From: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org (ecto-digest) To: ecto-digest@smoe.org Subject: ecto-digest V3 #54 Reply-To: ecto@smoe.org Sender: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-ecto-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk ecto-digest Monday, October 27 1997 Volume 03 : Number 054 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Paula Cole ["J. Wermont" ] Re: Shivers and tears ["J. Wermont" ] Re: ecto-digest V3 #53 [DaveLS@aol.com] Crunchy Frog heap good! [sspan ] Okay, I wasn't done yet... [sspan ] Moments In Music [emmy ] Sarah's Ottawa Show [Dave Williamson ] Paula Cole -Reply ["Kenn" ] Re: Moments In Music ["J. Wermont" ] Re: Shivers and tears [Tom Mink ] Mary Arden Collins [Horter3@aol.com] Omnichord (was:Paula Cole -Reply) ["Joanna M. Phillips" ] Re: Recording concerts [JavaHo@aol.com] June Tabor & other stories [Paul Blair ] Re: June Tabor & other stories [Neal Copperman ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 26 Oct 1997 01:02:22 -0700 (PDT) From: "J. Wermont" Subject: Paula Cole > Joyce inquired: > >>(PS - So, does anyone know what that bagpipe-like instrument in >>Garden of Eden is called?) > > I don't have the liner notes available to check right now (packed that > shelf already), but if memory serves I believe those are uillean pipes. Actually when I got home I pulled out the CD cover - it says it's called an "omnichord." Whatever that is - I've never heard of it before. > On a side note -- has anyone else listened to _Harbinger_ and then _This > Fire_ back-to-back? I remember reading when _Harbinger_ came out that > Paula Cole had very limited studio time and thus was stuck having to record > the vocals for that album even though she had a slight case of laryngitis. > It's *really* evident if you listen to both albums -- it's incredible how > much better her voice is on _This Fire_. That goes a long way toward > explaining why I like that album so much better than her first one. Interesting - I have noticed that she loses her voice on high notes, but I rather like that effect and I thought she was doing it deliberately. Oh well. I don't agree about the albums, though - I thought Harbinger was a *far* better album than This Fire. I was quite disappointed with the latter. I'm not talking about her voice now, but the quality of the songs. The songs on Harbinger are so richly emotional and exquisite. Nothing on This Fire has grabbed me at all, except I think the Cowboy song is good to dance to. YMMV, I guess. Joyce ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Oct 1997 01:31:39 -0700 (PDT) From: "J. Wermont" Subject: Re: Shivers and tears Mike Doyle wrote: > But the only song that turns on > the waterworks as consistently as "This Woman's Work" is "Kilkelly." It's a > song based on letters from a family in 19th-century Ireland to their > emigrant sons in America. The recording I have is by a folk duo called > Atwater-Donnelly; it's credited to Peter and Steve Jones. I've always really liked this song, too. The version I have is by a folk duo named Laura Burns & Roger Rosen, on their album "Light This Night," which came out in the mid-80's. I haven't listened to it for years because I have only the vinyl album and my turntable doesn't work any more (some day I have to replace it - I have a lot of great albums that I haven't been able to listen to for a long time!) Anyway, this album has some interesting covers: a song by Greg Greenway (anyone a fan of him?) and the song "Celibacy" by Marcie Boyd (whatever happened to her??). The album also boasts the likes of Patty Larkin doing backup vocals. Any ectophiles on the folkie end, who remember these performers? Joyce ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Oct 1997 08:50:07 -0500 (EST) From: DaveLS@aol.com Subject: Re: ecto-digest V3 #53 In a message dated 97-10-26 01:51:27 EST, you write: << Subject: Re: How about songs that make you cry? For me, top honors in this category go to Enya's profound "Exile" from Watermark. It also contains a fabulous Moment, in the pipes solo in the middle of the song. But when she sings "Out of these dreams, a boat / I will sail back to you", well, there I go... >> Ah...songs that inspire that lump in the throat and a tear or two...my own additions to this list must include a couple of Peter Gabriel contributions: "Wallflower," from Security, and "He Has Risen," from the soundtrack to The Last Temptation of Christ. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Oct 1997 11:53:47 -0800 From: sspan Subject: Crunchy Frog heap good! blah blah.. my weekend aquirements, 5 CDs and one t-shirt (never go directly from cashing your paycheck to the CD store) in no particular order.. Lisa Loeb - I Do single: Her new album comes out Nov. 11th, the single sounds great, I really like the second song on it, Jake, slow and introspective, prominently featuring a cello.. very nice.. The SUNDAYS - static & silence: I had a hard time picking out any favorites on this one, it's all so good.. but so far 'when I'm thinking about you' and 'cry' both really caught my ear.. highly recommended.. Listening to Lisa and this together I hear a lot of similarities I never noticed before.. Renaissance - Turn of the Cards: To quote Stan Lee, 'nuff said! Oh, that thing about song moments that stand out.. had a hard time thinking of any till one on this disc hit me in the face.. the intro to Mother Russia.. starts out with that slow, echoey piano, and then... BOOM! Adiemus 2 - Cantata Mundi: I loved the first Adiemus CD, and this one is even better... at 15 songs and 74 minutes you get your moneys worth too. Composed and conducted by Karl Jenkins with the London Philharmonic and the lovely voice of Miriam Stockley, the vocals aren't in any particular language, but rather are made up of phonetic sounds. The third track, Cantus-Song of the Spirit, is fantastic, with orchestration that reminds me of Mary Poppins Chim Chim Cheree and the music in Dr. Zhivago. Mary Arden Collins: This is a very promising sounding singer/songwriter from my local (Wilmington DE) area. Nice folky-rock with some upbeat, almost Alanisish moments. And... I found the coolest thing on the t-shirt rack, which usually has nothing but NIN, Green Day and Marilyn Manson.. a Milla shirt! Don't know how it got in there with all that other crap, but I scarfed it up quick. (and at half price.. cool) yadda yadda.. - -- ++ -dave- ++ + irc.Dal.net #Panic_Beach + + Maria McKee/Grey Eye Glances/Lisa Loeb + ++ ++ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Oct 1997 12:22:23 -0800 From: sspan Subject: Okay, I wasn't done yet... Forgot to mention.. on the subject of songs that make you all teary and junk.. the mention of Seasons in the Sun brought to mind several songs from way back when.. Vincent by Don MacLean (you know, the starry starry night song) and the song David Gates wrote in memory of his father, I believe it's called 'If'. And how about Empty Chairs at Empty Tables from Les Mis.. - -- ++ -dave- ++ + irc.Dal.net #Panic_Beach + + Maria McKee/Grey Eye Glances/Lisa Loeb + ++ ++ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Oct 1997 14:54:54 +0100 From: emmy Subject: Moments In Music Okay, so here are some of mine :-) Kate Bush - Constellation Of The Heart: 'Without the pain, there'd be no learning, without the hurt we'd never change' Ani DiFranco - Not A Pretty Girl 'Don't you think every kitten figures out how to get down, whether or not you ever show up?' Fiona Apple - Criminal 'What would an angel say, 'cause the devil wants to know' Fiona Apple - Sullen Girl 'Down under the waves, in the blue of my oblivion' Tori Amos - The Doughnut Song 'And if I'm wasting all my time.. this time..' Emmy - -,-`-<@ http://home.planetinternet.be/~elombaer/ased/ The alt.support.eating-disord F.A.Q. http://club.innet.be/~year2846 Music, Madness And Mayhem - My homepage @>-,-`-- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Oct 1997 13:01:51 -0800 From: Dave Williamson Subject: Sarah's Ottawa Show Just saw Sarah M. here in Ottawa last night (my fourth Sarah show) and I came away a little disappointed. She is still riding the crest of the Fumbling album, and for the thrid tour in a row (discounting Lilith which I didn't catch) is playing the majority of Fumbling and a minority of anything else. The key spots in the show are still Fumbling tracks, and even then quite repetitive from previous tours (e.g., the band walking off the stage at the close of the encore one by one to the Fumbling fade out) and are starting to get stale. I also thought the band was pretty flat for a good part of the show, particularly in the first 4 or 5 tunes. Good parts: Fear was awesome. It was the one point in the show where Camille Henderson was set loose, and the harmony between her and Sarah made me shiver. And Possession rocked - the guitarists came to life at that point. Low points: Sarah claiming she hadn't played Vox in about 6 years when I heard it on both Fumbling tours. She also claimed there were old songs she hadn't played in a while, but played basically the same cuts off of Touch and Solace that I've heard her play on the last two tours. I'm not quite sure why she felt the need to be deceitful. Also Ice Cream came off kinda corny with her and Ash doing their thing. Bottom line - it was a good show by the standard of what else is out there. But as with Surfacing, the lady is capable of far better. Dave. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Oct 1997 14:38:12 -0500 From: "Kenn" Subject: Paula Cole -Reply Joyce wrote: > Actually when I got home I pulled out the CD cover - it says it's > called an "omnichord." Whatever that is - I've never heard of it before. An omnichord is basically just a programmable rhythm, bass and drum machine. The one's I've seen are usually about the size of a laptop computer, they're kidney-shaped and they've got a bunch of buttons and dials on them. Bands usually use an omnichord when they want to have additional instruments playing during any given song or to add depth to instruments actually being played by the musicians. Indeed, I believe our own dear Ms. Rhodes uses an omnichord quite frequently in her own music (most effectively in her live performance of "The Issue Is" - especially the voice recording that repeats something about "the cat is going to die"). Most omnichords have the capabilities of providing guitar, harp, banjo, piano, celestina, marimba, steel drum, etc. accompaniment, in addition to several "vocal" accompaniments (almost like having a backup singer). So, basically, an omnichord is just a glamorized version of those keyboards you can buy at any retail store that have the capability of playing a bossa nova beat as an accompaniment to your own performance on the keyboard. Peace. Kenn ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Oct 1997 12:27:16 -0800 (PST) From: "J. Wermont" Subject: Re: Moments In Music > Ani DiFranco - Not A Pretty Girl > 'Don't you think every kitten figures out how to get down, whether or > not you ever show up?' Reminds me, there's an Ani song that always gives me shivers. This is not so much a musical moment as a lyrical moment - in fact I find the actual melody of this song to be fairly uninteresting, but the lyrics blow me away. And that song is "Letter to a John" on Out of Range. The song is from the point of view of a prostitute or lap dancer, sung to a john. The lines that get me all abump are: "I was eleven years old, he was as old as my dad And he took something from me I didn't even know that I had So don't tell me about decency, don't tell me about pride Just give me something for my trouble, 'cause this time it's not a free ride" Makes my hair stand up just thinking about those words! Joyce ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Oct 1997 14:53:56 -0700 From: Tom Mink Subject: Re: Shivers and tears I've always found that music has to associated with something, and there have been a few moments that did that. I was reminded of this the other night while reading Anne Rice's new book, Violin, and of all things, Green Day comes on the radio. I don't generally go in for Green Day, but for some reason, the frantic quality in the music complemented the book so perfectly, and contrasted with the snow falling outside, that somehow it just created one of those perfect moments. I'm sure the next time that song comes on, I'll pause a moment before going ahead and changing the station. Has anyone else had a time like that, where the song seemed to go with a situation so perfectly? What comes to mind for me are car songs, like I can't listen to Indigo Girls songs without wanting to go tearing down a dirt road for some reason. anyhow, back to my little corner Tomás ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Oct 1997 17:30:21 -0500 (EST) From: Horter3@aol.com Subject: Mary Arden Collins In a message dated 97-10-26 11:56:46 EST, sspan@magpage.com writes: > Mary Arden Collins: This is a very promising sounding > singer/songwriter > from my local (Wilmington DE) area. Nice folky-rock with > some upbeat, almost Alanisish moments YIPPEE!! Someone found my Mary!!! I posted about her about 6 months ago, but she had no CD out yet. (Neile has it I think :-) Mary tells me she may be doing another CD release thing at the Tin Angel. And that David Dye may be interested in doing a World Cafe about her. I am actually listneing to her right now. Rain. Love it!! OK OK...enough of my blabbering. One more thing: she is really good sounding live. And one of the sweetest people too. Webpage too! http://members.aol.com/maryarden1/MAC.html Enjoy! Tom np: Mary Arden Collins nr: Underworld (just starting) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Oct 1997 18:46:32 -0500 From: "Joanna M. Phillips" Subject: Omnichord (was:Paula Cole -Reply) > From: Kenn > To: ecto@smoe.org > Subject: Paula Cole -Reply > Date: Sunday, October 26, 1997 2:38 PM > > Joyce wrote: > > > Actually when I got home I pulled out the CD cover - it says it's > > called an "omnichord." Whatever that is - I've never heard of it before. > > An omnichord is basically just a programmable rhythm, bass and drum > machine. The one's I've seen are usually about the size of a laptop > computer, they're kidney-shaped and they've got a bunch of buttons and > dials on them. (snipping rest of very useful information!) It's the shape of an autoharp, actually...And I think you "strum" across the "strings" for the sound you want. Could someone elaborate if I am wrong (or even if I am not)? :-) fleur - --------------------------------------------------------------------- Joanna M. Phillips | "[This was music that] made you want to kick fleur@one.net | down the walls and ascend the sky on steps | of fire." --Terry Pratchett - --------------------------------------------------------------------- http://w3.one.net/~fleur/ <*> The Mouse House ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Oct 1997 20:31:14 -0500 (EST) From: JavaHo@aol.com Subject: Re: Recording concerts In a message dated 97-10-26 19:17:09 EST, denneuli@lifl.fr writes: << I know that some of you are already doing it so I am looking for advices on this topic like : - what kind of recorder to buy (DAT or audio) - what kind of microphone to use - the best place to stand (close to the speakers, close to the stage,...) >> Having been an audio engineer for 10 years, I thought I might comment on Yves' questions. -because the DAT format is digital, you will not get the tape hiss/degradation that is found with analog tape. However, DAT is still possibly prohibitively expensive (depending on other uses you might have for your deck). There are pros and cons, and I'm not up to speed on consumer gear (especially the portable kind) and the related costs. If you are a musician and have a need for a DAT machine, then you might think about getting one that will serve multiple uses. If you just want a deck to record concerts, a high-end analog unit will get you what you need. -regarding microphones...this is another one of those "it depends" kind of questions. Generally speaking, condensor mics produce a crisper, more accurate high-end signal. They also require a power supply and can distort much more easily. They are often more expensive than dynamics. Dynamics are more durable, require no power, and produce a warmer sound. You can get some inexpensive dynamics that will do nicely. A quick note here...compare the frequency range of the mic with that of the tape deck (if analog) that you are going to buy. No sense spending money on a nice crisp condenser if your tape deck takes a substantial nose-dive in the high frequencies. Another thing to note...microphones are directional. If you get cardioids (uni-directional), they pick up what is in front of them. Bi-directionals pick up front and back (or side-to-side...depending on how the mic is placed). Omnidirectionals pick up in a spherical pattern (something to avoid in a live setting). Mics are usually either just cardioid or multidirectional (dual-diaphragms which allow you to choose uni-, bi-, omni-, etc. patterns...these are more expensive). PZMs (pressure-zone microphones) are hemispherical and are usually set on a flat surface so that you can tape them to the wall. -where to stand? Wherever it sounds best to you. What you hear is what your microphone will pick up. Your best bet for live recordings is with small intimate settings...less crowd noise. If you are trying to record large concerts...well, it really doesn't matter what kind of tape deck, mic, or placement you use...you are going to hear mostly the people around you and a lot of bass. Hardly worth the expense. Also, in the U.S. anyway, many acts do not allow audience members to record them. Here's one that gets me every time. Many folks try to use a little hand-held self-contained unit and stick it in their shirt pocket or hold it up in front of them. Don't bother. You will hear one of several things...cloth rubbing back and forth on the mic, every breath that you take, every word that you speak, every word that the guy next to you speaks, etc. You get the picture. Bottom line (and really, aren't you all glad that I finally got to the point?!) is that it is difficult under the best circumstances (small setting, permission/cooperation of the band, your choice of mic placement) to get a good quality recording. If these conditions do not exist, save your money for better things, get an inexpensive deck, and hope to capture the feel, if not the quality, of the performance. Knowing what I do about ectophiles, however, there are probably at least 20 of you out there that are doing some sort of really swell concert recording, and I expect that I will hear from all 20 of you to show me the error of my ways. So let me say that this is just MHO and if someone *does* have a really great set-up...I sure would like to hear about it. Until next time...Java n.p. WIWAB...Jane Siberry n.r. taking suggestions ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Oct 1997 23:39:45 -0500 From: Paul Blair Subject: June Tabor & other stories On Wed, 22 Oct 1997, samantha wrote: > is no one else going to post about how unbelievably amazing june tabor was > at the bottom line? > > were there no other ectos there? Well, ahem, yes, I was--um, we had a big push for a client this week and I've been swamped! (Say, Sam, didn't I say hi to you there?) Neal did a good job in covering the highlights of the show, which were largely the same at the Bottom Line as the ones Neal reported at the Birchmere ("di Nacht," "A Proper Sort of Gardener," "Johnny o'Bredislee"). We didn't get "Shallow Brown," but we did get a Richard Thompson cover--I don't know what the title was. Besides powerful songs, there was also comic relief: "I Only Have Lies For You" (sung about politicians)--a funny added verse on "Rosedale Fair" (I know, that's not the right title, but I can't remember the real title, only that it resembles the "Rosewood Chair" from the spoof)--and "The Maid of Islington." (I was amused to learn that a joke that's been going around the Internet recently is actually an embellishment on this bawdy song from the 1700s. Sure, I'd be glad to post it if I get requests ;-) ... ) I was impressed by the power of the songs, but somehow overall the concert didn't reach me--I felt a great deal of respect for someone who was very good at what she does and puts a lot of passion into it, but who lives in a different universe from me. (I guess also this was in part a bit because based on what someone had told me, I was expecting "folk rock," whereas this music all falls into the category I'd call "traditional"; no rock there to speak of as far as I could tell.) Meth gushed: >Before I begin, just another plug for Susan McKeown and Lindsey Horner's >new CD _Through The Bitter Frost and Snow_. I've been listening to it more >closely, and it just keeps getting better and better. Hear, hear! >Actually, now that I've read the liner notes I know that that's our own >fellow ectophile Hillary (formerly of Prime-CD) in the chorus on "There Is >No Rose"! I knew that didn't sound like Susan... :) I can't quite figure >out what "mistress of the bellows" means in the notes for "Auld Lang Syne", >though. I'm not sure I want to know. ;> What, did you picture her as the apprentice to the smith who forged the chains used in the song? (I don't remember hearing any chains...) Actually if you check the notes, you'll see that Lindsey plays the harmonium on those tracks, which is an organ that uses a bellows to force air through the reeds. My folks have a turn-of-the-century harmonium at home, with bellows that you work via pedals. Re Project Lo: >Actually, we might be at the early show, since I can just hop on the train >and woj just has to come in from work. I think I'm going to be at the early show too. I just got a copy of the album, and I like it, but not so much that I'm dying to go to both shows. If I go to the early show, then if I am blown away I can just go out after it's over and buy a ticket for the next show. :-) I had an interesting time looking for the album. Muse lists it under "Jazz Instrumental," but being skeptical I'd look in several other departments too. After visiting two Towers, several indie stores in the Village, two Coconuts and two HMVs with no success (in New York City), I stopped in to Record Explosion on a lark--it's one of those discount "bucket shops" for CDs, not what I'd consider a "real" store. Guess what--they had it, in the Jazz section. I got the only one there, but there are a few other Record Explosions around the city. I was amused by the sticker on the shrink wrap: "'a pulsating musical orgasm of cosmic proportions' -- Mike Haid" Ah, now I know why I wasn't able to find it; I wasn't looking in the adult erotic CD ROM section. I like the Happy tracks, though I still haven't quite got comfortable with "Perfection." I'm disappointed that the lyrics aren't printed, since I doubt there's any other way I'm ever going to know what the backing vocals are saying. A lot of the rest of the album is pleasant enough but not really my thing--tracks that are all introduction or transition without ever getting on the road. Is this what they call "ambient"? meth inquired (of me): >Ah, then you've never seen The Nields, have you? Katryna has been playing >the fish for as long as "Fountain of Youth" as been a song.. nope, haven't seen 'em...yet. kenn wrote: > OK... corny as I'm sure this is going to sound to probably ever last Ecto > subscriber, a song that has always made me cry is "Seasons In The > Sun" by that inimitable, one-hit wonder, Terry Jacks. and Joanna responded: >It didn't make me cry, but I do remember feelings of melancholy when I >first heard it. The version I heard first (and the one I remember) is by >The Kingston Trio Say, isn't the original version of this song French? Cant' remember the title...I seem to remember hearing a track of...oh, darn, was it Jacques Brel, or am I confused?...singing a French version. The lyrics feel more genuine and less "schmaltzy" in the French version, as I recall. Yves mentioned: > - Autour de Lucie _Selon l'humeur_ (from _Immobile_) when she sings > "sans pudeur nous implore" What's this? I only know of the one album released by Nettwerk, _Autour de Lucie_, which I listen to a lot. Are there many other albums in France? Tom=E1s challenged: >Has anyone else had a time like that, where the song seemed to go with >a situation so perfectly? I remember once I was in Turin, Italy, about to get together (after a separation of several years) with a girl I had a terrible crush on... We were to meet at noon on one of the bridges over the river. It was winter, and so foggy you could hardly see five feet in front of you. I went walking toward the bridge through the neighboring park. I was daydreaming of meeting on the bridge in the fog the way the lovers are described in "Le Pont Mirabeau" with their arms extended towards each other... And then I heard someone playing from his car stereo up on the hill this amazingly romantic piano music, loud so that it was clearly audible from far off. It was like having my own soundtrack. unfortunately she pulled up next to me five minutes later in her little =46iat, going "beep beep beep" and the mood was shattered. *sigh* Cheers, Paul ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ "Whoever knows he is deep, strives for clarity; whoever would like to appear deep to the crowd, strives for obscurity. For the crowd considers anything deep if only it cannot see to the bottom: the crowd is so timid and afraid of going into the water." --Nietzsche Paul Blair psfblair@ix.netcom.com ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 27 Oct 1997 00:38:49 -0500 (EST) From: Neal Copperman Subject: Re: June Tabor & other stories On Sun, 26 Oct 1997, Paul Blair wrote: > Say, isn't the original version of this song French? Cant' remember the > title...I seem to remember hearing a track of...oh, darn, was it Jacques > Brel, or am I confused?...singing a French version. The lyrics feel more > genuine and less "schmaltzy" in the French version, as I recall. Looks like you get the gold star. First track on my Jacques Brel tape is Le Moribond, which is unmistakenly Seasons in the Sun. Neal np: The Kindness of Strangers - The Kindness of Strangers ------------------------------ End of ecto-digest V3 #54 *************************