Errors-To: ecto-owner@ns1.rutgers.edu Reply-To: ecto@ns1.rutgers.edu Sender: ecto@ns1.rutgers.edu From: ecto@ns1.rutgers.edu To: ecto-request@ns1.rutgers.edu Bcc: ecto-digest-outbound@ns1.rutgers.edu Subject: ecto #923 ecto, Number 923 Tuesday, 21 December 1993 Today's Topics: *-----------------* Re: The Best Albums of 1993 Re: "The Return of the Lurker" or "Keeping up with the Joneses" Re: Help!!! RE: Mail and news and Frente! and things Re: Deep Forest's SWEET LULLABY ecto piccie from the 1st euro-ecto party! UTP promo cassette 1993 Happy Gift Project Tape dubbing project FAQ Amendment Two Victoria Williams "Happy Come Home" on CD Re: My Top Ten for 1993 ======================================================================== Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1993 04:52:55 -0700 From: "Alex Gibbs" Subject: Re: The Best Albums of 1993 Michael Colford : > On Thu, 16 Dec 1993, John Relph wrote: ... > > Lenny Kravitz, "Are You Gonna Go My Way" > > Another uneven album, and Lenny takes himself much too seriously. He > > is a serious artist after all. But a few good tracks, and well worth > > a listen. Just don't expect anything new from his standard seventies > > pastiche. > > Not to criticize anyone's musical taste (because, believe me, I know > he has many fans, including my roommate and my boyfriend) but I just > can't understand the appeal of Lenny Kravitz. I don't think he has > an original note in his reportoire (sp?), I don't think he can sing, > and I think if he had never been married to Lisa Bonet, no one would > have every heard of him. Oh well, we can't like everyone. I really can't tell you exactly why, but I really like Lenny Kravitz. I find it's very hard to say exactly why I like an artist. I find it's much easier to figure out why I don't like an artist; there is usually something that bothers me about their work. In general you sort of have to say "well, I just like it", and sometimes some aspect of it will particularly appeal to you. I like a lot of what he says in his lyrics (including seriousness) and I like the music. (BTW, I think this partly explains why there was such a large negative to positive ratio of posts about Kate's new album on gaffa. Those who liked it didn't have as much to say as those who disliked something.) I had no idea he was ever married to Lisa Bonet; I just don't follow that sort of thing. I got into him in 91. All the hype he's getting about his 70s fashion means little to me except I think the hype is silly, but I feel that way about most fashion. As for his 70s music style, I wouldn't be a good judge; I was too young then, although I grew up with some 70s artists (born 67). I never noticed anything unusual about his voice, negative or positive but... I'm currently overdosing on Caterwaul and like Kate's voice which make others squirm (perhaps not you of course). Anyway, he doesn't appeal to you and he does to me and that's fine. :) --- AlexGibbs arg@kilimanjaro.opt-sci.arizona.edu |\| | (~, |-| ~|~ |-| /-\ \/\/ |< "A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools." "Have you ever seen a picture of Jesus laughing? Mmm, do \ Why Should I you think He had a beautiful smile? A smile that healed." \ Love You? ======================================================================== Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1993 04:56:13 -0700 From: "Alex Gibbs" Subject: Re: The Best Albums of 1993 Michael Colford : > > Curve, "Cuckoo" > > I'm looking forward to hearing it in its entirety. I haven't > picked it up yet, but have heard 3 or 4 songs. Sounds promising. A friend played it for me last night and from what I heard (over conversation) it seemed pretty good to me too. I liked Superblaster already. --- AlexGibbs arg@kilimanjaro.opt-sci.arizona.edu |\| | (~, |-| ~|~ |-| /-\ \/\/ |< ======================================================================== Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1993 05:22:28 -0700 From: "Alex Gibbs" Subject: Re: "The Return of the Lurker" or "Keeping up with the Joneses" Kjetil Torgrim Homme : > Klaus recommended Andreas Vollenweider's latest, "Eolian Minstrel". I > haven't bought it yet, but I really do enjoy others of his records. A I must have missed his post! Ditto on the new remark. > Vollenweider is simply amazing, though! I spent the first ten minutes Yes! I had some of his stuff and got to see him in Tucson (!!) in 86 maybe; there's no date on the ticket. Anyway, it was a great show. He said he really loved our saguaro cacti holding their arms up to the heavens. :) I have most all his stuff now. --- AlexGibbs arg@kilimanjaro.opt-sci.arizona.edu |\| | (~, |-| ~|~ |-| /-\ \/\/ |< "A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools." "Have you ever seen a picture of Jesus laughing? Mmm, do \ Why Should I you think He had a beautiful smile? A smile that healed." \ Love You? ======================================================================== Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1993 06:12:54 -0700 From: "Alex Gibbs" Subject: Re: Help!!! WretchAwry : > DeeTwo is trapped! > > > I'm surrounded by dittoheads! > > > > My parents are both ardent Rush Limbaugh fanatics, and I'm being slowly > > worn down by it.. I don't consider myself a liberal, I'm more centrist, > > leaning slightly to the left (I'm fairly conservative economically, but > > pretty liberal socially). I need some balance! What's more, I need some > > hard proof that Rush can be a real buffoon. > > Oh boy! Last night was an amazing night for talk shows. David Letterman > was trading snipes with his guest Rush Dumball, while Jay Leno was > trading snipes with Howard Stern-o. What fun! We were flipping back and > forth furiously, not wanting to miss a jibe. Of course, both Dumball and > Stern-o came off looking like the assholes they are (IMHO). Yeah, it was very amusing! I almost couldn't believe me eyes. I know this thread continues and I'm replying to an early post but the first post I saw was when I just read a hot-off-the-presses post. It mentioned "Rush" and being anti gay-rights I think. And I said to myself "Whoa, I really missed something about Rush (the MUSIC group!)" since I love Rush (music). I'm starting to really hate having to be sure which one someone is referring to because I don't want Rush Limbaugh even remotely subconciously related to Rush the group. I think it's important to keep realizing that Rush Limbaugh is an entertainer. (And not a very good one IMO.) I have watched the show a few times to see what it was about and happen on it now and then and I must say I can't stand it. It's another show blurring facts into entertainment, but I guess that's fairly obvious in this case. I worry about those who don't eventually realize that though. In addition I really can't stand his ego, not to mention most of his views. There will be a few things he says that I might be able to agree with (usually I roll my eyes though) but I now immediately flip the channel because I don't care about his point of view. His main theme is entertainment, and hence his views and facts can't be trusted. I don't want to start bleating like a sheep either. I'm curious to see what has already been posted now that I replied so early in the thread. (I know, I probably should have read them first.) --- AlexGibbs arg@kilimanjaro.opt-sci.arizona.edu |\| | (~, |-| ~|~ |-| /-\ \/\/ |< "A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools." "Have you ever seen a picture of Jesus laughing? Mmm, do \ Why Should I you think He had a beautiful smile? A smile that healed." \ Love You? ======================================================================== Date: Mon, 20 Dec 93 08:43:21 -0500 From: pearceja%pomis.dnet@wl.wpafb.af.mil Subject: RE: Mail and news and Frente! and things I N T E R O F F I C E M E M O R A N D U M Date: 20-Dec-1993 08:36am EST From: Lt Jeffrey A. Pearce PEARCEJA Dept: POSF Tel No: 55451 TO: _MAILER! ( _DDN[ECTO@NS1.RUTGERS.EDU] ) Subject: RE: Mail and news and Frente! and things Anthony, I have Sylvian's "Weatherbox" too! Pure bliss. Jeff Pearce pearceja@wl.wpafb.af.mil ======================================================================== Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1993 07:04:00 -0700 From: "Alex Gibbs" Subject: Re: Deep Forest's SWEET LULLABY Jeff (pearceja@wl.wpafb.af.mil): > know that "Sweet Lullaby" is being used as the music for a commercial for > Sony (I think). They even go so far as to show the song title and artist > on the screen just like MTV, just not quite as prominently. Interesting. Just like they do with Joe Satrianni. AlexGibbs arg@kilimanjaro.opt-sci.arizona.edu |\| | (~, |-| ~|~ |-| /-\ \/\/ |< ======================================================================== From: Tim Cook Date: Mon, 20 Dec 93 14:17:09 GMT Subject: ecto piccie from the 1st euro-ecto party! I've scanned in one of the photo's from Klaus and Claudias's ecto party. I thought it would be a good idea to put it in the ecto archives. Does anyone who's in the picture (Me!, Klaus, Claudia, Frank, Ilka, Uli, Chris and Perttu and a friend of K&C who's name I've forgot) object to it being put there (you all look great :)). I won't put it there unless it's ok'd by everyone in the piccie. tim ======================================================================== Subject: UTP promo cassette Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1993 23:50:21 From: anthony@xymox.apana.org.au (Anthony Horan) I was more than slightly pleased to find amongst this week's batch of promos a cassette promo from Warner Music Australia for Under The Pink. For discography purposes, the details are: Title: Tori Amos - Sampler EastWest Records (Australia) Tracks: 1. Pretty Good Year 2. God 3. Bells For Her 4. Cornflake Girl 5. Past The Mission Catalog: TA-1 Track listing is duplicated on both sides of the cassette. The cover insert is, I assume, the cassette size version of the album cover art, and it's beautiful. It's a black-and-white photo of Tori, wearing a frayed white sleeveless shirt/dress (impossible to tell which from the photo), looking directly into the camera with a trace of a smile on her face. She sits in front of a glass table upon which are a collection of glass beakers, flasks, tubes and funnels, and blocking her right shoulder is what looks to be a piece of crumpled plastic. It's a very striking image, and suits the contents of the album perfectly. I have heard the album in its entirety, and this sampler's choice of tracks is quite arbitary, taking the five most accessible tracks on the album to attract attention from the media. I don't agree with the idea of excerpted samplers, and particularly in this case the choice is not only unrepresentative of the album as a whole, but also flags particular tracks as "standout" material when in reality the album should be listened to as a whole. But this is standard industry practise, so who am I to argue? :-) A quick description of the five tracks here; I'll post a detailed review of the album once I have the genuine article in my hands. Pretty Good Year ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ A beautiful flowing piano melody backs this traditionally Tori-ish track which turns out to be anything but that about half way through. Sent into heavenly orbit by a string arrangement that's simply perfect. God ~~~ Quite funky, actually! Some really nice vocal work - especially the backing vocals - distinguish this one, and the song itself will surprise many who expect Little Earthquakes II, as will much of the album. Bells For Her ~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Backed, as its title suggests, by something bell-like, though I'm hard pushed to say what it is. Possibly some sort of bell-ish instrument - sounding somewhat like an old music box - mixed with normal piano. Anyway, this is a very quiet, desolate song that is perfection personified. The mood of the song, Tori's fragile vocal and the lyrics themselves make it impossible to remain unmoved. Cornflake Girl ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ This is another prime example of a song well served by its band arrangement. Quite a lively, singalong type of song. Really! You bet your life it is... :-) Past The Mission ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ The track that Trent Reznor of Nine Inch Nails contributes vocals to (you'd never recognise him, but he is there!) this is a another "immediate" track with full band instrumentation, some very nice guitar work, an unexpected mid-section with strange instruments, and as a song it's got a little bit of the desert packed in there with it. :-) As I said, these are the most accessible tracks on the album, but there's no harm in me saying at this point that if you have high expectations for this album, you're still going to be pleasantly surprised. I'm glad it didn't come out this year - I'd have to try to decide between Margot Smith's album and Tori's for the number one spot on my favorite albums list. Australian rdt-ers may be interested to hear that Warner are trying to get Tori out here for another tour; they just don't know when. Apparently she's so popular now that things like this have to be meticulously planned. :-) - Anthony -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Anthony Horan, Melbourne Australia - anthony@xymox.apana.org.au "I kind of feel like I'm Metallica..." - Tori Amos on the perils of long tours, November 1992 ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- ======================================================================== Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1993 07:53:51 +0700 From: dbx@ventana.atmos.colostate.edu (Doug Burks) Subject: 1993 Happy Gift Project Greetings, Well, it's finished and should be in the Sea Nymph's hands in a day or so for wrapping and mailing to Herself. The final contents of the 1993 Happy Gift Project tapes (2 C-90s') are listed at the end of this post. I would like to note a few things. As expected, I used none of the submitted filler material (Thanks for your efforts anyway, and maybe you can save it for next time) and only two of Mitch's guaranteed low-schmaltz holiday songs (He sent me a wonderful C-100 chock full of them! Maybe I should add it to the tape dubbing project. Opinions anyone? Mitch?). The range of the submissions was as wild and crazy, as sublime and ridiculous as ever. Several songs have already lodged immutably in my mind (I have to dig up a D'Cuckoo album somehow). We also came as close as ever to a duplication, as two different people picked songs from the same album. Also, though they are not listed, I stuck a couple very short songs into sub-minute tape gaps. Think of them as a surprise! :) Personally, I was surprised to actually already have ten (thirteen, counting my submission) of the selections in my record collection, a personal record by far. Finally, since Mitch's tapes took so long to wind their way from Chicago to Colorado, my re-recording was more rushed than I preferred, so please be kind to my mistakes. Can you find them all? I'm still turning them up. :) Fortunately, none of them were horrendous, though several make me cringe. However, I do apologize to Klaus & Claudia for not listening to your tape or reading your letter in time to realize you had no intro and relay that to Mitch for action. :( Of course, the 1993 Happy Gift Project was not a one-man show. I would like to extend thanks to my co-conspirator and mellifluous Master of Ceremony Mitch Pravatiner. (Where did you get "Have Yourselves a Groovy Little Solstice"? I've listened to it about seven times now and still find something new to die laughing about. :) ) I would also like to thank the Official Volunteer Gift Wrapper, our one and only royal sea nymph. Last, but certainly not least, I thank all of the contributors, without whom the project would be impossible. I especially applaud Joe Zitt, Mike DePumpo, Steve Fagg, Bob Lovejoy (and Deepspace? :) ), and seanymf for including fruits of their own creative energies in one way or other. Could you all check your entries in the following contents listing and send me any corrections? THANK YOU ALL!!! *HUG* You will get free copies of the two tapes within the next week or three. Enjoy the fruits of your labor!! (Eeek!! My exclamation points are almost reaching Court levels!!!!! :) ) For the non-contributors, you can still join the fun by getting copies of the 1993 Happy Gift Project tapes via the tape dubbing project. (I posted its FAQ concurrently with this post, in case you need more information (or lost your other copy :) )). As with all of the HG/BP tapes, they are highly recommended. After all, don't you want to find out if the inimitable Mitch talks just like he writes? :) Doug Burks _O_ @>->--- dbx@olympic.atmos.colostate.edu |< She really is!! 1993 HAPPY GIFT PROJECT Side A Louis Armstrong Cool Yule The Management Magic Mose (1) I'm Dreaming of a Noir Christmas The Management Magic Mose (1) Have Yourselves a Groovy Little Solstice Management Samantha Fox I Surrender (to the Spirit of the Night) M. Pravatiner Prince and the Revolution Take Me With U Mitch Pravatiner Prince and the Revolution Computer Blue Mitch Pravatiner Ella Jenkins I Got a Harmonica for Hanukah Mitch Pravatiner Simon & Garfunkel 7 O'Clock News/Silent Night Doug Burks Loreena McKennitt Snow Doug Burks Lene Lovich Blue Doug Burks Rainbirds Pride Claudia & Klaus (1) Full name: Magic Mose and His Royal Rockers Side B The Roches Deck the Halls The Management Patti Smith Going Under Michael Peskura Patti Smith Paths That Cross Michael Peskura ?? Esashi Oiwake Jens Brage Eva Madsen Oh - hjaelp mig Madonna Jens Brage Davy Spillane Journeys Of a Dreamer Jens Brage D'Cuckoo This Story Still Unfolding David Dixon Todd Rundgren A Dream Goes On Forever David Dixon Bob Dorough (1) Figure 8 David Dixon John McLaughlin Two Sisters Steve Fagg Steve Fagg (2) Spring Offensive Steve Fagg Royal Opera House (3) First Sea Interlude Steve Fagg (1) Lead vocal: Blossom Dearie (2) Reads poem by Wilfred Owens (3) Full name: Orchestra of the Royal Opera House, Covent Garden Side C Tom Lehrer A Christmas Carol The Management Loreena McKennitt The King Jim Gurley Robyn Hitchcock I Often Dream of Trains Jim Gurley Lida Husik Happy Jim Gurley Fairport Convention (1) Tam Lin Neile Graham Mary Margaret O'Hara Christmas Evermore Neile & Jim Joe Zitt A Very Special Day Joe Zitt Gentle Giant His Last Voyage Bob Lovejoy Happy Rhodes (2) Ode Bob Lovejoy (1) Lead singer: Sandy Denny (2) bass: Bob Lovejoy Side D Rainbirds Devil's Dance Claudia Spix & Klaus Kluge Giraffe Home/Progress Jennifer Albert World Trade The Painted Corner Patrick Terrell World Trade The Moment Is Here Patrick Terrell Happy the Man Carousel Patrick Terrell Mike DePumpo Temporary Sanity Mike DePumpo Mike DePumpo Flight of the Thunderbird Mike DePumpo Siddal Leaving Mike DePumpo The Coolbreezers Hello Mr. New Year The Management Holly Near Gotta Let Go The Management Doug Burks _O_ @>->--- dbx@olympic.atmos.colostate.edu |< She really is!! ======================================================================== Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1993 07:54:22 +0700 From: dbx@ventana.atmos.colostate.edu (Doug Burks) Subject: Tape dubbing project FAQ Greetings, Here are the answers to all of your questions you have asked (and some that you haven't :) ) about the Ecto tape dubbing project. * What tapes are available? Happy Gift Project 1991, Vol I (C-100) Happy Gift Project 1991, Vol II (C-100) These are songs selected by Ectophiles as a gift for Happy for the winter holiday season. It is quite an eclectic collection to browse through. Miscellaneous Happy tape (C-90) World Cafe interview of Happy, including live versions of "Feed the Fire", "Words Weren't Made For Cowards", and "Given In". The songs are included as originally recorded and in the context of the interview. The tape also includes two songs by Kevin Bartlett with Happy singing ethereal backing vocals, and the five Bartlett/Rhodes demos. Femme Music Collection Vol I (Lushy Pop) (C-90) Femme Music Collection Vol II (Mish Smash) (C-90) Femme Music Collection Vol III (Voices) (C-90) Femme Music Collection Vol IV (International Sampler) (C-90) Femme Music Collection Vol V (Easy, does it?) (C-90) Femme Music Collection Vol VI (C-90) A wide-ranging collection of female vocalists selected by Vickie Mapes Happy Rhodes Live! Albany NY 18 March 1992 Vol I (C-100) Happy Rhodes Live! Albany NY 18 March 1992 Vol II (C-100) Live recording by woj of the Happy Rhodes concert at the QE2. This is a high quality recording for the conditions. (Note that this tape will only be sent to Ectophiles. Please respect Happy's and Kevin's wishes and don't make copies of this for anyone who does not already own Happy's albums). The "Last" Champagne Jam 15 May 1992 Vol I (C-100) The "Last" Champagne Jam 15 May 1992 Vol II (C-100) The "last" Champagne Jam broadcast on WESU-FM in Middletown CT, hosted by Meredith Tarr, chock full of Ecto-style artists and even some (*gasp*) male vocalists. The recording is of decent quality. The Unofficial Happy Sampler (C-100) A sampler of songs by Happy Rhodes from all five of her albums, as chosen by Meredith Tarr. Happy Rhodes Live! Philadelphia PA 21 March 1992 (C-100) Live recording by Greg Bossert of the Happy Rhodes concert at the Harrison Auditorium. This is a good quality recording, though the last third of the concert was lost. (Note that this tape is covered by the same restrictions as the Albany concert tape). Happy radio tour (C-100) Recordings of Happy interviews by Ed Sciaci (WYSP 28 Mar 93) and Helen Leicht (WMMR 3 Apr 93), including live acoustic performances of her and others' songs. Happy Birthday Project 1993, Vol I (C-90) Happy Birthday Project 1993, Vol II (C-90) Happy Birthday Project 1993, Vol III (C-90) These are songs selected by Ectophiles as a gift for Happy's 28th birthday. As always, it is a wild, wonderful, and occasionally weird collection of music. Nordic Sampler I (C-100) Nordic Sampler II (C-100) A sampler of Scandinavian female vocalists selected by the Nordic Ecto Conspiracy. A wide range of styles and music. Happy Gift Project 1993, Vol I (C-90) Happy Gift Project 1993, Vol II (C-90) These are songs selected by Ectophiles as a holiday gift for Happy. Ho, hum, another fascinating varied collection of odd music ranging from the ridiculous to the sublime. If you want to read the actual contents of any or all of these tapes, please e-mail me. Besides, each ordered tapes comes complete with a full cassette label and a separate printed content list. * Sounds great! How do I get a copy of any or all of these tapes? Three methods are available for getting the tapes: * Establish a cassette account. In other words, send me a check to cover the cost of cassettes, packaging, and postage. Put in as much as you want, not necessarily just to cover a single order (though you can do that, too). After your first order, anytime you want a cassette, you would just e-mail me, and I can get things out to you as soon as possible without your mailing me anything. In this case, I would dip into my own supply of chrome cassettes which I've ordered in bulk (Thanks, Mitch!). Accounts can be opened or closed at any time. Put in as much as you want, as more tapes will be added. * Establish a cassette account, as in 1, except that I will purchase whatever type of tape you specifically request. Obviously the cost of the tape will be higher, though the packaging and postage will be the same. * Send me the cassettes you want to put the music on (C-90 or C-100) along with money to cover packaging and return postage. I will copy the tapes you request and return them. Consider opening an account, as it will save you having to mail an order, let alone the cassettes. * How much will it cost? If you use my stash of cassettes, the cost for the cassettes is currently $1.22 each. The packaging for mailing the cassettes is between $0.35 and $0.62, depending on the number of tapes mailed. The postage varies according to the number of tapes and the destination. So far, it has ranged between $0.98 and $16.70. Big help, eh? If you wish a more precise estimate of your postage costs, I can give you one via e-mail. US orders will be mailed book rate, taking five to seven days. Non-US orders will be air mailed, taking about seven to ten days. As for foreign payments, so far everyone has sent either American cash or a money order denominated in US currency. I believe that I can handle anything denominated in US currency, and probably any cashier's check (a check drawn on the bank's rather than a personal account). * Where do I send the order? To me. My mailing address: Doug Burks, 2036 West Plum Street C7, Fort Collins CO 80521 USA Orders will be processed in the order I get them, with special dispensation for foreign orders. Please note that I will not process any e-mail orders unless you have an open cassette account. * Anything else I should know? Just a few odds and ends: If I make any mistakes, I will replace the tape for free. I intend to post a progress report on the dubbing operation regularly. If you have any other questions, feel free to ask! Doug Burks _O_ dbx@olympic.atmos.colostate.edu |< She really is!! ======================================================================== Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1993 07:54:41 +0700 From: dbx@ventana.atmos.colostate.edu (Doug Burks) Subject: Amendment Two Greetings, As has already been noted, Colorado Judge Skip Bayless ruled that Amendment Two was unconstitutional. However, I'd like to expand this story, knowing how little detail national news likes to give. This post will be a short legal history of Amendment Two, though note that I am not a lawyer or anything close to one. Oddly, for something which has stirred such furor, Amendment Two has never taken legal effect in Colorado. In November 1992, 54% of Colorado voters approved an amendment to the state constitution which banned the state and its local governments from implementing laws specifically granting rights to gays. The law was scheduled to take effect thirty days after the election. The Monday after the election, a number of groups and individuals filed suit to overturn the amendment. The suits were consolidated and assigned to the court of Skip Bayless. The plaintiffs asked for a restraining order preventing the amendment from taking effect as scheduled, and a few days before the deadline, Judge Bayless granted it. The next step for the plaintiffs was to make the restraining order permanent. After studying the issue, Judge Bayless did so sometime early last spring (My memory is not clear here). The defendants (mainly the State of Colorado and Coloradans for Family Values) appealed that to the Colorado Supreme Court. In a truly stunning and unexpected ruling, the court not only upheld the restraining order, but ruled that the defendants had to prove that the state has "compelling" interests in denying rights to gays, the highest possible standard of proof. In other words, the state would have to prove that gays as a group were trying to overthrow the state government or planning to exterminate all heterosexuals or something on that order. This ruling was the true death blow to Amendment Two. Still, the legal hoops had to be jumped through. So the action returned to Judge Bayless' courtroom last summer. He allowed anyone and everyone to testify, creating a wild, almost circus-like atmosphere during the several weeks long trial. This atmosphere was aided by the plaintiffs, who feeling that the ruling against Amendment Two was in the bag, asked the judge to rule that gays were a "suspect" class, i.e., that gays were eligible for remunerative rights, such as affirmative action. Currently, such rights are available according to race, gender, and disability. Some other groups, such as religious, are specifically protected against discrimination, but are not eligible for the extra rights. Ironically, gay rights groups denied all through the campaign that they weren't asking for these "special rights". In any case, this request opened the trial to a full examination of homo- sexuality. The testimony ranged all over the political and sexual map, entertaining, fascinating, but only proving how little is known about homo- sexuality. It seemed like every piece of testimony was cancelled by another, even those on the same side. For example, one expert for the plaintiffs testified that homosexuality was purely genetic. Later, another expert for the plaintiffs testified it was purely a matter of personal choice. For example, experts who testified that local laws take preference over local laws (or vice versa) just a month earlier in Oregon testified here that state laws take preference over local laws (or vice versa). I guess you should add justice to laws and sausage in the list of things you don't want to watch being made. Thus Judge Bayless' recent ruling that Amendment Two was unconstitutional was expected, even anti-climatic. The true interest was in his "suspect" group ruling. Judge Bayless denied it. The law (I believe this is state law, but am not sure) places three conditions on being a "suspect" group. They must be discriminated against. They must be a clearly identifiable group. They must be politically powerless. Judge Bayless ruled that gays in Colorado only fit the first condition. On the third condition, the judge noted (among other things) the existence of gay rights laws in all Colorado cities with a significant gay population and gays' ability to form coalitions, such as the one successfully overturning Amendment Two. So what's next? The state will appeal to the Colorado Supreme Court, but given their ruling this spring, their upholding Judge Bayless' decision is a foregone conclusion. After that, the case will move into the federal court system. However, no one expects the ruling to be overturned there, since it's hard to find how federal law would apply. The only ground is the ability of a state court to overturn a vote of the people, but that is well-established in the American system of law -- the heart of our system of checks and balances. In short, all that remains is to pound the final nails into Amendment Two's coffin (and spread the wealth around to a few more lawyers :P ). While on the subject, someone asked about the estimate that 10% of the population is homosexual. This number comes from the Kinsey Report and every side recognizes the problems with it. The true number is likely smaller, but how much is a huge subject of debate. The plain fact is that gays have no identifying feature to count, so estimates rely on self-identification, and people lie about sex more than any other subject, even anonymously to pollsters and researchers. There are also varying degrees of homosexuality, so definitions and assumptions play a huge role in such studies. Trying to tie together the studies I've read, the estimates I use are 1-3% of the adult population is actively and strictly homosexual, 5-8% has an primarily homo- sexual orientation, and 20-50% have had at least one voluntary homosexual experience in their lives. Take your pick, along with a huge grain of salt! Doug Burks _O_ @>->--- dbx@olympic.atmos.colostate.edu |< She really is!! ======================================================================== Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1993 15:51:33 +0000 From: S.L.Fagg@bnr.co.uk (Steve Fagg's Mac) Subject: Victoria Williams "Happy Come Home" on CD I'm delighted to hear that this has been released on CD. Full marks to Geffen Records for picking up, and exercising, the rights to release this. I hope they will follow up with more VW releases. Does anybody know if this is available in the UK yet??? -- Regards Steve Fagg ( S.L.Fagg@bnr.co.uk +44-279-402437 ) BNR Europe Ltd., London Road, Harlow, Essex, CM17 9NA, UK *** "Better drowned than duffers. If not duffers, won't drown". *** ======================================================================== From: Tim Cook Date: Mon, 20 Dec 93 16:04:24 GMT Subject: Re: Victoria Williams "Happy Come Home" on CD > I hope they will follow up with more VW releases. Does anybody know if > this is available in the UK yet??? I checked with my local CD shop (he's a Victoria Williams fan) and he doesn't know of a U.K. release date but he's going to get it on import for me. tim ======================================================================== Date: Mon, 20 Dec 93 9:19:00 PST From: "John Relph" Subject: Re: My Top Ten for 1993 >Altan - Island Angel >-------------------- >Altan are IMHO the best active traditional Irish band. Island Angel >presents the usual mixture of energetic dance tunes and gorgeous songs. I had the chance to see both Altan and Greenfields of America earlier this year at the North Texas Irish Festival. While I agree that Altan is very very good, I think Greenfields of America actually were better. However, I don't know about their recorded work. They had just hired a new guitarist whose work was excellent but I do not know if this incarnation of the band has committed anything to tape as of yet. If so, the record may well be worth a listen. But the most amazing Irish band I have ever had the chance to listen to is by far a band from Cork (who have probably broken up) called Nomos. Utterly amazing. Their shows might have well been heavy metal concerts for all the power they demonstrated. -- John ======================================================================== The ecto archives are on hardees.rutgers.edu in ~ftp/pub/hr. There is an INDEX file explaining what is where. Feel free to send me things you'd like to have added. -- jessica (jessica@ns1.rutgers.edu)