Errors-To: ecto-owner@ns1.rutgers.edu Reply-To: ecto@ns1.rutgers.edu Sender: ecto@ns1.rutgers.edu From: ecto@ns1.rutgers.edu To: ecto-request@ns1.rutgers.edu Bcc: ecto-digest-outbound@ns1.rutgers.edu Subject: ecto #1044 ecto, Number 1044 Monday, 14 March 1994 Today's Topics: *-----------------* Happy from CDC, Brazil, & Closer Spinanes and more NIN Happy in Internet World... Re: Spinanes and more NIN Re: Tori Tix Re: Talked to Susanne... "Marketable Songs"...The *Definitive* Text :) Re: most marketable songs Stuff Kate lyrics Re: Happy from CDC & Brazil Re: Stuff ======================================================================== Date: Mon, 14 Mar 94 13:52:33 EST From: WretchAwry Subject: Happy from CDC, Brazil, & Closer JeffP asks: > Subject: Happy from CDC & Brazil > First, I ordered "Warpaint" from CDC, and when I received it Friday I found > that on the disc it said "For promotional use only." Anyone have any idea > why they sent me a promo "Warpaint?" Also, my disc has 12 tracks. I know > some of the other Happy CDs have bonus tracks. Should "Warpaint" have > bonus tracks? You're not missing any tracks, but I have no idea why they would send you a promos copy. Perhaps they sold all their others and didn't want to wait until they received more from AG. Maybe it's for a good reason, but it still means that Happy & Kevin didn't get paid for it. Very curious. Btw, Charles asked bout the song "Closer" and I e-mailed him, but thought I should say something here. Basically, there's nothing to say :-). Happy has never said anything for public consumption regarding that song. It's obviously about someone she doesn't like, and it is autobiographical. We won't hear the full story unless/until Happy ever writes an autobiography or authorizes someone else to write it. I know this for sure: She wasn't *really* in jail, it's a metaphor. The jail of her life. She *is* talking about us when she sings "every word volunteered for my army" It doesn't matter if the specific details aren't known, the song is still very important in understanding all the "depressing" songs on all the other albums. In earlier songs she was getting the demons and depression out, here she's getting the anger out. Good for her! > Second, I remember some time ago someone mentioned Kate Bush with respect > to the soundtrack to the movie "Brazil". I watched the laserdisc over the > weekend and carefully scanned the credits, but I saw no mention of Kate. > Could someone enlighten me as to her role in the film/soundtrack? The song wasn't used in the film, so I'm glad they did decide to put it on the soundtrack. Brazil is our favorite movie, so it wasn't too hard to pay full price for a 2-minute Kate song. It was supposed to be in the movie, probably during one of the extended dream sequences which Gilliam had to snip down. Terry Gilliam and Kate became good friends and Brazil's editor Julian Doyle directed her video of "Cloudbusting" and I think Gilliam got her into contact with Donald Sutherland too. Gilliam also did something for her film "The Line, the Cross, and the Curve" but I forget what. Editor maybe. Vickie ======================================================================== From: Ethan_Straffin@next.com (Ethan Straffin) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 94 11:04:49 -0800 Subject: Spinanes and more NIN Alex says: > _The Spinanes_ were given a profile treatment and a second video was > shown by them: "Sunday" (?). I liked the song they showed previously > better, but this is a first impression too. However, I am still > interested in them and think they have ectopotential. Do tell! (I knew I should have watched 120 Minutes last night.) I'll be seeing the Spinanes opening for Liz Phair on Friday night, and I know absolutely nothing about them. Speaking of concerts, Lisa and I saw Nine Inch Nails at their "surprise" gig at the Edge in Palo Alto. (This was on Friday night, just before some shithead broke into my car and stole my very-much-uninsured stereo, but we won't get into that on account of the fact that my job requires me to be nice to people. :) My final impression is pretty much the same as it was the last time I saw them: that this is not a concert where the music is the important thing. Now that may change as NIN starts playing bigger venues with better acoustics than the Edge (although I've heard plenty of "loud" bands there that managed to pull off a much better sound mix), or as Trent's hired help learn to work together musically, which I'm assuming is the main reason for these surprise previews. But in the end, most of the musical merit that might have been here was buried under a wall of noise. Trent once again opened the show with "Terrible Lie" -- a real high point on previous tours just because of the sheer drama of the song, but for some reason it just didn't come off as well this time around. (To be fair, it may have been because I was busy being crushed in a truly scary shifting mob of people trying to get closer to the stage at all costs.) Nor did Trent's stage persona help much; as usual he seemed mostly interested in looking scary and throwing equipment around, and his interaction with the audience consisted chiefly of tossing Evian bottles into it. Song selections were mostly from _Pretty Hate Machine_, plus "Pinion," "Wish" and "Suck" from _Broken_. I haven't picked up _The Downward Spiral_ yet (although I definitely will), but I believe the only songs they did from it were the single "The March of the Pigs"* and its B-side "Reptilian." Either the band needed more practice with the older material, or Trent figured that many people wouldn't have the new album yet...and at this show, if you didn't know the songs in advance, chances are you wouldn't have enjoyed them much! Ethan * Songs in 7/8 7/8 7/8 8/8 are really hard to dance to. ======================================================================== Date: Mon, 14 Mar 94 14:54:53 EST From: WretchAwry Subject: Happy in Internet World... ...thanks to our very own Brian Bloom! Brian and Valerie asked me about this (I congratulated Brian in e-mail) and neither knew about it! I assumed someone had posted about it in Ecto and I somehow missed it. Since I'm telling them, I'll tell the rest of y'all too :-) Internet World "The Magazine for Internet Users" has an article about Netcom in it and within that article are letters from netcom users. Our very own Brian Bloom writes: "I'm doing everything from maintaining the worldwide hostel network for Ectophiles (the online Happy Rhodes fan club, ecto-request@ns1.rutgers.edu for info), to MUDding, to IRC chatting, to buying and selling hard-to-find CDs, and more! I'd find it very painful not to have net access. I love it here...my online home" Brian Bloom brianb@netcom.com It's on page 70 of the March/April 1994 issue. I know this sells in the USA and Canada, but I have no idea if it's sold outside North America. It says on the cover "display until April 15th" so it shouldn't be hard to find here and in Canada. There's nothing on the cover that says it contains an article about Netcom. Good one Brian! Vickie ps, pertinents for Internet World: Internet World Editorial, 11 Ferry Lane West, Westport, CT 06880 phone (203) 226-6967, fax (203) 454-5840, e-mail meckler@jvnc.net Compuserve: 70373,616 AppleLink: meckler Letters to the editor: iw-lte@world.std.com Editorial submissions: ddern@world.std.com ======================================================================== Date: Mon, 14 Mar 1994 12:25:30 -0800 (PST) From: David Dixon Subject: Re: Spinanes and more NIN On Mon, 14 Mar 1994, Ethan Straffin wrote: > * Songs in 7/8 7/8 7/8 8/8 are really hard to dance to. > So are songs in 13/8 ("The Becoming"). God I love odd meters. D^2 ======================================================================== From: ezust@binkley.cs.mcgill.ca (Alan Ezust) Date: Mon, 14 Mar 1994 15:49:23 -0500 Subject: Re: Tori Tix [In message "Re: Tori Tix" on Mar 10, Ulrich Grepel writes:] | Hi! | | Anthony H. wonders: | > carries the mastering code DDDD (yup, 4 D's!) for Digital recording, mixing, | > mastering, and... umm... digital manufacture? :) | | Deutsche Grammphon use a technique called 4D. It basically means to get | the signal to digital as soon as possible, that is, the AD converter sits on | the stage right next to the microphone. Besides that 4D includes recording with | 21 bits with the option to go to 24 bits later. Also some other nice things | of course. I suppose your DDDD means something similar. Or something completely | different ;-). Actually, Wendy Carlos uses DDDD to mean that no analog recording technique (i.e. using a microphone) was used to create the source. She plays her synths, and the output of the synth goes directly onto digital tape. This kind of recording is difficult when there are analog instruments (such as the human voice) since humans don't have MIDI output! -- | Alan Ezust ezust@cs.mcgill.ca Montreal, Quebec, Canada | |------------- McGill University School of Computer Science ----------------| "Where is this L.L. Bean University anyway? It looks like lots of McGill students transfered from there!" ======================================================================== Date: Mon, 14 Mar 1994 21:01:24 +0000 From: S.L.Fagg@bnr.co.uk (Steve Fagg's Mac) Subject: Re: Talked to Susanne... At 8:46 pm 11/3/94 -0500, Robert Lovejoy wrote: > I spoke to Susanne again today, and she'd like to inform everyone >that AG wants you all to know that for ordering music from them, cash >isn't nesscessary. Personal checks and money orders are also fine, and >they are working on taking credit cards. Apparently somebody on ecto >told somebody that AG would only take cash when ordering albums, and >Susanne wanted to get the word out that checks and Money Orders were also >fine at this time. In case that was me being refereed to there, I confess to having told people this in the context of overseas orders. For us not in North America the bank charges on a personnal chec (or cheque as we call them) would make it quite impractical for a small sum such as an order on AG. So I recomend that people send US $ bills from overseas. Until they get a credit card facility at AG, that is! :-) -- Regards Steve Fagg ( S.L.Fagg@bnr.co.uk +44-279-402437 ) BNR Europe Ltd., London Road, Harlow, Essex, CM17 9NA, UK *** We tried to add it all up and got merely sunrise. *** *** Try putting that in a letter to someone in exile. *** ======================================================================== Date: Mon, 14 Mar 1994 17:01:59 -0500 (EST) From: Chris Sampson Subject: "Marketable Songs"...The *Definitive* Text :) As is my wont, I'm here to present what *I* see as the balanced viewpoint regarding Happy's putative "success" through the auspices of Mark Vigod (?): First Disclaimer: This ranting is purely rhetorical as the *first*, *last*, and *only* decision belongs to the Hapster herself...Godspeed her journey and her goodness". Second Disclaimer: NO, I'm not so high on myself as to actually believe that I am possessed of the one, the only, the indisputable truth...what follow are only the ideas about this offer that seem to make the most sense to me...try to stay awake :) There'll be a quiz later. First, it strikes me that monetary success in any creative field of endeavor is *good*. If H & K could live comfortably on the income from that which Happy would/must do ANYway, well, great! It gives one more time for it (or, for that matter, if ANY of us could live comfortably on the fruits of creative work, what a wonderful existence!). My favorite author, Harlan Ellison, once berated (at length....as part of a resignation speech from the post of (some office) of the science-fiction writer's association) his audience for thinking small....The argument went/goes something like this: Writing *books* is noble and good and the most important thing. The economic realities, however, suggest that it's a shitty way to make a living (he cited some stats which suggest that only abut 1% of Americans *buy* books, and that ca. 80% of those sales are one-per-year purchases, and that ca. 95% of those are Harelquin romances/Harold Robbins novels or some other tripe....). Yes, we all know that writing for TV is *evil* when one considers that totally mindless crap that passes for daring sf.... [Given these premises, he went on to suggest a radical solution] Write for TV! You'll make about $35K for 10 weeks work, TV sf will be better than ever, and the TV producers are so clueless that even the least talented of us will succeed. AND....and here's the saving grace...You will then have the rest of the year to write books (which is the important thing, anyway) without having to worry about making enough money to live. [Taken from "How You Stupidly Passed Up the Chance to Own a Kidney-Shaped Swimming Pool, Have a Mutually Destructive Relationship With Raquel Welch and/or Clint Eastwood, and Otherwise Pissed Me Off"] So, vitriol aside, the argument, IMHO stands up....though it may be only partially relevant here....I continue..... Well, is being paid royalties for having one's music played (as I-forget-who put it) behind some cheesy dream sequence in some marginal soap opera (consider the origin of the term "soap-opera") as creating and producing CDs? Or, put another way, would an otherwise creative, deep soul be cheapened by so shamelessly marketing herself (and, possibly, selling out cheap)....Well, Happy may not be a Richard Clayderman, or a Slim Whitman....:)..... Naturally, I *won't* get into the question as to whether or not supporting one's creative life by working some non-rewarding office job is any more noble than selling Cheese Doodles...(we have neither the time nor the energy.....as a matter of fact, I'd better throw in a sex scene or a chase scene about now so as to keep the attention of even *this* exceptional crowd....:) (really, not sarcastically .... :) :) Where was I? Oh yeah.... So, on the one hand, we have a certain efficiency of energy spent to fulfill one's monetary considerations whilst one is pursuing truly rewarding, creative, *necessary* work.......great, you don't need an extra wardrobe, no new training, no loans, no new equipment etc.....But, and here's where the worm (me, apparently) turns, what of one's artistic sensibilities? Or, what of one's desire not to contribute to the already too densely present "noise" of commercials and bad sitcoms and roller derby and Olympic Figure Skating controversies????? What if, in the process of securing a short-term level of comfort, an individual loses his/her self respect......I'm reminded of the scene in The Doors in which Val/Jim sees a TV backstage on which cavort a group of all-white-clad sappy singers doing their version of "Light My Fire" around a Cheverolet.....Jim speaks.... "Catchy tune....". In conclusion (Yayyyyyyyyyy!) I suggest that the answer is neither simple nor obvious. I know MY beliefs (and they're buried in the above diatribe, somewhere), but: It's Happy's life, not mine. This Mark guy may not be for real. I bid you gentle people Adieu..... .----------------------------------------------------------------------. ./| We cower in our shelters with our hands over our ears. | |/| Lloyd-Webber's awful stuff runs for years and years and years. | |/| An earthquake hits the theatre but the operetta lingers. | |/| Then the piano lid comes down and breaks his fucking fingers. | |/| It's a miracle. .-----------------------| |/| -Roger Waters "It's a Miracle" | Chris Sampson | |/| | chris@neuron.uchc.edu | |/`-----------------------------------------------`-----------------------' |///////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// `------------------------------------------------------------------------' ======================================================================== Date: Tue, 15 Mar 1994 10:09:32 +1200 From: Philip Sainty Subject: Re: most marketable songs >>I think the point is that someone as talented as Happy deserves >>success! > > Who defines success? Well I imagine Happy does in this case, but I can't imagine her idea of success does not involve wider distribution than she currently has... >>The way to success in the music industry is through wide distribution >>which is most easily accomplished by the big record labels... > > OK, usually that sounds reasonable. And? Some might say that's not > necessarily success, but rather doing what the big labels want. How so? Should an artist not desire wide distribution?? >>If the big labels are not interested in talent, then that is another >>matter entirely... but the big labels have the ability to give the wider >>distribution she deserves. > > At what price, I think is the next question. Well in a blue and fuzzy world, there would be no 'price' to pay for Happy's success... >>Also, there is no reason for an artist to change their ways after >>being picked up by a big label... I see no reason for someone to >>suddenly begin writing 'for the masses' if that was not what they >>were already doing... > > If big label wants something, big label will probably get it, else you lose > big label. Ugh. Well I imagine Happy doesn't want such a label then; but that is not the kind of label I am thinking of... In said blue and fuzzy world, Aural Gratification would have the ability to give Happy all the distribution she could desire... If this is not the case, it would be nice if Happy was picked up by a label that would do so without asking her to compromise anything... >>It all seems like a matter of artistic freedom... > >>If there are no such labels around, then that is a great shame... > > I think we basically agree, here. > > I don't think, IMHO, that we should blindly say "Happy should be on a big > label." While it would definitely be nice for her to get more > recognition, I would think she'd want it done without compromising anything. Me neither... so to clarify: I feel Happy should have lots of recognition, *possibly* through a big label who will not ask her to compromise a single thing. > Just being cynical. Just being hopeful... Philip .________________________________________. ._______. | __ _ ___ _ __ __ |\________/| | | / / | / \ | \ | | | | / | _ _ | _O_ | | \_ | | | | |__/ |__| | | \_ | / \/ \ | |/ | | / | | | | | | | | | / | \ / | |\ | | \__ \_ | \_/ | | | | |__ \__ | \ / | T W W | |________________________________________| \/ |_______| \ sainty_p@kosmos.wcc.govt.nz \________/ / `-------------------------------------------------------' ======================================================================== Date: Mon, 14 Mar 1994 16:38:42 CST From: Subject: Stuff WRT our thread on promotion, major labels, etc.: I suppose there's a differ- ence between aspiring to megastardom, in which case the homogenization pro- cess of mass marketing may play a major role; and aspiring to a comfortable if not opulent standard of living, with a substantial and stable base of fans, in which case artistic integrity has a better chance of prevailing. I'd like to believe Happy is more interested in the latter. Last Friday, _Morning Edition_ did a piece on the Spinanes. They're from Portland, they are fairly well in the emergent Northwest genre but are more melodic than the Seattle grungers, and have their own slot in Tower's bin (which was empty the other day). The next day, _All Things Considered_ had a piece on Jane Siberry, which I lost in the middle due to the need to keep my cat from running out the front door as I walked in it; but it reported that she's trying to broaden her appeal from her historic "queen of quirk" image. Today, _Fresh Air_ was to do an interview with Sam Phillips, whose new album they reviewed favorably on Friday, but they bumped it in favor of an interview with Jeffrey Dahmer's father. Go figure. Be sure to vote tomorrow if you're in Illinois. Mitch ======================================================================== Date: Mon, 14 Mar 94 14:54:33 PST From: Neal Copperman Subject: Kate lyrics I recently got photocopies of the lyrics to the b-sides discs from Kate's This Woman's Work box. They are from the Japanese box. My Canadian box doesn't have the lyrics, so I'm quite happy to have them in any format. I was told that they were at an ftp site somewhere, but friends searching only came up with a few songs. So, if they are not out there, I have them and am certainly willing to share. So, if people want me to send them their very own copies, I'll do that at cost of copying plus postage. If someone out there has a scanner or the time and desire to type them all in by hand, I'll send them a free copy. Neal ======================================================================== Date: Tue, 15 Mar 1994 09:17:00 +1000 From: Ross.Alford@jcu.edu.au (Ross Alford) Subject: Re: Happy from CDC & Brazil I probably won't be the first to reply to this, but you never know... >Date: Mon, 14 Mar 94 11:00:13 -0500 >From: pearceja%pomis.dnet@wl.wpafb.af.mil >Subject: Happy from CDC & Brazil > ... >First, I ordered "Warpaint" from CDC, and when I received it Friday I found >that on the disc it said "For promotional use only." Anyone have any idea >why they sent me a promo "Warpaint?" Also, my disc has 12 tracks. I know >some of the other Happy CDs have bonus tracks. Should "Warpaint" have >bonus tracks? Sounds very suspicious to me. The only reason I can imagine it saying "for promotional use only" is if it was originally produced for distribution to radio stations. I've seen quite a few discs so marked turn up for sale, but as secondhand, not as new. It would be interesting to know where CDC acquired it. The good (?) news is that it is probably as long as its supposed to be--my copy of Warpaint also has 12 tracks, and isn't marked as promotional (the (?) is because I wish my copy *did* have more tracks). >Second, I remember some time ago someone mentioned Kate Bush with respect >to the soundtrack to the movie "Brazil". I watched the laserdisc over the >weekend and carefully scanned the credits, but I saw no mention of Kate. >Could someone enlighten me as to her role in the film/soundtrack? Kate has collaborated with Terry Gilliam on a number of projects. She did sing on the original soundtrack of Brazil, but her contribution was never included in the finished film. It *is* supposedly on the official soundtrack CD/album, which I have never managed to run across, so I can't confirm this. Cheers, Ross -------------------------- I'm afraid *my* past is more like used motor oil ------ Ross A. Alford Ross.Alford@jcu.edu.au Department of Zoology or zlraa@marlin.jcu.edu.au James Cook University Phone: +61 77 81 4732 Townsville, Qld 4811, Australia Fax: +61 77 25 1570 ======================================================================== Date: Mon, 14 Mar 94 15:47:30 PST From: Neal Copperman Subject: Re: Stuff Personally, I wouldn't have minded hearing the interview with Jeffrey Dahmer's father. While not into most of the sensationalistic aspects of news reporting (or into news reporting at all), I did notice the book by JD's father in my favorite local bookstore and it looked fascinating. From the blurb it talks about how he first went through periods of denying the accusations, but then he goes on to examine how his son came to be how he was. I don't think he has any answers, but it's just his way of trying to understand and deal with it, and it didn't look like a trashy expose at all. Mitch, I can't believe you missed an RIP for Charles Bukoski. I thought you were on top of everyone who died (don't misread that!). Neal ======================================================================== The ecto archives are on hardees.rutgers.edu in ~ftp/pub/hr. There is an INDEX file explaining what is where. Feel free to send me things you'd like to have added. -- jessica (jessica@ns1.rutgers.edu)