From: owner-ecto-digest To: ecto-digest@ns2.rutgers.edu Subject: ecto-digest V2 #25 Reply-To: ecto@nsmx.rutgers.edu Errors-To: owner-ecto-digest Precedence: bulk ecto-digest Thursday, 16 February 1995 Volume 02 : Number 025 The Ecto digest is now being generated automatically. Please send problems and questions to: ecto-owner@nsmx.rutgers.edu. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kyrlidis@templeton.cchem.berkeley.edu (Angelos Kyrlidis) Date: Tue, 14 Feb 95 16:25:34 PST Subject: Add one more tour date to those that Jeff posted. That's april 2nd in Providence at the Veteran's memorial auditorium (wherever that is). I will try to go assuming there are still tickets available when I get my act together to order them...[It just occurred to me that I should mention that that's a Laurie Anderson tour date] Let me add one more emphatic POOH to AG for their decision to not bless non-philly ectophiles with a) their presence in a concert setting (all these announcements of concerts that are NOT in New England are becoming quite annoying, well not really, but you get my point) and b) their position on the PRISM dubbing and the non-availability of the Glory Radio promo CDs to the ectophiles. Other artists that are not as struggling as she-whose- music-graces-this-list (the name Tom Robinson comes to mind) have a MUCH better attitude towards their fans. That used to be the case with AG. I seriously don't know what happened to change that but I never thought I'd see the days when ectophiles wouldn't be the first to have access to things related to Happy's music. Sorry for the tone of the above paragraph, but I have been quite pissed off at their decisions. Finally jeff w. asks: >What is SiG118? to which I respond: what is smoe? :) Angelos ------------------------------ From: justicek@edge.ercnet.com (Kim Justice) Date: Tue, 14 Feb 1995 18:30:13 -0500 Subject: Re: Cocteau Twins... At 5:17 PM 2/14/95 +0000, Just another cambian in the shadows.... wrote: >I was lucky enough for a friend of mine to give me a loan of a copy of >four calender cafe by the cocteau twins the other day and as i am now >hooked, i was wondering if anyone could fill me in on who they are/what >they have availible etc.... You are in for a treat, especially since I consider FCC to be the weakest of their albums. I have all their stuff. Two of my favorites albums are "Treasure" and "Victorialand." There used to be a 2-CD set of the "Tiny Dynamine" and "Echoes in a Shallow Bay" EPs which is quite good, too. Their early albums ("Garlands" and "Head over Heels") are a bit rougher and more aggressive in texture and sound and are an acquired taste. kj - -- justicek@edge.ercnet.com (Kim Justice) "Let's remember that music is not the music industry." - Keith Jarrett Finger my account for a special FREE music offer. No, really! ------------------------------ From: veronica sawyer Date: Tue, 14 Feb 1995 18:41:40 -0800 (PST) Subject: re: Cocteau Twins sorry i lost the original message in there somewhere, you know how it is... well i suppose i can be restrained and i am still tired from being ill but when you say Cocteau Twins the first, last, best and always thing i think is "Treasure". and yes i know it's so conVENtional and i'm not sure why noone said it already or maybe i missed it? and after you get Treasure go get everything else. ;) except maybe garlands. ok ok no i was kidding... if you can find the "Snow" ep, it has covers of "Frosty the Snowman" and "Winter Wonderland(right?)". although it's hard maybe to appreciate the full strangeness of intelligible vocals without a enjoying couple years of alogical idioglossiac vowelerious eaurophonia first, it's still beautiful. and if i verge onto a limb? again? you might also appreciate "Love Spirals Downwards" but i'm shy about seriously suggesting stuff so *definitely* hear it first. thinner, slower, darker... dare i call it Gothteau Twins? at least two albums, Idylls and another i don't remember the name of. maybe more? but *definitely* hear them before you buy... you could hate it. Love to you All! various variedous velourious, veronica - --- "England Prevails!" - Alan Moore ------------------------------ From: elisheva@netaxs.com Date: Tue, 14 Feb 1995 23:45:03 -0500 (EST) Subject: Jewel Interview Don't forget that I'm probably going to interview Jewel this friday! If there's anything you want me to ask her, PLEASE email the question(s) directly to me by friday afternoon. Thanks. /~\ C oo Jon Held DISTRIBUTION: apartment _( ^) elisheva@netaxs.com / ~\ "Internet, on a stick!" *THIS MESSAGE WAS TRANSMITTED ON 100% RECYCLED ELECTRONS* ------------------------------ From: Cheri Villines Date: Tue, 14 Feb 1995 23:14:10 -0600 (CST) Subject: jewel on fx hmmm, there may have already been a post about this; i am behind on my reading :P, but i saw jewel on fx tonight. she sang a couple of songs and chatted with the hosts. i think she was a hit! :) i am looking forward to the cd's release. cheri ------------------------------ From: justicek@edge.ercnet.com (Kim Justice) Date: Tue, 14 Feb 1995 23:43:13 -0500 Subject: re: Cocteau Twins At 6:41 PM 2/14/95 -0800, veronica sawyer wrote: >if you can find the "Snow" ep, it has covers of "Frosty the Snowman" and >"Winter Wonderland(right?)". >...you might also appreciate "Love >Spirals Downwards"...Idylls and another i don't remember >the name of. Did I say I had everything by the Cocteau Twins? I stand corrected! Are "Love Spirals Downwards" and "Idylls" EPs or what? Thanks! Bursting forth with stentorian curiousity, kj - -- justicek@edge.ercnet.com (Kim Justice) "Let's remember that music is not the music industry." - Keith Jarrett Finger my account for a special FREE music offer. No, really! ------------------------------ From: brianb@netcom.com (Brian Bloom) Date: Wed, 15 Feb 1995 05:45:38 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: Cocteau Twins > > >...you might also appreciate "Love > >Spirals Downwards"...Idylls and another i don't remember > >the name of. > > Did I say I had everything by the Cocteau Twins? I stand corrected! > > Are "Love Spirals Downwards" and "Idylls" EPs or what? Thanks! > kj > Whoa whoa whoa. "Love Spirals Downwards" is the *group*.. They have a cocteau-esque sound insofar as they also sound layered, ethereal, with the wispy, occassionally angelic female vocals. Somewhat more gothic and dark-ambient than the Twins, but very good nonetheless. I think they're on Projekt records (correct me if I'm wrong) and also appear on the 2 disc sampler "Heavenly Voices" I too have all the major releases of Cocteau: their albums, most singles, Lonely is An Eyesore, plus their collaboration with Harold Budd called "The Moon and The Melodies". I'd roughly rank my faves as: 1. Blue Bell Knoll (but only for "Carolyn's Fingers" *swoon*) 2. Treasure/Victorialand tie 4. the Budd/Twins collaboration "Moon and The Melodies" 5. Heaven Or Las Vegas 6. Four Calendar Cafe 7. The Pink Opaque ..and then on to their older stuff.. (Head over Heels/Garlands/and singles) And if you're *really* off the beaten path, Liz Frazier recently did some vocals (and that's used literally here.. I'm reluctant to call it "singing") for Future Sound Of London, on the Lifeforms 1-7 EP. It's a very organic, ambient/electronic/soundscape thing.. Very definitely *not* typical ectofodder! Hope this helps! br!an the moo-man. moo. - -- __ ____ __ ____ __ __ (__==__) /\ \ / \_\ / /\ / \ \ / |\ / /\ (oo) ( moo.) / \_\ / /\ |_| / / /| /\ \ \ / ||/ / / /-------\/ -' / /\ | |\ \/ /_/_ / / / \ \/ \ \ / |/ / / / | U.T.|| / \/ |_| \ __ \_\ /_/ / \ /\ \_\ / /| / / * ||----|| / /\ ./_/ \ \ \/_/_\_\/ \ \ \/_// / | / / ^^ ^^ \ \/ |_| \ \_\ /_/\ \ \_\ /_/ /|_/ / Br!an Bloom \__/_/ \/_/ \_\/ \/_/ \_\/ \_\/ brianb@netcom.com .. but music hides me so well, ..and reveals me.. oh well - HR ------------------------------ From: jsutton@rahul.net (Jack Sutton) Date: Tue, 14 Feb 1995 19:32:22 -0500 Subject: more jewel Greetings, I found the following post on the folk_music mailing list and thought the rapidly growing Jewel converts would be interested. I just attended a house concert for Dar Williams and thought now that might be good idea for future ecto gatherings in respect to Jewel and other ecto artist. It might be a great break for someone on the road playing those venues that Ani DiFranco describes as "where there is more bad blood than beer" you know the type. Anyway, just food for thought. Date: Tue, 14 Feb 1995 15:35:37 -0500 From: Keith D McNeil To: folk_music@nysernet.ORG Subject: Re: jewel Message-ID: Sender: Keith D McNeil Subject: Re: jewel >the last two sunday evenings i have had the pleasure of seeing a >singer/songwriter named jewel kilcher play some honest and thoughtful >music at the kendall cafe in cambridge, ma. she is a 20-yr. old, originally >from alaska, more recently of san diego. while her stage manner betrays >that she is relatively new at the game, her voice, and to a lesser extent, >her songwriting, is quite polished. and, to be honest, her rough edges >and lack of cynicism are appealing. she has apparently (unfortunately?) >been signed to atlantic records, so i'm wondering what they'll do to her, >but, regardless, after seeing her this second time, i am convinced she is >the real thing. both shows i've seen here have been free, save my time, >and well worth that. some of my musician friends were admittedly less impressed >than i by her ability with the guitar, but still quite taken by her voice >and presence. upcoming dates: > > Afterwords Cafe, Washington, DC: Feb.15,22 > Last Drop, Philadelphia, PA: Feb.17,24 > Kendall Cafe, Cambridge, MA: Feb.19,26 > Ludlow Street Cafe, New York, NY: Feb.21,28 > > mailing list: Atlantic Recording Corp. > 75 Rockefeller Plaza > New York, NY 10019 > attn: Product Development/ Jewel > -k.mcneil Jack Sutton ------------------------------ From: WretchAwry Date: Wed, 15 Feb 95 10:03:16 EST Subject: About the Happy Rhodes / Ecto FAQ First, to those who have wondered where it is, and who have written me asking for a copy, my apologies for not keeping up with it and for not getting back to you right away. I finally got around to updating it and it's ready to be sent out. This morning I posted the updated version to the following newsgroups: alt.music.ecto alt.music.enya alt.music.alternative alt.music.alternative.female rec.music.misc rec.music.info rec.music.tori-amos I won't post it to any mailing lists, but if anyone who doesn't have access to any of these newsgroups wants the FAQ, just write me. I promise I'll get back to you asap. Vickie ------------------------------ From: Chandra Lekha Sriram Date: Wed, 15 Feb 1995 10:05:12 -0500 (EST) Subject: reviews okay, none of these are directly ecto bands, so ignore me at will innocence mission--bright as yellow (ep). karen peris has been possessed by hope sandoval of mazzy star. i like both, but this is definitely a different sound for im. can't wait to see what the album brings in april. siouxsie and the banshees--the rapture. after a couple of listens, this sounds pretty good, though there's nothing that really reaches out and grabs you like, say, peekaboo, or even kiss them for me. belly--king. after the ep disappointment, i was really wary of this album, but i like it a lot. it sounds very little like throwing muses, or star, but it has its own appeal. the tunes seem a bit poppier, and tonya donnelly's voice is almost pretty in places,which is strange to hear. i think it needs to grow on me more, but it's good. that's all for now, chandra ------------------------------ From: jeffy@wam.umd.edu Date: Wed, 15 Feb 95 10:28:45 EST Subject: WRNR or SiG?! At the ectogathering last weekend, John and Neal told me about a radio station in Annapolis of which I'd never heard, WRNR, 103.1. Reception in the DC area is pretty dodgy, but if you can pick 'em up, it's worth trying. Very free-form/progressive. Anyway, I'm listening to Damian's show (wonder where he went when he left 'hfs? I did...) and the first 5 songs of his show this morn included "You R Loved" by Vic Williams, a song from Throwing Muses' _University_, a Mazzy Star song (I think off _She Hangs Brightly_), and "Pretty Good Year" by Tori. Dunno what the 5th song was, but it had male vox. In any event, there's definitely no moratorium on playing too many female-vox songs... Now we gotta make sure they have some Happy discs and are playing them. Anybody know what their request # is, or their address so we could pass that on to Suzanne? Jeff |Jeffrey C. Burka | "When I look in the mirror, I see a little clearer/ | | | I am what I am and you are you too./ Do you like | |jeffy@wam.umd.edu | what you see? Do you like yourself?" --N. Cherry | ------------------------------ From: justicek@edge.ercnet.com (Kim Justice) Date: Wed, 15 Feb 1995 10:14:14 -0500 Subject: Re: Cocteau Twins At 5:45 AM 2/15/95 -0800, Brian Bloom wrote: >Whoa whoa whoa. "Love Spirals Downwards" is the *group*.. They have a >cocteau-esque sound insofar as they also sound layered, ethereal, with >the wispy, occassionally angelic female vocals. Somewhat more gothic >and dark-ambient than the Twins, but very good nonetheless. I think they're >on Projekt records (correct me if I'm wrong) and also appear on the 2 disc >sampler "Heavenly Voices" Okay. Thanks for the info! >I too have all the major releases of Cocteau: their albums, most singles, >Lonely is An Eyesore, plus their collaboration with Harold Budd called >"The Moon and The Melodies". I'd roughly rank my faves as: >1. Blue Bell Knoll (but only for "Carolyn's Fingers" *swoon*) >2. Treasure/Victorialand tie >4. the Budd/Twins collaboration "Moon and The Melodies" >5. Heaven Or Las Vegas >6. Four Calendar Cafe >7. The Pink Opaque >..and then on to their older stuff.. (Head over Heels/Garlands/and singles) Whew! Okay, I've really got it all. After FCC, I may not buy the next one without listening to it first. They seem to have gotten "stuck" in their development; I used to be able to count on each new album sounding somewhat different than the last, and I just don't feel like FCC did that. >And if you're *really* off the beaten path, Liz Frazier recently did some >vocals (and that's used literally here.. I'm reluctant to call it "singing") >for Future Sound Of London, on the Lifeforms 1-7 EP. It's a very organic, >ambient/electronic/soundscape thing.. Very definitely *not* typical >ectofodder! Scary big! I'm still waiting for someone to come out with a Yoko Ono karioke disk... kj - -- justicek@edge.ercnet.com (Kim Justice) "Let's remember that music is not the music industry." - Keith Jarrett Finger my account for a special FREE music offer. No, really! ------------------------------ From: mklprc@teleport.com (Michael Pearce) Date: Wed, 15 Feb 1995 12:17:42 -0800 Subject: Mac ezine "Black Lipstick" I like the idea and will be reading this, but you should be aware that you can _easily_ make a copy available to Windoze users as well by publishing it (actually *printing* it) into the .PDF format, Adobe Acrobat. Although you require Acrobat Reader to read the files, Adobe is giving away the reader (both Mac and Windows versions, and I believe XWindows too), so all the publisher has to do is embed the actual fonts used in the document and create the file. Any program may create a .pdf file: PageMaker, Quark, Corel, Word, etc. Only sounds and QT movies are not supported; maybe in version 3.0. Meanwhile, thanks to the popularity of Mosaic, there are sound and MPEG viewers/converters available to both platforms that work quite well. The best Mac one is Graphics Converter, $35 shareware. Of course, all PC users could trade up to a PowerMac; for the same price as a Pentium system with networking and sound card, they will have a Mac that also runs all PC programs under DOS or Windows (emulation at the speed of a 486) so they can keep all their game CDs and business apps, while getting Mac capability and the future OpenDoc (a more advanced superset of OLE). But that's enough hacking for the Ecto list; now back to your regularly scheduled music topics. - -- /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\_________________/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ | Please don't add "*@aol.com" to your twit filter. Thank you. | | mklprc@aol.com | Knowledge for the pupil -er- people. | | mklprc@teleport.com | Give them a light and they'll | | "annoying Xists since 1966" | follow it anywhere! -- Firesign | - ----------------------------->((^o0o^))<---------------------------------- ------------------------------ From: Date: Subject: [none] ------------------------------ From: Date: Subject: [none] ------------------------------ From: Date: Subject: [none] ------------------------------ From: Date: Subject: [none] ------------------------------ From: Date: Subject: [none] ------------------------------ From: Date: Subject: [none] ------------------------------ From: Date: Subject: [none] ------------------------------ From: nkg@helix.net (Neil K.) Date: Thu, 16 Feb 1995 02:10:58 -0800 Subject: Re: Cocteau Twins At around 5:45 AM on 2/15/95, Brian Bloom wrote: >I too have all the major releases of Cocteau: their albums, most singles, >Lonely is An Eyesore, plus their collaboration with Harold Budd called >"The Moon and The Melodies". [...] I'd say that the Moon and Melodies is probably one of my fave albums on all time. I can put that one on auto-repeat and never get bored! :) (maybe that reflects more on me than the music, though...) I'm also quite fond of some of the mid-early (post Sugar Hiccup) Cocteau Twins stuff, like Treasure and the Kookaburra EP. And I think Four-Calendar Cafe is pretty cool! Oh, and the last track from Heaven or Las Vegas ("Frou-frou foxes in Midsummer Fire" or whatever) is just incredible. Though oddly I think of swirling snow when I hear that track, not fire. Maybe because I remember listening to that track on a walkperson in the snow years ago. >And if you're *really* off the beaten path, Liz Frazier recently did some >vocals (and that's used literally here.. I'm reluctant to call it "singing") >for Future Sound Of London, on the Lifeforms 1-7 EP. It's a very organic, >ambient/electronic/soundscape thing.. Very definitely *not* typical >ectofodder! Really? Wow! I love the cassette of Lifeforms that Suzanne gave my housemate... didn't know it had Liz Frazier on it. Or is there more than one release with similar names? As soon as I scratch together enough money I'll probably want to buy that cassette on CD. I really like Lifeforms, though midway through one side there's this incredibly loud and very flatulent noise that sounds like an old analogue synthesizer... a *lot* louder than the rest of the tape. I wonder how many times I've disturbed the neighbours with that, late at night. :) Brrrrraaaaaaaaaaaaaaaap! - Neil K. - -- 49N 16' 123W 7' / Vancouver, BC, Canada / neilg@sfu.ca ------------------------------ From: S.L.Fagg@bnr.co.uk (Nightwol) Date: Thu, 16 Feb 1995 12:05:28 +0000 Subject: Re: laurie tour dates At 2:32 pm 14/2/95 -0800, John SUTTON wrote: >I pulled the following info from the Home Of the Brave Home Page URL listed >below. >http://www.c3.lanl.gov:8080/cgi/jimmyd/quoter?home ... stuff deleted ... >then off to Europe. So, I make my usual plea... Anybody know of any dates scheduled in Europe? Especially the UK, especially London! ;-) TTFN Steve - -- Steve Fagg a.k.a. Nightwol ( 'phone: +44-1279-402437 ) ( s.l.fagg@bnr.co.uk (work) nightwol@dircon.co.uk (home) ) *** We tried to add it all up and got merely sunrise. *** *** Try putting that in a letter to someone in exile. *** ------------------------------ From: "Just another cambian in the shadows...." Date: Thu, 16 Feb 1995 12:44:14 +0000 (WET) Subject: Cocteau Twins info thanks... Many thanks to all who gave me so much info on the cocteau twins!! whew! it looks like i'm going to have to squeeze the old bank balance a bit, but from what i can see, it will be worth it in the end.... Now if only you would all agree on what album to look for next!! *grin* thanks again bren - ---- Bren...no! Creed....no! Bren...no! Creed....aw, skrew it...Bob! :) 9021477@itdsrv1.ul.ie "Lemon pie, He's coming through, our commander still, Space Dog" ------------------------------ From: "Printshop" Date: 16 Feb 1995 08:49:09 -0500 Subject: Tickets Hey you guys and gals if anyone has extra tickets to the Sarah McLachan show on March 22 at the Warner Theatre in Washington D.C. and wants to get rid of them i'm in desperate need. You can e-mail me privately since i'm not on the list. Even if you don't have the tickets and know where i can go to get at least two please please let me know. Thanks a million in advance Bernadette ------------------------------ From: Mike Mendelson Date: 16 Feb 95 13:53:57 EST Subject: Victoria Williams News Flash I was at the Nanci Griffith / Sara Hickman show (not in that order) which was not as good as the last time I saw Nanci (which was sublime) because she had too much bass and drums and electric guitar smothering her wonderfulness and keyboardist, which really quite sucked, though Hickman was great live (!!!!!)... But what was interesting was the dufus from XRT, who once again were sponsoring an artist that they never play (they are weasels they are) except for This Heart (which was the only song that needed/sounded good with all the banging and booming (yuck, so sucky), said that Victoria Williams will be coming to town very soon to play a real show!!! Yay for us, because she was awesome at Schuba's. They did not know the date yet. Sooooo, if you find out about a VW tour schedule, please post away! I am still trying to figure how, if tix went on sale last Sat., did I buy tix for Sarah/Paula 4 weeks ago thru ticketslime (and I have the tix in hand)?!? Very bizarre. And the seats I got aren't even *that* great. Here's wishing real hard that Laurie Anderson sells out her first show at the Chicago theatre so they can open another show on Sat. night that I can actually attend (hope hope hope). - -mjm ------------------------------ From: jrshepar@indyunix.iupui.edu Date: Thu, 16 Feb 1995 15:24:51 -0500 (EST) Subject: Stuff... It's not so much a problem of being afraid to say what I want to say, it's more like I don't have anything _to_ say. I thought I'd fit right in, but then I discovered much to my terror that I only know about 15% of the musicians that are mentioned on here. But here goes. Just to be thrown out for discussion, the following entry from my CD collection: praise Great CD, although I did kinda wear myself out on it in '93. Anyone care to boot this about and discuss? Read the ecto FAQ yesterday. Happy is a Yes fan? I like her already. :-) Now I need to start scrounging money and finding excuses to go to Bloomington or Indianapolis or Clarksville or wherever has a decent record store. (The musicland at the mall here in Columbus? Nobody's that rich. Karma in Seymour? BWA HA HA HA! Mellencamp moved out of Seymour for a reason...) So lessee here, the list of stuff I need to start searching for, as it stands: 1) *anything* Happy 2) Jane Siberry's _When I Was A Boy_ 3) Ferron's _Testimony_ Oh, probably 50 or 60 more could be added to that, but it's not like I have a job or anything... it would cut too severly into my Internet use! :-) Well, anyway... Later. - -John (the Squid) Shepard ------------------------------ From: brianb@netcom.com (Brian Bloom) Date: Thu, 16 Feb 1995 13:41:48 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: Stuff... > > It's not so much a problem of being afraid to say what I want to say, > it's more like I don't have anything _to_ say. I thought I'd fit right > in, but then I discovered much to my terror that I only know about 15% of > the musicians that are mentioned on here. Don't let *that* stop you! When I first got involved with these guys (albeit back in 91), I had 2 Kate Bush albums and had actually *heard* a Cocteau Twins album the whole way through. Now, I think I've got probably 50 albums sparked by discussion just on ecto! (and the entire collection went from around 30 to nearly 500 cds, courtesy of lurking on the Net) ;) > But here goes. Just to be thrown out for discussion, the following entry > from my CD collection: > > praise > > Great CD, although I did kinda wear myself out on it in '93. Anyone care > to boot this about and discuss? I was really impressed with this then I first listened to it. It was an interesting hybrid of very ethereal melodies, some catchy pop tunes, and elements that reminded me of Enigma, Moodswings, and even Paul Simon's Graceland album. It was always a surprise to pop it in on shuffleplay... you never knew *what* to expect. I have since acquired the 'Easy Way Out' remix single which has some really slick dance mixes on it. Easily worth the 99 cents I paid for it! (There are a surpising number of albums that sound better when they're only 99 cents!) ;) br!an the moo-man - -- __ ____ __ ____ __ __ (__==__) /\ \ / \_\ / /\ / \ \ / |\ / /\ (oo) ( moo.) / \_\ / /\ |_| / / /| /\ \ \ / ||/ / / /-------\/ -' / /\ | |\ \/ /_/_ / / / \ \/ \ \ / |/ / / / | U.T.|| / \/ |_| \ __ \_\ /_/ / \ /\ \_\ / /| / / * ||----|| / /\ ./_/ \ \ \/_/_\_\/ \ \ \/_// / | / / ^^ ^^ \ \/ |_| \ \_\ /_/\ \ \_\ /_/ /|_/ / Br!an Bloom \__/_/ \/_/ \_\/ \/_/ \_\/ \_\/ brianb@netcom.com .. but music hides me so well, ..and reveals me.. oh well - HR ------------------------------ End of ecto-digest V2 #25 ************************* ======================================================================== Please send any questions or comments about the list to ecto-owner@nsmx.rutgers.edu