From: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org (ecto-digest) To: ecto-digest@smoe.org Subject: ecto-digest V4 #455 Reply-To: ecto@smoe.org Sender: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk ecto-digest Tuesday, December 29 1998 Volume 04 : Number 455 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Albums of the year/Hologram of Baal (LONG!) ["Tim" ] PJ Harvey ["Donald G. Keller" ] Kitchens of Distinction ["Tim" ] Re: Kitchens of Distinction [Jeff Burka ] My 1998 Favorites [ABershaw@aol.com] Re: Kitchens of Distinction [Old Spice ] Re: Kitchens of Distinction [Michael Colford ] Re: Kitchens of Distinction [Jeff Burka ] Re: Kitchens of Distinction [Michael Colford ] Re: Kitchens of Distinction ["Xenu's Sister" ] Re: My top albums of 1998 ["C. K. Coney" ] Re: Kitchens of Distinction [Old Spice ] Re: Kitchens of Distinction [Old Spice ] My Short List of 1998 Faves [Eponine ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 21:13:52 +0000 From: "Tim" Subject: Albums of the year/Hologram of Baal (LONG!) First, my top Eleven albums of the year, then my disappointments and the funniest song of the year, and then a detailed explanation of the reasons behind the number one spot. 1. The Church - Hologram of Baal 2. Tori Amos - From The Choirgirl Hotel Tori, to me, is an elemental force rather than a musician, so it is a matter of course that she would be listed here. She didn't have to write such a brave, challenging album to win this position, but I certainly appreciate her thoughtfulnes in doing so. 3. Puressence - Only Forever In a perfect world this excellent UK band would be whispered in the same reverent breaths as Joy Division or The Smiths. Certainly their second album had enough killer gloom-pop songs to win such success, but sadly they seem destined to share the fate of their spiritual fathers, The Chameleons. 4. Happy Rhodes - Many Worlds Are Born Tonight For the first time Happy has written songs which sounded like complete little worlds by themselves, and yet this was her most cohesive album yet - beautiful, haunting and intricate. Certainly the excellent arrangements and production didn't hurt either. 5. Marillion - Radiation Their new-found diversity works both for and against them. On one hand, Radiation lacks the encompassing vision of, say, Brave. On the other, its lovely to hear the band play with alien styles (blues? dance? worldmusic?) better than the actual leaders of those styles. One of the most outrageously talented bands ever. 6. Imogen Heap - I Megaphone Beautiful yet harsh, instinctive yet deliberately complicated, Imogen's debut is only a guilty pleasure if you are narrow-minded enough to completely dismiss the redemptive power of pop music. It pleased me no end to discover that the album is still only one side of Imogen's personality. 7. Sparklehorse - Good Morning Spider Out of the darkness of Mark Linkous' experiences (heroin withdrawal, near-death experience, temporary paralysis) comes this album, a weak, limping creature with bruises everywhere and still somewhat woozy from the morphine, yet packed with tunes that would put smiles on the faces of stones. 8. Ani DiFranco - Little Plastic Castle The (relatively) upbeat, tuneful album sandwiched in between two decidedly bleaker affairs, Dilate and next-year's Up Up Up Up Up Up (which, on first listen today, seems somewhat angular and impenetrable. Thoughts?), this album showcased Ani's lyrical talent, musical ability and production experience all flowering in unison. The first album of Ani's which actually put a smile on my face consistantly. 9. P J Harvey - Is This Desire? Polly's music becomes both more accessable and more haunting. While I miss the out-and-out rock of "Long Snake Moan", the intricate ballads ("The Wind", "Catherine", "The River") more than made up for it. "A Perfect Day, Elise" was a brilliant, brilliant single which should have been huge. 10. The Paradise Motel - Flight Paths Lighter, but more beautiful than before. Swirling strings were all the go here, but everything was still defiantly "Motel"ish, with inventive arrangements, lingering melodies, haunting or just scary period-piece lyrics and numbing vocals. "Daniel" was the most beautiful song of the year not on The Church's album. 11. Massive Attack - Mezzanine You can almost hear the Massive trio staying up late in the night working feverishly (well, it took four years, so maybe not feverishly), to build songs from a single beat, adding layer upon layer upon layer until every song was the equivalent of a scuba-diving mission. Ignoring the string "renaissance" while it's still at its peak, they substitute for it by dragging Liz Fraser into the fray, making for one of the most unexpected but inspired musical pairings in recent history. Disappointments: 1. Curve - Come Clean Obviously grown leaner and meaner while watching Garbage rise to the top on their patented formula, Curve returned with an album which half-fulfilled expectations, yet for the other half utterly failed them. It doesn't make sense that they would mix brilliant songs (which, even more than Garbage, demonstrated the potential of fusing dance with rock) as "Chinese Burn", "Coming Up Roses", "Alligators Getting Up" and "Recovery", with such dull, uninviting and sometimes painful fare as most of the rest, especially the horrible title track. 2. Manic Street Preachers - This Is My Truth, Tell Me Yours Again moments of brilliant musical life (the first single "If You Tolerate This.." especially), but the Preachers seem to have largely lost the spark and hunger which made them so good in the first place. And the lyrics for "S.Y.M.M." are almost comically horrid. A graceful bowing-out from a once great band. Funniest song: Faith Hill (I think) - This Kiss Hey? Who got a thesaurus past the Nashville Quarantine? Alright, now the explanation for Album Number One. Perhaps read this in a second sitting. The Church - Hologram Of Baal It's strange how absolute mind-crushing brilliance can slap you in the face for weeks before you look it in the eye and acknowledge it completely. My first reaction to this album a couple of months ago was, "Phew! They're back to writing good records again", and left it at that. It was everything an album by The Church should be - packed with gorgeous melodies, layered production, beautiful guitar-playing, surrealistic lyrics..., but I hardly expected to have my world rocked by it, an album so amazing that it made all the other fantastic albums released this year seem pedestrian. So when I was sitting on a train on my way to work one golden afternoon (Note: I'm a sixteen year old casual worker at a cinema) a few weeks ago, listening to the album on earphones and staring out the window, and the chiming guitars of "Louisiana" started echoing around my head, I wasn't prepared for the tears that sprang into my ears. Nor later when, walking by the river on the final stretch to work, the almost tidal force of the chorus of "Tranquility" coincided perfectly with the sun coming out from behind a cloud, and suddenly everything in the world was going to be alright, and I could face work. When my shift finished 8 and a half hours later at 2 am, "Another Earth"'s triumphant guitar peal summed up my exact feelings about going home. Suddenly this album had become, and still is, the soundtrack to my life. But of course the music is the important thing, so what is it that makes these 10 songs so brilliant? I think its an ability to infuse the music with complex emotions which marks some of my favourite records - Talk Talk's Spirit Of Eden, The Cure's Disintegration, Marillion's Afraid Of Sunlight and The Church's own Priest=Aura. But this time The Church not only do just that, but do it almost to excess, so that every song literally floods you with a particular emotion. However in its grandiose design, the songs do not gloss over the inherent subtleties of their own aims, but rather, replicate their aims as fingerprints the size of the moon, so that every line is actually a canyon to be explored. Such canyons include the way Marty Wilson-Piper's spiralling guitar in "Anaesthesia" perfectly matches Steve Kilbey's line, "I don't know why I've gotta fly", as if this was literally the *sound* of drugs. Steve's impressionistic story about (I think) an adulterous wife being surprised by her husband coming home from the war (sort of like "Somersby"?) in "Lousiana", is accompanied by music which can only be the product of six months intensive study of what hot American summers would sound like in music form (that the guitars "chime" is an understatement. They sound like I imagine softly tapping a thousan silver goblets of honey would sound, while underneath "radiotronic" noises hum like those (Indian?) bowls you rub around the edges with a metal rod). The mid-section of "The Great Machine" where all the guitars fade into nothing, leaving only a ghostly keyboard instrumental, perfectly simulates the slow shutting down of the entire universe which Steve sings about. "Tranquility" (about a woman who starts a new life out in the country) seeks to live up to its name by moving at snail-pace, yet its tune could still make the dead dance. The chorus is one of most beautiful ever made IMHO, even though it's grounded by pure noise (like a very very quiet grunge? Not angry or violent at all, rather... majestic, sort of). "Buffalo" weaves and ducks in and out of being a simple, stripped-back ballad and being swamped in more of that grunge-noise. "This Is It", the album's most desolate song, rides on a single guitar riff (which gets more haunting each time its played) and some more eerie, piercing, beautiful "radiotronics". Of course this is then followed with the album's grandest track, the exultant "Another Earth", which sounds like Spiritualised playing marching band music. It is perhaps the most gloriously uplifting song ever written - certainly that I've ever heard, beating my previous nominee, Marillion's "Heart of Lothian" - and you'd expect it to be the triumphant closer to an excellent album. Instead Steve and the gang choose to follow it with a song even sweeter, if possible. "Glow-Worm" is a surprisingly simplistic (in both words and music) paen to love and a special loved one on the surface ("You're so easy to love..."), but it soon becomes even grander (if more stately) than the previous track. There are so many shimmering layers here that when they drop away momentarily, it feels like the band have fallen off the edge of a cliff, only to be bouyed by a cloud of violins - imagine a cross between My Bloody Valentine at their most tuneful and The Paradise Motel at their most pretty. The other aspect which must not be forgotten are Steve's words and singing. Their '92 album "Priest=Aura" was one of the most lyric-centric albums ever made by an actual band (where the songs were little more than beautiful backgrounds intended to emphasise Steve's musings), and I can't imagine them trying to take that avenue again. Indeed, since then Steve has been pushed further into the background with each release, and here the roles are finally completely reversed, Steve's lyrics more often resembling a collection of abstract moments designed to give the music meaning rather than form any complete story. Yet despite this there are moments here when Steve's words resonate more deeply than I can fully understand. The tone of true surprise in his voice when he exclaims "Sometimes I'm knocked out by the damage that you're doing," in "Richochet". The way he rhymes "Lousiana" with "welcome banner", and then in the same song shrugs ironically, "That's my story, cast of thousands." The way he manages to write a tribute to Michael Hutchence ("This Is It") and yet avoids all the pitfalls hiding in such a prospect, (inane lines, cliches or caricature) by imagining what was going through Michael's head in the final few hours of his life, ("Sometimes you come across a fork in the road/and what was waiting there you never could have known"), in the process writing the anti-Candle In The Wind. Anyway, if you want an album that marries the jangle of R.E.M. with the grandeur of The Cure, the perfection of The Blue Nile with the experimentation of My Bloody Valentine, the passion of the Blues with the intelligence of Prog Rock, then please, buy this album. It may change your life. It has changed mine. Regards, Tim ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 21:29:31 +0000 From: "Tim" Subject: Ani's new album Just a note to say that I found "Up, Up, Up, Up, Up, Up" (phew!) here in Melbourne, Australia! It hasn't officially been released here (that's in two weeks) so I think it was an advance copy leaked from Shock Records (her distributor here). The cover is actually Ani standing on a pavement holding up a very long computer-manipulated arm, holding in her hands magazine cut outs of six letter "U"'s and six letter "P"'s. The picture I described earlier is on the inside page. The album on the whole seems much darker than "Little Plastic Castles" - sort of like Dilate I guess, but more understated and improv-ish. This is a looser album, perhaps reflecting the success of Live In Clip, yet still retaining the last two albums' experimentation - lots of wurlitzers and thingies. The lyrics are excellent, IMHO her best yet, but the music has yet to do much for me. The songs aren't exactly tuneful (with the exception of the beautiful "Angry Anymore"), but this is only on first listen, so give it time and I might just like Ani's latest style more than her earlier ones. We'll see, I guess.... Anyway, Just thought I'd let you know... Tim ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 06:08:27 -0500 (EST) From: "Donald G. Keller" Subject: PJ Harvey In a perfect demonstration of "different strokes," I'm quite bemused by Dirk's reaction to the last two PJ Harvey albums. I was in thrall to =To Bring You My Love= from the first blues guitar lick, and thought it was easily the best album of its year; and for me =Is This Desire?= tends to fade into the woodwork unless I'm paying it undivided attention. It's destined for =my= "honorable mention/slight disappointment" list (along with =from the choirgirl hotel=). (I'm still wrestling with my 10 Best list.) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 23:53:22 +0000 From: "Tim" Subject: Kitchens of Distinction - ---------- >From: "J." Wermont >To: afinney@ozonline.com.au >Subject: My Bloody Valentine, et al >Date: Sun, Jul 26, 1998, 8:26 AM > >Great!! I really love textured, layered music. Have you ever listened >to a band called Kitchens of Distinction? I wouldn't categorize them >with the bands we're talking about here, but I thought of them >because their sound is very textured, and it's the main thing I like >about them. I was just digging through old e-mails and discovered this. I don't think I acknowledged the question at the time, but I later got interested in the Kitchens from numerous comparisons to great bands (The Chameleons, The Smiths, The House Of Love and yes, My Bloody Valentine). So one day I came across "Strange Free World" and picked it up... and its great! You're right, their music is very textured and layered. Their music could be defined as shoe-gazer, although their songs are probably too tight to be considered "true" shoegazer. That's not the point, though, as the songs are great. Lovely guitar sounds, interesting melodies and top-notch lyrics. Unfortunately, I have searched and searched but haven't found any of their other albums, which annoys me because apparantly their first and third albums ("Love Is Hell", "The Death Of Cool") are the two highlights. Are they worth forking out money via internet for? Anyway, if you love Kitchens of Distinction, you'll also love The Chameleons. I can really hear the influence of their "What Does Anything Mean? Basically" album in "Strange Free World". Regards, Tim ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 08:07:33 -0500 (EST) From: Jeff Burka Subject: Re: Kitchens of Distinction Tim sez: >You're right, > their music is very textured and layered. Their music could be defined as > shoe-gazer, although their songs are probably too tight to be considered > "true" shoegazer. That's not the point, though, as the songs are great. > Lovely guitar sounds, interesting melodies and top-notch lyrics. Heh. My main exposure to KoD was when they opened for Suzanne Vega (!) on the 99.9F tour. Near as I can figure, it was the loudest show I've ever seen. We were at Lisner Auditorium, at George Washington University (where I've probably seen more great shows than anywhere else; Tori, Sarah, DCD, Suzanne Vega, Laurie Anderson, Cocteau Twins, the list goes on!), where the acoustics are surprisingly good, even as high up as we were. But KoD had their amps cranked to 11. Ouch. I don't remember any particularly lovely guitar sounds, textured layering, or even lyrics for that matter. The funniest bit, though, was that while we were listening to them and waiting for Suzanne Vega to come on, my dad dozed off. I've no idea how given the noise level. jeff np: Melissa Ferrick + 1 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 10:01:35 EST From: ABershaw@aol.com Subject: My 1998 Favorites Hi all, Had the major computer crash of 98, but I'm finally up again just in time to pop in on this thread with my favorite 1998 releases: Favorite album of 1998: "Cold & Bouncy" by High Llamas - unquestionably the best album by a very unique band that always thinks in terms of "texture" as apposed to "solos". Great pop songs, extremely joyful most of the time & by far the most playful use of synthesizers (which I usually dispise....) that I've heard in a long while. Honorable Mention to: "Flaming Red" by Patty Griffin - Shocking to many of her hard core "acoustic" fan base, but exactly what I knew she would do given the opportunity to work in a band context. I always thought Patty was on the verge of "spontaneously combusting" at the solo acoustic gigs I saw, & its great to hear her "let it rip" with her band. "Unspoken" by Joy Eden Harrison - Only released on cassette to LRT attendees (but soon to be available on CD through her new label Astarte), this album is a cathartic release of pain & loss, but still makes me feel soooo good & continues to improve with every listen. Luscious jazz & blues vocals blended with wonderfully unique pop-tinged production by Cindy Lee Berryhill. "Desert Cure" by The Henrys - A third difficult to find album by Toronto's legendary Henrys with more of the same incredibly beautiful slide guitar work of Don Rooke & possibly the best Mary Margaret O'Hara material yet! (PS. Their mailing list is by far the most hilarious thing I've ever subscribed to!) "Spirit" by Jewel Kilcher - yeah, I know. Lotsa great songs aren't on this, but I like it & can actually listen to most of it repeatedly, which I couldn't say about her 1st album that so many wish she'd do again. Plus it FINALLY relieved me of answering "When's her next album coming out?" ;-) "Miles From Our Home" - Cowboy Junkies- a first fullfledged mutitrack studio recording that had me worried at first, but I love the results. Margo's vocals have never sounded better & the ensemble playing has gotten much better, IMO, especially Pete's drumming. Not quite as laid back as previous albums. Michael's lead guitar playing is really amazing on this. Even better live augmented with "Over The Rhine" personel. From the Vaults(but released in 1998): Sandy Denny-Live at The Royalty- her last gig in 1977. Still my favorite singer after all these years. Not the CD to start with but a definite neccesity for all Sandy fans. Bob Dylan Live 1966 - By far the most significant "vault" release of the decade. A mezmerising show & all the evidence needed to explain how Dylan changed everything in the mid 60's. An incredible document of a peak time. Not for the faint of heart. Janis Joplin & Big Brother & The Holding Company Live at Winterland 1968 Another peak moment captured for posterity. This was recorded at the first hometown (San Francisco) gigs they did after their 1st national tour. Everybody in top form & happy to be home. This kicks ass. King Crimson- "Absent Lovers" - an awesome recording of the last night of their 1984 Tour in Montreal. PULVERIZING! :-) XTC- BBC Box Set- Transistor Blast -A great 4CD collection of live performances done for the BBC throughout their career. One of the most overlooked bands of all time, IMO. Favorite 1998 performance goes to Joy Eden Harrison for her improvisational experiment of "Yellow" augmented by High Llamas & sound effects underneath a Cape Cod LRT moon on 9/6/98. Show that I'm most bummed out for missing: Veda Hille's CT Living Room Gig. So close to home, yet I was in San Diego at the time & had to miss it. :-( Most anticipated 1999 release: Cindy Lee Berryhill's next studio album. Keep the Living Room Concert scene happening! Best wishes to all & heres to music galore in 1999! Alan ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 07:17:35 -0800 (PST) From: Old Spice Subject: Re: Kitchens of Distinction - ---Tim wrote: > > >From: "J." Wermont > >To: afinney@ozonline.com.au > > >...Have you ever listened to a band called Kitchens of Distinction? > > ...You're right, their music is very textured and layered…Lovely guitar > sounds, interesting melodies and top-notch lyrics... and - ----Jeff Burka responded: > ...Ouch. I don't remember any particularly lovely guitar sounds, > textured layering, or even lyrics for that matter....while we were > listening to them…my dad dozed off.... I find it kind of interesting (though maybe unintentional, as it's not really the point of the above exchange) that Kitchen of Distinction's greatest distinction hasn't been mentioned here: they're a queer band. The reason I find this factoid's omission interesting is, paradoxically, because it's not at all unusual. KoD has a pretty healthy alternarock following, but I've never heard anyone mention their queerness, except in personal conversations I've had with a few of their gay fans. I haven't yet decided how to interpret this. I want to interpret it as a sign of nonchalant acceptance; that it's a fact innocuous enough not to bear mentioning by their majority-straight listeners. But then I think of the Ellen hysteria, and other similar public overreactions to simple gayness in a publicly visible figure, and drop that theory. Then I wonder if maybe their listeners just don't _know_ they’re gay--seeing as how it's never mentioned and all. But then I remember lyrics such as these: " Never thought that he would ever Want this much from a man, But love is the steepest sharpest slide. ......................................... Oh here I'd lie between your thighs Looking up into your eyes Wondering if this is allowed But fear rules me easily It takes lust and strength To turn to you and say "I want you and I need you" ......................................... There were four men in this room Why did you have to go and pick on me? - --and I drop _that_ theory. Anyone have any other theories? I don't remember; did KoD come up in the gay-artist thread of a couple months back? Tim, Jeff, did you know they were gay? (Actually, not being a particular fan of their sound, I might never have known if Alan, my last boyfriend, hadn't hosted them in NYC once and accumulated some great stories in the process.) - --charley n.p.: _The_Miseducation_of_Lauryn_Hill_--one of my top albums of the year, list to follow, sometime, maybe. n.r.: _Looking_at_Giacometti_, by David Sylvester: "...a tree functions as a tree regardless of whether it is observed, but a work of art is merely a piece of stone or bronze, or a flat piece of canvas covered with paint, until it is seen by a human observer who interprets it as a work of art." _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 11:10:31 -0500 (EST) From: Michael Colford Subject: Re: Kitchens of Distinction On Tue, 29 Dec 1998, Old Spice wrote: > ---Tim wrote: > > > > >From: "J." Wermont > > >To: afinney@ozonline.com.au > > > > >...Have you ever listened to a band called Kitchens of Distinction? > > > > I find it kind of interesting (though maybe unintentional, as it's not > really the point of the above exchange) that Kitchen of Distinction's > greatest distinction hasn't been mentioned here: they're a queer band. Actually, only the lead vocalist/songwriter is queer. The rest are straight. I'm a big fan of Kitchens of Distinction. I love their wall of sound approach with all the layered guitars. The end result to me is a startlingly lush product. Couple that with great melodies and literate lyrics, as well as that whole melancholy mood that pervades a lot of their stuff, and I've been a fan of theirs for years. I knew that there was a gay angle, and thay may have interested me at first, since I am gay as well, but as Charley said, it's not really a big deal. I don't have my CD's in front of me, but they released 3 albums under the name, Kitchens of Distinction, and another under KoD I think. There were label problems and they couldn't record under the name Kitchens of Distinction. The KoD release may have been just a single called "Feel my Genie." The lead vocalist also released an album under the monniker, Fruit. I wasn't as much of a Fruit fan as a Kitchens of Distinction fan. I'll check my CD's tonight when I get home and report back tomorrow. Michael n.p. Hunters & Collectors - Cut - -------------------------------------------------------------------- Michael Colford | Reading Public Library Head of Technical Services | Reading, Massachusetts colford@noblenet.org | *North of Boston Library Exchange* - -------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 11:13:15 -0500 (EST) From: Jeff Burka Subject: Re: Kitchens of Distinction On Tue, 29 Dec 1998, Old Spice wrote: > I find it kind of interesting (though maybe unintentional, as it's not > really the point of the above exchange) that Kitchen of Distinction's > greatest distinction hasn't been mentioned here: they're a queer band. You hit the nail with your first parenthetical remark: I didn't say anything about the queer-quotient of the band because it was irrelevant to what I was talking about (one of, if not the loudest concert experiences of my life, one which hid the qualities of the band to which others were referring). > I haven't yet decided how to interpret this. I want to interpret it as > a sign of nonchalant acceptance; that it's a fact innocuous enough not > to bear mentioning by their majority-straight listeners. I don't listen to them and I'm not straight. What does this mean? The Klezmatics have come up on ecto several times in the last several months (in conjunction with a planned-then-canceled concert with Susan McKeown, in the Saddest Songs thread, etc) and nobody mentioned that they're a queer band either. (gotta love a man singing a line like "But a man so greek in his physique in New York I adore". And you think those KoD quotes are explicit?!) It simply wasn't relevant to the conversation. > Tim, Jeff, did you know they were gay? Sure...I knew they were a queer band before I'd ever actually heard any of their music. I can't help but feel like I'm being accused of keeping KoD in the closet, and I'm not sure if that amuses or offends me. I'm pretty sure I was the first person to be out on ecto, and one of ecto's nastiest arguements, back in '92 or '93, was because I wouldn't shut up about queer artists who at the time weren't out in a wide, public sort of way (indigo girls, to be specific). ecto, on the whole, has been pretty gay friendly all along (hell, we even managed a decent sized party at my folks' house before the '93 March On Washington). I've certainly never taken any flack for things I've said on the subject, nor received hate mail from people offended by my mere existance (which *has* happened on usenet). jeff np: _Up_, REM (fronted, of course, by finally-out-homo Michael Stipe) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 11:43:37 -0500 (EST) From: Michael Colford Subject: Re: Kitchens of Distinction On Tue, 29 Dec 1998, Jeff Burka wrote: > irrelevant to what I was talking about (one of, if not the loudest concert > experiences of my life, one which hid the qualities of the band to which > others were referring). I forgot to mention that I also saw them open for Suzanne Vega (although in Boston) and while I did find them loud, I was already a fan, so I really enjoyed their performance. However, I did find it to be a rather unusual pairing of musical acts! > ecto, on the whole, has been pretty gay friendly all along Absolutely. I'm amazed by the number of gay and gay-friendly folks on this list. Actually, I'm kind of amazed at the number of gay folks I encounter on the web in general! > jeff > np: _Up_, REM (fronted, of course, by finally-out-homo Michael Stipe) By the way, how is the REM album Jeff (or anyone else who want to comment.) I didn't get it for Christmas, so I'm thinking of buying it. However, I've only heard the single. Michael n.p.: Liz Phair - Whitechocolatespaceegg (which has no gay connection that I can think of off the top of my head!) - -------------------------------------------------------------------- Michael Colford | Reading Public Library Head of Technical Services | Reading, Massachusetts colford@noblenet.org | *North of Boston Library Exchange* - -------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 11:32:17 -0600 From: "Xenu's Sister" Subject: Re: Kitchens of Distinction At 11:13 AM 12/29/98 -0500, Jeff Burka wrote: > I'm pretty sure I was the first person to be out on ecto, Yep. (Though the concept of someone feeling like they're "in" or "out" bothers me. I can't wait for the day when someone telling others that they're gay isn't considered a major big deal, especially by other gays, because it's really no more a big a deal as someone saying they have gray eyes. It's an interesting fact about a person, but no more important than any other genetic fact. I'll be glad when the whole concept of stating you're gay="coming out of the closet" is as quaint as bowler hats and tea tatties.) >one of ecto's nastiest arguements, >back in '92 or '93, was because I wouldn't shut up about queer artists who >at the time weren't out in a wide, public sort of way (indigo girls, to be >specific). I don't remember this. Point me to some archives. If you had gotten some flack from some people (people who probably were only on ecto for a short time) for talking about anything gay-related, I and I'm sure, a lot of other people would have put up a united Wall of China in front of anyone causing you problems. There has never ever *EVER* been a flame war on Ecto because someone, ANYONE, wouldn't "shut up" about ANYTHING. Not gay artists, not Jewel, not anything, and if you feel otherwise, prove it by showing me the archives. Since you and Charley are both gay, I'm not quite sure what happened here in this thread. Something questioning, something defensive, on the verge of being something nasty...what? Take a deep breath, you guys. Vickie ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 12:35:55 -0800 From: "C. K. Coney" Subject: Re: My top albums of 1998 Xenu's Sister wrote: > 1. Happy Rhodes - Many Worlds Are Born Tonight > > 2. Tori Amos - from the choirgirl hotel > > Vickie (that was easy!) Yep, those are my top two...and easy picks for me too. Here are my other faves of '98...in no particular order: Sully - I Have Much to Report Jocelyn Montgomery w/David Lynch - Lux Vivens: The Music of Hildegard von Bingen Hector Zazou - Lights in the Dark Donal Lunny - Coolfin Sinead Lohan - No Mermaid Mors Syphlitica - Primrose Tina Marsh and CO2 (Creative Opportunity Orchestra) - Worldwide (experimental big band from Austin, TX) Angelique Kidjo - Oremi (funky African music from Benin via Paris) Honorable Mention: Madonna - Ray of Light Massive Attack -Mezzanine Etta Cox - My Foolish Heart (Pittsburgh jazz songstress extraordinaire/debut) Rasputina - How We Quit the Forest Lisa Gerrard w/ Pieter Bourke - Duality The Changelings - Amphibian CPR - CPR The Residents - Wormwood Three from 1997 that I didn't get 'til 1998 and would have otherwise made my list: Billy Mackenzie - Beyond the Sun Ida -Ten Small Paces Velour 100 - Of Color Bright Disappointments of '98 that dashed my great expectations: His Name Is Alive - Fort Lake Lida Husik - Faith in Space Happy new year to all...and to all a good day! Carol ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 09:42:12 -0800 (PST) From: Old Spice Subject: Re: Kitchens of Distinction - ---Jeff Burka wrote: > > On Tue, 29 Dec 1998, Old Spice wrote: > > > I find it kind of interesting (though maybe unintentional, as it's not > > really the point of the above exchange) that Kitchen of Distinction's > > greatest distinction hasn't been mentioned here: they're a queer band. > > You hit the nail with your first parenthetical remark: I didn't > say anything about the queer-quotient of the band because it was > irrelevant to what I was talking about (one of, if not the loudest concert > experiences of my life, one which hid the qualities of the band to which > others were referring). ...unless loudness is a quality. I'm still experiencing flashbacks from the near-hallucinatory volume of my last Geraldine Fibbers concert. > > I haven't yet decided how to interpret this. I want to interpret it as > > a sign of nonchalant acceptance; that it's a fact innocuous enough not > > to bear mentioning by their majority-straight listeners. > > I don't listen to them and I'm not straight. What does this mean? Other than that you don't listen to KoD and that you're not straight, I'm not actually sure it _means_ anything. > The Klezmatics have come up on ecto several times in the last several > months (in conjunction with a planned-then-canceled concert with Susan > McKeown, in the Saddest Songs thread, etc) and nobody mentioned that > they're a queer band either. (gotta love a man singing a line like "But > a man so greek in his physique in New York I adore". And you think > those KoD quotes are explicit?!) It simply wasn't relevant to the > conversation. Now see, I never knew the Klezmatics had lyrics like that. I kind of wish someone had mentioned it before; now I'm curious about them. Now what do you suppose _that_ means? > > Tim, Jeff, did you know they were gay? > > Sure...I knew they were a queer band before I'd ever actually heard any of > their music. > > I can't help but feel like I'm being accused of keeping KoD in the closet, Whoa whoa WHOA whoa whoa-- Let's not jump so high so fast, shall we? I certainly had no intention of implying, or even avoiding implying, or even thinking, such a thing. My assumption, insofar as there was one, was probably closer to my first-offered alternative: that you, jeff, probably knew about them, but didn't see the need to mention it in the context of the moment. > and I'm not sure if that amuses or offends me. I'm pretty sure I was the > first person to be out on ecto, and one of ecto's nastiest arguements, > back in '92 or '93, was because I wouldn't shut up about queer artists who > at the time weren't out in a wide, public sort of way (indigo girls, to be > specific). Which raises an interesting question. Or rather, echoes a question I've kind of been asking of myself since I started thinking about my response to this thread: Why is it important--or even relevant--that a band's queer identity be mentioned whenever such a band is referred to on Ecto? I'm pretty much totally out, have been since I was like 17, but I'm not the type to wear a pink triangle lapel pin at work. (At my present business-attire-office job that is; you should have seen me when I worked in bookstores and record stores and stuff: I wore my Phranc "I enjoy being a girl" pink Tshirt to work at a pet store all the time.) But somehow it's very important to me that queer artists or, more accurately, queer public figures--especially those that develop a following outside the gay ghetto--be identified as such. I was the one who started the recent thread when I asked if there had ever been a commercially successful artist beside Rufus Wainwright who'd been exarmarium from the get-go. I'm not a proponent of outing (unless to expose one of those unhealthy homos who's actively working to harm the gay "community"), but I have less respect for public figures who don't choose to be honest about themselves than I do for those who do; I've always felt kind of let down by Michael Stipe. Yes, I realize it's a private matter (which is why I'm against outing), but I'd be happy to explain my reasons for feeling this way if there's any interest. > ecto, on the whole, has been pretty gay friendly all along Of course I'll agree. If I didn't feel as you do, I'd never have brought it up. > (hell, we even > managed a decent sized party at my folks' house before the '93 March On > Washington). I've certainly never taken any flack for things I've said on > the subject, nor received hate mail from people offended by my mere > existance (which *has* happened on usenet). > One of the reasons I stopped posting on Usenet. > > jeff > np: _Up_, REM (fronted, of course, by finally-out-homo Michael Stipe) I must really be out of it; this is the first I've heard of this. What's the story? - --charley _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 09:48:25 -0800 (PST) From: Old Spice Subject: Re: Kitchens of Distinction - ---Xenu's Sister wrote: > > Since you and Charley are both gay, I'm not quite sure what happened > here in this thread. Something questioning, something defensive, on > the verge of being something nasty...what? Take a deep breath, you guys. I certainly wouldn't go so far as to say nasty, and I'm very sorry for anything I wrote that may have led to such a tone. I was mildly, amusedly curious about the habits/standards/vocabulary/whatever of discussions of gay-identified artists in a forum that is in no way hostile to the topic. My question was based on the presumption that such a thread would be welcome on Ecto, or at any rate not explicitly unwelcome: I meant nothing that should in any way engender a defensive or offended response. - --Charley _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 11:58:54 -0800 From: Eponine Subject: My Short List of 1998 Faves I bought a lot of really good CDs in 1998, but not many of them were actually released in 1998. So anyway, here is my (sickly-sweet) list of favorites that were actually released in '98: Tori Amos - From the Choirgirl Hotel PJ Harvey - Is This Desire? - the ladies above get an "A" from me. Rounding out my "best of" list are: Madonna - Ray of Light the Dave Matthews Band - Before These Crowded Streets Jeff Buckley - Sketches for My Sweetheart the Drunk Hole - Celebrity Skin - these artists get an "A-" from me. I have not yet heard these artists' '98 releases (but would like to eventually): Lauryn Hill Beck REM Golden Smog Smashing Pumpkins Patty Griffin Marilyn Manson K's Choice October Project Cowboy Junkies many others that I can't think of right now... Some '98 releases that get an "honorable mention" but, for one reason or another and to varying degrees, disappointed me: Heather Nova - Siren Jewel Kilcher - Spirit Pearl Jam - Yield Garbage - Version 2.0 Sarah McLachlan - Surfacing Rasputina - How We Quit the Forest Most disappointing 1998 release: Vanessa-Mae Nicholson - Storm Special Note: Lili Haydn's CD 'Lili' has "copywright 1997" all over it so I am left to assume it was officially released in 1997 (although I never saw any reviews of it until this year). That's why it's not on my list. All in all, I second Billy Corgan's opinion that 1998 was a "boring" year in (rock) music. Although I don't know a lot of the artists mentioned on the other Ectophiles' Best Of lists, so maybe it wasn't as much of a dud as I think. I can only go by what I've heard. : ) E. ------------------------------ End of ecto-digest V4 #455 **************************