From: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org (ecto-digest) To: ecto-digest@smoe.org Subject: ecto-digest V7 #79 Reply-To: ecto@smoe.org Sender: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk ecto-digest Sunday, March 18 2001 Volume 07 : Number 079 Today's Subjects: ----------------- And in French? "Il brilgue: les =?iso-8859-1?Q?t=F4ves?= lubricilleux..." [Valerie Richardson ] Re: 'Twas brillig, and the slithy toves [afrisch@t-online.de (Alexander F] Re: 'Twas brillig, and the slithy toves [recount chocula ] Re: Happy performing in NY [Ariusz Nowak ] Re: 'Twas brillig, and the slithy toves [Joseph Zitt ] Re: Brillig redux [Joseph Zitt ] Flirting with The Dark (Hannah Fury, Soul Poison) [Andrew Fries Subject: And in French? "Il brilgue: les =?iso-8859-1?Q?t=F4ves?= lubricilleux..." Il brilgue: les ttves lubricilleux Se gyrent en vrillant dans le guave, Enmnmis sont les gougebosqueux, Et le mtmerade horsgrave. Garde-toi du Jaseroque, mon fils! La gueule qui mord; la griffe qui prend! Garde-toi de l'oiseau Jube, ivite Le frumieux Band-`-prend. Son glaive vorpal en mail il va- T-` la recherche du fauve manscant; Puis arrivei ` l'arbre Ti-Ti, Il y reste, riflichissant. Pendant qu'il pense, tout uffusi Le Jaseroque, ` l'oeil flambant, Vient siblant par le bois tullegeais, Et burbule en venant. Un deux, un deux, par le milieu, Le glaive vorpal fait pat-`-pan! La bjte difaite, avec sa tjte, Il rentre gallomphant. As-tu tui le Jaseroque? Viens ` mon coeur, fils rayonnais! O jour frabbejeais! Calleau! Callai! Il cortule dans sa joie. Il brilgue: les ttves lubricilleux Se gyrent en vrillant dans le guave, Enmnmis sont les gougebosqueux, Et le mtmerade horsgrave. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2001 09:00:55 -0500 From: dave Subject: jabberwocky Lyle writes: > In response to Phil Hudson's question about O frabjous day. Here is the > source. I have a friend who memorized this poem in high school. It gave him > great satisfaction to repeat it. I remember memorizing it in 5th grade, we also made a big mural of what we thought the jabberwock would look like.. I guess at that age today kids are busy memorizing eminem lyrics instead.. Ayway.. the best recital I've seen of The Jabberwocky was by Desi Arnaz.. absolutely hilarious with the accent and all.. np: ishtar - the voice of Alabina dave ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2001 11:00:48 +0100 From: afrisch@t-online.de (Alexander Frisch) Subject: Re: 'Twas brillig, and the slithy toves Hi there, > > >Martin Gardner's "The Annotated Alice" has the text translated into > > >German, as well as, I think, other languages. > > > > Erm, how the hell would something that's full of made-up English words get > > translated into German?! Are the German words made up, too? > > >From memory: > > Es brillig war, und slithege Toven > gegirtet und gimbelt ins Wabe. > Mimliche war die Borogoven > und die Mome-Rathen ausgraben. > > I probably botched some of it, but that should give you the idea. Hope you don4t feel offended when I tell you, that your translations doesn4t make any sense at all ;-) Actually, I4m a newby here and don4t know what you4re talking about, but I can help out if you need a translation into or from german. Btw. what does that common n.p. mean ?!? "Now playing" ?!? Gruss, Alex http://members.xoom.com/boots66 ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2001 10:30:46 -0500 From: recount chocula Subject: Re: 'Twas brillig, and the slithy toves when we last left our heroes, Joseph Zitt exclaimed: >Martin Gardner's "The Annotated Alice" has the text translated into >German, as well as, I think, other languages. I occasionally deploy the >first verse in German in just such a way, but have never been able to >remember the rest of it. my favorite translation has always been jerseywocky, but i guess you'd have to have lived there to understand... woj n.p. zilch ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2001 12:25:52 +0200 From: Ariusz Nowak Subject: Re: Happy performing in NY > Happy will be performing as part of a multimedia show called "The Water > Wheel" by Eric Nicolas, at 9 p.m. on March 22, 23 and 24, and at 8 p.m. > on the 25th. Happy does not have a huge part...she's singing back up and > did the pre-show electronic music (there is a 1 hour pre-show > reception). The theater is at 205 N. 7th St, Brooklyn. For more info, > call 718-599-7997. You lucky ones there in NY. How I would like to see Happy live. BTW anyone knows about Happy's new album? Are there any chances to listen to it this year? Ariusz ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2001 13:00:58 -0600 From: Joseph Zitt Subject: Re: 'Twas brillig, and the slithy toves On Sat, Mar 17, 2001 at 11:00:48AM +0100, Alexander Frisch wrote: > Hi there, > > > > >Martin Gardner's "The Annotated Alice" has the text translated into > > > >German, as well as, I think, other languages. > > > > > > Erm, how the hell would something that's full of made-up English words get > > > translated into German?! Are the German words made up, too? > > > > >From memory: > > > > Es brillig war, und slithege Toven > > gegirtet und gimbelt ins Wabe. > > Mimliche war die Borogoven > > und die Mome-Rathen ausgraben. > > > > I probably botched some of it, but that should give you the idea. > Doublechecking the online translations, it looks like my memory was about 60% there. Robert Scott's translation starts: Es brillig war. Die schlichte Toven Wirrten und wimmelten in Waben; Und aller-muemsige Burggoven Die mohmen Rath' ausgraben. > Hope you don4t feel offended when I tell you, that your translations doesn4t > make any sense at all ;-) Actually, I4m a newby here and don4t know what you4re > talking about, but I can help out if you need a translation into or from german. Alexander, are you familiar with the original English poem at http://www76.pair.com/keithlim/jabberwocky/poem/jabberwocky.html ? The amount of sense in the German just about correlates to that in the English -- that is, most of the nouns, verbs, and adjectives are completely made-up words. >. what does that common n.p. mean ?!? "Now playing" ?!? Right. And "n.r." is "now reading". There are other variants, such as "n.p.i.m.h" for "Now playing in my head" and "n.w.b.p.i.t.c.h.n.b.e.b.a.d.a.t.n.j.t" for "Now would be playing if the cassette hadn't been eaten by a dragon along the New Jersey Turnpike", though I don't think that that one has actually been used yet. - -- |> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <| | jzitt@metatronpress.com http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt | | Latest CD: Jerusaklyn http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt | | Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List | ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2001 13:15:44 -0600 From: Joseph Zitt Subject: Re: 'Twas brillig, and the slithy toves On Sat, Mar 17, 2001 at 10:30:46AM -0500, recount chocula wrote: > my favorite translation has always been jerseywocky, but i guess you'd have > to have lived there to understand... > > Having grown up in New Jersey, I'm not sure whether to be offended or relieved that none of the places that I lived actually made it in there. > n.p. zilch My group QslashC actually covered that on our last Texas tour (though the guy doing the second line never quite got the rhythm right): http://www.metatronpress.com/mp3/qslashc/2000/123000/QslashC_-_123000_-_Zilch.mp3 (Yeah, I know that's not what woj meant :-]) - -- |> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <| | jzitt@metatronpress.com http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt | | Latest CD: Jerusaklyn http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt | | Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List | ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2001 19:41:29 -0600 (CST) From: "Mitchell A. Pravatiner" Subject: Brillig redux Shouldn't it be "ins Waben," rather than "ins Wabe," to rhyme with "ausgraben?" Actually, the thing I find most striking is how well it all fits into the tune of the old Anglican hymn, "Jerusalem." Kind of in the great tradition of a talk given at the University of Chicago some years ago, in which the speaker demonstrated how Robert Frost's poem "Stopping by Woods on a Snowy Evening" fit perfectly into the tune of "Hernando's Hideaway," from the old Broadway musical _Pajama Game_. Mitch ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2001 20:19:28 -0600 From: Joseph Zitt Subject: Re: Brillig redux On Sat, Mar 17, 2001 at 07:41:29PM -0600, Mitchell A. Pravatiner wrote: > Actually, the thing I find most striking is how well it all fits into the > tune of the old Anglican hymn, "Jerusalem." Kind of in the great > tradition of a talk given at the University of Chicago some years ago, in > which the speaker demonstrated how Robert Frost's poem "Stopping by Woods > on a Snowy Evening" fit perfectly into the tune of "Hernando's Hideaway," > from the old Broadway musical _Pajama Game_. Gak, I remember hearing that. And one is never the same after having heard Coleridge's "Kublai Khan" read in a bad fake Swedish accent... Actually, Jabberwocky's tetrameter is prone to all sorts of mischevous settings. There's a Jewish hymn, Adon Olam, in pretty much the same meter. One day in college, a group of us counted about 150 possible settings, including "Jesus Christ Superstar". Unfortunately, it being a Sabbath afternoon in an Orthodox synagogue, nobody wrote the list down. - -- |> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <| | jzitt@metatronpress.com http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt | | Latest CD: Jerusaklyn http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt | | Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List | ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 18 Mar 2001 15:16:07 +1100 From: Andrew Fries Subject: Flirting with The Dark (Hannah Fury, Soul Poison) The comment that brought Hannah Fury to my attention stated simply she was a Goth version of Tori, and I repeat it here, because after all it did the trick - it lead to me ordering her disks. But I don't think it is very true. For starters, I don't really think of her as Goth. Gothic, Victorian - perhaps. As for resemblance to Tori, they are both women playing the piano, but beyond that, their paths diverge. Tori's songs, those that really matter are so intensely personal listening to them is much like attending some ritual sacrifice, blood and guts spilling everywhere. "Soul Poison", on the other hand, is more like a book of Edgar Allan Poe's tales. It is certainly honest, but only because it makes no secret that these are tales told unashamedly for the purpose of evoking that delicious tingling feeling of fear and wonder running down your spine, not Tori-like public vivisection of her own psyche. The opener, "The Necklace of Marie Antoinette" is a perfect example, the tale of planned murder - her attraction to all things dark is clear, but I doubt the story is autobiographical. The next track, "Scars" turns out to be classic "Scarborough Fair", but the twist soon becomes clear: these are not the words I remember from Simon and Garfunkel! "Please don't go to Scarborough Fair/violets, roses, thistles and vines/Remember me, I am still here/He was not a true love of mine" she sings, but she seems to be saying, somewhat impatiently, "well, get over it already!" rather than pleading for forgiveness. "Idaho" touches on that classic dillema: "and what if I loved you with all of my heart/and what if my love wasn't good enough?" she asks. It's a good question and one I can certainly relate to, but she doesn't arrive at any conclusions either, just leaving me wondering instead while she moves on to "Eat the Dirt", for another dose of darkness and inner turmoil: "Run from these hands if you know what's good for you/I can't control the things I do"... And so it went. It is a fine record, I felt those tingles in the right places and I enjoyed them. But it was the final track, "The Last Piece of Cake" that suddenly made me doubt my interpretation. It starts as another Gothic tale flirting with the dark side, story of a mother betrayed by her daughter, but then the story kind of just stops while she continues..."this makes me want to believe in heaven and angels... for mothers... and hunchbacks... and volves/Please let me believe that she's happy... and safe... and warm..." It was only then it occured to me it is after all possible that despite their over-the-top Gothic setting that darkness and pain and fear might be all too uncomfortably real. Or maybe not. Who knows? In the end, Hannah remains something of an enigma to me. But if it's true that a work of art is but a mirror held up to our faces, I think I flinched just a little at what I saw. - ------------------------------------------------------ They will do whatever we let them get away with. - -- Joseph Heller - ------ http://www.zip.com.au/~afries/spot.php3 ------- ------------------------------ End of ecto-digest V7 #79 *************************