13-Nov-91 21:11:19-GMT,25562;000000000001 Received: from athos.rutgers.edu by aramis.rutgers.edu (5.59/SMI4.0/RU1.4/3.08) id AA10388; Wed, 13 Nov 91 15:47:30 EST Received: by athos.rutgers.edu (5.59/SMI4.0/RU1.4/3.08) id AA28875; Wed, 13 Nov 91 15:47:16 EST Date: Wed, 13 Nov 91 15:47:16 EST Message-Id: <9111132047.AA28875@athos.rutgers.edu> Errors-To: owner-ecto@athos.rutgers.edu Reply-To: ecto@athos.rutgers.edu Sender: ecto@athos.rutgers.edu From: ecto@athos.rutgers.edu To: ecto-request@athos.rutgers.edu Subject: ecto #39 ecto, Number 39 Wednesday, 13 November 1991 Today's Topics: *-----------------* Happy, music to fall asleep by (sweet dreams!) It's all in the brain the rest of the story third message (does anyone hear me?) Zine Subscriptions and International Pop Culture S King again, but Meredith, please read it... ======================================================================== Date: Tue, 12 Nov 91 20:37 CST From: vickie@chinet.chi.il.us (Vickie Ann Mapes) Subject: Happy, music to fall asleep by (sweet dreams!) Vickie here, this post appeared in rec.music.misc, and I'm posting the whole thing here. This nice fella asked me for a Warpaint for his radio station, and I hooked him up with Kevin. It's good to know that he likes it. His other choices are very interesting too. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: MURPH@MAINE.MAINE.EDU (M.A. Murphy) Subject: Re: sleepy music In article <1991Nov7.163957.9104@cbfsb.att.com>, mins@cbnewsf.cb.att.com (timothy.j.mizerak) says: >>In article aanderson@madvax.uop.edu writes: >>>I like to listen to music while I fall asleep. I've tried enya, dead can >>>dance, this mortal coil, and legendary pink dots. Anyone out there have >>>any other suggestions. I think I could use some more variety. > >I *love* to listen to music when I go to sleep but it drives my wife >nuts. I only prevail about twice a week. My favorites, Suzanne Ciani, >Elton John, Cutting Crew, Mannheim Steamroller, and slow Pet Shop Boys. >Strange, I know. I have the same 'problem', if you can call it that, with my wife. She says that when music is on she wants to 'listen' to it (imagine that! :-)), thus making it tough for her to fall asleep. My mind puts the music at the edge of my awareness, making the music more of an atmospheric thing than the focus of the current activity (the idea is to fall asleep). Thus, there are certainly a number of things that one just can't play in order to fall asleep. I often play new releases to gain a peripheral awareness of them, but some tried and true sleep albums (for me) include: |---------------------------------------------------------------------| |(an '*' preceding the artist means that I have review(s) available | |for one or more albums by that artist. Posting all of these | |reviews would be huge , so if you're interested | |in any of these reviews, please send me e-mail at Murph@Maine.Bitnet.| |Some of the newer releases listed will have reviews soon.) | |---------------------------------------------------------------------| * Elton John - lotsa stuff, but _The Superior Sound Of_ CD and the _Live in Australia_ CD both work quite well. Julee Cruise - _Floating Into the Night_. Twin Peaks Soundtrack. Both of these create an ambience very conducive to sleep for me. Gently rhythmic, repetitive dronings - soothing rather than annoying. One of my favorites to fall asleep to. Some artists/albums that regularly make their way to my turntable or cd player when I wish to sleep are: John Gorka's _Jack's Crows_ (great voice to fall asleep to) * Most anything by David Arkenstone Pink Floyd _Dark Side..._ and most anything recorded after that. * Tuck & Patti' _Tears of Joy_ * Everything by Clive Gregson & Christine Collister except _Change in Weather_ various Richard Thompson albums * Anything by Thelonious Monk * Anything by Michael Brecker * various Bruce Cockburn albums Anything by the Cocteau Twins * Anything by Cowboy Junkies Dire Straits live and also the first couple of their albums. * Anything by Nikki Meets the Hibachi * Natalie Farr's _Wondering_ * Anything by the Feelies various Dan Fogelberg albums, most notably _Nether Lands_ Ted Hawkins' _Watch Your Step_ & _On the Boardwalk_ Sam Cooke - _The Man and His Music_ * Sara Hickman's _Equal Scary People_ * Pat Kilbride's _Rock and More Roses_ Lush _Gala_ Nearly anything by Branford Marsalis various things by Wynton Marsalis James McMurtry's _Too Long in the Wasteland_ (another great voice various Joni Mitchell albums to fall asleep to) * Anything by Frank Morgan Almost anything by the Alan Parsons Project, most notably _I, Robot_ Various Prince albums Happy Rhodes' _Warpaint_ (a recent frequent visitor...) a few Kate Bush albums * Anything by Jane Siberry * The Silos' _Cuba_ and _The Silos_ Most things by Sonic Youth, especially _Goo_ Most Al Stewart, most notably _Year of the Cat_ Various Style Council albums * Swing Out Sister's _Kaleidescope World_ Various Triffids albums, most notably the _Stockholm - Live_ CD Wendy Wall's _Wendy Wall_ * Jennifer Warnes' _Famous Blue Raincoat_ various Neil Young albums depending on moods ------- Murph Michael A. Murphy MURPH@MAINE.BITNET ======================================================================== Date: 13-NOV-1991 01:07:55.14 From: MTARR@eagle.wesleyan.edu Subject: It's all in the brain Hi! Mailbox exploded BIG time today. This is getting silly. Speaking of which, I'll contribute to the latest silliness: 5'4, no clue (and no desire to know: :), blue-green-grey (depending on what I'm wearing), light brown, taken. And I get to borrow a white '79 Pinto on Wednesdays. ;) Jessica, thanks for the info. Tape forthcoming- how long should it be? Jeff, I see your points, with one exception: you basically state that if Stephen King were a bad writer, he wouldn't be where he is today. Bzzzzt, thank you for playing. Look at the whole schlock-Romance genre (with apologies to any fans out there)-- the big authors over there get automatic 6-figure advances, and earn out almost immediately. Case in point: _Scarlett_. I heard (and believe) that one reason for the choice of Alexandra Ripley to write it was, the Mitchell estate figured if they got somebody who wasn't all that hot in the writing-skill dept. to do it, nobody would buy it and they would be vindicated. Wrong. Ripley is HUGE in her field, she's making scads of $$$ on this whole thing, and people are eating it up. I spot-read five pages in the bookstore the other day. AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACK. Another case in point: (and I know people are going to go ballistic on this one, but I have to illustrate my point somehow) the success of Terry Brooks, Piers Anthony, and David Eddings. These guys sell like hotcakes and have the advances to show for it, but they really aren't good. Brooks has made a living off of blatantly ripping off Tolkien to the point of self-parody, Anthony is boring (IMO, as is all of this, of course) with no imagination, and Eddings would've been okay if he'd been able to stand up to his publisher and keep those damn 5-book series down to the trilogies he wanted them to be, but even then the results wouldn't have been all that much better. To move to film: Rambo. The Terminator. Home Alone. And I don't need to go into music. How many records have Milli Vanilli sold? Paula Abdul? New Kids On The Block? How many records *haven't* Kate Bush and Happy Rhodes sold in America? Why isn't "Brazil" a household name in Peoria? Why is there not a copy of _Five-Twelfths of Heaven_ on every bookshelf in the country? Yes, there are many exceptions, but all in all, the old adage proves true: Never Overestimate The Taste Of The American Public. And so you all don't think I'm putting any one of you down ('coz I'm not)-- we're not the American Public. The fact that Ecto (and Love-Hounds and and and) exists proves that at least some people have a clue. And what a fun bunch we are, too... ;) Hmmm- reading this over, I need to make a disclaimer: this made it sound like King is a *bad* writer. IMVHO he is, but he *is* better than some. He can put three words together and make some amount of sense. My point here is, quality and quantity of sales have very little to do with one another in this country-- sad, but all too true. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Meredith Tarr "We let the weirdness in..." mtarr@eagle.wesleyan.edu -Kate Bush +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ======================================================================== Date: Wed, 13 Nov 91 01:24:58 EST From: Caoineag Subject: the rest of the story I will never cease to be amazed at the brillance of Ecto....*sigh of joy, happiness, and wonder* it's such a wonderful album I can't get over it... as for the rest i am 5'11, hazel eyes (mostly green with brown), black hair, born at 8.23am *i think*, single, and i drive a VW Golf Gl 90 red affectionately called 'the lobster' and sports a small sebastian doll *from the Little Mermaid - one of the greatest Disney films :)* whose appendages have kate buttons on them :) that's about all - oh Doug - please tell how the interview/songs were!!! :) kIrI _____________ | |\ | | \ | \ | Kirstin A. Hargie | \ | / | hargieka@clutx.clarkson.edu | | \ | hargieka@clutx.bitnet | / | \ | | / | \ | "Only mother knows, that i'm the other half | | | The psychopath, i'm here, better fear me" | | | - Rainkeeper | Happy Rhodes | ======================================================================== Date: Tue, 12 Nov 91 15:03:00 EDT From: @cdp.igc.org:S.A..Ezust@p38.f1.n721.z5.Fidonet.Org (S.A. Ezust) Subject: third message (does anyone hear me?) Date: Tue Nov 12 15:03:42 1991 GMT+2 This is either my third or forth post to ecto, depending on whether the first attempt at sending my intro message (On oct 21) was successful. However, I haven't seen any of my msgs in the digest yet, so I may be talking to a wall, for all I know... But I shall persevere. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Someone started a thread of "power songs" which from context I interpret as songs that send shivers up people's spines, and sometimes induce tears, etc. Well, I have one I submit qualifies as such. Unfortunately, I don't remember the exact name: I taped all my CDs a week before I came here but didn't have enuf time to write down the track names, but you should be able to figger out which one it is: ======================================================================== From: Bel! Every time I listen to this, my eyes start to water, my shoulders tremble, etc etc. I sometimes listen to it with earphones and blast my ears out totally. What a song. Other songs that do this to me: Dead Can Dance: _Avatar_ (?) (the second to last song on the Spleen and Ideal CD, to which I also forgot to write the track listings of), and of course, Happy Rhodes'_Words Weren't Made for Cowards_. On the flip side, Skinny Puppy's song _God's Gift Maggot_ has a similar effect on me as well, but I guess nobody _here_ is interested in that bit of info... :-) -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Someone please e-mail me lyrics to the songs on Warpaint!!!! -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ezust@p38.f1.n721.z5.fidonet.org University of Zimbabwe, Harare Engineering CAL Project - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - NOTE: Sometimes my From: field gets adulterated, so "reply" from your end sends your message TO: someplace which doesn't = my mailbox, and it doesn't bounce back to you either. Please manually enter my address in To: field to be sure that it gets to me. -Alan ======================================================================== Date: Wed, 13 Nov 91 02:37 CST From: vickie@chinet.chi.il.us (Vickie Ann Mapes) Subject: Zine Subscriptions and International Pop Culture Vickie here. Just 2 short things this time... Jessica says: > And for those who haven't yet subscribed to the printed newsletter, > feel free to subscribe at the same time :) ($8 for 8 issues for one year) Some of the newer Ectophiles might be a bit in the dark about this. It's a fanzine that will try to reach people who are not on the net, to tell them yes, there *are* other fans out there. It should be ready soon, and Jessica will send subscriber's issues to Happy to sign. Then Happy will send them on to the people they go to. This is the first of (hopefully) many issues, and will be quite a collector's item. Now, whenever I say that, I always mean in terms of cherishibility, not monetary, value. So, if you want to have a copy signed by Happy, e-mail Jessica ASAP (in case she sends them out before she receives your subscription money) and you'll be included. ------------------------------ International Pop Culture: So far, except for Angelos, who's from Greece, we've only heard from the Americans on Pop Culture. This is an international list, so how about some thoughts from Canada, Germany, Finland, Australia and the UK? I'd be interested in knowing what pop culture is like in other countries. VM ======================================================================== Date: Wed, 13 Nov 91 02:43 CST From: vickie@chinet.chi.il.us (Vickie Ann Mapes) Subject: S King again, but Meredith, please read it... Vickie here. Poor Meredith, it must seem as if all the Stephen King fans are trying to gang up on you. I understand that you have no interest in him, really, but there are just two more things I wanted to comment on. First, I too hated "Children of the Corn" and I never even bothered to see the movie that was made from it. I've sometimes thought about seeing it just because it was Linda Hamilton's debut role (I think), but, as much as I like Linda, and Stephen King, I have no interest in watching it. Second, I was a bit disappointed in the story about your mother (teacher, and later, principal) throwing _Carrie_ away so early in the book. I was disappointed for reasons that have nothing at all to do with King himself, his writing style, or the basic plot ("girl goes crazy and blows up town") but more to do with the psychology of the characters in the book. I've often thought that Carrie should be required reading for all high school (maybe even Jr. High) students and teachers. I can't make such a broad statement without baring a bit of my soul, so here goes.... At the end of the book, the word "carrie" has entered dictionaries, and though I can't remember the definition from the book, the fact that it had become a common usage word was startling to me, because by then I had come to think of it that way too. My personal definition (taken from the character's name, but used for other people) was: "carrie... An outsider. A school-age child who is scorned and ridiculed by classmates and sometimes, teachers. A school-age child with no friends, and very few social skills. The brunt of jokes. An easy target." When I first read the book Carrie I was 17, married and with a baby boy. I had quit school because I'd gotten pregnant, but it was a big relief to quit school because I absolutely *hated* it. I hated it because nearly all my school life I had been a "carrie" and when reading the book I saw myself. Without going into excruciating and embarrassing detail about my childhood, I'll just say that, without an ounce of exaggeration, my school life was the definition I just wrote above. I could fill an entire Digest with just examples of how peers AND teachers made my life miserable growing up. I fought back sometimes, but with no friends or other backup systems, it was always futile. I became very insular, and only "put up" with school just because I had to. My off-school hours were spent alone in my room, reading or listening to music or watching TV, or I'd spend hours wandering around our farm, deep in my own imaginary mind-movies. At least I didn't come from a dysfunctional family. My parents were great, but there was very little they could do to help me. My problems came from being a "carrie" and what could they do? They couldn't change the way I was, and they couldn't change my classmates, and I never told them the problems I had with the teachers, because I was afraid of getting a bad grade if I complained. When a child starts out badly and gets a "reputation" as a dink, that reputaion stays with them their entire school life. That's how it works in a small town anyway, where the classes are small and everyone knows everyone else from kindergarten to HS graduation. I was always outside the mainstream, known as a loner, thought of as weird. If I ever tried to join in and be accepted, it never worked, because my classmates would not let me. Believe me, I tried many times. I ended up quitting school because I was so miserable. I went back, but quit again when I got pregnant. I finally did graduate, but it was with a younger class. Those people liked me, because they didn't know that I was supposed to be a carrie, they didn't know my reputation. I was married, was 20 years old, and had a 3 year old son when I went back to finish my Senior year of High School. I was supposed to have graduated in 1974. I actually graduated in 1976 (I went back to finish because I didn't want to be a statistic) and that last year was more fun than the 11 years of schooling I'd had before put together! I had lots of friends, made terrific grades and had the time of my life, because I *enjoyed* school, for the first time. It's a personal story, but I wanted to touch on it to give an idea of why the book _Carrie_ touched me so much. The character was very exaggerated, certainly, but wow, I could identify with her on many levels, including the desire to fry those who had given me such a hard time while growing up. :-> Carrie wanted desperately to fit in, but wasn't allowed. Only in the very brief, beautiful moments before the Prom tragedy did she finally feel like a normal, accepted human being. When even that good feeling was taken from her, she reacted in pain and fear and anger. I know the feeling. Before Carrie came out, there were very few "Pop Culture" books that dealt with the type of character that Carrie represented, the dink. The only one that comes to mind, and where I get the word "dink," is _Bless The Beasts And Children_ which I also loved. In that book, a group of total screw-ups go to a Summer Camp, where they are automatically segregated from the hot shots and populars and put into a cabin by themselves. These are kids from dysfunctional families, kids with mental problems, behavorial problems, unwanted outsiders all. Their counselor gets thoroughly sick of them and yells at them. It's been so many years since I've read it that I don't remember the exact speech, but paraphrasing, it was something like "NObody likes you, NObody wants you, EVERYbody hates you, you DON'T belong ANYwhere and you'll NEVER amount to ANYthing. You're just a bunch of FUCK-ups, just a bunch of DINKS" and so on and so forth. I loved that book, because in the end, though they tried to do something noble (freeing buffalo that were being killed as target practice and sport), they failed. They were still dinks, but they felt good about themselves, for the first time in their lives. I loved it, but I couldn't identify with it, because all the kids were boys. When Carrie came along I was overjoyed that finally, a female dink was being written about. The "outsider" is a common character, but normally he/she is portrayed in a romanticized way, generally in a "does-something-great-and-becomes- famous-or-saves-the-world" kind of way. With Carrie, if you take away the telekenetic powers and the Fanatical/Crazy mother, you have a character who's very familiar to an awful lot of people like me. And like Stephen King himself. And like Happy Rhodes, who had a miserable childhood too, had no friends and quit school because she couldn't stand it anymore. Take away the horror aspect, and the more exaggerated plot lines, and you have a psychological character study, not only of Carrie, but also the taunters and tormentors, and the nice people who were caught up in the "spirit" of making fun of Carrie, or at the very least, who just stood by and didn't speak up to defend Carrie. The character who asks her boyfriend to take Carrie to the prom was real to me until that point. The guilt trip decision was just a plot device. Oh well, King had to get Carrie to the prom somehow. Still, flawed as it may be in many areas, the book is powerful and fascinating to me, because of the psychology. That's why I think it should be required reading. As with many (not all :-) of SK's writings, there's much more there than meets the eye, and that he's given credit for. Maybe an English teacher wouldn't look at the book from the same angle as, say, a Psychology or Sociology teacher would, so I can understand your mother not liking it. Still, as a teacher, it's too bad that she discarded it so soon, before catching the deeper qualities of the book. The fact that it did enter Popular Culture (the movie helped it do so, even though the film has very little to do with the book) means that many, many school-age kids read it and identified with it. I hated Shakespeare until I saw the Zefferelli film of Romeo and Juliet, then I became very interested, and read the story with understanding. In the same way, teachers could use something like Carrie to get kids to talk about and understand the psychology of outsiders, or the ones who torment, or the stand-by-and-do-nothings. It could be used as an intro to many other topics that concern school-age kids, such as why is being popular so important? How can you deal with strange parents? :-), but that's a serious question for a lot of kids with strange parents. What are friends and what would it be like to not have any at all? How can kids deal with anger when they just want to lash out? Plus many, many more. It seems silly to put this heavy a burden on a mere "horror" novel, but just the fact that I think about these things in connection with Carrie will tell you that there's some serious stuff there. Um, er, or it will tell you that I'm totally off my rocker and should go To The Funnyfarm. :-) So there's my story of why I like(ed) _Carrie_ so much. I think this Stephen King thread is winding down now, but I really wanted to write this, and post it, before it goes away altogether. Meredith, thanks for your post, I really enjoyed it (especially your aunt's story :-) and don't worry at all about the "taste" remark. After meeting you in London, you could never do or say anything to get me upset, because I just like you too much and you're in my psyche as part of the KaTe Kon- venTion. ----------------------------------------- One last thing.. Jeff-with-the-long-black-hair asks: > BTW, Vickie...I was a bit confused by your Stand reference--is Franny your > favorite character or is it Tom Cullen? I would think the former (she *is* > great!) but I wasn't sure... Yes. Actually, I should have said "m-o-o-n, that spells Tom Cullen and Franny, my two favorite SK characters" but I also love Nick, Mother Abigail, Larry, Stu, Ralph, Glen, Kojak the wonder dog and even Lloyd, Harold and old Randy Flagg himself. (Just to name a few!) What wonderfully-written characters they all are! Even old Trashcan Man, the ultimate carrie, is quite amazing. Jeff, you should read the "Uncut" version at least once, so you'll have the holes filled in (such as Tom "seeing the elephant") but then read the original the next time you want to re-read The Stand for pleasure. Don't buy it, because you own the original, just check it out of the library. btw, have you ever read any of Tabitha King's books? Vickie-the-wonder-dink :-) ======================================================================== To join ecto, please send electronic mail to the following address: ecto-request@athos.rutgers.edu To have your thoughts included in the next issue, send mail to: ecto@athos.rutgers.edu To subscribe to "Ecto", the printed fanzine, send $8 to: Ecto PO Box 11291 New Brunswick, NJ 08906 Ecto is issued 8 times/year, and will include photos and as much material from non-net members as we can get! Donations above the subscription cost are welcomed - all money goes to bringing you better issues! Your "humble pseudo-moderator" -- jessica (jessica@athos.rutgers.edu)