Errors-To: owner-ecto@ns1.rutgers.edu Reply-To: ecto@ns1.rutgers.edu Sender: ecto@ns1.rutgers.edu From: ecto@ns1.rutgers.edu To: ecto-request@ns1.rutgers.edu Bcc: ecto-digest-outbound@ns1.rutgers.edu Subject: ecto #375 ecto, Number 375 Sunday, 29 November 1992 Today's Topics: *-----------------* FAQ Dracula Re: NEXP & SV Re: all things Loreena Re: Dracula and Policemen's other balls Re: NEXP Re: Fluff (as in snow) (tm) Re: SV ======================================================================== From: Martin Dougiamas Subject: FAQ Date: Sun, 29 Nov 1992 16:10:09 +0800 (WST) About the FAQ,... it needs a few things added to bring it closer to date: a) the new album Equipoise and its release date of about February '93. b) price of postage for 4 CDs to Australia is about $17US. (!) c) my "Ecto-file" : the list of names and addresses and passions of participating ectophiles, for ectophiles to find each other in RL. (BTW, I'll post the latest version soon) Martin -- ,------------------------------------+----------------------------. ~ _ . | At first there was nothing. | Martin Dougiamas. |~ _r' Ll\ ~ | Then god said "Let there be light!"| martin@cs.curtin.edu.au | | \ ~ | Then there was still nothing. | Curtin University | \ ._ / | But you could *see* it. | Perth, Western Australia --+->x~ `-' ~ `====================================+============================' ~ V ~ ======================================================================== Date: Sun, 29 Nov 92 4:16:14 EST From: WretchAwry Subject: Re: FAQ > About the FAQ,... it needs a few things added to bring it closer to date: > > a) the new album Equipoise and its release date of about February '93. > b) price of postage for 4 CDs to Australia is about $17US. (!) > c) my "Ecto-file" : the list of names and addresses and passions of > participating ectophiles, for ectophiles to find each other in RL. > (BTW, I'll post the latest version soon) > > Martin Thanks Martin! I went hunting for Greg's version but couldn't find it and didn't feel like messing around with ftp. I got mine and made some changes in a hurry, knowing I was missing some things. I'll incorporate these things, then send the version to Jessica for the ftp site. If anyone else has any comments, suggestions or additions, please let me know. If any newcomers have any questions that should be in the FAQ, please write me. Vickie ======================================================================== From: drk@leland.stanford.edu Subject: Dracula Date: Sun, 29 Nov 92 11:57:12 PST Greetings Ectophiles, I feel so strongly about Coppola's _Dracula_ that I have to disagree publicly with Vickie's review. This isn't a flame, of course, I just thought that _Dracula_ was a very *poor* movie. A complete waste of time and money, even at matinee prices. I haven't been this dissapointed since _Batman Returns_. :-( Why did I think that _Dracula_ sucks? <--(couldn't resist that awful pun) First and foremost, it wasn't scary. Not even a little. I wasn't even slightly nervous. Above all else, Dracula *must* give the audience some serious creeps. Coppola's version doesn't even come close. Second, the plot was confusing in the first half and predictable in the last half. I haven't read the original book, so I'm not sure who's fault this is. I consider myself to be reasonably intelligent, but it took me about an hour before I was certain that the old count and the young count were one and the same person (this isn't a spoiler, btw). Third, Winona Ryder's performance was embarassingly bad. I'm a fan of Ms. Ryder and thoroughly enjoyed her in _Heathers_, _Mermaids_ and _Scissorhands_. She is totally unconvincing in _Dracula_. To her credit though, she is the only female in the movie who doesn't bare her breasts. _Dracula_ is a beautiful-looking movie, but I find that all style and no substance just leaves me feeling empty. -- David. p.s. this is only my $0.02. Some of my friends really liked it. ======================================================================== Subject: Re: NEXP & SV Date: Sun, 29 Nov 92 17:02:15 -0500 From: jeffy@syrinx.umd.edu Vickie sez, regarding _Northern Exposure_: >Tape it, because I wish we had taped it from the beginning. Oh goody, I'm *not* the only weird one. I have all of the second season but one episone on tape, as well as all but one of the current season. I think I only have one or two shows from the first, abbreviated season. I do know that I've _seen_ every episode aired so far. It's the one TV thing I have in common with my parents. >pps, just the other night, I realized what "Bad Wisdom" is about. Was >this song discussed earlier? I remember Alan raved about this song >(I agree!) and I remember the lyrics to "Blood Makes Noise" and, >more recently, "As Girls Go" being discussed. No, "Bad Wisdom" hasn't been discussed yet. I gather from your contextual mention of "Blood Makes Noise" and "As Girls Go" that you decided that "BW" is about homosexuality? I go through phases where I think that's what it's about and where I don't. Certainly many of the lyrics are fitting to someone realizing they're gay and coming out of the closet ("Mother your eyes have gone suddenly cold and it wasn't what I was expecting / once I did think that I'd find comfort there and instead you've gone cold and suspecting" or "Mother you've taught me the laws are so fine if I'm good then I will be protected / I've fallen through the cracks and there's no getting back and I'll never trust whoever gets elected") On the other hand, the lyrics could almost as easily (if not more so) apply to a single (young) mother. The first lyric quoted above applies just as validly. But even more so is the first verse: "Mother the doctor knows something is wrong 'cause my body has strange information / he's looked in my eyes and knows I'm not a child but he doesn't dare ask the right question." Thoughts? >I'm still not sure if this is my favorite SV album. I have a *very* >large soft spot for _Solitude Standing_, mainly because of that song, >and "In the Eye." Interesting--my soft spot is for _Suzanne Vega_. The quirkiness of some of the songs is wonderful and like nothing else in my collection, and the power of other songs (most notably "The Queen and the Soldier") are phenomenal. Hmmm. I think I'd like to hear Loreena McKennitt cover "The Queen and the Soldier." Jeff ======================================================================== Subject: Re: all things Date: Sun, 29 Nov 92 17:19:42 -0500 From: jeffy@syrinx.umd.edu Steve wrote, a couple of days ago: >I also heard Suzanne Vega's "The Queen >and the Soldier" (OK, but didn't grab me at the time) Musically it's not overly exciting. But the lyrics are brilliantly depressing and worth learning (or at least reading) >and had a near-religious experience listening to Enya's "Caribbean Blue" [...] >The last two I have sworn to buy (but not gone out for yet) are >_Sheperd Moons_ [...] To throw in my personal two cents, which may be completely irrelevant to you, _Shepherd Moons_ is a waste of money. "Caribbean Blue" is quite probably my favorite Enya song. I get that same near-religious tingly feeling that you described when I listen to it--especially on good 'phones in a dark room, REALLY LOUD. But I think the only other really good track on the album is "Book of Days" (aka "Far and Away", which was the same track with English lyrics as used on the soundtrack of the movie). There are a couple of moderately good tracks ("Angeles" and "Ebudae" spring to mind). But where I pull out either _Enya_ or _Watermark_ once every week or three, I virtually never listen to _Shepherd Moons_. It's the sort of thing where I'd want a tape of the album and the CD singles of the two songs I like (in fact, both of the songs I mentioned *were* released as singles, and "Angeles", which I mostly like, is a b-side on one!) I've been an Enya fan since early '89 and would have bought _Shepherd Moons_ no matter what. But I was particularly excited because I'd heard "Caribbean Blue" on the radio and to me it bode well. I was very disappointed. Your mileage may vary. >I'm anxiously awaiting _More Paint_ -- especially since it needs >a much better title than that. By now I'm sure you've read Martin's post that the album is to be called _Equipoise_. For those interested, the word means "evenly balanced" or "even distribution of weight." However, it's often used (by the few people who use it...;-) to describe a state in which the two ends or sides of a thing are balanced--figuratively applied to moral, social, or political interests or forces. (courtesy of Webster's Unabridged). Knowing Our Happy, this probably applies to the moral/political edges of this definition. Particularly in the context of songs like "He Will Come" / "The Flight." Jeff (who wonders what the cover will look like--more Happy art or another photo?) ======================================================================== Date: Sun, 29 Nov 92 17:25:43 CST From: kIrI Subject: Loreena Hi all! Back from a great vacation in Memphis - where it actually snowed! :( Just wanted to write a quick note to tell you about a show Court and I watched over break. It was The Learning Channels show called Beliefs. This particular one dealt with Women and Witchcraft and was produced by some Canadian film company. The show was quite good in itself featuring several prominant pagan figures (margot adler, starhawk etc) for those familiar with these women. Anyway Loreena's music was used as the shows background music. There were several songs from what I guess is her first album - neither of us recognized them, and several songs from the Visit. It was an interesting place to find her music though, and I don't know if has been mentioned here or elsewhere. If you get the o opportunity to see the show you shouldn't miss it. If there are any art buffs out there we are also wondering about a painting/fresco?? that was displayed in the film. It was a painting of the burning of Joan of Arc. Neither of us had seen it before, and it's simply an amazing work - very powerful, very disturbing. Does anyone know about this work?? Court lent me the soundtrack to the film Gothic. Many of you have probably heard it before, since the soundtrack was written and produced by Thomas Dolby. It's an incredible tape. Court says the movie is wonderful too, but I haven't had the opportunity to rent it yet. It's well worth a listen if you find it though. Guess that's about it! Hope everyone had a wondy Turkey day! kIrI **************************************************** * Kiri Hargie byhargie@vm.cc.olemiss.edu * * byhargie@umsvm * * A ni nach cluinn cluas cha ghluais cridhe * **************************************************** ======================================================================== Subject: Re: Dracula Date: Sun, 29 Nov 92 20:43:00 -0500 From: jeffy@syrinx.umd.edu >I haven't been this dissapointed since _Batman Returns_. :-( I liked _Batman Returns_ more than _Batman_. The second movie was hysterical--providing you have an appropriately dark sense of humor. >First and foremost, it wasn't scary. Not even a little. I wasn't even >slightly nervous. The way I see it, it's hard to make a scary Dracula movie, because you know he's going to die at the end. He pretty much has to. So any 'fright' has to come through suspense, and I think _D_ had a fair amount. Certainly nothing like _Silence of the Lambs_ which was one of the most suspenseful movies I've ever seen, but it was still pretty good. One good example is near the end when the sun is sinking over Transylvania and everyone's racing toward Dracula's castle. The other thing to remember is that _D_ was meant as a _romance_, not a horror story (in the now expected sense; I _would_ however argue that from a Victorian p.o.v it is most definitely a horror story. It deals with such social taboos as blatant sex (remember, this is a society that produced the expression "drumstick" to avoid mentioning a chicken leg) and loss of decorum/control). And from the romance angle I think it worked particularly well. >Above all else, Dracula *must* give the audience some >serious creeps. Everyone gets creeps different ways. >Second, the plot was confusing in the first half and predictable in the >last half. I haven't read the original book, so I'm not sure who's fault >this is. I haven't read the book either and I didn't find it at all confusing. >I consider myself to be reasonably intelligent, but it took me >about an hour before I was certain that the old count and the young count >were one and the same person (this isn't a spoiler, btw). You're kidding, right? Perhaps it's time to re-evaluate your intelligence. >Third, Winona Ryder's performance was embarassingly bad. I'm a fan of >Ms. Ryder and thoroughly enjoyed her in _Heathers_, _Mermaids_ and >_Scissorhands_. She is totally unconvincing in _Dracula_. Again, I disagree. Keanu Reeves was embarassingly bad. His accent was a disgrace, and his acting left a lot to be desired. The whole thing was reminescent of his role in _Dangerous Liasons_, which I found equally poor. I feel bad typecasting him as the surfer-dude-teenager-rebel type, but the only roles he seems to have excelled in were the two Bill-n-Ted movies and _Parenthood_. He was reasonably good in Paula Abdul's "Rush Rush" video, but that doesn't count for much and he only really had 2 or so lines. Winona Ryder seemed fine to me. Absosmurfly no complaints. I find it interesting that you complain about how bad she was and yet mention none of the other performances. Gary Oldman was superb as the Count, Tom Waits made a great bit out of Reinfield, and Anthony Hopkins was hysterical as the Doctor. He had the funniest lines in the movie. >_Dracula_ is a beautiful-looking movie, but I find that all style >and no substance just leaves me feeling empty. Again, I think you were looking for the wrong sort of substance. This movie is a romance, one that spans 4 centuries. "Love never dies", remember? All that said, I had some serious problems with the film. Most of which tied into what I would consider tacky 70's cinematography and heavy handed symbolism of the sort I find insulting. On the other hand, perhaps that's the only sort of symbolism that works for the general public. But these flaws weren't enough to ruin a fine film. Jeff ======================================================================== Subject: Re: Dracula and Policemen's other balls Date: Sun, 29 Nov 92 21:08:22 EST From: sole gain dry silk Hi, >Again, I disagree. Keanu Reeves was embarassingly bad. His accent was >a disgrace, and his acting left a lot to be desired. The whole thing was >reminescent of his role in _Dangerous Liasons_, which I found equally poor. >I feel bad typecasting him as the surfer-dude-teenager-rebel type, but >the only roles he seems to have excelled in were the two Bill-n-Ted movies >and _Parenthood_. He was reasonably good in Paula Abdul's "Rush Rush" video, >but that doesn't count for much and he only really had 2 or so lines. :) I agree *completely* about Keanu. I kept expecting him to go 'Excellent, dude'... :) Saw the movie in distinctive ecto-company last night. It wasn't a bad movie, but I don't think it was brilliant either. I wasn't scared either, but in terms of cinematography and direction I was very impressed. The tricks with the shadows and the layers were IMHO awesome. No one has mentioned the *amazing* Annie Lennox song 'Love song for a vampire' that played during the end credits. I think I should go find the soundtrack for that and DIamanda's screams... On another subject, I went on a CD shopping frenzy due to various sales in local CD stores, and great finds in Used CD shops. I am especially happy I found a copy of "the secret policeman's third ball" with the live RUTH among other great songs (Lou Reed, PG, Duran Duran, and others). Highly recommended. I also picked up my first Danielle Dax CD 'Blast the human flower' for $3.99, and am so far very impressed. And I *finally* got me NIN's Pretty Hate Machine. Can't believe I waited so long to buy this brilliant album. That's all for now. Angelos 'Everybody dance now cause we-said-we are-oh yeah-we're waking up Waking up to put on warpaint Waking up to feed the fire Waking up to get up on the dance floor Coom didi wanna hi hi hi -oh yeah- saga mini too' - MC Happy 'Cool' Rhodes (The sensitive Dance diva) ======================================================================== Date: Sun, 29 Nov 92 21:39:00 EST From: WretchAwry Subject: Re: NEXP Jeff writes: > Vickie sez, regarding _Northern Exposure_: > >Tape it, because I wish we had taped it from the beginning. > > Oh goody, I'm *not* the only weird one. I have all of the second season > but one episone on tape, as well as all but one of the current season. I > think I only have one or two shows from the first, abbreviated season. I > do know that I've _seen_ every episode aired so far. It's the one TV > thing I have in common with my parents. Strangely, we've actually only seen about 5 episodes, so I envy that you've seen all of them. We've loved all the ones we've seen, but we just keep forgetting about it. It airs on Monday nights, and we tend to remember on Tuesday or Wednesday that we missed it. Twin Peaks and MST3K are the only shows that we never forgot/forget is on and what time. It's nice that Martin has the chance to see it from the very beginning...we would have developed a habit for it if we'd seen it from the beginning. Vickie ======================================================================== Subject: Re: Fluff (as in snow) (tm) Date: Sun, 29 Nov 92 21:42:06 -0500 From: jeffy@syrinx.umd.edu Almost a week late, but I'm cleaning out my mailbox (yet again! amazing how fast it fills up!) Doug wrote: >Now for my regular feature: Amendment Two tidbits! >After all, 65% of >Denver voters did vote against Two, and Denver did have its own gay rights law >overturned. This is true for the actualy city of Denver, but not the _suburbs_. I belive all of the Denver suburbs voted for Two. In a boycott like this, how do you distinguish between a city and its suburbs? Part of the point of the suburbs is taking advantage of the various services and amenities of the city that they surround. >How many other unboycotted cities and states can claim that? How many unboycotted cities/states have had gay rights (or non-discrimination) laws overturned? Or how many have rights laws to begin with? I can only think of one that had a gay rights law overturned--Tampa, FL. It was attempted in Portland, ME, but the effort failed. I've heard nothing particular about a Tampa boycott, but CO is probably stealing everyone's attention. As for cities/states with non-discrimination laws, there are quite a few. 7 states (MA, HI, CA, WI, NJ, and 2 more I can't think of off the top of my head) and I-don't-have-the-slightest-idea-how-many. Denver and Aspen and Boulder are the first cities in the US to lose their gay rights bills due to a constitutional amendment. >The town of Vail (Yes, _that_ Vail :) ) is enacting its own gay rights law, in >the face of Amendment Two. That's irrelevant unless Two is found unconstitutional in one of the lawsuits. A cynical person might go so far as to say that this is a simply a move to cover their ass and protect their tourist trade. Personally, I love Vail and have gone there on several occasions. Same for Aspen. But right now if I could afford a ski trip out west, it would probably be to Utah or maybe Wyoming. Utah has a somewhat oppressive atmosphere, but at least it's not like Colorado. >Many boycott >supporters are already calling Denver the "capital of homophobia", only >showing their own ignorance of one kind or other.... A matter of semantics. Jeff ======================================================================== Date: Sun, 29 Nov 92 22:53:05 EST From: WretchAwry Subject: Re: SV Me: > >pps, just the other night, I realized what "Bad Wisdom" is about. Was > >this song discussed earlier? I remember Alan raved about this song > >(I agree!) and I remember the lyrics to "Blood Makes Noise" and, > >more recently, "As Girls Go" being discussed. Jeff: > No, "Bad Wisdom" hasn't been discussed yet. I gather from your contextual > mention of "Blood Makes Noise" and "As Girls Go" that you decided that > "BW" is about homosexuality? No, not at all. BW is a companion piece to the song Luka, except that Luka is about physical child abuse and BW is about sexual child abuse. (It's just too bizarre. Twice I went through all the lyrics and wrote out explanations for each line and twice I lost what I wrote. I don't feel like trying for a third time. Take my word for it...) Vickie ======================================================================== The ecto archives are on hardees.rutgers.edu in ~ftp/pub/hr. There is an INDEX file explaining what is where. Feel free to send me things you'd like to have added. -- jessica (jessica@ns1.rutgers.edu)