From: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org (ecto-digest) To: ecto-digest@smoe.org Subject: ecto-digest V5 #247 Reply-To: ecto@smoe.org Sender: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk ecto-digest Saturday, July 24 1999 Volume 05 : Number 247 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Sarah Slean & Jewel [Steve I ] Re: Amazon, CDNow, etc.. [Greg Jumper ] The Stranglers [Greg Jumper ] MILA DRUMKE: (long) concert review [sierran@earthlink.net (JoAnn Whetsell] Re: Woodstock 3 ["Michael 'Brother Jimi' Sullivan" ] Re: Woodstock 3 and summer of sam? [Mark Miazga ] Re: Bring your CD's to the Tin Angel!!! [jjh969@juno.com] Re: Woodstock 3 and summer of sam? [Dennis Breslin ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 23 Jul 1999 02:36:58 -0400 From: Steve I Subject: Sarah Slean & Jewel Jeff B. typed, in response to Sarah Slean's _Blue Parade_ track listing: >but...but...but...what happened to the new version of "I Know" you >were telling us about way back when? You said it was even better >than the version on "Universe" and I didn't believe it was possible, >so I've been quietly waiting for my opportunity, and now I find out >there IS no opportunity! Not everyone will find it better, but I found that Sarah had learned more about arranging strings, and adding more strings added some more substance and oomph to the string parts. *I* liked it more, anyways... I don't have it anymore myself though, on a recent trip I accidentally left my CD wallet on the back seat of a cab and I lost many many cherished CDs... >> When a songwriter as prolific as Sarah waits for 2 years to put out an >> album, there are inevitably disappointing omissions. > >Look, as a long-time Jewel fan, you should go re-read this and then, >well, get over it. Talk about prolific songwriters. Talk about >disappointing ommissions...like a whole album that got scrapped. And >then when we did get new material, it was horribly overproduced and >overschmaltzed. Point well-taken! I still mourn the loss of that Fritz Creek (?I think?) album; one listen to _Spirit_ convinced me that it wasn't worth plunking down my money for. Hopefully Sarah won't let the same thing happen to her when she starts releasing stuff on Atlantic. (For those who don't know, Sarah wanted to release an album independently before releasing one on a major label, so when she signed with Atlantic she stipulated that they let her release an indie album before she starts recording her Atlantic debut. _Blue Parade_ is therefore an independent release, not an Atlantic one, even though Sarah is technically on their roster.) Steve np: Sarah Slean, _Blue Parade_ (of course!) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Jul 1999 07:29:10 -0700 (PDT) From: Greg Jumper Subject: Re: Amazon, CDNow, etc.. dave writes: CDNow recently (it seems just about the time they merged with MusicBlvd) went from sending out a mailing every month or so to ever couple of days or sometimes even up to 3 in a single day.. I've been trying for several weeks to get off of their mailing list with no success.. most messages to them are simply ignored, so they won't be getting any of my business in the future. I think I've gotten maybe one unsolicited e-mail (other than the messages confirming my order, shipping, etc) from CDnow in over three years. I'm pretty sure there is a way to set your preferences so that they don't send you unwanted e-mail. I generally select the least verbose option whenever I first use one of these services. Greg ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Jul 1999 07:38:58 -0700 (PDT) From: Greg Jumper Subject: The Stranglers This question isn't particularly Ecto-ish, but someone here is bound to know. :) Back in late 1987 or possibly 1988, I heard some really interesting somewhat "prog" sounding music playing over the sound system in a restaurant. When I asked about the music, all they could tell me was that it was the Stranglers; they didn't know what album or anything else (in fact, it was probably a compilation or mix tape). I've had both Dreamtime and Aural Sculpture since then, but neither album seems like what I heard back then. Does anyone know what other Stranglers music from that era might be what I heard? How about Stranglers recommendations in general? By the way, the reason this question is on my mind now is that I recently picked up a goth-rock collection called _Dark Pleasures_ which has the Stranglers' "Golden Brown". I've been playing that song over and over and... np: "Puddle of Grace" on the Felicity soundtrack (great song!) nr: _Alpha Centauri_ now and then ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Jul 1999 08:51:21 -0700 (PDT) From: sierran@earthlink.net (JoAnn Whetsell) Subject: MILA DRUMKE: (long) concert review Yesterday, I checked my e-mail before heading off to NY to see Mila, and I found this message from Kat: >So you're both members of the Time Travellers' Association, and will be >attending the next meeting last night? ;) Huh? I was so worried that I had mixed up the date of the concert and had missed it, but fortunately (very fortunately) that was not the case. I'd never been to Arlene Grocery before, and had only heard Mila's song "Someone" in the film _Go Fish_. But after ecto discussion, I had high expectations and was really excited. And as usual, ecto recommendations did not disappoint. My sister came with me. We got there at 9, but the band before her was still playing, so we just hung out in the back, trying to breathe through all the smoke. Then after their set finished, someone mentioned that a lot of people had left and there were free tables up front. Well, there weren't, but there was lots of standing room, and we stood right up in the very front. She started out with "Someone," and I was immediately hooked. She has a gorgeous voice, and the four piece band really worked. They had a lot of energy, and I especially liked Lyris Hung (sp?) on the electric violin. I can't think of a good genre description for the music, it's really a broad range, but the whole time, I kept thinking that if I had to describe it, I would call it seductive. Not in a sexual way, but in terms of having the power to draw you in. One song was kind of ethereal, and I felt that she reminded me of a mermaid, and I couldn't think why, except maybe the pulse of the music and the way she was singing, was undulating, like waves. Anyway, I throw in my high, hearty recommendations. And of course I bought both of her cd's, which I'm going to listen to in a few minutes. - -JoAnn ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Jul 1999 23:11:10 -0700 From: "Michael 'Brother Jimi' Sullivan" Subject: Re: Woodstock 3 >There are over 40 bands playing at this year's Woodstock festival. Only >three are women -- Jewel, Sheryl Crow, and Alanis Morissette. The >original one had Melanie, Janis Joplin, Grace Slick, and Joni Mitchell, >at least, right? We've come a long way in thirty years. > >And people wonder why Sarah M. started up Lilith Fair, or why Holly Then again, you have to wonder if there would be more female artists at Woodstock if there wasn't a Lilith Fair during the same summer. Doubt it but it's a thought. - -- Michael Sullivan WeightsNet - Where the 'net pumps up mailto:sullivan@WeightsNet.com http://www.WeightsNet.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Jul 1999 16:25:09 +0100 From: Cameron_Smith@obc.co.uk Subject: Re: The Stranglers > This question isn't particularly Ecto-ish, but someone here is bound to know. :) Invariably! > Back in late 1987 or possibly 1988, I heard some really interesting somewhat ?prog? sounding music playing over the sound system in a restaurant. When I asked about the music, all they could tell me was that it was the Stranglers; they didn't know what album or anything else (in fact, it was probably a compilation or mix tape). The Stranglers' management/record companies have redefined the meaning of the word 'compilation' in the last ten years - too many obscure gigs, best-of's, greatest-hit's, rarities etc... that I'm sure they now far outnumber the official proper album releases. Most are of questionable value or worth in my experience but then again I'm no completist when these things spiral out of control. > I?ve had both Dreamtime and Aural Sculpture since then, but neither album seems like what I heard back then. Does anyone know what other Stranglers music from that era might be what I heard? How about Stranglers recommendations in general? The one over-riding factor (and an unfortunate one too) with the Stranglers' output is the inconsistency element. They started out as a pub-rock band, experimented with heroin addictions, controversy, incitement-to-riot allegations, some prison sentences here & there, and wound up being extremely tasteful in places through no fault of their own before heading off in the direction of the bland and unimaginative following a long patch of sterile output & the departure of lead vocalist Hugh Cornwell, whose rich voice was probably the most identifiable aspect of their sound. As regards recommendations, hard to say, it depends what you've already heard and what gave you a buzz. "Golden Brown" is a carreer-high for them, but the parent album, 1981's "La Folie" isn't typical of that song for the most part. 1979's "The Raven" is significantly more experimental from a guitar perspective, while 1982's "Feline" has more of a leaning towards minimalist keyboard soundscapes which may or may not be the ecto-ish thing you're looking for. For outright weirdness, there's 1980's "The Gospel According To The Meninblack", which if nothing else, surely highlights the conceptual gulf that exists between narcotic-riddled musicians and the rest of society; not ecto in the slightest, definitely otherworldly but often just unlistenable. Best option, if it's still available is the compilation (I'm going against my own grain here!) is "The Collection, 1977-1982" that was released on United Artists in the UK in 1982. On recent checking, it's still listed as available from Boxman (www.boxman.com - choose 'Other' for the regional site) for $12.41. I think I'll go back to lurk mode for another year now - I'm often too busy reading Ecto to contribute anything that hasn't already been said! Cameron G. Smith N.P. The Blue Nile - "A Walk Across The Rooftops" N.R. Neville Farmer - "XTC: Songs Stories" Business e-mail: cameron_smith@obc.co.uk Private e-mail: cam.smith@dial.pipex.com Website: Extraneous - http://www.cam.smith.dial.pipex.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Jul 1999 13:13:17 EDT From: FAMarcus@aol.com Subject: A COMMENT ABOUT HAPPY AND WXPN............again I wasn't going to go to the Happy show at the tin angel this saturday as i have had a lot of personal distractions in my life at this time. I decided to go at the last minute when drew harrington offered his tickets up due to not being able to make it. I'd like to publicly thank him here for his generosity. thank you. The reason i am mentioning all this is that i havent gotten into supporting happy like I usually when she comes to philly with at least calling WXPN and harrassing them to play her music. I just got off the phone with Helen Leicht, who in the past was her biggest supporter in philly. She was totally shocked to hear she was going to be at the tin angel. She checked her schedule sheet and didnt see her name. Now the show is tomorrow. Someone should have been on the phone to her a long time ago. And I'm not saying it should have been a fan either. Happy has to take the responsibility to promote herself. She has to pick up a phone and touch base with the people who love her. Obviously WXPN in general doesnt give a shit about her but I know helen loves her work. You can blame Sampson all you want but sometimes you have to take control of things yourself. I'd also like to tell everyone who hasn't tried Afro Celt Sound System to do so. the 2nd cd is every bit as good as the first. Play it loud and often for maximum effect. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Jul 1999 13:23:29 EDT From: FAMarcus@aol.com Subject: Re: Woodstock 3 and summer of sam? In a message dated 7/23/99 12:52:13 PM Eastern Daylight Time, JimiHendrix@woodstock.com writes: << Then again, you have to wonder if there would be more female artists at Woodstock if there wasn't a Lilith Fair during the same summer. Doubt it but it's a thought. let me play the devil's advocate here..................has anyone complained that there are no male groups at lilth fair????? on a similar matter in the movie industry..............i saw summer of sam................it was ok. i am also an italian. I personally did not care that all the italians in that movie were portrayed as assholes, except for mira sorvino. The sterotypes portrayed by Lee are ones i recognize but despise myself. My point here is that I have not heard one word outcry from the italian community. If a white director had portrayed blacks in the same exact light, with really no balance, what would the response have been from the afro american community? fred ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Jul 1999 13:40:38 -0400 From: Laura Clifford Subject: Re: Woodstock 3 and summer of sam? At 01:23 PM 7/23/99 EDT, you wrote: >on a similar matter in the movie industry..............i saw summer of >sam................it was ok. i am also an italian. I personally did not >care that all the italians in that movie were portrayed as assholes, except >for mira sorvino. The sterotypes portrayed by Lee are ones i recognize but >despise myself. My point here is that I have not heard one word outcry from >the italian community. If a white director had portrayed blacks in the same >exact light, with really no balance, what would the response have been from >the afro american community? > fred Spike Lee got all kinds of exactly this type of attention from the media, other groups (which I don't remember specifics on) and a number of critics when this film came out. Laura ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Jul 1999 17:33:33 -0400 From: Mark Miazga Subject: Re: Woodstock 3 and summer of sam? > let me play the devil's advocate here..................has anyone complained > that there are no male groups at lilth fair????? Well, I have, and I've heard many others do so. I think that after the first year, Sarah didn't need to make Lilith Fair an all-female thing. Her point had been proven. She could have added a lot of the underappreciated male singer/songwriters that would have fit into the mix well -- Peter Gabriel, Duncan Shiek, Dan Bern, Steve Poltz, Ron Sexsmith, Chris Stills, Ben Harper, Moxy Fruvous... even certain alternative rock bands like Ben Folds Five and Pearl Jam I could see fitting into the mix. I would have preferred this to the current lineup, which seems to throw together artists of any style together. I'm not going this year, and it's mainly because most of the acts are country and R&B that are coming to the dates near me. It's like they've trivialized being a woman -- I mean, that the only thing many of the artists have in common. Why can't someone just do a tour where good music is the focus, and nothing else? Have a nearly equal mix of male and female artists. I personally don't look at music as male/female, but by styles or whether I like it or not. I thought H.O.R.D.E. had potential -- and I had a lot of fun at it last year (lineup of Barenaked Ladies -- one of the best live bands in the world -- Alana Davis, Ben Harper, Sheryl Crow, Chris Stills, Huffamoose, etc), but it ended last year and really wasn't that diverse to begin with. Okay, off my soapbox now. - --Mark NP: The Murmurs, Blender - -- Mark Miazga e-mail: miazgama@pilot.msu.edu 302 Mason Hall, MSU East Lansing, MI 48825 (517) 355-2106 http://www.msu.edu/~miazgama Voicemail: (517) 355-9380 Program Coordinator of The Common Grounds Coffeehouse. Cheap Concerts every Thursday and Friday night in the basement of Akers Hall on the MSU campus. Schedule, booking, and mailing list info at: http://www.msu.edu/~cgrounds ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Jul 1999 19:01:31 -0500 From: jjh969@juno.com Subject: Re: Bring your CD's to the Tin Angel!!! Many, Many Salaams Now Coming From These Pixels Towards The General Direction Of Your Face. >From A Very Happy John. On Fri, 23 Jul 1999 13:09:14 -0400 writes: >Hey John; > >Looks like you'll be able to pick up on the Project Lo >stuff............ > >Rich >---------------------- Forwarded by Rich W. Rapp/WCR/Effem on 07/23/99 >01:08 PM --------------------------- > > >From: LOLOREC on 07/23/99 04:57 PM >To: Rich W. Rapp/WCR/Effem >cc: >Subject: Re: Bring your CD's to the Tin Angel!!! > > > > >Hey, >Thanks. We will have tons of cds there! >See ya, >Bon > > ___________________________________________________________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Jul 1999 23:05:54 -0400 From: Dennis Breslin Subject: Re: Woodstock 3 and summer of sam? FAMarcus@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 7/23/99 12:52:13 PM Eastern Daylight Time, > JimiHendrix@woodstock.com writes: > > << Then again, you have to wonder if there would be more female artists > at Woodstock if there wasn't a Lilith Fair during the same summer. > Doubt it but it's a thought. > > let me play the devil's advocate here..................has anyone complained > that there are no male groups at lilth fair????? > on a similar matter in the movie industry..............i saw summer of > sam................it was ok. i am also an italian. I personally did not > care that all the italians in that movie were portrayed as assholes, except > for mira sorvino. The sterotypes portrayed by Lee are ones i recognize but > despise myself. My point here is that I have not heard one word outcry from > the italian community. If a white director had portrayed blacks in the same > exact light, with really no balance, what would the response have been from > the afro american community? > fred Oy...Mebbe five years or more lurking here and this what moves me to hit the reply button? Look, this is and isn't the place to argue this. I've enjoyed Ecto precisely because it has highlighted women who have generally experience additional difficulties in pursuing their music or careers or recording contracts or distribution or what have you precisely because they are women. It has been a singular pleasure to witness from afar the commercial success of some of these artists, eg. Tori Amos or Sarah M. In some small way a lot of the regulars on this list are due credit for championing women making music and giving these artists a wider hearing. In some larger way, a list like Ecto or a festival like Lillith Fair is a reflection of the power and legitimacy of these women making music. The lineup for this so-called Woodstock festival is also a measure of how little things have changed. Jewel, Morrisette, and Crow fulfill the quota for music biz suits and, perhaps, for many folks out in the audience. To put a less than fine point on it, thats sexism, plain and simple, however much that word's impact has been dulled. Its freakin shameful but so many people are dulled to this and the corporatization of it all that I feel a wee bit sanguine about it all. As for Lee's film, well he's taking heat for his depiction. This issue is part of the same beast. Too bad for Spike Lee - every freakin' white kid or white-ethnic can cry foul for the nasty portrayal of New York Italian-American culture. I dunno. Its rare that a different voice, a different perspective, can work its way through to a broad audience. How many white folks felt uneasy at Speilberg's treatment of the Color Purple or Amistad? As the old saying goes, not all oppressions are equal... Dennis Breslin ------------------------------ End of ecto-digest V5 #247 **************************