From: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org (ecto-digest) To: ecto-digest@smoe.org Subject: ecto-digest V5 #304 Reply-To: ecto@smoe.org Sender: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk ecto-digest Friday, September 10 1999 Volume 05 : Number 304 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Today's your birthday, friend... [Mike Matthews ] new buys [JoAnn.Whetsell@oberlin.edu] Re: kate rusby? [Chris Morriss ] Sarah Slean tour dates (a gig in NYC included!) [Michael Curry ] Re: kate rusby? [meredith ] ADMIN: smoe.org downtime 8/11/99 0600-1800 EDT [puppycakes ] Re: Mary Lydia Ryan and MP3 [Carolyn Andre ] Re: Mary Lydia Ryan and MP3 [Joseph Zitt ] Re: Mary Lydia Ryan and MP3 [Michael Curry ] Re: Mary Lydia Ryan and MP3 [Carolyn Andre ] Re: Mary Lydia Ryan and MP3 [neal copperman ] Marie Beer [Ellen Rawson ] Re: Mary Lydia Ryan and MP3 [Sue Trowbridge ] Re: Mary Lydia Ryan and MP3 [Andrew Fries ] mp3 vs RealAudio [Ken Blake ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 9 Sep 1999 03:00:03 -0400 (EDT) From: Mike Matthews Subject: Today's your birthday, friend... i*i*i*i*i*i i*i*i*i*i*i *************** *****HAPPY********* **************BIRTHDAY********* *************************************************** *************************************************************************** ***************** David Blank-Edelman (no Email address) ****************** *************************************************************************** -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- David Blank-Edelman Sat September 09 1967 Neon Holly Tominack Thu September 10 1970 Virgo Sharon Nichols - Terra Incognita Wed September 11 1963 Victim of Christianity Heather Russell September 11 Total Virgosity Karron Lynn Lane Tue September 14 1751 Ophelia Virgo Troy Wollenslegel Mon September 18 1972 Virgo Mark Frabotta Sun September 19 1965 Don't even THINK about parking here Joe Zitt Sat September 20 1958 Will Hack for CDs Ani DiFranco Wed September 23 1970 Virgo Paul Kim Sat October 01 1977 fetal position JoAnn Whetsell Fri October 01 1976 Pendulum William Gill Wed October 05 1960 A wide-eyed wanderer Dan Riley Sun October 08 1961 Libra Neile Graham Wed October 08 1958 pen Quenby M. Chunco Tue October 08 1968 Crunchy Frog Mike Garland Wed October 08 1952 Creature_of_the_Night Irvin Lin Tue October 09 1973 Libra - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 09 Sep 1999 13:28:45 -0400 From: JoAnn.Whetsell@oberlin.edu Subject: new buys Hi. Went to the Borders Outlet today, and as usual, I found nothing in the first few rows and started to feel like this was going to be a wasted trip, then ended up with a whole stack of stuff. I'm listening to the first one now, Merrie Amsterburg. Only on the 3rd track, but I like it quite a bit. It's soothing (or at least this track) but her voice is different enough to make it interesting. Also picked up: Lisa Germano-- Slide Siouxsie and the Banshees-- The Rapture Cordelia's Dad-- Comet The Klezmatics w/ Chava Alberstein-- The Well Happy Rhodes-- Equipoise I haven't heard anything by any of these artists before, so it should be interesting. I did have Happy's _Warpaint_ but it didn't do much for me so I sold it to another ectophile who could appreciate it more. I feel like I should give Happy another chance though, so I'm trying this album. Will let you all know how it goes later. I've been hearing Neile talk about Mary Lydia Ryan lately. I haven't heard any of her music either, I couldn't get the samples on her page to play, but I really liked the cd cover for Diaphonous and was thinking about trying it un-previewed. Was wondering if someone could talk a bit more about her style. JoAnn ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Sep 1999 19:49:52 +0100 From: Chris Morriss Subject: Re: kate rusby? In message <3.0.3.32.19990907221251.013b8508@smoe.org>, meredith writes >Hi! > >I was stuck at work way too late tonight, and while driving home I heard >most of the new album by an English trad artist called Kate Rusby. Of >course I can no longer recall the title ("Sleepless", maybe?), but it's on >the Compass label in the US, and it just came out. > >In a word: yum. Tasty. Must have. > >She's got that high, lilting voice I immediately associate with Irish and >English traditional music, and she does a nice mixture of trad tunes, her >own compositions, and covers (her cover of Iris DeMent's "Our Town" was >simply scrumptious). The arrangements are your basic contemporary trad >arrangements, with acoustic guitar and flute and that sort of thing, which >complements her voice perfectly. > >Does anyone know anything about this woman? Better yet, what's the album >called? > >(And if she's already been discussed here recently, my apologies - I am >*so* behind!) > (snip) First of all, Hi to everyone as this is my first posting to the list. There has been much discussion about Kate on the Richard Thompsom mailing list (!). I'm really surprised by the acclaim given to this album. One track, 'The Wild Goose' suits her voice wonderfully, but she sadly falls down on almost everything else. She simply doesn't have the range or control of her voice to carry the songs. Her version of 'Our Town' is embarrassing. I MUCH prefer the album she did with Kathryn Roberts, where Kathryn's more accomplished vocals helped a great deal. Speaking of Kathryn, the Equation CD was released quite some time ago here in the UK. I like it a lot, but Kathryn puts on a 'lisping' singing style reminiscent of the first CD by 'The Cranberries' which can annoy some people. Bye for now, - -- Chris Morriss (just having heard the excellent new CD by Garmana) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 09 Sep 1999 19:09:40 -0400 From: Michael Curry Subject: Sarah Slean tour dates (a gig in NYC included!) Yay! Sarah's coming to NYC in November! >Date: Thu, 09 Sep 1999 17:50:31 -0400 >From: "Sarah's Universe" >Subject: Sarah's Universe, Vol 2, Iss 16 > >Sarah's Universe Vol 2, Iss 16 > > >Hey there everyone, >In this issue: > - New Tour Dates > (Go out and see Sarah!) > - New Web Site Polls > (Vote for your favourite Sarah song!) > >Tour Dates: (* = new/changed) > > *Tue Sep 14 > Niagara On The Lake, ON > Niagara College > *NOON SHOW* > ("Alexander Davidsons") > > *Wed Sep 15 > Welland, ON > Niagara College > *NOON SHOW* > ("After Hours Pub") > > *Thu Sep 16 > Ottawa, ON > Carleton University > - Brees Inn > (with Sarah Harmer) > > *Fri Sep 17 > Kingston, ON > Queen's U > - Queen's Pub > (with Sarah Harmer) > > *Sat Sep 18 > Hamilton, ON > La Luna > > *Fri Sep 24 > Toronto, ON > CBC Radio "This Morning" performance > > *Sat Oct 2 > Wakefield, QC > Black Sheep > (being recorded by CBC Radio for future > broadcast) > > *Wed Nov 17 > New York, NY > CB's 313 Gallery > > *Thu Nov 18 > Fredonia, NY > Fredonia University > ("The Unicorn") > >Web Site News: >Check out the new Sarah Slean polls at www.SarahSlean.com. >Vote for you favourite Sarah Slean songs directly at: >http://www.sarahslean.com/ssfbpolls.htm >While you're there, why not "Interact" with Sarah and her fans at >"Interactive" section of www.SarahSlean.com >View the Interactive section here: http://www.sarahslean.com/ssfb.htm > >Enjoy! >-G.C. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Sep 1999 19:53:22 EDT From: Samsara0@aol.com Subject: Re: new buys In a message dated 9/9/99 10:34:38 AM Pacific Daylight Time, JoAnn.Whetsell@oberlin.edu writes: > Siouxsie and the Banshees-- The Rapture ugh. :-/ this is definately the WORST banshees cd. i am a huge siouxsie & the banshees fan, and i sold it because i hated it so much. check out hyaena or peepshow (or once upon a time or twice upon a time for a more general overview as these are singles collections), they are both fabulous...but the rapture is pretty much just...bad. imo. - - Siobhan ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 09 Sep 1999 18:28:54 -0600 From: Ellen Rawson Subject: Re: kate rusby? Chris Morriss wrote: Her version of 'Our > Town' is embarrassing. See, I rather liked it. It took me a couple of tries; I had just seen Iris Dement at an E-town taping not too long before hearing Rusby's take. I found it to be a much more universal song (in terms of its theme) after hearing Rusby's version. > Speaking of Kathryn, the Equation CD was released quite some time ago > here in the UK. I like it a lot, but Kathryn puts on a 'lisping' > singing style reminiscent of the first CD by 'The Cranberries' which can > annoy some people. It's on the Putumayo label here in the US, and they were promoting it quite a bit at Gavin (despite their 1:00 AM performance time ;). I do wish they'd perform more traditional material as I feel the band's energy and Kathryn's voice works so well with it. Ellen ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 08 Sep 1999 20:52:50 -0400 From: meredith Subject: Re: kate rusby? Hi! Mickey replied: >The two also sing "The Queen >& the Soldier" which is credited to Suzanne Vega. As Neile noted, it's on Suzanne Vega's first album. It's also one of my favorite songs ever. When I first got the album, back in high school I would just listen to that song over and over and over ... I actually wrote out the lyrics and had them hanging on my wall. (Yeah, I was 15, though - shoot me. :) I'd love to hear their take on it -- I'll have to keep an eye out for the album. I do know I'll be ordering _Sleepless_ as soon as I can get over to CD Now and take advantage of their 30% off sale. :) +==========================================================================+ | Meredith Tarr meth@smoe.org | | New Haven, CT USA http://www.smoe.org/~meth | +==========================================================================+ | "things are more beautiful when they're obscure" -- veda hille | | *** TRAJECTORY, the Veda Hille mailing list: *** | | *** http://www.smoe.org/meth/trajectory.html *** | +==========================================================================+ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 09 Sep 1999 20:58:26 -0400 From: puppycakes Subject: ADMIN: smoe.org downtime 8/11/99 0600-1800 EDT >Date: Thu, 9 Sep 1999 17:18:47 -0400 >From: Jeff Wasilko >To: guests@smoe.org >Subject: ADMIN: smoe.org downtime 8/11/99 0600-1800 EDT > >Due to a minor fire a few weeks ago at the location where smoe.org is >located, the building will be without power from 06:00 until >18:00 EDT on Saturday 8/11 so that repairs can be made to the >power distribution system. > >This means smoe.org will be down during that time. Please let me >know if you have any questions... > >-jeff ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 09 Sep 1999 22:35:05 -0500 From: Carolyn Andre Subject: Re: Mary Lydia Ryan and MP3 Neile posted the url for Mary Lydia Ryan's website; after the recent comments, I was interested in hearing her sound. course, then I find out I have to stay online for a 5 MB MP3 only download. Which causes me to revisit the topic that came up about a week ago, I think. While I understand the better quality available through MP3s - plus the fact that, if one really enjoys the music, one can save them on hard drive, transfer them to CD-ROM/convert them to WAV, etc., what is concerning me is: why is there a trend of artist websites offering ONLY MP3s? A short, even if low quality, RealAudio (for those of us without Macs) sample would give a teaser of whether I'd want to take the time to retrieve the longer MP3. Even the old fashioned .wavs and .aus tended to be kept under 1/2 MB. Knowing that folks here on ecto are pretty serious about their music listening, I just wondered your opinions (and yes, I've been discussing MP3s with the artists I host ... ) ... why the trend to MP3 only? are the 'average' surfers/potential listeners *really* going to go for the length to get the quality? do poor quality RA samples drive them away? ... ... now if only I can find some *short* Mary Lydia Ryan samples ... Regards, Carolyn Andre - ------------------- Chicago, IL / USA | Support Independent Music! Use the Internet candre@enteract.com | Carolyn's House of Music: http://house-of-music.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Sep 1999 23:48:02 -0500 From: Joseph Zitt Subject: Re: Mary Lydia Ryan and MP3 On Thu, Sep 09, 1999 at 10:35:05PM -0500, Carolyn Andre wrote: > Knowing that folks here on ecto are pretty serious about their music > listening, I just wondered your opinions (and yes, I've been discussing > MP3s with the artists I host ... ) ... why the trend to MP3 only? are the > 'average' surfers/potential listeners *really* going to go for the length > to get the quality? do poor quality RA samples drive them away? ... One significant factor: streaming RA effectively requires a RealServer. Downloading an MP3 can be done equally well from any FTP or Web server, including all free ones. - -- |> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <| | jzitt@metatronpress.com http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt | | Latest CD: Shekhinah: The Presence http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt | | Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List | ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 09 Sep 1999 23:52:07 -0400 From: Michael Curry Subject: Re: Mary Lydia Ryan and MP3 At 10:35 PM 9/9/99 -0500, Carolyn Andre wrote: >While I understand the better quality available through MP3s - plus the >fact that, if one really enjoys the music, one can save them on hard drive, >transfer them to CD-ROM/convert them to WAV, etc., what is concerning me >is: why is there a trend of artist websites offering ONLY MP3s? A short, >even if low quality, RealAudio (for those of us without Macs) sample would >give a teaser of whether I'd want to take the time to retrieve the longer >MP3. Even the old fashioned .wavs and .aus tended to be kept under 1/2 MB. > >Knowing that folks here on ecto are pretty serious about their music >listening, I just wondered your opinions (and yes, I've been discussing >MP3s with the artists I host ... ) ... why the trend to MP3 only? are the >'average' surfers/potential listeners *really* going to go for the length >to get the quality? do poor quality RA samples drive them away? ... I was under the impression that offering RealAudio required the use of special server software, either by you if you're running your own server or by your ISP, and I suppose for some artists being able to simply rip an MP3 and put it on your website might seem like a better choice. Do ISP's that offer RealAudio serving usually include it as part of a regular account or do they charge extra for it? And looking at another aspect of the issue, yes, the often crappy RealAudio experience, usually caused by some combination of the low quality of the sample and the fact that I rarely get a smooth playback with my 56k connection, can discourage me. I do think that artists should perhaps offer a few shorter samples in addition to full length songs so that people who just want a quick listen can have a smaller download option, but frankly an artist who offers MP3s is more likely to get me to give their work a hard listen than one who just offer RealAudio. Mike np: Kate Rusby -- Hourglass [ack! I can't believe it took me so long to listen to this... it's *great*!] ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 09 Sep 1999 22:57:26 -0500 From: Carolyn Andre Subject: Re: Mary Lydia Ryan and MP3 At 11:48 PM 9/9/99 -0500, Joseph Zitt wrote: >On Thu, Sep 09, 1999 at 10:35:05PM -0500, Carolyn Andre wrote: >> Knowing that folks here on ecto are pretty serious about their music >> listening, I just wondered your opinions (and yes, I've been discussing >> MP3s with the artists I host ... ) ... why the trend to MP3 only? are the >> 'average' surfers/potential listeners *really* going to go for the length >> to get the quality? do poor quality RA samples drive them away? ... > >One significant factor: streaming RA effectively requires a RealServer. >Downloading an MP3 can be done equally well from any FTP or Web server, >including all free ones. yes, but pseudo-streaming is possible from any web space. Yes, buffering/rebuffering problems "due to net congestion" -- but I notice those if I'm listening to RA broadcasts or streams from sites that I KNOW are using a server as often as I do with the pseudeo-streaming via metafiles. And in testing with one of my clients, they actually got worse reception from the active stream from my [ok, chintsey, 5 stream free] basic Realserver than the metafiles. Regards, Carolyn Andre - ------------------- Chicago, IL / USA | Support Independent Music! Use the Internet candre@enteract.com | Carolyn's House of Music: http://house-of-music.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Sep 1999 00:16:58 -0400 From: neal copperman Subject: Re: Mary Lydia Ryan and MP3 At 11:52 PM -0400 9/9/99, Michael Curry wrote: > And looking at another aspect of the issue, yes, the often crappy >RealAudio experience, usually caused by some combination of the low >quality of the sample and the fact that I rarely get a smooth >playback with my 56k connection, can discourage me. I had somewhat similar experiences as Mike in the past. I've mentioned a few times that my Mac has pitiful sound reproduction capabilities and I've got a 28.8 modem, so I pretty much never download music. When I was in New Mexico, I had better connections and sound at work, and I had a good time with on-line clips. However, we had a firewall and all the web stuff went through a proxy, and I only found 2 Real Audio streams out of about 30 that actually would get through. Without any concern for the download time (after all, I was supposed to be working, and just ran it in the background on an ethernet connection), I liked the MP3's much better. I'd download a bunch of snippets and run them on repeat for an hour or so. For something that doesn't immediately grab me (or even something that does!), I want to listen to it a bunch of times. And my listens were kind of half-hearted, so I needed a half dozen before the music would sink in. So, in that context, I definitely preferred mp3. neal np: Living in Clip - ani difranco ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 09 Sep 1999 22:31:00 -0600 From: Ellen Rawson Subject: Marie Beer Okay, I need to apologize. Information regarding Marie Beer was requested of me, and well, due to a crazy summer (too much work, music, and travelling), I accidentally lost that post. However, while perusing the latest Westword (Denver/Boulder alternative weekly), I was reminded of it. There's a nice article on Beer which may be of interest to a number of folks here; the story starts with information about Beer and her ex-friend, Jewel. ;) http://www.westword.com/issues/1999-09-09/music2.html Anyway, the Oct. 4th KGNU Marie Beer live broadcast probably will be at 7 PM Mountain Time, and KGNU is on real audio. http://www.kgnu.org I missed Beer opening for Joan Armatrading in late July (I was off in England), but a good friend and concert buddy went, so I'll try to eke some details from her. At any rate, I'll try to post some more this weekend about Beer, her cd (and more info. on how to obtain it), and the Women from Mars cd/program/group (you may be able to hear the Women from Mars radio show on Sat. and Sun. mornings on KWAB, btw -- http://www.workingassetsradio.com -- I think it's hooked up now). Ellen ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Sep 1999 21:38:55 -0700 (PDT) From: Sue Trowbridge Subject: Re: Mary Lydia Ryan and MP3 On Thu, 9 Sep 1999, Michael Curry wrote: > I do think > that artists should perhaps offer a few shorter samples in addition > to full length songs so that people who just want a quick listen > can have a smaller download option, but frankly an artist who offers > MP3s is more likely to get me to give their work a hard listen than > one who just offer RealAudio. One of the cool things about MP3s is that you can listen to them *during* the download. I will often download about 1.5 Mb of an MP3 and then start my player. That allows me to hear a minute and a half sample of a song without waiting the 20+ minutes it would take to download the entire thing. At that point, I can either stop the download (if I didn't particularly care for the song) or allow it to continue and download the entire MP3. I am on the verge of signing up for DSL service, which means I won't have this problem much longer, thank goodness. :) BTW, I conducted a survey of visitors to http://www.loudfamily.com -- a music site I maintain -- and half the users said they preferred MP3, half voted for RealAudio. - --Sue Trowbridge trow@slip.net np: Roxette, HAVE A NICE DAY ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Sep 1999 15:35:17 +1000 From: Andrew Fries Subject: Re: Mary Lydia Ryan and MP3 On Thu, 9 Sep 1999, Michael Curry wrote: >frankly an artist who offers >MP3s is more likely to get me to give their work a hard listen than >one who just offer RealAudio. Same here. Naturally if someone can afford to provide their samples in several different formats and lengths that's just great - I'm happy for them. But most webmasters especially unsigned artists and fans like myself are limited by small details like available disk space... so, if there's going to be just one sample my first choice is mp3 followed by non-streaming RealAudio. Why do I prefer mp3? Well, we could argue which one sounds better, which one is easier to record etc. Personally I feel mp3 wins in these areas, but it could be open to discussion. Another strong argument is that while not entirely open source, the mp3 field as a whole is a lot more open than RealAudio, which is limited to exactly one company. And now for the real reason: mp3 players are just SO MUCH cooler than RealAudio. Skins, plug-ins, visualisations, whatever - there's a whole world of fun to be had with them. RealAudio player on the other hand is just BORING, all it does is plays the music ... - ------------------------------------------------------ "When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why the poor have no food, they call me a communist." --Helder Camara - ------ http://www.zip.com.au/~afries/hall.html ------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 09 Sep 1999 22:40:28 -0700 From: Ken Blake Subject: mp3 vs RealAudio RealAudio sucks, mp3 rules! I've never heard real audio that wasn't compressed to death - I guess so it can stream over a 14.4 line. What's the point? At that level even good music sounds bad (to me). It's really a matter of how the two formats have been used rather than technical differences. I'd rather have better quality. Ken n.p. mp3 of HR playing Proof at Ectofest 99 (thanks Chris) ------------------------------ End of ecto-digest V5 #304 **************************