Errors-To: owner-ecto@ns1.rutgers.edu Reply-To: ecto@ns1.rutgers.edu Sender: ecto@ns1.rutgers.edu From: ecto@ns1.rutgers.edu To: ecto-request@ns1.rutgers.edu Bcc: ecto-digest-outbound@ns1.rutgers.edu Subject: ecto #306 ecto, Number 306 Tuesday, 28 July 1992 Today's Topics: *-----------------* rumble guppies This & That I lost it I have no idea Geburtstagswuensch Today's your birthday friends.... bdays Fluff (tm) Re: Replies on the femme-music thread KT Rhodes San Diego (poem) ======================================================================== Date: Mon, 27 Jul 92 19:00:37 EDT From: woj@remus.rutgers.edu Subject: rumble guppies Neile Graham sez: >Just wondering--do Rainbirds have any other cds besides the self-titled >one? I just bought it at a cut out sale for $3 and love it. yup - two others: _say i'm easy, say i'm strong, love me my way, it ain't wrong_ and _two faces_. _say i'm easy..._ is similar to the self-titled release. _two faces_ is a bit mellower with more promi- nent synths. it's a bit weird at first, but grows on you. i dunno if they are available in america though - i think the second is, but the third i kinda doubt. Mitch mentionez: >Maggie's Farm i found this cd for $1 in a cut out bin a few months ago. it's not too bad, but it didn't stick me as terribly wonderful. nice voices, unused potential (isn't that the way that it goes?). vickie asked me to describe the psychowelders cd when i got it. well, i did, so i am. for starters, two comparisons: caterwaul and hetch hetchy. rhondda francis's vocals are more understandable than betsy martin's though. and the music is a little less frenetic than cater- waul. however, the bass playing is strongly similar to linda from hetch hetchy - a kinda rolling and deep that strikes a chord in my heart. i think i mentioned the phrase "in your face rock" before. that is not quite accurate as psychowelders are not a "classic rock" band by any stretch of the imagination. i was trying to capture the feel of their music which *needs* to be played loudly. musically though, it is subliminal and intricate - it feels like a woven cloth in your ears (um, i don't think i can explain that, but i can imagine the band standing before a loom while producing this record). in a word, it's excellent. if you like caterwaul or hetch hetchy, this is a definite must-buy for you. it can be ordered from her directly (for $10) by sending a note to: rhondda francis 3815 walnut #1 south kc, mo 64111 if you want to use a credit card (mc/visa), call 800/432-7639 (though it costs $12 plus postage this way). incidentially, the cd is a collector's edition with a homemade insert that is absolutely gorgeous. woj ======================================================================== Date: Mon, 27 Jul 92 21:11:47 EDT From: Vickie Mapes Subject: This & That This is a weird, busy week! My ex-sister-in-law and neice came in over the weekend and left yesterday. I hadn't seen my neice Mary in about a year so it was pretty joyous. She's 10 years old and is into Paula Abdul, so I gave her a Warpaint cassette in hopes that she comes to like it. She thought it was just too cool that my name was in the credits :-) so maybe that will help get it into her cassette player. When she was little, I'd play Kate all the time but distance has prevented me from pouring on the Happy until now. My "sis" Cathy (she's divorced from my brother but it's all extremely friendly and we're still very good friends) asked, without prompting, for me to play a bunch of Kate videos. (Warning, here comes a Kate story, but gaffa's down, so what the hell...) Way back in 1981, within a week after I recieved the compilation tape that got me into Kate, Cathy came over to my apartment with my parents. I was in Full Speed Ahead Oh-My-God-This- Woman-Is-FANTASTIC-I-*MUST*-Play-Her-For-Anyone-Who-Gets-Within-Earshot mode and I raved on and on about how I'd just gotten this tape of a woman from England who was totally unknown in America and you have to listen this is just *TOO* cool! I put on the tape and the phone rang. It was a conversation that lasted until the end of the Kate section. When I came back in I was anxious to know what they thought. They were all very polite, bless their hearts. years later Cathy told me that they were sitting there making faces and she said she thought it was the worst thing she'd ever heard in her life. Circumstances forced Adrian and I to live with Cathy, Randy and Mary for quite a few months. During that time I used to play Kate *all* the time and slowly, Cathy came to really love Kate. She was home the night I arrived (after an 80-mile round-trip) with a precious copy of "The Dreaming" single. We listened to it together and were both appalled. The difference was that I kept listening to it over and over, until I got used to it and finally came to love it. Cathy never did, so that was her last "new" Kate. All this time I thought she'd completely lost interest and then she goes and asks me to play Kate for her, saying that seeing Kate videos is a luxury for her. I'm so happy! It's just a nice feeling when people suprise you like that. We have company all this week, a nice fella from out of town who came to Chicago for SIGGRAPH. His company paid for him to attend but didn't give him any money for a hotel room. How silly! We don't mind having him here though. Chris is in hog-heaven. SIGGRAPH in Chicago!! He's attending as many different workshops and fun things as he can. For those who aren't familiar with SIGGRAPH, it's the grand-daddy of computer graphics shows. I wish I could get in to see some of the state-of-the-art thingys. Chris says "maybe" so that might be Thursday, if he can finagle it. Tonight and tomorrow night I'll be working on my shows, Wednesday night is the Chicago show, Friday night is Tori....whew! All this to say that we're not going out of our way to put on a big Katemas. Chicago-area folks are welcome to come by on Saturday and we'll sit around and watch videos and listen to music until such time as we all (hopefully, everybody will come with us) leave to go see the Psychowelders at the Beat Kitchen Saturday night. So we'll just have a mini-abbreviated, Katemas. Anytime after 1:00pm till about 6-7pm (I'm not exactly sure when Psychowelders go on. I have to find out, because they're the opening band for a group called The Slugs....!....) Woj! Thanks for the wonderful post about Psychowelders! If you get a chance, perhaps you could post something in misc, rdt, cd and anywhere else you think might be appropriate. The CD is cheap and fairly easy to get, and with your recommendation (I know people really *trust* you!) their music can get some spread-around. The parallels with Hetch Hetchy and Caterwaul were good ones, it puts them in a general "category" that I was having a hard time coming up with (Arson Garden was the closest I could come. Btw, they 'welders are trying to finalize a gig in either Bloomington or Champaign opening for Arson Garden.) Also, I completely agree with you about the CD insert, it's gorgeous! Neile, yes, I did get the Dalbello cassette last week. Thank you *very* much! I have been familiar with Dalbello for many years, but those albums were two I didn't have. One of my "I-really-can't-believe-I-found-this" LP finds a couple of years ago was an album from when she was known as "Lisa Dalbello" and it's wild! It's called _Drastic Measures_ and it was recorded in 1981. It's almost all Disco Hell, but there are a few songs that point the way to her wanting to be *eally* weird once she's finally able to take the reins. (oops, pretend I have an editor and make that *really*) Hey, wait a minute. I just went to get my Dalbello albums and found that one of the ones I have *is* once that you sent. I guess that it's been so long since I listened to the LP (I have hundreds of LPs but they hardly ever get played) that I forgot about it. I have been listening to the cassette you sent over and over and it's much easier to do that with a cassette than with an LP. Thanks for making me realize that I just re-discovered an album I have! That's great! Oh, now that I have the LP out again and I'm looking at it very closely, I see that Mary Margeret O'Hara did all the hand lettering on the album. This gets better by the second! I have one (not "once" as per above...sheesh!) Dalbello video. Does anyone in the Canadaphile area have any? The one I have is wretched quality, about 10 generations down. ... I bought 2 new (well, used) CDs yesterday. I found Tiny Lights' very first album _Prayer For the Halcyon_ and Heidi Berry's 1st (?) album _Below the Waves_. I just put on the Tiny Lights, so I can't comment on it, but I really like the Heidi Berry! I know I like it much more than her album _Love_ which is on 4AD. (Now, I do like Love, but when it came out I was told that it would soon be released in the US, so I warned people not to pay the import price for it because I didn't think it was worth $17-24. It still hasn't been released in the US as far as I know.) This older one was recorded in 1989 and it's a Canadian copy. Heidi Berry had a low (not low like Happy though) lush voice, *very* *VERY* similar to the singer in All About Eve. Seriously, they could be twin sisters as much as they sound alike. The music, which I shouldn't try to describe since I've only listened to it once, is very Julia Fordham-ish. Not torchy, but in the same species. Not ethereal at all, but very soothing. That's not very good, but the best I can do right now. I liked it, anyway, and I'll definitely be listening to it more. It's about 5 songs into the Tiny Lights album and I *really* like it too! Tiny Lights is a *very* uneven group. I always hesitate to recommend them, because I really only like a few songs by them. I make liberal use of the "skip" feature when listening to _Hazel's Wreath_ and _Hot Chocolate_ but I haven't felt the need to do that to this one yet. (Mini Tiny Lights/Happy story: They played a small bar in Kansas City called the Grand Emporium and I taped the show. Afterwards, I talked to most of the members and got show IDs from them. I marked those tapes "Tiny Lights1" & "Tiny Lights2" and then put them away. A few weeks ago I was looking for some blank tapes and I decided to go through a bunch that maybe could be taped over. I took the Tiny Lights tapes with me and listened to them on my walkman. The show was good enough that I decided to keep it. Since I hadn't listened to the tapes since the night of the concert I was suprised to hear that I had left the walkman recording while I was talking to another KKFI programmer, plus while I talked to various members of the band. I was *really* suprised when I heard myself asking this other programmer, and the people in the group, if they had ever heard of an artist named Happy Rhodes. "A friend sent me this tape last week of this woman named Happy Rhodes, spelled R-h-o-d-e-s, and it's GREAT! Have you ever heard anything about her, do you know who she is?" I've never heard of her and I just thought I'd ask." They all answered no. I had no memory of asking these questions at all! I was persistant though, because I asked 5 different people! Strange to hear blasts from the past, of a time when I had heard Happy's music, but didn't know anything at all about her and was dying for any information at all! This has turned into a rare "Vickie" which I didn't intend, so I'd better quit now. Another thing that's going to be keeping me pre-occupied the next couple of weeks is the Olympics. I wasn't interested in the Summer games of 1988, but this time around I'm finding myself hooked already. I even bought blank tapes just to get all the gymnastics, so I'll be obsessed for a while. Vickie ======================================================================== Date: Mon, 27 Jul 92 21:23:30 EDT From: Vickie Mapes Subject: I lost it No, it's not a post about Meryn Caddell, who, if I'd been on the ball, I could have told you all about months ago, because I've had the tape for ages. (The song "Job Application" had me rolling on the floor and holding my sides, because it was *exactly* what I was going through at the time) Rather, this post is to confess that I lost a post I meant to answer. Ken? Keith? I'm so sorry, I forgot who....posted something about the Femme Music Collection and I wanted to make some comments but never got around to it and then realized I had accidentally deleted it. I've been meaning to ask someone to send that post to me, so, better late than never...could someone send that post to me? Thanks muchly! Vickie ======================================================================== Date: 27-JUL-1992 22:38:50.41 From: MTARR@eagle.wesleyan.edu Subject: I have no idea Hi! Neile wonders: >Just wondering--do Rainbirds have any other cds besides the self-titled >one? I just bought it at a cut out sale for $3 and love it. Yep- two. The self-titled is the first one, then the next are: Call Me Easy, Say I'm Strong, Love Me My Way, It Ain't Wrong (no joke) Two Faces (the band at this point consists of Katharina Franck and Ulrike Haage) My personal fave is the middle one, but they're all great, if different from the others. >I really appreciate how people share their new musical interests here. It >gives me a safe way to experiment in buying new music--I can trust your >taste. Safe Music! Slogan for the masses! :) woj notes: >well, next weekend is the debut performance of the ecto band (alterna- >tively known as the kt rhodes band, the ht bush band or the microwave >generation...we've not decided if we want to change it or not) at the >boston KaTemas parTy. be there or be rhomboid. I think we should be the KT Rhodes Band, formerly the HT Bush Band, formerly Microwave Generation, formerly Fridge Magnet, formerly (insert Monty Python routine here)... One thing is for sure- we gonna ROCK- infest your ears with parasites and slide you all the way back to the world of The Sensual Joyce. :> >ps. greg's cats are mobile. my plants are not. then again, my plants talk >and greg's cats do not. so there. Yes, but do your plants hiss at you when you try to water them? Vishal writes: >I don't know what percentage of men musicians are >lesbians, but if you find out please do let me know. I'm sorry, but this just has me rolling on the floor. A lesbian is a women who is involved in a sexual relationship with a woman. Now, if you take just the sexual preference meaning of that, then all attached heterosexual males are lesbians, so I'd say you've got a lot of counting to do, guys. :) This reminds me of a former History prof at Wesleyan, a white divorced man whose favorite thing to say about himself was that he was a black lesbian trapped inside a white man's body... and they wondered why he didn't get tenure. :) footah reports: >Angelos took his CDs to greece -- i would not be surprised to hear >that Happy has become a national idol by the end of his trip :) Yes, but as a rap artist or no? ;) +===============================================================+ | Meredith A. Tarr | | "I spent four years prostrate to the higher mind | | Got my paper, and I was free" - Indigo Girls | | mtarr@eagle.wesleyan.edu | +===============================================================+ ======================================================================== Date: 27-JUL-1992 22:44:18.04 From: MTARR@eagle.wesleyan.edu Subject: Geburtstagswuensch Hey there... HAPPY BIRTHDAY WOJ (a message for my favorite ectophile) :) +===============================================================+ | Meredith A. Tarr | | "I spent four years prostrate to the higher mind | | Got my paper, and I was free" - Indigo Girls | | mtarr@eagle.wesleyan.edu | +===============================================================+ ======================================================================== Subject: Today's your birthday friends.... From: klaus@inphobos.w.open.de (Cosmic Vagabond) Date: Tue, 28 Jul 92 06:42:55 GMT i*i*i*i*i*i i*i*i*i*i*i *************** *************** ***HAPPY******* ***HAPPY******* ********BIRTHDAY*** ********BIRTHDAY*** ******************* ******************* ******** w o j ******** ****** John Relph ***** *********************** *********************** -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- i*i*i*i*i*i *************** ***HAPPY******* ********BIRTHDAY*** ******************* **** Bob Kollmeyer **** *********************** -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Oops, the following paragraph, written a couple of weeks ago, was eaten by the digester. > From now on, I will only post the birthdays of the next month, and the > complete list a little bit less frequently, mainly when there have been > a lot of changes. OK? Rob Woiccak (woj) Sun July 28 1968 Leo John Relph Sat July 28 1962 Leo Bob Kollmeyer Wed July 28 1971 Leo Mark Carroll Fri July 29 1966 Hacker Kate Bush Wed July 30 1958 God Happy Rhodes Mon August 9 1965 HolyGhost Ron Hill Tue August 11 1964 Leo Vickie Mapes Wed August 15 1956 Giddy Martin Dougiamas Wed August 20 1969 Positive -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- If anyone wants to be added to this list, or change their "sign" just e-mail me with the information...if you don't know what day you were born on, I can figure it out if you give the year of birth. Thanks! _____ Klaus Kluge * klaus@inphobos.w.open.de * I'll be here, I'll be (in) Ecto! ======================================================================== Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1992 09:07:15 -0230 From: eperry@kean.ucs.mun.ca Subject: bdays Another popular day for birthdays... HAPPY BIRTHDAY to woj, John Relph and Bob Kollmeyer!! Beth ======================================================================== Date: Tue, 28 Jul 92 10:03:17 MDT From: dbx@olympic.atmos.colostate.edu (Doug Burks) Subject: Fluff (tm) Greetings, (Sigh! So much of the world turns through a new day before it gets here, that I always seem to be the last to get these greetings out. Anyway ...) Who says astrology doesn't work? Three Ectophile birthdays on the same day within very close distance of the birthdays of two of our collective Deities. :) Anyway, a warm fuzzy blue collective Happy HAPPY BIRTHDAY to ROB WOICCAK (aka that 'woj' fellow), JOHN RELPH, and BOB KOLLMEYER (whom I missed meeting by the length of one fake ID). (All of them younger than me, too! :) ) I hope you all do or listen to something fun or special today! Doug Burks _O_ dbx@olympic.atmos.colostate.edu |< She really is!! ======================================================================== Subject: Re: Replies on the femme-music thread Date: Tue, 28 Jul 92 13:47:46 -0400 From: jeffy@syrinx.umd.edu (this reply is a bit late; syrinx was down all weekend and I've been fairly busy...) Meredith writes: >Now- to Jeff's reply. >}And why not just assume from the outset that Sophie (or anyone >}else for that matter) is lesbian until "proven" otherwise? >Why do you feel the need to assume anything about anybody? I don't *feel a need* to assume anything about anybody; I merely recognize the fact that we _all_ do it. Consciously or unconsciously, it's very difficult to avoid. Every day I spend outside my house, at least one person assumes I'm heterosexual. These things happen. So why shouldn't I assume Sophie, or any other woman I meet for that matter, is a lesbian? So what if I'm wrong 90% of the time? The 10% that I'm right, I'll probably have made someone feel a bit better. The 90% that I'm wrong, well, there are plenty of people out there assuming they're straight, so why should they care that I made a mistake? >}And it's not as if assuming her to be a lesbian is a bad thing. >}Or do you think that's an insult? > >Do I detect a veiled implication of homophobia on my part here, >Jeff? If that's what you're getting at, then boy oh boy, you >have NO clue just how off-base you are. Yes, that was a not overly veiled implication, and I've yet to really see anything to contradict it. Intellectually you seem very open-minded, and I respect and appreciate that. But obviously your postings have touched a nerve, and whether that's some sort of internalized homophobia or merely insensitivity, there's clearly something going on. If I'm as clueless (clueleast? ;-) as you imply above, go ahead and explain to me _just_ how far off-base I am and why you feel that way. Mind you, there are plenty of gay people I'd call homophobic. >So I used it to illustrate the point I was making: that one line from a >song can cause one to make some pretty wild assumptions if one >feels like it. Thanks for helping me drive that point home by >your reaction. But the main reason for discarding that line in the first place was that it was quoted incorrectly. If you know a lyric word for word, that sort of mistake is much harder to make. "Precious" is most certainly about growing up "different" and it's certainly possible that that difference is one of growing up as a lesbian (Ferron address that issue in her "White Wing Mercy"). >After you spent a bunch of bandwidth proving your point >to me that using that one line from "Precious Things" as an >example of how a false assumption can arise from just one line >was "going overboard", you ask me why not? You've answered that >one for yourself already. And then I went ahead and unanswered it with the Melissa Etheridge example. My point was that those quick assumptions based on little or no information can be right or wrong. And I don't see any real harm in coming up with 'readings' of the meaning of a song or its relationship to the author as we're doing. >While we're waxing hypothetical here, why not look at that "this >isRomeo" line, indeed. What if, from those words in one song, >we assume Melissa Etheridge is a lesbian, when she really is >singing the song from a man's point of view, and we're from USA >Today and we decide to "out" her for it. Then it's Melissa's fault for not going through and releasing "Yes I Am" or whatever the song is called. >What if we're dead >wrong, since she's singing from a man's point of view, and it >turns out she's a raging fundie homophobe with an army of good >lawyers behind her? Libel suit city. First she'd have to prove that she's not a lesbian. Then she'd have to prove that being "accused" of being a lesbian hurt her career (this would be nigh impossible, as, as with kd lang and a few others, a very large chunk of her audience want her to be a lesbian, not a raging fundie homophobe). And she might have to convince a court that being a homosexual is a Bad Thing [tm], not just to her religion, but in general in american society. I don't know that any of this would happen. As for the whole thing about women writing and singing songs from men's points of view, it's all rather rare to begin with, isn't it? KaTe is the only woman I can think of who does this remotely often. (the only two I can think of are "Ran Tan Waltz" and "Mother Stands for Comfort"). How many can you think of? KaTe is also one of the few who won't change lyrics in a male-written song (such as "Rocketman"). Most covers sung by someone of the opposite sex have been 'edited.' Lastly, how many times do writers write *love songs* from the p.o.v. of the opposite gender? Neither of the KaTe songs (nor the cover for that matter) fit into this category. "Ran Tan Waltz" is about a man lamenting the wretched marraige he's wound up in (and one could even make an arguement that this is a feminist song based on the irony inherent in a man who was married by a trashy woman). "Mother Stands For Comfort" is nominally about a mass murderer and specifically about the unconditional love of a mother for her son. >Sorry if I disturbed you for >presenting an alternative point of view just for the sake of >engendering some lively discussion. No worries. Ecto can always use something like this. We wouldn't want anyone to think it's all hugz and warm fuzzies! ;-) >And I repeat: why do you feel the need to assume anything about >anybody? I could assume you're a retro-hippie because you're >known as Jeff-with-the-long-black-hair, or I could assume you >spend every waking hour doing nothing but flying kites because >I've never read anything to the contrary. I have a feeling that some people, including my father, think I'm something of a retro-hippie. And I do spend every possible waking moment flying kites. >I could assume you're a mass murderer, since I've never read anything you've >written to the contrary. Stay away from me when the moon is full; your assumption may well be correct. But seriously--I'm willing to bet that a not a single ecto subscriber knows a mass murderer personally. They're simply not too common. On the other hand, I'm also willing to bet that every single ecto subscriber knows a homosexual personally (and not just as a net.acquaintence), whether or not they realize it. >See how ridiculous assumptions can be? Haven't we been through this? Some assumptions are right. Some are wrong. We can be as intelligent or as idiotic about them as we want to be. This evening, a fellow employee and I watched a woman get out of her car and remove hospital booties from her feet; she was wearing what one might call traditional hospital garb. The other employee asked if I thought she was a surgeon or just the one who hands the surgeon the scapel. I said she was a surgeon. This is an utterly ridiculous assumption, not to mention a very unlikely possibility, given the percentages of female doctors and female nurses. When she walked in her store, I noticed the name tag stating that she is an orthopaedic surgeon. Why shouldn't I buck societal stereotypes and make unlikely assumptions like that? >If you really want to assume I'm a lesbian, go right ahead. But >be warned: for now, I can prove you wrong. Well, now, that's one sentence out of all of the things you've written here. I wouldn't want to jump to any conclusions and assume that you're straight based on this one line. For all I know, you could be posting from the point of view of a straight woman. Jeff ======================================================================== Date: 28 Jul 92 15:14:19 EDT From: Subject: KT Rhodes Any further discussion about this really should be moved to ecto, but I could not resist clarifying this point... Robert G. Cole writes: > I think you're giving out old ordering info. In newsletter #3, it was > listed as $0.50 for each additonal CD. Plus you didn't mention the > great T-shirt (also $13.99). It's XL, so one size fits all. Yes, Rob, you are correct. This is the new price scheme. > Vickie writes: > >ps, if you're curious, she was born Kimberly Tyler Rhodes. Her brother > >started calling her "happy baby" because he couldn't pronounce Kimberly. > >It became her permanent nickname. > > I must be slipping in my old age. I could have sworn that I read that > Happy really was her name. Here is a quote from a recent Echoes (NPR show) interview. The entire interview can be found in the ecto archives, or mail me for a copy: "She got the name Happy from her brother who couldn't pronounce Kimberly when she was a baby." > An unusual name to be sure, but the > coincidence factor involved in her brother "picking" a nickname that > when combined with her lastname creates something of a pun is even more > unusual. That and the fact that she could be called KT Rhodes. :) Perhaps this is the origin of woj's "KT Rhodes band"?! -mjm ------------------------------.--------------------------------------- mjm@zylab.mhs. /\/\ / /\/\ "No pinky ring hustlers, compuserve.com / / /_/ / / / No sabre-tooth neighbours" ======================================================================== Date: Tue, 28 Jul 92 15:44:39 -0400 From: gb10@gte.com (Gregory Bossert) Subject: Re: Replies on the femme-music thread i am cross-posting this from Ecto into LoveHounds/gaffa -- i think it is an interesting point. for those who don't read Ecto, this thread is spun off a much more complex discussion of music by/for women, with a focus on "womyn's" music and lesbian performers... most of the participants do read gaffa -- i hope Jeff doesn't mind me using his post as a starting point for a new thread... Jeff Burka says: > As for the whole thing about women writing and singing songs from > men's points of view, it's all rather rare to begin with, isn't it? > KaTe is the only woman I can think of who does this remotely often. > (the only two I can think of are "Ran Tan Waltz" and "Mother Stands > for Comfort"). How many can you think of? KaTe is also one of the > few who won't change lyrics in a male-written song (such as > "Rocketman"). Most covers sung by someone of the opposite sex have > been 'edited.' KaTe sings from many different character's viewpoints; in fact, i suspect it is dangerous to assume that the persona of any of her songs is actually herself, even with the relatively straightforward demo-era songs... off the top of my head, i can think of a few other songs other songs written from a male point of view: Pull Out the Pin -- most likely... i think Kate has referred to the Vietnamese protagonist as male. we'll have to wait for Ron to get back on line to be sure :) Night of the Swallow -- KaTe gets to play both sides here, and play with some sexual stereotypes (the reckless male, the overprotective female) -- the contrast is reinforced by the shifts in musical style between verse and refrain. what might have been a song about a rather cliched lover's quarrel, spiced up by hints of mysterious, illegal flight, is transformed into a brilliant and chilling piece by the final verse; the image of catching a swallow in malta places the events into a timeless, mythical context... can you tell i like this song? ;) This Woman's Work -- this song is particularly interesting, in that the clearly male persona uses very abstract language, e.g. "this woman's work" for "my lover giving birth". he even refers to himself in the third person ("now his part is over", "the father", etc.). KaTe's approach expresses the protagonist's uncertainty and desire to distance himself from the situation at hand in a subtle and devestatingly effective way... Cloudbusting -- hey, she even plays a boy in the video...! There are many other examples of KaTe presenting female characters by portraying their thoughts and actions -- "The Infant Kiss", "Houdini", and of course "Wuthering Heights" are some good examples. This certainly places greater demands on her listeners; one has to infer the people and situations from strange and sometimes baffling clues. the end effect, however, is far more powerful for having involved the audience's intellect and emotions... >Lastly, how many times do writers write *love songs* from the p.o.v. >of the opposite gender? mmm, this is a very pertinent question for me. since i write songs but don't sing, i am always putting words into some else's mouth, as it were, and in particular into a smart and independent female friend's mouth... the song of which i am most proud does, in fact, have a female protagonist, and in its own warped way, it is a love song ;) i would like to do more of this, taking KaTe's example and producing all sorts of songs from all sorts of viewpoints... hee, wish me luck! footah! -greg -- gb10@gte.com -- "a woman drew her long black hair out tight and fiddled whisper music on those strings and bats with baby faces in the violet light whistled, and beat their wings" -- T.S. Eliot ======================================================================== From: shark@cs.ucla.edu (Jeanne B. Schreiter) Subject: San Diego (poem) Date: Tue, 28 Jul 92 14:19:27 PDT San Diego 7/8/1992 We touched bases last Tuesday night I wanted to ask (oh for so long) questions about his soul from the Mind and body Reaching o u t in elegant words serious tongues of university flare Time changing the date memories lingering far away long after the event has past Something I wish I could say or speak or wave my hands whispering new words into the air I gave him a hug and wished him well, take young son Good night each in separate beds touching the bases of the mind. -JB Schreiter -- -- ======================================================================== The ecto archives are on hardees.rutgers.edu in ~ftp/pub/hr. There is a README file explaining what is where. Feel free to send me (or leave in the incoming directory, just let me know) things you'd like to have added. -- jessica (jessica@ns1.rutgers.edu)