From: owner-chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org (chakram-refugees-digest) To: chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org Subject: chakram-refugees-digest V5 #31 Reply-To: chakram-refugees@smoe.org Sender: owner-chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk chakram-refugees-digest Saturday, February 5 2005 Volume 05 : Number 031 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [chakram-refugees] Another Xena location [IfeRae@aol.com] Re: [chakram-refugees] Xena above all the imitators [cr ] Re: [chakram-refugees] Another Xena location [cr ] Re: [chakram-refugees] TONIGHT SHOW response [cr ] Re: [chakram-refugees] The end of Season Four... [cr ] [chakram-refugees] Tonight Show ["Cheryl Ande" ] [chakram-refugees] One Weekend A Month ["Cheryl Ande" "Lake Okaihau (Houghton's Lake) > A picturesque lake in a rural setting with a reputation as a good perch and > tench fishery. Rudd and koi are also present. The lake is on private land > (Houghton family, landowners) so access permission is essential. A long walk > > (about 1.5 kin) is required through the Woodhill Forest from Grass Track > Road > at Muriwai Beach." >> Is the lake considered private "property" or just the land? Excellent detective work, as usual. -- Ife ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 10:29:21 +1300 From: cr Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Xena above all the imitators On Thu, 03 Feb 2005 20:01, IfeRae@aol.com wrote (snipppage) > > Xena walked in and challenged Najara with executing people and Najara > > implicitly admitted it - *and* Gabby was obviously turned off by this. > > When > > Xena said 'Come on, Gabrielle' Gabby was moving to go with her before > > Najara > > > > stopped her. It was Najara who was the first to draw her sword and turn > > it > > into a fight. It wasn't, as I think you suggested in a previous post, > > Xena who started the fight. >. > > Sure, from Xena's perspective. As you say, Gabs wasn't pleased, but > neither had she said, "Najara, you're a fraud. I'm leaving with Xena." > From Najara's perspective, Xena started it with "Come on, Gabrielle" -- a > selfish, controlling bully who would rather get Gabs killed than leave her > with someone who might help her start a hospice. Well, I couldn't care less about Najara's perspective. But if you watch, I think you'll see that Gabrielle wasn't given a chance to make up her mind whether to go with Xena or not - Najara pulled her sword out. From the camera's perspective, Najara started the fight. But we've been all over this thing, time to let it die I think. cr ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 10:18:14 +1300 From: cr Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Another Xena location On Fri, 04 Feb 2005 18:50, IfeRae@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 2/2/2005 10:52:24 PM Pacific Standard Time, > > cr@orcon.net.nz writes: > > "Lake Okaihau (Houghton's Lake) > > A picturesque lake in a rural setting with a reputation as a good perch > > and tench fishery. Rudd and koi are also present. The lake is on private > > land (Houghton family, landowners) so access permission is essential. A > > long walk > > > > (about 1.5 kin) is required through the Woodhill Forest from Grass Track > > Road > > at Muriwai Beach." >> > > Is the lake considered private "property" or just the land? Excellent > detective work, as usual. > > -- Ife I believe all the land immediately surrounding the lake is privately owned. Whether the lake itself is probably depends on the relevant bit of New Zealand law - but since the land entirely surrounds the lake, that's kinda academic. The fringe of the forest goes very close to the lake, maybe 50 yards away, and _if_ that section of pine trees is legally part of Woodhill Forest, then it's Crown (government) land over which Carter Holt Forests have a lease. Such leases provide for public pedestrian access, and also Carter Holt allow access by permit for various things like horse riding, trail bike riding, etc. It may be that pedestrian access to the forest is legal without a permit, and that could mean pedestrian access to any part of the forest - or maybe only defined trails. (I've tried ringing Carter Holt to ask but keep getting the standard "we're not here right now" message). So, it may be that one can quite legally walk through the forest to 50 yards from the lake. I did it without being challenged, but then, it was a Sunday and there was no-one about to challenge me anyway. I would imagine RenPics got Houghtons (the landowners) permission, and probably Carter Holt's permission to take their trucks along the forest track to the lake. As for the detective work, I usually only bother to mention my successes After all, the failures don't make a very interesting story. cr ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 09:56:27 +1300 From: cr Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] TONIGHT SHOW response On Fri, 04 Feb 2005 06:28, meredith wrote: > Hi, > > TEXena responded: > >As has been said in another context-- "We were \not/ amused!" > > Hear, hear. > > "Oh, look at these freaks of nature! What morons they are! Let's all > laugh at them together as a nation!!" > > I can't say I was surprised at all. But it was still infuriating to watch. Not that I've seen it, or wish to defend the guy who put it together - in fact, making fun of fan conventions is almost too easy, like shooting fish in a barrel. So no credit to the creep for taking a cheap shot. But I have to say, the sight of fans dressed up like their fictional heroes is inherently absurd. This has struck me occasionally when watching Creation videos, but most strongly watching brief footage of a Red Dwarf convention (on a Red Dwarf DVD, so it certainly wasn't aimed at denigrating fans). I guess, though, all hobbies and fandoms have an element of the absurd. I'm also a railfan ('railway enthusiast' in English / NZ) and I've spent more time than I care to think about travelling in trains behind superannnuated steam engines. I could argue (at length and in detail) over the comparative merits of various classes of British steam locomotives which now no longer exist. Quite pointless. Equally absurd, maybe, is spending a lot of time prowling round the countryside looking for bits of otherwise totally undistinguished scenery that just happen to have been the sites where little bits of 'Xena' episodes were filmed, years ago. When I could have been doing something interesting and productive like - umm, playing chess, or sailing a boat, or drinking beer, or collecting stamps ;) Absurd, yes, pointless, yes - but not stupid. If it's something you enjoy doing, then it's worth it. Still, the inherent absurdity does reach it's most visible manifestation in the form of fancy dress or 'costume competitions'. I don't think I could ever find the nerve to do that, all credit to those fans who aren't afraid to dress up. I think my sense of the ridiculous is just too well developed. I wonder whether Lucy et al occasionally feel ridiculous, when in costume on a non-closed set? They do have the reason (or excuse) that in their case there's a purpose for the fancy dress, that of making a TV show. cr ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 10:50:17 +1300 From: cr Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] The end of Season Four... On Thu, 03 Feb 2005 20:01, IfeRae@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 2/1/2005 9:40:02 PM Pacific Standard Time, > cr@orcon.net.nz > > writes: > > Well, I think the unseen presence of 'the Vision' (which I think you > > mentioned too) was enough to keep the thread alive. I don't think the > > other scenes (the Najara fight, and the battle in A Good Day - these were > > shown in opposite sequence in Sin Trade) really contributed to the thread > > since when those occasions happened, there were no flashbacks to Alti's > > prophecy. > > Huh. It contributed for me. Reminded me of the vision, heightened the > suspense and made me feel "in" on the vision even when it wasn't shown as > Xena thinking about it. Not for me - since I hardly noticed those sequences in the original 'Sin Trade' vision. I was much more interested in Xena vs Alti. So, when those other bits actually happened, it didn't register with me. > For me, it also kept it from being a "one note" > thing, in terms of thinking about a crucifixion all season. I disagree (surprised? :) In the original vision, the crucifixion scenes stood out. The other scenes were just typical Xena mayhem. The crucifixion was in slow motion, Lo Duca's music was haunting, they were blue-tinted so they were visually distinct and immeditaely recognisable... and Xena was certainly thinking about a crucifixion all season. I thought that was very effective, and all the more so because TPTB didn't 'dilute' the effect of the crucifixion vision by reference to the others. I think the other bits were just put in as warm-ups, handy bits grabbed from other eps they happened to have 'in the can' by the time they filmed the Alti fight. The crucifixion sequence, OTOH, they filmed specially for Sin Trade. > Alti's intent, > after all, was to create havoc in Xena's life, uncertainty about where or > when she might die. I don't think Alti counted on Xena focusing solely on > the part connected to Gabs. I don't know that Alti was after creating uncertainty. Her intent was to imbue Xena with the certainty and inevitability of her own approaching death, I think. And (leaving aside Alti's intent, which we can only conjecture), Xena was certainly concerned about the apparent inevitability of the crucifixion. She gave no thought at all to the other bits that Alti showed her. If she had, wouldn't she have recognised Najara for a bad hat a bit quicker? > Similarly, I wasn't sure how harmful some of > those scenes might prove to Xena's well being. I was stunned by the scene > where she fought the mystery woman and was left lying -- perhaps seriously > injured or dead -- on the floor. Sure, I figured Xena would survive, but it > was still a shock to me. > > -- Ife Yes, but that sort of thing was always happening to Xena. For example, take one of the other scenes from the past that Alti used as a weapon (certainly in the Between the Lines fight) - Callisto whacking Xena flying with the hilt of her sword in the Amazon village in Maternal Instincts - Xena got up a few moments later and went after Callisto. Ditto the horsemen in the Coliseum in When in Rome, and Milo in Pomira. So there was no reason (at the time of the vision) in my mind to take unusual notice of those scenes. Whereas, the crucifixion - that was new, and attention-getting in every way. If TPTB had preceded it with a fanfare of trumpets and a little notice saying "Hey folks, get a load of this!" they couldn't have made it more obvious. cr ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 12:57:35 -0500 From: "Cheryl Ande" Subject: [chakram-refugees] Tonight Show I saw the clip on MaryD's site. You know I think all fandoms seem absurd to any one who isn't an initiate. You know if we all tuned in and watched a Duke's of Hazard's gathering (actually exists) or maybe a Honeymooner's convention with dozens of Ralph's and Ed's we might a bit amused by the shenanigans. If I had any objections to the spot was that the convention seemed almost empty when there was an excellent turn out especially Saturday when Lucy and Ren appeared (the spot was filmed Friday). I thought it was all in good fun and I know my buddy who got highjacked into asking questions at the Doctor's conference enjoyed himself. So let's just lighten up a bit and just realize that the Tonight show people are jus fools who just can't understand the profound importance of Xena. On a brighter note since NBC and Universal are now family - it's nice to know that NBC sees Xena as a property that still has cache and will bring in viewers. So perhaps in some small way it may help spur a Xena movie (or miniseries that's my wish). CherylA ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 13:26:53 -0500 From: "Cheryl Ande" Subject: [chakram-refugees] One Weekend A Month OWEAM is now up on the Sundance site. I just saw it and it is really good. Very short but Renee gives an excellent performance. It's a very realistic slice of what happens when Guard units are deployed. I think we often forget that people were sold on joining the guards and reserves as a way to supplement income and that basically they were told that they would be just "helping out" during national emergencies. These people very often were the most vulnerable economically - people with low paying jobs for whom the promise of extra money or job training was very enticing. Now we have placed the burden of fighting a war on their shoulders - people whose training has been one weekend a month and who leave chaos back home. Some of the most vulnerable people in our society have taken up the burden to defend America and are used by politicians in the most callous of ways. CherylA ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2005 12:42:55 -0600 From: "S. Wilson" Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] One Weekend A Month What's the link for the site/film? I'm finding two Sundance sites - one's for the channel and doesn't have the film, and the other's for the festival and there's a registration involved. Thanks! S. At 01:26 PM 2/4/2005 -0500, you wrote: >OWEAM is now up on the Sundance site. I just saw it and it is really good. >Very short but Renee gives an excellent performance. It's a very realistic >slice of what happens when Guard units are deployed. I think we often forget >that people were sold on joining the guards and reserves as a way to >supplement income and that basically they were told that they would be just >"helping out" during national emergencies. These people very often were the >most vulnerable economically - people with low paying jobs for whom the >promise of extra money or job training was very enticing. Now we have placed >the burden of fighting a war on their shoulders - people whose training has >been one weekend a month and who leave chaos back home. Some of the most >vulnerable people in our society have taken up the burden to defend America >and are used by politicians in the most callous of ways. > >CherylA ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ End of chakram-refugees-digest V5 #31 *************************************