From: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org (ecto-digest) To: ecto-digest@smoe.org Subject: ecto-digest V4 #281 Reply-To: ecto@smoe.org Sender: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk ecto-digest Tuesday, August 18 1998 Volume 04 : Number 281 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: Janis [Silme@ix.netcom.com] Re: out gay artists with straight following? ["Tim" ] Re: MWABT and a baby born in seven months ["Xenu's Sister" ] Various questions (Susan McKeown, Dar Williams, Noa, Valerie, ...) [Mario] Happy synths (Re: Various questions (Susan McKeown, Dar Williams, Noa, Valerie, ...) ["Xenu's Sister" ] Re: Cocteau Twins "Frosty the Snowman" [Stuart Myerburg ] Re: out gay artists with straight following? [Neal Copperman ] Re: new happy and tori ["jeffrey c. burka" ] Re: Selected New Releases for Aug. 18 [Neile Graham ] Re: new happy and tori [Stuart Myerburg ] Re:Jewel & why some people here remain enamored [ABershaw@aol.com] Re: respect for Jewel [Greg Dunn ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1998 00:01:05 +0000 From: Silme@ix.netcom.com Subject: Re: Janis Mark Lowry wrote: > > Out musicians: I know this doesn't count, but when did Janis Ian come > out? I guess it was pretty late in her career. She had a straight > following. Janis was out very early in her career. It was a shock to many when she married a man. I remember a radio interview with her at the time, and she said something along the lines of you fall in love with whom you fall in love. Ellen ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1998 16:35:32 +0000 From: "Tim" Subject: Re: out gay artists with straight following? In the same vein as Erasure and Bronksi Beat/Communards/Jimmy Somerville, how about Pet Shop Boys? Wasn't Niel always publicly out? An absolutely *excellent* sexually ambiguous band is Placebo. Probably a lot harder than most ectophiles are used to, but completely rewarding nonetheless. Its sort of art-punk, and sounds a bit like a faster Smashing-Pumpkins circa Disarm, but with more soft moments, better lyrics, and Brian Molko's high-pitched vocals. Their first album is eponymous, but they have a new album "Without You I'm Nothing". Brian is an excellent, androgynous, charismatic frontman, who has hinted at getting up to just about everything without actually saying anything, especially if the lyrics to Nancy Boy or Lady Of The Flowers are anything to go by. Nancy Boy: "Eye holes in a paper bag Greatest lay I ever had Kind of guy who mates for life Gotta help him find a wife We're a couple When our bodies double" Lady of The Flowers: "He likes your attitude He tries it on for size He spends the afternoon Between your thighs How's that for gratitude I apologise" Although no-one's *entirely* sure about Brian, the bassist Stephan has admitted that he is gay. The music though, will appeal to all (well, if you like that style) anyway, hope this interests somebody. Tim ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1998 01:57:38 -0500 From: "Xenu's Sister" Subject: Re: out gay artists with straight following? At 04:35 PM 8/18/98 +0000, Tim wrote: >Although no-one's *entirely* sure about Brian, the bassist Stephan has >admitted that he is gay. Though "politically correct" speech can at times be a pain in the neck (look at how much I hate the term "womyn"), I'd like to see the casual use of the phrase "admitted he/she is gay" banished from the lauguage. The term "admitted" implies that they did something wrong, something they expect to be punished for. A person "admits" that they stole cash from their mom's purse. A person "admits" that they robbed a gas station. A person "admits" they murdered someone. It's like saying "Vickie admitted that she's a Happy Rhodes fan" which is pretty silly sounding, right? No one, ever, "admits" to being gay. They're gay, and they just happen to tell other people that they are. Vickie (who's been "out" wrt Happy Rhodes since 1988) DIVX = GREED - Boycott Circuit City! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1998 09:00:28 +0200 From: Dirk Kastens Subject: Happy CDs in Germany Hi, I just found a new internet source for ordering CDs in Germany. It is TeleCD, "Earth's biggest musicshop" (www.telecd.de). They list all of Happy's albums at a price of 26,95 DM. That's very cheap compared to import prices. I just ordered a couple of Synergy (Larry Fast) CDs from TeleCD (don't know when they will arrive). A local record store chain (JPC) is asking 36,95 DM for each. TeleCD is selling them at 26,95! Dirk ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1998 02:16:27 -0500 From: "Xenu's Sister" Subject: Re: MWABT and a baby born in seven months At 11:07 PM 8/17/98 -0400, Valerie Kraemer wrote: >I had a very interesting week last week. On Monday, I went to my >gynecologist and found out that I was pregnant with my first child. Congratulations mama! >The CD is great. It wants to be played very, very loud. I have yet to listen to it like that. I've listened to it a couple dozen times (at least) and almost every time has been via headphones, (including the very first time) so I already think of it as a very intimate, in-your-head album. One thing about headphones, you can hear all these various sound effects and little voices that I think would be drowned out hearing it over speakers. Still, playing it loud over our big speakers is on my list of things to do. If I can ever get the darn thing out of my walkman. >I live in an inner-city neighborhood where the locals are constantly blasting salsa >and rap music out of their homes and cars. I know what it's like. We live in the same sort of situation. Our neighborhood is wonderful, very eclectic, consisting of mainly Korean, various Middle Eastern, Thai, Japanese, Swedish(!) and Spanish-speaking populations (needless to say, we're in restaurant heaven). > I can now add Happy Rhodes to the mix! :-) Vickie ps, Thanks for all the birthday wishes everybody! I had a nice evening, watching videos at home, with Chris, Charley (thanks again for the Rufus CD!) and Charley's friend Nikki. We ate pizza and cake, drank hard cider and White Russians, played the movie version of "You Don't Know Jack!" and watched the Victoria Williams documentary "Happy Come Home", "28 Up" and one of my favorite films of all time, "Local Hero." ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1998 23:24:02 -0700 From: Neile Graham Subject: Re: Respect for Jewel Fred wrote: >I know I'm going to catch it for this but for the life of me I don't >understand what Jewel has done to warrant the respect she has on this forum. Liking Jewel was a being in the right place at the right time thing. If you were lucky enough to see her live before her career took off, you'd understand why people here have a fondness for her. Her music isn't even the kind I normally like (mostly contemporary singer songwriter stuff, some of it quite funny), but ecto members sent me a tape of her songs months before her album appeared. I didn't like it at first, but it really grew on me. I was quite disappointed when the album came out because only a few of the songs I'd grown to like were on it, and IMO most of the songs on the album were her weaker ones. I still am fond of "Hey Little Sister" and "Daddy" and even "Painters" because of the lyrics but "I'm Sensitive" and "Adrian" have always made me cringe. "Who Will Save Your Soul" was ok despite its preachy nature until I heard it 100 too many times. I would love a cd version of her song "Nicotine Love" which has always been my favourite song of hers. None of her truly edgy songs or funny songs appeared on the album, though a couple like "Race Car Driver" showed up on promos. I saw her live in Seattle in a tiny cafe three times, and she was an extremely engaging performer--by the final show of 4 in Seattle (I missed one because I was out of town--believe me, that's the only reason I would have missed it) the crowd was huge and I was a committed Jewel fan. I saw her almost a year later in a bigger theatre during her tour with Edwin McCain, and still found her quite wonderful. Then about a year later I saw her at a huge theatre in Seattle. I actually hadn't planned on going, but then a net friend arranged for some excellent tickets and I thought it would be worth it. Her performance was, but with an audience that size I'd lost the personal connection I felt with her music and after so many performances her patter felt canned. (Not that you can blame her--after so many shows how could she think of something new and different to say every night?) After her utter overexposure I haven't been able to listen to the many many tapes I have of her performances and certainly don't listen to the cd. I think she had the choice of becoming a widely popular performer or being a risky, interesting one, and she chose the former. I don't disrespect her for it, but it means I'm less interested in the music she produces. Still, she has a wonderful voice and can use it in a zillion different ways. She's prolific and some of her material is wonderful, but the songs that you hear on the air everywhere aren't her best and certainly aren't her most creative. At all. And even when I was really into her music I would never have put her on the same scale as Happy, Tori, Kate, or Veda--she's never proven herself, and now I am certain never will. She's been drawn into the machine totally, and now she's last year's flavour for the general public. - --Neile - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Neile Graham ..... http://www.sff.net/people/neile ..... neile@sff.net The Ectophiles' Guide to Good Music .... http://www.smoe.org/ectoguide - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1998 12:51:02 +0200 (W. Europe Daylight Time) From: Marion Kippers Subject: Various questions (Susan McKeown, Dar Williams, Noa, Valerie, ...) Hi, Various friends have asked me various questions that I thought various somebody's on Ecto would probably know the answer to. Also, I have some questions myself. :-) Oh, and Happy is mentioned in the n.p. section. :-) So, here they are: - - Somebody wanted to know if Susan McKeown is related to Erin McKeown. Now that name looks familiar, but I don't remember how or where anymore. - - That same friend heard a rumour that Dar Williams would come to the Netherlands for some concerts. In the tourdates on the Dar Williams homepage I note several dates in the U.K. and Ireland, but no other European dates. Anybody know? - - Sarah McLachlan is getting quite a lot of airplay on the Dutch public radio with "Adia". I've heard rumours of a European edition of Lilith Fair this autumn - anybody know anything about that? - - Former Ectophile Marcel Rijs noticed a new (U.S.) album by Noa when browsing the cdnow website, "Both sides of the sea". Does anybody know anything about that album? It appears to be a compilation album of Israelian cd's she made as Achinoam Nini (with Gil Dor), but there are some new / unfamiliar titles on the tracklisting - are they new songs, or maybe different versions? Or are they just English translations of Hebrew songtitles of her latest '1998' album? - - Speaking of Noa's latest album, could anybody who speaks Hebrew give me a short introduction to that '1998' album? Translate some titles, maybe tell something about what the songs are about? For some reason with this album I feel that the lyrics are important, and I don't speak Hebrew at all. It's funny though, I never had problems with her other Hebrew songs (though I would like to read the poems by Leah Goldberg and Rachel that she put to music on the second album - haven't found them yet). - - Also, while searching for more info I found a Noa discography at http://www.sas.upenn.edu/~arubin/disc.html that mentions another new cd, "Achinoam Nini and the Israel Philharmonic Orchestra" - anybody know anything about that one? - - Finally, and I'm sorry to put this on Ecto... :-( I've been trying to reach Valerie Nozick (valerie@smoe.org) for a couple of months now, but it seems my e-mails don't get through. If you read this, Valerie, please get in touch with me so that we can finish off our trade. And to the other Valerie, congratulations on your pregnancy - hope all goes well for you! Best wishes, Marion n.p. Happy Rhodes - Rearmament (still growing on me, thank you all for your comments. I think the reason why I didn't like it is the sound of the keyboards. Don't know how to explain that in English, but for me there is something irritating about that sound which distracts me from the music. Also, ''Til the dawn breaks' somehow got on my nerves - still does a little bit, but it's getting less. Now, after repeated listening to it I seem to get used to it or get past it, and I'm discovering the beauty of the songs more and more... :-) ) n.r. in between books, just finished T.H. White - The once and future king (I finally started to get into it from about part 3, about Lancelot and the quest for the Holy Grail, but it's not my favourite Arthur book...) - ---------------------- Marion Kippers Marion.Kippers@wkap.nl ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1998 07:15:23 -0500 From: "Xenu's Sister" Subject: Happy synths (Re: Various questions (Susan McKeown, Dar Williams, Noa, Valerie, ...) At 12:51 PM 8/18/98 +0200, Marion Kippers wrote: (I hate to chop, but I don't know the answers to any of your questions, sorry!) >n.p. Happy Rhodes - Rearmament (still growing on me, thank you all >for your comments. I think the reason why I didn't like it is the >sound of the keyboards. Don't know how to explain that in English, >but for me there is something irritating about that sound which >distracts me from the music. I can understand that. Happy did a lot of synth experimentation on that album and not everything is successful to everyone. To this day, I still hate the glub-glub synth sound of "The Issue Is" and the farty makes-me-want-to-scratch-my-eyeballs-out synth sound of "Box H.A.P." and I almost always skip them when I listen to the album. I think it's those 2 songs that keep Rearmament from being my very favorite Happy album. It's a shame, because I really do love everything else about those particular songs, the voices, the music and the lyrics (especially "Box H.A.P." which I'd *love* to hear done just once with a different arrangement, such as swirly violins and cellos. That's one of Happy's best songs, lyrically, IMHO, and it's brilliant how the background voice responds to and questions the foreground voice.) > Also, ''Til the dawn breaks' somehow >got on my nerves - still does a little bit, but it's getting less. Oooh, this song I have to talk about. Not that what I say can or will or should change how you hear it, but it really is one of my all-time favorite Happy songs. Have you ever listened to it on headphones? If not, try it a few times. Just concentrate on nothing but the song, the way it slowly builds and progresses, the way Happy uses first her high and then her low voice, alternating between the two, singing enigmatic lyrics which are creepy and comforting at the same time. It's one of those songs that, on casual listenings, seems fairly simple, but then one day out of the blue it just smacks you upside the soul, and you'll never hear it the same way again. To my ears it's one of Happy's most triumphant accomplishments. It's so powerful, it never fails to give me goosebumps or at least a shiver or two. Maybe it's just because I love thunderstorms :-). Vickie "You made your choice, now go to the end You will find your peace, when it comes Greet it, welcome it, make it stay " HTR DIVX = GREED - Boycott Circuit City! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1998 08:37:03 EDT From: Riphug@aol.com Subject: Selected New Releases for Aug. 18 Below are just some of the new releases for today. The absolute best of the bunch is Jennifer Kimball's newest album "Veering From the Wave." You can hear sound samples of the album at her website: Jennifer Kimball Official Home Page If you've never heard of her, Jennifer is best-known for being *the other half of The Story* along with Jonatha Brooke. The songs on this album are intensely emotional......if you can only afford one new cd this week......make it Jennifer's!!! Jill :D *share the music!* ******************* *Rock and Pop new releases* - -------------------------- - - JENNIFER KIMBALL - Veering from the Wave (Imaginary Road) - - SALLY FINGERETT (member of 4 Bitchin' Babes) - Silent, Silent (Shanachie) - - KATE RUSBY - Hourglass (traditional English folk) (Compass) - - HECTOR ZAZOU FEATURING KATIE MCMAHON - Lights in the Dark (Erato/Detour/Atlantic) - - Various artists - Chicago Bulls Vol. 3 (compilation of music played at their games) (Alphabet City/Atlantic) - - Various artists - Treasures Left Behind: Remembering Kate Wolf (tribute w/Dave Alvin, Nanci Griffith, Lucinda Williams, Emmylou Harris, Kathy Mattea, et al.) (Red House) - - Various artists - Utah Jazz (compilation of music played at their games) (Alphabet City/Atlantic) *Rock and Pop reissues* - ----------------------- - - KACY CROWLEY - Anchorless (w/new packaging plus newly recorded "Rebellious" and acoustic version of "Scars") (Atlantic) - - JANIS JOPLIN - Janis (box set reconfigured to smaller size) (Legacy) - - BOB MARLEY - Trench Town Rock (Pegasus) - - OTIS REDDING - Dreams to Remember: The Anthology (two CDs) (Rhino) - - Various artists - Beach Party ('60s compilation) (Del-Fi) - - Various artists - Schoolhouse Rocks the Vote (Rhino) - - Various artists - Yuletide Soiree: Party Pack (two-CD holiday set w/recipes and party planner) (Rhino) For the complete listings of new releases, check www.icemagazine.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1998 08:41:12 EDT From: Riphug@aol.com Subject: Fwd: NSC: CD-pluscore This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - --part0_903444073_boundary Content-ID: <0_903444073@inet_out.mail.aol.com.1> Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII - --part0_903444073_boundary Content-ID: <0_903444073@inet_out.mail.aol.com.2> Content-type: message/rfc822 Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Content-disposition: inline Return-Path: Received: from relay20.mx.aol.com ([172.31.106.66]) by air17.mail.aol.com (v48.1) with SMTP; Tue, 18 Aug 1998 04:16:11 -0400 Received: from yoyo.cc.monash.edu.au (yoyo.cc.monash.edu.au [130.194.9.1]) by relay20.mx.aol.com (8.8.8/8.8.5/AOL-4.0.0) with ESMTP id DAA14358; Tue, 18 Aug 1998 03:28:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by yoyo.cc.monash.edu.au (8.9.0/8.9.0) id QAA07640 for fte-outgoing; Tue, 18 Aug 1998 16:52:46 +1000 (EST) Received: from smtp2.erols.com (smtp2.erols.com [207.172.3.235]) by yoyo.cc.monash.edu.au (8.9.0/8.9.0) with ESMTP id QAA09734 for ; Tue, 18 Aug 1998 16:52:11 +1000 (EST) Received: from erols.com (207-172-240-105.s42.as2.bsd.erols.com [207.172.240.105]) by smtp2.erols.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA07478 for ; Tue, 18 Aug 1998 02:52:45 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <35D9248E.4C989CC0@erols.com> Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1998 02:51:58 -0400 From: Dixon Lee X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I) To: FTE Subject: NSC: CD-pluscore Sender: owner-fumbling-towards-ecstasy@yoyo.cc.monash.edu.au Precedence: bulk Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Schott/DG=92s CD-pluscore Raises Bar for Interactive Music by Barry Willis August 16, 1998 Enhanced Compact Discs (ECDs) are one of a host of hybrids and mutations popping up in the garden of digital infotainment. Many ECDs have added biographical text, still pictures, short video clips, and garish graphics to bulk up the content of basic music CDs. Others provide links to fan clubs, to an artist=92s website, or to the record label=92s home page. Most such efforts could be categorized as "art for art=92s sake"---experimental projects undertaken without any clear idea as to how the finished product will be used. "Value added" is usually the justification, but rarely the result. Until now. The venerable German music publisher Schott Musik International has teamed up with classical record label Deutsche Grammophon to produce a series of Enhanced CDs with enormous added value for musicians, teachers, music students, and serious hobbyists alike. The new product, dubbed CD-pluscore, is a music recording that can be played on any normal disc player. But drop it into a computer=92s CD-ROM drive and the recording=92s musical score appears onscreen, with access t= o biographical information, performance data, and musicological analyses. Users of CD-pluscore will be able to play along with famous musicians, adding their own notations on the score if they wish---notations that are stored as files to be brought up when needed, without altering the musical performance. The score can also be printed out. Text and illustrations provide "a mass of background information for the interested listener, who will discover more about the composer and performing artist," according to Schott=92s informational website. The company claims that CD-pluscore is the "first successful synthesis of the latest computer technology" with high-quality sound "that will satisfy the most demanding audiophile." The project has been in development for almost a year. The first disc of the series was released in April, a live recording from 1997 of pianist Maurizio Pollini performing three Beethoven piano sonatas, Opp.22, 26, and 53. The score was synchronized to the performance by hand, bar by bar, according to Schott Musik=92s multimedia division manager Katya Kratzer. She noted that, apart from his phrasing, Pollini did not improvise on the score, or miss any notes during the recording. "It=92s really amazing how you can synchronize Pollini=92s playing to the score," she said. Pollini=92s Beethoven CD-pluscore is priced similarly to other DG releases, as will be all future releases in the new format. Upcoming releases will include embedded MIDI (musical instrument digital interface) files that will let users take a more active role in playing the music. Planned features include the capacity for assigning various parts to MIDI-enabled instruments, or deleting a solo in order to play it oneself, or slowing the tempo of a piece in order to memorize it note by note---an idea that Pollini nixed for his first interactive disc. He didn=92t want anybody altering his performance. from: Stereophile http://www.stereophile.com/shownews.cgi?240 Dixon, who followed Kacy outside [1] [1] this is the last time i'll be using this one, so strike up the funeral dirge BTW, anyone get what song & artist it references? dixonlee@erols.com IM: Dixoff New England Fumblers http://come.to/fumblers - - This has been a post from the fumbling-towards-ecstasy list. To unsubscribe from this list, send a message containing 'unsubscribe fumbling-towards-ecstasy' to Majordomo@yoyo.cc.monash.edu.au= . To send a message to the list, send it to fte@yoyo.cc.monash.edu.au. - --part0_903444073_boundary-- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1998 08:49:35 -0400 From: Laura Clifford Subject: Cocteau Twins "Frosty the Snowman" This song came up in conversation over the weekend. Does anyone know where and/or if this is available on CD? Thanks, Laura ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1998 08:59:45 -0400 (EDT) From: Stuart Myerburg Subject: Re: Cocteau Twins "Frosty the Snowman" On Tue, 18 Aug 1998, Laura Clifford wrote: > This song came up in conversation over the weekend. Does > anyone know where and/or if this is available on CD? It's on the Cocteau Twins' _Snow_ EP, which I still see ocassionally in stores. I also believe it showed up on some Christmas compilation called _The Coolest Christmas_. Stuart _________________________________________________________ Stuart Myerburg Information Services, Rollins School of Public Health http://userwww.service.emory.edu/~stuart _________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1998 09:02:53 -0400 (EDT) From: Stuart Myerburg Subject: Re: out gay artists with straight following? On Tue, 18 Aug 1998, Tim wrote: > In the same vein as Erasure and Bronksi Beat/Communards/Jimmy > Somerville, how about Pet Shop Boys? Wasn't Niel always publicly out? No. It was pretty much an open secret and he never really denied it, but he did the usual celebrity dance around the subject. He didn't come out until about 2 years ago around the time of _Bilingual_. Stuart _________________________________________________________ Stuart Myerburg Information Services, Rollins School of Public Health http://userwww.service.emory.edu/~stuart _________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1998 09:43:56 -0400 (EDT) From: Stuart Myerburg Subject: Re: new happy and tori On Mon, 17 Aug 1998, Jet Girl wrote: > Okay, think my all time favorite Happy song - which is > hardly that - Oh the Drears, has been supplanted by > Tragic. Oh how I love this song. "Oh the Drears" is my favorite Happy song too. "Tragic" doesn't supplant it, but that and "Looking Over Cliffs" are my favorites on _MWABT_. > Saw Tori at the MCI Center here in DC. Uggh. If it > wasn't free for me I wouldnt have gone. Something tragic > about seeing Tori as a small spec on stage compared to > the Park West where I saw her last and was practically > sitting under her. I completely did not dig the band, > and the sound was terrible from where I was sitting. > But Tori still has that magic when she's doing her solo > stuff. Really? I just saw Tori last night. I must say it was quite a different experience than seeing her on previous tours. But there is something to be said for hearing "Precious Things" and "Cornflake Girl" with a full band, not the least of which being that it cuts down on the length of that "GIRRRRLLL" Tori had taken to doing in "PT." Many of Tori's songs just work better with the full band and it was nice to hear them that way at least once. I was really pleased with the concert last night. She did everything I hoped she would do with a band and even added some wonderful surprises like "Siren," which is one of my favorites and something I was not expecting at all, and solo versions of "China" and "Cooling." Now, my dream concert would have been twice as long and been dedicated half to songs that need the full band and half to songs that work best with just Tori and the piano. But I guess that's asking a little too much. Stuart _________________________________________________________ Stuart Myerburg Information Services, Rollins School of Public Health http://userwww.service.emory.edu/~stuart _________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1998 09:48:27 -0400 (EDT) From: Neal Copperman Subject: Re: out gay artists with straight following? On Tue, 18 Aug 1998 FAMarcus@aol.com wrote: > I know I'm going to catch it for this but for the life of me I don't > understand what Jewel has done to warrant the respect she has on this forum. Neile described it realy well. It was all a time and a place thing. I think anyone who found Jewel through her live shows within the first year of her album caming out will always have a soft spot for her. Jewel's Internet fan base almost definitely started right here on ecto, when I saw her do a 15 minute set as one of 2 or 3 openers for Iris Dement (wow, I just looked that up and it was almost exactly 5 years ago... 8/23/93). After that, Jeff Hanson and I saw her (almost) weekly in a coffeehouse in San Diego for the next year. At that time, she had written over 100 songs, played 3 hour sets, and was amazing to see. We talked her up and sent out a lot of bootlegs from those shows, and a fan base started to build here, all before she was even signed. Then the record was recorded, and nothing happened. She started out on her residency tour, where she played 4 shows a month in a given city. This was pretty tough work, since she would do simultaneous residencies in places like DC, NYC, Philly, cycling between the cities for the month. I think everyone who saw her at that point became a fan. And part of the appeal was that she was this raw, unfinished talent. She had so much in her, and it wasn't clear where it would go. It certainly never seemed like she'd become immensely popular. I don't think anyone at the time thought she could be sold and marketed to such a huge audience. I've probably only listened to her album 4 or 5 times, and find it to be pretty mediocre. I'd never have become a fan if all I had to go on was the fact that someone handed me that alubm. But I can still here what thrilled me in all those early tapes. (Plus, I listen to the radio so little that I never get burnt out on radio heavy songs. I think I still haven't heard Paula Cole's Cowboy song.) One thing I do respect her for is the connections she has kept with her fan base. And I'm certainly not ready to write her off yet. I do think it would have been dramatically more beneficial for her as a musician to have achieved a much more gradual success though. Then we'd have had the chance to see her develop as a musician, rather than as a media figure. Neal now shuffling over: Peter & Wendy - Johnny Cunningham, Susan McKeown,.... Miles From Home _ Cowboy Junkies Surfacing - Sarah (interesting to compare to the above - lush, deep and satsifying vs. lush and frothy) White Town - Women in Technology Sohre - Who Will Know ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1998 09:04:30 -0500 (CDT) From: "Joseph S. Zitt" Subject: Re: new happy and tori On Mon, 17 Aug 1998, Jet Girl wrote: > Saw Tori at the MCI Center here in DC. Uggh. If it > wasn't free for me I wouldnt have gone. Something tragic > about seeing Tori as a small spec on stage compared to > the Park West where I saw her last and was practically > sitting under her. I completely did not dig the band, > and the sound was terrible from where I was sitting. > But Tori still has that magic when she's doing her solo > stuff. The Tori concert that I saw at the MCI Center was quite wonderful. Although it didn't have the intimacy of the solo gigs, the addition of the stage lighting and drums added a sense of spectacle that worked very well. (I can't say how the guitar and bass would have helped, since I couldn't hear them until the encore, during which Steve Caton did a pretty good Kevin Bartlet imitation :-]) Some songs that didn't work for me at all on the CDs came to life, and the rest were quite solid, though I wished she'd done some that she didn't. - - ---------1---------1---------1---------1---------1---------1---------- |||/ Joseph Zitt ===== jzitt@humansystems.com ===== Human Systems \||| ||/ Maryland? = <*> SILENCE: The John Cage Mailing List <*> = ecto \|| |/ http://www.realtime.net/~jzitt ====== Comma: Voices of New Music \| ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1998 10:01:10 -0400 (EDT) From: "jeffrey c. burka" Subject: Re: new happy and tori On Tue, 18 Aug 1998, Stuart Myerburg wrote: > On Mon, 17 Aug 1998, Jet Girl wrote: > > > Okay, think my all time favorite Happy song - which is > > hardly that - Oh the Drears, has been supplanted by > > Tragic. Oh how I love this song. > > "Oh the Drears" is my favorite Happy song too. "Tragic" doesn't > supplant it, but that and "Looking Over Cliffs" are my favorites on > _MWABT_. I'm fond of "Oh the Drears," but the last time I heard it (last week, I think), I was *yet again* reminded of my biggest gripe about it: lousy synth strings. Much like Vickie's recent comments about wanting "Box HAP" redone, my dream for the last *8* years has been to have a properly orchestrated and performed version of "Oh the Drears" with real strings. jeff ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1998 07:40:40 -0700 From: Neile Graham Subject: Re: Selected New Releases for Aug. 18 Jill :D wrote: >Below are just some of the new releases for today. >- KATE RUSBY - Hourglass (traditional English folk) (Compass) I have a copy of this and it's quite nice. Rusby has a rich & sweet voice and the traditional songs are simply, acoustically done but sound contemporary (because of the style of her guitar playing?). I like them because they're not New Age-y or bland or prettified, which are my major complaints with most contemporary recordings of traditional songs. I have other things i should do reviews of that have caught my ear more, but this is a nice one. - --Neile n.p. the above j.f.r. (just finished reading) P.D. James, The Children of Men, which was pretty interesting but overall I don't think I'd highly recommend it. - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Neile Graham ..... http://www.sff.net/people/neile ..... neile@sff.net The Ectophiles' Guide to Good Music .... http://www.smoe.org/ectoguide - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1998 11:24:22 -0400 (EDT) From: Stuart Myerburg Subject: Re: new happy and tori On Tue, 18 Aug 1998, jeffrey c. burka wrote: > I'm fond of "Oh the Drears," but the last time I heard it (last week, I > think), I was *yet again* reminded of my biggest gripe about it: lousy > synth strings. > > Much like Vickie's recent comments about wanting "Box HAP" redone, my > dream for the last *8* years has been to have a properly orchestrated > and performed version of "Oh the Drears" with real strings. I'm less annoyed by the cheesy synths. I guess it's because I spent the better part of the 80's listening to all sorts of even cheesier synth sounds and actively liking them. Now, some of the songs on _Rearmament_ are a little too unnatural sounding even for me, but for the most part Happy's early dabblings with synthesizers don't bother me too much. Stuart np: If I Was: The Very Best of Midge Ure and Ultravox (speaking of 80s synths) _________________________________________________________ Stuart Myerburg Information Services, Rollins School of Public Health http://userwww.service.emory.edu/~stuart _________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1998 11:28:28 EDT From: ABershaw@aol.com Subject: Re:Jewel & why some people here remain enamored On Tue, Aug 18, 1998 at 12:28:40AM -0400, FAMarcus@aol.com wrote: > I know I'm going to catch it for this but for the life of me I don't > understand what Jewel has done to warrant the respect she has on this forum. > I've listened to her cd when it came out many times as I always do to any cd I > purchase. Just to make sure I'm not missing something. There were a couple > really good songs and that was it for me. I can totally understand why many people probably feel this way about Jewel & I think I can shed light on why others remain enamored with her. If I had nothing but the POY album to go on, I would have lost interest a long time ago! That album is essentially one night at a coffeehouse for the then 19 year old songwriter. It only scratched the surface of where she was then & is nothing more than a brief moment in time compared to the over 400 songs written since then. Many of us that are still interested in Jewel remain interested because of the exposure to live recordings (& these other songs) which reveal a far more prolific talent than her one very dated album demonstrates. In a message dated 8/18/98 2:54:07 AM, Jeff wrote: >She had a new CD recorded 2 years ago, but was unable to release >it due to record company politics. From what I heard at the >concert she did in Bearsville while she was recording, the new >songs would have been wonderful. The studio (and live) band >featured T Bob Burnett and Jerry Marotta... Jeff is correct that Jewel finished a 2nd album back in 1996, but this got lost in the popularity frenzy that Atlantic had on thier hands when "You Were Meant For Me" reached such meteoric & unexpected popularity. Now that POY has finally cooled off & the time is ripe (in the eyes of Atlantic) for another major album release, Jewel chose to move on, since that 1996 album is now also extremely dated & no longer reflects her current songwriting interests or ability. She's in the studio as we speak recording another album from scratch, tentative release date is Nov. 17th, 1998. One correction on Jeff's statement about that aborted 2nd album--The core studio band did not contain T-Bone Burnett (who I personally like quite a bit!), but did feature T-Bone Wolk, Marc Schulman & Jerry Marrotta. All the best, Alan ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1998 10:51:54 -0500 (EST) From: Greg Dunn Subject: Re: respect for Jewel Neile definitely hit a chord here... > Liking Jewel was a being in the right place at the right time > thing. If you were lucky enough to see her live before her > career took off, you'd understand why people here have a > fondness for her. And how! I cherish the shows I caught before the big Atlantic machine decided she was a cash cow and decided to milk her album for every dollar they could get. :-( She was fresh, funny, and quite in tune with her audience. > I was quite disappointed when the album came out because only > a few of the songs I'd grown to like were on it, and IMO most > of the songs on the album were her weaker ones By far the best of Jewel's tunes have never been committed to CD. As a mailing list member, I've gotten many tapes of live performances with outstanding songs which will likely never be released... her live shows only occasionally feature a nugget from the vault. Jewel has written over 200 songs so far, and how many of those not on the album are ever heard nowadays? > I would love a cd version of her song "Nicotine Love" which > has always been my favourite song of hers. When we attended JewelStock (a private show for her mailing list which was arranged to coincide with the recording of her -- now discarded -- second album), she played for two and a half hours solid, and I think we heard one song from the first album. That was over two hours of the neatest, most haunting, most enchanting music I've heard in a long long time. "Nicotine Love", "His Pleasure Is My Pain" and "Moon Over Austin" stand out as the most heart-wrenching performances of the evening. We were utterly drained when we left the theater about 12:30, and yet Jewel stood around in the parking lot and talked to all of us for another hour before leaving. It was impossible to have atttended that concert and left without feeling the magic of a fascinating new singer/songwriter ready to take the world by storm. It's incredibly disappointing to realize that most of the music we heard that night won't be heard by many other people; Atlantic dumped the album she recorded that month -- and has delayed the production of a new one until Jewel herself has gotten tired of the wait and decided to move on to other things. > I think she had the choice of becoming a widely popular > performer or being a risky, interesting one, and she chose the > former. I don't disrespect her for it, but it means I'm less > interested in the music she produces. I'm not convinced it has been totally her choice; even while waiting for Atlantic to give the green light for her second album, she continued to write some excellent music. But either because she doesn't have the leverage or because she doesn't feel strongly enough about it, she failed to push for a new album when the music was fresh. Atlantic saw that they could sell millions of copies of her album without spending any additional money or effort on producing a new one. :-( I may be wrong, but I don't think she's written any new music in quite a while, and she's gotten interested in other outlets for her talents -- to the detriment of her songwriting. And so it goes... but I'll defend that music I have on tape to my final breath. :-) - -- | Greg Dunn | "Talking about music is like | | gregdunn@indy.net | dancing about architecture." | | gregdunn@aol.com | Frank Zappa | | http://www.indy.net/~gregdunn/ | (quoting Thelonious Monk) | ------------------------------ End of ecto-digest V4 #281 **************************