From: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org (ecto-digest) To: ecto-digest@smoe.org Subject: ecto-digest V5 #184 Reply-To: ecto@smoe.org Sender: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk ecto-digest Wednesday, May 26 1999 Volume 05 : Number 184 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: tonight's buffy season finale delayed ["Ron Starr" ] Chapel Hill Ecto Connection (was re: Courts, Finns, ....) [Heather Russel] Annie Herring and Jonatha Brooke [dave ] Re: tonight's buffy season finale delayed [Michael Curry ] Re: Courts, Finns, and Boulders [Michael Curry ] Re: tonight's buffy season finale delayed [Peter Clark ] Re: early alanis question [Greg Dunn ] Re: tonight's buffy season finale delayed [Joseph Zitt ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 16:32:26 -0700 From: "Ron Starr" Subject: Re: tonight's buffy season finale delayed Send 'em a note using the feedback@buffy.com alias. It's a start. - -----Original Message----- From: Michael Curry > ....Someone needs to get the people at WB a clue (lots of >clues actually).... n.r. Charles Simic, Jackstraws n.p. Ligeti, Piano Concerto ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 18:52:28 -0500 (CDT) From: Talamasca Subject: Re: tonight's buffy season finale delayed At 07:23 PM 5/25/99 -0400, Michael Curry wrote: > I really tired of this nonsense, and this particular lame >reaction strikes me as being even more pointless than some of >the others. Someone needs to get the people at WB a clue (lots of >clues actually). At least when they scrubbed the episode shortly >after Littleton I was under the impression that it actually involved >a student shooting at other students, but judging from the "spoiler" >part of the message from WB the stuff that's at issue in this >episode is well into the realm of fantasy. Well, to be fair about the previous scrub, I think that had to do with an episode that aired a couple weeks ago, and a couple weeks after Littleton, in which a student plotted to terrorize and kill fellow students by training hellhounds to attack people at the prom. That did indeed parallel Littleton, though the weapons were demons and not guns. This latter scrub, though, does seem a bit silly to me. For one, the parallel to Littleton is far-fetched, especially in that the menace here is not a student, but instead it seems that the students will band together against an outside force. For another: they already aired the episode which _was_ a parallel. If they felt it was not insensitive to show that one, why is it suddenly insensitive to show this one? (Unless, perhaps, they received a bunch of letters concerning the prom episode?) John Higdon (Talamasca) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 20:10:19 -0400 From: Michael Curry Subject: Re: Anybody see The Phantom Menace? At 03:02 PM 5/25/99 -0500, Patrick Moseley wrote: > Please don't pummel me if you're getting sick of the over-exposure, >but I was curious if any ectophiles had taken in the Phantom Menace yet >and what they thought? I seem to recall a couple of threads on this >newsgroup when the trailer came out, so I was expecting a few reactions >by now... Actually, I think Paul posted his opinions the day after the movie opened. ;) I saw The Phantom Menace on Friday and I have to admit that I actually liked it quite a bit. Yes, it had it's flaws, but it certainly wasn't as bad as some people on the net would have you believe. I think that some people were expecting far, far too much from this movie. For those that haven't seen it yet, I suggest that you go expecting a good SF movie rather than some glorious and perfect masterpiece. Anyway, here's some spoiler space, so if you haven't seen the movie you might not want to read past this point... | S P O I L E R S | | | | | | Things I liked: I liked the performances of both Natalie Portman as the Queen and Ewan McGregor as Obi-Wan. Yes, Ewan was sort of wasted because of how little Obi-Wan did until the toward the end of the film, but I still think he is a perfect choice for the role and I'm looking forward to seeing more of him in the next movie. I liked most of the special effects and other CGI. Obviously it worked better with the setting than it did with some of the CGI characters, but I've actually read complaints about how all the CGI made things too "sterile," as though rubber costumes, plastic models and painted scenery were something that actually made the original movies *better*. I loved the light-saber duel! I loved it when Darth Maul impaled Qui-Jon, something I'll explain further along. I thought that John Williams once again did a superb job with the music, with the highlight being "Duel of the Fates" (which is what played during the part of the movie with the light-saber duel). Things I didn't like: Liam "Wooden" Neeson. Ugh. I think that Qui-Jon was a character that called for a lot more emotion than Mr. Neeson was giving. Seeing him die, and therefore being assured that Liam wasn't going to be in the next movie, was great. Jar-Jar Binks. I did not find him to be nearly as annoying as some people seem to have found him, and for me he didn't even begin to approach the annoyance level of the Ewok hordes, but that doesn't mean I think he was a good character. I think the best way to describe him was Jerry Lewis with an unintelligible accent. He was obviously placed in the movie to appeal to kids, so I hope they liked him. The kid who played Anakin. Yikes... was this really the best Lucas could come up with? As for the overall plot... well, there were some holes in it and some things that could have been better developed, but since the movie was already over two hours long it's hard to complain about what was left out. I think it was very obvious that this was the first of a trilogy, given the number of things left unresolved. Anyway, I think I've babbled enough about this. :) Mike np: Liquorice -- Listening Cap nr: _Cryptonomicon_ by Neal Stephenson | Michael Curry / mcurry@io.com / mcurry@smoe.org | | http://www.io.com/~mcurry | | "Am I bitter? Do I sound bitter?" -- Veda Hille | ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 20:20:12 -0400 From: Heather Russell Subject: Chapel Hill Ecto Connection (was re: Courts, Finns, ....) > Neile passed along some disappointing news from Susan Court: > > >One last bit of news on the performance front: family obligations > >have made the Indiegrrl Summer tour dates in NYC and Chapel Hill > >impossible for me. :( > > Drat. Living in Chapel Hill, I sometimes feel a twinge of envy > when the Northeastern ecto contingent, or the DC'ers, or the > Seattleites, discuss the marvelous indie shows they've seen. > Fortunately, we have Our Lady of the Roland, Heather Russell. What a great name! Thanks for coming to my show last month - it was nice to meet you, and it's always nice to have an ectophile in attendance... And for other lurking NC ectophiles, I will be performing Wednesday the 26th at The Cave in Chapel Hill with fellow Indiegrrl Melanie Sparks, starting at 10 p.m. Do drop by and say hello. >(snip) There's a better-than-even-money chance > (he said, knocking on wood) that I'll be moving to Boulder next > month. > Noooooooo, you can't move until after the Indiegrrl concert July 17th. That's an order! ;) - - heather - -- |********************************************************* | Heather Russell | My music site: http://www.freecloud.com/heather | My CD: http://cdbaby.com/buy/russell.htm | Indiegrrl - an independent music resource: http://www.indiegrrl.com | Email: hrussellatbellsouthdotnet |_________________________________________________________ "I'm in favor of love as long as it doesn't happen when 'The Simpsons' is on television." --- Anita, age 6 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 20:34:02 -0400 From: dave Subject: Annie Herring and Jonatha Brooke I've got 'Wonder' by Annie Herring, she's got a nice voice, I hadn't seen anything else by her though, I'll have to look for some of those titles that were mentioned.. Ah.. Jonatha.. word is that she and her management weren't particularly nice to a band that recently opened for her. Don't know all the details, do know she wouldn't let them use drums, although she had them for her own set. Tie in to Christian music, I saw somewhere that reigning GMA female vocalist of the year Jaci Velasquez listed Jonatha as her favorite singer. - -- +-----------------------------------------------+ + dave + + Visit Sideshow Bob's House of Wax and Waffles + + Female vocalists, Christian, and Polish music + + -=-=- and the fabulous Kasia Kowalska -=-=- + + http://magpage.com/~sspan/ + +-----------------------------------------------+ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 20:32:12 -0400 From: Michael Curry Subject: Re: tonight's buffy season finale delayed At 06:52 PM 5/25/99 -0500, Talamasca wrote: >At 07:23 PM 5/25/99 -0400, Michael Curry wrote: > >> I really tired of this nonsense, and this particular lame >>reaction strikes me as being even more pointless than some of >>the others. Someone needs to get the people at WB a clue (lots of >>clues actually). At least when they scrubbed the episode shortly >>after Littleton I was under the impression that it actually involved >>a student shooting at other students, but judging from the "spoiler" >>part of the message from WB the stuff that's at issue in this >>episode is well into the realm of fantasy. > > Well, to be fair about the previous scrub, I think that had to >do with an episode that aired a couple weeks ago, and a couple weeks >after Littleton, in which a student plotted to terrorize and kill fellow >students by training hellhounds to attack people at the prom. That did >indeed parallel Littleton, though the weapons were demons and not guns. Umm... that episode ("The Prom") wasn't scrubbed. The episode that was scrubbed was called "Earshot" (which was supposed to air on April 27th) and after checking around on the web I now see that it involved Buffy gaining the power to read minds and then overhearing (so to speak) a student planning a schoolyard massacre. As I said, I understood why they didn't want to show that one. Mike np: Cadallaca -- Introducing Cadallaca nr: _Cryptonomicon_ by Neal Stephenson | Michael Curry / mcurry@io.com / mcurry@smoe.org | | http://www.io.com/~mcurry | | "Am I bitter? Do I sound bitter?" -- Veda Hille | ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 20:38:45 -0400 From: Michael Curry Subject: Re: Courts, Finns, and Boulders At 08:45 AM 5/25/99 -0400, Michael Stevens wrote: >> Personally I'm really enjoying it, though I am still wondering why >>he chose to refer to Linux as Finux. > >The esteemed Linus Torvalds, primary architect of Linux, is a >native of Finland, so the name Finux slyly implies that the >OS bears a distinctly Finnish stamp. Actually I was more curious about why he felt the need to give it a clever name at all. *grin* >It would be interesting, given the increasingly global collaborative >authorship of Linux, to see whether it has enough "domestic content," >like Accords and Camries, to be labeled as "Made in USA." :-) Hopefully no one is keeping close enough track for it to ever be labled as being made in any one country. *smile* Mike np: Cadallaca -- Introducing Cadallaca nr: _Cryptonomicon_ by Neal Stephenson | Michael Curry / mcurry@io.com / mcurry@smoe.org | | http://www.io.com/~mcurry | | "Am I bitter? Do I sound bitter?" -- Veda Hille | ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 17:48:16 -0700 From: Peter Clark Subject: Re: tonight's buffy season finale delayed Paul Kim wrote: > > this came today through the Buffy email newslist. for those who care. i > think there's a spoiler in the paragraph that starts "at issue for us" but This is really sad. "Buffy" is a guilty pleasure of mine and I was modestly interested in how they were going to conclude this arc... But this is pandering in the worst way. Were WB so concerned about this episode (as distinguished from any other) they'd be constrained to cancel the series as unwholesome. I apoligize for the brief rant. Peter Clark ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 18:15:30 -0700 From: Peter Clark Subject: Re: tonight's buffy season finale delayed RavFlight@aol.com wrote: > > Sorry.. I didn't mean to send that directly to you.. I meant to send it to > the list. My appologies. Accepted. Additionally, at the risk of sounding completely cynical, postponing this airing would seem to afford a large promotional opportunity for later in the summer... Peter Clark ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 02:08:16 -0400 From: Joseph Zitt Subject: Re: tonight's buffy season finale delayed On Tue, May 25, 1999 at 04:32:26PM -0700, Ron Starr wrote: > n.r. Charles Simic, Jackstraws > n.p. Ligeti, Piano Concerto Simic and Ligeti... the range of tastes on this list never fails to pleasantly amaze me... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 02:25:07 -0400 From: Joseph Zitt Subject: Re: tonight's buffy season finale delayed On Tue, May 25, 1999 at 06:52:28PM -0500, Talamasca wrote: > Well, to be fair about the previous scrub, I think that had to do > with an episode that aired a couple weeks ago, and a couple weeks after > Littleton, in which a student plotted to terrorize and kill fellow students > by training hellhounds to attack people at the prom. That did indeed > parallel Littleton, though the weapons were demons and not guns. If I'm not mistaken, the initial scrub was a different episode, not yet aired, that involved the guns. If memory serves, the "next week's episode" blurb at the end of the previous week's episode involved Buffy developing telepathy, which hasn't happened on any of the episodes yet shown. They did, I believe, show a rerun that week instead, then continued with the regular schedule. If they had reinserted a deleted episode on the schedule, it would have blown their sweeps scheduling to have Buffy and Felicity end their seasons on the same night.... which, however, they trashed anyway. I suspect that the season finale will air toward the end of June, after high school graduations are finished across the country. The Washington Post reports that the two-parter may be reedited into a movie, to be shown as one event. ...which is more than I can I believe I would have had to say about TV programming... ------------------------------ Date: 25 May 99 23:08:40 EDT From: Matthew Woods Subject: Re: Anybody see The Phantom Menace? Well, we here is another thread that coaxes me to delurk for a moment. Warning slight spoilers ahead. I loved The Phantom Menace. I just returned from seeing it a second time. It is a very different style movie than the others though. The other movies started in the middle of the action. This movie on the other hand has much to set up. I agree with some of the complaints. Darth Maul deserved more screen time. I was also disturbed by the whole immaculate conception thing, and it bothered me that young Anakin seemed to be making passes at Imidala (SP?). How old is he supposed to be? 7? I agree with Patrick though in that I liked Jar Jar and the Gungans. Though the effects were vastly cool, what made the movie for me were its subtleties and The Phantom Menace, unlike the other movies, is subtle! I found it vastly cool that the whole movie, the war, and its apparent happy ending, was all a ploy by Palpitine to gain control of the senate. What is on the surface a happy ending, is if you read into it... well... menacing. The movie truely lives up to its title (which I hated before I saw it). Yes Darth Maul was disapointing, but Palpitine made up for it. Everything he says literaly drips with irony and forshadowing. My personal favorite line in the whole movie was him telling Anakin "I'll be watching your career with interest." I would definitely recommend seeing this movie several times to delve beyond the visual effects. Back to lurking. - -Matt ____________________________________________________________________ Get free e-mail and a permanent address at http://www.netaddress.com/?N=1 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 23:22:56 -0500 (CDT) From: Talamasca Subject: Re: tonight's buffy season finale delayed At 08:32 PM 5/25/99 -0400, mcurry@mail.io.com wrote: >At 06:52 PM 5/25/99 -0500, Talamasca wrote: >> Well, to be fair about the previous scrub, I think that had to >>do with an episode that aired a couple weeks ago, and a couple weeks >>after Littleton, in which a student plotted to terrorize and kill fellow >>students by training hellhounds to attack people at the prom. That did >>indeed parallel Littleton, though the weapons were demons and not guns. > Umm... that episode ("The Prom") wasn't scrubbed. The episode that >was scrubbed was called "Earshot" (which was supposed to air on April >27th) and after checking around on the web I now see that it involved >Buffy gaining the power to read minds and then overhearing (so to speak) >a student planning a schoolyard massacre. Ah, okay, I didn't know this. I'm a fan of the show, watch it, but I don't read the newsgroup or peruse the webpages. I figured, when I saw the parallels of the prom episode to Littleton, that that was what was scrubbed (or, actually, just delayed), and why. Still, it's interesting that, though not as obviously so as the scrubbed episode, the prom episode was definitely (to my mind) close enough to the Littleton events (student trying to get "revenge" upon other students by killing them) that if the producers were really trying to exhibit some sort of sensitivity, I would think that they would have scrubbed that episode, too. Especially since it was aired still only a couple weeks after. John Higdon (Talamasca) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 02:39:38 -0400 From: Joseph Zitt Subject: Re: tonight's buffy season finale delayed On Tue, May 25, 1999 at 05:48:16PM -0700, Peter Clark wrote: > This is really sad. "Buffy" is a guilty pleasure of mine and I was > modestly interested in how they were going to conclude this arc... But > this is pandering in the worst way. Were WB so concerned about this > episode (as distinguished from any other) they'd be constrained to > cancel the series as unwholesome. I apoligize for the brief rant. Buffy is pretty much a cash cow for them, so I doubt it would be in such danger. But I understand that the Powers That Be are *very* glad that the cast won't be in high school anymore next season... ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 21:05:21 EDT From: RavFlight@aol.com Subject: RE: tonight's buffy season finale delayed We have to take pause..do we really have unsubstatiated proof yet that the episode is being preempted? it is strange that they woudl do this with such little notice and even after they aired Part 1. (Very strange indeed) Yes, it is oversensitivity, and probably isn't the best judgement call from the producers, however at the same point, it is nice to see a network taking responsibility at least in part for their impact on their audience. With as much utter pandering and exploitatin of the tragedies of late, and with as much carelessness expressed by most media sources, I have to give my utter respect, however overblown or misguided, to the support of an executive willing to forgo ratings points (and this will hurt their ratings points if they, in fact, do prempt the show) for sensitiveity to their audience. That is a rare, RARE understanding from a group not known for it. I am disappointed as well, but in that same breath show my respect for their respect. R. Ryan Rogers RavFlight@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 23:38:46 -0500 (CDT) From: Talamasca Subject: RE: tonight's buffy season finale delayed At 09:05 PM 5/25/99 EDT, RavFlight@aol.com wrote: >I have to give my utter >respect, however overblown or misguided, to the support of an executive >willing to forgo ratings points (and this will hurt their ratings points if >they, in fact, do prempt the show) for sensitiveity to their audience. That >is a rare, RARE understanding from a group not known for it. On the other hand, one could see this move as building anticipation for the show when it does air, to earn even bigger ratings points. Making the decision just a short time before airing the show also might still translate into okay ratings, as fans (like me) who schedule this hour for the show don't develop other plans, figure "what the heck, might as well watch the repeat". John Higdon (Talamasca) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 00:46:22 -0400 From: DanS Subject: Re: early alanis question At 07:24 PM 5/24/99 , Heidi Heller wrote: >Now is the Time > >Songs written by Alanis, Leslie David Howe, Serge Cote >Produced, engineered and mixed by Leslie David Howe for Ghetto Records I don't have all the albums to verify this, but I'm pretty sure Leslie David Howe and Serge Cote have also been the force behind some other acts you may have heard of... The band One To One, which preceded Alanis... Then, following Alanis they were involved with Sals Birdland, and now Artificial Joy Club. All of these are essentially female-fronted power-pop, with a different female lead singer in each case. Dan ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 00:24:57 -0500 From: Greg Dunn Subject: Re: early alanis question >Now is the Time > >Songs written by Alanis, Leslie David Howe, Serge Cote >Produced, engineered and mixed by Leslie David Howe for Ghetto Records > That's MCAD10731. Alanis MCBBD10253 Produced, engineered and mixed by Leslie Howe for Ghetto Records Serge Cole: keyboards Leslie "Bud" Howe: Drum programming, guitar, keyboards, little cool bits here and there, finger pulling Frank "Fish" Levin: Mastermind cheese man on "Human Touch", keyboard solo on "Too Hot", extra strings arrangement on "My Own". Alanis: all vocals Backup vocals on "Too Hot" & "Feel Your Love": Chad & Wade [her brothers], Tyley Ross, John & Peter (the "Burn Bros."), Tom "Slappy" Saidak, Kevin "Iceman" Little, Dan "Capt. Pin", Deane Josh Lovejoy, Sean Daley, Jenny "Frank #1" Parlier, Mr. Fish, Sal, Rick "Slick" Kumar Recorded at Distortion Studios Sept. 90 - Dec. 90, Ottawa More than you ever wanted to know... - -- | Greg Dunn | And all you touch and all you see | | gregdunn@indy.net | Is all your life will ever be. | | The Sultan of Slack(tm) | Pink Floyd | | http://www.indy.net/~gregdunn/ | | ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 04:39:17 -0400 From: Joseph Zitt Subject: Re: tonight's buffy season finale delayed On Tue, May 25, 1999 at 09:05:21PM -0400, RavFlight@aol.com wrote: > We have to take pause..do we really have unsubstatiated proof yet that the > episode is being preempted? it is strange that they woudl do this with such > little notice and even after they aired Part 1. (Very strange indeed) Yes, I have a feeling that you didn't mean the "un" in "unsubstantiated". Anyway, the WB press release is at http://www.buffy.com/052499release.html and was early Wednesday by, among others, Zentertainment and the Washington Post, who tend to be accurate. (Matt Drudge somehow missed the chance to jump on it and blame it all on Al Gore :-]) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 23:37:02 -0600 From: neal copperman Subject: Re: Anybody see The Phantom Menace? At 5:04 PM -0400 5/25/99, Joe Casadonte wrote: >Basically, I'm like you: I like the movie, but it failed to live up to >expectations (and as you said, it probably could never have done it). Well, I just got back from seeing it, and I was thoroughly entertained too. I particularly liked how so much is implied for the future movies, and how scenes have weight based on what you already know. SOme of those scenes (mentioned by others in previous posts), would mean next to nothing if the other movies hadn't of come first. The movie more than lived up to my expectations. Then again, I seem to have been in the somewhat small minority of people that thought it might really suck. I thougth Jedi was appauling. It destroyed so much of what was set up and implied in the previous movies, replacing it with the cutesy/disgusting ewoks and a nauseating ending. I'm a believer that some movies can be saved by audience editing, so during the re-release, I walked out twice to prevent seeing the most insulting scenes. Didn't really help though. So, with that in mind, I thought there was a decent chance that Phantom Menace would be unbearable too. This was actually a perfect mindset for enjoying the movie. > And the Queen -- I guess >he made her young so that she and Anakin can make nookie later in the >series and make it believable, but someone of her youth didn't seem >credible w/r/t being so wise or savvy. I find it amusing that we are continuing the elected royalty politics that seemed to exist in the old movies too. We are a proud democracy, and here is our queen to plead our case. >I also agree that Darth Maul was underplayed, almost minimally played. I just couldn't shake the idea that he should be fronting a heavy metal band. He could give King Diamond a run for his money. >We should have seen a lot more of him. And the duel scene was great, >until the very end, when Obi-wan pulls a Luke manuever and flips up >and somehow surprises Darth Maul and slices him in half. Actually, I thought these Jedi were so much more powerful than Luke ever managed to be. Gave you more respect for the Jedi than he did. Then again, I refuse to accept that Luke was really a Jedi anyway. He was just a pretender who somehow managed to avert disaster by dumb luck and gutless writing. While kind of flat and lifeless (I missed the dynamism and energy of the old characters - no one seemed to really have that in this movie), these Jedi demnad far more respect than Luke did. And I agree that Ewan McGregor is a promising Jedi for future movies, though that's based on his other roles, rather than his performance here. I thought the special effects characters fit into the scenery better than usual, and wasn't particularly bothered by them. And I found Jar Jar generally amusing, and not really too annoying, though I saw him more as a Disney sidekick than a classic Star Wars one. SOrt of a singing tea pot or something. Ok, I think that's enough of that.... neal np: Red, Hot and Blue ------------------------------ End of ecto-digest V5 #184 **************************