From: owner-ecto-digest To: ecto-digest@ns2.rutgers.edu Subject: ecto-digest V2 #329 Reply-To: ecto@nsmx.rutgers.edu Errors-To: owner-ecto-digest Precedence: bulk ecto-digest Wednesday, 3 January 1996 Volume 02 : Number 329 The Ecto digest is now being generated automatically. Please send problems and questions to: ecto-owner@nsmx.rutgers.edu. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: damon harper Date: Wed, 03 Jan 1996 00:38:03 -0800 Subject: Re: The Return Of The Replies meth mentioned (and charly said something similar :): >Damon called: > >>i'm doing a bit of work on the ectophiles' guide web pages, and want to >>expand, and expand on, neile's categorisation system. so far we have the >>following categories: > >Why have categories at all? Just do it alphabetically and leave it at that. >"Good Music" is all the categorization we need here. > >One of these millenia, woj and I are going to have a (really cool ;) record >store. All of the albums will be filed alphabetically by artist, and there >will be no subcategorization whatsoever. Looking for B.B. King? Check "K". >King Crimson? "K" again. All these artificial categories are ridiculous, >insho... as evidenced by the occasionally bizarre places Happy's albums >have been filed so far. If you're looking for something, you should be able >to find it, dammit. And if you're just browsing around, you might as well >have the opportunity to discover something you never may have thought of >otherwise. that sounds like a great idea to me :) especially if you *know* what you're looking for. i, and i think neile too, agree with you wholeheartedly about the categorisation thing, but in this case i think it's *good*, if a bit haphazard. the music represented in the guide is artists/bands people on ecto have *discussed*, and you'll have to admit that every one of us certainly does *not* like everything every other one of us likes. so there *is* a wide range of music described, and not all of it will be "good" for everyone. secondly, the guide is primarily a place for people to find new artists, not to browse entries on the ones they already know they like. so, while categorisation in a record store where it serves little purpose (i mean, would you walk into a record store and buy something just because it was filed under "pop"? i think not!!! ;), is a waste of time, but categorisation in the guide will help somewhat, since the "pop" music described there will generally be ecto-pop, or at least described with an ecto spin on it, and therefore more closely knit than "pop" in a music store... though categories are rather loose and eminently breakable, all the music described is of some interest to some subset of ectophiles, and these categories are the best we can do to try to narrow the choices down a tiny bit, so that someone who likes the synth-ey side of ecto, for instance, can avoid the folk-ey side, and vice versa. they're far from absolute, and probably won't be one hundred percent accurate all the time, but they make for a good starting place. *whew*! i hope that made some sense, and neile, i hope i described the idea accurately enough :) >Sage elucidated: > >>4. Dar Williams - "This Is Not The House That Pain Built" >>I admit to not being very fond of most of the songs on The Honesty >>Room (I almost never like 'fast' songs and most of these are pretty >>boppy) > >Yeah, I'm agraid I have to join in the "huh?" chorus on this one. "Boppy"?!? teehee... yeah, sage, c'mon... explain this to us! we're waiting :) i'm also one of the ones with a puzzled look on his face. damon _/\_ Damon_Harper@mindlink.bc.ca __\ /__ "I'm proud to be a banker... Vancouver, BC, CANADA \ / Because I get to play with |/||\| other people's money!" http://www.dfw.net/~soulmate/damon/paukarut.html - Arrogant Worms ------------------------------ From: damon harper Date: Wed, 03 Jan 1996 01:09:13 -0800 Subject: mature, immature... it can happen to anyone i said: >alanis morissette, _jagged little pill_ > a lot of people accuse this album of being mature, while a lot of other >people laud it as an extremely mature piece of work. this confuses me. ...but what *really* confuses me is how i managed to do that! :) add an "im" to the beginning of that first "mature" and there you have it. damon _/\_ Damon_Harper@mindlink.bc.ca __\ /__ "I'm proud to be a banker... Vancouver, BC, CANADA \ / Because I get to play with |/||\| other people's money!" http://www.dfw.net/~soulmate/damon/paukarut.html - Arrogant Worms ------------------------------ From: Marion Kippers Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 11:18:31 +0100 Subject: RE: Sinead & MC Lyte Hi all, First, a Happy New Year to all of you! May it bring you all that you hope for! :-) Aaron wrote: >I'm fairly certain there was a video for "i want your (hands >on me)" from THE LION AND THE COBRA. 'course, I'm also >convinced said video featured a rap by MC Lyte, and I've >never seen confirmation of the existence of such a remix, so >YMMV. I don't know about video's, but there was a single (7") for "I want your (hands on me)" that did feature MC Lyte. At least over here in Europe, in 1988. Where "Troy" was Sinead's first single, BTW. Talk about impressive debuts! I looked for confirmation on the Web and found a (the?) Sinead O'Connor homepage with an extensive discography, where the remix is mentioned also (only the 7"). It's on: http://www.engr.ukans.edu/~jrussell/music/sinead/sinead.html Best wishes, Marion ______________________________________________________________ Marion Kippers Wolters Kluwer Academic Publishers Automation Department Dordrecht, The Netherlands Marion.Kippers@wkap.nl "Leave the shadows dancing..." (OP) ______________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ From: ptv@rtp.scm-metals.com (Patrick Varker) Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 07:50:00 -0500 Subject: New Tori First off, Happy New Year everyone. I've a feeling 1996 is going to be a great year. I'm set to see Alanis Morissette on Jan.27 and Ani DeFranco the first week of Feb.(both shows in Raleigh,N.C.). Like that's not enough I got my first new Tori music yesterday. It's her domestic release of Caught A Lite Sneeze,they are calling it a CD5 maxi single. The other four songs are called silly songs and include This Old Man, and Graveyard. I,ll try to give a more detailed review later if no one beats me to it,just wanted to let everyone know it's out there. Patrick ------------------------------ From: Michael Colford Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 07:49:41 -0500 (EST) Subject: Lolita Pop Hi everyone, I was listening to an old compilation tape I made in the mid-80's, and I came across a song by Lolita Pop. Any of you Scandinavian ectophiles (or anyone else) know what became of them? I have 2 albums, and I'm just curious. I love trying to find out to bands/ artists who have seemingly disappeared from the face of the earth. On a related note, also mid-80's, does anyone know what happened to Sandy Stewart or David Munday? I have Sandy's album, Cat Dancers, and Blue Yonder's album. Did they ever do anything else either singly or together? (I know about Sandy all over Stevie Nicks' second album.) Thanks! michael -------------------------------------------------------------------- Michael Colford | Reading Public Library | Reading, Massachusetts colford@noble.mass.edu | *North of Boston Library Exchange* -------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ From: Paul Davidsson Date: Wed, 3 Jan 96 14:36 MET Subject: Re: Lolita Pop Michael Colford wrote: > I was listening to an old compilation tape I made in the mid-80's, > and I came across a song by Lolita Pop. Any of you Scandinavian > ectophiles (or anyone else) know what became of them? I have 2 > albums, and I'm just curious. Lolita Pop split up about five years ago. Their (female) singer Karin Wistrand made a solo-album (in Swedish) a couple of years ago. The album didn't achieve any commercial or artistical (IMHO) success. Lolita Pop, on the other hand, made some great albums in the 80's. During the first 4 they were singing in Swedish and they then made 3 English albums. /Paul Davidsson ------------------------------ From: "Matt Bittner" Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 08:19:05 -0500 Subject: Re: Okay okay, here's mine On 2 Jan 96 at 22:39,From: THE OLIVE-LOAF VIGILANTE typed diligently: > Alanis Morrisette > - -- I'm sorry, but somebody needs to slap her. ROTFL!!!! Hey, she's got a couple of okay songs, but what's all the hype about? I bought JLP for my sister (since she really likes it) over Turkey Day, and had a chance to listen to it in its entirety, and found it - let's say, lacking. Like I said, a couple of OK songs, but the rest fall flat. I also wanted to point out that thanks to Meth, I picked up The Nields BotC, and - well - you can read the review in my previous post. A definite band to check out. Luckily, as Nan Vernon is growing "off" me, The Nields are growing "on". Hmm... I'm sure some English teacher somewhere is fretting over that previous sentence. Matt - -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ Matthew Bittner WW1 Modeler, ecto subscriber, semi-new dad, meba@cso.com PowerBuilder developer; Omaha, Nebraska Disclaimer: opinions expressed by me are my responsibility only. "You cannot make anything foolproof, because the fools are so ingenious." - Christian Walters - -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ ------------------------------ From: "Donahue, Jim" Date: Wed, 03 Jan 96 09:56:43 EST Subject: Aimee Mann The name of the Nilsson tribute album on which Aimee Mann appears (the one Meridith Tarr mentioned) is "For the Love of Harry: Everybody Sings Nilsson" (not "I'm With Harry"). Mann covers "One." Any closet Nilsson fans (surely I'm not the only one???) should get the recently released RCA Nilsson reissues-- especially "Pandemonioum Shadow Show" (the Beatles' favorite album--really) and "Aerial Ballet." Forget the annoying hits (Without You, Coconut)--the man was an AMAZING pop songwriter and vocalist. ------------------------------ From: gzverev@RPC.glas.apc.org (Russian Privatization Center) Date: Wed, 03 Jan 96 17:57:01 Subject: Re[6]: My Top 10 Paul Cohen replied: > Oh you are oh so wrong. There is always new music and new bands to > discover. For instance, right now I'm listening to my first Clannad albums. Ariel Brennan disagreed: > Oh, wow, I really, strongly disagree. You can never run out of music to > discover. There's always something new out there to find. They'll be new > artists who grab your attention, old music you didn't notice existed until > this moment, stuff you've heard before but didn't like the first time, you > name it. Go to any music newsgroup and ask for recommendations, and you'll > get TONS of stuff you've never heard of, much less heard. I didn't say there is nothing to discover after some age or number of listenings. I just said that percent of things in music that getting you high is getting lower and lower. The trick is very simple: there are more and more music, you have less and less time. People who can advice also pick up music on random basis. In result we have more and more fans of rare/local/ nobody-else-heard stuff. Our parents could say that they grew up on the same music (sort of education). We can't. How about our children? It's not bad and not good. It's different as world before Internet and after. And while our society unable to create a method to link our brain to the Net and search music by music (*not by its titles!*) you have less and less chances to find *THE* band you were looking for that long..... Paul Cohen cont'd: > I'm working on the 'puter, the music is always blasting. At work, I curtail > what I bring in to eliminate too many strange looks, but people are usually > amazed at all the music I bring in that they've never heard of and like. Ariel Brennan added: > Well, my tastes certainly aren't compatible with anyone at all I know. > There are some overlaps, but only because I introduced people to what I > love. Even so, no one I know likes more than one or two of the things I > like, and I never like ANYTHING anyone else likes. But what does that > matter? Why should that infringe on your discoveries? Same with me. People think I'm nuts having ethno, punk, jazz and pop on the same shelf. I wanted to say since you don't have anyone around to ask (whose tastes are compatible) you have to go through more and more new garbage, or just lurk here and wait anything mentioned here appears in used store to get a brief listen. Robert Lovejoy advised: > learn! To me, it's the opposite: I find more and more to discover in music, > and I love to hear new bands apply their spin on the old matrix! Gleb, it > sounds as if you are stagnating somewhat. I know a lot of old coots my age > who only listen to music that defined what they considered the best times of > their life. It's as if they calcified, they chose to stop growing. No. I'm not stopping to grow. I also love to hear that new spin, but I get their idea before they finished to explain their intro. I always catch myself on how I would did this or that while I'm listening as everyone I suspect, and disagreements often too high to continue listening. > I deeply hope you reopen yourself to the wonder and mystery of life and > music. Don't worry about anyone else's taste in music; we are all > different. Find what moves you and enjoy it. And if you can find nothing > that moves you in music, ask yourself what things in life give you awe and > goosebumps, and develop those feelings! > > Hoping I'm not out of line, Thanks for kind comments - frosty and gloomy Moscow weather pulls out windsurfing images on my wallpaper. Ariel Brennan con'd: > watching MTV and VH1 (or MuchMusic, I'd guess, or any other music channel) > you'll occasionally find something interesting and powerful. Or maybe > suddenly, something will click with you... something of a genre you'd never > been interested in before. Well, I have passed and grabbed almost all genres. I still have compilations on open reels with Bachman Turner Overdrive, Thin Lizzy, Lisa DalBello, whatever. When I was devoted british electro-new-wave-ska-reggae fan in early 80's I thought it is for the rest of my life. Indeed - I got about 50 albums from that era that shifted my mindset - Japan's 'Tin Drum', Kate's 'Dreaming', Soft Cell, Tuxedomoon, Bad Manners, Siouxie, Police, Martha and the Muffins, too long to list - almost everything from indie charts. Then I opened jazz and world music. But my point here is that it is too hard for me to find mix of everything I like by now in one band or album... Matt Bittner added: > And, if the current crop of "commercial" music isn't doing anything, > then check out your local indie scene! Russian music got a lot of development recent two years. It's amazing to discover new bands who create something totally new. Unfortunately they do not have enough money to release CDs, they do not get enough promotion and I do not have enough time even do discover new clubs! So that option theoretically exists, but in fact it turns easier to order a CD somewhere from cyberspace. > I agree with Robert. If music is not your cup of English Breakfast, > then understand what it, and develop it to its fullest. Life is too > short to sit, surfin' the TV. Enjoy life. And woj supported a bit: > i find that i go through mood swings: sometimes, i feel like there is > no music that can completely change my world me like KaTe did in 1985. > then, out of nowhere, comes some song or band that just blows my brains > to saturn and back via alpha centuari. Fortunately, or unfortunately music *is* my cup, or I would say the whole breakfast and dinner and there is nothing to do about that. I have disagreement with myself. I'm keeping expect same storm of feelings from new music as I used to have 15 years ago! Then, Robert Lovejoy noted: > So if vinyl is making a comeback of sorts, I hope I can avoid it. Or maybe > I can jump ahead of the curve and pick up an Edison Cylander machine before > they become trendy again! Or open-reel tape recorders! It's so much fun to watch a tape running! Happy New Eyes! Gleb ------------------------------ From: Emmy May Lombaerts Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 17:03:21 +0100 (MET) Subject: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Sin=E9ad?= Meredith wrote: =20 > Again, I'm going to join in the chorus: run, don't walk to your nearest >record emporium and get this album. It's one of the best ever, period. = Such >a shame that everything Sinead's done since then has really sucked. :( And >"Troy" is really a killer, even after all these years... I have to agree that I'm not nearly as fond of Sin=E9ad's other albums as I am of "The Lion And The Cobra".. It's very powerful, very moving, and the way she uses her voice is just superb. The album also sounds raw and unpolished, and although the others'lyrics are very personal too, still, IMHO, they sound a little too 'over-produced'.. "The Lion And The Cobra" has a very honest, live-sound to it.. .=20 =20 >Well, there was a video for "I Want Your (Hands On Me)", and one for >"Mandinka", as well. As far as I know those were the only two videos >made for that album.=20 If I'm not mistaken, there's a video for "Troy" as well.. Or at least I think I spotted it one day on Super Channel's "On The Air". Anyone here remember that show? =20 Emmy.=20 Emmy May Lombaerts lombaeg@mail.interpac.be http://www.ping.be/~ping2242/emmy.html o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o 'This is not a conclusion, not a revolution, just a little confusion' Tori Amos o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o =20 =20 ------------------------------ From: Neile Graham Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 08:34:44 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: The Return Of The Replies > meth mentioned (and charly said something similar re: the Guide > >Why have categories at all? Just do it alphabetically and leave it at that. > >"Good Music" is all the categorization we need here. > store... though categories are rather loose and eminently breakable, all the > music described is of some interest to some subset of ectophiles, and these > categories are the best we can do to try to narrow the choices down a tiny > bit, so that someone who likes the synth-ey side of ecto, for instance, can > avoid the folk-ey side, and vice versa. they're far from absolute, and > probably won't be one hundred percent accurate all the time, but they make > for a good starting place. Yes--this is exactly why we're bothering with this. If you like an artist, and see that we categorize her on the "alternative pop" and the "folk" lists you get an idea of what we think the person is like and other people that fall in the same rough area--so you can explore further. A good example is Ana Countinho because few of you will have heard of her. She's listed in the "evocative" and the "folk" listings. The evocative list includes her with artists like Haris Alexiou and Susan Court and eventually Tori Amos, Kate Bush, etc. The folk list includes her with An Evening in Plaid and Joan Baez and eventually people like Joni Mitchell, etc. so you get a feel for both her music and other people you might be interested in whose music is a little "like" hers. - --Neile ------------------------------ From: hobo@ralip.se (Håkan Bårman) Date: Wed, 03 Jan 1996 17:10:51 EST Subject: Re: Lolita Pop Paul Davidsson wrote: >Michael Colford wrote: >> I was listening to an old compilation tape I made in the mid-80's, >> and I came across a song by Lolita Pop. Any of you Scandinavian >> ectophiles (or anyone else) know what became of them? I have 2 >> albums, and I'm just curious. > >Lolita Pop split up about five years ago. Their (female) singer Karin >Wistrand made a solo-album (in Swedish) a couple of years ago. The album >didn't achieve any commercial or artistical (IMHO) success. YMMV :-), Lolita Pop was much better though, especially live. >Lolita Pop, >on the other hand, made some great albums in the 80's. During the first 4 >they were singing in Swedish and they then made 3 English albums. And there was a "greatest hits" album released (94 or 95?) with both Swedish and English lyrics. The name of the album may have been "Regn av dagar"? /Håkan ------------------------------ From: ariel_b@pipeline.com (Ariel Brennan) Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 12:08:07 -0500 Subject: Re: The Return Of The Replies On Jan 02, 1996 22:41:03, 'THE OLIVE-LOAF VIGILANTE ' wrote: >Why have categories at all? Just do it alphabetically and leave it at that. >"Good Music" is all the categorization we need here. I agree! ;> I was wondering about that myself. >>6. Jonatha Brooke And The Story - Plumb >Hmmm. I think it's a nice album, but doesn't hold a candle to _Grace In >Gravity_, the debut album that blows everything else either Jonatha or >Jennifer have done since completely out of the water. The title track >gives me the chills every time I hear it... Wouldn't know. I'm planning to get that album eventually though! heh. :) >>3. Melissa Ferrick - "Willing To Wait >> Take Ani Difranco's guitar, cross it with Alanis Morissette's voice, and >>Dar Williams' accent, and you get a guitaring playing, great voiced sack of >>nothing. > >Take out the unfortunate comparision to Alanis Morrisette, and you get >something sort of accurate. :) I think Melissa Ferrick sounds most like >Amy Ray at points, myself... I have no idea who Amy Ray is, so I can't say much to that, BUT, I can testify to the resemblence between Ferrick and Morissette's voices. I've played JLP and WTW to a few people, and they generally had no idea the vocalists were different people. >>Aural Gratification Vol 1 and 2 >> TOWER had this! Woo hoo! Well, it's interesting, to say the least. I >>can't say I'll be listening to it all that much, but it's good background >>music at least. > >Where did they have them filed? We've been trying to find #2 (that >categorization thing again...). Well, um, I don't know. I was with someone else, and they found it for me. But, it was on the 72nd street Tower near HMV, and it apparently had it's own "Aural Gratification" divider. The guy who found them for me said they only had one copy of each though. ;/ >>XTC A Testimonial Dinner >> After hearing all the raves about Sarah M's version of "Dear God", I >>had to listen to this at Tower on the station. Excellent tribute album! >>That good tribute album thing going around needs this thrown on it. I could >>actually listen to this tribute album relatively often. Sarah's Dear God is >>the best of the bunch, but I also love They Might Be Giants' 25 O'clock. >>I'm unfamiliar with XTC themselves, but this tribute made me want to buy >>their stuff. ;> > >Please do. With the exception of "Dear God", the originals are much, much >better. :) The liner notes defining them a punk kind of scares me. ;> Re: The Lion And The Cobra >Amen. Again, I'm going to join in the chorus: run, don't walk to your nearest >record emporium and get this album. Would, if I weren't deathly sick in the middle of a snowstorm. Poo. :/ >Aimee Mann put out an incredible solo album in 1993 called _Whatever_. Yah, 'twas a good album... >I can't remember which record label she >finally landed on, but you should be able to find it, since I see you're in >Belgium. I don't think it's nearly as good as _Whatever_, but that's just >me. Geffen, wasn't it? Ariel - -- "Where are the bones on that one?" - Joan Osborne ------------------------------ From: Yngve Hauge Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 18:59:04 +0100 (MET) Subject: Re: Muses video on the web (fwd) On Tue, 2 Jan 1996 jeffy@wam.umd.edu wrote: > > > > Yngve wrote: > > >Saw this on Subbacultcha ... might interest someone around here :) > > > > > >---------- Forwarded message ---------- > >Date: Fri, 29 Dec 1995 13:25:01 -0500 > >From: Emily Arkin > >To: subbacultcha@cs.mcgill.ca > >Subject: Muses video on the web > [...] > > And this made me curious. Anybody know what "Subbacultcha" is, meaning its > derivation? I'm familiar with the term from a cool Pixies song (on _Trompe > Le Monde_ as I recall), and was wondering if the mailing list has taken its > name from the Pixies song or if the Pixies and the mailing list got it from > somewhere else.. Subbacultcha is the mailinglist for Pixies (I'm no fan of theirs :) Throwing Muses Belly Breeders Amps Kristin Hersh I'm on it cause of the last 5 :) You are right about the derivation of the name. It is taken from the album _Trompe Le Monde_. hugs, ________________________________________________________________ Yngve Hauge | __ ___ __ | | _ www: http://ulke.himolde.no/~yngveh/ |-- | | | ||-- |_||| |_ Irc-nick: One Alien |__ |__ | |__|| | |||_|_ ------------------------------ From: VNozick@tribune.com Date: Wed, 3 Jan 1996 11:58:22 -0800 Subject: Re[2]: Okay okay, here's mine Matt Bittner said: typed diligently: >> Alanis Morrisette >> - -- I'm sorry, but somebody needs to slap her. >ROTFL!!!! Hey, she's got a couple of okay songs, but what's all the >hype about? I bought JLP for my sister (since she really likes it) >over Turkey Day, and had a chance to listen to it in its entirety, >and found it - let's say, lacking. Like I said, a couple of OK >songs, but the rest fall flat. I, too, can't really stand her. Here's my theory: It's no accident that AM is signed to Madonna's label. Neither knows the first thing about subtlety, that little thing that can change music from a piece of dreck to a masterpiece. Compare AM's anger to Tori's anger. They both have a lot of rage, but Tori crafts hers in smooth, calm tones. Tori doesn't have to scream to get her point across -- instead she writes "Me and a Gun." Madonna and AM are both over-the- top, albeit with different perspectives. AM is acting like the angry victim; Madonna is the sexqueen. I don't deny the fact that AM may have been seriously hurt in life. However, AM loses all credibility as a serious musician by taking the easy road in expressing herself. She comes across as pissed off, true, but not with any depth. Plus, AM's music has no rhythm or flow. Every time I hear "You Oughta Know," I'm jarred by the dissonant transition from verse to chorus. It's like she wrote the song with two different, totally incompatible, styles. ==> Valerie ------------------------------ End of ecto-digest V2 #329 ************************** ======================================================================== Please send any questions or comments about the list to ecto-owner@nsmx.rutgers.edu