From: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org (ecto-digest) To: ecto-digest@smoe.org Subject: ecto-digest V6 #218 Reply-To: ecto@smoe.org Sender: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk ecto-digest Friday, July 28 2000 Volume 06 : Number 218 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Today's your birthday, friends... [Mike Matthews ] Attention Napster users [WretchAwry ] Re: Attention Napster users [Ted ] 'E' is for Eels... [Drew Harrington ] 'E' is for Eels... (fwd) ["Mark Anthony Miazga" ] Albums of the Year ["Mark Anthony Miazga" ] it's been a while ["Michael Mendelson" ] Re: Lisa Germano ["C Goldberg" ] Forget Napster, where's Hapster? [Ted ] Re: it's been a while [jburka@min.net] Boycott central [Ted ] Gnutella's web page is down, AOL may have pulled the plug. [Ted ] Re: Boycott central [jburka@min.net] Lisa Germano and the Eels ["Adam K." ] Re: Lisa Germano and the Eels [Sue Trowbridge ] Re: Lisa Germano and the Eels [Sue Trowbridge ] Re: Lisa Germano and the Eels [Jay Behel ] Re: Boycott central [dsr@mail.lns.cornell.edu] Re: Boycott central [jburka@min.net] Re: Boycott central [Ted ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 03:00:04 -0400 (EDT) From: Mike Matthews Subject: Today's your birthday, friends... i*i*i*i*i*i i*i*i*i*i*i *************** *****HAPPY********* **************BIRTHDAY********* *************************************************** *************************************************************************** ******************** Alvin Brattli (no Email address) ********************* ****************** Christy Eger Smith (no Email address) ****************** ***************** Shirley Ye (shye@uclink4.berkeley.edu) ****************** *************************************************************************** -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Alvin Brattli Sun July 27 1969 Lefthanded Christy Eger Smith Thu July 27 1944 Horse Crossing Shirley Ye July 27 Lioness woj Sun July 28 1968 children at play John Relph Sat July 28 1962 Leo Bob Kollmeyer Wed July 28 1971 Leo Steve Lusky Tue July 29 1952 Bike! Kate Bush Wed July 30 1958 God Chuck Smith Wed July 30 1958 Reboot Yves Denneulin Fri July 30 1971 Lion-Heart Joel Kenyon Wed July 31 1963 Leo Eli Brandt August 05 Leo Martin Bridges Sat August 08 1970 BigGuy Happy Rhodes Mon August 09 1965 HolyGhost Michael Stevens Sat August 12 1967 For Sale or Lease Martin Dougiamas Wed August 20 1969 Positive Tori Amos Thu August 22 1963 Leo Sam Warren Tue August 22 1961 Leo Henk Van Wulpen Sat August 22 1970 Leo Kerry White Wed August 22 1951 Exact Leo/Virgo Don Gibson Wed August 26 1959 Virgo - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 02:31:01 -0500 From: WretchAwry Subject: Attention Napster users You folks have probably heard that the judge in the Napster case granted the RIAA a temporary injunction to shut down Napster pending trial. Barring a reversal via an emergency appeal, Napster is due to be shut down on Friday (I've heard various times, but count on it being shut down by midnight Friday night/Saturday morning. Napigator has already taken off the official Napster servers from its program. Anyone who has Napigator (www.napigator.com) can log into one of the unofficial servers and continue to use Napster. I don't know if I'll be checking out one of the unofficial servers but I am looking for an alternative. For now, I've set up on Cute MX, which I like a lot (for one thing, it has the advantage of letting me show *all* my files) but has its own bugs to deal with (such as booting people off if there hasn't been enough activity in however long it is this time, not to mention a bad habit of crashing when you least expect it). It also has many advantages, not least of which is a resume command if it does go kerplooie during the middle of a download. Look for Equipoise (me) and/or GaffaServer (our firewall server). When I'm around, I try to keep open a chat channel called Gaffa, but Cute MX closes down channels if they've been inactive. If no such channel exists, CMX works like irc in that once you type in the name Gaffa, you've just created the channel. Chris is also setting up a Gnutella client, but we've looked at and pretty much discarded Scour Exchange. Like Napster, it hates people with a lot of files and makes their lives miserable trying to stay on the damn program. If I find something better I'll post. Napster may or may not be doomed. The sharing of music among music-lovers will continue unabated. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 04:47:22 -0400 From: Ted Subject: Re: Attention Napster users I'm only going to comment on the tech stuff here :) you might find the gnutella clone such as "gnucleus" a nice alternative to the others, gnucleus a lot easier to use than the original, but all the gnu's are still clunky at present. The clones are at: http://gnutella.wego.com/go/wego.pages.page?groupId=116705&view=page&pageId=119596&folderId=117728&panelId=-1&action=view WretchAwry wrote: > You folks have probably heard that the judge in the Napster > case granted the RIAA a temporary injunction. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 07:49:18 -0700 (PDT) From: Drew Harrington Subject: 'E' is for Eels... > Moving on, I just noticed a mention of Lisa Germano > in our street mag: the article is about someone > variously calling himself "eels" or just "e". The > current line up of his apparently fluid band > consists of certain Butch Norton, and Lisa > Germano. "e" is touring in Australia... The Eels had cancelled their last two San Francisco shows - both due to a death in E's family. When they were scheduled to play here in June I jump at the chance to see them, and was not disappointed. At that time the band consisted of E variously on piano, guitar, and vocals, Butch on drums, percussion, and timpani, Lisa on keyboard (using an ironing board as a keyboard stand), violin, flute, percussion, and vocals, two horn players, and a bassist (contra). The show was very dynamic, reproducing the very orchestral arrangements of the last album. E was very darkly funny, explaining that his roadie, Spider Mellencamp, had had to open the show because the opening band had been tragically killed on the way to the show. "First my Mother, then my Sister, and now the Baby Rapers...." His Mother and Sister's deaths being the reason for the previous two San Francisco shows' cancellations respectively, and the dark tone of the last two albums. Lisa Germano was great at the show. I'd never seen her before, and she definately added a lot to the show. I'll go see her next time she's in town. One last thing. If you do see them you should know that in SF they only did one encore, then spider asked that the house lights be brought up. 15 minutes later, after the sold out Great American Music Hall (capacity 600+) had been drained of all but 40 or so people (autograph seekers and tee-shirt buyers), the entire band came back out and did one last encore. Amusingly, none of the local rave reviews of the show mentioned this. Ecto? Don't know. Great music? No doubt. Don't miss the dynamic, orchestral, dark pop of the Eels if you have a chance to see them. Drew __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get Yahoo! Mail - Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 11:01:53 -0400 (EDT) From: "Mark Anthony Miazga" Subject: 'E' is for Eels... (fwd) > Ecto? Don't know. Great music? No doubt. Don't miss > the dynamic, orchestral, dark pop of the Eels if you > have a chance to see them. Just wanted to add a voice of agreement to this. I've never known much about them before, but heard this great pop song on the soundtrack of - of all things - - the raunchy comedy "Road Trip". I looked up who it was - it sounded like Wilco to me - and it ended up being the Eels. I remembered them from their unique hit "Novocaine for the Soul" a couple of years ago. Anyhow, this song (which turned out to be "Mr. E's Beautiful Blues", a hidden bonus track on the new album) was so ingratiating that I bought the album (called something like "Daisies of the Galaxy"). Anyhow, it's phenomenal. My pick for album of the year so far. Fine songwriting, Quixotic lyrics, great vocals, eclectically produced, catchy - really excellent. I'll be getting the rest of their stuff soon. - -mark - -- Mark Miazga miazgama@msu.edu http://www.msu.edu/~miazgama ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 11:26:31 -0400 (EDT) From: "Mark Anthony Miazga" Subject: Albums of the Year Here's my picks for the best of 2000, so far: 1. Eels, Daisies of the Galaxy: Songs that can make you cry, if the melodies and production weren't making you grin from ear to ear. 2. Sinead O'Connor, Faith and Courage: She's ba-a-ck! And in stunning form. While it doesn't match the consistency of "I Do Not Want What I Haven't Got" or have as many standout tracks as "Universal Mother" or "The Lion and the Cobra", this is still a return to form for the owner of the best voice in pop music. The song "Daddy I'm Fine" is an early pick for recording of the decade, while worthy stunners like "Jealous" (her vocals have never been more beautiful), "No Man's Woman", and the sexy "Till I Whisper U Something" stand out as well. 3. Juliana Hatfield, Beautiful Creature & Total System Failure: Double albums usually come off as pretentious, but Juliana does it brilliantly with these two marvels, possibly the best work of her career. Beautiful Creature features some stunning acoustic tracks and the most confident vocals Juliana has ever laid out, while TSF showcases Juliana's ballsy, funny, and angry side. As always, Juliana's music works because of the smart songwriting, the pop hooks, and the way her voice meshes with the music. But she's never got it so right so consistently before. 4. Jill Sobule, Pink Pearl: Sobule's best album ever features more of her trademark mix of wittiness and pathos. Songs like "Somewhere in New Mexico", "Loveless Motel", and "Mexican Wrestler" showcase her ability to create characters that both move and amuse you, while cuts like "Mary Kay" and "Heroes" are just plain hilarious. Few songwriters achieve the sort of peculiar whimsy that Sobule does. 5. Wally Pleasant, Hoedown: Continuing in his tradition that odd albums are great, even numbered albums are iffy, Wally's 5th album is a gem. Still here are his hilarious songs, but this time he's added the best backing music of his career. With production ranging from rock to rockabilly to punk-folk, Wally makes the most out of such live favorites as "Two for One Coupon", "New Action Hero", and "VH-1 Song". 6. Melissa Ferrick, Freedom: Though a letdown after the brilliant "Everything I Need," Ferrick's latest contains some of her best songwriting ever - "Little Love", "The Stranger", "North Carolina", "Win 'Em Over", the sexy "Drive". I have a problem with a lot of the production here - particularly "Hold On" and the title track - but both songs came out marvelously live. And that's the key for Ferrick. When her albums capture what she does live (as "Everything I Need" did), they come out as masterpieces. When they capture what she does in the studio, they come out as merely great. 7. Everclear, Songs for an American Movie Vol. 1 - Despite an ill-advised cover of "Brown Eyed Girl," Everclear still manages to produce some of the best songwriting you'll ever hear out of a rock band. Art Alexis is an excellent lyricist and storyteller, and the band remains tight. Even if a lot of their songs sound the same. 8. Aimee Mann, Bachelor #2: This one can't get too high of a mark, since many of the tracks already came out on the "Magnolia" soundtrack. But Mann's disattached lyrics and vocals about lonely, complex characters still is riveting. Best is "Deathly", in which the narrator is begging her suitor not to give her what she needs the most: "Now that I've met you / would you object to / never seeing each other again?" I'm having a tough time remembering others. Plus, it's only July. Mark (Check out my 1998, 1999, and 90's lists on my webpage) - -- Mark Miazga miazgama@msu.edu http://www.msu.edu/~miazgama ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 10:42:04 -0500 From: "Michael Mendelson" Subject: it's been a while Hello all, your friendly neighborhood palindrome man here. It's been quite a while since I have read or written to ecto. I attended a superb ectofest last Sept. and then saw Happy with Lo in chicago last fall (which was also great) but then a number of life events (good ones, mostly) took over and I dropped out for a while... 1) In Feb. I got married to Debi... yay! We took a trip to Israel in April and 2 weeks after we returned 2) I lost my job company basically ran out of money.. y'know, the whole internet bubble thing, and laid off the whole engineering staff ;;--)) So, now I have been married almost 6 months and am back at work at a new start-up company (www.auvo.com). Yay! And now finally I am ready to rejoin ecto. Unfortunately, we will not be able to attend ectofest this year, since we have already made plans for labor day weekend. But, in whatever incarnation it appears, I highly recommend it. Since I have been out of the ectoloop for so long, I am hopelessly behind in my music-listening. I am hereby soliciting recommendations of recent albums/discoveries that have been popular on ecto over the last several months -- please send them to me at this address (no need to bog down the list with this type of thing, though obviously it's up to you). Is there anything that I simply *must* here?! Finally 2 notes: One, I have picked up and been listening to the latest Sinead O'Connor CD and I like it alot. Welcome back to her! Second, I want to thank Jeff Burka for recommending Bushes and Briars as the next McKeown cd to listen to -- it spent about a year in my car CD player and I went from tolerating it to not being able to get the songs out of my head at all (it drove me crazy so I had to take it out of the car)... so Jeff, what should I get next? It's good to be back. - -mjm (mmendelson@auvo.com) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 10:05:38 -0700 From: "C Goldberg" Subject: Re: Lisa Germano Mark "E"verett is a friend of a friend so I know a little about this. If I remember the story correctly, Lisa joined the band last year after being an opener for the eels and also being part of the inner circle of singer-songwriters that musically reside in a Los Angeles club called Largo. The band has since gone on several tours with Lisa as the permanent violin player/backup vocalist, similar to the role she had with The Latin Playboys on their tour last year. They're last stop together was at the Roxy in Hollywood earlier this year. I believe Lisa has only done one or two little-publicized solo shows in the last year. The last time I saw her, the entire show was on piano, highlighting her exquisite taste for combining melody with downtrodden lyricism. She did hint at being a little bitter about her record deal falling through but her songs seemed to be more optimistic than ever. csg Currently in rotation: Poe - Haunted [one of the best albums of the year, IMHO] GoGoGo Airheart - Love My Life Hate My Friends Daniel Cage - Loud on Earth Sri - Gravity Reminds Me Carlos Olmeda - Sensitive Groove [I like this a lot] >Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2000 08:51:47 -0400 (EDT) >From: jburka@min.net >Subject: Re: cd prices, Lisa Germano > >On Wed, 26 Jul 2000, Andrew Fries wrote: > >> Moving on, I just noticed a mention of Lisa Germano in our street mag: >> the article is about someone variously calling himself "eels" or just >> "e". The current line up of his apparently fluid band consists of certain >> Butch Norton, and Lisa Germano. "e" is touring in Australia at the >> moment, but unfortunately the article didn't make it perfectly clear >> whether Lisa participates in this tour as well. I wouldn't mind seeing >> her again, if only in support role - it's been all too many years! I am a >> bit suspicious of this "e" character though :) > >E is a local guy (northern virginia) who had something of a hit back in >the early 90's. He later put together a band, the Eels, which had a >rather large hit called "Novacaine for the Soul." > >If you're looking for some sort of ecto-cred, If memory serves, E opened >for Tori Amos the second time she blew through DC on the Little >Earthquakes tour, when she played Lisner Auditorium. > >jeff > HotBot - Search smarter. http://www.hotbot.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 13:49:59 -0400 From: Ted Subject: Forget Napster, where's Hapster? I wrote: The clones are at: http://gnutella.wego.com/go/wego.pages.page?groupId=116705&view=page&pageId=119596&folderId=117728&panelId=-1&action=view I noticed one of the developers has the handle "Capn Bry". ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 14:05:32 -0400 (EDT) From: jburka@min.net Subject: Re: it's been a while mjm sez: > Unfortunately, we will not be able to attend ectofest this year, since we > have already made plans for labor day weekend. But, in whatever incarnation > it appears, I highly recommend it. yeah, what he said. I'll be at the beach for a nice, long weekend, but I'd *love* to be going to the 'fest again. last year's was such an amazing experience. >Is there anything that I simply *must* here?! Emmylou and Linda Ronstadt's _Western Wall_. Tracy Chapman's _Telling Stories_. Aimee Mann's _Bachelor No. 2_. Jorane's _Vent Fou_. those are some of the finest ectophilic albums of the last year. Outstanding. (I'd have thrown _Faith and Courage_ in as of the best of the last year, but you already have it!) (I'm tempted to include Neutral Milk Hotel's _In the Aeroplane Over the Sea_, but Jeff Magnus has such a weird voice and there's so much bizarre noise in the album that it's hard to really recommend -- it's the sort of thing you might have to listen to 30 times before you understood it. Sort of like a lo-fi roots-rock implementation of the Pixies from the _Come On Pilgrim_ days) > Second, I want to thank Jeff Burka for recommending Bushes and Briars > as the next McKeown [...] so Jeff, what should I get next? Gee, thanks. Glad to be of service. Actually, you should now get Johnny Cunningham's _Peter and Wendy_ which features Susan on vocals. Truly stunning and possibly my favorite of "her" albums. I'm also very partial to _Mighty Rain_, particularly if you like really stripped down, sparse arrangements. Don't forget that Susan will be releasing her new traditional album (sort of a follow-up to _Bushes and Briars_ ) in September and will be touring with Johnny again in the fall. Welcome back, Mike... jeff ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 14:18:32 -0400 From: Ted Subject: Boycott central http://boycott-riaa.com/ http://dieriaa.netfirms.com/boycott.htm WretchAwry wrote: > You folks have probably heard that the judge in the Napster > case granted the RIAA a temporary injunction to shut > down Napster pending trial ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 14:36:49 -0400 From: Ted Subject: Gnutella's web page is down, AOL may have pulled the plug. No worries go to http://zeropaid.com/ for all your Gnutella and napigator needs - Spread the word. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 14:38:24 -0400 From: cjmacs Subject: courtney love sounds off hi all! a friend forwarded this link to me today. every fan of music in the world should read this article, especially the friends and foes of napster. i'm astounded that courtney love (whom i've always considered a shallow and superficial non-talent) wrote so eloquently on such an important subject. yes it's a long article but it's well worth the read... http://www.salon.com/tech/feature/2000/06/14/love/print.html chuck ectofest 2000 9.2.00 www.ectofest.org ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 14:40:52 -0400 (EDT) From: jburka@min.net Subject: Re: Boycott central On Thu, 27 Jul 2000, Ted wrote: > http://boycott-riaa.com/ > http://dieriaa.netfirms.com/boycott.htm Are you shitting me? This is the stupidest thing I've ever heard. How dare you shut down our Napster! To show you who's boss, we're going to refuse to pay for any of the music we were copying for free via Napster while it was still in operation! jeff ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 20:03:36 +0100 From: "Adam K." Subject: Lisa Germano and the Eels The eels are a superb group, albeit really just a channel for e to vent his angst through. They hit it pretty big with"Beautiful Freak" (1996) from which "Novocaine for the Soul" is taken, and then followed it up with "Electro-Shock Blues" (1998). This is an incredible album -- e wrote it after the death of his mother and the suicide of his sister, and it's full of angst, whimsy, black humour, and is devastatingly beautiful. I urge everyone to buy it. I saw them tour it a couple of years ago, and Lisa Germano opened for them, previewing tracks from "Slide". She didn't participate with the band, but she did play on a track on "Electro-Shock Blues". They recently released a new album, "Daisies of the Galaxy", which is pretty good, as well, although it doesn't have the same black air hanging over it. I know this is a good thing, I just thought it lent an extra bit and melancholy to the previous release. Speaking of Lisa Germano: After having a US release cassette of "Happiness" for years, I bought the cd from Harmony Ridge. I discovered that not only is the track listing very different, but the mixes on the songs are very different, as well -- it's particularly noticeable on "Energy" which on my cassette is a far more driving, rockier song than the one on the cd. Does anyone know why that is? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 12:12:03 -0700 (PDT) From: Sue Trowbridge Subject: Re: Lisa Germano and the Eels On Thu, 27 Jul 2000, Adam K. wrote: > Speaking of Lisa Germano: After having a US release cassette of "Happiness" > for years, I bought the cd from Harmony Ridge. I discovered that not only is > the track listing very different, but the mixes on the songs are very > different, as well -- it's particularly noticeable on "Energy" which on my > cassette is a far more driving, rockier song than the one on the cd. Does > anyone know why that is? There are two versions of HAPPINESS -- the first released on Capitol, and the second on 4AD. Here is what it says on 4AD's Lisa Germano page ( http://www.4ad.com/artists/germano/biog.htm ): Capitol released Happiness, but then 4AD boss Ivo Watts-Russell saw Lisa at a showcase and approached Capitol about licensing the album in the UK. It quickly became obvious that Lisa and Capitol weren't hitting it off, and Lisa moved across to 4AD. Happiness was remixed and resequenced, and the cover version of 'These Boots Were Made For Walking' that Capitol had insisted on was dropped, and the album was rereleased on 4AD. Some Lisa fans argue that the Capitol version is superior. I only have the more common 4AD release, so I haven't been able to compare & contrast. The original version does turn up from time to time in used bins and on eBay. BTW, I too saw the Eels in San Francisco on their current tour and they were fantastic! Don't miss 'em if they come to your town... - --Sue Trowbridge trow@slip.net ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 12:16:06 -0700 (PDT) From: Sue Trowbridge Subject: Re: Lisa Germano and the Eels On Thu, 27 Jul 2000, Adam K. wrote: > Speaking of Lisa Germano: After having a US release cassette of "Happiness" > for years, I bought the cd from Harmony Ridge. I discovered that not only is > the track listing very different, but the mixes on the songs are very > different, as well -- it's particularly noticeable on "Energy" which on my > cassette is a far more driving, rockier song than the one on the cd. Does > anyone know why that is? (I just tried responding to this and my e-mail program crashed, so let's try again...) There are two different versions of the album -- the first released on Capitol, and the second on 4AD. Here's the official word from 4AD's Lisa Germano page ( http://www.4ad.com/artists/germano/biog.htm ): Capitol released Happiness, but then 4AD boss Ivo Watts-Russell saw Lisa at a showcase and approached Capitol about licensing the album in the UK. It quickly became obvious that Lisa and Capitol weren't hitting it off, and Lisa moved across to 4AD. Happiness was remixed and resequenced, and the cover version of 'These Boots Were Made For Walking' that Capitol had insisted on was dropped, and the album was rereleased on 4AD. I only have the 4AD version so I can't really compare & contrast, but some Lisa fans swear the Capitol release is better. It is certainly rarer, but it does turn up from time to time in used bins and on eBay. I saw the Eels show in San Francisco a few weeks ago and it was fantastic. Don't miss 'em if they come to your town!! - --Sue Trowbridge * albany, california trow@slip.net * http://www.interbridge.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Jan 1970 00:00:00 -0500 (EST) From: Jay Behel Subject: Re: Lisa Germano and the Eels >Speaking of Lisa Germano: After having a US release cassette of "Happiness" >for years, I bought the cd from Harmony Ridge. I discovered that not only is >the track listing very different, but the mixes on the songs are very >different, as well -- it's particularly noticeable on "Energy" which on my >cassette is a far more driving, rockier song than the one on the cd. Does >anyone know why that is? > Happiness was initially released on Capitol Records, who had pushed for poppier mixes and production and then (surprise) failed to promote the album. Ivo Watts Russell at 4AD convinced Lisa (or maybe the other way 'round) to retool the album, and it was released on 4AD in its creepier, more atmospheric form. I actually like both versions. Jay Jay M. Behel, Ph.D. \"When I dare to be powerful-to use my strength in the service of my vision, then it begins to matter less and less whether I am afraid.\" Audre Lorde ------------------------------ Date: 27 Jul 2000 15:34:41 -0400 From: dsr@mail.lns.cornell.edu Subject: Re: Boycott central jburka@min.net writes: > On Thu, 27 Jul 2000, Ted wrote: > > http://boycott-riaa.com/ > > Are you shitting me? This is the stupidest thing I've ever heard. > > How dare you shut down our Napster! To show you who's boss, > we're going to refuse to pay for any of the music we were copying > for free via Napster while it was still in operation! Is it? One of the points of contention is whether the people using Napster buy CDs (there is actually some evidence they might buy more than average). If Napster users normally don't buy CDs, then the RIAA has nothing to fear from a boycott. If they do buy CDs, then a boycott would be the most effective way to demonstrate this to the RIAA--for all their posturing about artist's rights, the RIAA's real interest in this is their profits, and the most effective way to get their attention would be a demonstration that zealously prosecuting Napster might hurt their bottom line. A large enough boycott might even motivate the RIAA to get off their "intellectual property is property" high horse and start investigating workable solutions. Ok, so I don't really think that's very likely. I do think it is an interesting idea that might even help clarify some of the issues, and a *long*, *long* way from the stupidest thing I've heard today, much less the stupidest thing I've ever heard. - -- Dan Riley dsr@mail.lns.cornell.edu Wilson Lab, Cornell University "History teaches us that days like this are best spent in bed" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 16:11:29 -0400 (EDT) From: jburka@min.net Subject: Re: Boycott central On 27 Jul 2000 dsr@mail.lns.cornell.edu wrote: > Is it? One of the points of contention is whether the people using > Napster buy CDs (there is actually some evidence they might buy more > than average). If Napster users normally don't buy CDs, then the RIAA > has nothing to fear from a boycott. I disagree for the simple reason that if folks want CDs and they're going to buy them (as opposed to relying solely on copies downloaded via napster or other net distribution methodology), then they're going to buy them. I could swear up and down that I would never buy another item in protest of the RIAA, but if KaTe released another album on the Columbia/Sony monstrosity, I can tell you that my ideals would be out the window and I'd be in line to make my purchase. This is not dissimilar to the silly "protest the high gas prices by not buying gas for a day" thingy from a year or two ago. As so many people pointed out, that's all fine and well if you're never going to drive again. But you are. So you'll tank up before, or you'll tank up after, but despite your one day of not buying stuff, the gas company will still get your for the x dollars worth of gas you actually used. Please don't miscontrue my disdain for Napster or the idea of a boycott of the RIAA as tacit approval of their practices. The recording industry has been evil for decades (remember Bo Diddly living almost destitute in a Florida trailer park before folks finally figured out just how much credit he deserved?). > A large enough boycott might > even motivate the RIAA to get off their "intellectual property is > property" high horse and start investigating workable solutions. This I'd love to see. But some of the majors are already starting to look at the possibility of releasing material digitially (cf EMI). What's the boycott going to do? Frankly, all of the talk of digital distribution worries me. I *want* to go out and buy CDs. I don't want crappy MP3s being my only option. I don't want music that can expire. I don't want a subscription service I need to pay for in order to be able to hear the same music over and over. I *like* physical cover art and liner notes I can pore over in much the way I'd rather read a hardbound book than an e-book. And as I've said before, I want to support artists. I'd rather do it for indie artists and I'd rather see artists make a higher percentage and not get screwed by the majors. But I'm not going to become a vigilante. What's stupid about this to me (other than the blatant hyprocrisy) is that none of this is new -- it's just that now we've got a bunch of folks whining over the restraining order against Napster. If you'd have shown me this boycott a year or two ago, I would have taken it far more seriously. jeff ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 00:59:03 -0400 From: Ted Subject: Re: Boycott central Sorry, guys. I am supplying information to the people who are interested in boycotting the RIAA, I don't plan on debating the issues any further, now is the time for action. I don't plan on changing anyone's minds on the issue at this point, however I will do the same as many people are doing right now, which is to pass along the information and news from the perspective of the Napster users. It is within everyone's rights to disagree with me, and I respect their right to be wrong, and they should respect mine. It appears that the boycott is a very large one to boot! As for the rest of the debate, time will tell if it were a wrong action. One thing's for sure, We all will know in a couple of weeks if Napster users are thieves or if they were consumers. ------------------------------ End of ecto-digest V6 #218 **************************