From: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org (ecto-digest) To: ecto-digest@smoe.org Subject: ecto-digest V4 #276 Reply-To: ecto@smoe.org Sender: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk ecto-digest Sunday, August 16 1998 Volume 04 : Number 276 Today's Subjects: ----------------- IG on radio... [00jnweiser@bsuvc.bsu.edu] Sinead Lohen? [00jnweiser@bsuvc.bsu.edu] Re: IG on radio... [Neal Copperman ] Re: Sinead Lohan? [Riphug@aol.com] Re: more Lilith [Neal Copperman ] Our day in the garden ["Tom Ditto" ] Re: *Really* evil/anti Lilith/Sarah article up on the web... [Joseph Zitt] Re: IG on radio... [Carolyn Andre ] Re: Sinead Lohan? [Carolyn Andre ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 15 Aug 1998 21:55:45 -0500 (EST) From: 00jnweiser@bsuvc.bsu.edu Subject: IG on radio... Neal writes: >Wow, I thought Closer to Fine and Galelleo(sp) were always >on the radio. Not here they weren't. ;) Where do you live, MD, right? I dunno, with the exception of one or two good college stations, the Midwest hasn't really caught on to diverting from anything off of a AAA format. Really. It's so sad. I'd never even heard of the Indigo Girls until i watched a Party of Five episode my junior or senior year of high school and heard a song from S.O. Here's what's on the stations claiming to have the "best" music of the 80's/90's here: Mariah Carey, Celine, some Paula and Sarah, some Fiona (though rare), Backstreet Boys, Natalie Imbruglia, Matchbox 20/Tonic/Third Eye Blind, a bunch of one hit wonders from 96-98, etc. Same old stuff over and over again. It's sad, really. Anyway, I'm sure they got airplay in some parts of the US, but not a lot here. jessica n. weiser / 00jnweiser@bsuvc.bsu.edu / http://adam.nettfriends.com/Jess "i'm stained all through my insides" - e.g. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 Aug 1998 21:58:50 -0500 (EST) From: 00jnweiser@bsuvc.bsu.edu Subject: Sinead Lohen? hey, I'm wondering if I could get some opinions on Sinead Lohan's new CD? I've got the promo tape with "No Mermaid" and "Don't I know" on it and like it, but how does the rest of the album compare? What's her songwriting like, are the melodies different and interesting? Has anyone else heard the Live from mountain stage featuring Dar, Joan Baez, Laura Love, Sinead, etc? It's a really good one, imho, and they all do "The Boxer" at the end and it rocks. I think it will be on repeat soon, btw, if it hasn't already happened. Please CC or email comments to me--thanks! jessica n. weiser / 00jnweiser@bsuvc.bsu.edu / http://adam.nettfriends.com/Jess "i'm stained all through my insides" - e.g. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 Aug 1998 23:41:28 -0400 (EDT) From: Neal Copperman Subject: Re: IG on radio... On Sat, 15 Aug 1998 00jnweiser@bsuvc.bsu.edu wrote: > Neal writes: > > >Wow, I thought Closer to Fine and Galelleo(sp) were always > >on the radio. > > Not here they weren't. ;) Where do you live, MD, right? I > dunno, with the exception of one or two good college stations, > the Midwest hasn't really caught on to diverting from anything > off of a AAA format. Well, a handful of their songs have definitely been played here in MD, and the earlier stuff I heard on the radio when I was in college in Utah. There was actually fairly decent stuff on the radion in Utah then, surprisingly enough. Neal np: ALison Faith Levy - The Fog Show I bought this at the Loud Family show. Alison sings backup and plays keyboards with them. In LF (NOT Lilith!), the music is quirky and aggressive, so I was really surprised by this album. It's stately and beautiful. Many songs are long and complex, clocking in at 6 to 8 minutes, and contain some very nice touches - a bit of cello, some trumpet, all paired with Alison's piano playing. It's kind of nice to hear subdued piano playing for a change. Nothing rollicking like Tori or Veda. Somely lovely instrumental opening and closing numbers. The songs haven't really sunk in yet, but they definitely merit more attention. The vibe reminds me somewhat of Carolin Lavelle's album, or how I think I remember her album, having not listened to it much or recently. ) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 Aug 1998 23:42:06 EDT From: Riphug@aol.com Subject: Re: Sinead Lohan? In a message dated 8/15/98 11:00:25 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 00jnweiser@bsuvc.bsu.edu writes: << I'm wondering if I could get some opinions on Sinead Lohan's new CD? I've got the promo tape with "No Mermaid" and "Don't I know" on it and like it, but how does the rest of the album compare? What's her songwriting like, are the melodies different and interesting? >> Jessica, I was kind of disappointed in the rest of Sinead Lohan's album, No Mermaid. I really loved the two songs on the promo tape, but it seems that several of the other tracks on the album are not quite as pretty. It struck me at times as being almost *country-sounding*. I'll listen to it again and let you know more details...... <> I didn't realize that you get that radio program in Muncie....or Indy....lucky you! I checked the Mountain Stage website (http://www.wvpubrad.org/msprograms2.htm) and can't find hide nor hair of the session you mentioned above...... Jill :D *share the music!* < Subject: Re: more Lilith On Sat, 15 Aug 1998, Birdie wrote: > This is *not* like a bunch of artists got together and decided to go out on the > road. > > It was always presented as something Sarah and her agents and > management and record company put together. > > Because of that it has always struck me - and I do believe others - as having > been primarily business movtivated. But when artists decide to go out on the road, don't they all get together with management, agents and record companies and work out the details of the tour? Aren't most tours timed to correspond to the release of a new album - basically serving as advertising and marketing of that album. While small groups may be able to avoid some of that, everything you complain about goes hand in hand with a major concert tour. > > > > Puts a whole new perspective on things doesn't it? > > > > I dunno, does it? I seem to have missed the curtain going up here. What > > has just been revealed to me? That there are commercial aspects to > > Lilith? > > Nah it would just appear that you missed the 60's and possibly parts of the > 70's..... > > Once upon a time it was about the music and the people...... Seems to me that the festival I described recently, and in my review after the event, and in the local newspaper reviews, was about just that. I didn't give a moments thought to the sponsors or logistics of the tour while I was there. I enjoyed people watching and listening to a variety of music, some annoying, some exciting. > I can feel what is missing......I can tell you don't. Lot's of things are missing. But I look at the festival for what it is, not what it isn't. I've seen most of the main stage performers in clubs when they were young and fresh. The shows were mostly all better than seeing them in an amphitheater. Much more intimate and personal. I didn't bother with Lilith I for that reason. I planned to get lawn tix for Lilith II explicitly to see the small stage acts, and ended up with seats since friends had already bought them. And it was great to see some of those performers again. (And no, I'm not dense, I'm just ignoring the other aspects of the festivals that aren't so much a part of Lilith. I'm sure there is a better sense of community at the Michigan Festival, but it's not my community, and you are right, I can't really imagine a festival that provides me that. But I went to Lilith for music, so that's what I focus on.) > > My experience certainly had the music dominating the packaging. > > The packaging is the agents on the phone to starbucks in one ear and > Jewel's management in the other ear....it's the structure and form and > content as well. If I accepted that, I couldn't listen to most of the music I love. I'm listening to the latest Cowboy Junkies disc right now. It was brought to me thanks to cooperation between musicians, technicians, managers, corporate flaks, advertisers, shippers, and probably tons of other things I can't even think of. If the content is defined by the structure and form, then everything outside of independent, self-produced and distributed artists are merely packaging. > > It's gotta have roots and influences somewhere. I can't recall a musical > > festival of this scale that focused on women performers. That seems to be > > Lilith's claim to fame, and it seems pretty undeniable. > > For your generation.... > > In the late 30's & early 40's during the war there were swingbands and entire > jazz orchestras that were 100% women..... and they toured all over. > > Every decade has it's group of outstanding women singer-songwriters > musicans and due to sheer youth and a lack of knowledge - they always do > seem to think they are the best ever. No one here has denied the existance of those women, or even said that what is happening now is musically superior to them. BUt if you have to go back almost 60 years to find an example of a largescale taveling women's event (and even your examples are individual bands), then my claim still holds. And even if examples exist in history, Lilith was widely regarded as being a questionable endeavor when it started, and it has pushed at many views and expectations of the music industry. > But you know, it really has been about all these other things...all of > which I obviously find distracting and disheartening..... Well, like I said, you see what you want to see. Clearly no one is going to make you see the event differently. But what you see as dominating the event, many of us saw as being tangential or enabling. And even when you point these things out, which I hadn't paid attention to before, I still can't see them in any other way. It's too bad you can't find anything to enjoy from Lilith, and a good thing that you are able to attend the far superior events that provide you what you want. Neal np: Cowboy Junkies - Miles From Our Home ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1998 00:19:43 -0400 From: "Tom Ditto" Subject: Our day in the garden We showed up on time, but New York State Troopers, Granite Management, Ticket Bastards and Bastard Card conspired to turn our Will Call into a two hour ordeal. Then they stripped us of our bottle of water at the gate. All of it reminded me of Stone Henge which is now a concession stand for the British National Trust. As a result of all that we missed Melanie, Donovan and some of Ritchie Havens. He was trying to do a solo vocal cover for Pink Floyd's "The Turning Away" when we came in. I guess he couldn't find a guitarist worthy of the part, but the song cries for Gilmore. Lou Reed started with the pedal to the metal and stopped suddenly 90 minutes later. There was no modulation in the set. Perhaps that's because he can only sing two or three notes. The guitar does the work. Joni complained half way through that her fingers were sticking to the strings. She finally sang the title song for the whole event when brought back for an encore, but she couldn't break out of her current instrumentation, and it sounded like another and lesser song than the anthem of Woodstock. I was disappointed. She did put "Big Yellow Taxi" right, adding a vamped final verse that bettered the recording. Her newer work has always evaded me, but being down front helped me get better acclimated. I'm not a jazz lover, and the muted trumpet backing she sometimes uses doesn't sit well with me. I want that folk rock stuff she abandoned years ago, and it's clear now how unlikely we are to hear anything of that from her again. Peter Townshend topped everyone by a mile. He bonded magically with his audience who were on their feet from the get-go. His set started with Canned Heat's "Mother's Son," and later he reprised the same 60's group with "Going to the Country" with Taj Majhal at his side as a walk-on. That was the first floor. The act rose to very great heights, playing everything from Townshend's recent work to Who tunes as early as their second single. Everything was brilliant, including the sunset that accompanied it. As the Dittos discussed the day on the ride home, we agreed that it was a good day for us. Our little tyke whose vocabulary includes a frequently used and multi-meaning word "garden" (pronounced "gawden") found friends and entertained adults. We found many sympathetic people in the crowd of 10,000 which was as varied in character as the rainbow. So it goes. I'm just sorry that Joni couldn't rise to the level of our expectations. Stepping on stage today she said, "It took 30 years to get here." but it appears by the time she arrived in Bethel she was no longer the person who missed the original Woodstock. Tom ditto@taconic.net "Do you copy? Over" ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1998 00:43:21 -0400 From: Joseph Zitt Subject: Re: *Really* evil/anti Lilith/Sarah article up on the web... Birdie wrote: > Could someone list an *out* gay artist who had their career made by > having a primarily straight following? This is a test. Elton John. What do I win? - -- - ---------1---------1---------1---------1---------1---------1---------- |||/ Joseph Zitt ===== jzitt@humansystems.com ===== Human Systems \||| ||/ Maryland? = <*> SILENCE: The John Cage Mailing List <*> = ecto \|| |/ http://www.realtime.net/~jzitt ====== Comma: Voices of New Music \| ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 Aug 1998 23:38:21 -0500 From: Carolyn Andre Subject: Re: IG on radio... >On Sat, 15 Aug 1998 00jnweiser@bsuvc.bsu.edu wrote: > >> Neal writes: >> >> >Wow, I thought Closer to Fine and Galelleo(sp) were always >> >on the radio. >> >> Not here they weren't. ;) Where do you live, MD, right? I >> dunno, with the exception of one or two good college stations, >> the Midwest hasn't really caught on to diverting from anything >> off of a AAA format. back when I used to listen to radio here in Chicago (pre-1996), I know that at least WXRT played them. And seem to recall other airplay as well - more recently WCBR. both commercial stations, tho tending 'alternative'. (tickets for their shows - from 100 seat small clubs to 2000 seat venues - nearly always have sold out within the first day - if not first few hours, and a musician friend who has seen *every show* they've done up here usually ends up buying from a scalper if she can't get in line right away on sale date). Course, since XRT was bought by GE or Westinghouse or whoever it was, I think their lineup has gotten a bit less alternative. Plus with WCBR changing formats to "boring", that's another loss. I'm pretty sure I started listening to the IGs because of radio airplay - which would have to have been before the first time I saw them, at the Newport Folk Festival in 1993 (yeah, I admit it, late bloomer). Regards, Carolyn Andre - ------------------- Chicago, IL / USA | Support Independent Music! Use the Internet candre@enteract.com | Carolyn's House of Music: http://house-of-music.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 Aug 1998 23:50:12 -0500 From: Carolyn Andre Subject: Re: Sinead Lohan? At 11:42 PM 8/15/98 EDT, you wrote: >In a message dated 8/15/98 11:00:25 PM Eastern Daylight Time, >00jnweiser@bsuvc.bsu.edu writes: > ><< I'm wondering if I could get some opinions on Sinead Lohan's new > CD? I've got the promo tape with "No Mermaid" and "Don't I know" > on it and like it, but how does the rest of the album compare? > What's her songwriting like, are the melodies different and > interesting? >> I had 'discovered' Lohan back when her song appeared on the Irish "A Woman's Heart II" compilation, and bought her first album. It was the lyrics that attracted me, I think. to my ears, so many of the currently-popular US singer/songwriters do what I call 'toomanywordsinaverse' and write in very direct language about rather intimate (emotionally, at least) personal experiences of their daily lives. Sinead's lyrics were picturesque, using (I'm way too far out of school - forget which) allegories or analogies - well, dagnabbit, word imagery. "Dreams are a kite on a windy day Free as a boat by the pier And I can see it's always me Holding her here" ok, young perhaps (befitting a 21-23 year old woman), but still ... I did find the album, musically, as Jill says, a bit of a mix of singer/songwriter and country & ballads. (actually, Irish music seems influenced by country -- a couple of years ago when I called Dara Records, their 'on hold' music was nearly always from albums or radio that contained *very country* Irish music). But it must have impressed me quite a bit at the time, because I ordered about 5 copies directly from the label in Ireland, for later sale & distribution to friends & compu-friends. When she played the mainly industry showcase here in Chicago in June (the one Vickie also attended), I felt she was a much more "secure" performer than she had been on the various Irish radio shows I had previously received tapes of. And she had quite an engaging stage presence - tho her humor wasn't any competition for Cheryl Wheeler's . I did feel, however, that I was hearing a slide to dangerous similarity between a lot of her melodies. (now I admit that, after 6 Mary Chapin Carpenter albums, I find a good bit of similarity in the later material - but, after all, that's a few more than '2nd album'). when I was in NY for the Fleadh, I had dinner with an musician type ecto-folk who had gotten her hands on an advance copy of Sinead's album - and at the time, she felt the title track was good, but the rest of the material got to sounding too much the same. Since then, *I* forgot to look for the album Wednesday when I was out getting MWABT, so can only comment on the live performance and the first album ... Regards, Carolyn Andre - ------------------- Chicago, IL / USA | Support Independent Music! Use the Internet candre@enteract.com | Carolyn's House of Music: http://house-of-music.com ------------------------------ End of ecto-digest V4 #276 **************************