and often encouraged by > their existing fan base, to maintain the relative purity of their musical "status quo". i for one, know that i am often disappointed with an artist when they release something new, especially after a rather successful album. but i try not to fault the artists, rather i tend to fault the producer, the label, their audience, pretty much anyone i can, other than the artist. which makes me wonder, maybe it IS the artist's choice to do what they want to do. i realize that there is a whole heck of a lot of pressure put on the artist to put out something that is commercial viable, especially if they have just had a big hit, to have an even bigger hit, but often i think we discount the fact that perhaps the artists has their own reasons for doing what they want. whether it artistic, or financial, ultimately it has the artist's name on it, which usually means that they endorse the product (with the exception of artists who actually make press statements about how the album wasn't their idea - ie. AIMEE MANN's ULTIMATE COLLECTION or that one album by LEEANN RIMES). case in point. SARAH MCLACHLAN. for me and for many people on ecto, she showed promise with TOUCH, raised the ante with SOLACE and arrived with FUMBLING. then SURFACING came about. ugh. i mean it wasn't a terrible album. just rather dull. and her most successful album at the time. But SARAH herself has said that she is proud of SURFACING. and i have to believe what she says. SARAH is really just one example of a number of artists that, well, i usually say "i liked her earlier stuff..." on the other side of the coin, artists like BJORK keep coming up with brilliant albums after brilliant album. the money that she is able to make off the success of each album fuels her desire to make more interesting and challenging work. i think HOMOGENIC was worlds better than DEBUT, and i thought DEBUT was a pretty darn good album when it came out. other artists that come to mind include RADIOHEAD (their first hit CREEP definitely didn't lead me to believe that they would release something like OK COMPUTER - and then KID A/ AMNESIAC), to AALIYAH, whose latest (and sadly last album) was amazing in it's boundary pushing of RnB. basically i don't believe that financial reasons are the sole reason for an artist's change in style or sensibility. money can be a burden, causing someone with talent to flounder (ahem. JEWEL). or it can elevate the artist to another level (JANE SIBERRY's WHEN I WAS A BOY was her highest profile album, the most expensive for her to make, and her most brilliant to date - imo). so lately i have taken to not apologizing for what i like. if i like earlier work, stuff that isn't as popular (PJ HARVEY's DRY and RID OF ME blows away anything she has released since), then so be it. if i like the artist's more recent popular work (AIMEE MANN's BACHELOR No. 2 is definitely an improvement over I'M WITH STUPID or WHATEVER) than more power to me. and i still like the new HEATHER NOVA. so *mwah* to you all... irvin ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2001 06:05:00 -0600 From: kscleaves@juno.com Subject: Amusing mis-assignment of a Happy song... Hey-- Was just browsing through gnutella looking for a rain sound effect. One of the tracks that popped up was Happy's "When the Rain Came Down," as performed by "Kate Bush and Annie Lennox." Rather the most amusing description of Happy's voice that I've heard in a while. (I enlightened the owner a smidge.) Would be an interesting cover, though. I'd like to be a fly on the wall at *that* recording session. - --Kay ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2001 04:37:07 -0800 (PST) From: anna maria "stjärnell" Subject: agnes bernelle and clare fader Hi. this is something for all lovers of german cabaret music to check out. The late Agnes Bernelle did a duet with Marc Almond and worked with Elvis Costello. Her cd Father is lying dead on the ironing board is a fine example of her voice and some great songs from the 1920's. I suspect her of being Ute Lemper's spiritual mother. The newer artist Clare Fader(see eponymous website)has a splendid cd in Elephant's baby. Closely resembling Abby Travis(she lapses into german in one song too!)she does some excellent songs in a cabaret style with witty lyrics and great tunes. Anna Maria(humming Pirate Jenny) np-Ute lemper-punishing kiss Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions for all of your unique holiday gifts! Buy at http://shopping.yahoo.com or bid at http://auctions.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2001 08:07:48 -0800 From: Phil Hudson Subject: RE: Susan McKeown tomorrow night Won't you be cold? ;) Phil - -----Original Message----- From: Philip David Morgan [mailto:pmorgan@suffolk.lib.ny.us] Sent: Tuesday, December 11, 2001 6:22 PM To: ECTO Subject: Susan McKeown tomorrow night Good Evening, Ectofolk: Is there anyone on the listing hoping to see Susan McKeown at Joe's Pub in NYC (425 Lafayette) tomorrow night? If so, look for me. I'll be sporting a blue beret cap and a cloth bag...... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2001 10:27:49 -0600 From: Joseph Zitt Subject: Re: Susan McKeown tomorrow night On Wed, Dec 12, 2001 at 08:07:48AM -0800, Phil Hudson wrote: > Won't you be cold? Not if it's an insulated bag. But he may be mistaken for Yoko Ono. > -----Original Message----- > From: Philip David Morgan [mailto:pmorgan@suffolk.lib.ny.us] > Sent: Tuesday, December 11, 2001 6:22 PM > To: ECTO > Subject: Susan McKeown tomorrow night > > > Good Evening, Ectofolk: > > Is there anyone on the listing hoping to see Susan McKeown at Joe's Pub in > NYC (425 Lafayette) tomorrow night? > > If so, look for me. I'll be sporting a blue beret cap and a cloth bag...... - -- |> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <| | jzitt@metatronpress.com http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt | | Latest CDs: Collaborations/ All Souls http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt | | Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List | ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2001 09:37:18 -0800 From: Phil Hudson Subject: RE: Susan McKeown tomorrow night Hmmnn, A large number of responses spring immediately to mind...I'll satisfy my compulsions by saying; I don't think anyone could ever be mistaken for Yoko Ono :) - -----Original Message----- From: Joseph Zitt [mailto:jzitt@metatronpress.com] ....But he may be mistaken for Yoko Ono. > - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2001 16:59:56 -0800 (PST) From: "Xenu's Sister" Subject: The past *is* Warpaint at Google! Oh my goodness gracious! Lookie what that darn Google found! http://www.google.com (Groups tab) "New! Google offers complete 20-year Usenet Archive with over 700 million messages" There's nothing like having the past catch up with you. I'll bet this is going to cause some major consternation for quite a lot of people. It's not all there though. I haven't found some pretty findable things (findable if the archives were in fact complete) but gaps are to be expected, and I'm amazed at some of what I did find. Anyone want to read the first time I mentioned Happy on the Internet, on December 31, 1989?? We had only been on the net a couple of weeks (I haven't yet found our very first post), though we'd been involved in various gaffa-related doings since 1985. http://groups.google.com/groups?q=chris%40world.std.com&start=20&hl=en&rnum=30&selm=9001010728.AA00560%40world.std.com (Man, that formatted badly. Sorry) There were no such things as Public "Internet Service Providers" back in those olden days, but one called The World had started up in Boston and we signed up, first as chris@world.std.com, then as katefans@world.std.com. We had to call long-distance from Kansas City to Boston to get our mail and read newsgroups. Ouch! I noticed that a couple of other people have used chris@world.std.com over the years. We only used in it late 1989 and the early part of 1990. We have no interest in snowboarding, thank you. Imagine, a net before spam! A net before paid ads! A net before flami....oh, never mind. Flaming has always been a part of the net. Still, a net that only a tiny fraction of people knew about. (Not that that was "better" but it was different). Re non-findable posts: We haven't yet found a very funny posting from alt.suicide.holiday that was posted on or near Groundhog Day, something like "10 Ways To Kill Yourself With A Groundhog" and one of them was to walk into a biker bar, show a big burly mean-looking biker a Groundhog and say (something like...can't remember) "Hey man, is this your old lady?") V. Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions for all of your unique holiday gifts! Buy at http://shopping.yahoo.com or bid at http://auctions.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2001 19:50:53 -0600 From: Joseph Zitt Subject: Re: The past *is* Warpaint at Google! On Wed, Dec 12, 2001 at 04:59:56PM -0800, Xenu's Sister wrote: > Re non-findable posts: We haven't yet found a very > funny posting from alt.suicide.holiday that was > posted on or near Groundhog Day, something like "10 > Ways To Kill Yourself With A Groundhog" and one > of them was to walk into a biker bar, show a big > burly mean-looking biker a Groundhog and say > (something like...can't remember) "Hey man, is > this your old lady?") Google Knows All. A seatch for "kill yourself with a groundhog" brought up a single hit, http://www.etext.org/Zines/ASCII/m00se/m00se38 which contained the following: - - - - - - - - - (Submitted by Ruprecht) Description: Whenever I get depressed, I read this. >In article <14050@reed.UUCP> jswanson@reed.UUCP (Grendel) writes: >> >Ok, how about a top 10 list of ways to kill yourself with a groundhog? Here are a couple: Take a groundhog, inject the groundhog with a large dose of methamphetamines, place the groundhog inside your shirt. More than likely, the groundhog will begin to tunnel into your chest cavity, thereby causing your demise. Take a groundhog into a biker bar. Find the largest biker in the place. Hold up the groundhog and say, "Hey donkey puke, this is your old lady ain't it? Oh, excuse me, your old lady don't look this good." Death should follow within 20 seconds. Take some electrical wire and attach one pair of leads to a twelve volt battery and the other ends to the hind legs of the groundhog. Then hold the groundhog near your throat. Slow but efficient. - -- - /| | Karl Klingman \`O.o' -->GAK! | UUCP: gatech!stiatl!karl ={___}= Cubicles: Just say NO! | Internet: stiatl!karl@gatech.edu ` U ' | ______________________________________________________________________________ I read this and somehow I never get around to killing myself. Ruprecht V067LUFD@UBVMS - -- |> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <| | jzitt@metatronpress.com http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt | | Latest CDs: Collaborations/ All Souls http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt | | Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List | ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2001 21:11:00 -0500 From: meredith Subject: Re: The past *is* Warpaint at Google! Hi, Vickie reported: >Oh my goodness gracious! Lookie what that darn >Google found! > >http://www.google.com (Groups tab) > >"New! Google offers complete 20-year Usenet Archive >with over 700 million messages" > >There's nothing like having the past catch up >with you. I'll bet this is going to cause some >major consternation for quite a lot of people. Heh. woj discovered this yesterday, and we've been getting all misty-eyed recalling the days of yore. Well, "cringing at how INCREDIBLY annoying I was in college" would be more like it. Gods. >It's not all there though. I haven't found some >pretty findable things (findable if the archives >were in fact complete) but gaps are to be expected, >and I'm amazed at some of what I did find. I was trying to find my first post to .gaffa, but I couldn't find that ... though I did find my post to rec.music.misc (on December 15, 1989) wondering if there were any other KaTe Bush fanatics out there, which led to a pointer toward Love-Hounds that, well, changed my life. Ah, the memories. >I noticed that a couple of other people have >used chris@world.std.com over the years. We only >used in it late 1989 and the early part of 1990. >We have no interest in snowboarding, thank you. Heh. woj found out that after I gave up my meth@aol.com e-dress in '93 (after three agonizing months of the worst Internet service on the planet - -- it took literally up to 30 days to get mail delivered to me at that damnedount) someone else picked it up, who is most certainly NOT into the things I'm into. I hope if that guy is ever investigated by the FBI, they know enough to distinguish between his postings and mine. Back to memory lane... remember, kids: Watch what you post. It *will* come back to haunt you! :) ======================================= Meredith Tarr New Haven, CT USA mailto:meth@smoe.org http://www.smoe.org/meth "an eye for an eye only ends up making the whole world blind" -- mahatma gandhi ======================================= Live At The House O'Muzak House Concert Series http://www.smoe.org/meth/muzak.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2001 21:30:07 -0600 (CST) From: "Mitchell A. Pravatiner" Subject: Don't be late Meredith reposted something from another list, apparently posted there by _Midnight Special_ host Rich Warren, about the special live edition in honor of WFMT's 50th birthday starting at 9:10 Central time. I wouldn't take that on faith. The show's regular start time is 9 PM straight up, central time, and I am confident that will be the case for the special edition as well. So call up www.midnightspecial.org shortly before 9 PM CST (GMT-6 hours) tomorrow, click on "Listen on the web," and access the live streaming audio. Download Real Player in advance, if you don't already have it or Windows Media Player. You'll be glad you did. This is a special edition of Chicago's premier folk and eclectic music program. Mitch ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2001 21:47:36 -0600 (CST) From: "Mitchell A. Pravatiner" Subject: Before she was famous--kinda sorta I met Sheila Nicholls the night after Thanksgiving, 1999. She was playing at the Uncommon Ground, and she was actually the opening act for a local band whose name I wish to hell I could remember, because they were really good and if there ever is an Ectofest offshoot in these parts, they are the kind of band that should be on the bill. But to make a long story longer, as either Groucho Marx or George Burns (I forget which) once put it, the set had to be foreshortened a fair amount because she and her band got lost on the way over, having confused a street with some name in Chicago with a street with the same name in an outer-ring suburb. For all that, it was an excellent performance. As was my wont after performances at this particular coffeehouse, I was able to chat a little with Sheila, unfortunately not for long because they had to hit the road again soon for the next gig which was in another city. On the strength of hearing this show, I bought her first CD, which then had just come out. Of course, the fact that she had a CD on a nationally distributed label meant that she was already more famous than most of the artists that play the UG, but still... Mitch (wondering about the ratio of the length of the above to that of Molly Bloom's Soliloquy) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2001 22:50:08 -0600 From: Joseph Zitt Subject: Re: The past *is* Warpaint at Google! On Wed, Dec 12, 2001 at 09:11:00PM -0500, meredith wrote: > Back to memory lane... remember, kids: Watch what you post. It *will* come > back to haunt you! :) What a blast. I also go back to 1989. My .signature overloads the personal wayback machine: Joe Zitt * {sun!hoptoad,cmcl2}!dasys1!jzitt * Big Electric Cat PAM Repertory Company also: (killer,uunet,psuvax}!cbis3!elephant!zitt!joe imagine the clouds dripping. dig a hole in your garden to put them in. yoko '83 Remember, BTW, that Ecto posts do end up in there, courtesy of the mysterious newsgroup fa.music.ecto - -- |> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <| | jzitt@metatronpress.com http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt | | Latest CDs: Collaborations/ All Souls http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt | | Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List | ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2001 23:44:44 -0500 From: strange little woj Subject: Re: The past *is* Warpaint at Google! when we last left our heroes, Joseph Zitt (jzitt@metatronpress.com) exclaimed: >Remember, BTW, that Ecto posts do end up in there, courtesy of the >mysterious newsgroup fa.music.ecto kinda nice having a searchable ecto archive, huh? not sure how far back it goes though. incidentally, the "fa" stands for "from arpanet" -- fa.* was a place for gatewayed arpanet mailing lists, kinda like how some listserv lists were gatewayed to bit.listserv.*. the gateway for ecto has been going since nearly the beginning of the list, courtesy of kjetil torgrim homme (oes he even pay attention to ecto anymore?). woj ------------------------------ End of ecto-digest V7 #355 **************************