From: owner-chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org (chakram-refugees-digest) To: chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org Subject: chakram-refugees-digest V4 #118 Reply-To: chakram-refugees@smoe.org Sender: owner-chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk chakram-refugees-digest Tuesday, April 27 2004 Volume 04 : Number 118 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [chakram-refugees] Fates Again [cr ] [chakram-refugees] New Fan Fiction by Iseqween [Cousin Liz Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Fates Again On Mon, 26 Apr 2004 14:41, IfeRae@aol.com wrote: > I got my Chakram newsletter #26, which has an interview with Katherine > Fugate about Fates. A few bits that caught my attention for one reason or > another. Some deal with issues that received lots of discussion. (snip) > 9. As to Some People's opinion that Xena would not let herself be > crucified without a fight, Fugate says, "All Xena knows is that the point > in time Caesar changed should not have been changed and that was her > crucifixion. He stopped it. She knows that path was the right path and > she accepts that now. She was supposed to be on that cross. That led to > the bad Xena which led to the Warrior Princess who fought for good and that > led to Gabrielle. That was Xena's destiny.... That's all she knows and > that's what she had to trust and believe in. That's how this world started > and this is how it will end.... Gabrielle doesn't know she's going to bring > the world back, but she does. So Xena was right." Errrm, metaphysical nonsense IMO. How on earth would Xena know that letting Caesar do to her what he failed to do ten years before was going to make things *better* ? Or that the crucifixion was the key? How could she know that she didn't need to go back to the same beach, same state of the tide, same phase of the moon, same whatever, before she could put it back on track? And never mind how Xena could know, *why* didn't the circumstances all need to be the same? Why was Xena letting herself be crucified the one magic ingredient? (And *that* was different too, it wasn't voluntary the first time). As reasons for getting dead go, if the one in Friend in Need was a little unforeseen, this one was so far out you could orbit satellites around it. :) cr ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2004 19:10:18 -0400 From: Cousin Liz Subject: [chakram-refugees] New Fan Fiction by Iseqween Two new short stories by IseQween: In "IT COULD BE WORSE", Xena and Gabrielle weather a few ripples in their new friendship immediately following their experiences in the second episode, "Chariots of War." In IseQween's second offering, with their more active years behind them, Xena and Gabrielle spend some quality time enjoying what they have and preparing for the future in "TRANSITIONS". You can find these stories by visiting the Xena Dinosaur Bards page on my website http://cousinliz.com/ Please enjoy. - -- Cousin Liz eas01@fast.net Soulmates Xena Dinosaur Bards http://cousinliz.com ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2004 22:10:16 -0400 From: "bookdaft" Subject: RE: [chakram-refugees] Jinx jinxed--Xena too? I'm not nearly so pessimistic. I think a Xena film will happen, but it may take some time. I may be inferring incorrectly, but Katherine Fugate's comments at the Box Office Mojo website ( http://www.boxofficemojo.com/articles/features/?id=040416fugate.htm ) suggests to me that others believe the franchise is potentially profitable, such that they are willing to commit money to litigate for the film rights. Elektra is yet to come out and if, judging by this last weekend's 13 Going On 30, it is successful because of Jennifer Garner, then that puts a more positive spin on Xena. Elektra has a built-in audience, as does Xena, because of the comic in Elektra's case. Besides, if they can do a Fat Albert film after 30 years, the chances are good there will be a Xena film, someday. I think it is a matter of time. Of course, I won't speculate on the quality of the film at this juncture. bd - -----Original Message----- From: owner-chakram-refugees@smoe.org [mailto:owner-chakram-refugees@smoe.org]On Behalf Of KLOSSNER9@aol.com Sent: Friday, April 23, 2004 7:12 PM To: chakram-refugees@smoe.org Subject: [chakram-refugees] Jinx jinxed--Xena too? Variety , April 19, 2004, p. 22 of the supplement on United Artists studio, has a picture of Halle Beery as Jinx from her James Bond film, with a caption reading -- "Plans to spin off Halle Berry's Jinx character from "Die Another Day" are on hold, partly due to such femme [female] actioners as the "Charlie's Angels" and "Tomb Raider" sequels underperforming." The accompanying article says plans for a Jinx spinoff have "collapsed" rather than being "on hold." That sounds bad for the prospects for a Xena movie. But I never expected it to happen anyway. Boeotian ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= _____________________________________________________ This message scanned for viruses by CoreComm ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 00:08:34 EDT From: IfeRae@aol.com Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Fates Again In a message dated 4/26/2004 1:07:53 AM Pacific Daylight Time, cr@orcon.net.nz writes: > On Mon, 26 Apr 2004 14:41, IfeRae@aol.com wrote: > >I got my Chakram newsletter #26, which has an interview with Katherine > >Fugate about Fates. A few bits that caught my attention for one reason or > >another. Some deal with issues that received lots of discussion. > > (snip) > > >9. As to Some People's opinion that Xena would not let herself be > >crucified without a fight, Fugate says, "All Xena knows is that the point > >in time Caesar changed should not have been changed and that was her > >crucifixion. He stopped it. She knows that path was the right path and > >she accepts that now. She was supposed to be on that cross. That led to > >the bad Xena which led to the Warrior Princess who fought for good and that > >led to Gabrielle. That was Xena's destiny.... That's all she knows and > >that's what she had to trust and believe in. That's how this world started > >and this is how it will end.... Gabrielle doesn't know she's going to bring > >the world back, but she does. So Xena was right." > > Errrm, metaphysical nonsense IMO. How on earth would Xena know that > letting Caesar do to her what he failed to do ten years before was going to > make things *better* ? Or that the crucifixion was the key? >> Actually, we (and I include myself) made it a lot more complex than what Fugate seems to have intended. She doesn't say that Xena knew things would be "better" or changed or that she'd get the "right" world back. All Xena knows is that Caesar crucified her before, with terrible consequences for her (and death for him), and that he figured to improve his chances by not allowing that "defining moment" to occur. Mind you, he could've picked the moment before his compatriots assassinated him, which would also have changed things. But (since "show's called XENA") he focused on our girl and (along with Tapert) determined that the crucifixion was the "key." Now, I hadn't thought about that so much before -- that it was actually his own fate that he was trying to change. By allowing that nightmare moment to occur, she figures it will once again set in motion events necessary to end the world Caesar planned and/or for him to experience what was supposed to happen to him. She doesn't know how that might play out or the details -- e.g., that Alti will betray him in place of Brutus, that Gabs will be driven to destroy the loom, or that they'll instantly be transported back to their "real" world. She only knows that she must accept the consequences of the moment that made her different from the Xena of Caesar's altered timeline, if she is to have any chance of changing what Caesar has wrought. How could > > she know that she didn't need to go back to the same beach, same state of > the > tide, same phase of the moon, same whatever, before she could put it back on > > track? And never mind how Xena could know, *why* didn't the circumstances > all need to be the same? Why was Xena letting herself be crucified the one > > magic ingredient? (And *that* was different too, it wasn't voluntary the > first time). >> Again, Fugate was saying Xena saw it much simpler than that. Caesar determined that it was the "magic" ingredient, and he seems to have been right. He changed a lot of people's fates by preventing Xena from becoming who she was supposed to be. (Let's not forget all the "as Xena goes, so goes the world" moments in XWP.) Xena didn't have to be arrogant in her conclusion, as someone else might also have been able to do something if they had her insight into what was happening. (Actually, Gabs did act on what she learned.) But the only fate she could be responsible for was her own. She chose to end the life of the Xena who shouldn't be. Period. Logic or faith or whatever may have suggested to her that this might also somehow restore the Xena -- and the world -- that should be. She didn't know that for sure or even necessarily imagine it, but she was right. Does this make anymore sense than most other "metaphysical nonsense" or fantastical things on XWP? No. Either we accept it or we don't. I think it actually cuts through a lot of the gobbledygook we conjectured, by simplifying Xena's motivation to, "The betrayal/crucifixion is what Caesar did to set the 'right' events in motion. It's what he chose to eliminate when tampering with fate, thereby causing this mess. By allowing that act to happen, I will end my participation in propelling the 'wrong' set of events forward." Obviously, we don't have to agree what Fugate came up with. It doesn't end questions like you raised. We can criticize how well her logic got communicated. That said, I happen to like her explanation. It makes sense to me in the context of what she presented. - -- Ife ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 00:08:37 EDT From: IfeRae@aol.com Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Lucy reference In a message dated 4/25/2004 8:11:25 PM Pacific Daylight Time, hjjh@mail.utexas.edu writes: > In today's "Celebrities" column of the TV info supplement to the Sunday > paper was Um, could you supply the name of the supplement and the paper? - -- Ife ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ End of chakram-refugees-digest V4 #118 **************************************