3-Dec-91 22:55:45-GMT,28251;000000000401 Received: from athos.rutgers.edu by aramis.rutgers.edu (5.59/SMI4.0/RU1.4/3.08) id AA02927; Tue, 3 Dec 91 17:31:53 EST Received: by athos.rutgers.edu (5.59/SMI4.0/RU1.4/3.08) id AA24730; Tue, 3 Dec 91 17:31:50 EST Date: Tue, 3 Dec 91 17:31:50 EST Message-Id: <9112032231.AA24730@athos.rutgers.edu> Errors-To: owner-ecto@athos.rutgers.edu Reply-To: ecto@athos.rutgers.edu Sender: ecto@athos.rutgers.edu From: ecto@athos.rutgers.edu To: ecto-request@athos.rutgers.edu Subject: ecto #73 ecto, Number 73 Tuesday, 3 December 1991 Today's Topics: *-----------------* Pain Typo City, USA (& Snowdancing) Not Happy but happy Quickstuff Re: Happy Gift Project (3rd attempt) Database info... Stuff/Pain People who listen to Happy A correction, _inter alia_ ======================================================================== Date: Tue, 3 Dec 91 01:50:10 PST From: stevev@greylady.uoregon.edu (Steve VanDevender) Subject: Pain Doug Burks writes brilliantly: >Once I began to listen to Happy's lyrics, I felt an immediate, instinctive, and >intensely personal empathy, bypassing any leavening of reason or intellect. >Happy gives voice to a part of my life, heart, and soul which had lain dormant >and silent, locked away for years. Happy hits the nail precisely in describing >the feelings of spending close to two years debating whether life was worth it, >the complete crumbling of your assumptions about life, the incessant arguments >with yourself, the fantasy worlds you construct. (She has a much better >imagination than I do, though!) Fortunately for her, Happy found an easier way >out than I did, using her music making for a firm grasp on life. After two >attempts, I merely realized that I couldn't kill myself (a very desolate >feeling). While not a very positive reason, it eventually forced me to deal >with my problems, while were (and still are) largely self-inflicted. I saw how little it weighed on the scale of things whether I lived or died, though my life was precious to me. And of these two thoughts I forged a mood by which I stood ready to grasp each smallest chance to live, yet in which I cared not too much whether I saved myself or not. By that mood, as I think, I did live; it has been so good a friend to me that I have endeavored to wear it ever since, succeeding not always, but often. Gene Wolfe, _The Claw of the Conciliator_ I was immediately reminded of that quote on reading the paragraph you wrote, Doug. I don't know if it does anything to describe your truce with life, but it is one of my favorite parts of "The Book of the New Sun". I am tempted to quote more but I'm afraid I wouldn't be able to stop. If the rest of you haven't gone out and read Gene Wolfe's masterpiece yet, teleport or better yet travel back in time to your favorite bookstore and buy and read these books. They are an ideal literary accompaniment to Happy's music, and they speak to people in pain much as Happy's music does. >Let's take an example from one of Happy's songs. I remember reading Kiri's >puzzlement about the lyrics of "Beat It Out". I wanted to scream "Can't you >see it? It's obvious!", but only to fail to find a way to describe "it" right >away. Maybe even Happy can't face it, dismissing it as simply an exercise of >her deepest voice. To put it simply, I can't listen to this song anymore. It >is the most painful, agonizing song I've ever heard, and Happy's cold >controlled vocals only make it more so. She describes the feelings when the >internal torment grows to an unbearable level and you simply rage. With no >external target, you take it out on yourself, trying to beat out the demons >which torment you. The self-flaggelation is physical, mental, and spiritual. >"Beat It Out" paints the desolation during and after such an attack perfectly. >There is no way out. I think you may have explained why I rarely listen to "Beat It Out". I like pretty much everything else on _Vol. II_, but I will skip that song or just rewind to the beginning of the tape rather than listen to it. If I do listen to it, I just really don't get into it that much. >Just because Kiri didn't catch in "Beat It Out" what I catch doesn't mean that >she hasn't experienced personal pain or isn't attracted to Happy's lyrics by >the pain. (I'm not even saying that my interpretation is right, though I don't >think I'm way off base). I'm just saying that hers was different than mine. > >Steve posits that part of the attraction is that Happy shines a light of >optimism and hope through the darkness of her songs. I certainly won't argue >that, and totally agree with it, to a point. I still would have felt a kinship >with her music even had she left out the optimism. Her lyrics just hit my >soul's bulls-eye with a very deadly aim. (Maybe too deadly. Once awakened, >my ancient demons ripped off the age old scabs, making the last few months a >bit rough. They will force me to re-write the truce with my past on better >terms. With any luck, I'll come out of the mess stronger). I certainly >appreciate the touches of optimism, and her lyrics would lose a valuable aspect >without them, but I don't think they answer Vickie's question. On further reflection, I'm not even so sure that the attitude of optimism in Happy's music just isn't my projection of my deep-down optimism. Some of her songs are ideal music for pessimists, dressed in cheery-sounding music that just underlines the pessimism. "The Revelation" is the prime example, and "The First to Cry", "The Wretches Gone Awry", "I'll Let You Go", and "To the FunnyFarm" as other songs in that mold. Some of Happy's songs have brought back to me feelings that I had formed scar tissue over. My main source of personal pain has come from repeated bone fractures (somewhere over 40 in my life to date; I haven't kept accurate count), in which the recovery process is sometimes as psychologically painful as it is physically painful, when I am left incapacitated and sometimes nearly isolated for weeks and don't recover full use of a broken limb for months until I can rebuild the muscles atrophied by the treatment for the fracture. My sense of optimism comes, though, from having survived all of these and not only healed but become increasingly stronger and more physically active. Here is my example of another Happy song that vividly encapsulates a whole complex of feelings for me, although I'll have to ramble on for a bit to explain its relevance, so bear with me. My most recent crash was especially rough, because I flipped my 'chair over right in front of a friend of mine, breaking my right femur. He came with me to the emergency room and watched me get put in traction, even though I had warned him that it wouldn't be at all pleasant to watch. Then I spent six weeks in traction, then six weeks in a cast (although not so hideous a cast as my doctor had been threatening), then, a week after getting out of the cast, I fell over backwards right outside the house of the very same friend, and thus made another emergency room trip with him, followed by four more weeks in traction and another six weeks in a cast. When I was younger and did the same sort of stints, it seemed so much easier, because although I missed home, neither did I have all the experience with the outside world and independence that I missed so much while being stuck in a bed for ten weeks last time. And crashing the second time was what made things unbearable--the first six-week stint was no fun, but I had thought it would be _over_ and I wouldn't have to go back for years if I was lucky. I already felt a little guilty for having had the bad luck of having my friend seeing me in a lot of pain each time, but he had also been so supportive each time that I also came to crave his companionship just because it would make me think I could forget about all the unpleasance. So it all started to come to a head when my friend became uncomfortable with my often clinging behavior, and I couldn't figure out what to do when I thought being around him would help me be happy, but if I hung around him that much, it might drive him away. I was also frustrated because I had missed the ski season, would have to skip the early part of the next year's 'chair racing season, could feel myself getting further and further out of shape, and had to be even more paranoid than usual in order to be sure that I wouldn't injure myself again. I felt I had betrayed myself, that I couldn't understand or control some of my feelings, and my resistance to despair was dangerously thin. That few words doesn't begin to describe the whole complex of feelings, but-- "Let Me Know, Love" recalls it all to me with frightening accuracy. It's hard making the emotions turn around The ones you have lost and never found Oooh, can you feel it yearn on Let me know, when you do, love Know what it's like to disappoint yourself You store your confidence on a shelf You hate the world for its influence on you You hate your heart for betraying you It's been about two years since that ordeal, and only about six months since I first heard that song, so by the time I heard it I had already figured out my own solution, which had mostly involved waiting for the recovery process to finish and living with the emotional turmoil until it had spent itself. I don't know whether hearing "Let Me Know, Love" at the time it now reminds me of would have helped or been too much to bear. Fortunately at about that time I began to read "The Book of the New Sun" and became caught up in the character of Severian, whose adventures and philosophy put my own into a different perspective. I've already spent too much much time writing this and stayed up too late, so I'll stop before I start writing in blunt declarative sentences and excessively short paragraphs. Steve VanDevender stevev@greylady.uoregon.edu "Bipedalism--an unrecognized disease affecting over 99% of the population. Symptoms include lack of traffic sense, slow rate of travel, and the classic, easily recognized behavior known as walking." ======================================================================== Date: Mon, 2 Dec 91 22:21 CST From: vickie@chinet.chi.il.us (Vickie Ann Mapes) Subject: Typo City, USA (& Snowdancing) I CAN'T BELIEVE I MISTYPED WHAT I JUST SAW I MISTYPED!! Listen....Klaus Kinski played the part of... Brian Sweeney Fitzgerald ^^ One of my favorite characters and I screwed it up...blah pooh! Laura! I'm so happy to hear of another Ectophile who was interested in Klaus Kinski. Could you, if you have time, type in the obit you have and e-mail it to me? I don't know anything except what was in a few line obit in People magazine. They didn't even have a photo of him :-( I'll have to look for his autobiography, I heard about it but have never seen it. I would agree that Aguirre was his greatest role, his best film. Fitzcarraldo is my favorite because of the gentleness of the character, and the perservering dreamer. I've got a lot more posts to read, I'll be back later. It's *FINALLY* snowing in Chicago! So far we've only had a few flurries and a thin dusting one day, but we're getting a real winter storm now. It's going to be a little one (4"-10" expected) compared to the ones already seen by our Rocky Mountain Doug and our Mosquito Alley Ectophiles Cathy and Dan, but it's nice to see anyway. Ha! Especially since I don't have to drive in it. It's going to be beautiful in the morning. Vickie ======================================================================== Date: Tue, 3 Dec 91 07:31:32 MST From: dbx@olympic.atmos.colostate.edu (Doug Burks) Subject: Not Happy but happy Greetings, The story is complex, long, and personal as to why I shout this, but I do: ALANN STEEN IS FREE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Joseph Cicippio was freed Monday, and Terry Anderson should be released within a week or two, ending seven years of captivity. Doug Burks _O_ dbx@olympic.atmos.colostate.edu |< She really is!! ======================================================================== Date: Tue, 3 Dec 91 03:40 CST From: vickie@chinet.chi.il.us (Vickie Ann Mapes) Subject: Quickstuff Wow, I just got finished recording my Kansas City show. It seems to take me so long to put together, but the end result is so simple. This show was pretty much dedicated to Klaus Kinski and Michael Carroll. I played Enya and West India Company and "Don't Give Up" and Jane's "Seven Steps To The Wall" and "The Ballad Of Lucy Jordan" and various other things. Oh, I played "Crystal Orbs" too. The way things look, Suspended In Gaffa (Kansas City) will be a thing of the past come Jan. 1 because they've re-vamped the schedule and turned Saturday nights into an all-night reggae, world beat something or other, kicking Sue and I out. Things might change before then, it's possible we'll be moved to a different time slot, but not very likely. My show has been on KKFI since the week after the station went on the air in late February, 1988. It's nearly the longest-running show still on and I'm pretty devestated that they'd just dump me, but I can't complain because I'm not in Kansas City. My friend Sue took over my time slot when we moved to Chicago, and she gives up an hour of her show so that SiG can air. Looks like we're both out in the cold. Boohoo boohoo boohoo..... I told the listeners to write the station in support, I wonder if anyone will. "Is anybody out there? Does anybody really care...?" Would someone who is a faithful reader of rec.music.gaffa tell me if my post about West India Company appeared? I also sent one listing my favorite Kate songs, and one with a few trivia bits too. Our news has the Doug syndrome and we haven't gotten anything for days. It's not gaffa, because we also haven't gotten rec.music.misc, folk, cd, any of the film groups (I haven't seen if my Fitzcarraldo/Klaus Kinski article appeared) and a few others. We get the Love-Hounds Digest, but seem to be missing 385 and 386. Just got 387 a few minutes ago. I'm just wondering if I should re-post some things, but I don't want to if they've already appeared. I'll re-work the West India Company post for Ecto in the next couple of days. Meredith, what a wonderful phone call from Kevin, I'm so pleased for you! Doug, your post was very moving, thank you for it. Mine's still half-finished (I have so many half-finished posts lying around...blah!) but I haven't given up on the topic. Btw, I watched a bit of the celebrations for Thomas Sutherland, it all looked like so much fun, so full of joy. I was wondering if you were there. He looks so good! He looks far to young to have taught at the University for 25 years (I thought that's what they said) and it's so great that he came out of the ordeal in such fine condition. Jeff Burka, did I tellyou that rec.kites passed? If not, hey Jeff, rec.kites passed! Perttu, I got your letter for the EctoSig, Court, I got your package (yes, it's a very weird Welsh love song alright! I can picture Happy rolling on the floor now) and Greg, I got The Story CD. I haven't had a chance to really get into it, but what I've heard has been interesting. I've already played the Dog Dreams song on SiG. Everybody better start picking/choosing songs (we should subtitle the HGP "decisions, decisions") and get them in the mail to me. Send a 100 minute tape. Even though all the songs aren't chosen/timed yet, I think a 100 will be a safe bet. If there's time left over on the tapes I can think of something to put (maybe Suburban Hum, which I wouldn't choose as my HGP song, but that I'd like you all to hear) to fill the tape that comes back to you. You all may end up getting the Ecto Sig and the HGP tape back in the same package. There's more to say, but I should get to bed. I have a temp job (woopie) I have to get up early for. See y'all, Vickie "In the land of my dreams..." ps, Meredith, did you send the Australian postage prices to Graham? btw, thanks for them Martin. I haven't sent them yet. ======================================================================== Date: Tue, 3 Dec 1991 09:54:09 -0600 From: Brian Bloom Subject: Re: Happy Gift Project (3rd attempt) I think I've decided that my HGP contribution shall be This Mortal Cortal, "Tarantula". (Unless someone has a convincing reason why I shouldn't) I am, however, clueless how long the track is... have an unlabeled vinyl LP of it, and will have to time it myself. Having a 'Happy' Holidays! __ ____ __ ____ __ __ (__==__) /\ \ / \_\ / /\ / \ \ / |\ / /\ (oo) ( moo.) / \_\ / /\ |_| / / /| /\ \ \ / ||/ / / /-------\/ -' / /\ | |\ \/ /_/_ / / / \ \/ \ \ / |/ / / / | U.T.|| / \/ |_| \ __ \_\ /_/ / \ /\ \_\ / /| / / * ||----|| / /\ ./_/ \ \ \/_/_\_\/ \ \ \/_// / | / / ^^ ^^ \ \/ |_| \ \_\ /_/\ \ \_\ /_/ /|_/ / Br!an Bloom \__/_/ \/_/ \_\/ \/_/ \_\/ \_\/ brianb@natinst.com ======================================================================== From: Yli-Krekola Perttu Subject: Re: Happy Gift Project (3rd attempt) Date: Tue, 3 Dec 91 19:13:22 EET If there's still room in the HGP tape, I'd like to take part too. My contribution would be 'Mari Tudoro' by Trio Bulgarka (4m 10s). Re: personal database project. 182cm, 68 kg, dark brown hair, single, vehicles: green Toyota Tercel -79, red Honda CB 250 RS -83. -- Perttu Yli-Krekola, the Finnish KorrespondenT py64725@cc.tut.fi ======================================================================== Date: Tue, 3 Dec 1991 11:32:28 -0600 From: Brian Bloom Subject: Database info... Okay, got to toss in my info as well, I guess.. Brian Lawrence Bloom born Oct. 14, 1969 (Libra) in Anchorage, Alaska 22 years old, 5' 11", 186 lbs., short brown hair, blue eyes, single w/girlfriend, Senior at University of Texas, drives 82 silver Volkswagon Rabbit - "Wascally Wabbit" (only half the doors work--car has character, *lots* of it...) Anything else ya need? ======================================================================== From: foster@magnum.convex.com (Harry Foster) Subject: Re: Quickstuff Date: Tue, 3 Dec 91 12:32:06 CST > > Everybody better start picking/choosing songs (we should subtitle the > HGP "decisions, decisions") and get them in the mail to me. Send a 100 > minute tape. Even though all the songs aren't chosen/timed yet, I think What address should we send the tape to ? Harry ======================================================================== Date: Tue, 3 Dec 91 12:09:38 MST From: dbx@olympic.atmos.colostate.edu (Doug Burks) Subject: Stuff/Pain Greetings, First, my condolences to Vickie on the loss of the Kansas City _Suspended in Gaffa_. I'm sorry that I never had a chance to hear it. Second, since I started this I might as well keep going. (I also just finished the accounting on the computers I manage my November Ecto file ended up at 1.1megabytes and 24548 lines. Wordy bunch, aren't we?!! Third, thank you Steve for your post. I understand the irony/humor of your .signature quote more sharply. I would like to add some comments: Re _The Book of the New Sun_: I do have it, but that quote never struck me, though in retrospect, I remember the sentiment and can guess (probably wrongly) where it occurred in _Claw_. I'll have to re-read it, which is as much of a chore as listening to a Happy album once again. Steve wrote: On further reflection, I'm not even so sure that the attitude of optimism in Happy's music just isn't my projection of my deep-down optimism. Some of her songs are ideal music for pessimists, dressed in cheery-sounding music that just underlines the pessimism. "The Revelation" is the prime example, and "The First to Cry", "The Wretches Gone Awry", "I'll Let You Go", and "To the FunnyFarm" as other songs in that mold. No, Happy's optimism is definitely there. Admittedly, some songs (I personally would put "Beat It Out" at the head of the list) lack it, but most of her songs have some sliver of optimism to cling to. Sometimes it's as small as the realization that something has changed or must be changed. This gives each of her first four albums their unique feel of darkness with a dash of optimism. I've also noted that that optimism and the healing are more and more clear with each successive album. My own barely started Happy project is going through her albums and describing my view of them and their songs, so I plan to plunge into this subject even deeper, since I think it's a key point, and one reason Happy is who she is today. ... and I couldn't figure out what to do when I thought being around him would help me be happy, but if I hung around him that much, it might drive him away. I know it's completely off the subject, but your sentence here perfectly describes the vast portion of my love life to let it slide by without comment. ... and my resistance to despair was dangerously thin. This fact has always surprised me. The emotional supports that look and feel so strong during the good times prove to be so fragile when stressed. The line between me and despair always shows up much closer than I would like. In the end, I guess the supports just have to be strong enough to keep it even a micron away. I more and more wish I had recorded Tom Sutherland's talk about his captivity, the constant striving (mainly through talking, reading, teaching, and learning) to keep that line of despair away. [Gee, and I promised myself to post no more hostage stuff]. Obviously, this isn't a subject of casual conversation (outside of warm fuzzy blue mailing lists), so I don't know how whether the above it just true for people who have gone through hell at one time or another or equally true for the more fortunate. Again, Steve, thanks for your reply. It's amazing what Happy's music forces us to write. Doug Burks _O_ dbx@olympic.atmos.colostate.edu |< She really is!! ======================================================================== Subject: People who listen to Happy From: "Mark C. Carroll" Date: Tue, 03 Dec 91 14:30:43 -0500 I was just sitting around listening to Warpaint, and thinking about something someone said a couple of weeks ago. Someone suggested that the people who listen to Happy are, mainly, people who've experienced a lot of pain in their personal lives. At the time, I disagreed, but I didn't have time to sit and think about why. To me, it seems like most of the people who really like Happy's music are very emotional, empathic people. I think that what makes us like her isn't necessarily that we can identify with the pain that she's felt, but that we can feel the honesty and compassion in her music. Of the people that I've played Warpaint for, the ones who've liked it are all very strongly empathic - meaning that they all care very deeply about the people around them, and identify with what they're feeling. The people who haven't been crazy about Happy have been people who, while not less caring people, can't identify as strongly with other peoples emotions. Everyone who has liked Warpaint when I played it has been struck by the honesty and depth of feeling that Happy puts into her music. What makes her so extraordinary isn't just the music - it's the depth of her self that she puts into the music. -Mark || Mark Craig Carroll: ||"Don't ever think that you can't || Univ of Delaware, Dept of CIS|| change the past || Grad Student/Labstaff Hacker || or the future" || carroll@udel.edu || - _Love_and_Anger_, Kate Bush ======================================================================== Date: 3 December 1991 12:18:43 CST From: Subject: A correction, _inter alia_ Doug just posted the following: >Mitch asked: > Nice song, "HSTBAI", but why would you want to dedicate that to Happy, > Doug? The truth is, I didn't ask that. I don't know who did. I've never even heard that song--much less heard _of_ it--but it actually sounds like an excellent choice, judging solely from the title and Doug's subsequent comments. On the basis of what he says, it would appear that my own sense of humor is also in a league with Happy's--as would eventually have been revealed anyway by the selection I am leaning toward for the HGP tape. BTW: Doug's idea for a Ecto Shopping Guide is superb. It sounds like it would closely resemble the satirical book I saw in a bookstore years ago, but unfortunately never thought to buy, called "Items From Our Catalog," which I seem to recall was more a spoof of L.L. Bean than anything else; but the concept could certainly be extrapolated to such places as Sharper Image (my first choice for a role model for the proposed ESG). Speaking of which: by pure coincidence, yesterday's _Chicago Tribune_ ran ads on two sides of the same page, which individually have no relevance at all to what we're doing here, but which collectively have at least a remote--indeed, very remote--connection thereto. On one side, there was an ad for flannel nightgowns and the like (if anything, the virtual antithesis of my "Fuzzy Blue Vickie" idea awhile back), whose headline prominently featured the keywords (more like buzzwords aong present company) "warm," "fuzzy," and something else. On the other side, there was an ad for an appliance/electronic s store, which has nothing at all to do with us except that the top 3/8 or so of the page featured the ad's headline in reverse type, with a blue background. Go figure whether the parts sum to a Warm Fuzzy Blue whole, or not. Which brings me to "just one more thing," as Lt. Columbo once said. It occurs to me that the aforementioned shopping guide could be enhanced by including practical products, as well as those aimed at the conspicuous con- sumer. With all the current concern over the crisis in health care, what could be more practical than a way around the high cost of prescription drugs? More specifically, I now envision starter kits for growing your own penicillin mold. I don't know if this particular life form is either fuzzy or blue in its natura l state, but I have seen slices of superannuated cheese in the fridge at home on which the add-ons were definitely like that; so there may yet be a rational nexus in the instant case. Optimally, it would provide the nascent ecto indus- trial machine with yet another (literally!) Fuzzy Blue product line. :-)* Mitch *(you know it's there, and I know it's there, but is it really necessary to let on to the rest of the populace that it's there?) ======================================================================== To join ecto, please send electronic mail to the following address: ecto-request@athos.rutgers.edu To have your thoughts included in the next issue, send mail to: ecto@athos.rutgers.edu To subscribe to "Ecto", the printed fanzine, send $8 to: Ecto PO Box 11291 New Brunswick, NJ 08906 Ecto is issued 8 times/year, and will include photos and as much material from non-net members as we can get! Donations above the subscription cost are welcomed - all money goes to bringing you better issues! Your "humble pseudo-moderator" -- jessica (jessica@athos.rutgers.edu)